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| krotscheck | #startmeeting Storyboard | 16:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Jan 19 16:01:23 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is krotscheck. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'storyboard' | 16:01 |
| NikitaKonovalov | o/ | 16:01 |
| SergeyLukjanov | o/ | 16:01 |
| krotscheck | So, before I post an agenda, what quorum do we actually need? | 16:02 |
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| krotscheck | We’ve got 3/4 cores here. | 16:02 |
| krotscheck | That works for me. | 16:02 |
| krotscheck | Agenda: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StoryBoard#Agenda | 16:03 |
| krotscheck | #topic Actions from last week | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last week (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:03 | |
| krotscheck | None! | 16:03 |
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| rcarrillocruz | hey | 16:03 |
| rcarrillocruz | so | 16:03 |
| krotscheck | Hey! | 16:03 |
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| rcarrillocruz | it seems there's a bunch of people off today? | 16:03 |
| jedimike | o/ | 16:03 |
| rcarrillocruz | wasn't aware of US being bank holiday, what is it? | 16:03 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: There aren’t. ttx is on a plane, that’s the only person we’re missing. | 16:03 |
| jedimike | i'm here, but lagging, builders are here doing things to the house | 16:04 |
| krotscheck | It’s Martin Luther King day in the U.S. | 16:04 |
| krotscheck | #topic Urgent Items: Truncated OAuth Tokens Work (rcarrillocruz) | 16:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Urgent Items: Truncated OAuth Tokens Work (rcarrillocruz) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:04 | |
| rcarrillocruz | ah ok | 16:04 |
| yolanda | hi | 16:04 |
| yolanda | was in wrong window... | 16:05 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: Any progress on that? | 16:05 |
| CTtpollard | hi | 16:05 |
| rcarrillocruz | nope, haven't looked at it yet, sorry | 16:06 |
| krotscheck | Alrightey, postponed to next week. | 16:06 |
| krotscheck | #topic User Feedback | 16:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "User Feedback (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:06 | |
| krotscheck | Any new user feedback? | 16:06 |
| krotscheck | Honestly, the UI has been pretty stagnant. We’ve got a large backlog of UI issues and I’m still tied up with email :/ | 16:06 |
| CTtpollard | my work allocation for our internal storyboard instance has dried up atm so I don't have any new feedback | 16:07 |
| krotscheck | No worryes, CTtpollard | 16:07 |
| krotscheck | So we’ll move on. | 16:07 |
| krotscheck | #topic Discussion Topics | 16:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion Topics (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:07 | |
| krotscheck | Nothing on the agenda, anyone have something they want to discuss? | 16:07 |
| rcarrillocruz | yeah | 16:07 |
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| krotscheck | The floor is yours. | 16:08 |
| rcarrillocruz | i wanted to show the deferred queue/replay events | 16:08 |
| rcarrillocruz | so, rabbitmq has something called exchange to exchange binding | 16:08 |
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| rcarrillocruz | i.e., you can bind an exchange to another exchange | 16:08 |
| krotscheck | yep | 16:08 |
| rcarrillocruz | so, in order to have a queue that logs all events (deferred queue for processing) and websocket clients the ability to replay events | 16:08 |
| rcarrillocruz | we can do something like this: | 16:09 |
| rcarrillocruz | http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6148381/rabbitmq-persistent-message-with-topic-exchange | 16:09 |
| rcarrillocruz | (look at the diagram) | 16:09 |
| rcarrillocruz | a fanout exchange that we push all events to, and that's abound to a queue that logs ALL events | 16:09 |
| rcarrillocruz | and to another topic exchange, where we create on-demand queues with the given filters (i want just tasks, with id 1 for example) | 16:10 |
| rcarrillocruz | what do you think? | 16:10 |
| rcarrillocruz | if a websocket clients triggers 'replay history', we bind the client to the deferred queue | 16:10 |
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| krotscheck | I like it. We already have a topic exchange, however the topic format won’t yet allow us to subscribe to specific events. | 16:10 |
| rcarrillocruz | and upon binding, all events are pushed to the client. We could filter on the websocket client that only events meeting a date criteria is shown | 16:10 |
| krotscheck | All it filters on right now is type. | 16:11 |
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| rcarrillocruz | yeah, that topic format needs to be changed to address the pubsub spec | 16:11 |
| rcarrillocruz | all good then? | 16:11 |
| NikitaKonovalov | rcarrillocruz: is all the history relayed on request? | 16:12 |
| krotscheck | Yeah, let’s talk a bit more about that though. We may be able to add some kind of an ack/nack layer to websocket clients so they themselves can manage which events they’ve handled. | 16:12 |
| NikitaKonovalov | it clould be a huge amount of data then | 16:12 |
| rcarrillocruz | NikitaKonovalov: yes, so we need some filtering mechanism, since a 'replay' would contain a param saying 'just replay since day X from time Y' | 16:12 |
| krotscheck | Rather than thinking of it from a ‘replay history’ perspective, we could think of it from an atomic level and assert that individual messages were received. | 16:13 |
| krotscheck | That way we can forget about anything that wasn’t received. | 16:13 |
| krotscheck | Sorry | 16:14 |
| krotscheck | That way we can forget about anything that WAS received. | 16:14 |
| rcarrillocruz | so you mean keeping a list of what's being sent per client connection? | 16:14 |
| rcarrillocruz | so when the client triggers 'replay' we only send what was NOT sent? | 16:15 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: Well, I say create a persistent queue that collects messages and has some nice high upper bound, one that can store messages through a day or so of zuul being down. | 16:15 |
| rcarrillocruz | ah | 16:15 |
| rcarrillocruz | i think rabbitmq queues have a TTL | 16:15 |
| krotscheck | And on our version of rabbit that’ll slowly but surely accumulate, until a client connects and starts acknowledging that it’s consuming messages. | 16:15 |
| rcarrillocruz | i.e. keep stuff just for X days | 16:15 |
| * rcarrillocruz digging | 16:16 | |
| rcarrillocruz | https://www.rabbitmq.com/extensions.html | 16:16 |
| krotscheck | I figure, that way we make rabbit do all of the history management for us, and don’t have to implement some crazy on-disk cache. | 16:16 |
| rcarrillocruz | check for Per-Queue Message TTL | 16:16 |
| rcarrillocruz | yep | 16:17 |
| rcarrillocruz | so let's agree that, sure, a client can trigger replay on-demand, but not since the beginning of mankind | 16:17 |
| rcarrillocruz | just up to a day or something (obv configurable) | 16:17 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: I don’t think it’s our job to cache messages in case a client dies horribly. | 16:18 |
| rcarrillocruz | nod | 16:18 |
| krotscheck | All we can reqally guarantee is that we’ll send them every message, and assume they can handle it sanely | 16:18 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: But with that said, we can definitely create two queues, one as a replay cache and the other as the consumer cache. I’m just concerned about memory | 16:20 |
| rcarrillocruz | yeah, i thought about that also | 16:20 |
| rcarrillocruz | creating a 'backup' queue upon websocket opened and normal queue is created | 16:20 |
| rcarrillocruz | but this is twice memory...so if we have a lot of consumers it can quickly kill the instance | 16:21 |
| NikitaKonovalov | well, then we could keep only a very short history, so that the client can recover from a short outage or a network issue | 16:21 |
| rcarrillocruz | so lean towards having a global replay queue, that is capped (as you say a day or something) | 16:21 |
| NikitaKonovalov | I dont see a case where a client needs events for a whole day | 16:21 |
| krotscheck | I think we have two use cases here. One is replay of already-handled messages, while the other is guaranteed delivery. | 16:21 |
| rcarrillocruz | and it's the client that says 'ok, replay me everthing from last 3 hours) | 16:21 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: That makes sense. | 16:22 |
| rcarrillocruz | ok, i think we have a plan here | 16:22 |
| rcarrillocruz | second topic: refresh tokens. The more i think about it, the more I think i should not handle this (i'm only working on the backned thing) | 16:23 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: If there’s a global replay queue, how do we guarantee that the queue will remain full for other clients, if one client drains it? | 16:23 |
| rcarrillocruz | i think there's a persistence setting for messages for that | 16:24 |
| krotscheck | kk | 16:24 |
| rcarrillocruz | but it's a good point | 16:24 |
| rcarrillocruz | let's put a work item for me to have a POC on this idea | 16:24 |
| krotscheck | You got it | 16:24 |
| rcarrillocruz | and i get back to you next week on the meeting | 16:24 |
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| NikitaKonovalov | I thought a persistent qeue means the messages are kept until TTL | 16:24 |
| krotscheck | #action rcarrillocruz Figure out global replay queue edge cases. | 16:25 |
| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: I think none of us actually know the actual behavior of the system right now :) | 16:25 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: So, refresh tokens. | 16:25 |
| rcarrillocruz | heh, indeed | 16:25 |
| rcarrillocruz | so yeah | 16:25 |
| krotscheck | #topic Discussion: Subscription API Refresh Tokens | 16:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion: Subscription API Refresh Tokens (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:25 | |
| rcarrillocruz | refresh tokens: i think that should be handled on the frontend, not backend (which is i'm working right now) | 16:26 |
| rcarrillocruz | i've been looking at the code and the refresh code is mainly done in the SB-webclient | 16:26 |
| krotscheck | That mostly makes sense. What cases are we looking at here? | 16:26 |
| rcarrillocruz | i.e. request contains a refresh token from OAuth endpoint, then token expires, it uses it to get a new token | 16:26 |
| rcarrillocruz | but nothing on the backend | 16:26 |
| rcarrillocruz | the backend simply cares about tokens | 16:27 |
| rcarrillocruz | that is a Bearer , it's on the db storage and it's valid | 16:27 |
| krotscheck | Ok, so if I connect with a valid token and get a socket, and then that token expires… | 16:27 |
| rcarrillocruz | this raises another thing: | 16:27 |
| rcarrillocruz | we should have a section in the SB webclient for streaming | 16:27 |
| rcarrillocruz | :-) | 16:27 |
| rcarrillocruz | something i have no clue thre, not a frontend guy | 16:27 |
| NikitaKonovalov | if a client notices that his token expires soon, it may refresh it through REST and reestablish connection | 16:27 |
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| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: I agree. What should happen on the socket connection handler serverside though? Should it drop the connection? | 16:28 |
| rcarrillocruz | yolanda: would you work on this with me? | 16:28 |
| krotscheck | If we have ack/nack on the client, a suddenly dropped connection wouldn’t result in data loss. | 16:28 |
| zaro | hi | 16:28 |
| yolanda | rcarrillocruz, sure | 16:28 |
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| * yolanda cannot attend 100% to this meeting, tied with on-call issues | 16:29 | |
| rcarrillocruz | krotscheck: so the way i have it right now it's to close the websocket if check_access_token is not cool | 16:29 |
| krotscheck | yolanda: NO worries. | 16:29 |
| rcarrillocruz | so, access tokens, but i don't check anything on the backend for refresh tokens | 16:30 |
| krotscheck | And then leave it for the webclient to get a good token. | 16:30 |
| rcarrillocruz | yep | 16:30 |
| NikitaKonovalov | krotscheck: what about sending a warning while a token is valid | 16:30 |
| rcarrillocruz | NikitaKonovalov: good point | 16:30 |
| NikitaKonovalov | if a client does not care it will be disconnected | 16:30 |
| krotscheck | Yeah, building a streaming handler for oauth tokens is basically trying to rewrite the oauth spec. Let’s not do that. | 16:30 |
| rcarrillocruz | we can check for token validity, if it's going to expire we return to the websocket client 'hey, your token is gonna die' | 16:30 |
| rcarrillocruz | but dunno...i think we should leave that to the frontend | 16:31 |
| rcarrillocruz | a web browser websocket thingy can handle this | 16:31 |
| rcarrillocruz | for command line websocket clients, we can leave that to implementors | 16:31 |
| NikitaKonovalov | rcarrillocruz: sure the consumer should care, not the backend | 16:31 |
| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: I don’t even think that’ll be necessary. If a client is disconnected, they’ll try to reconnect, get a 401, trigger the refresh token flow, then reconnect and keep consuming where it left off. | 16:31 |
| rcarrillocruz | i really think it's out of the scope | 16:31 |
| krotscheck | And as long as the server queue remembers where we left off, we’re good. | 16:32 |
| NikitaKonovalov | krotscheck: then let's sent a "Disconnectin for expired token" message before the connection is physically dropped | 16:32 |
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| NikitaKonovalov | so it would not like an unexpected error | 16:33 |
| rcarrillocruz | krotscheck: so, that implies we have a grace period for a websocket connection death. meaning, we leave the associated queue open for some time, just in case they reconnect? | 16:33 |
| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: That’s fair. That way the APi explains itself. | 16:33 |
| krotscheck | rcarrillocruz: Is that something the client could ask for when they connect? | 16:34 |
| krotscheck | A queue TTL perhaps? | 16:34 |
| * krotscheck ponders this. | 16:34 | |
| krotscheck | That’s going to get dangerous :/ | 16:34 |
| rcarrillocruz | rcarrillocruz: it could be done. When the websocket is opened and the queue is created, we can return to the client 'ok, this is your queue ID' | 16:34 |
| rcarrillocruz | so if the websocket dies, the client at least knows the id to bind to again when the connection is done again... | 16:34 |
| rcarrillocruz | but we must weigh how long we keep those queues around....to not have leaked queues filling the instance memory... | 16:35 |
| krotscheck | Exactly, that’s what worries me. | 16:36 |
| krotscheck | That would fix our replay queue problem though :) | 16:36 |
| NikitaKonovalov | rcarrillocruz: is it an expensive operation to create a queue, if not than it makes more sense to drop and recreate every time | 16:36 |
| NikitaKonovalov | and reply will help if some messages were missed | 16:37 |
| rcarrillocruz | hmm | 16:37 |
| rcarrillocruz | let's see if the client drain of the global replay queue is doable | 16:37 |
| rcarrillocruz | if not, we can look at keeping on-demand queues around upon websocket die... | 16:37 |
| rcarrillocruz | decisions decisions... | 16:37 |
| rcarrillocruz | :-) | 16:37 |
| krotscheck | Have fun with that :). Shall we move on? | 16:38 |
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| rcarrillocruz | yeah, sorry to hijack, thx folks! | 16:38 |
| yolanda | i wanted feedback for that | 16:38 |
| yolanda | https://review.openstack.org/147105 | 16:38 |
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| yolanda | so that's a button to remove all recent events, question raised if there is a need to open a confirmation box or not | 16:39 |
| * krotscheck doesn’t have an opinion, but can appreciate the frustration of an accidentaly click. | 16:39 | |
| NikitaKonovalov | yolanda: what about a confirmation box with "No ask me again option"? | 16:40 |
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| yolanda | NikitaKonovalov, and store the pref in user settings? | 16:40 |
| NikitaKonovalov | yes, that's the good place to store options | 16:40 |
| yolanda | i was thinking on the modalbox but i also appreciate the situation where you have to clean tons of events and clicking on a modal box all the time | 16:40 |
| zaro | yolanda: maybe work on that as separate change? | 16:41 |
| yolanda | zaro, an incremental change looks fine to me , yes | 16:41 |
| yolanda | but i wanted to know feedback of people | 16:41 |
| krotscheck | It feels like we’re undecided, because none of us know how it would feel to use it. | 16:42 |
| yolanda | ttx would have an opinion too | 16:42 |
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| zaro | yeah, that would me my preference. just merge this one and work on user preference as another change. | 16:42 |
| yolanda | so i can close the change without any confirmation then wait for feedback, sounds good | 16:43 |
| krotscheck | kk | 16:43 |
| krotscheck | I’m ok with that | 16:43 |
| NikitaKonovalov | I'm ok also | 16:43 |
| yolanda | i'm on call this week but i'll try to find a hole to finish that | 16:43 |
| rcarrillocruz | +1 | 16:43 |
| krotscheck | I’ve got a couple of thoughts on improving the event list now that we have story_id’s in all relevant events. | 16:43 |
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| krotscheck | What if we group the results we get from the server by story. | 16:44 |
| krotscheck | And then say: Here’s all the changes that happened in story X. | 16:44 |
| krotscheck | Someone commented, someone updated status, etc etc. | 16:44 |
| NikitaKonovalov | krotscheck: sounds good | 16:44 |
| krotscheck | And then only offer one ‘remove’ button which flushes all relevant events. | 16:44 |
| NikitaKonovalov | and ui could have a hide/show toggle so the resuls are displayed in a more compac way then | 16:45 |
| krotscheck | yep | 16:45 |
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| krotscheck | 12 things happened to story X: (show more) | 16:45 |
| yolanda | sounds good to me, yes | 16:45 |
| krotscheck | Coool. Any other discussion topics? | 16:45 |
| yolanda | what do you think about sorting that? by story id? | 16:46 |
| yolanda | by latest update of some event? | 16:46 |
| krotscheck | I’d start with just sorting by the order they arrive in. | 16:47 |
| zaro | i like that. | 16:47 |
| NikitaKonovalov | yolanda: I think the story with the latest event should be on top, so yes by update times | 16:47 |
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| krotscheck | Which is chronologically by date. | 16:47 |
| zaro | i almost want an entire page dedicated to events that i can sort and chop up anyway i want | 16:47 |
| NikitaKonovalov | yep | 16:47 |
| yolanda | makes sense to me, but first have something simple in the dashboard then we could add an independent events screen | 16:48 |
| krotscheck | yep | 16:48 |
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| krotscheck | Ok, let’s move on to ongoing work. | 16:48 |
| zaro | so why fuss over how it should look or return, just leave it up to user defined. | 16:49 |
| krotscheck | zaro: I guess I don’t understand what you mean by that. | 16:49 |
| krotscheck | Because to be able to have a user define something, the UI has to be able to render it that way first. | 16:49 |
| zaro | leave as is. make something that users can sort and filter whichever data they want out of it | 16:50 |
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| krotscheck | zaro: Ok, do you want to take a stab at putting that together? | 16:51 |
| zaro | hmm, good point, not atm | 16:51 |
| krotscheck | :D | 16:51 |
| krotscheck | Alright, moving on. | 16:51 |
| krotscheck | #topic Ongoing Work (rcarrillocruz) | 16:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Work (rcarrillocruz) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:51 | |
| krotscheck | We more or less covered your stuff in discussion, anything else you want to add? | 16:51 |
| rcarrillocruz | what was commented earlier , nothing else, nope | 16:51 |
| krotscheck | Coool | 16:52 |
| krotscheck | #topic Ongoing Work (jedimike) | 16:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Work (jedimike) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:52 | |
| krotscheck | Eaten by bandits? | 16:52 |
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| krotscheck | I guess he’s not here. | 16:53 |
| krotscheck | #topic Ongoing Work (NikitaKonovalov) | 16:53 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Work (NikitaKonovalov) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:53 | |
| krotscheck | How’s the client API coming? | 16:53 |
| NikitaKonovalov | The Stories/Tasks support is in progress | 16:53 |
| NikitaKonovalov | what I've noticed is that we cannot access tasks as a story subresource | 16:54 |
| NikitaKonovalov | so I'm now refactoring API controllers to support both /tasks and /stories/id/tasks enpoints | 16:54 |
| NikitaKonovalov | at lease the API will look more consistent | 16:55 |
| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: Ironic does something interesting with that, you might want to talk to that team to see how they have automatically nested resources. | 16:55 |
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| NikitaKonovalov | krotscheck: we already have this in a lot of places like teams/users and project_groups/projects | 16:55 |
| NikitaKonovalov | and those work fine | 16:56 |
| krotscheck | Works for me. | 16:56 |
| NikitaKonovalov | so there is no reason why tasks would not work | 16:56 |
| NikitaKonovalov | Also I've finally updated the tags change | 16:56 |
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| krotscheck | They managed to work some magic where any controller ended up being magically embedded as a subcontroller for every other controller | 16:56 |
| NikitaKonovalov | krotscheck: I'll have a look | 16:57 |
| krotscheck | Yay tags! | 16:57 |
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| NikitaKonovalov | link for tags https://review.openstack.org/#/c/114217/ | 16:57 |
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| krotscheck | NikitaKonovalov: It might be too much magic. | 16:57 |
| NikitaKonovalov | most comments resolved I hope | 16:57 |
| krotscheck | Yay tags :) | 16:57 |
| krotscheck | Is that all? | 16:58 |
| NikitaKonovalov | all from me | 16:58 |
| krotscheck | #topic Ongoing Work (yolanda) | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Work (yolanda) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:58 | |
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| yolanda | krotscheck, sorry, on 2 conversations at same time | 16:58 |
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| yolanda | something is on fire here | 16:59 |
| krotscheck | Ok, we’ll let you pass then :) | 16:59 |
| krotscheck | #topic Ongoing Work (krotscheck) | 16:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Work (krotscheck) (Meeting topic: Storyboard)" | 16:59 | |
| krotscheck | I’ve been working on various utilities necessary for email & simplification. | 16:59 |
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| krotscheck | The email templateing engine is up, and I’ve written a new, tested algorithm to evaluate the correct list of subscribers for a given resource. | 16:59 |
| krotscheck | I’ve also got a new UI where you can actually see which story a given comment was left on. | 17:00 |
| krotscheck | Small change, but omg so much better. | 17:00 |
| krotscheck | Anyway, my next big push is going to be to build an email outbox handler that just sends emails. | 17:01 |
| krotscheck | After that I’ll build the digest and the individual email consumers. | 17:01 |
| krotscheck | And now we’re out of time. | 17:01 |
| krotscheck | DOH | 17:01 |
| krotscheck | Thanks everyone! | 17:01 |
| krotscheck | #endmeeting | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:01 | |
| rcarrillocruz | thx folks | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Jan 19 17:01:55 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:01 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2015/storyboard.2015-01-19-16.01.html | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2015/storyboard.2015-01-19-16.01.txt | 17:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2015/storyboard.2015-01-19-16.01.log.html | 17:02 |
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