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| devananda | good morning / afternoon / evening, all | 16:59 |
|---|---|---|
| devananda | #startmeeting ironic | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Aug 17 17:00:00 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is devananda. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ironic' | 17:00 |
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| devananda | #chair NobodyCam | 17:00 |
| openstack | Current chairs: NobodyCam devananda | 17:00 |
| jroll | \o | 17:00 |
| thiagop | morning all | 17:00 |
| betherly | o/ hi! | 17:00 |
| rameshg87 | o/ | 17:00 |
| lucasagomes | o/ | 17:00 |
| vdrok_ | morning | 17:00 |
| yuriyz | o/ | 17:00 |
| devananda | as usual, the agenda is in the wiki | 17:00 |
| mrda | o/ | 17:00 |
| trown | o/ | 17:00 |
| devananda | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Ironic | 17:00 |
| saripurigopi | O/ | 17:00 |
| devananda | I'll try to keep each topic brief today so we can have plenty of time for open discussion / follow up from the midcycle | 17:00 |
| rloo | hi | 17:00 |
| jlvillal | o/ | 17:00 |
| TheJulia | o/ | 17:00 |
| NobodyCam | o/ | 17:01 |
| mariojv | \o | 17:01 |
| JoshNang | o/ | 17:01 |
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| devananda | skipping announcements section since it's empty | 17:01 |
| NobodyCam | :) | 17:01 |
| devananda | #topic subteam status reports | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "subteam status reports (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:01 | |
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| devananda | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IronicWhiteBoard | 17:02 |
| devananda | if you haven't already updated your subteam status, tracked at that ^ link, please do so now | 17:02 |
| devananda | there was a lot of work / progress on the neutron/ironic integration last week | 17:03 |
| devananda | many thanks to jroll, Sukhdev, and others for that | 17:03 |
| jroll | :) | 17:03 |
| jroll | it's coming along nicely | 17:03 |
| NobodyCam | and thank you to all who attened the mid-cycle | 17:03 |
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| rloo | hmm, dtantsur is on PTO. Are we in a hurry to get the ironic-lib stuff done? | 17:03 |
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| devananda | rloo: yea, we kinda are. it's been blocking other things for a while | 17:03 |
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| rameshg87 | rloo: and we have a soft freeze on those files in ironic now | 17:04 |
| jroll | he's back wednesday | 17:04 |
| rloo | devananda: looks like there are two patches for ironic-lib dvsm testing. | 17:04 |
| devananda | also, jroll and I need to catch up with dhellmann soon to sort out releases | 17:04 |
| jroll | devananda: it's on my calendar to hit him up tomorrow | 17:04 |
| devananda | we tried last week but there's things in pip/pbr I dont understand | 17:04 |
| lucasagomes | yeah, I think it's most good for a release right? | 17:05 |
| devananda | rloo: thanks | 17:05 |
| lucasagomes | in a code POV | 17:05 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: yea | 17:05 |
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| devananda | pshige_, jlvillal: any updates on docs? | 17:05 |
| rloo | is anyone familiar with tempest/devstack stuff, to continue Dmitry's patches? (Or we wait til Wed?) | 17:05 |
| jroll | lucasagomes: there's two patches right now to get dsvm running | 17:06 |
| rameshg87 | and sfaizan has some patches (ready) for switching ironic to use ironic-lib when it's released | 17:06 |
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| * lucasagomes checks the review list | 17:06 | |
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| jroll | lucasagomes: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/212491 https://review.openstack.org/#/c/212495/ | 17:06 |
| devananda | jroll: release ironic first, then switch to using ironic-lib, ya? | 17:06 |
| jroll | devananda: yes pls | 17:06 |
| jlvillal | devananda: Not from me. Was I supposed to do something on docs??? | 17:06 |
| lucasagomes | jroll, thanks | 17:06 |
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| lucasagomes | devananda, ++ | 17:06 |
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| devananda | rameshg87: do you have links to those patches? pls put on the etherpad | 17:07 |
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| rameshg87 | devananda: ack | 17:07 |
| * jlvillal trying to remember if he had a TODO item that he forgot about. | 17:07 | |
| jroll | devananda: I expect by EOD tomorrow we'll be ready to release unless we see a major bug we want to fix first | 17:07 |
| devananda | jlvillal: oh, nope. I imagined it :) | 17:07 |
| * jlvillal Whew! | 17:07 | |
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| rloo | jlvillal: I thought you were going to reorganize our docs? | 17:08 |
| rloo | jlvillal: just kidding | 17:08 |
| mrda | lol | 17:08 |
| * jlvillal recovers from heart-attack.... :P | 17:08 | |
| NobodyCam | hehe | 17:08 |
| devananda | mrda: !! you're here :) | 17:08 |
| devananda | jetlag, eh? | 17:08 |
| mrda | devananda: I'm in SAT this week | 17:08 |
| devananda | ahh | 17:08 |
| devananda | well, welcome :) | 17:08 |
| devananda | anything to add to the nova/ironic section of the status report? | 17:09 |
| mrda | thanks - it'll be my last team meeting for a while due to TZ | 17:09 |
| lucasagomes | mrda, :-( | 17:09 |
| mrda | devananda: Not really, we have some things to do, and jlvillal and I will update later today hopefully | 17:09 |
| devananda | k k | 17:09 |
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| mrda | devananda: but I haven't had time to get anything done so far | 17:09 |
| rloo | mrda & jlvillal: please remind us if there are nova patches that ought to be reviewed that we want in before liberty deadline whenever that is | 17:10 |
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| mrda | rloo: shall do | 17:10 |
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| rloo | thx mrda | 17:10 |
| jlvillal | devananda: On Nova, we have mainly been catching back up as both mrda and I were out on vacation. There are two patches in the review queue. | 17:10 |
| jroll | rloo: nova is full-on feature freezed for L, bug fixes can land any time AIUI | 17:11 |
| jlvillal | But if people have patches to go into Nova, please ping mrda or jlvillal (me). So we can add them to the review queue. | 17:11 |
| mrda | yes please | 17:11 |
| jlvillal | We usually look for Nova bugs that are tagged as Ironic. And then look for patches off of those bugs. | 17:11 |
| devananda | good stuff, everyone - thanks for the updates! | 17:12 |
| devananda | anything else before we move on? (giving it another minute) | 17:12 |
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| rloo | so we have OneView in the etherpad, but I don't htink the spec has been approved yet? | 17:12 |
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| lucasagomes | yeah not yet | 17:13 |
| lucasagomes | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/187762/ | 17:13 |
| devananda | nope, not yet | 17:13 |
| sambetts | hg87 :) | 17:13 |
| thiagop | In fact, we're waiting for some reviews | 17:13 |
| thiagop | any feedback is appreciated | 17:13 |
| * lucasagomes adds to his todo for tomorrow | 17:13 | |
| devananda | oh -- actually, one more thing to add to the update list | 17:13 |
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| devananda | jroll and I (and others) sat down and looked at both the approved and unapproved specs | 17:14 |
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| devananda | compared to list of things we set out at beginning of the cycle | 17:14 |
| devananda | and did a major update to the priorities spreadsheet | 17:14 |
| devananda | #link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Hxyfy60hN_Fit0b-plsPzK6yW3ePQC5IfwuzJwltlbo | 17:14 |
| mrda | thanks devananda for the link | 17:14 |
| devananda | since LP doesn't give us any good way to group bp's by topic, we did that in google ... | 17:14 |
| lucasagomes | oh nice one | 17:14 |
| * devananda waits for the mythical future when openstack will have a good tool for this | 17:15 | |
| NobodyCam | current priorities tab! | 17:15 |
| rloo | devananda: awesome (for updating priorities). Not good wrt all the stuff to do, sigh. | 17:15 |
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| lucasagomes | loads of changes to the driver interfaces O.O | 17:15 |
| devananda | rloo: it's more of a "here are all the things people seem to want to do" + "what major themes emerge" + "what's really important to everyone" | 17:16 |
| rloo | devananda: wrt state machine. should we add some item number about microversioning/client default versions blah blah. or did we decide how to handle enroll? | 17:16 |
| devananda | rloo: let's not discuss that now | 17:16 |
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| thiagop | One more thing about oneview, we're working to put a 3rd party CI to work when the code is merged, even if it runs just periodically due to hardware restrictions | 17:16 |
| NobodyCam | thiagop: awesome! | 17:17 |
| thiagop | 30% done | 17:17 |
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| devananda | ok, going to timebox this lest we run out of time for other things | 17:17 |
| devananda | thanks everyone for the updates! | 17:17 |
| lucasagomes | thiagop, ++ awesome | 17:17 |
| rloo | devananda: don't want to discuss, just think it is high priority and not sure it is captured in the doc | 17:17 |
| jlvillal | thiagop: +1 on awesome :) | 17:17 |
| devananda | rloo: fair point | 17:17 |
| rloo | devananda: i don't think we can release liberty w/o resolving that | 17:17 |
| devananda | #topic scripts that do not fit into our current project repositories | 17:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "scripts that do not fit into our current project repositories (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:18 | |
| devananda | NobodyCam: that's you | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | oh thats me | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | :) | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | we've have a couple of folks purpose utility type scripts, many are driver or vendor specific and | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | do not have a good location in the ironic tree. It was suggested that a solution to this would be | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | to have these scripts in their own repos, and a wiki type page could be created with links pointing | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | to these repos. I kinda like this as it allows the script creators to maintain them with out having to | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | bogged down by the entire Ironic review process, but they could still be "linked" to the ironic | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | project via the wiki page. | 17:18 |
| NobodyCam | (sorry for large paste) | 17:18 |
| jroll | isn't that exactly the method we decided to move forward with in vancouver? | 17:19 |
| jlvillal | I like the idea of separate repo(s) outside of Ironic. | 17:19 |
| NobodyCam | would like to hear what other folks think about this | 17:19 |
| devananda | jroll: maybe? but we haven't implemented it yet afaik, so it came back up at the midcycle | 17:19 |
| lucasagomes | yeah seems fine to have a separated repo | 17:19 |
| sambetts | I think we decided on a single utils repo in vancouver | 17:19 |
| lucasagomes | I mean "many are drivers", drivers could easily live in our tree | 17:19 |
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| jroll | devananda: what is there to implement about "make your own repo" and "put a link on our wiki page" | 17:20 |
| rloo | +1 for separate repos. I think in Vancouver there were 2 solutions and no decision. | 17:20 |
| devananda | sambetts: I recall a discussion around having a single "other utils" repo, but there are problems with that | 17:20 |
| TheJulia | If I remember correctly, the decision in vancouver was to come back to it, that there was no consensus then | 17:20 |
| * BadCub is again fashionably late | 17:20 | |
| jroll | heh | 17:20 |
| devananda | like, who approves changes in it? what language is it in? how is it tested? | 17:20 |
| gabriel-bezerra | rloo: +1 | 17:20 |
| mrda | would they be curated in anyway? Or just freeform? i.e. would there be an owner for each repo as to ensure some sort of consistency? | 17:20 |
| jlvillal | lucasagomes: Problem with drivers in our tree is that difficult for people to review hardware/vendor specific code | 17:20 |
| jroll | I'm not seeing this in the etherpad :( | 17:20 |
| devananda | jroll: the only thing for us to do: 1) agree on it 2) document the agreement in a wiki page | 17:20 |
| jroll | right | 17:20 |
| devananda | mrda: no curation | 17:21 |
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| lucasagomes | jlvillal, well we do it already right? | 17:21 |
| devananda | the wiki would indicate who, from that vendor (presumably) is the maintainer | 17:21 |
| sambetts | I think we should use the neutron vendor decomp as a case study | 17:21 |
| mrda | s ironic-<vendor>-caveat-emptor as a repo name? | 17:21 |
| jlvillal | lucasagomes: Yeah, but is that a good thing or not? I'm not sure. | 17:21 |
| lucasagomes | jlvillal, many of the vendor stuff can live in a separated library | 17:21 |
| mrda | s/s/so/ | 17:21 |
| NobodyCam | in many cases not everyone will be able to test them asfolks may not have the HW to test | 17:21 |
| devananda | so the communit has a point of contact for issues in, essentially, third-party tools | 17:21 |
| lucasagomes | like proliantutils | 17:21 |
| jroll | let's be clear here: this isn't driver code. this is utility scripts etc. | 17:21 |
| rloo | we aren't discussing the home of drivers. just other "stuff", right? | 17:21 |
| jroll | right? | 17:21 |
| devananda | much like several drivers have already created their own repos on stackforge or github | 17:21 |
| TheJulia | jroll: correct | 17:21 |
| jlvillal | Sorry, for off topic then. | 17:21 |
| devananda | rloo, jroll: correct | 17:21 |
| jroll | python enroll_hardware_from_acme_cmdb.py etc. | 17:22 |
| trown | how would this work with "big tent" ie. no more stackforge | 17:22 |
| devananda | exactly | 17:22 |
| devananda | trown: so, frankly, I don't like the "no more stackforge" approach | 17:22 |
| jroll | as I said in vancouver, I think this should be completely outside of the ironic program, with the exception of links on our wiki. | 17:22 |
| devananda | jroll: +100 | 17:23 |
| jroll | I don't care if your repo is in the openstack ecosystem or not | 17:23 |
| thiagop | people that wants can use the 'openstack/' namespace instead of stackforge | 17:23 |
| jroll | make a repo. put it somewhere. | 17:23 |
| sambetts | trown: you can have independantly released projects under the ironic statium | 17:23 |
| trown | devananda: me neither...but it seems that is the direction | 17:23 |
| thiagop | it's just not a "official" project | 17:23 |
| lucasagomes | I'm good with separated repos | 17:23 |
| devananda | jroll: so if people put these tools in openstack/ then they will naturally propose that they be listed in openstack/governance/projects.yaml | 17:23 |
| rameshg87 | +1 for separate repos and documenting on wiki | 17:23 |
| mrda | jroll: I'm fine with that, but is there an owner? I'm not sure it should be a free for all | 17:23 |
| devananda | and included in the ironic project | 17:23 |
| lucasagomes | people can manage their own tools and edit the Ironic wiki to talk about it, no problem | 17:23 |
| gabriel-bezerra | jroll: +1 | 17:23 |
| jroll | devananda: right, they should not be included in the ironic tree there. | 17:24 |
| devananda | jroll: right | 17:24 |
| jlvillal | So is it separate repos under openstack/ or just some repo on github.com? | 17:24 |
| NobodyCam | jroll: devananda: yep that was my thinking too | 17:24 |
| mrda | I think everyone agrees with not in the ironic tree | 17:24 |
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| sambetts | I don't | 17:24 |
| jroll | mrda: I think a free for all is fine | 17:24 |
| jroll | ok, here's an example | 17:24 |
| jroll | https://github.com/rackerlabs/onmetal-scripts | 17:24 |
| trown | "just some repo on github.com" is problematic as there is no access to the wealth of infra resources then | 17:25 |
| jroll | should that be in the ironic program? should ironic maintainers be responsible for that repo? | 17:25 |
| thiagop | so, to have a wiki is a consensus? | 17:25 |
| rloo | isn't 'ironic tree' == git repo for 'ironic' code. vs 'ironic program' which includes ipa, inspector, bifrost... | 17:25 |
| thiagop | the problem is just were to put the code? | 17:25 |
| NobodyCam | example: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158577/ | 17:25 |
| sambetts | jroll: being under the ironic stadium doesn't mean that the ironic core team is invloved with it at all | 17:25 |
| devananda | thiagop: the problem is "who is responsible fo rmaintaining the code" | 17:25 |
| jroll | rloo: right, sorry | 17:25 |
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| jroll | sambetts: it implies that the ironic team is responsible for it | 17:26 |
| * mrda just doesn't want to allow nefarious updates | 17:26 | |
| devananda | sambetts: did we switch from umbrellas to stadiums? :) | 17:26 |
| jroll | sambetts: people will come to the ironic team when they have problems with it | 17:26 |
| jlvillal | How about allow both repos on github.com and under openstack/ Either is acceptable? | 17:26 |
| jroll | jlvillal++ (just not in the ironic program) | 17:26 |
| jlvillal | Just link to them from the wiki. | 17:26 |
| jroll | +++++ | 17:26 |
| rloo | i personally don't care where they put their stuff as long as i'm (ironic program) is not responsible for it | 17:26 |
| NobodyCam | ++ | 17:26 |
| TheJulia | ++ | 17:26 |
| mrda | +1 | 17:26 |
| devananda | jlvillal: that's what NobodyCam proposed at the opening of this topic :) | 17:26 |
| devananda | rloo: exactly | 17:26 |
| jroll | "if you make a repo, we'll link to it" | 17:26 |
| trown | jroll: how does one create a openstack/ repo for an ironic based project that is not under the ironic program? | 17:27 |
| NobodyCam | yep | 17:27 |
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| rloo | jroll: or 'if you make a repo, you can link to it' | 17:27 |
| sambetts | Our networking-cisco repo lives in the neutron statium but is completely independant, its only there to state its relevance to the project | 17:27 |
| devananda | trown: one does not | 17:27 |
| jroll | trown: I have no idea, they should ask infra | 17:27 |
| mrda | trown: ask infra | 17:27 |
| thiagop | trown: did that this week | 17:27 |
| lucasagomes | I think it's fair to have separated. Once the project is mature enough it can even be proposed to be part of the ironic umbrella | 17:27 |
| lucasagomes | as others have done already | 17:27 |
| thiagop | just don't add it to the governance stuff | 17:27 |
| lucasagomes | but it needs time | 17:27 |
| TheJulia | Honestly, this may not be a project, it may just be "I have some helper scripts, the community could use them" | 17:28 |
| devananda | wait - thiagop - you created an openstack/* project related to ironic, but that is not intended to be part of the ironic project? | 17:28 |
| jroll | thiagop: oh, that's a good point. infra/tc/whatever doesn't have a problem with that? | 17:28 |
| trown | thiagop: can you point me to the project-config review for that? | 17:28 |
| thiagop | devananda: yep | 17:28 |
| gabriel-bezerra | devananda: it is openstack/python-oneviewclient | 17:28 |
| thiagop | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/211301/ | 17:29 |
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| devananda | so TheJulia brings us back to the topic at hand -- this isn't about pyhton libraries or UI frameworks or things like that -- it originally came up because the iLO team has some tooling they use, with iLO, to do mass discovery | 17:29 |
| thiagop | trown: ^ | 17:29 |
| devananda | I dont know if it's even written in python | 17:29 |
| trown | thiagop, thanks | 17:29 |
| NobodyCam | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158577 | 17:29 |
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| devananda | thiagop, gabriel-bezerra so that clearly should be part of hte ironic project in my opinion (once the spec is approved to implement that driver) | 17:29 |
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| TheJulia | Which has occured again as other groups have indicated that they have something that is a helper script to do x or y specific task, but don't know what to do to help users who may find the items useful | 17:30 |
| thiagop | devananda: I know, but once the community hasn't yet agreed on that, I proposed it that way | 17:30 |
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| sambetts | devananda: doesn't that go back to the goverances "Am I OpenStack?" thing? if it can live in openstack/* or not then | 17:30 |
| TheJulia | is an ansible module openstack? | 17:30 |
| thiagop | and it can be a way out to the helper scripts too | 17:31 |
| TheJulia | (as an example) | 17:31 |
| devananda | TheJulia: it can be. see OSAD :) | 17:31 |
| rloo | devananda: off topic now, but it would be good to discuss which openstack/python-Xclients will fall under ironic program in the future. i'm concerned that for every vendor, we'll end up with such a client. | 17:31 |
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| TheJulia | devananda: I knew you were going to respond with that :) | 17:31 |
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| mrda | osad: \o/ | 17:31 |
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| devananda | rloo: I was just checking projects.yaml and I agree -- it's not currently clear | 17:31 |
| devananda | proliantutils isn't listed there, but I think it should be | 17:31 |
| jroll | so getting back on topic | 17:31 |
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| jroll | there are clearly things we don't want in the ironic umbrella | 17:32 |
| rloo | otoh, if OpenStack wants to rule the world, we can put all opensource code used by openstack under our tent | 17:32 |
| * devananda sets a timer for 5 more minutes on this topic | 17:32 | |
| jroll | and an openstack repo can be made without putting under ironic umbrella | 17:32 |
| NobodyCam | jroll: ++ | 17:32 |
| jroll | so I think we should advise vendors to make a repo on openstack or github, doesn't matter | 17:32 |
| jroll | and link to it from a wiki page | 17:32 |
| thiagop | jroll: +1 | 17:32 |
| BadCub | jroll: +1 | 17:33 |
| rameshg87 | jroll: +1 | 17:33 |
| jroll | who wants to write those docs? :) | 17:33 |
| jroll | (or wiki page) | 17:33 |
| rloo | jroll: write what docs? | 17:33 |
| trown | jroll: ++, the ability to make a repo under openstack namespace but not under **any** umbrella is news to me | 17:33 |
| devananda | jroll: I think the way things are going, if it's in openstack/* namespace, the TC will want it to be associated with _some_ project team | 17:33 |
| lucasagomes | seems fair... it's basically what was said before "create a repo and link on the wiki" "note you can create a repo under openstack/ if u wish" | 17:33 |
| devananda | trown: yea, news to me too | 17:33 |
| rloo | jroll: the wiki page part is easy. | 17:33 |
| jroll | rloo: the "here's what you should do for tools repos" | 17:33 |
| jroll | rloo: it could be a paragraph on the wiki, rather than docs or whatever | 17:33 |
| rloo | jroll: so two wikis: one for instructions on how, one that lists the 3rdparty/whatever stuff. | 17:34 |
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| thiagop | devananda trown I think it was after the depreciation of stackforge namespace | 17:34 |
| rloo | jroll: did we agree/vote on this? | 17:34 |
| BadCub | devananda: if we have folks setup a repo, can they not "associate" to Ironic if the "thing" is meant to be used for Ironic? | 17:34 |
| jlvillal | Or one Wiki with both | 17:34 |
| jroll | devananda: maybe we should get that clarified, then, but today it's possible | 17:34 |
| rloo | jroll: (not the wiki part, the process) | 17:34 |
| jroll | rloo: I made a statement, I'm not seeing disagreement | 17:34 |
| jroll | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 17:34 |
| NobodyCam | I would also think many vendor type folk already a github repo like the rackerlabs one | 17:34 |
| sambetts | BadCub: +1 | 17:34 |
| rloo | jroll: yeah, but we're in a meeting. don't we have to vote? | 17:34 |
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| devananda | BadCub: the question at hand is how to do that association so a) users can find it, but b) the ironic core team isn't expected to maintain vendor tools (which may not even be in python) | 17:35 |
| devananda | jroll: ++ to getting that clarified | 17:35 |
| NobodyCam | and require spicific HW to test | 17:35 |
| jroll | rloo: sure, whatever, voting is fine | 17:35 |
| jlvillal | Should it be in the docs too? Or the links are only in the Wiki? | 17:35 |
| thiagop | NobodyCam: right | 17:35 |
| BadCub | Those are very good points to get clarified | 17:35 |
| * devananda doesn't feel the need to vote | 17:36 | |
| lucasagomes | jlvillal, I think only wiki is fine | 17:36 |
| jroll | +1 for wiki. | 17:36 |
| devananda | anyone volunteering to writing this in the wiki? | 17:36 |
| rameshg87 | I will | 17:36 |
| * NobodyCam can take a stab at it | 17:36 | |
| jroll | woo, thanks rameshg87 | 17:36 |
| devananda | rameshg87: ty :) | 17:36 |
| NobodyCam | or rameshg87 | 17:36 |
| BadCub | rameshg87: +1 :) | 17:36 |
| thiagop | rameshg87: o/\o | 17:36 |
| NobodyCam | :) | 17:37 |
| NobodyCam | Thank you all! | 17:37 |
| * rameshg87 hasn't got this much cheer ever :) | 17:37 | |
| BadCub | lol | 17:37 |
| devananda | #action rameshg87 to wiki'fy the results of this discussion: vendors can create tool / utility repos without needing to put them under the "ironic" project umbrella, and should link from wiki page | 17:37 |
| devananda | thanks all! | 17:37 |
| TheJulia | thank you! | 17:37 |
| devananda | #topic patches adding copyright headers | 17:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "patches adding copyright headers (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:37 | |
| lucasagomes | hope this one to be fast... | 17:37 |
| devananda | I don't see naohiro here, so I'll proxy | 17:37 |
| jroll | can we just agree to email legal-discuss here | 17:38 |
| lucasagomes | so we have this patch here https://review.openstack.org/212973 adding some copyright lines to their code | 17:38 |
| devananda | #link https://review.openstack.org/212973 | 17:38 |
| lucasagomes | IMHO I don't think it matters that much, but we don't have a consensus around it | 17:38 |
| devananda | I googled a bit, but didn't find it -- but there have been several discussions in -infra about this before | 17:38 |
| jroll | nobody present right now is going to have a definitive answer as to if this is ok. I'm fairly certain those headers aren't enforcable anyway. | 17:38 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: infra does have a policy here | 17:38 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, not infra, it's legal | 17:38 |
| lucasagomes | also, AFAIR some projects have decided not to have any copyright lines | 17:39 |
| devananda | there's a much bigger discussion around CLA / DCO / (C) headers -- some of which was wiki'd here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OpenStackAndItsCLA | 17:39 |
| devananda | but then that got caught up in board and TC meetings for a long time, and still isn't resolved | 17:39 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: it's not about legal. the CLA asserts the copyright on submission | 17:39 |
| NobodyCam | at one time we were adding: # Copyright <year> OpenStack Foundation headers | 17:39 |
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| devananda | NobodyCam: you should never have added one of those -- sinc eyou were never, afaik, an employee of the openstaack foundation .... | 17:40 |
| devananda | nor should I ever have | 17:40 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, right, yeah I know... but many of the code have copyright lines and we keep accepting it | 17:40 |
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| rloo | Is the question whether we should allow those Copyright's? We already have code with them. | 17:40 |
| devananda | rloo: no - the question is whether we can allow them to be added after the fact | 17:40 |
| devananda | fujitsu submitted code w/o any (c) header, and it landed, and now they want to "correct" it | 17:41 |
| lucasagomes | yeah can we add it after they are already submitted? | 17:41 |
| rloo | devananda: OH. that is different. No, I don't think so. | 17:41 |
| mrda | Some companies do demand it, rightly or wrongly, for newly created files. I think we should allow that, but not allow updates. | 17:41 |
| devananda | #action devananda to follow up with infra and/or legal team on this | 17:41 |
| BadCub | is there a "chance" The foundation will require this copyright in the future, or do they even have the right to require it? | 17:41 |
| jroll | so as I understand it. those copyrights are meaningless. AFAIK we do it because we cargo cult the header. | 17:41 |
| mrda | It's all Apache licenced independent of copyright notices - but the copyright notice is a visual indication that it's not public domain code, that it is covered by an explicit licence | 17:41 |
| jroll | devananda++ | 17:41 |
| devananda | the CLA imputes it on code submission, based on the attribution of the patch author | 17:41 |
| lucasagomes | jroll, ++ yeah they are meanless because we signed the CLA | 17:41 |
| rloo | (or is the definition of 'landed' -- when a release occurs) | 17:41 |
| devananda | so as far as openstack foundation legal is concerned, they aren't needed. | 17:42 |
| devananda | but some companies feel otherwise, thus we get them, and mostly don't care | 17:42 |
| devananda | rloo: no, commit accepted | 17:42 |
| rloo | devananda: ok, let's move on then. You've got your action item :) | 17:42 |
| lucasagomes | ++ | 17:42 |
| devananda | anyway, time boxing at this point, but wanted everyone to be aware of the discussion and policy | 17:42 |
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| jroll | +1, let's move on | 17:42 |
| devananda | #topic driver name length limit | 17:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "driver name length limit (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:42 | |
| lucasagomes | another fast one | 17:43 |
| devananda | this one has no name on the agenda ... | 17:43 |
| devananda | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/209605/ | 17:43 |
| lucasagomes | there's a patch changing the length of the name from 15 to 25 | 17:43 |
| thiagop | mine | 17:43 |
| thiagop | but lucasagomes bringed that to us | 17:43 |
| jroll | is there any reason to continue to limit this artificially? if we proposed 255, what would be the objection? | 17:43 |
| lucasagomes | while I think it's fine, do we have any consensus whether 25 is enough for the driver's name ? | 17:43 |
| lucasagomes | imo we can make it longer and have no more problem's with it | 17:43 |
| mrda | 25 might be too limited | 17:43 |
| devananda | jroll: the driver name is actually hte python entrypoint name | 17:44 |
| rloo | jroll: +1. I see no reason to limit it to 25 | 17:44 |
| devananda | is there a limit on python entrypoint names? | 17:44 |
| jroll | +1, let's make it so we never have to deal with this again | 17:44 |
| thiagop | broght* | 17:44 |
| jroll | devananda: good question, I doubt it but who knows | 17:44 |
| jroll | probably 79 :) | 17:44 |
| betherly | I think 25 is limited but equally think there should be a limit of some kind? | 17:44 |
| devananda | I don't care about the db field length (as long as it's < 256) | 17:44 |
| rloo | let's limit it to python entrypoint names then! | 17:44 |
| NobodyCam | my only thought here is many folk nay not what to "node-create -d aReallyLongDriverNameGoesHere | 17:44 |
| * jroll googles about entrypoints | 17:44 | |
| devananda | NobodyCam brings up a good point - usability is also a concern | 17:45 |
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| mrda | 255 might be a better choice, just so we don't have to revisit | 17:45 |
| devananda | this will be displayed in UI, typed on CLI, etc | 17:45 |
| yuriyz | imo reasonable value is 64 | 17:45 |
| rloo | devananda: but the names have to be approved by the core-reviewers. | 17:45 |
| devananda | but I'm fine with the DB no longer imposing an arbitrarily small limit | 17:45 |
| NobodyCam | yuriyz: more than in my option | 17:45 |
| devananda | and if someone wants to use MyReallyLongdriverNameThatNoOneWillEverType -- well, they can | 17:45 |
| lucasagomes | right | 17:45 |
| jroll | setuptools doesn't seem to document a max length for entry points | 17:45 |
| BadCub | Would it be sane an reasonable to set it to 100? I think it would be difficult for someone to come up with something longer, unless they are really, really creative | 17:45 |
| jroll | fwiw | 17:45 |
| NobodyCam | ++ | 17:46 |
| devananda | jroll: cool | 17:46 |
| thiagop | we could add a recommendation to use short names | 17:46 |
| betherly | +1 | 17:46 |
| mrda | (assuming they can convince everyone in code review...) | 17:46 |
| yuriyz | ok | 17:46 |
| devananda | BadCub: 100 is even more arbitrary :) | 17:46 |
| lucasagomes | alright, so everyone agrees 25 is too small? | 17:46 |
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| devananda | lucasagomes: yes | 17:46 |
| yuriyz | +1 | 17:46 |
| BadCub | +1 | 17:46 |
| mrda | yup | 17:46 |
| betherly | Yup | 17:46 |
| NobodyCam | yup | 17:46 |
| rameshg87 | +1 for 255 | 17:46 |
| jroll | let's just decide on a number now before we bikeshed all over gerrit | 17:46 |
| devananda | I've heard two suggestions so far: 64 and 255 | 17:46 |
| jroll | I like 255 | 17:46 |
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| thiagop | lets do a vote? | 17:46 |
| NobodyCam | rameshg87: ya | 17:46 |
| rloo | +1 255 | 17:46 |
| lucasagomes | well 255 then | 17:47 |
| mrda | +1 for 255 | 17:47 |
| lucasagomes | no hard limits | 17:47 |
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| thiagop | 255 it is | 17:47 |
| trown | +1 for 255 | 17:47 |
| jlvillal | +1 for 255 | 17:47 |
| yuriyz | ok 255 is good | 17:47 |
| devananda | that's easy | 17:47 |
| jroll | we can artificially limit in code if we want to make the limit smaller for usability | 17:47 |
| BadCub | +1 for 255 | 17:47 |
| gabriel-bezerra | as unlimited as possible | 17:47 |
| rloo | unless we find out there's something else that limits it | 17:47 |
| devananda | #agreed use 255 for the driver name field length in the db | 17:47 |
| lucasagomes | rloo, yeah | 17:47 |
| devananda | #undo | 17:47 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Agreed object at 0x9c577d0> | 17:47 |
| betherly | +1 jroll | 17:47 |
| jroll | woo, done | 17:47 |
| jroll | NEXT | 17:47 |
| lucasagomes | thiagop, thanks for the patch :-) | 17:47 |
| devananda | #agreed use 255 for the driver name field length in the db, unless we find out that there is another limit (eg, python entrypoint length) | 17:47 |
| devananda | #topic open discussion | 17:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: ironic)" | 17:48 | |
| thiagop | lucasagomes: not at all, will to it later today | 17:48 |
| lucasagomes | well I put yet another item there for the delete instances at any time in the deployment | 17:48 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, while I think target_provision_state would be great, I don't see any clear way to actually implement it? | 17:48 |
| * BadCub wants to thank everyone for making mid-cycle so awesome. | 17:48 | |
| NobodyCam | ++ | 17:49 |
| mrda | Great job BadCub! | 17:49 |
| betherly | +1 | 17:49 |
| lucasagomes | and syntax way, I don't think the flag is all bad. Because the node will actually transit from the target_provision_state it's currently set to transit | 17:49 |
| betherly | It was awesome | 17:49 |
| *** carl_baldwin has quit IRC | 17:49 | |
| betherly | And thanks to everyone for making me feel welcome! | 17:49 |
| lucasagomes | and then it will be deleted (and the target_* will mark it as deleted) | 17:49 |
| BadCub | thnx mrda :) | 17:49 |
| TheJulia | BadCub: Thank you for setting things up | 17:50 |
| mrda | BadCub: and thank you for putting up with the hills | 17:50 |
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| BadCub | It was a pleasure! I am glad everyone had a good time. And we got to welcome betherly to the fold :) | 17:50 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: the flag is easy enough to implement inside of ironic, but I have serious concerns about the usaiblity implication for clients | 17:50 |
| betherly | Woohooooo | 17:50 |
| jroll | lucasagomes: so I think devananda makes a good point, in that it's a third field to look at to determine the state | 17:50 |
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| lucasagomes | jroll, devananda right yeah I agree that target_ would be ideal | 17:51 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: ie, anyone building an interface on top of ironic suddenly needs to account for a whole new field (above a certain api version) | 17:51 |
| rameshg87 | jroll: determine target state rather | 17:51 |
| jroll | rameshg87: the overall state :) | 17:51 |
| lucasagomes | just trying to figure how we can actually implement it | 17:51 |
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| lucasagomes | due the way our global lock current works | 17:51 |
| rloo | what if we had a concept like 'queuing events' | 17:51 |
| devananda | rloo: indeed .... :) | 17:51 |
| lucasagomes | target_provision_state to be a queue? | 17:51 |
| jroll | I brought that up before | 17:51 |
| jroll | it's super complex | 17:52 |
| NobodyCam | would a que'd delete work for what lucasagomes is looking to acomplish? | 17:52 |
| rloo | well, i wasn't thinking of target_* being a queue. More like a separate field, with target* reflecting the current action. | 17:52 |
| jroll | see top level comments for patch set 7 | 17:52 |
| devananda | yea, we spent a lot of time (well, at least I did) thinking about how we would do an event / queue based system intead of our current+target system | 17:52 |
| rloo | cuz there are problems with queues, eg depending on what events are queued. | 17:53 |
| devananda | the API changes for that would be, well, massive | 17:53 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, right | 17:53 |
| devananda | as it represents a complete shift in how one interacts with the service | 17:53 |
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| devananda | it's not something we can incrementally add | 17:53 |
| rameshg87 | and you never know if the queue will be executed or not | 17:54 |
| NobodyCam | good poing rameshg87 | 17:54 |
| NobodyCam | point even | 17:54 |
| devananda | rameshg87: in a properly designed event-based system, one does know if the enqueued item is acted upon or times out (because of TTLs and call-backs) ... | 17:54 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, one way I was thinking is to have instance as a separated resource | 17:54 |
| devananda | rameshg87: split-brain scenarios not withstanding | 17:55 |
| lucasagomes | one can create an instance, and then assign it to the node (instance_uuid) | 17:55 |
| * mrda sounds the bell for 5 minute warning | 17:55 | |
| devananda | which is where one gets into RAFT or BASE systems | 17:55 |
| lucasagomes | and on that instance you can mark as delete | 17:55 |
| devananda | anyway ... :) | 17:55 |
| NobodyCam | TY mrda | 17:55 |
| devananda | lucasagomes: "instance" as a resource in ironic? | 17:55 |
| lucasagomes | devananda, yeah... (I know it's already a "thing" in nova too) | 17:56 |
| devananda | cause, well, it's already a resource in Nova. perhaps we just need to change the nova.ironic.virt driver to be able to issue the deletes? | 17:56 |
| devananda | heh | 17:56 |
| devananda | *re-issue | 17:56 |
| jroll | so devananda and I actually talked about this topic a bit at the midcycle | 17:56 |
| jroll | and about possibly making the state machine transitions work differently based on (provision_state, target_provision_state) | 17:56 |
| *** dims has quit IRC | 17:57 | |
| jroll | and this could make delete a valid transition for (DEPLOYING, ACTIVE) | 17:57 |
| jroll | it might get weird in fsm.py, but that's probably ok | 17:57 |
| lucasagomes | jroll, right, but how to make it not racy | 17:57 |
| jroll | where's the race? | 17:57 |
| rameshg87 | jroll: and where would we record the new desired transition ? | 17:57 |
| devananda | rameshg87: we'd update target_state | 17:58 |
| jroll | rameshg87: it would change target to DELETED | 17:58 |
| devananda | ie, (DEPLOYING, DELETED) becomes a valid state | 17:58 |
| lucasagomes | hmm | 17:58 |
| betherly | Before this meeting ends real quick | 17:58 |
| devananda | so that when the current task finishes and calls process_event("done") | 17:58 |
| betherly | Wanted to just bring up horizon UI stuff if anyone has heard further on those panels? Otherwise waiting on the UX guys and Piet to be in touch :) | 17:58 |
| betherly | Will chase on it this week | 17:58 |
| lucasagomes | jroll, I mean, we certainly need to acquire a exclusive lock to do that | 17:58 |
| devananda | then task_manager notices that the target_state has changed -- and is now DELETED -- and fires off the next step automatically | 17:59 |
| rloo | how would we update target_state if another task has lock on node? | 17:59 |
| BadCub | betherly: you can follow up with me on that as well. | 17:59 |
| lucasagomes | jroll, when the request comes it will already be locked by another process | 17:59 |
| betherly | BadCub: thanks I'll message you :) | 17:59 |
| BadCub | :) | 17:59 |
| lucasagomes | so 2 process writing to the node simultaneously | 17:59 |
| rameshg87 | I think we should go back to channel and then discuss | 17:59 |
| lucasagomes | I mean same fields | 17:59 |
| jroll | lucasagomes: yeah, the locking is where it gets weird, surely it's possible to deal with it | 17:59 |
| lucasagomes | yeah chanell | 17:59 |
| jroll | cool | 18:00 |
| lucasagomes | times' up | 18:00 |
| devananda | yep. time's up | 18:00 |
| jroll | thanks all | 18:00 |
| devananda | thanks everyone! | 18:00 |
| BadCub | thanks everyone! | 18:00 |
| NobodyCam | thank you all | 18:00 |
| mrda | Thanks everyone - nice to chat with you in the meeting! | 18:00 |
| jlvillal | Thanks! | 18:00 |
| *** sridhar_ram has joined #openstack-meeting-3 | 18:00 | |
| *** singlethink has joined #openstack-meeting-3 | 18:00 | |
| rloo | lucasagomes: so I think we can handle this if we don't do it via periodic task. if eg a task about to finish whatever it was doing before xsitioning to a new state, checks something else... | 18:00 |
| devananda | see you all at the same bat time, same bat channel next week! | 18:00 |
| devananda | #endmeeting | 18:00 |
| NobodyCam | :) | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Aug 17 18:00:28 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2015/ironic.2015-08-17-17.00.html | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2015/ironic.2015-08-17-17.00.txt | 18:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ironic/2015/ironic.2015-08-17-17.00.log.html | 18:00 |
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| betherly | Thanks guys | 18:02 |
| betherly | *all | 18:02 |
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| flaper87 | #startmeeting Zaqar | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Aug 17 21:01:07 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is flaper87. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zaqar' | 21:01 |
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| flaper87 | vkmc: exploreshaifali flwang1 | 21:01 |
| vkmc | HI | 21:01 |
| exploreshaifali | hi! | 21:01 |
| flaper87 | hellooooooooooooooooooooooo | 21:01 |
| vkmc | o/ | 21:01 |
| flaper87 | #topic Roll Call | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:01 | |
| flaper87 | o/ | 21:01 |
| vkmc | o/ | 21:01 |
| exploreshaifali | o/ | 21:02 |
| flaper87 | #topic Agenda | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Agenda (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:02 | |
| flaper87 | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Zaqar#Agenda | 21:02 |
| flaper87 | that's our agenda for today | 21:02 |
| flaper87 | I believe we don't have pending actions from last week other than reviews | 21:02 |
| flaper87 | so, lets get started with our topics for today | 21:02 |
| flaper87 | #topic Pending important reviews | 21:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Pending important reviews (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:03 | |
| * flaper87 checks gerrit | 21:03 | |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/213744/ | 21:03 |
| flaper87 | recently, auth for ws landed. That patch fixes a deauth bug | 21:03 |
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| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/202374/ ( flwang1 ) | 21:03 |
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| flaper87 | That's email notifications, it still needs to be updated | 21:04 |
| flwang1 | o/ | 21:04 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: morning buddy | 21:04 |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/212828/ | 21:04 |
| vkmc | flwang1, morning! | 21:04 |
| flaper87 | That one is a new baby but quite important too | 21:04 |
| flwang1 | mornings, zaqers :0 | 21:04 |
| flaper87 | That puts us closer to running mongodb+sql | 21:04 |
| exploreshaifali | morning flwang1 :) | 21:04 |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/195010/ | 21:05 |
| flaper87 | That's claims for WS | 21:05 |
| flaper87 | vkmc has been updating it | 21:05 |
| flaper87 | and we kinda have to merge it to complete the ws work | 21:05 |
| flaper87 | we still have time so please, lets get to it | 21:05 |
| flaper87 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/199824/ | 21:06 |
| vkmc | claims, notifications (therve's) and we are all set for ws I guess | 21:06 |
| flaper87 | Set unreliable to False by default | 21:06 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: yup, remember we'll discuss notifications+ws tomorrow at 12/13 UTC | 21:06 |
| vkmc | yes :) will be there | 21:06 |
| flaper87 | lets see how that goes and if we can merge WS notifications in Liberty | 21:06 |
| flaper87 | ok, that's it from the reviews side | 21:06 |
| flaper87 | Great work on reviews last week | 21:07 |
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| flaper87 | Lets keep it up and review the pending patches | 21:07 |
| flaper87 | btw | 21:07 |
| flaper87 | One note w.r.t reviews | 21:07 |
| flaper87 | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-August/072191.html | 21:07 |
| flaper87 | Ryan Brown has accepted to join the core-reviewers team | 21:08 |
| vkmc | wohoooo | 21:08 |
| flaper87 | With full honesty, that sets us one step farther away from having a diverse team | 21:08 |
| flaper87 | Nonetheless, I'm very happy about it | 21:08 |
| flaper87 | Ryan has provided great reviews and guidance | 21:09 |
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| flaper87 | please chime in if you've something to share/say | 21:09 |
| flaper87 | :D | 21:09 |
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| exploreshaifali | Great! yes he answer my questions :P | 21:09 |
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| flaper87 | :D | 21:09 |
| vkmc | ryansb is great, I'm really happy to have him in Zaqar | 21:09 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: seems all the zaqar core team members should be redhater, right? | 21:10 |
| flwang1 | can you send my CV to your boss? | 21:10 |
| exploreshaifali | haha | 21:10 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: you can just send it to me ;) | 21:10 |
| vkmc | lol flwang1 | 21:11 |
| flwang1 | ok, seriously, we need more guys from the other org | 21:11 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: yeah, I'm not very proud of that but that's the best we can afford from now until ametts sends back ppl from RAX :P | 21:11 |
| vkmc | we need more diversity in our team, please bring more Catalyzers flwang1! | 21:11 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: or you can put more resources :) | 21:12 |
| vkmc | (I just invented a term to call people from Catalyst) | 21:12 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i will | 21:12 |
| flaper87 | Catalystizers is WAY better | 21:12 |
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| flaper87 | just sayin' | 21:12 |
| vkmc | hahaha | 21:12 |
| flaper87 | flwang1 I'll take your word on that | 21:12 |
| flaper87 | :) | 21:12 |
| vkmc | just repeat it 10 times non-stop | 21:12 |
| vkmc | and tape yourself doing that | 21:12 |
| flaper87 | argh, MY HEAD! | 21:12 |
| vkmc | and post it to twitter | 21:13 |
| vkmc | thanks | 21:13 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i will eat my words if you still don't buy a beer for me | 21:13 |
| flaper87 | did anyone see my last vine? | 21:13 |
| flaper87 | T_T | 21:13 |
| vkmc | nope | 21:13 |
| * flaper87 keeps embarrasing himself | 21:13 | |
| flaper87 | ok, don't go there | 21:13 |
| vkmc | too late | 21:13 |
| flaper87 | flwang1 I'll buy you TONS of beers | 21:13 |
| flaper87 | with vkmc's credit card | 21:13 |
| flaper87 | ok, moving on | 21:14 |
| flaper87 | #topic OpenStack Summit (Tokyo) | 21:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Summit (Tokyo) (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:14 | |
| vkmc | flaper87, good luck with that :D haha | 21:14 |
| flaper87 | Not much to say there, to be honest. However, we need to start planning sessions. | 21:14 |
| vkmc | yeah | 21:14 |
| vkmc | I have one I have one I have one | 21:14 |
| flaper87 | We know what features landed in Liberty and the ones left for Mitaka | 21:14 |
| flaper87 | therefore, I'd like us to start brainstorming on specs on what's next in terms of features | 21:14 |
| flaper87 | Just like for Liberty, I think we should keep the number of features in Zaqar small and focus on having other projects consuming Zaqar | 21:15 |
| flaper87 | In addition to that, I believe we should have sessions for things that have a spec | 21:15 |
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| flaper87 | Rather than going there and just do basic brainstorming, I'd like us to use that time to clear doubts and move some specs forward | 21:16 |
| vkmc | so, maybe its a good moment to talk about integration with Horizon? | 21:16 |
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| flaper87 | Although, this needs to be discussed with the next PTL as well | 21:16 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: what kind of integration? | 21:17 |
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| flaper87 | vkmc: horizon consiming Zaqar? or having a Zaqar UI on horizon? | 21:17 |
| vkmc | flaper87, Horizon consuming Zaqar | 21:17 |
| vkmc | for the Zaqar UI... I think that one is not so urgent | 21:17 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: exploreshaifali is working on the UI, AFAIR | 21:18 |
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| exploreshaifali | yes | 21:18 |
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| vkmc | cool | 21:18 |
| vkmc | I didn't know about it | 21:18 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: re horizon consuming Zaqar, it'd be really cool | 21:18 |
| exploreshaifali | today only I had a littile discussion about same with one Horizon dev | 21:18 |
| flaper87 | However, we should also prioritize adoption efforts | 21:18 |
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| flaper87 | This cycle we focused a lot on Heat and we had tons of help from Heat folks | 21:18 |
| exploreshaifali | and he asked me to prepare a BP first | 21:18 |
| vkmc | nice | 21:18 |
| flaper87 | Next cycle, I think we could focus on either guest-agent or user-facing notifications | 21:19 |
| flaper87 | At this point, I'm leaning towards the later since it's definitely a use-case that hasn't been explored enough | 21:19 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: any links about the integration with heat? should we invite heat folks to give/join a session? | 21:19 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: I think we should give space to other projects this time | 21:20 |
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| flaper87 | We've had Heat sessions for 2 summits in a row | 21:20 |
| flaper87 | and we've gotten to the point where heat is consuming Zaqar | 21:20 |
| flaper87 | now we need to help other projects | 21:20 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: ok, cool | 21:20 |
| flaper87 | Also, I'd like to see a session on the client | 21:21 |
| flaper87 | I hope dynarro will be able to attend and prepare that session | 21:21 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i vote for a GUI of zaqar in horizon and the integration of horizon | 21:21 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: I'd love to have a GUI but that's at the bottom of my interests and what I believe is urgent | 21:21 |
| exploreshaifali | I think I can prepare spec for zaqar GUI before summit | 21:22 |
| flaper87 | unless you folks think otherwise, I'd prefer to stick with that | 21:22 |
| flaper87 | exploreshaifali: that should be a horizon spec, though. | 21:22 |
| exploreshaifali | yeah | 21:22 |
| flaper87 | I'd love to attend that session if it is scheduled and approved | 21:22 |
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| exploreshaifali | great! :) | 21:23 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: how about the swift notification middleware? | 21:23 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: that's another exciting use-case, great thinking. | 21:23 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: we should also sync with them | 21:23 |
| flaper87 | #info sync with notmyname and swift folks about swift consuming zaqar | 21:24 |
| * flaper87 intentionally summoned notmyname | 21:24 | |
| flwang1 | s/notmyname/flaper87 | 21:24 |
| flaper87 | #info sync with folks from horizon to clarify their use-case for Zaqar now that websocket is in place | 21:24 |
| flaper87 | ok, anything else? | 21:25 |
| * notmyname will be happy to talk. is in meeting for a few more minute | 21:25 | |
| flaper87 | Can we convert the above into action items? | 21:25 |
| flaper87 | flwang1 would you like to sync with ppl from swift ? | 21:26 |
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| flaper87 | vkmc: would you like to sync with folks from horizon ? | 21:26 |
| vkmc | flaper87, sure | 21:26 |
| flaper87 | I will sync again w/ folks from Sahara since their required feature is implemented | 21:26 |
| vkmc | #action vkmc sync with folks from horizon | 21:26 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: yes, and what's the ppl you're talking about? | 21:26 |
| flaper87 | #action vkmc to sync with folks from horizon about a possible joint session for zaqar+horizon | 21:27 |
| vkmc | thanks | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | #action flwang1 to sync with folks from swift about a possible joint session for zaqar+swift (swift notification middleware) | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | #action flwang1 to sync with folks from Sahara about their guest-agent use-case | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | damnit | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | #undo | 21:27 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Action object at 0x9a13cd0> | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | #action flaper87 to sync with folks from Sahara about their guest-agent use-case | 21:27 |
| flaper87 | ooooooooooooooooook | 21:28 |
| flaper87 | we can move on now | 21:28 |
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| flaper87 | #topic Testing and Focus | 21:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Testing and Focus (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:28 | |
| flaper87 | I believe this cycle has been productive so far. We still don't have a crazy load of users but we've moved forward with steadier steps | 21:28 |
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| flaper87 | Now is the time to test what we've done and make sure it's as rock solid as we can expect it to be | 21:29 |
| flaper87 | therefore, I'd like to call for a joint testing session | 21:29 |
| flaper87 | What day from next week would work for you ? | 21:29 |
| flaper87 | I'd like us to dedicate a full-day (or as much as you can from that day) to testing Zaqar | 21:30 |
| flaper87 | Single node, multi-node, pre-signed url, websocket, etc | 21:30 |
| flaper87 | V2 needs testing-love | 21:30 |
| flaper87 | and so on | 21:30 |
| vkmc | sounds good | 21:30 |
| vkmc | Thursday/Friday are usually good for me (no meetings those days) | 21:31 |
| exploreshaifali | yea its exciting | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: what about you? | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | exploreshaifali: what about you? | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | Thursday/Friday? | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | Shall we do Friday? | 21:31 |
| exploreshaifali | I am ok with any day | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | It'd be like a hackday | 21:31 |
| flwang1 | Friday works for me | 21:31 |
| exploreshaifali | yup Friday will work | 21:31 |
| flaper87 | Awesome, Friday next week it is | 21:31 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i'm interested in the performance of notification | 21:31 |
| exploreshaifali | :D | 21:32 |
| flaper87 | That should give us enough time to land the remanining patches | 21:32 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: yeah, same here. I'll work on a list of tasks for the test-day | 21:32 |
| flaper87 | Etherpad, that is. | 21:32 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: cool | 21:32 |
| vkmc | I want to check websocket vs wsgi :o | 21:32 |
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| flaper87 | awesome | 21:33 |
| flaper87 | all that sounds awesome | 21:33 |
| flaper87 | ok, I don't have much else on this topic | 21:33 |
| flaper87 | I wanted us to find a date and schedule the test-day | 21:34 |
| flaper87 | I'll send an email to the mailing list and then a reminder next-week | 21:34 |
| vkmc | cool | 21:34 |
| flaper87 | anything else? | 21:34 |
| flaper87 | I'll take that as a no | 21:35 |
| flaper87 | #topic Open Discussion | 21:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Zaqar)" | 21:35 | |
| vkmc | I have a few things for Open Discussion | 21:36 |
| vkmc | 1. Rally gate | 21:36 |
| flaper87 | go | 21:36 |
| flwang1 | i have a open question | 21:36 |
| vkmc | it has been failing for a while now | 21:36 |
| flwang1 | yep, i saw the rally gate failure recently | 21:36 |
| vkmc | and I couldn't be able to find logs on that | 21:36 |
| vkmc | zaqar server seems not to be starting and there are on logs on the screens | 21:36 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: yeah, I was going to work on the gate today and then got side-tracked | 21:36 |
| flwang1 | vkmc: is there a bug? | 21:36 |
| flwang1 | i can work on that | 21:36 |
| vkmc | flwang1, nope, I didn't file a bug | 21:37 |
| flaper87 | that said, I think the reason the server is not showing the logs is because of the "fork" code | 21:37 |
| vkmc | oh | 21:37 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: how's the policy work going ? | 21:37 |
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| flwang1 | flaper87: it works based on my test, and i'm trying to make the unit test pass | 21:37 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: cool, I look forward to your patch | 21:38 |
| flwang1 | we just need some decorators like this https://review.openstack.org/#/c/209910/1/zaqar/transport/wsgi/v2_0/queues.py | 21:38 |
| flaper87 | I'm heads down on fixing bugs now so, lets try to find as many as we can and fix them | 21:38 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i have another topic | 21:39 |
| flaper87 | go | 21:39 |
| flwang1 | not sure if all of you guys are interested in | 21:39 |
| flwang1 | as we're trying to adopt zaqar | 21:39 |
| flwang1 | but you know, we're public cloud(though we're small), so we need to charge our customer | 21:39 |
| flwang1 | for zaqar, the question is how to charge our customer | 21:40 |
| flwang1 | you know, there is no api request statistics components in openstack, like AWS | 21:40 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: I'm very interested in that topic | 21:40 |
| vkmc | flwang1, me too | 21:41 |
| flaper87 | and I'm sad we couldn't improve our story there during Liberty | 21:41 |
| flwang1 | so we're thinking another way to charge user based on message number | 21:41 |
| flaper87 | That said, I think we have some options | 21:41 |
| flaper87 | These options include emitting things to ceilo or statsd | 21:41 |
| exploreshaifali | may be by counting/tracking the size and number of messages | 21:41 |
| flwang1 | but because AWS and RAX are charging based on API request | 21:41 |
| flwang1 | so i'm not sure if it's stupid ideae | 21:41 |
| vkmc | flwang1, AWS SQS/SNS have the same charging schema? | 21:41 |
| vkmc | than the rest of AWS | 21:42 |
| flaper87 | What if we leave that to the cloud provider? What if we limit ourselves to emit as much useful information as we can? | 21:42 |
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| flwang1 | First 1 million Amazon SQS Requests per month are free $0.50 per 1 million Amazon SQS Requests per month thereafter ($0.00000050 per SQS Request) | 21:42 |
| flaper87 | Once the cloud provider has info to reason about, it'll be easy to find compeating plans | 21:42 |
| flwang1 | vkmc: ^ | 21:42 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: requests or messages? | 21:42 |
| vkmc | I see | 21:42 |
| flaper87 | What about bulk requests ? | 21:42 |
| vkmc | requests | 21:42 |
| flaper87 | erm, bulk inserts | 21:43 |
| flwang1 | request | 21:43 |
| vkmc | A single request can have from 1 to 10 messages, up to a maximum total payload of 256KB. | 21:43 |
| flwang1 | api request | 21:43 |
| flaper87 | ok | 21:43 |
| flaper87 | eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeenteresting | 21:43 |
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| flaper87 | so yeah, I think the best thing we can do is not to start reasoning about what metrics we can emit | 21:43 |
| flaper87 | Then ask for feedback to OPs | 21:43 |
| vkmc | yup | 21:44 |
| flaper87 | and start emitting a sub-set of those metrics | 21:44 |
| flwang1 | flaper87: i was thinking we can create another pipeline plugin like the notifications plugin to count the message numbers for billing | 21:44 |
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| flwang1 | but i'm not sure if that's the correct direction | 21:44 |
| vkmc | would it make sense to consume Ceilometer for this? | 21:44 |
| flwang1 | like i mentioned above, because AWS and RAX didn't go for that | 21:44 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: mmh, I think we already have that info in the transport layer but we'll figure that out later | 21:44 |
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| flwang1 | brb in 5 mins | 21:45 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: yup, I'd say ceilo or statsd | 21:45 |
| vkmc | flaper87, never heard of statsd | 21:45 |
| vkmc | cool | 21:45 |
| flaper87 | I just don't like the idea of working on some specific metrics and say: "This is how you should bill" | 21:45 |
| vkmc | but we can collect metrics | 21:45 |
| vkmc | and the cloud provider decides | 21:46 |
| flaper87 | I'd rather have a set of metrics and say: "This is what you have for billing, you figure it out" | 21:46 |
| vkmc | "ok, I'll charge on no of queues... no of messages... no of requests.." | 21:46 |
| vkmc | yeah | 21:46 |
| vkmc | charge for all the things | 21:46 |
| flaper87 | "You've been breathing a lot today, Sir. We'll charge you 0.01 for each breath you took" | 21:47 |
| vkmc | haha | 21:47 |
| flaper87 | lets give flwang1 a couple of mins to come back and comment, otherwise, we'll call it | 21:47 |
| vkmc | sure | 21:47 |
| vkmc | in the meantime | 21:47 |
| vkmc | I want to gently remind | 21:47 |
| vkmc | 2. docs | 21:47 |
| vkmc | we don't have docs whatsoever for api v2.0 | 21:48 |
| vkmc | I'll document websocket, but we also need some love for the other features | 21:48 |
| vkmc | well, ws is for v1.1 | 21:48 |
| flaper87 | True that, I'll do my part on pre-signed URLs | 21:48 |
| vkmc | let's say, new features | 21:48 |
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| vkmc | 3. client and cli | 21:49 |
| vkmc | we need to catch up with reviews there as well | 21:49 |
| vkmc | we have implementations for pools and flavors for the cli, and support for v2 for several endpoints | 21:49 |
| flaper87 | yup yup | 21:49 |
| flaper87 | I'm hoping we can do a zaqarclient release soon | 21:49 |
| vkmc | yeah me too | 21:50 |
| flaper87 | I'd like to work on pre-signed urls first | 21:50 |
| vkmc | dynarro has been working a lot on that | 21:50 |
| flaper87 | niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice | 21:50 |
| vkmc | and we also have some contributions diga and exploreshaifali did | 21:50 |
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| flaper87 | +1 | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | ok, lets call it! | 21:51 |
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| vkmc | sweet | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | flwang1: we can keep talking in #os-zaqar | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | THANKS FOLKS! | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | great meeting and lets keep it up | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | #endmeeting | 21:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:51 | |
| vkmc | YEAH :D :D | 21:51 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Aug 17 21:51:32 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:51 |
| vkmc | thanks | 21:51 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2015/zaqar.2015-08-17-21.01.html | 21:51 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2015/zaqar.2015-08-17-21.01.txt | 21:51 |
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| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zaqar/2015/zaqar.2015-08-17-21.01.log.html | 21:51 |
| exploreshaifali | Thanks everyone! | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | vkmc: ^ <3 | 21:51 |
| flaper87 | :D | 21:51 |
| vkmc | flaper87, ^<3 | 21:51 |
| vkmc | :) | 21:51 |
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