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| Swami_ | hi | 15:06 |
|---|---|---|
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| jamiec_ | Hi | 15:06 |
| Swami_ | Hi jamiec nice to see you | 15:07 |
| Swami_ | safchain ping: | 15:07 |
| safchain | Hi | 15:07 |
| jamiec_ | Thanks. Good to join today. | 15:07 |
| Swami_ | sorry I was late by 5 minutes | 15:07 |
| Swami_ | safchain: hi | 15:07 |
| Swami_ | Ok let us start the meeting | 15:08 |
| Swami_ | #startmeeting Distributed-virtual-router | 15:08 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 18 15:08:22 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Swami_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:08 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Distributed-virtual-router)" | 15:08 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'distributed_virtual_router' | 15:08 |
| Swami_ | #info Meeting-agenda | 15:08 |
| Swami_ | I want to go over the Google doc for the Distributed Router | 15:09 |
| Swami_ | I am not sure if anyone of you got a chance to review the doc, but I have been constantly updating the doc. | 15:09 |
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| Swami_ | #link https://docs.google.com/document/d/1iXMAyVMf42FTahExmGdYNGOBFyeA4e74sAO3pvr_RjA/edit | 15:10 |
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| Swami_ | jamiec: Did you get a chance to review the doc | 15:11 |
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| Swami_ | safchain: did you get a chance to review the doc | 15:11 |
| safchain | Swami_, sorry, I didn't but I will for sure | 15:11 |
| jamiec_ | yes, I have had a look through earlier today | 15:12 |
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| Swami_ | So I think we are almost close in defining the requirements for the DVR. This design doc addresses both East-West and North-South. | 15:12 |
| Swami_ | In terms of providing the services, I have been having discussions with Sumit and Nachi on what services should be distributed and what should be centralized. | 15:13 |
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| Swami_ | Right now we would be supporting a hybrid mode where tenants can have a Logical network node and regulare compute node with distributed routers. | 15:14 |
| Swami_ | There is a slight difference between the current gateway model and North-South gateway model in our proposal. | 15:15 |
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| jamiec_ | That would make sense to keep the dvr implementation light (hybrid) | 15:15 |
| jamiec_ | so, just floating ip and gateway distributed? | 15:16 |
| Swami_ | In order to reduce the number of IP's consumed by the External Gateway residing in the Compute Nodes, we have made a decision to split the Gateway functionality from the router. | 15:16 |
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| Swami_ | This would not affect the existing gateway, but apart from the existing gateway we will be having an additional field to add the "id" of the Distributed-router-gateway to the router object | 15:17 |
| Swami_ | jamiec: yes just the floating ip and gateway functionality will be distributed. If required Firewall as a service can be also distributed, I checked with Sumit and he mentioned that there should not be any issue in that. | 15:18 |
| jamiec_ | that's reducing IPs consumed for ext gateway IP on internal networks? | 15:18 |
| Swami_ | Reducing the IP's for the external gateway.(Public IPs). | 15:19 |
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| Swami_ | We still have flexible option, such that if any tenant wants to have their own gateway, then they can add it. If not they can share it. | 15:20 |
| safchain | Swami_, does it mean that the router for ext gateway are not fully distributed, I mean on each compute node ? | 15:20 |
| Swami_ | safchain: It is fully distributed. | 15:20 |
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| Swami_ | On Each compute node, there will be at least one "distributed-router-gateway". | 15:21 |
| jamiec_ | ok. so, for internal the distributed gw IP can be shared across all compute and handled with local arp response from ovs ? | 15:21 |
| Swami_ | If each tenant want to have their own Distributed-router-gateway then that is also possible. | 15:21 |
| Swami_ | We also did some proof of concept to have Overlapping IPs in a same comupte node and still goes through a single Distributed-router-gateway on that compute node | 15:22 |
| hemanthravi | distr-router-gw is realized only through flows in OVS or is there a namespace for fwding on each compute node? | 15:23 |
| Swami_ | safchain: To show you how the Distributed-router-gateways are distributed, you can take a look at the picture in the google doc, at the end of the doc, "Bridge between network node and compute node". | 15:23 |
| Swami_ | That will show for tenant A he is using the Network node and distributed router combo and for Tenant B he is using the distributed router feature on all compute nodes. | 15:24 |
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| safchain | Swami_, Yes I'm doing it | 15:25 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: There is a namespace for fwding in each compute node, this is exactly similar to the legacy gw functionality but we have split it apart. | 15:25 |
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| hemanthravi | Is the namespace in the data-path for the east-west traffic too? | 15:26 |
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| Swami_ | hemathravi: For east west traffic there is no requirement for the "distributed-router-gateway". All we need is to populate some rules in the ovs-flow table to route the traffic. prevent arps from going out. So our dvr agent will populate the router arp table. | 15:27 |
| hemanthravi | swami: when you get a chance can you label the namespaces if they are shown in the diag | 15:27 |
| hemanthravi | swami: got it | 15:27 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: yes I will do. | 15:27 |
| safchain | Swami_, You said that you reduced the number of IPs consumed by ext. gw, two compute nodes/tenant could share the same ext. gw ? | 15:28 |
| Swami_ | Just for other people's info, currently the "Internal router" "IR" and the "EGA" they run their own namespaces. | 15:28 |
| Swami_ | safchain: Sorry if I have miss-stated, each compute node will at least have one "ext.gw". Any two tenants residing on the compute node can share the same "ext-gw" | 15:29 |
| safchain | Swami_, ok | 15:29 |
| safchain | Swami_, just to be sure, one ip per compute node at least | 15:30 |
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| hemanthravi | swami: won't this create a explosion of ext-net addr required? | 15:30 |
| Swami_ | safchain: Yes you are right, one ip per compute at least. | 15:30 |
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| safchain | Swami_, ok | 15:30 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: I don't think so, there will be only one external-net-id per Ext-gw. | 15:31 |
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| Swami_ | If tenant requires different external-net-id, then they will have to create additional ext-gw to connect to the ext-net. | 15:31 |
| hemanthravi | will each compute-node need an addr on external-net | 15:31 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: Yes. | 15:32 |
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| hemanthravi | swami: is the IR's func to be a proxy ARP for east-west router IP? | 15:33 |
| hemanthravi | I meant the IR namespace | 15:33 |
| Swami_ | hemathravi; if you look at the db model, you can realize that each GW, will have different ports on each compute node, so each port will have its own IP address and Mac unique for its compute node. | 15:34 |
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| safchain | Swami_, firewall (fwaas) would be on distributed-router-gateway ? | 15:34 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: Yes it would act as the proxy ARP. Also any traffic that moves out of the compute Node in a East-West Traffic will have a Unique MAC as the source address. This unique mac will be added by the br-int rule when the packet leaves the br-int. | 15:35 |
| Swami_ | safchain: I discussed the firewall with sumit and he seems comfortable distributing the firewall, but I still need to take a look at the firewall and see if there is any change required. | 15:36 |
| Swami_ | Right now the firewall agent is integrated with the L3-agent, so if we are creating a "dvr-agent", then we might also include the firewall agent as part of the dvr-agent. | 15:36 |
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| Swami_ | Do you guys have any other questions | 15:39 |
| hemanthravi | Is the floating-ip func handled in EGA ns | 15:39 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: yes it is handled in EGA. | 15:39 |
| jamiec_ | Swami_, in the case of a tenant using only basic distributed L3 (no advanced service) is a network node still needed for DHCP? | 15:40 |
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| Swami_ | jamiec: Good question. Our current assumption is, yes it is required. Since we were not planning to distribute the DHCP service, it is a requirement. | 15:41 |
| jamiec_ | understood. | 15:42 |
| Swami_ | jamiec: I think we may need to address the DHCP distribution after we complete our existing DVR work. | 15:43 |
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| Swami_ | jamiec: if you have any thoughts on also distributing the DHCP, it would be great if you can send me your thoughts. | 15:43 |
| jamiec_ | yes, it is lightweight - but the current implementations aren't well suited to distributing. | 15:44 |
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| hemanthravi | does the floating-ip range have to be statically distr among the EGAs | 15:44 |
| jamiec_ | swami, yes, that's worth thinking about later (DHCP) | 15:44 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: I don't think you need to distribute the floating-ip range among the EGAs. You can still have a single pool and can assign from that pool. | 15:45 |
| hemanthravi | thx, pool managed by the db like the network node | 15:46 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: yes that is our thought right now. | 15:46 |
| Swami_ | #action I would recommend that all go through the Google doc and provide your feedback | 15:47 |
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| Swami_ | Also if possible we can have a meeting (phone call) to go over the doc, and detailed items if you are ok. | 15:48 |
| safchain | for the traffic from a vm to ext. net, the traffic goes directly from the vm through distributed-router-gateway ? | 15:48 |
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| hemanthravi | swami: added some comments but most of them are resolved today | 15:48 |
| safchain | no traffic through the IR in that case ? | 15:49 |
| Swami_ | safchain: The traffic from the VM, hits the br-int, then it reaches the "IR", in the IR it makes a decision, to route the traffic to the EG, since it is an outside network and the traffic will flow through the EG | 15:49 |
| safchain | ok, thx | 15:50 |
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| Swami_ | safchain: If it is for East-West, the router will forward the traffic to the br-int, the br-int will then replace the "source-mac" to the "unique mac" assigned to the br-int per compute node and then will forward the packet to the br-tun. | 15:51 |
| safchain | I will have some questions about the overlapping, I will add them to the gdoc | 15:51 |
| hemanthravi | Is it possible to make the IR and EG be the same namespace like in the network node | 15:52 |
| Swami_ | safchain: Yes go ahead and add your comments. Right now with single EG, with overlapping IP, we are using linux contrack utils in the EG namespace to distinguish the interfaces it came in. | 15:52 |
| Swami_ | hemanthravi: Yes we can do it and it is more simpler, then each IR will consume a EG and you might have to have multiple IPs per compute node, that was the reason we moved to a shared EG model. | 15:53 |
| safchain | ok, thx | 15:53 |
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| Swami_ | ok guys. | 15:54 |
| Swami_ | we will meet next week. | 15:54 |
| jamiec_ | thanks Swami, I'll also add any comments to gdoc later this morning.. | 15:54 |
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| hemanthravi | thx | 15:54 |
| Swami_ | Meanwhile we want to have a voice call to discuss, we can have one. | 15:54 |
| Swami_ | What do you guys think | 15:54 |
| Swami_ | Next week can we have a voice call, so that everyone can provide your thoughts and feedback. | 15:55 |
| hemanthravi | +1 for the voice call | 15:55 |
| jamiec_ | works for me | 15:55 |
| safchain | ok for me | 15:55 |
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| Swami_ | Ok, then I will send a meeting invite for all, Will the same time work for all. | 15:55 |
| Swami_ | Next week we have holiday here, so I am fine with any timings. | 15:56 |
| safchain | time is fine for me | 15:56 |
| Swami_ | #action Swami to sending meeting invite with bridge numbers to the sub-team. | 15:56 |
| hemanthravi | works for me | 15:57 |
| jamiec_ | also ok | 15:57 |
| Swami_ | #action Swami will also update the Google doc with more flow diagrams to show the L2-L3 communication. | 15:57 |
| Swami_ | Thanks guys for your time. | 15:57 |
| hemanthravi | swami: thx | 15:57 |
| Swami_ | Talk to you all next week same time. | 15:58 |
| jamiec_ | thankyou | 15:58 |
| Swami_ | bye for now. | 15:58 |
| safchain | Swami_, thanks for the meeting, bye all, talk next week | 15:58 |
| Swami_ | #endmeeting | 15:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 18 15:58:15 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/distributed_virtual_router/2013/distributed_virtual_router.2013-12-18-15.08.html | 15:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/distributed_virtual_router/2013/distributed_virtual_router.2013-12-18-15.08.txt | 15:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/distributed_virtual_router/2013/distributed_virtual_router.2013-12-18-15.08.log.html | 15:58 |
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| asadoughi | hi | 15:59 |
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| rkukura | hi | 15:59 |
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| banix | hi | 16:00 |
| hemanthravi | hi | 16:00 |
| rkukura | mestery: Are you online? | 16:01 |
| mestery | rkukura: Sorry, have a 1:1 with my boss now. | 16:01 |
| mestery | Hoping you can run the meeting rkukura this week. :) | 16:02 |
| rkukura | mestery: Right, I'll chair | 16:02 |
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| rkukura | Looks like we've got many of the usual suspects, so we'll get started | 16:03 |
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| rkukura | #startmeeting networking_ml2 | 16:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 18 16:04:06 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rkukura. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_ml2' | 16:04 |
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| rkukura | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/ML2 Agenda | 16:04 |
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| rkukura | #topic Action Items From Last Week | 16:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Action Items From Last Week (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:04 | |
| asadoughi | hi | 16:04 |
| asadoughi | so, last week i had two actions items, first being running unit tests | 16:05 |
| asadoughi | i posted my results to the ML, but with no interpretation of the results since i wasn't sure what we are aiming for besides more coverage which would be represented by the % field | 16:05 |
| rkukura | asadoughi: Yes, and see how our coverage looks | 16:05 |
| asadoughi | http://paste.openstack.org/show/54845/ | 16:05 |
| asadoughi | ^ that was for ml2 tests and this is the agent unit tests: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-December/022146.html | 16:06 |
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| Sukhdev | Hi | 16:07 |
| asadoughi | yeah, i have nothing more to add about unit tests, rkukura? | 16:07 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: hi - just discussing the tox coverage action item | 16:08 |
| rkukura | asadoughi: nothing in the plugin jumps out, but there is room for improvment | 16:08 |
| asadoughi | definitely | 16:09 |
| rkukura | particularly in the of the type drivers | 16:09 |
| asadoughi | agents could use some improvement and i will be working on the ovs_neutron_agent going forward | 16:10 |
| rkukura | I'm kind of surprised rpc.py is at 85% | 16:10 |
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| asadoughi | higher than expected? | 16:10 |
| rkukura | agent unit tests are really important as we do all the bug fixing and refactoring for stability | 16:10 |
| rkukura | I didn't think the RPC handlers (like get_device_details) were covered in the unit tests | 16:11 |
| asadoughi | ah, well, i'm not sure how much of the unit tests are actually unit tests if you catch my drift | 16:11 |
| rkukura | Does anyone know if there is a way to get annotated source showing line-by-line coverage? | 16:11 |
| rkukura | Or at least method-level coverage rather than just file-level | 16:12 |
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| asadoughi | not sure, but i can look into if it's possible or not | 16:12 |
| rkukura | asadoughi: I think so, but I did not expect real RPCs between agent and server to be executed in the unit test run, right? | 16:13 |
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| asadoughi | right | 16:13 |
| rkukura | #action: asadoughi to look into if line-level or function-level coverage data is available | 16:13 |
| dane_ | Don't know about 'tox -e cover', but 'run_tests.sh --coverage' will give line-by-line coverage in HTML format | 16:14 |
| kblin | sorry for barging in, but if you're testing classic python code, the python "coverage" tool can generate line-by-line coverage output | 16:14 |
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| rkukura | dane_, kblin: Thanks. | 16:14 |
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| rkukura | anything else on the current coverage data asadoughi provided, or next steps? | 16:15 |
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| rkukura | if not, lets move on to: asadoughi to discuss ovs-firewall-driver on email list and schedule IRC meeting on ML2+SG | 16:16 |
| asadoughi | i held a meeting monday at 2000 utc; all of those who voiced their opinion agreed about what i later posted to the ML for wider discussion: adding --source-port-range-min and --source-port-range-max to security groups API | 16:17 |
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| asadoughi | http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-December/022518.html or https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Neutron/blueprint_ovs-firewall-driver#Security_groups_extension_API_addition_discussion | 16:17 |
| asadoughi | did anyone have a chance to read the e-mail? the tl:dr is To implement a performant OVS-based security groups solution in Neutron today, source port matching is a required addition to the security groups extension API. | 16:18 |
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| rkukura | asadoughi: I had not seen the email, but looks like there is a concrete recommendation | 16:20 |
| asadoughi | this week, i will continue with the reviews i have already uploaded and continue with baseline work to get the agent compatible with the firewall | 16:21 |
| asadoughi | that is all for now. any feedback is appreciated. thanks. | 16:22 |
| rkukura | asadoughi: thanks! | 16:22 |
| rkukura | any other comments on the ovs-firewall-driver? | 16:22 |
| asadoughi | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/62129/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/62130/ | 16:23 |
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| asadoughi | just mentioning the links for completeness if anyone had questions | 16:24 |
| rkukura | asadoughi: I'm not seeing any review comments - how long until you feel you can remove the WIP? | 16:24 |
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| asadoughi | work should be completed this week on those reviews | 16:25 |
| rkukura | Is the source port support being added to the iptables driver as well? | 16:25 |
| asadoughi | it already has it, will add tests though | 16:25 |
| rkukura | great | 16:26 |
| asadoughi | (source port is already in the rpc api) | 16:26 |
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| rkukura | #topic MechanismDriver API delete method ordering and the relationship between DB state and external mechanism state managed by the driver | 16:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "MechanismDriver API delete method ordering and the relationship between DB state and external mechanism state managed by the driver (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:27 | |
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| rkukura | rcurran: Would you like to summarize where we are on this? | 16:27 |
| rcurran | ummm, lots of good email :-) | 16:28 |
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| rcurran | two solutions have been proposed | 16:28 |
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| rcurran | 1. reverse order of deletes to match create | 16:28 |
| rkukura | rcurran: Agreed, but we need to move the email discussion back onto openstack-dev | 16:28 |
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| rcurran | 2. save off bound_segment to another object for use w/ deletes | 16:28 |
| Sukhdev | I believe both solutions are orthogonal | 16:29 |
| Sukhdev | perhaps need both of them :-) | 16:30 |
| rkukura | rcurran: Isn't #2 more about making the previous_bound segments available in update_port_postcommit, and making sure that's called while unbinding before deleting? | 16:30 |
| rkukura | rcurran, Sukhdev: There seems to be some fundamental question about the relationship between the DB state and the external state (device state managed by drivers), and how these are kept in sync | 16:31 |
| rcurran | perhaps ... today most mech drivers only take actions (in this area) on delete_port | 16:31 |
| rkukura | rcurran: That may work in many cases, but what about things like VM migration where a port gets unbound and then rebound? | 16:33 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: I saw your latest email, agree to most of what you say and replied to it. | 16:33 |
| rkukura | I'm not sure whether we should try to continue/wrap-up that discussion here, or move the email discussion to openstack-dev and continue there | 16:34 |
| rcurran | vm migration is one of the things i need to port to the cisco_nexus md, and yes this is where i'll need more info on bound_segment info | 16:34 |
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| rkukura | So we have several options on how to make bound_segment or previous_bound_segment available in the existing method calls | 16:35 |
| rkukura | we also seem to realize there are race conditions and failure modes where external state can diverge from the DB state | 16:36 |
| rkukura | To me, the biggest question is whether we want loose synchronization with eventual consistency, or need tighter transactional synchronization between the DB state and the external state | 16:37 |
| Sukhdev | I think keeping loose coupling is better model | 16:38 |
| rcurran | sukhdev: agreed | 16:39 |
| rkukura | If we stick with loose synchronization, what do we need to do the ensure eventual consistency? | 16:39 |
| Sukhdev | However, the split of pre/post gives the preception that framework is proposing tight synchronization model | 16:39 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: Maybe the names are unfortunate, but the precommit methods are the ones that are part of the DB transactions, and are therefore the only tightly synchronized part | 16:40 |
| rcurran | creating delete functions are always tricky, on a failure to you try to re-create what was (potentially) just deleted or make a "best effort" at deleting everything and then regardless tell the calling function about the exception | 16:41 |
| rkukura | rcurran: Its definitely easier to recover from a failed create by doing a delete, then trying to undo a failed delete | 16:42 |
| Sukhdev | In that case, what should be the behaviour of ML2 framework when a post operation is failed? | 16:42 |
| rkukura | We also need to think about update failures | 16:42 |
| rkukura | One approach is to really only guarantee the transactional part, and come up with some way to achieve eventual consistency for the external state | 16:43 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: I like that model | 16:43 |
| rcurran | rkurura: agree about creates being the easier to solve and for updates we can consider (and andre left this as a TODO) on failure use the org_dict info to put the info back to the way it was | 16:43 |
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| Sukhdev | I have a crazy thought - what if used pre operations as golden and do not act on the failures of post operations and send a notification to the north bound APIs that devices may be out of sync and will requiire operator invention | 16:45 |
| rkukura | Would some sort of periodic re-syncing of the DB state with all the drivers be sufficient and scalable? | 16:45 |
| rcurran | but as sukhdev as stated these are similar but orthogonal type converstaions | 16:45 |
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| rkukura | Sukhdev: So failures in postcommit driver methods would flag the resource to resynched later? | 16:47 |
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| rcurran | sukhdev: agreed - i think for all types of failures (create, update, delete - even though on create we "clean up" by deleting) that the calling function would get an exception | 16:47 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: If you look at Arista Driver's sync mechanism, it preceisely does that - periodically sync the state between DB and back-end....it assumes DB as "true source" | 16:47 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: yes | 16:48 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: So maybe that sync mechanism or something similar could get promoted to the plugin, and the cost amortized across all the drivers? | 16:48 |
| rkukura | rcurran: If we go with loose synchronization with some mechanism in the plugin to ensure eventual consistency, do we still have a reason to reverse the precommit/postcommit methods for delete operations? | 16:49 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: it may be a very heavy handed operation :-) | 16:49 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: That is a concern, and maybe it could be optimized by flagging individual resources for re-synch or something like that | 16:50 |
| rcurran | rkukura: yes. port.bound_segment would not be available on delete_port_postcommit() | 16:50 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: Lets flesh out the sync options/details on openstack-dev | 16:51 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: yes, we can improve upon the implementation - but, overall, this is a great way to go.... | 16:51 |
| rkukura | rcurran: So why not have the unbinding phase occur before delete_precommit, and result in update_precommit/update_postcommit calls on the driver where previous_bound_segment is available in PortContext? | 16:52 |
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| rcurran | i think we need a previous_bound_segment for other reasons. if we want delete_port_xxxcommit() to access the previosus_bound_segment for retrieving the vlan then i can live w/ that | 16:53 |
| rkukura | rcurran: That way unbinding looks the same to the drivers regardless of whether its part of a delete, a migration, or something else (agent failure) | 16:54 |
| rkukura | rcurran: What about doing the unbind 1st as an update before calling delete_port_precommit on the drivers? | 16:54 |
| rkukura | Or do we really want the unbinding to be the same transaction as the deleting? | 16:55 |
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| rcurran | right now, the cisco_nexus driver (and i think all others) are taking no actions on port_bind and unbind ... only deletes | 16:55 |
| rkukura | rcurran: Yes, and that is because port_bind and port_unbind are only called on a subset of the drivers | 16:56 |
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| rkukura | rcurran: I'm suggesting unbinding is really an update with port_update_precommit and port_update_postcommit calls on all register mechanism drivers | 16:57 |
| Sukhdev | True for Arista - we do not take any action on bind/unbid - only delete | 16:57 |
| rcurran | and will previous_bound_segment still be available (and accurate as the last vlan used) on delete_port() | 16:58 |
| rkukura | There is also a TODO related to compound bindings or something like that, which maybe is really what we need so that ToR switch drivers are explicitly part of a binding that is based on an L2 agent's driver. | 16:58 |
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| asadoughi | sorry, we're running out of time, had a quick question: next week is christmas and the week after is new year's day. are we holding any meetings before January 8? | 16:59 |
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| rkukura | rcurran: If we do treat the implicit unbind as a separate transaction, I don't think the previous info from the unbind transaction would be visible in the delete precommit/postcommit calls | 17:00 |
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| rkukura | asadoughi: mestery proposed cancelling the next two - I'm OK either way | 17:00 |
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| asadoughi | rkukura: +1 on cancel, i'll be out on vacation after this week until 2014 | 17:01 |
| rcurran | then that would cause a re-write for my md ... basically i'd want to remove the nexus switch info on port_unbind(). not undoable but not how things have been working | 17:01 |
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| rkukura | rcurran: I think you'd need to remove the switch info in port_update_postcommit unless we did compound-binding | 17:02 |
| rkukura | Lets move this discussion to openstack-dev | 17:02 |
| rkukura | OK, we'll cancel the next two regular meetings | 17:03 |
| rkukura | Enjoy the holidays and/or time off everyone! | 17:03 |
| rkukura | #endmeeting | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:03 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Dec 18 17:03:47 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2013/networking_ml2.2013-12-18-16.04.html | 17:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2013/networking_ml2.2013-12-18-16.04.txt | 17:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2013/networking_ml2.2013-12-18-16.04.log.html | 17:03 |
| asadoughi | happy holidays! bye | 17:03 |
| kiall | Hey guys :) | 17:04 |
| kiall | #startmeeting Designate | 17:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 18 17:04:01 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is kiall. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:04 |
| Sukhdev | bye | 17:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'designate' | 17:04 |
| kiall | Heya - Who's about today? | 17:04 |
| mugsie | o/ | 17:04 |
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| artom | I'm here for the first 10 minutes | 17:04 |
| eankutse1 | here | 17:04 |
| betsy | o/ | 17:04 |
| rjrjr_ | here | 17:04 |
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| kiall | Okay - So, some real quick housekeeping.. It's Christmas .. I'm taking a wild guess we're skipping Dec 25th's meet! | 17:05 |
| kiall | Do we resume on Jan 1, or Jan 8 ? | 17:05 |
| mugsie | 8th | 17:05 |
| artom | +1 | 17:05 |
| kiall | (I'd be "off work" on the 1st, but am happy to do a meet if people are around) | 17:05 |
| betsy | +1 | 17:05 |
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| rjrjr_ | +1 | 17:05 |
| kiall | Okay - Let's call that settled so :) | 17:06 |
| tsimmons | Psh, I was going to be here ;) | 17:06 |
| artom | I assume people who want will be around on IRC, so... | 17:06 |
| kiall | Exactly :) | 17:06 |
| kiall | Okay .. So, no actions from last week.. | 17:06 |
| kiall | #topic Followup on Blueprint Backlog Prioritisation | 17:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Followup on Blueprint Backlog Prioritisation (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:06 | |
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| kiall | mugsie .. Since this was your doing ;) | 17:07 |
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| mugsie | cool | 17:07 |
| mugsie | so i think last week went well | 17:07 |
| mugsie | i have writen up the notes i took from the meeting | 17:07 |
| mugsie | they are here | 17:07 |
| mugsie | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Designate/Blueprints/Meetings/12-2013/Minutes | 17:07 |
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| mugsie | as it turns out there is a youtube clip of the whole meeting | 17:07 |
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| mugsie | which I can share if people want | 17:08 |
| mugsie | (it is currently set to private) | 17:08 |
| * artom would watch it. | 17:08 | |
| eankutse1 | my IRC is lagging today | 17:08 |
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| mugsie | People also expressed an interest in having a repeat | 17:08 |
| mugsie | i think some time like the 8th? | 17:08 |
| kiall | eankutse1: mine too.. particularly badly | 17:08 |
| mugsie | what do people think? | 17:09 |
| rjrjr_ | +1 | 17:09 |
| kiall | (The next topic will deserve some serious thought, and probably a HO dedicated to it) | 17:09 |
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| kiall | So, I'd say, Yes - let's do another video call in place on the meet on the 8th | 17:10 |
| mugsie | cool. I will research google hangouts properly this time, and set up something similar as last ime | 17:10 |
| mugsie | time* | 17:10 |
| mugsie | #action set up VC on the 8th Jan - mugsie | 17:10 |
| betsy | mugsie: thx | 17:11 |
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| kiall | Okay - Before we move on, Did anyone have any followups or comments on the call? Anything they'd change for next time? | 17:11 |
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| kiall | (Other than knowing where the "Start" button is in advance ;)) | 17:11 |
| eankutse1 | mugsie: cool. Thx | 17:11 |
| betsy | Were y'all able to hear all of us at RAX who were in a room together? | 17:11 |
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| mugsie | yeah | 17:12 |
| betsy | Did that work out? | 17:12 |
| mugsie | it was fine | 17:12 |
| betsy | cool | 17:12 |
| kiall | betsy: yea, that worked fine | 17:12 |
| rjrjr_ | betsy, i heard everyone fine. | 17:12 |
| kiall | Okay .. Next topic unless anyone has anything more on the call? | 17:12 |
| kiall | #topic Initial discussion of a possible solution to several issues raised during the Blueprint Hangout | 17:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Initial discussion of a possible solution to several issues raised during the Blueprint Hangout (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:13 | |
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| kiall | Okay.. So I've intentionally kept ^ a little vague, as we wanted to discuss "in person" | 17:13 |
| kiall | Several of the issues raised in the hangout, like: | 17:13 |
| kiall | - Better BIND support | 17:14 |
| kiall | - RFC Dynamic DNS (aka nsupdate support) | 17:14 |
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| kiall | - Transnational updates to zones | 17:14 |
| kiall | and .. quite possibly a few others | 17:14 |
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| eankutse1 | 17:15 | |
| kiall | Myself and mugsie got thinking, what if instead of trying to integrate with BIND/PowerDNS/NSD in the way we do today, what if we implemented a *tiny* minimal DNS server capable of taking AXFR's from BIND/PowerDNS etc | 17:15 |
| eankutse1 | k | 17:16 |
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| kiall | Before you call me insane .. the DNS protocol is quite simple.. I mocked this up in sometime around Jan/Feb to refresh my DNS memory.. (looking for link, lost it) | 17:16 |
| kiall | #link http://pastie.org/private/w9mvs6xgtqzil6wwuflx5a | 17:16 |
| eankutse1 | Whoa Radical!! | 17:16 |
| * artom did a caching DNS server in Java for a school project. Took a couple of weeks. | 17:16 | |
| eankutse1 | exaplain :-) | 17:16 |
| kiall | A simple 600 line implementation of DNS that can accept and respond to queries (the service bit ain't there..) | 17:17 |
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| kiall | Since we're not aiming for responding to end user queries with this, we can avoid the need to handle the million or so edge cases | 17:17 |
| artom | How would Designate update the zones served by the custom DNS server? | 17:17 |
| kiall | But we get some big advantages (and some disadvantages) | 17:17 |
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| rjrjr_ | kiall, tiny server would be between Designate and real backend? | 17:18 |
| kiall | rjrjr_: exactly.. | 17:18 |
| artom | If you say MySQL database, I'm going to bonk you for reimplementing a subsset of PowerDNS ;) | 17:18 |
| kiall | Some advantages: | 17:18 |
| kiall | - All updates (bar create/delete zone) go via AXFR | 17:18 |
| kiall | - An endpoint/framework for RFC Dynamic DNS / nsupdate is built | 17:18 |
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| kiall | - Transactional changes - we only need to write the changeset to the DB transactionally, AXFR's handle the rest | 17:19 |
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| kiall | - DNSSEC signing could be done here, sending pre-signed zones to the real DNS servers | 17:19 |
| kblin | kiall: the DNS protocol has it's dirty corners. | 17:19 |
| kiall | - Overlapping zones could be implemented using TSIG to distinguish which view | 17:19 |
| eankutse1 | 17:19 | |
| kiall | eankutse1: keep seeing blank messages from you, not sure if you're trying to talk? | 17:20 |
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| kiall | kblin: oh it has 1000's of dirty corners! | 17:20 |
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| rjrjr_ | so, Central storage, tiny DNS server, and backend need to all be synched? uhhh... | 17:20 |
| kiall | That's why this would never, ever, ever be public facing | 17:20 |
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| * artom has to run, but consider my previous two comments about reimplementing a subset of PowerDNS - they were only half in jest. | 17:20 | |
| kiall | rjrjr_: tiny DNS would talk to central, just like the API service does | 17:20 |
| tsimmons | His IRC is probably lagging as hard as mine, literally minutes behind. | 17:20 |
| kiall | rjrjr_: At that point, we've actually reduced the # of things that need to be kept in sync | 17:21 |
| mugsie | tsimmons: seems like freenode is having issues this week | 17:21 |
| rjrjr_ | howso? is central storage replaced with tiny DNS server? | 17:21 |
| betsy | Or does the tiny DNS sever not have storage? | 17:22 |
| kiall | rjrjr_, no. tiny DNS server talks directly to storage (well - to central) | 17:22 |
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| kiall | It has no storage of it's one.. | 17:22 |
| kblin | kiall: I'm still catching up, on my backlog, but you're planning to use tht thing to push data into the real backend DNS server, right? | 17:22 |
| kiall | of its own* | 17:22 |
| rjrjr_ | gotcha. so central storage and tiny DNS server are a whole. | 17:22 |
| tsimmons | eankutse (or others with mad lag): You can refresh this page to see things in real(ish) time. http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/designate/2013/designate.2013-12-18-17.04.log.txt | 17:22 |
| kiall | rjrjr_: yep - exactly.. tiny DNS server is just like designate-api | 17:23 |
| kiall | it decodes DNS (i.e. JSON), calls central via RPC, and encodes DNS (i.e. JSON) | 17:23 |
| kiall | Raw speed is not so important, as we're talking about AXFR to the public facing servers.. not end user queries | 17:23 |
| rjrjr_ | question, how does the backend learn about new zones? | 17:24 |
| kiall | The current "backends" would be totally stripped down, whichever central processes a "create zone" would, for bind, call `rndc addzone { master tiny-dns-server; }` | 17:24 |
| kiall | Today, here's what we try and keep in sync: | 17:25 |
| kiall | - The SQL DB | 17:25 |
| kiall | - The Master Backend | 17:25 |
| kiall | - The Slave Backends | 17:25 |
| betsy | Right | 17:25 |
| kiall | PowerDNS is "easy" .. the SQL DB, and the PowerDNS SQL DB .. | 17:25 |
| kiall | Bind is harder, as it's zonefiles on a master (and is the master alive? or rebooting? or..) | 17:26 |
| kiall | We also don't do things transitionally, we have no mechanism in place for it.. | 17:26 |
| rjrjr_ | transactionally? | 17:27 |
| kiall | If we dumped the current idea of backends for this, we would only have to write to the DB transactionally, then issue the NOTIFY's to the real DNS servers | 17:27 |
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| betsy | How would this work with server pools? | 17:27 |
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| kiall | rjrjr_: adding 3 RR's while removing 2 RR's from an RRSet - you mentioned it as one of your nsupdate things | 17:27 |
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| kiall | betsy: good question :) I think it changes how those would be implemented, but not how they would be exposed. | 17:28 |
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| betsy | hmm. Lots to think about | 17:28 |
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| kiall | A pool would have N DNS servers configured in it.. when a new zone is added, a TSIG key is built, and central calls out to the servers in that pool with `rdnc addzone`, or a queue, or.. whatever mechanism is needed for the DNS server in use | 17:29 |
| kiall | betsy: I did say this was "radical", didn't I? ;) | 17:29 |
| rjrjr_ | backends don't go away completely though because of needs like zone creation. | 17:29 |
| betsy | :D | 17:29 |
| kiall | rjrjr_: exactly, but they get simplified significantly | 17:29 |
| rjrjr_ | i like the idea! | 17:30 |
| kiall | Also - Thus is by no means a decided thing.. I'm on the fence over if this is doable, or if I should go check myself into a clinic somewhere ;') | 17:30 |
| kblin | kiall: what's the advantage of AXFR instead of letting the "real" dns servers handle the zone and doing DNS update calls? | 17:30 |
| betsy | So what are the advantages and disadvantages y'all have come up with so far? | 17:30 |
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| kiall | kblin: so, some big advantages I see are: | 17:31 |
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| kiall | 1) We no longer care about the details of a DNS server bar the basic add/delete zone | 17:32 |
| kiall | s/DNS server/public facing DNS server/ | 17:32 |
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| kiall | 2) All public DNS facing servers are equal - there all slaves, there is no master (well - the "tiny AXFR only" DNS server is master). | 17:33 |
| kiall | 3) We gain an endpoint for RFC Dynamic DNS (i.e nsupdate) | 17:33 |
| kblin | neither should the "nsupdate" code path | 17:33 |
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| kiall | kblin: so, one issue with doing nsupdates is .. | 17:34 |
| kiall | either we still have a master, or we're left needing to keeping everything in sync across every DNS server | 17:35 |
| kiall | s/keeping/keep/ | 17:35 |
| kiall | Implementing DNS is *hard* .. too hard for us to take on. Implementing just enough DNS to handle AXFR's from known clients, rather than every broken implementation in the world, is easier.. (but still not easy) | 17:36 |
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| kblin | true. I'm just not sure if you really can avoid the dirty details of DNS if you're still the DNS master the public facing DNS servers pull from | 17:36 |
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| betsy | kblin: I was thinking the same thing | 17:37 |
| kiall | kblin: that may be so :) Which is why I'm on the fence over if this is a good idea.. It frankly needs a TON of thought before anything is decided. | 17:37 |
| kblin | now assuming you have your central API that handles the DNS logic, that's the part that has the core logic | 17:37 |
| kblin | that needs to know what your DNS looks like | 17:37 |
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| kblin | I don't see why, from this central instance, pushing updates to the user-facing servers is very different if you use AXFR or UPDATE | 17:38 |
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| kiall | Right, but - we always need something that knows what your DNS should look like, with the current method, we need to know how to transform that for PowerDNS, BIND, NSD, ... | 17:38 |
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| kblin | in all cases your "backend" needs to know how to set up new zones | 17:38 |
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| kiall | kblin: what happens when 1 of to 50 user facing DNS servers is down? We need to start keeping track of every change, and which servers it's been applied to | 17:39 |
| kblin | and in all cases once the zone is there, you can then send updates via a DNS protocol mechanism | 17:39 |
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| rjrjr_ | kblin, the zone setup is the only diff. some admin work when setting up DNS servers is needed (allow-notify) but that would be true for update (allow-update). | 17:40 |
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| rjrjr_ | those settings can be done globally. | 17:40 |
| kblin | kiall: sorry for sounding negative, I've just been bitten repeatedly by "oh, nobody is using that obscure feature of DNS anyway" | 17:41 |
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| kiall | Yea - I think kblin's argument is around if we implement the tiny DNS server, or a tiny DNS client (or, more likely wrap nsupdate) | 17:41 |
| kiall | kblin: totally understood, I'd be pissed if nobody thought I was insane for suggesting this ;) | 17:41 |
| kblin | as a disclaimer, I'm the author of Samba's DNS server implementation that we wrote to have a server that can use the AD DNS backend active directory uses | 17:42 |
| kiall | I know :) | 17:42 |
| kblin | it also started out as "oh, it's only 1000 lines of code" :) | 17:42 |
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| eankutse | Kiall: just catching up with my slow IRC - by "tiny DNS" you mean "minimal" not as in the DNS product tinyDNS? | 17:43 |
| mugsie | eankutse: yes | 17:43 |
| eankutse | thx | 17:43 |
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| kiall | eankutse: minimal, just enough to receive and respond to an AXFR from the "real" DNS server | 17:43 |
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| kblin | kiall: ok, my gut feeling would be that a tiny DNS client might be a bit easier to control | 17:43 |
| eankutse | k | 17:43 |
| kblin | kiall: but arguably the "what if we can't update some of the servers" case needs some thought in that scenario | 17:44 |
| kiall | kblin: there are a couple of advantages to doing it this way rather than using nsupdate.. Ignoring keeping the N global DNS servers in sync.. | 17:44 |
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| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o openstack | 18:06 | |
| SlickNik | imsplitbit: we're waiting for the resurrection of meetbot | 18:06 |
| hub_cap | ~5 min | 18:07 |
| imsplitbit | damnit hub_cap | 18:07 |
| yogesh | hi | 18:07 |
| kiall | #endmeeting | 18:08 |
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| vipul | well that didn't work | 18:08 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o jeblair | 18:08 | |
| kiall | vipul: jeblair is fixing it at the moment ;) | 18:08 |
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| cweid | o/ | 18:09 |
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| kiall | vipul / hub_cap .. looks like it's alive again in the other room.. a "startmeeting" worked for them.. | 18:12 |
| hub_cap | <3 | 18:12 |
| hub_cap | #startmeeting | 18:12 |
| openstack | hub_cap: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee' | 18:12 |
| vipul | hehe | 18:13 |
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| vipul | amatuer | 18:13 |
| hub_cap | LOL | 18:13 |
| hub_cap | #startmeeting trove | 18:13 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Dec 18 18:13:08 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is hub_cap. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:13 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:13 |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'trove' | 18:13 |
| hub_cap | wow that was dumb | 18:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:13 | |
| hub_cap | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting | 18:13 |
| cp16net | /0\ | 18:13 |
| vipul | o/ | 18:13 |
| pdmars | o/ | 18:13 |
| grapex | o/ | 18:13 |
| cp16net | |o| | 18:13 |
| SlickNik | o/ | 18:13 |
| kevinconway | o7 | 18:13 |
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| hub_cap | #topic Datastore compat matrix | 18:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Datastore compat matrix (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:14 | |
| hub_cap | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Trove/DatastoreCompatibilityMatrix | 18:14 |
| robertmyers | o/ | 18:14 |
| datsun180b | grandiose term for 'drop list' | 18:14 |
| hub_cap | ive started it, id like the persons who are working on cassandra/redis/mongo to fill out (or correct) whats there | 18:14 |
| kiall | or not.. | 18:14 |
| hub_cap | datsun180b: u know me, im all about grandiose | 18:14 |
| hub_cap | kiall: its a-workin for us | 18:14 |
| hub_cap | ;) | 18:15 |
| SlickNik | looks good for now | 18:15 |
| hub_cap | so tehre isint really much to talk about wrt this... | 18:15 |
| kiall | hub_cap: was the lag ;) I saw your start, but took like 3 minutes for the bot's response to come | 18:15 |
| greghill | I notice pgsql is missing (is anyone even working on that yet?) | 18:15 |
| hub_cap | kiall: wow damn | 18:15 |
| * hub_cap thinks its your side of the world | 18:15 | |
| SlickNik | we did have a pgsql poc for a bit at one time. | 18:16 |
| hub_cap | SlickNik: yup kevinconway | 18:16 |
| kevinconway | yes, i will update the matrix | 18:16 |
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| hub_cap | ok time to move on | 18:17 |
| SlickNik | cool, thanks kevinconway | 18:17 |
| hub_cap | #topic datastores logfiles | 18:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "datastores logfiles (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:18 | |
| esmute | o/ | 18:18 |
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| hub_cap | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/TroveDBInstanceLogOperation | 18:18 |
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| vipul | denis_makogon: ? | 18:19 |
| hub_cap | so in general, i think that we need to do this | 18:19 |
| cp16net | yeah that sounds like a good idea | 18:20 |
| hub_cap | id like to get your opinions (denis is not here today) | 18:20 |
| hub_cap | not in the meeting of course | 18:20 |
| hub_cap | but on the wiki / mailing list / etc.. | 18:20 |
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| cp16net | it would be great to get the logs out of the guest for debugging purposes and such | 18:20 |
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| SlickNik | I agree, I think this is a generally good idea. | 18:21 |
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| robertmyers | looks good to me | 18:21 |
| greghill | idea++ | 18:21 |
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| imsplitbit | +1 | 18:21 |
| hub_cap | ill be replying to the mailing list, and adding a title to his email, so watch for that today | 18:21 |
| konetzed | i +1 it | 18:21 |
| hub_cap | ok great | 18:21 |
| cp16net | nice | 18:21 |
| imsplitbit | as long as they are only stored on the guest | 18:21 |
| SlickNik | Not sure I'm convinced about the implementation that that page is hinting at, though. | 18:21 |
| hub_cap | imsplitbit: they are going to be streamed only to the customer directly via the guest | 18:21 |
| konetzed | yes no need to pull them up to one large central system | 18:21 |
| vipul | so are we strreaming them down via API? | 18:21 |
| robertmyers | imsplitbit: it uses swift I think | 18:21 |
| imsplitbit | right, I +1 that hub_cap | 18:21 |
| hub_cap | customer get sa user/password to rabbitmq, and is able to read the logs from rabbit | 18:21 |
| vipul | swift i'm ok with | 18:22 |
| imsplitbit | robertmyers: that too would be ok | 18:22 |
| konetzed | vipul: i think first pass is just switf | 18:22 |
| imsplitbit | I just don't want to get into the business of central log aggregation as a service | 18:22 |
| konetzed | vipul: i think second pass could offer X number of last lines via api | 18:22 |
| hub_cap | customer gets a "one time use" ssh session to get th logs ;) | 18:22 |
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| robertmyers | hub_cap: fail | 18:22 |
| vipul | are we concerned with sensitive things in the log files... | 18:22 |
| imsplitbit | hub_cap: bite your tongue | 18:22 |
| demorris | can someone detail the API calls that would exist? Its not clear from the wiki | 18:22 |
| grapex | hub_cap: Great idea | 18:22 |
| hub_cap | HAH | 18:22 |
| * konetzed slaps hub_cap | 18:22 | |
| demorris | I can see there is a GET to basically move a log file to swift | 18:23 |
| hub_cap | demorris: hes starting with the swift stuff, so "move/delete" log file in swift | 18:23 |
| demorris | what about a list of what logs are available to get? | 18:23 |
| hub_cap | hes not doing the "tail" for a customer | 18:23 |
| vipul | demorris +1 | 18:23 |
| hub_cap | demorris: i think u should know the list of those right? | 18:23 |
| demorris | not for all datastores | 18:23 |
| hub_cap | do we need a "list" of log files avail for mysql? | 18:23 |
| grapex | Eh, let's not get into enumerating info swift has that the user could get for themselves. | 18:23 |
| robertmyers | slow query log | 18:23 |
| kevinconway | mysql has like 9 log files | 18:23 |
| demorris | you should be able to query what logs are available | 18:23 |
| konetzed | vipul: i dont think we need to worry about that as much, this is a customers instance if they have sensitive things in their logs they also have access to get them from the db | 18:23 |
| vipul | probably need list/save | 18:23 |
| grapex | hub_cap: Will users be able to specify the swift file path? | 18:23 |
| demorris | one provider may expose slow query, another may not | 18:24 |
| * hub_cap shrugs grapex | 18:24 | |
| imsplitbit | kevinconway: ... | 18:24 |
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| imsplitbit | 9? | 18:24 |
| grapex | hub_cap: Well if not, demorris's suggestion makes more sense | 18:24 |
| hub_cap | demorris: so for this, list seems sensible | 18:24 |
| konetzed | i still think slow query log should go in the db for mysql | 18:24 |
| grapex | but then again | 18:24 |
| vipul | konetzed: Yea i guess so.. | 18:24 |
| konetzed | imsplitbit: 10? | 18:24 |
| kevinconway | imsplitbit: fine, 5. http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.1/en/server-logs.html | 18:24 |
| hub_cap | imsplitbit: its written in java, 9 files | 18:24 |
| demorris | also, what happens if I move a log to swift multiple times | 18:24 |
| grapex | demorris: if they can list log files, should trove also allow them to download them through the trove API and not via swift? | 18:24 |
| cp16net | adding on to grapex's question: or specify the container to store the logs files in? | 18:24 |
| demorris | does it overwrite the existing? Create a new entry in swift? | 18:24 |
| hub_cap | kevinconway: i dont think its fair to count binlogs there either, so, 4 ;) | 18:25 |
| imsplitbit | but for debugging purposes you really only need access to the general log and slow query log | 18:25 |
| kevinconway | grapex: some of those log payloads are going to be big | 18:25 |
| demorris | grapex: not sure about that | 18:25 |
| konetzed | grapex: i think you can only get x number lines back throught he api | 18:25 |
| imsplitbit | rather, the end user only needs those | 18:25 |
| kevinconway | seems like swift would be the right place for them | 18:25 |
| konetzed | grapex: like the last 100 or so | 18:25 |
| grapex | kevinconway: yeah, I don't think we should support downloading swift objects via Trove | 18:25 |
| grapex | demorris: So in that case, lets not let people enumerate the swift files either. | 18:25 |
| grapex | Sounds like this could be a fairly simple API- like we don't want to store that much info in the database | 18:25 |
| grapex | As in, we won't have that any metadata for each log we back up. If we do, we need to enumerate that stuff. | 18:26 |
| SlickNik | grapex: agreed. Let's just support the copy to swift operation. To read / download the logfiles then they would have to use the swiftclient. | 18:26 |
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| grapex | SlickNik: Cool. vipul / hub_cap, thoughts? | 18:27 |
| grapex | One issue is there *can* be a subtle delay when you try to get files you just uploaded from Swift | 18:28 |
| vipul | grapex: agreed.. i think just a list what's available.. and save operation | 18:28 |
| vipul | and they can look in swift to find what they need | 18:28 |
| vipul | we don't even need a delete.. | 18:28 |
| vipul | it shouldn't be tracked as a resource by Trove | 18:28 |
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| demorris | so what if I request a log multiple times? Is the behavior that it overwrites the existing file? | 18:29 |
| robertmyers | demorris: no, it changes the timestamp | 18:29 |
| hub_cap | demorris: aye | 18:29 |
| grapex | demorris: If you specify it to, yes | 18:29 |
| demorris | vipul: not sure about not having a delete, why would we not provide the ability to remove the log? | 18:29 |
| hub_cap | i think we all have different opinions here heh | 18:29 |
| vipul | robertmyers: +1 | 18:30 |
| demorris | we provide the ability to delete backups that are stored in swift | 18:30 |
| vipul | demorris: we should only provide a way to get at the logs.. not manage them in Trove | 18:30 |
| robertmyers | demorris: but those are our resources | 18:30 |
| robertmyers | logs are the users | 18:30 |
| vipul | That's because we need the backups to restore from | 18:30 |
| SlickNik | demorris: That's because we track backups as trove resources. | 18:30 |
| demorris | backups are the users | 18:30 |
| demorris | its their data not ours | 18:30 |
| robertmyers | demorris: technically, but with out our api it is worthless | 18:31 |
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| demorris | not really though | 18:31 |
| imsplitbit | no for reals | 18:32 |
| robertmyers | basically, they have to build an exact image of a trove host | 18:32 |
| robertmyers | same mysql and everything to work with xtrabackup | 18:32 |
| demorris | my point is that if we are going to allow a customer to create something in their swift account, we should provide the ability to delete it as well | 18:32 |
| imsplitbit | they have that ability | 18:33 |
| imsplitbit | in swift | 18:33 |
| grapex | demorris: Interesting premise. | 18:33 |
| kevinconway | imsplitbit: +1 | 18:33 |
| imsplitbit | seems like a duplication of work | 18:33 |
| robertmyers | imsplitbit: +1 | 18:33 |
| demorris | then why don't we do that for backups? | 18:33 |
| grapex | I can see how it would be a pain to have to know that a file Trove named some weird GUID was for a backup that was deleted. | 18:33 |
| robertmyers | the only point of the logs api is to put it in swift | 18:33 |
| grapex | And not a backup that is needed. | 18:34 |
| grapex | demorris: I think the log api would be different | 18:34 |
| robertmyers | the backups are different use case | 18:34 |
| robertmyers | we just store them in the same place | 18:34 |
| robertmyers | the customer only interfaces with trove for backups | 18:34 |
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| robertmyers | to create/delete/restore | 18:34 |
| robertmyers | logs they will need to go to swift to read the log | 18:35 |
| SlickNik | demorris: backups are a special snowflake since we need them exact same bits for restore. | 18:35 |
| SlickNik | demorris: We don't need to use he logs for anything in the future, so we don't need to manage them any longer. | 18:35 |
| grapex | demorris: The difference is we don't manage that data- it's just a text file | 18:36 |
| grapex | Backups are more complex, so we have to manage it for users to give them a decent experience | 18:36 |
| demorris | okay, so thats fair | 18:38 |
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| hub_cap | ok so um, mailing list? | 18:39 |
| cp16net | yes | 18:39 |
| imsplitbit | yep | 18:39 |
| SlickNik | do it | 18:39 |
| robertmyers | I thought we all agreed | 18:39 |
| hub_cap | #topic reviews on the meeting agenda | 18:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews on the meeting agenda (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:40 | |
| demorris | i think this is a great first rev here for log integration | 18:40 |
| robertmyers | is this for general review? | 18:40 |
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| robertmyers | reviews? | 18:40 |
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| hub_cap | id prefer us to _not_ put reviews on the meeting agend | 18:41 |
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| hub_cap | *agenda | 18:41 |
| grapex | hub_cap: I like it | 18:41 |
| robertmyers | got it | 18:41 |
| hub_cap | ok cool, lets not do this anymore :) | 18:41 |
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| greghill | but how else can we beg for +2s? | 18:41 |
| hub_cap | LOL | 18:41 |
| vipul | paypal | 18:42 |
| robertmyers | vipul: ++ | 18:42 |
| SlickNik | lol | 18:42 |
| SlickNik | vipul | 18:42 |
| hub_cap | i think it could be fair to put some review if its part of a bigger conversation | 18:42 |
| grapex | Maybe it should be allowed if it you're not posting your own review. | 18:42 |
| SlickNik | have you seen gittip? | 18:42 |
| hub_cap | but not the whole "open discussion" "look at my shiz" | 18:42 |
| datsun180b | where did that conversation about ranking reviews by oldest first go? | 18:42 |
| SlickNik | hub_cap +1 | 18:42 |
| hub_cap | yes sign up for gittip and get some $ on the side | 18:42 |
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| SlickNik | I'm also okay if there's been a review that's fixing a broken gate or something needs urgent attention. | 18:43 |
| greghill | so… are we out of things to talk about then? | 18:43 |
| hub_cap | sorry, was afk | 18:44 |
| hub_cap | #topic next meetings | 18:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "next meetings (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:44 | |
| hub_cap | so | 18:44 |
| imsplitbit | no longer at noon??? | 18:44 |
| imsplitbit | yes! | 18:44 |
| imsplitbit | +10000000000000000000000 | 18:44 |
| amytron | +1 | 18:45 |
| hub_cap | imsplitbit: shaddup | 18:45 |
| pdmars | imsplitbit: +1 | 18:45 |
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| greghill | I vote for meetings on Christmas and New Years | 18:45 |
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| greghill | I won't attend, but I think you all should :D | 18:45 |
| amytron | ha | 18:45 |
| hub_cap | so we have 2x meetings during holidays | 18:46 |
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| datsun180b | not a huge fan of noon meetings but i don't mind them | 18:46 |
| cweid | o/ | 18:46 |
| hub_cap | hi cweid | 18:46 |
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| robertmyers | hub_cap: quick end the meeting | 18:46 |
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| robertmyers | :) | 18:47 |
| grapex | Wait | 18:47 |
| hub_cap | well hold up. are we saying we should skip 2x meetings? | 18:47 |
| grapex | Are we considering the next two meetings? | 18:47 |
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| vipul | skip next two weeks | 18:47 |
| imsplitbit | I don't care, I'm out for 3 weeks | 18:47 |
| datsun180b | the next two wednesdays are crimbo and new years | 18:47 |
| grapex | I'll be out for the next two weeks anyway | 18:47 |
| vipul | yea most people won't be around | 18:47 |
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| hub_cap | im ok w it, i feel like our last meetings have been slower due to the holidays | 18:47 |
| SlickNik | I'm okay with skipping them as well. | 18:48 |
| grapex | +1 skip | 18:48 |
| SlickNik | We can bring things up in the channel, in case anything comes up. | 18:49 |
| hub_cap | okey dokie | 18:49 |
| hub_cap | #topic general discussion | 18:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "general discussion (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:49 | |
| greghill | can we just eliminate time zones? | 18:49 |
| juice | just an updated on usage events... | 18:49 |
| hub_cap | juice: hit me | 18:50 |
| juice | the issue was a confusion across the class hierarchy in instance tasks and its parent SimpleInstance | 18:50 |
| juice | As you all know we have a lots of classes with The name status | 18:50 |
| juice | well they got mixed up | 18:50 |
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| robertmyers | nice | 18:51 |
| juice | sometimes using one sometimes the other | 18:51 |
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| juice | so I went through BuiltInstance and wrote a unit tests | 18:51 |
| juice | made it consistent | 18:51 |
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| grapex | juice: Which two status classes were getting mixed up? | 18:51 |
| juice | InstanceServiceStatus, ServiceStatus and sometimes a String | 18:51 |
| juice | sometimes a lowercase string comparision | 18:52 |
| juice | to a Status class | 18:52 |
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| juice | so I'm a little concerned because as you know there is a lot of logic surrounding status | 18:53 |
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| grapex | juice: They all have their own purpose... I guess I'll have to see on the pull request, I'm sure its good stuff. | 18:53 |
| juice | grapex - the challenge is knowing which one to use where | 18:54 |
| juice | and when | 18:54 |
| kevinconway | use them all just to be sure | 18:54 |
| juice | kevinconway - that's what I did, I just created a new class called TheRealStatus and changed all the code to use it instead | 18:55 |
| grapex | Not sure if that's a joke... | 18:55 |
| juice | it catches any exceptions to and just logs them and keeps trucking | 18:55 |
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| grapex | InstanceServiceStatus is a wrapper around the database object represented by ServiceStatus. I think the problem is, ServiceStatus was too thin to really need a wrapper. | 18:55 |
| datsun180b | well it's supposed to be an aggregate or gestalt status at least | 18:55 |
| juice | so tests are guaranteed to pass now | 18:56 |
| grapex | Or maybe decorator is the right term | 18:56 |
| datsun180b | the goal was to keep from getting nova and trove statuses getting confused | 18:56 |
| juice | correct instance service status had the dbinstance + service_status if my memory serves me correct | 18:56 |
| hub_cap | juice: i hope to see variables named the_real_status in your code | 18:56 |
| robertmyers | for realz | 18:57 |
| greghill | new_the_real_status_for_real | 18:57 |
| grapex | juice: How about StatusStatus? | 18:57 |
| datsun180b | not allowed to implement a please_stand_up method | 18:57 |
| juice | the odd thing is that instance_service_status is almost always used within *Instance which also has DBInstance | 18:57 |
| juice | so it seems a bit redundant | 18:57 |
| juice | I didn't go to the extent of refactoring any classes | 18:58 |
| datsun180b | see i was about to ask that | 18:58 |
| juice | I'll have a review up today for you guys to check out. | 18:58 |
| robertmyers | juice: cool | 18:58 |
| juice | i need to review it myself to see all that has been changed | 18:59 |
| grapex | Thanks juice! | 18:59 |
| juice | and un doubtedly a merge or two to do since I have been working on this since Jesus' birth | 18:59 |
| juice | speaking of which... | 18:59 |
| hub_cap | #endmeeting | 18:59 |
| hub_cap | ;) | 18:59 |
| robertmyers | burn | 18:59 |
| juice | merry christmas everyone enjoy your holidays | 18:59 |
| juice | hub_cap :) | 19:00 |
| robertmyers | looks like it didn't actually end | 19:00 |
| imsplitbit | merry holidays | 19:00 |
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| juice | oh yay!!! I get to talk more | 19:00 |
| hub_cap | see yall in a few wks | 19:01 |
| juice | you can't shut me down hub_cap! | 19:01 |
| kevinconway | happy days of less work due to winter seasons | 19:01 |
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| juice | that's the spirit kevinconway | 19:01 |
| juice | don't forget the awesome sales too | 19:01 |
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| luQAs | t | 21:52 |
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| itzikb | Hi, Is the meeting regarding Neutron 3rd party testing is taking place? | 22:14 |
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