Wednesday, 2015-11-11

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Sam-I-Amanyone home for the install guide meeting?01:01
* fifieldt waves01:01
* fifieldt tips hat01:01
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Sam-I-Amwelp, lets get this party started01:02
Sam-I-Amis this still under "docteam" ?01:02
Sam-I-Amseems kind of weird01:02
Sam-I-Am#startmeeting docinstallteam01:03
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 01:03:04 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is Sam-I-Am. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.01:03
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:03
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'docinstallteam'01:03
Sam-I-Ami think thats it01:03
Sam-I-Amfirst thing - meeting time, actually date01:03
Sam-I-Amin liberty, the apac and us meeting were swapped so that the apac general docs meeting (30 minutes before now) wouldn't conflict01:04
Sam-I-Ami suggest we swap these meetings back01:04
Sam-I-Amif nothing else, respond to the existing ML thread01:04
Sam-I-Amany thoughts?01:05
bmossI think that makes sense, so long as it doesn't conflict for anyone else.01:05
Sam-I-Amwell yeah01:05
bmossEvery two weeks (on even weeks) on Wednesday at 0100 UTC in #openstack-meeting-301:05
bmossEvery two weeks (on odd weeks) on Tuesday at 1300 UTC in #openstack-meeting-301:05
Sam-I-Amhence why it'd go to the list. probably just an oversight.01:05
bmossso swap the even and odd weeks there01:05
Sam-I-Amalso, christian instead of me would be chairing thee first meeting for mitaka :)01:05
Sam-I-Am#action suggest week swap on existing mailing list thread01:06
bmossI'll respond to the ML. If anyone else wants to pile on with an opinion, that's good too.01:06
Sam-I-Amerr, #topic meeting time01:06
Sam-I-Am#topic meeting time01:06
*** openstack changes topic to "meeting time (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:06
Sam-I-Am#action suggest week swap on existing mailing list thread01:06
Sam-I-Ammy brain hurts01:06
Sam-I-Ammoving on?01:07
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:07
Sam-I-Ami'm on the fence about such things for reasons described in the patch01:07
Sam-I-Amlong story short, we see a lot of people doing first installs in VMs, but supporting a specific semi-commercial hypervisor and then having to test the guide using it in addition to bare metal... lots of overhead.01:08
Sam-I-Amcontent is good, but content in the install guide needs a lot of love to keep it working01:09
bmosscould we make this an appendix or something? I.e. make it seem less official, but keep it as information that might help some people get going?01:09
Sam-I-Amthen comes questions like which version of virtualbox do we support and how do we deal with virtualbox problems?01:09
Sam-I-Amsure, except it'll go stale01:09
fifieldtI like it as an appendix, if it can be kept up to date01:10
Sam-I-Amthis might be different if we had some people willing to maintain and test it every cycle... along with triaging bugs01:10
Sam-I-Amwe'd also have to ask questions in bugs like "is this on a vm?"01:10
Sam-I-Amunless the issue was obvious01:10
Sam-I-Amanything else?01:11
Sam-I-Amdo we need to take this to the list?01:11
fifieldtI thought the purpose of this patch was to show how to setup the basic vms/nets for the hypervisor, ya?01:11
bmossI wonder if we can get some stats about where people install using the Install Guide01:11
Sam-I-Amit is01:11
fifieldtit's something that you kinda follow first if you need a bit of help01:12
fifieldtbut after that it's all install guide01:12
fifieldtso I'm not sure it would lead to "is this on a vm?" bugs?01:12
Sam-I-Amwell, thats why i liked our generic hypervisor comments... "you may need to do these things to your hypervisor... its up to you to figure out the details"01:12
Sam-I-Amvs "heres how you do this on virtualbox" which leads to "i did X on virtualbox, and my stuff isnt working"01:13
Sam-I-Amand since we 'support' it, we have the burden of triaging the bug or supporting something thats not openstack01:13
fifieldtnaw, I don't think that changes our triage01:13
fifieldtwe'd still send those folks to virtualbox for help01:13
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Sam-I-Amwe'll still need testers and maintainers, and probably some limit on versions that work01:14
fifieldtperhaps a few more links to virtualbox docs from the proposed patch would be good?01:14
Sam-I-Amand concerned about translating screen shots01:14
fifieldtyeah, I think the screenshots could go away01:14
Sam-I-Amexcept there's really no other way to show how you configure vbox01:15
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fifieldtexcept words :P01:15
Sam-I-Amother option is trying to provide pre-configured files01:15
fifieldtthe patch doesn't seem terribly unmaintainable01:15
Sam-I-Amif such a thing exists01:15
fifieldtoh yeah, that totally exists for KVM01:16
Sam-I-Amin kvm, that'd be ab xml file01:16
Sam-I-Amso, if were supporting vbox, does that mean we also need to support kvm and vmware?01:16
Sam-I-Amthose are the main three i see people using01:16
fifieldtI think that depends on people who want to write and maintain 'em ;)01:16
fifieldtthis is a "nice to have"01:17
bmossThis sounds like something that needs more discussion on the ML. Sam-I-Am, do you mind starting the discussion with your reservations?01:17
Sam-I-Amalright... so....01:17
Sam-I-Amsure. my reservations are in the patch comments too.01:18
bmossgood point. Then maybe just a short email pointing to the patch?01:18
fifieldtsounds good to me01:18
bmosssee if we can get some more eyes on it01:18
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Sam-I-Am#action place issue on mailing list for a wider audience01:18
fifieldtit might be that this should just live somewhere more rough and ready :)01:19
fifieldtcould consider asking osops01:19
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fifieldtthe loose collective of ops doing interesting things :)01:20
fifieldtthey have config snippets, scripts etc at the moment01:20
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fifieldtdoc snippets could be of interest, but *shrug*01:20
Sam-I-Amwant to take that on?01:20
Sam-I-Amget your feet wet agai with docs? :)01:20
fifieldthehe :) sadly I can't commit time for this01:21
Sam-I-Amsleep less?01:21
Sam-I-Amaight,  moving on01:22
Sam-I-Am#topic liberty status01:22
*** openstack changes topic to "liberty status (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:22
Sam-I-Amanother wave of annoying but easy to fix bugs came in over the last week or so. i just triaged a bunch and we should try to get to as many as we can prior to the stable/liberty cut in a few days.01:23
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Sam-I-Ammost of these issues seem related to packaging, so its easier to add workarounds than solve them the right way, but we should also open parallel bugs for the packages01:24
bmossI'm starting to have adverse reactions to the word 'packages'01:24
Sam-I-Amsounds about right01:25
Sam-I-Amfor all that the install guide does for packagers, you'd think we would have some hotline to them when we come across a problem01:25
bmossnot the worst idea01:25
Sam-I-Amso far it hasnt happened01:25
Sam-I-Amand we've asked, many times01:25
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Sam-I-Amubuntu has gotten a bit better01:26
bmossbut yeah, let's try to get those done. I'll take a look at the list today. Maybe also advertise on the ML? In the context of getting it done before the cut?01:26
loquacitiesi've got a draft in my email of what a source install would look like01:26
Sam-I-Amloquacities: phil's thing?01:26
Sam-I-Amthats a potentially viable option to analyze further01:26
Sam-I-Amit fixes one thing at the expense of others01:26
loquacitiesi liked anne's idea of doing an A/B test01:26
loquacitiesyeah, no option is foolproof01:27
Sam-I-Amif anything, it would be added to the existing guide01:27
bmosscould be worth doing the A/B01:27
Sam-I-Amrather than replace01:27
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Sam-I-Amsee how many takers we get. but even to get to that level requires testing and maintenance01:27
bmossloquacities, how much effort do you think it would take to put the source install bit together?01:27
loquacitiesi haven't looked that closely yet01:27
loquacitiesthe guide he sent me looks more or less complete as it stands, though01:28
Sam-I-Amsource installs have come up for almost as long as i've been here. we get some initial content, but no ones willing to test/maintain it.01:28
fifieldthard to get maintainers for something that few use :(01:28
Sam-I-Amwell, i'd hope people would see the light about source01:29
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Sam-I-Amanyway, not really enough quorum here to decide anything01:29
Sam-I-Amanother mailing list thread i guess01:29
Sam-I-Amor more of these meetings01:30
fifieldtjust not how the vast majority are doing their infrastructure, and therefore not a good learning experience :)01:30
Sam-I-Amkind of surprised people are using upstream packages01:30
fifieldtthose who are advanced enough to work with source use it to make their own packages :)01:30
Sam-I-Amthats what i figured01:31
Sam-I-Ambut the ultimate source is... source01:31
Sam-I-Amnot packages from the distros01:31
fifieldtfeel the source, luke01:31
bmosstautology FTW!01:31
Sam-I-Amaight, this drifted a bit off-topic...01:31
Sam-I-Am#topic debian version of the installation guide01:32
*** openstack changes topic to "debian version of the installation guide (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:32
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Sam-I-Amlong story short, not going to be ready for liberty... and some of the patches going in are inadvertently breaking other distros that we've validated.01:32
fifieldtdamn :|01:32
loquacitiesyeah, it's messy01:32
loquacitiesbut there's action, so unwilling to discourage it01:32
Sam-I-Amso i suggest we bump these patches until after the stable/liberty cut01:33
Sam-I-Ammeanwhile i still have some things to fix from one or two that did make it in01:33
Sam-I-Amthat was easy01:33
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Sam-I-Am#topic bug triage process01:33
*** openstack changes topic to "bug triage process (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:33
Sam-I-Amjust a reminder... please only patch triaged bugs. if you're triaging bugs, make sure you can verify the problem somewhere. most of the bugs we see are not actual bugs, but they get "fixed" and break the guide.01:34
Sam-I-Amalong those lines... if you're doing a patch review and it adds/changes/modifies/deletes conditionals, make sure the patch doesn't inadvertently mess up rendering of content for other distros01:35
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bmossAndreas sent a timely reminder to the ML about that.01:35
Sam-I-Amwe've taken great leaps to make content less distro-specific, but debian insists on using debconf and that's causing a lot of problems to come back01:36
bmosstbh, not checking the rendered output is a not uncommon problem.01:36
Sam-I-Amsure. and the install guide is unique in that respect.01:36
Sam-I-Amif you're not used to it, you dont do it01:36
bmossyep. Gotta check all the versions!01:37
Sam-I-Amlast topic01:37
Sam-I-Am#topic update the wiki page01:37
*** openstack changes topic to "update the wiki page (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:37
Sam-I-Amapparently this needs an update01:37
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bmossyeah, it is just a bit out of date now.01:38
bmossI can fix it up.01:38
Sam-I-Ami'll just assign it to christian since he's not here01:38
Sam-I-Amor you :)01:38
bmossI've heard fifieldt has a lot of free time.01:39
Sam-I-Amhe does01:39
Sam-I-Am#topic open discussion01:39
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: docinstallteam)"01:39
fifieldtso very much01:39
Sam-I-Amanything else?01:39
bmoss#action bmoss to update
bmossnope. I'm good.01:40
Sam-I-Amaight, time to go drink some tabasco for this fever01:40
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Sam-I-Amburn it out!01:40
Sam-I-Amthanks everyone01:41
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"01:41
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 01:41:09 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)01:41
openstackMinutes (text):
bmossthanks all. Catch ya later.01:41
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eladyTaas in 5 min06:26
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dederyhi :)06:27
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tamarhi  everyone06:30
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vnyyadshall we get started06:31
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dederyyep :) It's already very late for some of the participants I guess..06:32
vnyyadok sure06:32
vnyyadwelcome to the first TaaS meeting06:32
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vnyyadcan we have a round of intro from all our participants06:33
dederyGreat to be here06:33
eladyHi all, Elad Yosef from ALU06:33
vnyyadi am vinay from Ericsson06:34
dederyI'm David Edery from CloudBand ALU06:34
ktatsuroHi , I'm Tatsuro Kimura from NTT@japan06:34
KazI'm Kazuhiro Suzuki from Fujitsu Laboratories.06:35
tamarTamar Inbar-Shelach from ALU06:35
soichiHi!, I'm Soichi from Fujitsu Laboratories Ltd., Japan.06:35
irenabHi, I’m Irena from Midokura06:35
yamamotoyamamoto from midokura06:35
yamamotovnyyad: anil_rao: can you #startmeeting?06:35
anil_raoHi, This is Anil from Gigamon (Santa Clara, California)06:35
ryu_ishimotoryu from Midokura06:35
openstackvnyyad: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee'06:35
vnyyad#startmeeting Tap as a Service Meeting06:36
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 06:36:29 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is vnyyad. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.06:36
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Tap as a Service Meeting)"06:36
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tap_as_a_service_meeting'06:36
vnyyadstarted now06:36
vnyyadso lets dive into the agenda06:37
vnyyadi guess we got the intro from all present now06:37
vnyyadnext up the status of the project06:37
anil_raoIts great to see all the new folks. Welcome to TaaS :)06:37
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vnyyadi guess most of you were in the tokyo summit are appraised of the status06:39
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anil_raoAt the summit we entered serveral immediate work items into etherpad06:40
eladyPlease sync, on current status06:40
anil_rao (see Tap-as-a-Service)06:41
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amotokiis this the meeting agenda?
vnyyadamotoki: yes it is06:42
amotokivnyyad: thanks06:43
yamamoto#link Agenda06:43
vnyyadWe currently have a basic version of TaaS with core features of port mirroring on a OVS switch implemented06:44
vnyyadThanks to contributions from yamamoto in the recent months we have some  unit test cases for TaaS06:45
vnyyadyamamoto: could you give a short description of the work you and others have added to TaaS recently06:47
yamamotoi added unit tests for plugin.  someone needs to write tests for agent-side.06:48
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yamamotoi have halfly baked devstack plugin.  i think i will finish it in near future.06:48
vnyyadyamamoto: thanks06:48
vnyyadi guess the list prepared in the tokyo summit server as a good next step for TaaS (
vnyyadi guess we need to prioritize the activities in that06:50
dedery_as i recall, the number one priority was to get into Neutron's big-tent (thus be in the safe zone from breakage)06:51
vnyyadi agree06:51
anil_raoWe have some items identified under 'Big Tent requirements' section06:52
vnyyadDevstack automation06:52
amotoki+1. In addition, from the point of view of subproject management, it is better to have a portal doc/wiki page.06:52
amotokiI am not sure all attendees to this meeting are aware of all resources (urls) or not.06:53
amotokisorry for interruptiing. please go ahead06:54
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vnyyadamotoki: will add creation of wiki page to the todo list06:54
amotokivnyyad: sounds perfect06:54
yamamotoi don't think wiki is a good idea.  it's better to concentrate to in-tree doc.06:55
vnyyadnext this for Big Tent req is the automated testing06:55
yamamotoi can write skeleton tempest plugin so that others can write actual tests.06:56
vnyyadyamamoto: this will be good, i guess we can all pitch in with writing the test cases06:57
yamamotoand we need agent coverage of unit tests.  any takers?06:57
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dedery_i can take. what kind of tests?06:58
dedery_at Tokyo we've talked about static analysis of the generated flows06:59
dedery_which i assume should be part of the agent tests (since its the one settings the flows) isn't it?06:59
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yamamotoi was talking about unit tests.  i'm not sure about static flow analysis.07:01
anil_raoThe actual flows are programmed into OVS by the TaaS driver07:01
vnyyadand tass driver is invoked by the agent07:01
eladyI can take the API checks07:02
vnyyadelday: thanks07:02
dedery_I can take the unit tests07:03
vnyyadI can help out in that as well07:03
eladyE2E tests ? later?07:04
tamarI'd like to help with the E2E07:04
dedery_E2E should be part of the tempest/API tests no? (same context)07:05
reedipI would also like to help out with the Unit test cases07:06
yamamotoit doesn't need to be, but i think tempest is the best choice at this point.07:06
vnyyadthanks dedery_ and reedip07:07
anil_raoI feel there are a few items that we should also be considering as an immediate goal in addition to the tests07:07
anil_raoTwo of these are: ensuring basic error handling and restoring flows upon TaaS agent restart07:08
anil_raoNothing covering these often leads to bad situations in case a node dies07:09
vnyyadi can take the error handling part07:09
anil_raoi'll look into restoring the flows07:09
anil_raoAs a background activity we should also be discussing 'resource reservation' so that we can take this up with the core Neutron team07:10
anil_raoI think that is necesary in order to come under the Big Tent07:10
vnyyadanil_rao: i agree07:11
vnyyadwas there some discussion around this with the core (formally or otherwise) with the cores?07:11
vnyyadat the summit07:11
anil_raoi did get a chance to briefly discuss this with Armando07:12
anil_raoHis take was that this is a problem seen by a few other projects outside of just TaaS. We might have to have a discussion on this in the main07:12
anil_raoNeutron mailing list of in the Neutron IRC chat.07:12
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vnyyadi guess we can first take a call on how this should be done and then take the discussion with the cores... any thoughts07:13
anil_raoThe current code essentially disables 'anti arp spoofing'. We'll have to co-ordinate OVS table entries to ensure that both projects work well together.07:13
eladyIn the summit we talked about using "on demand allocation" of resources and also alternative option of using MPLS encapsulation.07:13
eladythe "on demand" should be easy, I haven't got to investigate the MPLS thing07:14
eladybut the idea is to encapsulate the mirrored traffic in the same manner SFC does07:15
anil_raowe must however be careful to preseve the isolation guaratees of mirrored traffic (not only from production traffic but other TaaS service instances)07:15
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anil_raoIn my opinion whichever way we proceed we'll need to co-ordinate with other projects to ensure that mirrored traffic is not visible to anyone outside the destination port of a TaaS service instance07:16
soichii agree07:16
vnyyadanil: should we have this resolved before we get into the Big Tent07:17
amotokimore generally speaking, we need to define the order of applying various services: SFC, TaaS, QoS, ...07:17
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amotokithe same topic was raised in the context of SFC disucssion.07:18
anil_raovnyyad: We need to discuss this as a group and make a proposal that we can present to the Neutron core team.07:18
vnyyadanil_rao: i agree07:18
anil_raoWe don't need to have it all implemented rightaway but I feel that this question will come up when a decision to include TaaS in the big tent is being made07:19
anil_raoArmando had mentioned to me that this issue was being faced by several other projects such as kuryer, SFC, IP networks, etc.07:20
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vnyyaddo we need to coordinate or atleast watch out for the approaches they take?07:21
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anil_raoYes, we should be watching activity around this on the core Neutron mailing list and IRC channels07:21
vnyyadi guess we have enough activities to get started on targeting the Big Tent07:22
anil_raoYes :)07:22
dedery_looks like it :)07:23
dedery_i'd like to address the blueprint at some point if it's possible07:23
vnyyaddedery_: sure07:24
vnyyadjust to be sure can everyone who took up some activity repeat what they will look into07:25
dedery_adding unit tests07:25
vnyyadError handling07:25
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yamamotodevstack and tempest plugin07:25
anil_raoRestore flows upon Agent restart07:25
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vnyyadok then we can get going on these onces to start with07:27
vnyyadanything else to be discussed today07:28
dedery_there was another task which we've talked about but it's not mentioned in etherpad - the "productization" of the agent and plugin (making it a service and not a manual script if i recall. anil_rao do you remember?)07:28
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yamamoto"service" in which sense?07:29
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anil_raoWe essentially need the TaaS agent to get launched automatically07:29
anil_raoIt is currently started manually from a shell script07:30
vnyyadhaa ok yes07:30
yamamotomy impression is that taas agent should be turned into an agent extension driver eventually.07:31
anil_raoI can look into this07:31
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anil_raoI guess we are out of time.07:32
dedery_yeh, i'll keep my blueprint questions for next time :)07:32
irenabyamamoto: +1 on agent extension driver07:32
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yamamotoi guess we already have enough work for a week.07:32
irenabsimilar pattern to QoS agent extension07:33
yamamotoirenab: indeed07:33
vnyyadwe can add this discussion on driver extension to next weeks agenda07:33
vnyyadi guess we are out of time07:34
anil_raoThanks everyone.07:34
yamamotothank you07:34
dedery_thank you07:34
soichisee you07:34
vnyyadthanks for everyone for participating. We got a good list of work to start off with07:34
vnyyadthanks and see you07:34
dedery_vnyyad: i think that you should use the #endmeeting now07:35
vnyyadthanks for pointing it out :)07:35
vnyyadbye all07:35
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"07:36
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 07:36:06 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)07:36
openstackMinutes (text):
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amotokibye all07:36
eladybye all07:36
ktatsurothanks all07:36
dedery_yamamoto/amotoki - can we take the unit-test discussion offline?07:37
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reedipdedery_ kindly include me as well, if possible07:37
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dedery_no problems. IRC/emails?07:38
yamamotodedery_: i'm leaving from keyboard right now.  feel free to email or ping me later.07:38
reedipdedery_ , sent on the chat07:38
amotokidedery_: me too. I am going to another meeting. both email or irc (#-neutron) works for me.07:39
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dedery_thank you very much.07:40
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ifat_afek#startmeeting vitrage08:59
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 08:59:36 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is ifat_afek. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.08:59
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: vitrage)"08:59
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'vitrage'08:59
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emalinhello all09:00
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ifat_afekHi everyone, welcome to vitrage weekly meeting. Posting a link to the agenda:09:00
ifat_afek#topic Meeting Summaries09:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Meeting Summaries (Meeting topic: vitrage)"09:00
ifat_afekLet’s go over the meetings we had during the last week, and see how we progressed.09:00
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ifat_afekWe had a meeting with everyone involved in Vitrage project. We went over the high-level architecture, and decided about the responsibilities of the different teams.09:01
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alexey_weylWe had a blueprints meeting, and decided on the blueprints that needs to be done for mitaka. In addition we thought of more blueprints which will be done if we will have the time09:02
alexey_weylThe blueprints can be seen in our launchpad and also in github and gerrit under vitrage-specs09:03
alexey_weylif anyone has any reviews on the blueprints it will be great.09:04
alexey_weylWe are planning to finish the the blueprints reviews until the next meeting09:04
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alexey_weylthis is the link to the blueprints in launchpad09:05
ifat_afekThanks. Nadav, can you update about Vitrage Synchronizer meetings?09:05
nadav_yakarwe have written the synchronizer blueprint and gerrit design09:06
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nadav_yakarthese assumes the synchronizer need to deduce the changes out of OS services which returns only a snapshot,09:06
nadav_yakarbut now we are checking which notifications are revealed over the message bus,09:07
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nadav_yakarwhich may enhance our design09:07
elisha_rosensweihave you started to consider non-OS syncronizers as well?09:07
elisha_rosensweiOS = OpenStack09:08
emalinwe are consider them09:08
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* omer_ slaps AlonHeller around a bit with a large fishbot09:08
emalinWe would need to use rest api call to get the data from them09:09
ifat_afekAlon, can you update about the meeting regarding Vitrage UI in horizon?09:09
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AlonHellerI created the UI blueprint for  the system health, and started to setup the devstack09:11
elisha_rosensweiyou can see it here:09:12
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emalinAlon, do you already know how are you going to implement it ?09:13
AlonHellerOmer will create today the blueprint for UI-RCA09:13
AlonHellerNot yet @emalin, Working on that09:14
nadav_yakarfor whoever is interested, following is the most up-to-date synchronizer gerrit review -
nadav_yakar#link -
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ifat_afekRegarding the status of our blueprints, I see that most blueprints were rewritten in gerrit, and match our updated architecture.09:17
ayah alon please add a link to the gerrit09:17
ifat_afek#action ifat_afek make sure we finish updating our blueprints in the following days09:17
ifat_afek#topic Openstack Procedures09:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Openstack Procedures (Meeting topic: vitrage)"09:18
ifat_afekDuring the last week we configured our openstack environments, and have our meetings in the official openstack channel. Thanks mgrosz and alexey_weyl09:18
ifat_afek#topic Next Steps09:19
*** openstack changes topic to "Next Steps (Meeting topic: vitrage)"09:19
mgroszWork that has been done till now: new vitrage, vitrage-specs, vitrage-dashbaord (UI) rpoject are already in github, ready for your code. Note the temaplate in vitrage-specs for new specifications - tests check all titles from the temaple do exist. I still need to push the initial files in the dashboard project.Later, once it wil be relevant, I will09:19
mgrosz also add the vitrage client project (python-vitrageclient).09:19
mgrosz(sorry for the typos...)09:20
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emalinnice work09:20
ifat_afekThanks Maty09:20
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ifat_afekThere are several issues we need to address next.09:21
ifat_afek. First, once we finish writing down all blueprints, we should meet and assign blueprints to the developers that plan to implement them.09:21
ifat_afekWe should also finish the discussions regarding the synchronizer architecture, and update its blueprint.09:22
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emalinWe saw nice openstack project that has code we can use in the syncronizer09:23
emalinIt called search light09:24
alexey_weylWe plan to finish all blueprints review until the next meeting09:24
danoffekcan we reuse that code ?09:25
emalinThis project collect data form OpenStack services for build search DB09:25
emalinWe can use the same logic for our synchronizer09:26
emalinWe would examine the project in the coming days09:26
mrungeemalin, there should be a hook or a notifier. I sounds so ugly to copy code and re-use it in the same way09:27
mrungeor you should get in touch with searchlight folks to make that code a library09:27
nadav_yakar#action talk with them at room openstack-searchlight09:27
alexey_weylThanks mrunge :)09:28
emalinI would get in touch with them09:28
mrungeI believe, you're not alone with the same request. gnocchi or ceilometer should have the same issue09:28
mrunge(or the other way around, searchlight should hook into ceilo or gnocchi)09:28
emalinWe would try to reuse the code of one of these projects09:29
ifat_afekinteresting input, thanks mrunge09:30
mrungeyou're welcome. I was just stating, others might have the same issue as you guys, no need to re-invent the wheel again09:30
ifat_afekthanks, let's move on09:32
ifat_afekOnce we are done with the high level architecture, we should start talking about the interfaces between the different components.09:32
ifat_afekAnyone from Doctor or PinPoint joined our meeting?09:33
ifat_afekWe should contact Doctor and PinPoint guys, and ask them to review our blueprints. It is important to see that our architecture can match their requirements.09:33
alexey_weylI will talk with Doctor guys09:34
ifat_afekok, I'll talk with PinPoint guys09:34
ohadOPNFV summit this week. we will continue discussions with them next week.09:35
ifat_afekok. So let me summarize our action items:09:35
ifat_afek#action all finish the discussions regarding the synchronizer, and optionally update its blueprint09:36
ifat_afek#action all assign blueprints to developers09:36
ifat_afek#action alexey_weyl contact Doctor guys, ask them to review our blueprints09:36
ifat_afek#action ifat_afek contact PinPoint guys, ask them to review our blueprints09:37
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ifat_afek#topic Open Discussion09:37
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: vitrage)"09:37
ifat_afekAnything else?09:37
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AlonHeller@mrunge, do you have any experience with AngularJS Horizon plugin ?09:38
mrungea little AlonHeller09:39
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mrungethe situation is quite clear here, you folks should build a plugin for horizon09:39
AlonHellerOK, I'll talk with you in private. Maybe you can help me.09:39
mrungehmm, maybe we should move that to #openstack-horizon?09:40
mrungeit's nothing super secret, right? it's open source, let's keep it open09:40
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AlonHellerNo secrets09:41
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robcresswellI'm also around to give pointers on the Horizon work09:43
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robcresswellIf you needed advice etc :)09:43
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danoffekthanks !09:44
AlonHellerThanks I moved to the #openstack-horizon group09:44
nitzikowthanks mrunge, robcresswell. we also want to add a screen for active alerts to ceilometer, i saw your reply on email for the open blueprint09:45
robcresswellI wasn't sure if that was the same bp09:45
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nitzikowyes we are checking it with the guys who opened it09:45
mrungeugh. the situation with ceilometer is a bit unfortunate currently09:46
ifat_afekwhy? can you explain?09:46
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mrungeuhm, currentl metering support in horizon is quite unusable09:46
nitzikowthe vitrage project should use or leverage a screen of active alerts. we must use the ceilometer for that09:46
mrungewe're not managing alarms at all09:47
mrungebut we would like to do09:47
mrunge *hint*09:47
nitzikowwe will be happy to work on that :)09:47
ifat_afekwe need to have alarms list in horizon, because we would like to show RCA on alarms09:48
mrungeso managing alarms would probably be a blueprint for current horizon09:48
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robcresswellmrunge: There is a bp for it already, which is being revived by someone09:49
mrungeoh great robcresswell09:50
danoffekwe have blueprints for it09:50
alexey_weylok, we'll check it09:50
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robcresswellnp :)09:51
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elisha_rosensweiI will check what the current status us, and coordinate with AlonHeller to push this bp forward09:53
ifat_afekcool, thanks09:53
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elisha_rosenswei*us* = is09:53
ifat_afek#action elisha_rosenswei check horizon alarm management blueprint09:53
ifat_afekanything else?09:53
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amir_gurI don't think so09:54
ifat_afekok, so goodbye everybody, see you next week09:54
ayahsee you next week09:54
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"09:55
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 09:55:01 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)09:55
openstackMinutes (text):
mrungethanks everybody09:55
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alexey_weylThanks :)09:57
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david-lyle#startmeeting Horizon12:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 12:00:29 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is david-lyle. Information about MeetBot at
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openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.12:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Horizon)"12:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'horizon'12:00
mrungehey o/12:01
doug-fis_\o morning all12:01
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david-lyleLet's get rolling12:02
david-lyleSeveral of us attended the summit in Tokyo two weeks ago12:03
david-lyleas a reminder, the gist of the conversations were recorded12:04
-amotoki- it seems there was no session on Friday afternoon12:04
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david-lyleamotoki: there was little contention and people were ready to do other things :)12:04
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david-lyle2 people were there at 2 pm, so we adjourned and enjoyed Tokyo12:05
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doug-fishA much different Friday than the previous summit.12:05
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r1chardj0n3swe were very efficient, yes12:05
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r1chardj0n3sI think the rapid agreement on priorities helped :-)12:05
neillcSo much agreement...12:06
david-lyleI also want to thank amotoki for arranging the meetup on Monday night, excellent location and a good time. Thank you!12:06
robcresswell+1, although I was late :)12:06
r1chardj0n3sI was sad I missed it, but I flew in too late12:06
doug-fishyes - thanks amotoki!12:06
amotokivery happy to hear you all enjoyed Tokyo (and more Japan) !12:07
david-lylethe resulting priority list for Mitaka can be found12:08
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david-lyleHighest priority is really documenting plugins and theming and testing, all of which are in progress12:09
david-lylebasically give users and operators enough information to successfully use all the nice features we've been adding12:10
david-lyler1chardj0n3s: I saw that our pbr issue is unlikely to become unblocked12:11
david-lylewhich was another critical priority12:11
r1chardj0n3sthat's a problem because it's blocked on lifeless12:11
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r1chardj0n3sI've engaged with him post-summit but I think he's got other priorities12:11
r1chardj0n3sand he's the only pbr core12:12
david-lylewe may need to consider other solutions :/12:12
mrungeso, that leaves us hanging somewhere?12:12
r1chardj0n3sI'm not sure what other solutions there are, but yeah, we're blocked on being able to release thru openstack infra :/12:12
mrungeif releasing is blocked, isn't that a super-urgent-high-critical issue?12:13
david-lyleadding another group with publishing privileges other than openstack-infra?12:13
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r1chardj0n3sso the core problem is that we need some credentials to publish to pypi that we can all share12:14
r1chardj0n3sopenstack infra have solved that problem12:14
r1chardj0n3swithout using their solution, we'll have to implement our own solution12:14
david-lyleare there groups on pypi?12:14
r1chardj0n3sno, sadly12:15
mrungeI *know* I released at least one django_openstack_auth just by tagging it12:15
r1chardj0n3syou can have multiple maintainers for a package12:15
mrungebut that has been a year since then...?12:15
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david-lyleso openstack-infra is just an account that multiple people have access to?12:15
amotokiIIRC openstack infra use openstack-ci account to access PyPI.12:15
david-lylemrunge: d-o-a is not an issue12:15
r1chardj0n3smrunge: that package doesn't run into the problem that the xstatic packages do: 4 digit versions are rejected by infra because pbr12:15
david-lyleonly xstatic with x.x.x.x version strings12:15
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amotokiahh... pbr now supports only x.y.z12:16
david-lyleand not looking highly likely to change12:16
r1chardj0n3sthe spec to change pbr is fyi12:17
robcresswellAre pbr changes just at the mercy of a single developer?12:17
r1chardj0n3srobcresswell: yes12:17
r1chardj0n3spersonally I think that's an amazing risk that OpenStack is taking12:18
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robcresswellWhat are the alternatives? We produce our own horizon-infra procedure?12:19
david-lyleanother alternative is we deviate from the upstream version numbers12:19
david-lylewhich will be confusing12:19
r1chardj0n3syeah, had considered that, but that would be tres confusing12:19
david-lylejust increment each release and document in a version file or something the real version12:20
r1chardj0n3sI think we considered using .postN at one point, but I believe pbr rejects those too12:20
r1chardj0n3sbut I'm not 100% sure on that. and testing it is difficult ;-)12:20
david-lylebut since we already have releases that would have us starting in weird places12:20
david-lyleand the requirements changes would be challenging12:21
r1chardj0n3sI know we can't use +internal extensions to versions because *pypi* rejects those12:21
david-lyler1chardj0n3s: I thought we tried the postN bit at the midcycle12:21
r1chardj0n3sdavid-lyle: yeah, that was my recollection too12:21
david-lyleto no success12:21
r1chardj0n3showever, I recall some muttering about .postN in another place since then12:22
r1chardj0n3sI'm gonna write myself a note to look into that, *and* to poke Robert again to see if I can get some movement12:22
r1chardj0n3seven if that movement is a final "no"12:22
david-lylewe can try again I suppose, maybe it wasn't postN exactly that we tried, but another of the key words in the 4th value12:23
r1chardj0n3swhich would suck, but at least we know where we stand (not a real project)12:23
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david-lyleThe other critical item from the summit, not document related was moving forward with some angular content on master12:25
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david-lyleany general feedback on the summit this time?12:26
robcresswellFelt like it was good overall. Cross-project sessions seemed pretty unproductive12:26
robcresswellI think next time we should work with the project teams beforehand to discover issues, then discuss how to solve them at the summit12:27
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david-lylerobcresswell: re: x-project or horizon related issues?12:28
robcresswellCeilometer was the one I was specifically thinking of12:28
robcresswelldiscussion seemed a little vague12:28
robcresswellThat may just be my lack of experience with it though.12:28
r1chardj0n3sI learned a lot about ceilometer in that session actually ;-)12:29
r1chardj0n3sI was starting from a pretty ignorant position though, admittedly12:29
david-lylerobcresswell: I thought you were referring to the grander x-project sessions12:29
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robcresswellOh, no sorry12:30
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david-lyleI agree those two sessions could have been more productive, but sometimes the summit is just a good way to start the conversation with the interested parties in the room12:30
david-lyleget everyone up to speed on the unknown together :)12:30
r1chardj0n3syep :)12:31
amotokiit usually happens in neutron sessions..12:31
robcresswellFair enough, t'was just a suggestion12:31
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david-lylerobcresswell: not a bad one12:31
david-lyleany other general feedback?12:32
david-lyleor specific, I suppose12:32
r1chardj0n3spersonally, I'd like to be more prepared for having time like we did on Friday - with the assumption that the next summit will go just as swimmingly :-)12:34
david-lyler1chardj0n3s: after the last summit I just assumed we'd need all that time12:35
robcresswellDifficult to judge though. Travis was saying its the first summit he hasn't left early friday evening, and its the first one he could've left early and not missed anything.12:35
robcresswelldavid-lyle: Agreed12:35
doug-fishmaybe it's not a good assumption we won't meet Friday, but maybe we could reach some agreement on Thursday if we have any other work to do.12:36
david-lylethe other option is not schedule something in the afternoon and have informal time if needed12:36
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doug-fishI'd rather have the time scheduled - it has been important and useful in past summits12:36
r1chardj0n3sI think if I had've been more prepared I could've sat with a couple of people and been productive on Friday arvo12:36
r1chardj0n3ser afternoon12:36
david-lyler1chardj0n3s: sure12:37
neillcWe were all pretty tired by Friday afternoon. That's likely constant.12:37
r1chardj0n3sI just wasn't expecting to have to, and then Friday came and I was too exhausted to think so hard ;-)12:37
amotokiFriday afternoon is a spare time. if we have topics, let's discuss. otherwise enjoy sightseeing or others!12:37
r1chardj0n3sthe one thing that not hanging around on Friday meant was no Horizon post-summit drinks, which I also missed12:38
r1chardj0n3sbecause we disintegrated early12:38
david-lyle r1chardj0n3s: true12:38
doug-fishmaybe we need to schedule more mid-week drinking?12:38
neillcpost summit drinks would have been good :)12:38
david-lylewe didn't properly close things out12:38
robcresswellI think we should do the meetup later in the week12:39
r1chardj0n3swell, I don't want to be that guy, but the *swift* team all got a harbor cruise12:39
r1chardj0n3sof course, swift is a Real Project so someone paid for it  :-/12:40
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robcresswellHey Horizon is real, HP made t-shirts this time12:40
robcresswellI loved in Vancouver when they told Travis "we don't really have anyone working on Horizon"12:40
amotokii think swift is special in this summit. no sponsor in neutron meetup  too12:41
r1chardj0n3sanyway, I did want to make the point that I think things went so smoothly partly because we met only three months prior for the midcycle12:41
david-lyler1chardj0n3s: I would agree with that12:41
r1chardj0n3sso I think there's value in doing that thing again12:41
amotokirobcresswell: really? we use horizon for production12:41
r1chardj0n3samotoki: so do we12:41
robcresswellamotoki: Yeah, just some naive marketing person I think.12:41
r1chardj0n3s(though not in the public cloud, of course)12:42
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robcresswellSo, another mid-cycle?12:42
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david-lyleI took the action to try and track potential venues for a midcycle12:43
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david-lylebut since I've been back at it for 1 day now since the summit, I have not made much progress12:43
david-lylewest coast US would be easy to arrange12:43
r1chardj0n3sdavid-lyle: San Diego has been bandied about by several folks12:43
david-lyleSJC or PDX would be easy12:43
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r1chardj0n3snot sure precisely who the host org would be there12:44
david-lyleI'm not sure who that cares about horizon has an office in SD12:44
david-lyleHP used to, but not since post split, I belive12:44
david-lyleSeattle is also probably a possibility12:45
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david-lyleI'll work on some concrete options12:46
david-lyleI know I can offer to host in Santa Clara or Portland, but I'll build the list12:47
david-lyle#topic bug report12:48
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robcresswellSo I updated it for this week, and updated the criteria too. It's a wiki, so feel free to add to it. I'll keep adding new things and removing merged ones each week.12:50
robcresswellBeen speaking with matt borland too, so we're synced on priorities with some of the angular patches12:51
david-lylelooks good12:51
robcresswellIdeally, we can merge the majority of these each week, and keep on top of the priority list, but it will require active participation so bookmark it folks :)12:51
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david-lyleisn't the magic search one merged, that bug report is a mess, but there is a merge message at the bottomw12:53
david-lylelaunchpad disagrees12:53
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david-lylebut launchpad12:53
robcresswellI think there are more for it12:54
robcresswellAt least, there seem to be active patches still attached to it12:55
david-lylejust scanning12:55
david-lyle#topic reno12:55
*** openstack changes topic to "reno (Meeting topic: Horizon)"12:55
david-lylerobcresswell: o/12:55
robcresswellSo, lhcheng has a patch to hadd this12:55
* david-lyle admits still hasn't reread12:55
david-lyleso our release notes are to be yaml rather than rst?12:56
robcresswellThis is how we'll manage our release notes now. It's not as draconian as a I first thought.12:56
amotokiI haven't figured out the full picture yet12:56
david-lylewell yaml that -> rst12:56
amotokianother one, the last call for juno stable update has been sent, but horizon juno gate is broken. can we handle it, or no action?12:57
robcresswellYeah, yaml then rst12:57
robcresswellMakes it easier to do it as we go, and we control what needs to be reno'd12:58
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robcresswellSo it just means a little bit more "stuff" with our larges features, so bps and larger bugfixes I assume.12:58
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david-lylethe positive for me is that we can require release notes as part of a change12:58
david-lyleamotoki: good topic12:59
david-lyle#topic juno12:59
*** openstack changes topic to "juno (Meeting topic: Horizon)"12:59
amotokiwe have less than 1 min.12:59
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david-lylethe gate is broken12:59
amotokijust link
robcresswellIs the gate issue a known bug that we can fix? Or new?12:59
david-lylethere is a bit of a hacky patch to fix it12:59
david-lylerobcresswell: known issue12:59
david-lyledependency hell13:00
amotokiit is not our fault, but dependency is broken.13:00
amotokidark side of oslo dependency13:00
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david-lylewe should fix it, but I'm not sure I saw much meat for juno patches outstanding13:00
david-lylebut this will be the last formal juno release13:01
david-lylefixing the gate would be a nice start13:01
r1chardj0n3sa co-worker has a phrase be uses to describe the dependency hell around juno "tangled web of onions"13:01
david-lyleok, time's up13:02
david-lylethanks everyone13:02
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"13:02
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 13:02:13 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)13:02
openstackMinutes (text):
neillcNight all o/13:02
robcresswellThanks all13:02
r1chardj0n3so/ and good night all :-)13:02
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amotokigood night :)13:02
oetrog_good night13:02
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rhochmuth#startmeeting monasca15:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 15:00:08 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is rhochmuth. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'monasca'15:00
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rhochmuthSo, sorry about the mix-up last week on the time change15:01
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witekyou were not the only one :)15:01
rhochmuthNIce to see everyone here today15:01
rhochmuthLooks like we'l have a good meeting then15:01
bogdanlooks like we have big news, right?15:01
rhochmuthPlease update the agenda15:02
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rhochmuth#topic tent15:02
*** openstack changes topic to "tent (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:02
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rhochmuthCongratulations to everyone, Monasca is in the Big Tent.15:02
bkleicongrats!  way to stick with the process rhochmuth!15:02
bogdancongratulations to everyone!15:03
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rhochmuthSo, I'm not sure I have too much to say.15:03
bkleijust take a bow15:03
witekgood job!15:03
rhochmuthI think we are doing good on process, with improvements in areas that we can still make15:03
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rhochmuthHopefully, we'll get some more developers on-board with the project as a result15:04
bkleithat would be great!15:04
bogdanbig tent should be a booster15:04
witekfor sure15:04
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rhochmuthWe can also be a part of the official OpenStack process like having our own sessions at the next summit15:04
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rhochmuthIt will also help us with other projects, like Congress15:05
fabiog+2 ;-)15:05
rhochmuthSo, unless any questions, maybe we should move on, but again Thanks to everyone for all the support!15:06
bkleinice work15:06
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rhochmuth#topic twc15:06
*** openstack changes topic to "twc (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:06
bkleithat's me15:07
rhochmuthyou are up15:07
bkleifirst update on perf15:07
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bkleione of the enhancements i'd been working on, and actually got working for vertica was pre-join projections15:07
bkleibut found a bug where the db crashed when you'd update statistics15:07
rhochmuththe agenda says it is deprecated15:07
bkleiyup -- so abandoning that
bkleii guess it wasn't a widely used feature or stable15:08
rhochmuthwow, that didn't last long15:08
rhochmuthdidn't they only add it in 7.215:08
bkleiyeah, i don't think it would buy us much -- not as much as some app caching15:08
bkleiat least 7.115:08
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rhochmuthso, i just started looking at that this morning15:08
rhochmuththe caching that is15:09
bkleisweet -- initial thoughts?15:09
rhochmuthi don't think it will be difficult15:09
bkleiyou're my hero15:09
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rhochmuthi didn't do it yet15:09
rhochmuthi'll start playing with it, unless deklan wants a reprieve15:09
rhochmuthfrom devstack15:09
bkleiwould love to hear your thoughts -- i can help identify the queries that are repeated...15:09
ddieterlydevstack is never ending15:10
rhochmuthlet me try writing some code and then i'll put somethign up for review15:10
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bkleiperfect, thx!15:10
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bkleiwell that covers 2.5 in my list15:11
bkleinext topic -- persister weirdness15:11
openstackLaunchpad bug 1511793 in Monasca "java version of monasca persister appears to have memory leak" [Undecided,New]15:11
bkleinot sure it's a memory leak, but about once a week, we simply see things 'stall' in the persister15:11
ddieterlythe persister has a cache in it, could that be the problem?15:12
bkleinot sure, just know nothing gets to the db, kafka lag seems to keep up, nothing in the logs15:12
bkleicould use some ideas for how to triage15:12
ddieterlycan you do a 'kill -3' against the process to get a thread dump the next time it happens?15:12
bkleirestart fixes it, for a while15:12
bkleiwill do ddieterly15:12
rhochmuthso, this is occurring once a week15:13
bkleii have some jstack output already15:13
bkleiyes, about that, happened yesterday15:13
rhochmuthvery interesting15:13
bkleiworst part is, data is lost15:13
ddieterlyyou can also try setting the cache to a low size15:13
rhochmuththe persister should immediately fail if it can't write to the database15:13
rhochmuththere should be any loss of data15:13
bkleirestart, huge gaps in data, depending on how long it takes to notice15:13
rhochmuthif a db write fails, a sql exception should be caught and the persister exists15:13
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bkleidoesn't seem to be happening, more like things are hung15:14
rhochmuthand the offset in Kafaka shousl not have been updated15:14
rhochmuthso, on restart it shoudl start where it was the last time15:14
ddieterlythe persister could be in a hung state, but the kafka offsets should not be advanced then15:14
rhochmuthok, that process dump will help15:15
bkleiit's possible a bug i found in our consumer lag monitoring could have masked that fact, and kafka lag is big for certain partitions of the metrics topic15:15
bkleii'll do that15:15
bkleii'll have better consumer lag checking in our next week's deploy to prod15:15
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bkleithx for the help on that one, it's gnarly15:15
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bkleiok -- next topic?15:15
bkleirbak - that's u15:16
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rhochmuthso the only window that we know of where data could be lost is if the persister fails write after a db write15:16
rhochmuththat is a succesful db write15:16
rhochmuththen you would end-up with duplicate data15:16
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rhochmuthok, i'm done, rbak you are up15:17
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rbakSo currently if you submit a datapoint with some dimensions, e.g. hostname, and later add more dimensions, e.g. hostname and region, the first metric becomes impossible to query15:17
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rhochmuthi don't consider that a bug15:17
rbakwhy not?15:17
rhochmuththat is the way influxdb works15:17
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rhochmuthwe removed the ability to return multiple metrics in a query15:18
rhochmuthbecause of influxdb15:18
rbakThe problem is that it causes grafana to error and display nothing when you hit one of these cases without the merge flag.15:18
rbakBecause it tries to query every dimension set, but one isn't actually valid15:18
fabiogbut if you query the one with the hostname and region do you get the data?15:19
ddieterlyinfluxdb has peformance issues when we try to sort out the different series based on dimensions15:19
ddieterlywe might want to see if they fixed that in later releases15:19
rbakfabiog: For the metric with both dimensions yes, but not for the metric with only hostname set15:20
fabiogrbak: I think it is right, if you want the old too you need to apply the merge flag15:20
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rhochmuthSo, currently the API says you can't get multiple series/metrics back in a single query15:21
rbakfabiog: But you might not want to merge if they are separate data15:21
rhochmuthEach one needs to be uniquely identified15:21
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s-kawaba_I tested "GET /v2.0/metrics/names" with dimensions(only one), but I can't get result.15:21
fabiogrbak: but they are not, since they have the same hostname15:22
bkleiseems like at a minimum, we need some error handling around this -- grafana will just barf, yes rbak?15:22
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rhochmuthWe should return an error15:22
rbakfabiog: In this example yes, but that isn't always the case15:22
rbakbklei: That's correct15:22
fabiogrhochmuth: I think a 409 conflict error would be appropriate. You are querying for things that are not unique ...15:22
bkleithis certainly makes me nervous to add dimensions15:23
bkleipaints us into a corner15:23
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rhochmuthso, if you add dimensions, then you've got problems, i agree15:24
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rhochmuthit is a trivial change for Vertica, but I didn't think that InfluxDB coudl support this15:24
rhochmuthwhich is why we removed from Vertica15:24
ddieterlyif you add dimensions, is it to the same logical series? if so, then you can use the merge-metrics flag15:24
rbakIt might be or might not, especially if you are adding dimensions in order to split out the data into something more specific15:25
bkleii think it's more an issue when our users build graphs adhoc15:25
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ddieterlywe could give the java api a 'influxdb compatibility mode'15:25
ddieterlythen we could allow the java api to do the things that twc wants when it is not in influxdb compatibility mode15:26
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bkleior a metrics list flag that says, ignore un-queryable dimension sets15:26
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bkleidon't want to kill the whole hour on this topic15:27
ddieterlymaybe we could do a launchpad design sketch for this feature15:27
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bkleiagreed ddieterly15:27
rbakThat works.15:27
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bkleinext twc topic -- hoping for some support to add start/end time to metric list call15:27
bkleihere's the scenario15:27
bkleia dashboard does a metrics list for a time period, then does a stats call for all dimension sets15:28
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fabiogbklei: but if your queries you always have the hostname and merge you will always get the right result ..15:28
bkleiyes fabio, this is a case where we aren't merging15:28
bkleiso the dashboard ends up querying needlessly for data that isn't there if there aren't measurements15:29
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bkleithis happens a lot for a MaaS dashboard where VMs are short lived15:29
fabiogbklei: what I am saying is that forcing the merge does not change the queries that have the least amount of common dimensions ...15:29
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rhochmuthso, you are trying to get a list of the metrics that are active in some time period15:30
bkleithat could be fabiog, well include you in the etherpad discussion on that?15:30
bkleiyes rhochmuth15:30
fabiogbklei: sure15:30
bkleithis is one of the perf enhancements we'd like to make at twc before going live with maas15:31
rhochmuthi'm ok with the change15:31
bkleithis review isn't done, bug at least works on the vertica side and accomplishes what i'm describing15:31
rhochmuthprobably should have a blueprint15:31
bkleii'm just testing the influxdb/python15:31
rhochmuththe other issue is Tempest tests and Python API15:31
rhochmuthdo you have the tempest tests working15:32
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bkleican add tempest too, haven't got that far -- at least not in devstack15:32
rhochmuthit should be really easy to add15:32
rhochmuthdevstack isn't required to run them15:32
bkleiwill do that for sure, and if you want a blueprint i'll start one and link to my review15:32
rhochmuththere are directions on how to install/run15:32
rhochmuthall that should change is the endpoint and user credentials to match your environment15:33
bkleibueno -- i need to ramp up there, so thx for the directions15:33
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bkleiawesome, i'm sure it'll work 1st time :)15:33
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bkleii think that's it for that topic?15:33
bkleirbak -- grafana 2.0 update?15:34
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rbakI have a monasca plugin for grafana 2.5.  The branch here:
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cdupontHello everybody15:34
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rbakFeel free to pull it down give me feedback.15:34
rbakI'm still making changes, but once it's stable I'll submit a pull request.15:35
rbakThis plugin is for the standalone grafana, and does not currently integrate with horizon.  It needs a keystone token in the datasource to talk to monasca.15:35
rbakI'm currently looking at integrating the built in grafana auth with keystone.  That way it can get it's own keystone token.15:35
rbakIt might also be possible to leverage the grafana concept of "organizations" to provide per tenant dashboards, so I'm looking at this as well.15:36
rbakjobrs created a blueprint for this.  I'll try to keep that updated with how things are going.15:36
rhochmuthThanks Ryan.15:37
fabiogrhochmuth: rbak: we should see if the grafana community may be interested in supporting a Monasca datasource15:37
rhochmuthI think that is the plan15:37
rbakfabiog: It should be easy to get this pulled into the plugins repo.15:37
fabiogrbak: ok15:37
rbakLater we can also try to get into the main repo if we want.  That's what gnocchi is trying to do now15:37
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rhochmuthThanks for update ryan, should be move on15:38
rbakSure, that's all I have15:38
rhochmuth#topic logging15:39
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rhochmuthLog-management integration into monasca-vagrant / devstack plugin ?15:39
witekwe would like to integrate our ansible roles into monasca-vagrant15:39
rhochmuthThat would be great.15:39
witekand then start working on devstack integration15:39
witekdo Monasca plan to support both installers?15:40
bkleishould it be the reverse?  i assumed devstack will cause us to deprecate monasca-vagrant?15:40
witekwell, but we have ansible roles already15:41
rhochmuthwell, there is always the possiblity of monasca-vagrant getting deprecated15:41
rhochmuthas a result of devstack15:41
rhochmuthtoday we still need it for other reasons15:41
ningy_what's the current status of devstack plugin? I think rally needs this for adding monasca tests15:42
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bogdanit's just we had some questions after the summit, on how to install thte logging15:42
ddieterlythe devstack plugin works with both java and python implementations15:42
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ddieterlywe need to fix up some of the smoke tests at this point15:42
rhochmuthVertica is not supported in DevStack15:43
fabiogddieterly: can you enable different parts, like enable monasca_metrics monasca_events or something like that15:43
ddieterlyyou should be able to run the smoke tests against monasca running from the devstack plugin15:43
ddieterlyfabiog: no, not at this time15:43
rhochmuthAs far as the overall DevStack plugin it works, but we are still relatively new to tis DevStack thing, so there could be issues that you run into15:43
ddieterlywe need to test the vagrant devstack next15:44
rhochmuthSo, where should the log api devstack plugin live15:44
rhochmuthi was thinking in the monasca-log-api repo15:44
ddieterlyideally that would be its own plugin15:45
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witeki don't know how it works, how it intagrates  with monasca devstack plugin?15:45
rhochmuthAnd for the monasca-vagrat, it would be in ansible-monasca-log-api15:45
witekand also monasca-log-agent15:46
ddieterlyyou will need to create a separate plugin that does what the monasca-api devstack/plugin does15:46
ddieterlyideally, each separate repo has a devstack/plugin15:46
ddieterlywe may need to deviate from the ideal if it makes sense15:47
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witekok, additionally should we add monasc-log-api into governance project?15:47
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rhochmuthi think monasca-log-api should be added15:48
bogdanwho's doing it? witek?15:48
witeki will push the change15:48
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bogdangreat! thanx!15:48
rhochmuththanks witek15:48
ddieterlythe goal is to have the plugin in a repo be able to run in a gate job15:48
ddieterlyso that any changes to the repo go thru a suite of integration tests using the plugin to setup the env15:49
witeki get it15:49
witekok, i think that's all for logging15:50
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rhochmuth#topic tokyo15:50
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rhochmuthnews from tokyo15:50
rhochmuthi think we should reach out to patrick petit from miranis15:51
bogdanHe's doing the LMA plugin for Fuel, right?15:51
rhochmuthhe was doing work with Heka, and seemed interested in Monasca,15:52
rhochmuthSo, that is one follow-up item I had15:53
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rhochmuthFabio has done great work in getting connnected with Congress15:53
rhochmuthfabiog: comments15:53
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fabiogwhat we discussed is the ability for Congress to create alarms in Monasca based on Policies15:54
fabiogthen Congress will receive Webhook notifications when the alarms go off and act on the related Policy15:55
fabiogthey liked the idea a lot, but they want to move in steps15:55
fabiogso what we agreed at the summit is to start integrating Congress with Monasca using a driver15:55
fabiogdrivers are their standard polling mechanism to get data out of the Openstack services15:56
fabiogI have a WIP around this:
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fabiogI will start interacting with them to understand what API they would like to see polling, in my mind Metrics and Statistics (and maybe Alarms) are viable, but Measurements will kill them15:57
fabiogthey store all this data in SQL ...15:57
fabiogany comments?15:57
rhochmuthI guess move on then15:57
rhochmuthThanks to all the presenters. Great job.15:58
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bkleiwatched most on youtube -- nice work everyone15:58
bkleilots of monasca interest there?15:58
witekoh yes15:58
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rhochmuthSo, unfortunatley we are going to have to end the meeting15:59
rhochmuthDo we need to get togehter outside of weekly meeting?15:59
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bkleiperhaps mailing list discussions?15:59
bkleiremind me the mail alias?15:59
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rhochmuthSounds good. We need to address your design question16:00
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:00
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 16:00:20 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:00
openstackMinutes (text):
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acabot_#startmeeting watcher16:01
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 16:01:12 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is acabot_. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: watcher)"16:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'watcher'16:01
acabot_our agenda for today #link
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mehdi__hi i am here16:02
cdupontHi everybody16:02
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seanmurphy_hi all - a few of us are here from ZHAW (me, bruno, vojtech) - we are not proficient with IRC meetings, so apols if we don’t know conventions etc16:03
mehdi__hi corentin16:03
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acabot_seanmurphy_: no problem ;-)16:03
mehdi__also a few of us from CREATE-NET are here16:03
alexchadinHello from Moscow!16:03
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sballewelcoe :-)16:04
alexchadinServionica is here:)16:04
acabot_before we dig into the agenda, just to let you know that Monasca has been accepted yesterday in the big tent
mehdi__great news for Monasca16:04
mehdi__congrats guys16:04
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acabot_#topic Announcements16:05
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acabot_so took the opportunity to invite our friends from ICCLab Zurich today16:05
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jwcroppewelcome folks16:05
sballeacabot_: +116:05
jwcroppeglad to have you attend!16:05
acabot_maybe we can start by a quick intro guys16:05
seanmurphy_thanks for the invitation antoine16:06
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seanmurphy_as you may see from agenda, we are a university applied research lab16:06
seanmurphy_focused on cloud computing with different aspects16:06
seanmurphy_one of which is energy16:06
seanmurphy_we have done a bit of work16:06
seanmurphy_it is modest, tbh - i don’t want to oversell it16:07
seanmurphy_we have developed an energy monitoring tool which collects energy consumption from servers16:07
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seanmurphy_and shows it in a dashboard etc16:07
seanmurphy_it is based on the kwapi project16:07
seanmurphy_in the larger openstack ecosystem16:07
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seanmurphy_it’s maybe a bit basic, but it’s open source and we can share a small video of it16:08
seanmurphy_we also have done a bit of work on delay tolerant workload mgmt as a tool to achieve energy savings16:08
seanmurphy_and have a horizon plugin to support deferred workload16:08
acabot_seanmurphy_: you didn't put the link for the monitoring tool in the agenda, can you share it ?16:08
seanmurphy_so you can tell openstack to schedule launch of a VM at a specific time16:08
seanmurphy_i will do so16:09
jwcroppeseanmurphy_: interesting use cases indeed16:09
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bruno_Link for energy monitoring tool -
seanmurphy_the idea with the deferred workload stuff is to add a scheduling component around it16:09
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seanmurphy_which can take delay tolerant workload from users of the system16:10
bruno_and scheduler -
seanmurphy_and schedule them using the deferred workload mechanism16:10
seanmurphy_then we have done a bit on load consolidation16:10
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seanmurphy_reading usage info from a system a having a basic mechanism to support consolidation16:10
seanmurphy_it’s a bit heuristic rather than based on Hard Science16:10
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seanmurphy_but it’s prob a reasonable compromise16:11
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jwcroppeyeah, most things are in this space :)16:11
seanmurphy_we also did work on live migration using so called post copy live migration rather than the standard pre copy mechanism which suffers from some issues if there is intense memory use in a VM16:11
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seanmurphy_that suffers from the prob of lacking support in linux kernel and also of distributed state within the migration process16:12
seanmurphy_but is more certain to terminate than the pre copy approach16:12
seanmurphy_that’s our work in a nutshell16:12
seanmurphy_it’s not fully consolidated as yet16:12
jwcroppevery cool, I'll read thru the material later today16:12
seanmurphy_but we plan to bring it together over the coming months16:12
seanmurphy_i think that’s abt it16:13
seanmurphy_from our side16:13
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seanmurphy_acabot_: is that sufficient?16:13
sballesame here16:13
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tpeoplesthanks for the intro16:13
acabot_seanmurphy_: seems great and interesting, I will look at the material16:13
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jwcroppeacabot_: shall we proceed with the agenda?16:14
seanmurphy_we will put more of our content in the minutes16:14
acabot_as I see we have people from create-net, federico ?16:14
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cdupontwe're here :)16:14
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cdupontwe can introduce ourselve quickly16:15
acabot_yes please16:15
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cdupontso we are from Create-Net (, in Italy16:15
cdupontOur area is called Smart Infrastructure (Smarti), working on cloud computing infrastructure16:15
cdupontOur project is DC4Cities, which aim at using more renewable energy in data centres16:15
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cdupontAt the moment we have several prototypes we're working on...16:15
cdupontone is the EASC (Energy Efficient Software Controller):16:16
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cdupontit will control the workload level of flexible apps to follow some constraints, such as renewable energies16:16
acabot_cdupont: could you share links on the agenda or on IRC using # link ?16:16
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cdupontAlso Plug4Green: a VM consolidator based on constraint programming with an energetic model16:17
cdupontBut it's in Java16:17
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cdupontPlug4Green is based on BtrPlace16:17
mehdi__EASC makes application adaptive to renewable energy availabilty16:17
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mehdi__by introducing a few working modes (execution modes) for each application16:18
cdupontSo we have 2 ways to optimize: VM consolidation to save energy16:18
cdupontEASC to optimize renewable energies16:18 is for DC4Cities project16:18
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acabot_ok please share links (blogs & source code) as much as you can on the agenda and we will all look at it before our next meeting16:19
cdupontthere is also a tool called PaaS consolidator to consolidate containers but that might be out of topic for this meeting16:19
acabot_cdupont: yes ;-)16:19
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acabot_#topic Review Action Items16:20
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edleafe#link www.dc4cities.eu16:20
mehdi__I was looking for it16:20
cdupontdoes this sound interresting for you? How could we collaborate :)16:20
acabot_thx Ed (# link add the link to minutes)16:21
mehdi__EASC is instantiated for various computing styles16:21
mehdi__like PaaS and IaaS16:21
jwcroppeacabot_: the watcher-specs templates are all merged now -- thanks for all the reviews from folks16:21
mehdi__EASC-PaaS has been implemented with Cloud Foundry16:21
acabot_cdupont: we will look at it in more detail and come back to you next week, as we have only an hour, we need to follow the agenda16:22
jwcroppe(and big thanks to our nova colleagues allowing us to promote code reuse) :)16:22
cdupontok thanks :)16:22
sballeI am working on two things. 1. end to end install of watcher and all the pieces in a vM. I hope to have that completed today. and 2. workingon a sec with Nishi for the PoC. we are meetign with jed56 tomorrow to discuss further16:22
acabot_sballe: ok thx for all your feedback regarding the installation process, feel free to send reviews on doc if there are issues16:23
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acabot_sballe: it would be better if the next one has a better doc ;-)16:24
jwcroppesballe: thanks for that... I will appreciate that for when I set it up soon16:24
tpeoplesZhenzan Zhou (is that you Kevin_Zheng ?) took care of my action item, creating the devstack plugin blueprint (#link i added a bit more detail and hope to start working on that soon16:24
sballeacabot_: will do. I still have to do the final step around configuration16:24
sballeno Zhenzan Zhou is with Intel and his nick is bzhou16:24
tpeoplesah okay16:24
jwcroppeAll... for each BP, we need to now submit the formal spec now that watcher-specs is ready16:24
Kevin_ZhengHe is a guy from Intel16:24
acabot_jwcroppe: +116:25
Kevin_ZhengI'm from huawei16:25
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sballeKevin_Zheng:  who are oyu with16:25
jwcroppeif it's a 'small' change, then no spec is needed... otherwise we should get started on the formal spec write-up and get those approved16:25
acabot_yes sorry we didn't introduced you Kevin16:25
sballejwcroppe: we need the ceilometer integration for Devstack16:25
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sballeBTW any ETA on Ceilometer integration. I believe jed56 said yes to ETA of Dec 116:26
Kevin_ZhengThat's ok I can do it in the open discussion16:26
acabot_sballe: I agree we need to have the ceilometer integration and then we will be able to use Watcher in devstack env16:26
sballe+1000 my thoughts exactly16:26
acabot_yes we plan to do it next week16:27
sballeyou guys are the BEST!16:27
jwcroppeOk, so let's close on the specs stuff.  For those LP blueprints we've opened, we should now create the specs in the watcher-specs repo now that we are all ready for that16:27
acabot_we had a great discussion yesterday with jed56 and thx to Ceilometer discussion in Tokyo, it would be pretty easy to do16:27
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sballeI'll work on Nishi's PoC spec with her. Should have a DRAFT early next week16:27
mehdi__can we review on the spec?16:27
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acabot_medhi__: yes of course16:28
jwcroppeacabot_: create an action for watcher-specs submission?16:28
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jwcroppemedhi___: yes, please review all specs :)16:28
acabot_ok so I will approve BP regarding ceilometer, devstack and Nishi use case right ?16:28
sballeand we'll work on the specs16:28
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jwcroppesballe: wonderful16:28
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mehdi__what's BP?16:29
acabot_#action acabot_ approve BP regarding ceilometer, devstack and Nishi use case16:29
acabot_BP = blueprint16:29
jwcroppetpeoples: are you going to look at the devstack integration for watcher?  do you want to post up the spec review for that too?16:29
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tpeoplesjwcroppe:  as time allows...yes16:29
jwcroppetpeoples: +116:29
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edleafefwiw, ceilometer is changing its name to 'telemetry'16:30
acabot_edleafe: ok I will update the BP then16:30
sballethx for letting us know16:30
jwcroppeedleafe: wonderful.  that's not confusing :)16:30
edleafejwcroppe: :)16:30
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acabot_bug triage has been done by dtardivel16:31
acabot_so feel free to fix them ;-)16:31
tpeoplescool acabot_16:31
acabot_and of course add new one if you have troubles installing Watcher16:31
edleafe#info change 'ceilometer' references to 'telemetry'16:32
acabot_sballe: you asked for changing our meeting time16:32
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acabot_sballe: what would be best for US/China & Europe :-D16:32
sballeyes the main reason is that it is 12am for bzhou16:33
Kevin_ZhengMe too16:33
sballeI could do as early as 6 or 7 amEST16:33
acabot_UTC ?16:33
sballewhich is 8pm in China16:33
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sballelet me find a converter16:33
tpeoplesthat'd be 5-6 am CST?16:33
jwcroppesballe: my biological clock does not compute anything between 5-6 am16:34
acabot_jwcroppe: :-D16:34
Kevin_ZhengMaybe just move to 1 or 2 hour earlier, think it will be ok for us16:34
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acabot_7am EST is 1pm Paris time and 8pm in China right ?16:35
sballeI understand but how if we moved to 8 am EST == 7 am CST == 9pm in China16:35
edleafeI can handle up to 3 hours earlier16:35
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acabot_jwcroppe: what about you ?16:35
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jwcroppeperhaps we try a model like others and alternate times every other week?  just a thought16:36
sballethat would be 1pm UTC per my converter16:36
acabot_3h earlier is OK for France, Italy and Switzerland I suppose16:36
sballeHow about 2pm UTC == 9am EST == 10pm in China = 7am CSt16:37
Kevin_ZhengI'm OK16:37
seanmurphy_yes - 3h earlier is fine for CH16:37
Kevin_ZhengIn China16:37
edleafe9am EST == 8am CST16:37
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sballeoh yeah I went MST16:38
edleafeso maybe 8am EST?16:38
jwcroppeI'm fine with 8 am CT16:38
acabot_so 2h earlier than today16:38
jwcroppe7 am will be almost impossible for me, but I don't want to be the bottleneck.16:38
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sballe2pm UTC == 9am EST == 10pm in China = 8am CSt16:38
jwcropperight, 2h earlier16:38
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sballetpeoples: Can you check and see if you can find a day/channel for that time? You did it last time rigth?16:39
acabot_#openstack-meeting is available at 2pm UTC on wednesday16:39
sballeacabot_: you were reading my mind :)16:39
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sballeacabot_: then let's grab it16:40
mehdi__10 pm for EU?16:40
acabot_#action acabot_ ask for a new time slot for meeting at 2pm UTC on wednesday on #openstack-meeting16:40
Kevin_ZhengNo 10 for China16:40
jwcroppewe can also try alternating times too eventually if needed16:40
acabot_it would be 3pm for EU16:40
jwcroppe(since the reality is there is no perfect world time)16:40
sballeacabot_: it will be early if we want people from the west coast to join. But it all about balance between all the time zones16:40
sballejwcroppe: I agre16:40
tpeoplessballe: acabot_ :  #openstack-meeting-4 is open during that time every week. #openstack-meeting is taken every other week during that slot by the doc team16:41
sballeI agree on the alternate times down the road16:41
sballetpeoples: #openstack-meeting-4 it is16:41
acabot_tpeoples: ok my cal is driving me crazy...16:41
tpeoplesacabot_:  :)16:42
jwcroppeacabot_: you should use Notes :)16:42
acabot_jwcroppe: lol16:42
acabot_#topic Blueprint/Bug Review and Discussion16:42
*** openstack changes topic to "Blueprint/Bug Review and Discussion (Meeting topic: watcher)"16:42
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edleafejwcroppe: don't be mean!16:42
acabot_I'd like to discuss BP regarding the Nova load balancer16:42
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sballeacabot_: +116:43
acabot_to my understanding, it implies to change the nova configuration and this is something we definitely dont want to do16:43
alexchadinWe've made videos16:43
tpeoplesacabot_:  are you referring to specifically?16:43
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acabot_tpeoples: yes16:44
tpeoplesi think that seems to be two specific algorithms (underload / overload) that would be written for watcher specific to the "reactive" part of watcher, which relies in getting the CEP working for that ?16:45
samarinvvacabot_: In Tokyo we discussed, what Watcher already have some improvements to Nova functionality what we ned16:45
mehdi__btw, who are Antoine Cabot and Jean-Émile DARTOIS?16:46
jwcroppeI'm not seeing anything in there that would require a change to nova?16:46
acabot_mehdi__: sorry I am Antoine, and Jean-Emile is jed5616:46
tpeopleswhat needs to change in nova for that blueprint samarinvv  acabot_  ?16:47
jwcroppeacabot_: time check ... 13 mins remaining16:47
alexchadinthere is some changes in nova libvirt driver and nova db (models, api)16:47
acabot_jwcroppe: yes sorry for that I looked at the videos at the end of the agenda just before the meeting and it seems to me that Nova has been modified16:48
Kevin_ZhengHmm I think we have tested something similar16:48
samarinvvand extend nova-api16:48
jwcroppealexchadin: It's not clear to me why you'd need model/api changes for what's written in the description?  we can take that offline tho16:48
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tpeoples+1 jwcroppe , seems to me that could be implemented without nova changes. let's maybe get a written summary of the needed changes for next meeting and go from there?16:49
acabot_alexchadin: what do you think ?16:50
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samarinvvacabor_: Ok, we should discuss this offline16:50
alexchadinwe are on the way to leave nova code16:50
alexchadinjwcroppe: it could be good16:50
acabot_alexchadin: samarinvv: ok that we can start iterate through a more detail spec right ?16:51
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samarinvvok, right16:51
acabot_as we now have a watcher-specs repo, we can start working on it and review specs16:51
acabot_it would be easier to discuss it later on16:52
samarinvvokay, we should prepare some for next meeting to discuss16:52
sballeacabot_: +116:52
tpeoplesthat's what i meant by written summary :$16:52
jwcroppeacabot_, sballe: any further detail on mid-cycle to discuss this week?16:52
acabot_but anyway thx for the videos, its really helpful to understand your current status16:52
sballeI have not heard back from Orran yet16:53
sballegive him 2 more weeks and then after we can look at planB16:53
acabot_ok just to let all know about it, we plan a mid-cycle meetup end of January in Boston, MA16:53
mehdi__link to the video?16:53
jwcroppeok, was Orran going to host at Boston Univ potentially?16:53
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acabot_medhi__: in the agenda16:54
sballejwcroppe: see above16:54
samarinvvacabot_: thanks for watching16:54
acabot_samarinvv: which of your 2 BP you want to start providing detailed specs ?16:55
jwcroppesballe: saw that, just wasn't sure if that was your pending question to him...16:55
alexchadinacabot_: overload16:56
acabot_ok thx16:56
samarinvvacabot_: overload16:56
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acabot_#action acabot_ set overload BP as started16:56
sballeI sent him email several time but I know heis busy16:56
acabot_ok so before the end, ICCLab & Create-net please complete the agenda with links to your current work16:57
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acabot_we will look at it before next meeting and see how we can iterate from it16:57
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cdupontOK, thanks acabot_!16:58
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acabot_thanks for this great meeting, I will go back to my day off ;-)16:58
mehdi__have a nice evening all16:59
acabot_thanks bye16:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:59
samarinvvhave a nice day!16:59
sballebye have a nice day16:59
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 16:59:29 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:59
alexstav_Bye-bye, thanks16:59
openstackMinutes (text):
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jwcroppebye.  ttyl!17:03
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lifelessdavid-lyle: I've identified the work that needs to be done to unblock the spec, I don't think its actually been done17:38
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david-lylelifeless: ok, I will revisit the spec, just scanned the responses after vacation17:39
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TravTtqtran: is there a horizon driver's meeting right now?20:02
tqtrani thought there was20:02
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TravTdavid-lyle: is there a horizon driver's meeting, or did that get changed?20:02
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tqtranbut i dont see anyone else on20:02
mrungethere should be, no?20:02
TravTwell, there's the usual suspects20:03
david-lyled-oh utc20:03
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david-lyle#startmeeting horizondrivers20:03
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 20:03:59 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is david-lyle. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:04
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"20:04
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'horizondrivers'20:04
TravTyeah, i just went in and updated my meeting reminders to be based on utc20:04
* david-lyle tries to refocus20:04
david-lyleaha, no agenda20:05
david-lyle#topic priorities20:05
*** openstack changes topic to "priorities (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"20:05
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david-lylefor anyone who missed it, or forgot, those were the priorities we arrived at for mitaka20:06
david-lyletqtran: I started working on you plugin doc patch today20:06
david-lylewhich was up there and the other doc patches are moving forward so that's half the critical items in progress20:07
david-lylea couple more weeks and we can go home for 5 months20:07
robcresswellDont we all workm from home anyway?20:08
tqtranhome is where he heart is20:08
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david-lylealright then20:08
david-lyle#topic midcycle20:09
*** openstack changes topic to "midcycle (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"20:09
david-lylewe discussed briefly the possibility of a midcycle this morning20:09
david-lylemost people seem to be interested based on conversations20:09
david-lyleI will privately be soliciting potential hosts20:09
david-lyleI can offer Santa Clara and Portland20:10
TravTI'm sure I can get an HP site somewhere.20:10
tqtransame here, can host at an IBM site somewhere as well20:10
david-lyleso places and dates are needed, since this is my second day back, I haven't gotten far :)20:10
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TravTi think we should try for southern california, florida, etc20:11
TravTsomewhere warm...20:11
tqtranyes, warm weather will be nice20:11
david-lyler1chardj0n3s has his heart set on San Diego20:11
david-lylenot sure who could host there though20:11
TravTyeah, i kinda placed that bug in his ear...20:11
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david-lylesome unlucky airbnb?20:12
mrungewhich makes it a bit more expensive for Europeans20:12
TravTMaybe southern italy, then?20:12
robcresswellA bit expensive for the Europeans employers* ;)20:12
mrungeI guess, I could find a conference room in Brno (Czech republic)20:12
david-lyleI will start compiling a list20:12
david-lyleping me if you realistically have a hosting offer :)20:13
tqtranso... southern Italy then?20:13
robcresswelltqtran: +120:13
TravTYou can write down Fort Collins, Seattle, Sunnyvale for HPE.  I don't think I have to even ask about those. Just need time to schedule.20:14
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david-lyleI think we could get 5 companies in the SJC area20:14
david-lyle#topic summit feedback20:15
*** openstack changes topic to "summit feedback (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"20:15
tqtranyeah, theres two IBM sites in SJ, and Im sure Austin will also be open for grabs20:15
david-lyleI asked this morning as well but any feedback on the summit?20:15
doug-fishprobably can skip Austin for the midcycle since the summit will be there20:15
david-lyleto either feed up or just in general for next time20:15
mrungeI found it quite productive20:16
tqtranyes, arrived at priorities pretty quick20:16
TravTi thought it was good, except i didn't like that the design summit overlapped more with the main conference than normal.20:16
TravTfelt like there was less opportunity to go to other sessions.20:17
tqtranless days, i dont think it could hav ebeen avoided20:17
mrungeyeah, I had to skip at least 2 horizon sessions due to parallel other sessions20:17
robcresswellIts going back to 5 next time20:17
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david-lylesome this morning mentioned that the more rapid convergence may have been in part due to the midcycle20:18
david-lyleso I think that illustrates some value20:18
mrungeit seems we all were more on the same side20:18
tqtrangood point.... that seems likely20:18
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tqtranthat was for david's comment btw lol20:19
mrungewould end of january to late for midcycle?20:19
david-lyleI wouldn't think so20:19
robcresswellNo, that sounds about right20:19
mrungejust a silly idea, as there is FOSDEM in Brussels, which is a AWESOME conference20:20
tqtranit should be sometime in jan i think, nov and dec are mostly american holidays20:20
david-lyleAustin is April 25-2920:20
david-lyleand release is april 720:21
mrungeso, 2 months before release might be a bit too late for *mid* cycle...20:22
david-lylewon't FOSDEM already be too busy20:22
TravTMaybe last week of Mitaka-2?20:22
TravTJan 16th?20:22
mrungeI was just trying to talk you to visiting Brussels ;-)20:23
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mrungebut it's *cold* there20:23
TravTi'd happily go to europe... probably have same problem as you coming the US.  much harder to get approval for mid-cycles.20:23
david-lylelet me find some option and we can vote20:24
david-lyleany other summit feedback20:24
mrungeyeah. makes sense20:24
david-lylethe later the better for me this time around, but that's just me20:25
mrungewould it be possible to get some tables in the hall next time?20:25
david-lylemrunge: in which hall?20:25
mrungeI found those more informal meeting points (outside of sessions) quite useful in the past20:25
tqtranah yes, great idea20:26
david-lylethere was the dev lounge room/lunch room20:26
mrungelike in Vancouver, there were several possibilities20:26
robcresswellOhhh, like the tables in Paris?20:26
mrungeoh yes20:26
mrungesometing like that20:26
tqtranwe need a horizon sign somewhere though, the dev lounge was too scattered20:26
robcresswellWe could just make ourselves a little sign :)20:26
doug-fishMaybe we can fly one of those t-shirts20:26
robcresswelldoug-fish: Excellent idea20:26
david-lyledoug-fish: you beat me too it20:27
mrungethis time, we had meetings all days, but barely a chance to do something in smaller groups20:27
mrungejust an idea...20:27
david-lyleor ducttape_'s shirt20:27
david-lylemrunge: I agree20:27
TravTi actually think contributors meetup might be better with several smaller tables than one giant table20:28
mrungemaybe we could even reduce sessions for horizon by one or two?20:28
robcresswellI think the extra day will help20:28
david-lylemrunge: I'd be fine with that20:28
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mrungethis time, we talked 3-4 times about angular in general20:28
robcresswellHeh :p20:29
david-lylemrunge: I expected it to take more time :P20:29
mrungeheh ;-)20:29
mrungenot saying, it wasn't useful20:29
david-lylewant to review the new crop of bps ? :-D20:30
mrungefirst one, fresh from today:
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"20:31
* david-lyle was digging them up20:31
robcresswellOh yeah, I was discussing this with him this morning20:31
mrungeI think, we started discussing something like this at the summit20:31
* doug-fish is confused20:32
david-lyleI was discussing this yesterday and this deviates from the approach I would prefer20:32
tqtranwhat is the approach you prefer?20:33
TravTdavid-lyle: was this the rambling going on in the room yesterday?20:33
TravTwith enabled files?20:33
robcresswellTravT: Sounds about right20:33
david-lylenot to mention it's already covered in the blanket bp20:33
david-lyleTravT: yeah20:33
TravTok, i tried to follow, but go a bit lost20:33
TravTdo you have a summary?20:34
david-lyleessentially, for the themes, you need a setting to indicate the path to the theme20:34
david-lylewhen installing a package containing the theme, it's not in the packages scope to go and edit the horizon settings file20:35
mrungeyeah, one can not override theme path20:35
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david-lylecurrently with the plugin mechanism we don't support adding/overriding settings either20:35
david-lylebut that is planned behavior20:36
mrungethat makes themes unusable in packages20:36
david-lylewithout manual intervention20:36
david-lyleso there are two proposals20:36
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david-lylealthough 1 has variants20:37
TravTSo the ability to do this, sounds like a +120:37
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tqtranquestion..... when installing a package containing the theme, couldnt it just import horizon setting and override?20:37
david-lyle1st add the ability to override settings in plugins20:37
david-lyleI think the ability to add settings is a given, but they should be namespaced to the plugin generally20:38
david-lyletqtran: no20:38
david-lylepackages shouldn't alter other packages when installed20:38
david-lyleotherwise the second package is corrupted20:38
david-lyleand not reliable or updatable generally20:39
tqtrantaking a step back, why would you install a theme package if there is no intention to use it?20:39
david-lyleor removable, etc20:39
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robcresswelltqtran: ?20:39
david-lyletqtran: that's not really the point20:39
david-lylebut you could install several20:39
tqtrani think theme and plugins arent two different things. not really seeing the reason for mixing them20:40
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david-lyletqtran: I don't see the need to create another random python file loading system20:40
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david-lyleand plugins now can add/remove or move content20:41
TravTi think only allowing one theme package to be installed would not be good.20:41
tqtranwe dont have to, im making the assumption that only one theme package will get install20:41
TravTwe'd want to be able to toggle which one is active independently20:41
tqtranhm.... thats true...20:41
david-lyletqtran: that's not a fair assumption when considering the per user theme selection20:41
david-lylewhich is proposed20:41
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tqtranok never then :D20:42
tqtran*never mind20:42
mrungetqtran, it's more a general issue, not even connected to theme packages20:42
mrungeit affects all plugins20:42
tqtranmrunge: yep, i think i am starting to get it20:42
mrungebut yes, you're right, it started from a theme plugin20:43
tqtranso help me understand how we are going allow overriding of themes? or is that the problem we dont have a good answer for yet?20:43
tqtran*overrding of settings20:43
robcresswellThat's what is up for discussion20:44
tqtrangotcha... huhuhu20:44
TravTwell, david-lyle mentioned per user... a settings file override wouldn't achieve that20:44
mrungecurrently you can not override CUSTOM_THEME_PATH20:45
david-lyleTravT: that's a slightly different issue, but demonstrates the multi-theme requirement20:45
tqtranwhat if you want to override CUSTOM_THEME_PATH but are not installing any plugins?20:45
TravTthat would be some other mechanism, yes?  unless you allow settings with group by something else like project or domain...20:45
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mrungetqtran, same issue20:46
tqtranTravT er... that would be bad, I am thinking that user settings should be stored client-side20:46
mrungein package world, you can not change local_settings file depending on installed plugins20:46
TravTso, is there a competing blueprint?20:47
tqtranno, i think the per user settings should be handled differently20:47
doug-fishshouldn't the local_settings file always be the last word in what a setting should be?20:47
robcresswellIt's kind of two distinct issues, IMO. You can't do settings via enabled, and you cant have enabled files without content (i.e. settings only)20:47
doug-fishotherwise how does an admin know how to update?20:47
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david-lylecompeting is the larger plugin bp20:48
robcresswelldoug-fish: lol20:48
tqtranplus, if you have 2 plugins competing for the same setting, that would then depend on load order, which could be bad?20:48
david-lylebut it's light on details, just has a task20:48
david-lylebut I expected it to be incorporated into the enabled files20:48
david-lylethat's why there is a load order20:48
david-lylea clearly defined one20:49
tqtranbut now, the user is force to look through all the enabled files to locate which plugin loaded SETTING_A last20:49
david-lylebut a general theme plugin, I would not expect to use the enabled files or even a plugin necessarily20:49
tqtranand if you have 10 different settings you are looking out for, it could get very messy20:50
david-lylemaybe a plugin and a manual edit of settings20:50
doug-fishI'd think local_settings should always remain the final authority on what a setting should be20:50
mrungetqtran, but that's still better than 'you can't modify'?20:50
david-lylefor a company based theme, that's where setting the default becomes valuable20:50
doug-fishand we should be selective about what we provide in that file20:51
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doug-fishso the priority is settings->enabled files->local_settings20:51
tqtranmrunge: i'm still not understanding why a packager cant modify local_settings?20:51
david-lyledoug-fish: not entirely sure that works20:51
mrungedoug-fish, that would make overriding impossible20:52
doug-fishtqtran: it's because a file needs to belong to one package20:52
doug-fishhow so?20:52
doug-fishWe should only have things in local_settings that the user has explicitly chosen20:52
doug-fishdefaults should be in settings20:52
mrungetqtran, changing a config file due to context of installed combinations of other packages becomes messy20:53
mrungeand it's clearly defined, a file belongs to a *single* package20:53
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mrungebesides, changing a config file would involve most probably a shell script (or so)20:54
doug-fishmrunge: does local_settings belong to any package?20:54
mrungeyes, it does20:54
mrungeto openstack-dashbard20:54
mrunge+o somewhere20:54
mrungeone would change local_settings by installing a plugin20:55
david-lyledoug-fish: these are distribution packages, not pure upstream20:55
doug-fishyep understood20:55
mrungethe last installed plugin would then dictate the contents of local_settings?20:55
doug-fishI'd expect local_Settings to be a user editable file - wasn't sure that would belong to a package20:55
david-lylemrunge: I think there are two things20:55
mrungedoug-fish, that is a config file20:56
mrungeand nothing has to change that file, other than the user of something like puppet20:56
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doug-fishmrunge: got it - thx20:57
* david-lyle about to stomp on his own point20:57
doug-fishdon't other projects with plugins have the same issue?20:57
doug-fishis there a known solution/pattern that would work better?20:57
david-lylemrunge: where does the apache config for horizon come from in rpms?20:57
mrungefrom horizon package20:58
david-lyleactually, those are just drop in files20:58
mrungeand it's placed in a .d config dir20:58
* david-lyle lucky illustrates own point20:58
mrungethe Thomas idea with a local_settings.d is quite straightforward then20:58
david-lylejust not sure the need of another mechanism :/20:59
david-lylewe have 20 now20:59
mrungeif we can enable updating local_settings by enabled files, there you go20:59
mrungeor some other documented mechanism20:59
david-lylemrunge: either takes new code21:00
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robcresswellDo we want to allow plugins to override any setting?21:00
tqtranI like the local_settings.d more, having many places to place your settings is confusing21:00
mrungeyes we should...21:00
mrungetqtran, +121:00
robcresswelltqtran: Isn't this *more* places than just using enabled?21:01
david-lyleso now my plugin needs to drop the enabled file and the local_settings.d file?21:01
tqtranif i installed 10 plugins, and they all are overriding settings.... its a complete mess for me to trace down which ones had the last load21:01
mrungerobcresswell, think about a networking plugin, which requires new/changed neutron settings...21:01
mrungethat would require a manual config change otherwise21:01
david-lylewith it's own precedence scheme that should match the plugin21:01
doug-fishbut again - I think local_settings needs to be the final authority on a settings value21:02
robcresswellYeah the settings would have a different load order than enabled/21:02
doug-fishand maybe we need fewer values there21:02
robcresswellif we had two mechanisms21:02
mrungedoug-fish, in that case, you can not override settings defined in local_settings21:02
david-lyledoug-fish: that doesn't even hold for INSTALLED_APPS21:02
david-lylewhich is why plugins work :D21:02
doug-fishmaybe INSTALLED_APPS shouldn't be in local_settings by default21:03
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alaskisorry to interrupt, are ya'll just about finished in here?21:03
david-lyleahh over time21:03
david-lylethanks everyone we'll pick this up in #openstack-horizn21:03
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"21:03
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 21:03:51 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)21:03
openstackMinutes (text):
alaskidavid-lyle: thanks21:04
alaski#startmeeting nova_cells21:04
david-lyleapologies alaski21:04
openstackMeeting started Wed Nov 11 21:04:11 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is alaski. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.21:04
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"21:04
alaskidavid-lyle: no worries21:04
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'nova_cells'21:04
alaskiwho's here to discuss cells!?21:04
dansmithme is21:04
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alaski#topic v1 testing21:05
*** openstack changes topic to "v1 testing (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"21:05
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alaskiI didn't have time to put together a summary of what's been going on, but a ec2 volume test has been failing regularly21:06
alaskidue to an apparent race in updating/creating bdms in the parent cell21:06
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alaskifor now the test is skipped, but dansmith and mriedem have put some work together at **
alaskiany eyes on that would be great21:07
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dansmithI don't think that's all working21:07
dansmithi.e. not needing eyes yet21:07
alaskiit's not21:07
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alaskitrue, review isn't needed yert21:07
alaskibut people can help debug if they'd like21:08
alaskiand the lock_unlock test was recently added to the skiplist21:08
alaskiother than that I think things are fairly stable21:09
alaski#topic Specs for Mitaka21:09
*** openstack changes topic to "Specs for Mitaka (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"21:09
alaskiIf anyone has any specs they should list them on
alaskiincluding me, because I have one open I think21:10
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alaskiand I would like to discuss open specs each meeting and I'm going to pull a list from there21:11
alaski#topic Open Reviews21:11
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alaskiany reviews needing attention?21:11
* alaski suspects not this early in the cycle21:11
alaski#topic Open Discussion21:12
belmoreiraalaski: we still have the grenade problem with the code for the flavors21:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"21:12
belmoreirawe need some help on this21:12
alaskithat's the series at
alaskibelmoreira: that should have been fixed when we went into Mitaka and grenade switched from L->M21:14
dansmithyeah, I should get that base grenade patch working again21:14
dansmiththat's a prerequisite for the flavors stuff21:14
dansmithI'll try to get that done in the next week21:14
alaskiokay, great21:14
belmoreiradansmith: great21:14
alaskiso based on the summit outcome my take is that the big work items this cycle are modifying boot to call the scheduler in a new place, persist request-spec, and cell021:16
alaskiand the flavor migration to set a pattern for future migrations21:16
dansmithyeah, I had some concerns about the flavor thing21:17
dansmithI don't remember what they were, but they might just be outright fear21:17
belmoreirasoft delete?21:17
dansmithI think we need to figure out how we're going to draw a box around that to make it graceful and not too painful21:17
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dansmithah, well, yeah, that wasn't my complaint but I don't recall what the outcome of that was21:18
dansmithreally don't want to add soft delete into the cell db, but also don't want to delay any further21:18
alaskiI think we said that we would carry it over for now, but I can't recall for sure either21:18
dansmithI wonder,21:19
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alaskiit's not on the etherpad21:19
dansmithcould we use the migration path to help us defer this?21:19
dansmither, no that's not going to work21:19
alaskithe contention was that it's an API change21:20
alaskisince deleted flavors can currently be listed21:20
alaskiand we need to tackle that first21:20
dansmithwhich is death knell21:20
belmoreiraI think Sean will write a spec for it21:20
dansmithbut we can't support deleted flavors in older microversions otherwise,21:20
dansmithso I'm not sure how we're going to spec our way out of that box21:21
belmoreiraand the outcome was not to block the current work, at leat is what I thought21:21
alaskiI think we need to defer that all for now, and carry over soft delete21:22
alaskiand by defer I mean let sdague run with his spec21:22
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alaskidansmith: the current migration review attempts to be painless, and online, so if you could list your fears there that would be helpful21:23
dansmithalaski: yeah, I need to remember them and then document the defensible ones I guess21:24
sdagueoh, good reminder that I'm supposed to write something up there21:24
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dansmithalaski: I'm generally concerned about the moving things between databases thing21:24
dansmithalaski: and the thing about us not being able to hit graceful API restart this time21:24
dansmithbut I have no cats to pull from my hat to make that better, so...21:25
alaskidansmith: yeah, good point21:25
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alaskiI've been starting to think about needing an "atomic move" for instances as well21:25
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dansmithalaski: so, about that21:25
alaskiI'll try some different things and share my failure with the group and maybe we can find something21:26
dansmithalaski: we initially talked about not persisting the instance and just using the request spec to answer queries until it's either scheduled or dead in cell021:26
dansmithalaski: that would mean no atomic instance move.. have you changed your mind about that?21:26
alaskibut the problem is still sort of the same right?21:27
dansmithwith flavors, we need to move them from the cell to the api db21:27
dansmithwith instances, existing ones stay in the existing db, which becomes the cell21:28
alaskiwe're moving the request-spec to the cell, albeit in a different format21:28
dansmithand only newly failed instances go into the cell021:28
dansmithwe're not storing request-spec yet though21:28
alaskiI'm thinking of boot, not migration21:28
alaskiit is slightly different though, so nvm for now21:29
dansmithright, I'm talking about boot and existing data too21:29
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alaskiwhat we want is a copy, ensure it's written, delete operation I think21:30
dansmithyeah, I'm just totally missing why we need that for instances or request spec21:30
dansmithbut maybe we can catch up high bw offline and discuss21:31
alaskiI'm going to rework the request-spec persistence patch since dansmith went and changed object while I was out21:32
alaskidansmith: do you have any interest in the cell0 or scheduling work?21:33
dansmithI did?21:33
alaskithe relationship mappings thing21:33
dansmithwell, I changed that in liberty and you haven't been out that long, but okay :)21:33
alaskiwell, I didn't notice the review comment on it until then :)21:34
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dansmithalaski: I'm too stupid for scheduling stuff, but I guess I need to help with the cell0 and general object support for who-am-i-talking-to, eh?21:34
alaskioh yeah, the object support would be great21:35
alaskimelwitt had some initial work on that21:35
alaskibut there were open questions about it21:36
dansmithah, cool21:36
alaskianything else to discuss today?21:37
alaskioh, I should mention that we're back to meeting weekly now21:38
alaskiI'll send an email out to the ML21:38
pranav_dansmith : can you point me to that grenade patch?21:38
alaskithanks everyone!21:39
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"21:39
openstackMeeting ended Wed Nov 11 21:39:06 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)21:39
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