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| dguitarbite | Hello Guys | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| sarob | #startmeeeting training-manuals | 15:00 |
| sarob | #startmeeeting training-manuals | 15:01 |
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| sarob | #startmeeeting training-manuals | 15:02 |
| sarob | bot seems to be broken | 15:03 |
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| sarob | #startmeeting training-manuals | 15:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 19 15:04:59 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sarob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:05 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: training-manuals)" | 15:05 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'training_manuals' | 15:05 |
| sarob | finally | 15:05 |
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| sarob | who's here? | 15:05 |
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| sarob | morning | 15:19 |
| nermina | hi sarob | 15:20 |
| rev | Howdy | 15:20 |
| rev | @sarob: is this the official time for the OpenStack Training Dev IRC meeting | 15:21 |
| sarob | hello all | 15:21 |
| sarob | well it started at 7 | 15:21 |
| sarob | no prob | 15:21 |
| sarob | just making coffee | 15:21 |
| rev | Oh... yeah. | 15:22 |
| sarob | colin is off having fun in the jungle | 15:22 |
| rev | Coffee is why I was late. | 15:22 |
| rev | That's my story ... and I'm sticking to it. | 15:22 |
| sarob | morning nermina | 15:22 |
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| sarob | sooo | 15:24 |
| sarob | ill go through the two main topics real quick | 15:24 |
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| sarob | #topic restructure | 15:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "restructure (Meeting topic: training-manuals)" | 15:27 | |
| sarob | #link https://docs.google.com/a/yahoo-inc.com/drawings/d/1ju78O-PjkZIeSbpGkUndIohQeQy06QXseRPbCy2F6F8/edit | 15:27 |
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| rev | ... need pemissions to access | 15:28 |
| sarob | whats your gmail addr? | 15:29 |
| sarob | or req through gdraw | 15:29 |
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| rev | revans | 15:29 |
| sarob | yur in | 15:30 |
| rev | thx | 15:30 |
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| rev | Suggestion: start small. Start with classes with 1-3 student BEFORE trying a class with 15 or more. | 15:33 |
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| rev | For example a small train-the-trainers event | 15:33 |
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| rev | Trainging is best when practiced. Your first three teaches are going to be rough, so don't waste the time of a lot of people by starting with large classes | 15:34 |
| rev | In general By the fourth teach you will be golden | 15:35 |
| rev | Ideally that's when you invite the hungry hoards | 15:35 |
| rev | Think of training like a stage play. It will only be good after rehearsals. | 15:35 |
| sarob | sounds like good planning to me | 15:37 |
| sarob | sfbay hackathon is the training rough drive plan | 15:38 |
| sarob | does the timing and limited content make sense for assoc? | 15:38 |
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| rev | Are you assuming there is hands-on work during the Assoc class (I hope so). from chart it looks just like lecture/quiz/lecture/quiz... | 15:40 |
| rev | In other words are "labs" hands-on practice? | 15:40 |
| sarob | administration tasks will be the hands on | 15:40 |
| sarob | for associate | 15:41 |
| sarob | that the plan | 15:41 |
| rev | okay thanks. | 15:41 |
| rev | Another reason to do training run throughs with small audience is to check timing. | 15:41 |
| sarob | install and digging into files will be saved for the 10 day operator class | 15:41 |
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| rev | Typically the more you teach something the faster it will go. Example the class I used to barely be able to teach in 5 days, I now finish easily in 3 days. | 15:42 |
| rev | ... after about a dozen teaches | 15:43 |
| sarob | hmm, well we can always add more material | 15:43 |
| rev | :-) yup | 15:43 |
| rev | or teach more classes. | 15:43 |
| rev | :-) | 15:43 |
| sarob | sure | 15:43 |
| sarob | so you think i have enough logical structure here to restructure the guides again | 15:44 |
| sarob | im real eager to give him and some profs a chance to dig into the rough draft | 15:45 |
| sarob | give you that is | 15:45 |
| sarob | stupid radio | 15:45 |
| rev | ? | 15:45 |
| rev | Uh logical structure looks good to me | 15:46 |
| rev | I need to dig in ... as you said | 15:46 |
| sarob | i heard him as i was typing you, and typed what i heard | 15:47 |
| sarob | im going to create a patch for the associate version of the gdraw today | 15:47 |
| sarob | any experience with online testing sources? | 15:48 |
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| rev | Dumb question: If students are not installing OpenStack what will they use for hands on? Are you assuming they'll have a DevStack of their own? Or a pre-installed system ... like HPCloud or something from another benefactor... like Yahoo or Marantis? | 15:48 |
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| rev | I see setup scripts, not sure what that means ... | 15:49 |
| sarob | we're going to use virtualbox install four node with scripts | 15:49 |
| rev | okay. Script like VMTrooper was doing with DGuitartByte? | 15:50 |
| sarob | right exactly | 15:50 |
| rev | Got it. | 15:50 |
| sarob | ever used an online testing service? | 15:51 |
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| rev | a little bit. Not lately. | 15:51 |
| rev | You talking about proctored certification services? | 15:52 |
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| sarob | not proctored | 15:52 |
| sarob | just online like moodle | 15:53 |
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| rev | Oh. moodle. Sure online quiz stuff ... more formally known as Learning Management Systems (LMS) ... pain in the ass to setup. | 15:53 |
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| sarob | yeah, id like to use surveymonkey | 15:54 |
| rev | ... well ... more than online quizes... a proper LMS tracks a students process as they traverse a curriculum. | 15:54 |
| sarob | it doesnt really work that way | 15:54 |
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| rev | I have studied moodle but not worked with it. | 15:54 |
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| sarob | can you figure out what we should use? | 15:55 |
| rev | Okay ... | 15:55 |
| sarob | that would be really helpful, cause i have never used any of them | 15:55 |
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| sarob | or experience with what is important | 15:55 |
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| sarob | dont kill yourself just your best guess | 15:56 |
| sarob | surveymonkey, moodle, coursera, educity are the ones i looked at | 15:57 |
| rev | Should I assume you want a cetnralize quiz systems that tracks students results, ... or do you want the local meetup folks to do the tracking? | 15:57 |
| sarob | the former would be awesome | 15:57 |
| rev | Okay | 15:57 |
| sarob | it would help us improve the material | 15:58 |
| sarob | if everyone is getting 100% or 0% | 15:58 |
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| sarob | time to go | 15:59 |
| sarob | #endmeeting | 15:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 19 15:59:46 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-11-19-15.04.html | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-11-19-15.04.txt | 15:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-11-19-15.04.log.html | 15:59 |
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| rev | It occurs to me that Mirantis might want to get involved with this... since training is their business... but I'm not sure about politics and their willingness to support open source training. | 16:00 |
| rev | advice? | 16:00 |
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| sarob | nermina works for mirantis | 16:01 |
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| sarob | so she is quite aware of what we are doing | 16:01 |
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| rev | Great! | 16:01 |
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| sarob | she wants to start reusing our swift docs for the cloud admin guide | 16:01 |
| sarob | once i get this restructure done | 16:01 |
| rev | Awareness is not the issue, I meant does Mirantis want to work with sponsoring free training and its infrastructure (i.e., test tracking)? | 16:02 |
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| nermina | rev, please contact nchase at mirantis dot com | 16:03 |
| rev | THANKS! | 16:03 |
| rev | will do | 16:03 |
| sarob | ah right | 16:03 |
| sarob | thx nermina | 16:04 |
| sarob | i didnt think of that, sigh | 16:04 |
| nermina | no problem, sarob :) | 16:04 |
| rev | May I assume nchase is in charge of training at Mirantis? | 16:04 |
| nermina | rev, and that's nick | 16:04 |
| rev | heh | 16:04 |
| rev | I was going to ask that. | 16:05 |
| rev | My guess was either Nick or Nancy | 16:05 |
| nermina | he's the technical marketing manager | 16:05 |
| rev | Okay. | 16:05 |
| nermina | i'm a tech writer | 16:05 |
| rev | thanks | 16:05 |
| nermina | no problem | 16:06 |
| nermina | thank you | 16:06 |
| balajip | is this Neutron advanced services IRC meeting? | 16:06 |
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| ativelkov | My schedule says it should be Solum's time. But it looks like I am wrong | 16:08 |
| balajip | sorry to ask about this!! | 16:08 |
| balajip | ok..looks like no neutrons here..!! | 16:11 |
| balajip | please carry on ..!! | 16:11 |
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| ativelkov | Hi there! Any Muranoers around? We have a meeting scheduled | 17:03 |
| sergmelikyan | Hi! | 17:03 |
| tsufiev | hi1 | 17:03 |
| ativelkov | #startmeeting murano | 17:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 19 17:04:20 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ativelkov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'murano' | 17:04 |
| ativelkov | So, let's begin | 17:04 |
| ativelkov | Our agenda is here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/MuranoAgenda#Agenda | 17:04 |
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| ativelkov | let's start with the #topic Summit summary | 17:05 |
| ativelkov | #topic Summit Summary | 17:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Summit Summary (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:05 | |
| ativelkov | So, we have officially presented the changing of Murano mission from "Windows DataCenter as a service" to "Application Catalog" | 17:05 |
| ativelkov | Received some positiv | 17:06 |
| ativelkov | received some positive feedback from the community | 17:06 |
| ativelkov | Seems like lot's of people were working on the similar topics on their own, looks like we may get some synergy while working together | 17:07 |
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| ativelkov | Also, it is #agreed to extract reusable functionality from Murano and contribute it to other projects | 17:07 |
| ativelkov | E.g. Murano Workflows will be contributed to Mistral, Murano Agent may become Unified Agent, and some of our software post install configuration may get its way into Heat Software Configuration | 17:08 |
| ativelkov | Discussions on Mistral and Unified Agent are already in progress | 17:09 |
| katyafervent | Good news! | 17:09 |
| ativelkov | That's all for summit, I think. Any questions? | 17:09 |
| katyafervent | Is there is a special project name for a Unified Agent? | 17:10 |
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| ativelkov | Not yet. We just call it "unified agent", and "unified" means "adopted by more then one project" | 17:11 |
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| ativelkov | So, next topic | 17:12 |
| ativelkov | #topic AI review | 17:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AI review (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:12 | |
| ativelkov | We actually have 4 AIs | 17:12 |
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| ativelkov | gokrokve was supposed to "Put together and distribute over the mailing list AIs and agreements achieved in HK" | 17:13 |
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| ativelkov | gokrokve is on the Solum workshop today, so he probably cannot answer. In fact, we have sent an email into the distribution, summarising all the agreements and inviting the community to participate | 17:14 |
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| ativelkov | sergmelikyan was supposed to "Find new available timeslot for Murano meeting that is later then current one." | 17:15 |
| ativelkov | As we are chatting right now it seems like this is done :) | 17:15 |
| sergmelikyan | ativelkov, we moved meeting to Tuesday, 17:00 UTC :) | 17:15 |
| ativelkov | yup | 17:15 |
| sergmelikyan | And today is a first meeting with new schedule :) | 17:15 |
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| ativelkov | There is an AI to "fix Jenkins configuration to full eng" | 17:16 |
| ativelkov | It was not assigned | 17:16 |
| ativelkov | any news on this? | 17:16 |
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| sergmelikyan | It was assigned to Timur and AFAIK was done at the same day as assigned | 17:17 |
| ativelkov | Probably it is up to tnurlygayanov, but he is not present | 17:17 |
| ativelkov | ah, good | 17:17 |
| ativelkov | last AI was to start discussing with Solum devs API specs and env. descriptions format | 17:18 |
| ativelkov | sergmelikyan: any progress on that? | 17:18 |
| katyafervent | May by Gosha is doing it right now) | 17:19 |
| ativelkov | I hope so | 17:20 |
| sergmelikyan | ativelkov, from my side I had not enough time to do that :( | 17:20 |
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| sergmelikyan | And Georgy on the Solum Design Workshop now | 17:20 |
| ativelkov | OK. So, let's hope gokrokve will do this on their workshop | 17:21 |
| ativelkov | ok, we are done with AIs | 17:21 |
| ativelkov | #topic Release 0.3 status | 17:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Release 0.3 status (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:21 | |
| ativelkov | sergmelikyan, can you give us an update on the release status? | 17:21 |
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| sergmelikyan | We fixing last issues in Release 0.3 and finishing with documentations | 17:22 |
| ativelkov | Any estimates on when it will be ready? | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | Current ETA for the release - 2 days, we planning to release 0.3 on Thursday | 17:23 |
| ativelkov | #info Realease 0.3 is expected on Thursday | 17:23 |
| ativelkov | #topic Release 0.4 | 17:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Release 0.4 (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:24 | |
| ativelkov | tsufiev: can you give an update for r.04? | 17:25 |
| tsufiev | we're finishing admin UI for metadata today almost as planned | 17:25 |
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| tsufiev | i mean, last commit implementing its functionality should be approved tomorrow | 17:26 |
| tsufiev | also there is advanced networking still to be merged... | 17:26 |
| katyafervent | I thought it have already merged | 17:27 |
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| ativelkov | yes, I am working on this today | 17:27 |
| ativelkov | #info metadata repository admin part is almost done | 17:27 |
| ativelkov | #info advanced networking is being finished | 17:27 |
| ativelkov | katyafervent: adv networking part of Conductor has been merged indeed, however some workflows still has to be modified | 17:28 |
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| katyafervent | ativelkov, Ok, thanks | 17:28 |
| ativelkov | so, next topic) | 17:29 |
| ativelkov | #topic Load Balancer Issue | 17:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Load Balancer Issue (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:29 | |
| ativelkov | AFAIK, there was an email by sergmelikyan describing the problem | 17:29 |
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| ativelkov | Serge, can you briefly describe it here as well? | 17:30 |
| igormarnat_ | I remember there was some feedback about the subj | 17:30 |
| sergmelikyan | Yes, but not so many responses. Maybe we need to forward this email to the Fuel Team to get they thoughts on Neutron LBaaS support. | 17:30 |
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| ativelkov | The feedback from Heat team was that we should't use AWS::-based templates if we can use OS::-based | 17:31 |
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| ativelkov | so, let's ale an AI ) | 17:32 |
| ativelkov | make* | 17:32 |
| igormarnat_ | Yep, I think we can modify the subj, adding there [Neutron] and [Fuel], and may be to ping folks personally to get some feedback | 17:32 |
| ativelkov | #action forward the LoadBalancer email to Neutron and Fuel team, asking for feedback | 17:32 |
| ativelkov | Anything else on this topic? | 17:33 |
| ativelkov | If no, then the next one | 17:34 |
| ativelkov | #topic Solum Integration | 17:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Solum Integration (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:34 | |
| ativelkov | I guess we don't have much here for now - not until gokrokve has some news from the workshop | 17:34 |
| igormarnat_ | He's there in #murano channel, let me ping him | 17:35 |
| ativelkov | #action gokrokve to summarise the decisions of Solum design workshop for further discussion of integration paths | 17:35 |
| ativelkov | Ok, probably he is busy. May be they have a lot to discuss, this may be promising :) | 17:37 |
| igormarnat_ | What else is in the agenda? What about scope of 0.5? Is it there? | 17:37 |
| ativelkov | it is not in the agenda ) | 17:37 |
| ativelkov | #topic Open Discussion | 17:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:37 | |
| ativelkov | but let's discuss it now then | 17:37 |
| ativelkov | So, we are going towards Application Catalog, obviously | 17:38 |
| ativelkov | The core concept of the App Catalog will be the Metadata, describing the Cloud Applications | 17:38 |
| katyafervent | Do we need to implement more applications? | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | Nope | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | at least not for now | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | We expect others to do that - and not as part of Murano project | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | For release 0.5 we need to dramatically improve the concept of Metadata | 17:40 |
| ativelkov | I think we will need to develop the specification | 17:40 |
| ativelkov | Rich and detailed, formal and excessive | 17:40 |
| ativelkov | Then, we will need to extract a subset of it - which will be easy to explain and implement | 17:41 |
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| ativelkov | and then - last but not least - actually implement it :) | 17:41 |
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| igormarnat_ | rich and detailed, formal and excessive … sounds scaring:) | 17:41 |
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| ativelkov | igormarnat_: that's specification only | 17:41 |
| ativelkov | we don't want to change it often | 17:42 |
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| ativelkov | but we do not need to implement it as the whole thing | 17:42 |
| ativelkov | we'll need something simple to begin with | 17:42 |
| ativelkov | but this simple implementation should comply to the global vision, so the vision should be detailed | 17:42 |
| igormarnat_ | Speaking of spec, I'd say it's enough to be integral and consistent, but still these are just words:) | 17:43 |
| igormarnat_ | What's the plan then? When do we plan to have the draft? | 17:44 |
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| igormarnat_ | BTW, is Stan here? | 17:45 |
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| ativelkov | stanlagun: are you here? | 17:45 |
| stanlagun | yep | 17:46 |
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| stanlagun | we are working on it | 17:47 |
| stanlagun | I mean ideas for spec | 17:48 |
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| ativelkov | We'll try to have some formal draft as soon as I finish with adv.net. | 17:49 |
| igormarnat_ | Do we have an etherpad or something? | 17:49 |
| ativelkov | not yet, just the ideas. As I said, we need to fomalize them | 17:49 |
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| igormarnat_ | Suppose to have them formalized by the next meeting (in a week)? | 17:51 |
| ativelkov | Yes | 17:51 |
| ativelkov | #action ativelkov stanlagun to formalise the new metadata ideas in the etherpad | 17:51 |
| stanlagun | sure | 17:52 |
| ativelkov | Ok. Any other questions? | 17:52 |
| igormarnat_ | #action ativelkov stanlagun To elaborate and formalize the spec for Metadata | 17:52 |
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| ativelkov | So, let's conclude the meeting | 17:53 |
| ativelkov | thanks for joining | 17:53 |
| ativelkov | #endmeeting | 17:53 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:53 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 19 17:53:40 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:53 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2013/murano.2013-11-19-17.04.html | 17:53 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2013/murano.2013-11-19-17.04.txt | 17:53 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2013/murano.2013-11-19-17.04.log.html | 17:53 |
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| pballand | hello everyone - I believe this slot has been cleared for a Congress team meeting - we'll get started in a few minutes | 18:00 |
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| pballand | ok, lets get started | 18:04 |
| pballand | #startmeeting CongressTeamMeeting | 18:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 19 18:04:11 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is pballand. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)" | 18:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'congressteammeeting' | 18:04 |
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| pballand | #topic Intro to Congress | 18:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Intro to Congress (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)" | 18:04 | |
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| pballand | Since I don't know how many people are here, I want to keep the intro brief, and allow people to introduce themselves | 18:05 |
| pballand | The brief intro is: A few of us have been working on policy for some time, and feel that it fills an important need in OpenStack | 18:05 |
| pballand | We've proposed a service (initially named "Congress") and posted some POC code and overview | 18:06 |
| pballand | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Congress | 18:06 |
| pballand | with that, let's see who (if anyone) is here | 18:06 |
| pballand | #topic Participant intros | 18:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Participant intros (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)" | 18:06 | |
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| banix | Hi, This is Mohammad Banikazemi | 18:07 |
| pballand | I'll go first: my name is Peter and I work at VMware; I want to see congress facilitate declaring business logic in a way that can facilitate customers needs in the cloud | 18:08 |
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| banix | I am mainly interested in Policies for networking but thought should here a bit about Congress | 18:08 |
| pballand | Hi Mohammad | 18:08 |
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| pballand | anyone else around? | 18:09 |
| banix | Hi | 18:09 |
| thinrichs | Hi. My name is Tim Hinrichs. I recently started working at VMWare. Before that I spent 10 years on policy languages. | 18:09 |
| pballand | ok - I know there is another working group for networking policy, so we don't want to replicate that here | 18:10 |
| pballand | at the last conference, we discussed some things that make sense to do at a level above networking, with potential merging in the future | 18:11 |
| pballand | banix: does that sound reasonable to you? | 18:12 |
| banix | yeah; Makes sense. I was thinking at some point here may be some interactions | 18:12 |
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| banix | so I just want to be aware of where you guys are heading and if there are things to sync/discuss in future | 18:13 |
| pballand | ok, since it appears to be just the three of us, it seems we should move on to future work | 18:13 |
| thinrichs | I agree it makes sense to keep in touch with the other effort. | 18:13 |
| pballand | #topic Initial use cases | 18:13 |
| thinrichs | I was going to participate in the Thur networking policy irc meeting. | 18:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Initial use cases (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)" | 18:13 | |
| banix | sounds good | 18:13 |
| pballand | it seems that the networking group is focused on using policy for connectivity and service modeling | 18:14 |
| pballand | so, while we expect congress can cover that, it seems we should steer clear for our initial use cases | 18:14 |
| banix | I agree | 18:14 |
| thinrichs | Yep. | 18:14 |
| pballand | also, while congress could satisfy RBAC and ABAC use cases, it seems there is overlap with Keystone | 18:15 |
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| pballand | I think that still leaves substantial space where we can focus for now | 18:15 |
| pballand | the demo use case in the code is out of Neutron: only allow tenants that share a group with the network owner to share networks | 18:16 |
| thinrichs | I think the class of use cases we want to focus on are those that bridge OS components. | 18:16 |
| pballand | are there other use cases that people would like to propose? | 18:16 |
| pballand | thinrichs: I agree | 18:16 |
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| thinrichs | The demo draws from 3 sources: Nova, Neutron, and a group-management system. | 18:17 |
| pballand | #agreed Initial Congress use cases should focus on cross-component policy rules | 18:18 |
| *** flaper87|afk is now known as flaper87 | 18:18 | |
| pballand | okay, I don't think we're going to get much further without a larger community - does this time work for you banix? | 18:19 |
| banix | yes it does | 18:19 |
| pballand | can we take as an action item to come up with at least 2 more use cases that illustrate the cross-component focus? | 18:20 |
| pballand | thinrichs: it seems you may be well-positioned for this | 18:21 |
| thinrichs | Sounds good to me. | 18:21 |
| pballand | okay, lets focus on that for next time, and we'll see how this develops | 18:21 |
| pballand | does anyone have something else they want to dicuss? | 18:22 |
| pballand | #topic open discussion | 18:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)" | 18:22 | |
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| thinrichs | There's been some discussion about making Congress a part of Keystone. | 18:23 |
| pballand | ok, I'll see both of you in Thrusday's meeting :) | 18:23 |
| thinrichs | Okay. See you then. | 18:23 |
| banix | bye :) | 18:23 |
| pballand | thinrichs: yes, my thought is to focus on items clearly outside of Keystone, until we have someone from Keystone as part of the discussion | 18:23 |
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| pballand | I think we should end there for this week, and pick up with the use cases next week | 18:24 |
| thinrichs | Sure. | 18:24 |
| pballand | thanks for joining | 18:24 |
| pballand | #endmeeting | 18:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:25 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 19 18:25:05 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:25 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2013/congressteammeeting.2013-11-19-18.04.html | 18:25 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2013/congressteammeeting.2013-11-19-18.04.txt | 18:25 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2013/congressteammeeting.2013-11-19-18.04.log.html | 18:25 |
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| lifeless | good morning everyone! | 19:00 |
| lsmola | hello | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #startmeeting tripleo | 19:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 19 19:00:20 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is lifeless. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tripleo' | 19:00 |
| jistr | hi | 19:00 |
| ifarkas | hello | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #topic agenda | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:00 | |
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| lifeless | bugs | 19:00 |
| lifeless | reviews | 19:00 |
| lifeless | Projects needing releases | 19:00 |
| lifeless | CD Cloud status | 19:00 |
| lifeless | CI virtualized testing progress | 19:00 |
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| lifeless | Insert one-off agenda items here | 19:00 |
| lifeless | open discussion | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #topic bugs | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:00 | |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/ | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/ | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-refresh-config | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-collect-config | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar | 19:00 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar-ui | 19:01 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-tuskarclient | 19:01 |
| lifeless | one critical fixed - bug 1251166 | 19:01 |
| jcoufal | o/ | 19:01 |
| bnemec | \o | 19:01 |
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| pleia2 | o/ | 19:01 |
| jomara | good afternoon | 19:01 |
| slagle | |o | 19:01 |
| tzumainn | heya | 19:01 |
| jomara | i broke the wave | 19:01 |
| dkehn | hi | 19:01 |
| jomara | i am so sorry | 19:01 |
| jtomasek | hey | 19:01 |
| marios | 'evening | 19:02 |
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| jprovazn | hi | 19:02 |
| lifeless | sorry elocal there | 19:03 |
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| lifeless | ok so all other bugs triaged it looks like | 19:04 |
| lifeless | and no other criticals - cool | 19:04 |
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| lifeless | any other bug business? | 19:04 |
| dprince | lifeless: question about general OS fixes that affect tripleO as well. | 19:05 |
| lifeless | dprince: shoot | 19:05 |
| dprince | lifeless: should we register those against tripleO in LP as well? | 19:05 |
| dprince | lifeless: and/or put them in the trello | 19:05 |
| dprince | lifeless: or just fix them in each project (Nova) and mention in on tripleO IRC | 19:06 |
| *** jcoufal has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 19:06 | |
| * dprince doesn't like extra busy work but wants to keep people in the loop | 19:06 | |
| lifeless | dprince: can you give a for-instance ? | 19:06 |
| dprince | lifeless: for instance... if any sort of integration point breaks that we aren't gating on | 19:07 |
| rpodolyaka1 | sqlalchemy-migrate versioning bug | 19:07 |
| lifeless | ok | 19:07 |
| dprince | ^^ or that, sure | 19:07 |
| rpodolyaka1 | that broke nova and other api services for a few hours | 19:07 |
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| lifeless | so, IMO if we're going to make a code change (e.g. version lock to work around) then it's entirely appropriate to have a bug in TripleO | 19:07 |
| lifeless | if it's something we're going to wait and see / just fix in the source location immediately | 19:08 |
| lifeless | then I think a trello card maybe, and/or a topic update to surface the info | 19:08 |
| lifeless | dprince: how does that sound? | 19:08 |
| *** david-lyle_lunch is now known as david-lyle | 19:08 | |
| dprince | lifeless: okay. thanks | 19:09 |
| rpodolyaka1 | +1 | 19:09 |
| lifeless | ok | 19:09 |
| lifeless | #topic reviews | 19:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:09 | |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-openreviews.html | 19:09 |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-30.txt | 19:09 |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-90.txt | 19:09 |
| * SpamapS dons UTC watch | 19:09 | |
| lifeless | Median wait time: 0 days, 6 hours, 15 minutes | 19:10 |
| lifeless | 3rd quartile wait time: 1 days, 4 hours, 7 minutes | 19:10 |
| lifeless | so we're a little behind, *but* | 19:10 |
| rpodolyaka1 | WIP? | 19:10 |
| lifeless | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/52045/ is the reason, and I think it's meant to be marked work in progress | 19:10 |
| dprince | reviews seem to be totally under control... so much so that I frequently don't get to see things until after they land | 19:10 |
| lifeless | but isn't | 19:10 |
| * matty_dubs actually wears UTC watch | 19:10 | |
| lifeless | marios: gerrit sadly requires you to click on 'work in progress' after each push | 19:10 |
| jcoufal | matty_dubs: but only 12 h mode :P | 19:11 |
| marios | lifeless: oh is that what that was | 19:11 |
| marios | sorry, fixing | 19:12 |
| SpamapS | I have not been doing my usual share of reviews the last week as well. Just getting back into it today. | 19:12 |
| lifeless | ok, so yeah good stuff! | 19:13 |
| lifeless | #topic Projects needing releases | 19:14 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Projects needing releases (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:14 | |
| lifeless | we've landed a bunch of code | 19:14 |
| lifeless | do we have a volunteer to do releases of them all ? | 19:14 |
| rpodolyaka1 | pick me :) | 19:14 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: tag! | 19:14 |
| lifeless | #action rpodolyaka1 to release all the things | 19:15 |
| lifeless | #topic CD Cloud status | 19:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CD Cloud status (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:15 | |
| *** gokrokve has quit IRC | 19:16 | |
| lifeless | its pretty unwell | 19:16 |
| lifeless | I've not lead by example and fixed it this week - sorry | 19:16 |
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| SpamapS | I have a POC that will at least let us track the map of hardware<->instances | 19:17 |
| SpamapS | Should push that up for review later today. | 19:17 |
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| SpamapS | I have a hypothesis that certain hardware is causing timeouts/problems while others allow it to finish properly. | 19:17 |
| dprince | SpamapS: do we have a mixed bag of hardware in the CD cloud then? | 19:18 |
| lifeless | not really | 19:19 |
| lifeless | we have two hardware configs | 19:19 |
| lifeless | in theory | 19:19 |
| lifeless | but we have some oddness | 19:19 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: it's failing 100% of the time atm though | 19:19 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: so I think diagnosing directly is needed | 19:19 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: network driver reload again? | 19:19 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: I don't know :) | 19:20 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: but I want a larger set of people responding and fixing | 19:20 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: agreed diagnosing directly is needed. My suggestion is that it is 100% failing because the good hardware is all taken. But I am willing to accept evidence of other problems. Right now we have very little data beyond "it fails" | 19:20 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: we have 4 machines deployed and 50 in the rack. | 19:20 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: your theory is wrong. | 19:20 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: :) | 19:20 |
| SpamapS | unless we're using the same 4. | 19:21 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: so, I don't want to rathole right now. | 19:21 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: lets talk process and coordination instead. | 19:21 |
| SpamapS | nor do I. But I don't want to leave without a plan of action. | 19:21 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: I think a volunteer poking directly and gathering data is a good start. | 19:22 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: e.g. stop the service, run 'nova boot' and see if a machine comes up | 19:22 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: I do want us to gather more automated data | 19:23 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: but we also need to get into a production mindset and keep the thing itself running. | 19:23 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: my concern is that right now we have 9 sysadmins, but the cloud has been down for 3+ days | 19:24 |
| SpamapS | the cloud is down for several minutes every hour | 19:24 |
| SpamapS | I don't think it matters to anyone yet that it goes down... | 19:24 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: if it fails to deploy, that means we have a problem that may affect everyone doing devtest. | 19:25 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: I've been uninterested in part because it feels more important to preserve state first so we can have some kind of SLA/monitoring of "cloud is up" before we chase these problems. | 19:25 |
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| dprince | lifeless: So I think the issue now is we (as a team) are chasing things on multiple fronts. Once CI and CD get closer we'll have more interest in CD cloud errors for sure. | 19:25 |
| dprince | lifeless: I only logged into the CD cloud for the first time this week... | 19:25 |
| dprince | lifeless: and then only briefly | 19:26 |
| lifeless | dprince: mmmm I can see that angle. The way I think of this is that this period is our learning period. | 19:26 |
| slagle | what happened to the status announcements in #tripleo? | 19:26 |
| * dprince needs a crash course perhaps in our CD cloud setup | 19:26 | |
| slagle | or is that part of what's down? | 19:26 |
| lifeless | slagle: that would seem to be down too | 19:26 |
| SpamapS | slagle: it may be turned off. | 19:26 |
| lifeless | slagle: which means either someone disabled the service (and didn't say so somewhere visible like the channel topic) | 19:27 |
| lifeless | or the undercloud host has lost its firmware marbles again | 19:27 |
| slagle | :) | 19:27 |
| slagle | so that's part of the problem | 19:27 |
| lifeless | agreed! | 19:27 |
| lifeless | I have linked references to a HPCS ticket about these cards/firmware having issue | 19:28 |
| SpamapS | Let's just agree to make it a priority and do analysis on why it has been failing. | 19:28 |
| lifeless | ok | 19:28 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: can you continue the meeting? ELOCAL | 19:28 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: perhaps.. does the bot let you transfer? | 19:28 |
| dprince | SpamapS: I don't think so... but we can unofficially follow your lead | 19:29 |
| SpamapS | Ok sure. :) | 19:29 |
| dprince | SpamapS: not 100% on that though | 19:29 |
| SpamapS | documentation doesn't show any way to take it | 19:30 |
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| SpamapS | anyway, I think we agree that analysis is needed and that we should probably hold it to a higher standard. | 19:30 |
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| SpamapS | #topic CI virtualized testing progress | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | pleia2: is this still your area? | 19:31 |
| pleia2 | yeah | 19:31 |
| pleia2 | I owe a patch to create-nodes and would like to talk a little about boot-seed-vm | 19:32 |
| pleia2 | we could use boot-seed-vm in setting up the test environment, but we'd need to modularize it a bit more, right now we have it as an optional option to actually boot the seed vm, we could also make it optional to build the seed vm | 19:32 |
| pleia2 | so essentially it would just run configure-vm without building the image, or we could just run configure-vm outside of boot-seed-vm | 19:33 |
| pleia2 | thoughts? | 19:33 |
| SpamapS | pleia2: I like splitting things into smaller and smaller tools | 19:33 |
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| SpamapS | anyone else have strong opinions? | 19:34 |
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| lifeless | hi, backish | 19:35 |
| pleia2 | ok, beyond that I'm working on how to tackle network addressing for all these test envs | 19:35 |
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| lifeless | we need to separate out all the libvirt manipulation | 19:35 |
| lifeless | e.g. configure-vm should be run just once as part of setting up the test environment | 19:35 |
| lifeless | so I'd like to see boot-seed-vm behaviour change to assume the vm is defined | 19:36 |
| pleia2 | ok, great | 19:36 |
| lifeless | and just build the image, copy to $place, and start it. | 19:36 |
| * pleia2 nods | 19:36 | |
| pleia2 | that's all from me, dprince and derekh are looking into the gearman stuff https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/3rYI32gvfu | 19:37 |
| * dprince wishes this meeting didn't run concurrently to the infra team meeting | 19:37 | |
| dprince | pleia2: cool, good progress. The gearman stuff is coming along nicely too | 19:38 |
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| dprince | On the gearman front I believe we are still hitting issues with the python gearman client. But if you see the etherpad above the PHP client seems to work fine. | 19:39 |
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| dprince | So... we might need to have a closer look at fixing that. | 19:39 |
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| dprince | Is it worth having another CI focussed google hangout this week? pleia2/derekh? | 19:41 |
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| eggmaster | durrh, sorry, just saw tuskar meeting invite email. | 19:41 |
| pleia2 | dprince: yeah, maybe tomorrow? I'm on the tail end of a flu so today still isn't great | 19:41 |
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| dprince | pleia2: okay. sound good | 19:42 |
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| * dprince hopes pleia2 feels better | 19:42 | |
| pleia2 | thanks :) | 19:42 |
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| pleia2 | I think that's it for the CI stuff in this meeting | 19:43 |
| lifeless | ok properly back | 19:43 |
| SpamapS | ok so let's just move on | 19:43 |
| SpamapS | #topic Open Discussion | 19:44 |
| lifeless | dprince: I'm up for a CI hangout | 19:44 |
| SpamapS | oh and now he's back ;) | 19:44 |
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| jistr | so i didn't make the meeting last time but wanted to give my +1 to the idea of gate involving techs like puppet or chef, for projects where it's helpful | 19:44 |
| dprince | lifeless: cool, sounds like tomorrow is the best day for it | 19:44 |
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| jistr | if we don't gate on it, the potential bugs won't go away, we'll just hit them more painfully | 19:44 |
| jistr | and in the end someone will have to fix it anyway | 19:45 |
| jistr | so we might as well fix it *before* stuff gets in | 19:45 |
| jistr | and if some dev feels blocked by tech he doesn't understand, he can ask for assistance | 19:45 |
| lifeless | jistr: so, I agree, but I think it's a -infra discussion at this point | 19:46 |
| jistr | ok :) | 19:46 |
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| lifeless | #topic Open Discussion | 19:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:49 | |
| lifeless | I'll time out the meeting in a minute | 19:49 |
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| dprince | lifeless: I have a question about my local dev env... which I've been chipping away in again | 19:49 |
| dprince | lifeless: sent you derek and liz the email a few days back... | 19:50 |
| dprince | lifeless: got back to it today, and still hitting an issue | 19:50 |
| dprince | lifeless: which is, I can't ping my overcloud from outside my seed VM | 19:50 |
| dprince | lifeless: which sort of breaks the devtest story :( | 19:50 |
| lifeless | the overcloud host | 19:51 |
| lifeless | or an instance in the overcloud | 19:51 |
| dprince | lifeless: overcloud host (all-in-one) | 19:51 |
| dprince | lifeless: I can ping the undercloud host fine | 19:51 |
| lifeless | login via the console using stack:stack and check the networking is setup | 19:51 |
| lifeless | sensibly | 19:51 |
| dprince | lifeless: did that | 19:51 |
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| jomara | \/win 4 | 19:51 |
| jomara | ! | 19:51 |
| dprince | lifeless: didn't see anything too odd | 19:51 |
| lifeless | dprince: in particular check there is a default route out via 192.0.2.1 | 19:52 |
| lifeless | dprince: cause that being missing would give the symptoms you're describing | 19:52 |
| dprince | lifeless: I think it was, but I can check. | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | well that could explain the 100% fail rate on the CD cloud... | 19:52 |
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| rpodolyaka1 | haven't tested Dan's all-in-one template yet, but devtest is working right now | 19:54 |
| lifeless | dprince: if the route is there, start a ping from outside to your overcloud host, and tcpdump each hop along the way | 19:54 |
| dprince | lifeless: So if it isn't set should I use the NeutronPublicInterfaceDefaultRoute in the template? | 19:54 |
| dprince | lifeless: did that. I saw incoming ICMP packages. But no responses on br-ex from the overcloud | 19:55 |
| rpodolyaka1 | only to override the default route set AFAIK | 19:55 |
| dprince | lifeless: on a related note... it would be really cool if our standard image included tcpdump | 19:55 |
| lifeless | dprince: it does | 19:55 |
| lifeless | dprince: :) | 19:55 |
| lifeless | dprince: maybe not on fedora? | 19:56 |
| dprince | lifeless: not on Fedora :( | 19:56 |
| lifeless | dprince: I'm entirely happy for us to add it :) | 19:56 |
| dprince | lifeless: yep. Which element is it in again (DIB presumably) | 19:56 |
| lifeless | dprince: not sure if NeutronPublicInterfaceDefaultRoute would be appropriate | 19:56 |
| rpodolyaka1 | dprince: there is a problem with br-ex when hand executing devtest (https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1252304), but it should only affect floating ips | 19:56 |
| rpodolyaka1 | not pings of overcloud host | 19:56 |
| lifeless | dprince: I'd add it to the fedora element TBH | 19:56 |
| dprince | rpodolyaka1; thanks, I did see your ticket earlier this week | 19:57 |
| dprince | lifeless; thanks | 19:57 |
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| lifeless | ok, we're out of time :) | 19:58 |
| lifeless | thanks everyone! | 19:58 |
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| lifeless | #endmeeting | 19:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 19 19:58:14 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:58 |
| rpodolyaka1 | o/ | 19:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-11-19-19.00.html | 19:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-11-19-19.00.txt | 19:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-11-19-19.00.log.html | 19:58 |
| lsmola | thanks, good night | 19:58 |
| rpodolyaka1 | good night | 19:58 |
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| jomara | night | 19:58 |
| jistr | see ya | 19:58 |
| jcoufal | see ya | 19:58 |
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| shadower | did I just miss the meeting | 20:03 |
| shadower | ? | 20:03 |
| shadower | sigh, must have been timezones or something, sorry | 20:03 |
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| lifeless | shadower: yup, one hour ago | 20:05 |
| eggmaster | shadower: yeah, fyi, zimbra thought it began an hour ago | 20:05 |
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| eggmaster | I noticed the invite 40 min into it :P | 20:05 |
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| shadower | I've fixed my reminder, won't miss it the next time around | 20:09 |
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