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| Vijay_ | Hi, I need to create a new extension API in neutron and have some questions in this regard. Can someone help me out? | 01:04 |
|---|---|---|
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| Vijay_ | I understand that if I create a new extension like xyz, so that the api looks like GET v2.0/xyz, I must create a new file called xyz.py in neutron/extensions/, define the new API extension there in a dictionary, and then in the get_resources() method of the xyz class, register that dict with a controller object, and create a resource for it, and return that.. | 01:07 |
| Vijay_ | I did the above, but when I invoke the CLI, it hits a 404 error, and I see an error in the q-svc logs : DEBUG routes.middleware [-] No route matched for POST /xyz.json from (pid=54551) __call__ /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/routes/middleware.py:97 | 01:08 |
| Vijay_ | Am not sure what I'm missing | 01:09 |
| Vijay_ | I don't have a plugin for this new extension yet - do I have to implement one? This doesn't involve any device, so do I still need to implement a plugin? | 01:09 |
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| Vijay_ | For now, I'm just passing manager.NeutronManager.get_plugin() for the plugin parameter, to create_resource() | 01:11 |
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| baoli | #startmeeting PCI Passthrough | 13:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 11 13:00:07 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is baoli. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: PCI Passthrough)" | 13:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'pci_passthrough' | 13:00 |
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| baoli | Hello | 13:00 |
| *** sarob_ has quit IRC | 13:00 | |
| irenab | Hi | 13:00 |
| rkukura | hi | 13:00 |
| heyongli | hi | 13:00 |
| baoli | Great, everyone is here | 13:00 |
| baoli | Let's start with code review | 13:01 |
| irenab | ok | 13:01 |
| irenab | nova or neutron first? | 13:01 |
| baoli | Irenab, can we start with yours? | 13:01 |
| irenab | sure | 13:02 |
| baoli | My main question is whether or not we'll support non-identical vNICs (therefore multiple sriov MDs) in the same cloud | 13:02 |
| irenab | Iink https://review.openstack.org/#/c/74464/ | 13:02 |
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| irenab | I think that teoretically it can be possible, but for real cloud not sure... | 13:03 |
| baoli | If that's not a concern, then I think that it's ok to check the vendor info after the agent query | 13:04 |
| irenab | baoli: any reason you need the assumtion for single SRIOV MD? | 13:04 |
| baoli | irenab, my comments to your change is that the vendor infor should be checked before the agent query | 13:05 |
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| irenab | baoli: I probably miss your point here, why the order is critical? | 13:05 |
| rkukura | I think it does make sense for the MD to ignore (not bind) ports using unrecognized devices | 13:06 |
| baoli | irenab, the agent query requires DB access. | 13:06 |
| sadasu | baoli, irenab: from the info that I have so far, it is possible to have a cloud with sr-iov devices from diff vendors | 13:06 |
| sadasu | so we need to check for vendor info before L2 agent query | 13:07 |
| irenab | baoli: so the order is just for optimization, right? | 13:07 |
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| irenab | rkukura: any chance you can take a look at MechnismDriver at review I posted to see if looks OK or you suggest reordering? | 13:08 |
| baoli | irenab, yea, it won't affect functionality | 13:08 |
| rkukura | irenab: I'll give it a closer review, but at a quick glance, I think I agree with baoli and sadasu that checking the vendor 1st makes sense | 13:09 |
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| irenab | baoli: good comment anyway. I need to see how to take an advantage of basic agent MD logic | 13:09 |
| baoli | irenab, cool | 13:09 |
| baoli | Let's move on | 13:10 |
| baoli | #topic port admin_state | 13:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "port admin_state (Meeting topic: PCI Passthrough)" | 13:10 | |
| irenab | sadsu: regarding PCI vendor info check, shall we add some utils? | 13:10 |
| irenab | baoli: just few more minutes on previous topic, please | 13:10 |
| baoli | Sorry, sure | 13:10 |
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| sadasu | irenab: yes...makes sense | 13:11 |
| baoli | irenab, rkukura, is it ok to have a separate base class for SRIOV? | 13:11 |
| irenab | I am not sure that creating SRIOVBaseMD for Agent based makes sense | 13:11 |
| rkukura | baoli: sure, but keep in mind that some use agents and some don't, so mixin might make sense | 13:11 |
| sadasu | takes supported vendor info as params and checks against the port that is trying to bind | 13:11 |
| baoli | or is it ok to add vendor_info the current agent base class? | 13:12 |
| irenab | sadasu: ok | 13:12 |
| irenab | baoli: can you please elaborate a bit | 13:13 |
| sadasu | rkukura: +1 for Mixin, although I don't know of any other MD (other than mine) that does not use an agent | 13:13 |
| rkukura | given we are not rushing to get this in icehouse, my general advice would be to not initially worry too much about sharing common code between SR-IOV drivers. That can be done later as a refactoring step once we see what's really common. | 13:13 |
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| baoli | irenab, in the current AgentBase class, we can add vendor_info | 13:14 |
| baoli | rkukura, I agree. | 13:14 |
| irenab | rkukura: still we joined effort here, seems we do not want to spend cycles at both sides, both for code and unittest for common parts | 13:14 |
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| sadasu | rkukura: agreed. | 13:15 |
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| rkukura | agreed that sharing code where it is obvious will reduce effort | 13:15 |
| irenab | at least we can try to share | 13:15 |
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| irenab | seems we ca skip to next topic | 13:15 |
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| rkukura | maybe start with a simple mixing for common SR-IOV-specific code | 13:16 |
| rkukura | s/mixing/mixin/ | 13:16 |
| irenab | rkukura: you had some objections for Mixin before | 13:16 |
| irenab | not relevant here? | 13:16 |
| sadasu | rkukura, irenab: this method of adding proposed common code to existing patches so others can take a look, is working for me | 13:16 |
| sadasu | then when we converge, we can move that to a diff BP | 13:17 |
| rkukura | no objection to using a mixin from me | 13:17 |
| rkukura | refactoring can often be handled as a bug | 13:17 |
| irenab | sadasu: I am ok with it too | 13:17 |
| baoli | rkukura, I took an attempt to come up with a common SRIOV base class, take a look at this thread when you have time: RE: [openstack-dev] [nova][neutron] PCI pass-through SRIOV binding of ports | 13:17 |
| sadasu | rkukura: ok | 13:18 |
| irenab | I think its possible to push number of patches for same bp, so common part can be pushed separatly if needed | 13:18 |
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| rkukura | baoli: hadn't seen that, looking | 13:19 |
| baoli | Ok then, can we move on now? | 13:19 |
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| irenab | sure | 13:20 |
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| baoli | so neutron port API supports change of port state. | 13:20 |
| baoli | I checked the ovs implementation for it | 13:20 |
| irenab | ovs pushed DEAD vlan for port disable | 13:21 |
| baoli | it basically installed a dead vlan and a flow to drop packets to/from the port | 13:21 |
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| baoli | and I think the vm is not aware of the status change of the port | 13:21 |
| rkukura | baoli: right | 13:22 |
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| irenab | I thought to use 'ip link set ' command to enforce it on VF | 13:22 |
| rkukura | although there is a patch in review to push some port status changes from neutron to nova | 13:22 |
| beagles | rkukura, +1 yeah that is one of the future purposes of that series of patches | 13:22 |
| baoli | rkukura, that seesms to make more sense | 13:22 |
| irenab | what nova action will be once get the notification? | 13:23 |
| baoli | rkukura, can you share links for those patches/bugs, etc? | 13:23 |
| beagles | https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:merged+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:bp/admin-event-callback-api,n,z | 13:23 |
| baoli | beagles: thanks | 13:23 |
| rkukura | Right now, my understanding of nova's use of this is simply to block VM boot until the ports are up. | 13:24 |
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| baoli | rkukura, can you change the status after the VM is up? | 13:24 |
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| beagles | in short the mechanisms are in place, but it is not employed everywhere it might be | 13:24 |
| irenab | admin state can be changed after VM is already up | 13:24 |
| rkukura | The neutron API allows the admin state to be changed any time, and I don't think nova is involved in those changes after boot | 13:25 |
| baoli | rkukura, that's what I'm trying to discuss | 13:25 |
| rkukura | In fact, it should be possible to create a port with admin state down, and allow nova to boot with it, and bring it up later via the API | 13:25 |
| irenab | rkukura: agree | 13:25 |
| baoli | The question is should the VM be aware of port status change? | 13:26 |
| irenab | admin state should be enforced on port and not VIF | 13:26 |
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| baoli | another question is why would admin decides to change the port status? | 13:26 |
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| irenab | baoli: VM awareness probably depends on Vif type | 13:27 |
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| irenab | For SR-IOV it should be aware | 13:27 |
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| baoli | irenab, my question to you is that with direct passthrough, how do you admin down/up a port? | 13:27 |
| rkukura | Can that be done using the PF? | 13:28 |
| baoli | after it's attached to a vm | 13:28 |
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| irenab | probably via 'ip link set' command | 13:28 |
| baoli | irenab, after it's attached, you can't do that any more | 13:28 |
| baoli | it's not a ip link on the host any more, isn't it? | 13:28 |
| irenab | I think you cando it via pf net device and vf index. | 13:29 |
| sadasu | baoli: lets clarify that it works this way for the cisco pci passthrough ports | 13:29 |
| irenab | I need to recheck, but I think it works for mellanox nics | 13:29 |
| baoli | sadasu, we need to check as weel | 13:30 |
| baoli | s/weel/well | 13:30 |
| sadasu | baoli: ok | 13:30 |
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| irenab | baoli: sadasu: if it works for your case, I think you may need L2 agent to handle it | 13:30 |
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| sadasu | irenab: no, even L2 agent will not solve the problem | 13:31 |
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| sadasu | because the host looses control of the port to the VM | 13:31 |
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| sadasu | if 'ip link set' works then L2 agent would work | 13:32 |
| rkukura | I think the model for admin state is that it just stops/starts flow of packets. The VM should not see it as a hot-plug or anything like that. | 13:32 |
| sadasu | but with some initial testing 'ip link set' isn't working | 13:32 |
| irenab | baoli: speaking of hot-plug, does your patch support it? | 13:32 |
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| sadasu | lets stay on topic | 13:33 |
| baoli | irenab, not yet | 13:33 |
| irenab | ok | 13:33 |
| baoli | irenab, the patch can get you going with basic testing. | 13:33 |
| sadasu | rkukura: so the VM will not know that the port is admined down, and may still keep sending traffic? | 13:34 |
| rkukura | I think that's the model, but not positive | 13:34 |
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| irenab | any action items to record? | 13:34 |
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| baoli | #action, check ip link to see if it can change a vf state after it's attached to a vm | 13:35 |
| sadasu | is it Ok to reject an admin down of the port after VM is attached? | 13:35 |
| sadasu | before moving on, I had this additional q on this topic? | 13:36 |
| baoli | sadasu, I'm still thinking about the question why would a admin like to change the port state after it's attached to a vm which is running. | 13:37 |
| irenab | sadasu: you may add another cisco MD that talks to switches/controller to enforce admin state on physical switch | 13:37 |
| irenab | baoli: it may be for the case tenant is not paying :-) | 13:37 |
| sadasu | irenab: in that case we could also unbind | 13:38 |
| baoli | irenab, that would be an interesting way to get the money back | 13:38 |
| rkukura | how about some sort of fencing for fault isolation? | 13:38 |
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| baoli | rkukura, that sounds like a possibility. | 13:39 |
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| irenab | rkukura: looks like real case | 13:39 |
| irenab | rkukura: so unbind is an option for this? | 13:39 |
| rkukura | no idea if anyone is using it that way, just a thought | 13:40 |
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| irenab | I wanted to discuss plans for Juno summit | 13:40 |
| rkukura | irenab: Changing the host_id or something to force unbinding would prevent the port from being plugged, but doesn' | 13:40 |
| rkukura | doesn't necessarily do anything after the port is plugged | 13:41 |
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| irenab | rkukura: thanks | 13:42 |
| rkukura | I don't think we should spend too much time on this right now, but I'm not sure the semantics of admin state and status are all that clear/consistent right now. | 13:42 |
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| baoli | rkukura, ok. let's move on | 13:42 |
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| rkukura | This might be something to try to get agreement on at the summit. | 13:42 |
| irenab | works for me | 13:43 |
| baoli | agreed | 13:43 |
| sadasu | rkukura: point taken...will look into this some more | 13:43 |
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| irenab | the design sessions proposal is open: link http://summit.openstack.org/ | 13:43 |
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| sadasu | we had agreed upon a joint nova/neutron session | 13:44 |
| irenab | I think we need to arrange the plan and proposal | 13:45 |
| irenab | seems also that there is more content for nova and maybe need one joined and one anly for nova | 13:45 |
| irenab | ^only | 13:45 |
| sadasu | agree | 13:46 |
| irenab | we need to see how to get nova cores to sponsor this | 13:46 |
| heyongli | irenab, this is the key problem. | 13:47 |
| baoli | first thing first, we can add the proposed sessions first, right? | 13:47 |
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| irenab | baoli: I think so | 13:48 |
| heyongli | i will proposed a nova common sriov support topic | 13:48 |
| rkukura | lets propose beagles for nova core! | 13:48 |
| irenab | rkukura: +1 | 13:48 |
| beagles | rkukura, don't embarass me :) | 13:48 |
| beagles | it will quickly come to everyones attention how I'm so distributed that I'm not fit to be core anywhere ;) | 13:48 |
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| beagles | I do need to talk to some cores about some related subjects | 13:49 |
| rkukura | It could be argued that nova really needs a core focusing on the networking | 13:49 |
| beagles | while I can't promise anything maybe that could garner some interest | 13:49 |
| beagles | rkukura, no question... for the moment it'll be proxy I guess | 13:49 |
| beagles | by proxy that is | 13:50 |
| beagles | (how appropriate ;)) | 13:50 |
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| beagles | in all seriousness, I was in a nova related conversation and SR-IOV/PCI Pass through came up. I'm following up on some details | 13:51 |
| irenab | for joint nova-neutron session on SRIOV what do we want to discuss? | 13:51 |
| beagles | maybe if we get the summit proposal in before I have the conversation I can reference that | 13:51 |
| baoli | irenab, certainly the interface between the two | 13:51 |
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| irenab | baoli: seems it is defined already,thanks to rkukura work on profile and vif_details | 13:52 |
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| irenab | do I miss something? | 13:52 |
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| beagles | are the use-cases the group have in mind sufficiently fleshed out to use in that or a related discussion. I'm aware (painfully one might say) that these discussions have occurred but would it be fair to say that they are "set" at the moment? | 13:53 |
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| rkukura | maybe a nova session on scheduling taking network connectivity (including special things like SR-IOV, QoS) into account? | 13:53 |
| baoli | irenab, agreed. And also how neutron make uses of the nova pci generic support | 13:53 |
| beagles | by "set" I mean established or at least tentatively agreed upon | 13:53 |
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| sadasu | beagles: I think that is the case w.r.t use cases | 13:54 |
| irenab | rkukura: agree | 13:54 |
| irenab | beagles: proably need to refresh and put together | 13:55 |
| baoli | beagles, is there a IRC for the meeting you attends? | 13:55 |
| sadasu | rkukura: we can keep that as a separate session...neutron aware nova scheduler | 13:55 |
| beagles | sadasu, okay cool. That's one of the things want to make sure is generally "known" among at-least-a-few cores so we are all on the same page | 13:55 |
| irenab | we need also the nova api related discussion, for requesting vnic_type | 13:56 |
| sadasu | at this point our "base" session should cover use cases, API changes and flavor discussion | 13:56 |
| beagles | irenab, not at the moment, but this is something we might want to look at... ie. acting as a subgroup that is attached to both neutron and nova | 13:56 |
| beagles | I should've done something like that for parity, but wasn't savvy and afaik, nobody has done before | 13:57 |
| sadasu | that was the major point of contention for icehouse | 13:57 |
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| irenab | beagles: I think we need to define and get agreement how to request specific vnic_type, working via neutron port is not convenient for end users | 13:58 |
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| beagles | irenab, agreed | 13:58 |
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| irenab | shall we set some etherpad for topics to discuss and send it to ml? | 13:59 |
| beagles | afaict, this is a specifc point of contention... how this kind of thing can be used in a fashion that is compatible with 'cloudness' | 13:59 |
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| baoli | ok, times is up. | 13:59 |
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| baoli | we should continue with eitherpad, and in the next meeting. | 13:59 |
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| irenab | baoli: do you want to open one? | 14:00 |
| baoli | in the mean time, we should add the session in the design summit. | 14:00 |
| baoli | irenab, sure | 14:00 |
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| irenab | great, thanks | 14:00 |
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| baoli | thanks, everyone | 14:00 |
| baoli | #endmeeting | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:00 | |
| heyongli | bye, | 14:00 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 11 14:00:56 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-03-11-13.00.html | 14:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-03-11-13.00.txt | 14:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-03-11-13.00.log.html | 14:01 |
| irenab | bye | 14:01 |
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| rkukura | bye | 14:01 |
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| kgriffs | #startmeeting marconi | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 11 15:00:31 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is kgriffs. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'marconi' | 15:00 |
| flaper87 | <o/ <o> \o> | 15:00 |
| sriram | o/ | 15:00 |
| kgriffs | roll call | 15:00 |
| kgriffs | o/ | 15:00 |
| malini | o/ | 15:00 |
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| flaper87 | flapercop is here o/ | 15:01 |
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| flwang | o/ | 15:01 |
| alcabrera | o/ | 15:01 |
| balajiiyer | o/ | 15:01 |
| funzo | o/ | 15:01 |
| kgriffs | thanks everyone for coming! | 15:02 |
| alcabrera | hurray | 15:02 |
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| kgriffs | hmmm... missing our interns | 15:02 |
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| kgriffs | well, let's get going | 15:02 |
| kgriffs | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Marconi#Agenda | 15:02 |
| kgriffs | #topic graduation prep | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "graduation prep (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:03 | |
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| kgriffs | so, we have docs and sqla to finalize, plus tempest | 15:03 |
| malini | plus devstack issues | 15:03 |
| kgriffs | anything else? | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: sqla is done | 15:03 |
| flaper87 | says flaper87 before finding a new bug in sqla | 15:04 |
| alcabrera | lol | 15:04 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: ok, I wasn't sure if you still had something cookin' | 15:04 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: just testing it and fixing things as I find them | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | but looks like it's in good shape now | 15:04 |
| kgriffs | have we tested it with pgres? | 15:04 |
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| flaper87 | it runs on mysql, at least | 15:04 |
| alcabrera | and sqlite | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I knew you were going to ask that | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: not yet | 15:04 |
| flaper87 | that's the next one | 15:04 |
| alcabrera | cool | 15:04 |
| balajiiyer | kgriffs: pecan eval is not part of graduation, but based on the discussion yday Im going to redo benchmarks. Might need a day or two to do this right. | 15:05 |
| alcabrera | #note flaper87 has tested sqlalchemy on mysql and sqlite - looks good, needs postgres | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | ok. well, we should do that. but graduation req. was we work on a non-AGPL db, which we do now (MySQL) | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | balajiiyer: actually, it is part of graduation | 15:05 |
| flaper87 | pecan is part of graduation | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | we agreed to do a serious Pecan eval | 15:05 |
| kgriffs | sorry, I forgot to mention above | 15:06 |
| flaper87 | what is not part of the graduation requirement is to migrate to pecan | 15:06 |
| kgriffs | right | 15:06 |
| flaper87 | but we have to have a good understanding of where we're standing | 15:06 |
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| kgriffs | flaper87: I understand that infra doesn't like to take on additional deps in the gate | 15:07 |
| kgriffs | but, isn't Falcon already running in the gate with no adverse affects? | 15:07 |
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| flaper87 | it's running in the gate | 15:07 |
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| flaper87 | it's part of the global requirements | 15:07 |
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| balajiiyer | so with pecan eval, there is no patch reqd, so thats good. Im working on the benchmarks, took help from kgriffs on how to structure the email that will be sent out. Im drafting the email, and will send it out for review. | 15:08 |
| kgriffs | some dependency must have caused a big problem in the past for them to be so cautious now, methinks | 15:08 |
| kgriffs | #topic pecan eval | 15:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "pecan eval (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:08 | |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: many dependencies, starting with sqlalchemy | 15:08 |
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| kgriffs | flaper87: after this mtg, can you elaborate? | 15:09 |
| * kgriffs is seeking first to understand | 15:09 | |
| kgriffs | #note balajiiyer working on benchmarks for Pecan eval, will take another day or two to finish that up and draft the report | 15:10 |
| balajiiyer | alright, looks like I jumped the gun a bit | 15:10 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: sure | 15:10 |
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| vkmc | o/ | 15:10 |
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| alcabrera | vkmc: \o/! | 15:11 |
| kgriffs | so, just so everyone knows, I just suggested a rough outline for the report, but have been trying to let balajiiyer work out the details | 15:11 |
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| kgriffs | balajiiyer: btw, one more criterion you might add is runtime support (Python 2.6-3.3, PyPy) | 15:11 |
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| kgriffs | I'm curious to know whether Pecan works on PyPy, for example | 15:12 |
| balajiiyer | kgriffs: noted | 15:12 |
| kgriffs | vkmc: o/ | 15:12 |
| kgriffs | balajiiyer: thanks | 15:12 |
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| alcabrera | I'd like to narrow that a bit: 2.6, 2.7, 3.3 | 15:12 |
| alcabrera | 3.2 is not necessary | 15:12 |
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| kgriffs | alcabrera: +1 | 15:12 |
| alcabrera | also, pypy | 15:12 |
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| alcabrera | so, regarding pecan eval | 15:13 |
| kgriffs | so, I suggested that balajiiyer get some folks outside our team to review the draft before it goes out | 15:13 |
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| alcabrera | we've got some benchmarks and writing to do | 15:14 |
| kgriffs | just to make sure it is as reasonable and as objective as possible | 15:14 |
| alcabrera | sounds good | 15:14 |
| alcabrera | I'm looking forward to the report. :) | 15:15 |
| sriram | +1 | 15:15 |
| alcabrera | any other thoughts on pecan eval? | 15:15 |
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| kgriffs | balajiiyer is putting together a weighted decision matrix, and I'm helping him set up an autobench run so we can get some serious numbers | 15:15 |
| flwang | maybe we can take a look at Ceilometer | 15:15 |
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| kgriffs | that's all I had | 15:16 |
| flwang | since it's using Pecan + WSME | 15:16 |
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| kgriffs | it would be interesting to use WSME and redo the benchmarks, but that may have to wait for a "round #2" | 15:16 |
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| alcabrera | #note ceilometer uses Pecan + WSME | 15:17 |
| kgriffs | #note would be nice to benchmark WSME some time | 15:17 |
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| kgriffs | #topic ATL summit | 15:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ATL summit (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:17 | |
| kgriffs | just a couple reminders | 15:18 |
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| kgriffs | #1 design session proposals are now open - submit yours now! | 15:18 |
| vkmc | I saw somewhere that Oslo working on building a common library for Pecan as well | 15:18 |
| kgriffs | #2 Make your travel arrangements ASAP if you haven't already | 15:18 |
| kgriffs | vkmc: at the last summit it was mentioned they wanted to put together common code into a shared lib | 15:19 |
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| flwang | kgriffs: what's the context for #2? | 15:19 |
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| kgriffs | travel to the summit | 15:19 |
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| kgriffs | I hope we can get as many marconi team members there as possible | 15:20 |
| vkmc | kgriffs, Indeed, thanks | 15:20 |
| flwang | kgriffs: seems there is a team dinner? | 15:20 |
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| flwang | kgriffs: got it | 15:20 |
| alcabrera | flwang: there will be many team dinners, if we can help it. :D | 15:21 |
| kgriffs | flwang: yes, evening of the 10th. We can also do another meetup during the week | 15:21 |
| flwang | kgriffs: alcabrera: fabulous........................ | 15:21 |
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| kgriffs | vkmc: I am a little hesitant to endorse the common Pecan lib approach - i would rather see us creating generic libs that can be dropped into any kind of hook method | 15:21 |
| kgriffs | that would allow us to contribute upstream these libs to the broader Python community | 15:22 |
| * kgriffs doesn't like tight coupling if he can help it | 15:22 | |
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| kgriffs | one more thing wrt the summit | 15:22 |
| alcabrera | kgriffs: +1 | 15:22 |
| kgriffs | I was thinking of these themes for Juno: | 15:22 |
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| kgriffs | #1 Operational Maturity | 15:22 |
| kgriffs | #2 Notifications | 15:22 |
| kgriffs | #3 Flavors | 15:22 |
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| vkmc | kgriffs, Its reasonable, +1 | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | I think most of the stuff we've been talking about for Juno can fit in one of those | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: re-conceptualize marconi ? :D | 15:23 |
| sriram | Sounds good. | 15:23 |
| malini | Does Operational Maturity include new gatecheck jobs etc ? | 15:23 |
| alcabrera | haha | 15:23 |
| flaper87 | s/queuing/messaging/ | 15:23 |
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| kgriffs | malini: tests, security, logging, etc. | 15:23 |
| flwang | flaper87: +1 | 15:23 |
| alcabrera | I'm favorable towards these themes. | 15:23 |
| malini | We have a lot of infra work tht needs to be done | 15:23 |
| flwang | flaper87: it's important, IMHO | 15:23 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: we can rework #3 to fit in that stuff | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | meaning, re-conceptualize | 15:24 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: sounds good | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | let me think on #3 - I think we can play around with that theme, broaden it a bit | 15:24 |
| flwang | flaper87: pls involve me when you start to work on the topic/tag stuff | 15:24 |
| kgriffs | #topic sqla driver GC | 15:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "sqla driver GC (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:25 | |
| flaper87 | flwang: sure thing | 15:25 |
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| kgriffs | so, iirc we delete expired messages each time someone posts a new one? | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yeah, we haven't changed that bit yet | 15:25 |
| flaper87 | but I think we may want to | 15:25 |
| kgriffs | is there a plan to add an out-of-band GC? | 15:25 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: not a concrete plan but I think we should | 15:26 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: can you file a bug for that? | 15:26 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: sure thing | 15:26 |
| kgriffs | thanks! | 15:26 |
| alcabrera | out of band GC would unify the operational semantics of sqla vs. mongodb | 15:27 |
| kgriffs | #action flaper87 to add a bug for sqla GC | 15:27 |
| alcabrera | so I like this, however we manage to solve it | 15:27 |
| kgriffs | kewl | 15:27 |
| kgriffs | #topic api v1.1 updates | 15:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "api v1.1 updates (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:27 | |
| kgriffs | so, there are three proposals | 15:28 |
| kgriffs | #1 lazy-create queues | 15:28 |
| kgriffs | this is where we auto-create a queue when someone posts a message | 15:28 |
| flaper87 | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/marconi/+bug/1290907 | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yeah | 15:29 |
| kgriffs | I think if we do this, app developers will be less likely to think about lifecycle management for queues | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | so, we need to: | 15:29 |
| flwang | kgriffs: will we introduce the topic/tag concept at that stage? | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | 1) Decide if what I proposed makes sense and vote | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | 2) Decide what's the migration plan towards that | 15:29 |
| kgriffs | meaning, they will neglect deleting them as well | 15:29 |
| kgriffs | flwang: nope, not until 2.0 | 15:29 |
| flaper87 | FWIW, the plane we came up with yday still makes sense to me | 15:30 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: ok, let's jump to your proposal and circle back | 15:30 |
| flaper87 | #link http://blog.flaper87.com/post/531cd585d987d24e83f082a5/ | 15:30 |
| alcabrera | so, it sounds like we might want to make queue auto-deletion configurable; a kind of queue TTL | 15:30 |
| kgriffs | #topic queues -> topics | 15:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "queues -> topics (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:30 | |
| flwang | flaper87: seems we didn't touch the migration plan a lot | 15:30 |
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| flaper87 | flwang: we did | 15:30 |
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| flwang | after I dropped :)? | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | So, TL;DR of the proposal is that we don't need the queue to be a first-citizen resource nor it to be exposed to the client | 15:31 |
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| flaper87 | users want to post messages and have a nice way to group them together | 15:31 |
| flaper87 | the concept of queue is getting old | 15:32 |
| flaper87 | and we could adopt topics as a way of grouping messages | 15:32 |
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| flaper87 | the main difference between topics and queues is that queues are a resource on top of messages | 15:32 |
| flaper87 | whereas topics are attributes of the message | 15:32 |
| alcabrera | what benefits do you see us reaping over time as a result of changing the way we address messaging, flaper87? | 15:32 |
| flaper87 | they don't require to be created beforehand | 15:32 |
| flwang | flaper87: the 'migration' I'm saying is migrating a legacy Marconi deployment to new | 15:32 |
| flwang | flaper87: are we on the same page? | 15:33 |
| flaper87 | flwang: hold on, we'll get there | 15:33 |
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| flwang | flaper87: ok | 15:33 |
| flaper87 | alcabrera: Usability is the main one | 15:33 |
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| flaper87 | then we'll make creation of amqp 1.0 based drivers easier | 15:33 |
| kgriffs | I would also say, it gives us more flexibility. For example, now we could have a message be associated with more than one topic | 15:34 |
| flaper87 | we'll reduce the space required since we don't need a separate storage for the queue | 15:34 |
| flaper87 | A table in sqla, a collection in mongodb | 15:34 |
| alcabrera | cool | 15:34 |
| * alcabrera takes notes | 15:34 | |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: right | 15:34 |
| sriram | yes the space required for storage might reduce. | 15:34 |
| flaper87 | and it'll be easier to route messages based on topics | 15:35 |
| alcabrera | #note +1 - queues as topics leads to usability benefits: easier to use marconi | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | ah also, we won't need to query the queues collection everytime | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | every time* | 15:35 |
| flwang | flaper87: but we may need another table for sqla against topics/tags | 15:35 |
| alcabrera | #note +1 - queues as topics leads to flexibility: message associated with multiple topics | 15:35 |
| flaper87 | (the query of the queue's collection depends on the driver) | 15:35 |
| kgriffs | idk about the space - assuming no metadata, a normalized schema can save space. but that is assuming people always delete their queues when they are done with them. :p | 15:35 |
| alcabrera | #note +1 - queues as topics leads to storage reduction: no concrete store allocated for topics | 15:35 |
| kgriffs | anyway, adding a bit of text with topic name to each record is not a big deal | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: yeah but during the queue life, that space is required | 15:36 |
| flwang | flaper87: right | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | anyway, those are the main ones | 15:36 |
| sriram | Does the working of claims change in anyway due to this? | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | sriram: nope | 15:36 |
| flaper87 | sriram: claims work on messages | 15:36 |
| alcabrera | I don't expect it to, since claim status is a property of a message | 15:36 |
| alcabrera | what flaper87 said | 15:37 |
| flaper87 | sriram: so, we'll still be able to claim messages | 15:37 |
| sriram | cool, was just making sure. | 15:37 |
| kgriffs | alcabrera: topics are kind of like RSE channels | 15:37 |
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| flwang | yes, queues is like a 'container' for messages, but now we don't need it anymore | 15:37 |
| kgriffs | ok, any other questions before we vote | 15:38 |
| alcabrera | kgriffs: fair enough, though I admit I never studied RSE in depth. :) | 15:38 |
| alcabrera | hmmm | 15:38 |
| flwang | we can just give messages a topic/tag to distinguish it | 15:38 |
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| flwang | +1 from me | 15:38 |
| sriram | yeah, it sounds good to me as well. | 15:38 |
| flwang | for the lazy queue in v1.1 | 15:38 |
| kgriffs | #startvote Queues -> Topics in v2.0: yes, no | 15:38 |
| openstack | Unable to parse vote topic and options. | 15:38 |
| kgriffs | crap | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | can't remember the syntax | 15:39 |
| flaper87 | #vote yes | 15:39 |
| alcabrera | #startvote Should we vote now? Yes, No, Maybe | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | #startvote Queues -> Topics in v2.0? yes, no | 15:39 |
| openstack | Begin voting on: Queues -> Topics in v2.0? Valid vote options are yes, no. | 15:39 |
| openstack | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | 15:39 |
| flaper87 | #vote yes | 15:39 |
| alcabrera | #vote yes | 15:39 |
| sriram | #vote yes | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | #vote yes | 15:39 |
| kgriffs | balajiiyer: ? | 15:40 |
| balajiiyer | yes | 15:40 |
| flaper87 | malini: ? | 15:40 |
| flwang | #vote yes | 15:40 |
| malini | #vote abstain | 15:40 |
| openstack | malini: abstain is not a valid option. Valid options are yes, no. | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | balajiiyer: can you revote with the hash | 15:40 |
| malini | :( | 15:40 |
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| kgriffs | malini: sorry, forgot to add that option. | 15:40 |
| kgriffs | malini: noted your abstain | 15:40 |
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| balajiiyer | #vote yes | 15:40 |
| vkmc | #vote yes | 15:41 |
| kgriffs | closing the vote in 30 seconds | 15:41 |
| cpallares | #vote yes | 15:41 |
| flaper87 | cpallares: you bet >.> | 15:41 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:41 |
| cpallares | :P | 15:41 |
| kgriffs | #endvote | 15:42 |
| openstack | Voted on "Queues -> Topics in v2.0?" Results are | 15:42 |
| openstack | yes (8): alcabrera, balajiiyer, vkmc, kgriffs, cpallares, flwang, sriram, flaper87 | 15:42 |
| kgriffs | ok, thanks! | 15:42 |
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| flaper87 | awesome | 15:42 |
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| kgriffs | #agreed queues -> topics in v2.0 | 15:42 |
| flaper87 | so, migration plan | 15:42 |
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| kgriffs | #topic migration plan | 15:42 |
| flaper87 | mind if I take the floor ? | 15:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "migration plan (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:42 | |
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| kgriffs | go for it | 15:42 |
| flaper87 | so, we discussed it yday a bit and this is what we came up with | 15:42 |
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| flaper87 | 1) We introduce lazy queues in v1.1 (this doesn't affect the user) | 15:43 |
| flaper87 | 2) We remove queue's metadata in v1.1 (this affects the user, if they cry, we can add it back in v2.0 somehow) | 15:43 |
| flaper87 | 3) We rename queues into topics in v2.0 and complete the work | 15:43 |
| flaper87 | That's roughly what we discussed | 15:44 |
| flaper87 | The migration will require updating the client | 15:44 |
| flaper87 | I added some notes on the blog post about the client | 15:44 |
| kgriffs | I have some thoughts re metadata | 15:44 |
| flaper87 | there's a way to migrate the client without breaking users code | 15:44 |
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| flaper87 | kgriffs: shoot | 15:44 |
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| * flaper87 STFU | 15:44 | |
| kgriffs | :) | 15:44 |
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| kgriffs | so, I was thinking that people will probably want to access the same queue from both v1.0 and v1.1, right? | 15:45 |
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| kgriffs | if that is true, then once way to accomplish that is lazy metadata creation | 15:45 |
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| kgriffs | wait, I'm conflating this with #1 | 15:46 |
| flwang | kgriffs: i'm curious how to implement the lazy metadata creation for sqla? | 15:46 |
| kgriffs | so, my idea was to make queue an attribute of each message | 15:46 |
| kgriffs | and then simulate it being it's own resource | 15:46 |
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| kgriffs | so, we only create a separate resource if someone sets the metadata | 15:46 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: I'd leave that to v2.0, though | 15:47 |
| kgriffs | listing queues and such would have to do a grouping query | 15:47 |
| flaper87 | I was thinking the v1.1 work to be something like: | 15:47 |
| flaper87 | 1) Check if the queue exist (we already do this) and create it if it doesn't | 15:47 |
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| flaper87 | I'd prefer making the change in v1.1 as minimum as possible | 15:48 |
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| flaper87 | and slightly change the API towards a lazier one | 15:48 |
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| flaper87 | then SBRANG, we swap it in v2.0 and laugh watching users crying | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | wait, did I say that? | 15:48 |
| kgriffs | mmm, now that you mention it, I think messing with the data schema may be best left to 2.0 after all | 15:48 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:49 |
| kgriffs | :p | 15:49 |
| alcabrera | heh | 15:49 |
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| flaper87 | so, really small change for v1.1 (since we don't even have sqla migrations yet) and then bigger change in v2.0 | 15:49 |
| alcabrera | yeah, let's hold off on schema changes as much as possible until v2.0 | 15:49 |
| kgriffs | users may be less likely to think about deleting queues they no longer use if they are doing lazy-create | 15:49 |
| kgriffs | but, I guess those records don't take much space | 15:50 |
| flaper87 | yeah | 15:50 |
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| flwang | alcabrera: yep, and as an end user, I don't want to the see the application is changing drastically | 15:51 |
| * flaper87 reads flwang message and laughs.... muahahaha muahahah MUAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA | 15:51 | |
| flaper87 | :D | 15:51 |
| alcabrera | lol | 15:51 |
| flwang | and the developers are laughing me :D | 15:52 |
| alcabrera | flaper87 - smiter of end users | 15:52 |
| cpallares | lol | 15:52 |
| sriram | developer vs end user. Stay Tuned. | 15:52 |
| vkmc | Maybe we could use something like a dirty-bit for lazy queues deletion... it may need checking those periodically though | 15:52 |
| kgriffs | ok, so if an operator ends up with a ton of dead queues, that should be taken care of by the eventual migration to v2.0 | 15:53 |
| flwang | then user will beat the developer if they can meet at somewhere :) | 15:53 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: plus, the operator can delete them too :) | 15:53 |
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| kgriffs | flaper87: yes, I suppose so | 15:53 |
| kgriffs | vkmc - yeah, I think we will need to be creative when we plan the v2.0 upgrade process | 15:54 |
| kgriffs | we'll have to decide whether we want v2.0 topics to be exposed as v1 queues | 15:54 |
| kgriffs | and stuff | 15:54 |
| * flaper87 was thinking something along: "Stop marconi, delete the database; upgrade marconi; start marconi" | 15:54 | |
| flaper87 | :D | 15:55 |
| vkmc | Yeah... it would require some thinking | 15:55 |
| kgriffs | ok, one last thought re metadata | 15:55 |
| sriram | oh yeah. the topic-> queue exposure will be important | 15:55 |
| kgriffs | I was thinking we could ask rackspace to check and see how many people are using that feature | 15:55 |
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| flwang | kgriffs: it would be great | 15:56 |
| kgriffs | otherwise, I'm cool with lazy queues and removing metadata for queues in v1.1 | 15:56 |
| flaper87 | awesome | 15:56 |
| kgriffs | any vehement objections? | 15:56 |
| flwang | kgriffs: to get some thoughts from the RAX product manager and the end uers | 15:56 |
| kgriffs | flwang: +1 | 15:56 |
| flwang | before they beat us :D | 15:56 |
| flaper87 | we should actionize this things and create some bps for v1.1 | 15:56 |
| cpallares | kgriffs: +1 | 15:56 |
| flaper87 | I can do that | 15:56 |
| kgriffs | flaper87: bps already there, man | 15:56 |
| * kgriffs lives in the future | 15:56 | |
| flaper87 | s/this/these/ | 15:56 |
| flaper87 | kgriffs: waaaaaaaat? | 15:56 |
| flaper87 | holy moly | 15:57 |
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| kgriffs | #topic open discussion | 15:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: marconi)" | 15:57 | |
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| alcabrera | we made it through all the topics | 15:57 |
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| alcabrera | I'm pleased. :) | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 15:57 |
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| flaper87 | o/ | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 15:57 |
| alcabrera | we're getting really good at this | 15:57 |
| vkmc | :) | 15:57 |
| sriram | nice. :) | 15:57 |
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| * alcabrera picks flaper87 | 15:57 | |
| flaper87 | so, Yday was the last day of cpallares intership. I would like to thank her for her really AMAZING job, for being around all this time, participating in meetings and providing the help he provided | 15:58 |
| flaper87 | so, lets all thank her and a huge round of appluse | 15:58 |
| * kgriffs claps loudly | 15:58 | |
| cpallares | flaper87: :D | 15:58 |
| kgriffs | cpallares: THANK YOU!!! | 15:58 |
| alcabrera | cpallares: I'm so happy to have worked with you! Thanks fo joining in with us. :D | 15:58 |
| malini | thank you cpallares!! | 15:58 |
| alcabrera | *for | 15:58 |
| * sriram claps | 15:58 | |
| flwang | cpallares: thank you for your contribution :D | 15:58 |
| malini | hope you come back | 15:58 |
| vkmc | Yay cpallares \o/ | 15:58 |
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| flaper87 | malini: oh, she's not going anywhere | 15:59 |
| sriram | Thank you cpallares! :) | 15:59 |
| kgriffs | cpallares: Hopefully this was a good experience for you and you have some good takeaways. | 15:59 |
| flaper87 | I said the intership ended not that she's free to go | 15:59 |
| flaper87 | :P | 15:59 |
| alcabrera | lol | 15:59 |
| cpallares | haha | 15:59 |
| balajiiyer | cpallares: thank you | 15:59 |
| cpallares | kgriffs: I did :) | 15:59 |
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| malini | flaper87: that was a big LIE! | 15:59 |
| * flaper87 is obviously kidding | 15:59 | |
| malini | but anyways..cpallares happy to have you around | 15:59 |
| cpallares | thanks malini :) | 15:59 |
| cpallares | I will stick around thanks to flaper87 | 16:00 |
| kgriffs | #endmeeting | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 11 16:00:14 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2014/marconi.2014-03-11-15.00.html | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2014/marconi.2014-03-11-15.00.txt | 16:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/marconi/2014/marconi.2014-03-11-15.00.log.html | 16:00 |
| *** jcoufal has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 16:00 | |
| kgriffs | thanks everyone! back to #openstack-marconi | 16:00 |
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| adrian_otto | #startmeeting Solum Team Meeting | 16:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 11 16:01:17 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is adrian_otto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'solum_team_meeting' | 16:01 |
| datsun180b | o7 morning | 16:01 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Solum#Agenda_for_2014-03-11_1600_UTC Our Agenda | 16:01 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Roll Call | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:02 | |
| adrian_otto | Adrian Otto | 16:02 |
| roshanagr | Roshan Agrawal | 16:02 |
| stannie | Pierre Padrixe | 16:02 |
| julienvey | Julien Vey | 16:02 |
| paulczar | Paul Czarkowski | 16:02 |
| datsun180b | Ed Cranford | 16:02 |
| devkulkarni | Devdatta Kulkarni | 16:02 |
| aratim | Arati Mahimane | 16:02 |
| gokrokve | Georgy Okrokvertskhov | 16:02 |
| *** alcabrera has left #openstack-meeting-alt | 16:03 | |
| coolsvap | Swapnil | 16:03 |
| adrian_otto | hi everyone | 16:03 |
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| adrian_otto | Daylight Savings Time (yay) | 16:03 |
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| adrian_otto | I'd like to pursue a #agreed to end Daylight Savings time, all time zones will be eliminated, and move everyone to UTC | 16:04 |
| adrian_otto | ;-) | 16:04 |
| devkulkarni | :D .. good luck with that .. which channel you will be discussing it ;) | 16:04 |
| datsun180b | I agree, so long as we move to metric time | 16:05 |
| adrian_otto | heh, It's an exercise in futility | 16:05 |
| adrian_otto | #topic announcements | 16:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "announcements (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:05 | |
| adrian_otto | our Solum Summit event is growing closer. | 16:05 |
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| adrian_otto | if you are planning to attend, be sure you have registered so Dan at Red Hat can get an accurate count | 16:06 |
| adrian_otto | do other team members have announcements to share? | 16:06 |
| devkulkarni | and add topics to discuss here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/SolumRaleighCommunityWorkshop | 16:06 |
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| adrian_otto | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/SolumRaleighCommunityWorkshop Solum Summit Agenda Topics | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | thanks devkulkarni | 16:07 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, let's look at our action items from last week | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Review Action Items | 16:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:08 | |
| adrian_otto | adrian_otto to adjust the wiki to show intent for incubation (adrian_otto, 16:20:35) | 16:08 |
| adrian_otto | this is done. See: | 16:08 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Solum#Summary Solum Wiki | 16:08 |
| devkulkarni | is that that timestamp when you finished it? :D | 16:08 |
| adrian_otto | just in the nick of time | 16:08 |
| *** cpallares has left #openstack-meeting-alt | 16:09 | |
| adrian_otto | the timestamp above is from the prior meeting chat log, so you can find it in context | 16:09 |
| devkulkarni | "Solum is planning to pursue incubation as an OpenStack project upon achievement of development milestones." — awesome | 16:09 |
| devkulkarni | ah! I see. | 16:09 |
| adrian_otto | anyone is welcome to edit that to improve it if you feel so motivated. | 16:09 |
| adrian_otto | next is the mission statement | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | adrian_otto to draft mission statement and solicit input form interested contributors (adrian_otto, 16:35:50) | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | I did not act on this item. I think this would be a valuable exercise for our upcoming Solum Summit event | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | I plan to come with a draft for us to iterate on then | 16:11 |
| devkulkarni | oh yeah. that is a great idea. discuss it at the summit | 16:11 |
| adrian_otto | who would like to work with me to make that initial draft via etherpad and IRC? | 16:11 |
| gokrokve | +1 | 16:11 |
| devkulkarni | I would like to help | 16:12 |
| adrian_otto | gokrokve: excellent | 16:12 |
| adrian_otto | ok, the three of us can touch base after we adjourn here, and sort out a convenient time. | 16:12 |
| devkulkarni | sounds good | 16:13 |
| adrian_otto | so I will carry this action item forward | 16:13 |
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| adrian_otto | #action adrian_otto to draft mission statement and solicit input form interested contributors (gokrokve, devkulkarni) | 16:13 |
| julienvey | I'm in ! | 16:13 |
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| adrian_otto | julienvey: excellent, I will include you | 16:13 |
| adrian_otto | let's pick an etherpad now. one sec | 16:14 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/solum-mission Mission Statement Draft work | 16:14 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so those interested are welcome to check that | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | next topic | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Review Blueprints: https://launchpad.net/solum/+milestone/milestone-1 | 16:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Blueprints: https://launchpad.net/solum/+milestone/milestone-1 (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:15 | |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/api Solum API (aotto) | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | The API is looking reasonably complete at this point | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | at least for M1. | 16:16 |
| devkulkarni | +1 | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | noorul mentioned this morning that we believe everything for the CLI is in there | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | I have links to chare | 16:16 |
| julienvey | yes, we are solving the last problems by doing the functionnal tests | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | 1. Add solum builder client (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78315/) | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | Â Â Â This one is required as it fixes a bug. | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | 2. Add plan manager and corresponding tests | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/72105/) | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | Â Â Â Takes care of the app commands | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | 3. Connect assembly commands and Rest API | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79606/) | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | Â Â Â Takes care of the assembly commands. | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | I will focus on making sure these get the attention needed to merge | 16:18 |
| adrian_otto | please review these as well to offer your input | 16:18 |
| devkulkarni | +1 to that adrian_otto | 16:18 |
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| adrian_otto | that is a good intro to the related topic | 16:18 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/solum-minimal-cli Command Line Interface for Solum (devdatta-kulkarni) | 16:18 |
| devkulkarni | you gave the updates already :) | 16:18 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: any additional status beyond the above? | 16:18 |
| devkulkarni | nope | 16:19 |
| adrian_otto | sweet, we can move on | 16:19 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/solum-git-pull Pull integration of Solum from an external Git repo (kraman) | 16:19 |
| devkulkarni | about this: | 16:19 |
| devkulkarni | we have the code for it in image_handler + build_app. | 16:19 |
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| devkulkarni | so we are good for now. the remaining things are: | 16:19 |
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| devkulkarni | 1) When a plan is registered we need to send back the trigger url to the user so that they can add it manually as a git webhook to their repo. | 16:20 |
| devkulkarni | 2) Testing that the git webhook is getting triggered. | 16:20 |
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| devkulkarni | 3) Invoking the assembly create workflow when trigger is received | 16:21 |
| devkulkarni | that is all | 16:21 |
| julienvey | I can do 1. but I don't understand what you mean in 2. ? | 16:21 |
| julienvey | There is also some discussions about the trigger | 16:21 |
| julienvey | if it should belong to plan or assembly | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | julinevey: thanks. for 2, I mean just testing that the trigger is actually working (may not be code based test though) | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | julienvey: yes, I remember that discussion. | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | don't know where we landed on that. | 16:22 |
| julienvey | it is currently in assembly | 16:22 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: on #2, did you mean that we need help from team members, or that this is what will be worked next? | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: actually, I might have spoken incorrectly. I don't think we need any code for #2. | 16:23 |
| adrian_otto | we do | 16:23 |
| adrian_otto | because I'm reasonably sure the trigger handler code is just a comment still, right? | 16:23 |
| julienvey | for #2, we have an integration test, is that enough ? | 16:24 |
| julienvey | for the trigger part, the comment should be replaced by #3 | 16:24 |
| devkulkarni | julienvey: yes, I think integration test will be enough | 16:24 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: trigger handler code is kind of there (need to double check). julien, might know the current status on that | 16:24 |
| adrian_otto | ok, seems like #2 depends on #3 | 16:24 |
| julienvey | #1 is missing | 16:25 |
| julienvey | #2 is tested | 16:25 |
| devkulkarni | #3 is definitely missing. | 16:25 |
| julienvey | and #3 is missing yes | 16:25 |
| devkulkarni | yes, #1 is missing | 16:25 |
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| adrian_otto | ok | 16:25 |
| julienvey | we just need to plug it | 16:25 |
| julienvey | all the plumbing is here | 16:25 |
| devkulkarni | yep | 16:25 |
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| adrian_otto | do we have enough brains applied to that work, or should I help with recruiting more? | 16:26 |
| devkulkarni | I think we have it covered. | 16:26 |
| devkulkarni | of course we will need reviews :) | 16:26 |
| julienvey | yes | 16:26 |
| adrian_otto | ok, thakns for the update devkulkarni. Exciting to be so close! | 16:26 |
| devkulkarni | yep!! | 16:27 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/specify-lang-pack Specify the language pack to be used for app deploy (devdatta-kulkarni) | 16:27 |
| devkulkarni | okay. the updates on this are: | 16:27 |
| adrian_otto | we touched on this on the ML this week too | 16:27 |
| devkulkarni | 1) aratim finished the GET lang-pack | 16:28 |
| devkulkarni | 2) what adrian_otto said | 16:28 |
| adrian_otto | aratim: !! yay !! | 16:28 |
| paulczar | I have some quick notes that touch on both M1 and LP blueprints adter devkulkarni is done | 16:28 |
| devkulkarni | paulczar: please share them :) | 16:28 |
| devkulkarni | I am done | 16:29 |
| devkulkarni | oh wait! | 16:29 |
| julienvey | I am also working on POST/PUT/DELETE for LP, to be able to create initial data with the API | 16:29 |
| devkulkarni | yep. was about to add that | 16:29 |
| devkulkarni | thanks julienvey | 16:29 |
| julienvey | should have a review tomorrow | 16:29 |
| devkulkarni | +10 | 16:29 |
| paulczar | If we want to use Docker nova-driver for M1 We need the following reviews merged into their various projects: | 16:29 |
| adrian_otto | julienvey: Thanks!! | 16:29 |
| paulczar | devstack fixes for docker driver install - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78322/ ( we have an easy localrc workaround for this, so not a huge problem ) | 16:30 |
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| adrian_otto | paulczar: let's revisit this one in Open Discussion today. I have news to share about this. | 16:30 |
| paulczar | olso-common libraries fail out when glance images have no name - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78642/ ( this is BREAKING ) | 16:30 |
| paulczar | oh ok | 16:30 |
| adrian_otto | tx | 16:31 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: any more on specify-lang-pack BP? | 16:31 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: that will be all. | 16:31 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/logging Logging Architecture (paulmo) | 16:31 |
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| devkulkarni | I think this is done, right? | 16:32 |
| devkulkarni | paulmo is out today | 16:32 |
| adrian_otto | structured logging is in scope for M1 | 16:32 |
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| adrian_otto | but I don't recall seeing code for that | 16:32 |
| adrian_otto | let's ask paulmo when he returns | 16:32 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/solum/+spec/deploy-workflow Workflow outlining deployment of a DU (asalkeld/devdatta-kulkarni) | 16:32 |
| devkulkarni | Paul's patch did get merged. Georgy is using that right? | 16:32 |
| devkulkarni | ok. about the deploy-workflow. | 16:33 |
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| gokrokve | Patch was merged | 16:33 |
| devkulkarni | Angus has started on adding the Heat client | 16:33 |
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| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: did we get the unit/func test code added for that? | 16:33 |
| adrian_otto | I have not looked at that review thread since Thu | 16:34 |
| devkulkarni | you mean for the Heat client? | 16:34 |
| devkulkarni | will check. | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | but I did see that asalkeld posted a series of newpatchset actions | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | if that's not yet done, we might seek volunteers to assist him with that | 16:34 |
| devkulkarni | yeah. I need to also go back and check that.. | 16:35 |
| devkulkarni | okay. let me take a look soon and get back to you. | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | ok, one moment | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | ok, we can revisit that later | 16:36 |
| adrian_otto | I think we are in pretty good shape with it | 16:36 |
| devkulkarni | sounds good | 16:36 |
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| devkulkarni | yeah, I thought so too. | 16:36 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Open Discussion | 16:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:36 | |
| devkulkarni | that will be all on that bp | 16:36 |
| adrian_otto | so paulczar | 16:36 |
| paulczar | yes | 16:36 |
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| adrian_otto | I met with members of the Nova team this past week | 16:37 |
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| adrian_otto | and got a sense of clarity with respect to where our containers support should come from | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | early on we evaluated options for using Docker, or similar technologies | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | our favorite one was to use the Nova Docker Driver. | 16:37 |
| devkulkarni | was? | 16:38 |
| adrian_otto | that driver is somewhat incomplete, and has some open bugs, although Sam Alba is continuing to work on it | 16:38 |
| adrian_otto | there is also work on an equivalent solution that plugs in container support underneath the libvirt driver | 16:38 |
| adrian_otto | so Nova would interact with libvirt just like it does to get a KVM instance | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | but would get a Docker container back | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | this also provides an integration point for other emerging container technology | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | so we should expect that driver to mature. | 16:40 |
| paulczar | That sounds similar to how lxc is implemented | 16:40 |
| adrian_otto | exactly | 16:40 |
| paulczar | it may be difficult to do for docker due to the complexity of the union filesystem | 16:40 |
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| adrian_otto | to the implication to Solum is that we can couple to that driver without necessarily coupling to any singe container tech. | 16:40 |
| adrian_otto | s/singe/single/ | 16:41 |
| devkulkarni | how would this affect Heat? As in, in the HOT that Solum generates would we have to worry about the compute? | 16:41 |
| adrian_otto | we will still need to use a container image format | 16:41 |
| adrian_otto | and Docker's is suitable, so I doubt we have a good reason to deviate from that | 16:41 |
| devkulkarni | *type of compute | 16:41 |
| adrian_otto | devananda: great question | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | s/devananda/devkulkarni/ | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | sorry devananda (again) | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | so.. | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | we ask Heat for a compute instance | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | and Nova is configured to use the libvirt driver | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | and produces a Docker container | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | or potentially a KVM instance | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | depending on hints passed through | 16:43 |
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| adrian_otto | so that is very convenient for us | 16:43 |
| paulczar | devkulkarni, adrian_otto: the image type being set to 'container' would tell the scheduler to use a nova-compute host in an AZ that supports that container type | 16:43 |
| julienvey | that looks nice | 16:44 |
| paulczar | so yeah, we should get that for free | 16:44 |
| adrian_otto | paulczar: yes, from the appropriate compute aggregate | 16:44 |
| adrian_otto | so the hint is actually in the form of glance metadata | 16:44 |
| paulczar | so, what to do for m1 ? stick to docker driver for speed of instantiation, swap to kvm for compat ? | 16:45 |
| devkulkarni | paulczar: I see. And we don't need to worry about placement of containers because Heat + Autoscale will take care of that for Solum. | 16:45 |
| paulczar | orrrr, switch to LXC and get the instantiation speed, but lose the unionfs ( which only affects the time taken to copy the image to the nova host ) | 16:45 |
| adrian_otto | deployment speed is important to reduce the CI/CD cycle time, so we want to use the Docker driver until we have a working libvirt driver option to substitute there. | 16:46 |
| julienvey | adrian_otto: do you have some links (reviews, bps..) to share about the libvirt container support ? Maybe we could help them | 16:46 |
| paulczar | right. we need to get at least two bugs pushed through to use docker for m1 | 16:46 |
| devkulkarni | -1 to switching to LXC (since we already have Docker based builds) | 16:46 |
| adrian_otto | julienvey: not yet, but I would be happy to track them down | 16:46 |
| julienvey | I talked to the Docker team recently, their current focus is on getting the CI working in nova, that's why there is not much work on the driver | 16:47 |
| adrian_otto | #action adrian_otto to locate Nova blueprints/reviews on libvirt driver support for Docker | 16:47 |
| julienvey | Eric Windisch is leading that | 16:47 |
| paulczar | julienvey: I got the same story talking with Eric | 16:48 |
| devkulkarni | is the Docker team also working on the libvirt option? | 16:48 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: I will check with them to confirm | 16:48 |
| paulczar | they're using my dockenstack project as a base which is pretty cool. | 16:48 |
| devkulkarni | paulczar: link please :) | 16:48 |
| adrian_otto | I do know that RAX is contributing to that effort | 16:48 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: awesome. thanks! | 16:48 |
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| paulczar | we have two blocking bugs in oslo and nova that will stop us from using docker driver | 16:49 |
| adrian_otto | paulczar: each has open reviews in Nova, right? | 16:49 |
| paulczar | I have patched oslo, and fixed the patch for nova | 16:49 |
| paulczar | yes | 16:49 |
| paulczar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78642/ | 16:49 |
| paulczar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/65393/ | 16:49 |
| paulczar | and this is a nice to have - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78322/ | 16:50 |
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| paulczar | devkulkarni: https://github.com/ewindisch/dockenstack | 16:50 |
| paulczar | heh, sudden flurry of +1's :) | 16:51 |
| devkulkarni | paulczar: cool.. thanks! | 16:51 |
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| ewindisch | paulczar: feel free to add me to any such reviews as above... (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78322/) | 16:52 |
| adrian_otto | hardcoding a specific username in https://review.openstack.org/78322 is likely to raises concerns | 16:52 |
| paulczar | specific username ? | 16:53 |
| adrian_otto | if other solutions are possible, we should explore those | 16:53 |
| adrian_otto | the patch adds "samalba/registry" as a default | 16:53 |
| ewindisch | paulczar: ewindisch | 16:53 |
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| paulczar | adrian_otto: that's just the name of the trusted build | 16:53 |
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| paulczar | ewindisch: thx | 16:54 |
| ewindisch | paulczar / adrian_otto: that's off the master branch. What is used right now is the cut release. | 16:54 |
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| ewindisch | if there is a bug in the release we should cut a new one | 16:54 |
| paulczar | ewindisch: I gave up asking for that! ( before you started ) ;) | 16:55 |
| adrian_otto | ok, seeing something named after a person jumped out at me | 16:55 |
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| paulczar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/78642/ wants a unit test … does a real dev want to help out with that ? | 16:56 |
| julienvey | paulczar: sure | 16:56 |
| adrian_otto | paulczar: thanks for raising those reviews to our attention | 16:57 |
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| paulczar | np | 16:58 |
| adrian_otto | paulczar: Doug Hellman asked for a unit test on https://review.openstack.org/78642 | 16:58 |
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| paulczar | adrian_otto: julienvey just offered to help with that | 16:58 |
| adrian_otto | lagged. thanks! | 16:58 |
| adrian_otto | anyone else that would like to be recorded in the attendance, please chime in | 16:59 |
| paulczar | with those merged in I think we'll be good to M1 on docker | 16:59 |
| ewindisch | as long as we're linking reviews... I've got a pile for Docker stuff: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+owner:ewindisch,n,z | 16:59 |
| adrian_otto | ewindisch: thank you! | 16:59 |
| adrian_otto | thanks everyone | 17:00 |
| adrian_otto | #endmeeting | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 11 17:00:15 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-03-11-16.01.html | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-03-11-16.01.txt | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-03-11-16.01.log.html | 17:00 |
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| ativelkov | #startmeeting murano | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 11 17:00:42 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ativelkov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'murano' | 17:00 |
| katyafervent | Hi all! | 17:00 |
| ativelkov | Hi folks | 17:00 |
| ativelkov | Those who are here for Murano, please identify yourself | 17:01 |
| dteselkin | Hi | 17:01 |
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| gokrokve | Hi | 17:01 |
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| stanlagun | hi | 17:01 |
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| ativelkov | Ok, some folks around, let's start then | 17:01 |
| ativelkov | #topic AI review | 17:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AI review (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:02 | |
| ativelkov | We have just a few of AIs from the last week | 17:02 |
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| ativelkov | BTW, agenda is here: #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/MuranoAgenda#Agenda | 17:02 |
| igormarnat_ | Howdy | 17:02 |
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| sergmelikyan | o/ | 17:02 |
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| ativelkov | So, the first AI was on ruhe: ruhe to add repository-reorganization BP to roadmap | 17:03 |
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| ativelkov | he is not jere, as far as I can see | 17:03 |
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| katyafervent | Didn't we postpone this activity? | 17:04 |
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| ativelkov | But eventually it was decided to drop repository reorganization blueprint from this delivery | 17:04 |
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| ativelkov | katyafervent: yes, we did. We just did it after the previous weekly meeting | 17:04 |
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| katyafervent | well if we will unite 3 repos to one we'll kind of reach this) | 17:05 |
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| ativelkov | #agreed to postpone explicit repo reorganization till the delivery is done | 17:05 |
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| ativelkov | We have a section in agenda to discuss this | 17:05 |
| katyafervent | I'm talking about contributing new code to murano-api | 17:05 |
| katyafervent | Ok, sorry) | 17:05 |
| ativelkov | It's more then just 3 repos | 17:05 |
| ativelkov | So, the next one: tsufiev to create a BP on Marconi usage | 17:05 |
| ativelkov | Is Timur here today? | 17:06 |
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| tsufiev | hi | 17:06 |
| ativelkov | Hi Timur | 17:06 |
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| ativelkov | There was an AI on you: tsufiev to create a BP on Marconi usage | 17:06 |
| tsufiev | i did it ) | 17:06 |
| ativelkov | Could you please share the link? | 17:07 |
| tsufiev | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/murano/+spec/investigate-marconi-messaging | 17:07 |
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| ativelkov | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/murano/+spec/investigate-marconi-messaging | 17:07 |
| ativelkov | Thanks | 17:07 |
| ativelkov | Did you have a chance to do the initial investifation about it? | 17:07 |
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| ativelkov | tsufiev: ? | 17:08 |
| tsufiev | nope (. i've been doing a lot of CR recently | 17:09 |
| ativelkov | Ok, no problem. We are not in a rush with this. We'll need to coordinate with Dmitry on unified agent initiative, but this waits till the AppCatalog MVP is live | 17:09 |
| ruhe | Hi! | 17:10 |
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| ativelkov | Hi | 17:10 |
| gokrokve | hi | 17:10 |
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| ativelkov | So, the last AI: ruhe to create BPs for infrustructure-related items in roadmap | 17:10 |
| tsufiev | ativelkov: yes, as soon as I finish with AppCatalog UI, i'll able to do it | 17:10 |
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| gokrokve | ruhe: Do you have +2 rights? | 17:11 |
| gokrokve | We need to improve our review activity. | 17:11 |
| ruhe | gokrokve: no, i didn't earn this privilegy yet :) | 17:11 |
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| ruhe | gokrokve: but i'm reviewing as hard as i can | 17:12 |
| gokrokve | cool | 17:12 |
| ativelkov | YEs, we have quite a long backlog | 17:12 |
| ativelkov | We need to catch up on this | 17:12 |
| gokrokve | sure | 17:13 |
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| ativelkov | But let's keep with the Agenda ) | 17:13 |
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| gokrokve | there are some patches with did not get any review since March 9th | 17:13 |
| gokrokve | sure | 17:13 |
| ativelkov | So, as for the last AI, I believe ruhe has made all the blueprints for our infra-changes | 17:13 |
| ativelkov | So, we can proceed | 17:14 |
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| ativelkov | #topic Repo-reorganization progress | 17:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Repo-reorganization progress (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:14 | |
| ativelkov | So, we have decided not to explicitly spend any time on repo-migration during this phase | 17:15 |
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| ativelkov | however, there are chances to do a lot of work seemlessly | 17:15 |
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| ruhe | the only item under question is murano-common | 17:16 |
| ativelkov | We have two major blocks which are going to land to our codebase in the nearest month: a new DSL engine and a new repository API | 17:16 |
| ruhe | should we get rid of that repo by copy-pasting it across other projects or leave it as is? | 17:16 |
| ativelkov | We've decided to put them both into the murano-api repository (instead of murano-conductor and murano-repository accordingly) | 17:16 |
| ativelkov | ruhe - yes, it seems like this is the only part which will remain outside of joined murano-api | 17:17 |
| katyafervent | btw, did we make change in review that is already in progress? | 17:17 |
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| ativelkov | I believe we should fallback to copy-pasting this into the agent till we are done with its unification | 17:17 |
| ativelkov | katyafervent: which review do you mean? | 17:18 |
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| katyafervent | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/75882/ | 17:18 |
| katyafervent | this one | 17:18 |
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| ativelkov | Ah, we will finish reviewing it | 17:19 |
| tsufiev | katyafervent: ruhe has already copy-pasted this commit into murano-api | 17:19 |
| katyafervent | great! | 17:19 |
| ruhe | katyafervent: i've copied this CR to murano-api. see https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79629/ | 17:19 |
| ativelkov | and oncah, then, tsufiev, please abandone it | 17:19 |
| igormarnat_ | oncah? | 17:19 |
| tsufiev | ativelkov: ok, once it get 2 +2 | 17:19 |
| ativelkov | Sure | 17:19 |
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| ativelkov | oncah was a typo, sorry ) | 17:20 |
| tsufiev | everybody is eager to know what did you mean ) | 17:20 |
| ativelkov | So, we are on a good progress with this: in 0.5 we are going to have all murano services in one repo, and a single python-client | 17:20 |
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| ativelkov | that was supposed to be the beginning of "and once we have it approved.." | 17:21 |
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| ativelkov | We'll manage murano-docs and murano-tests during the next iteration | 17:22 |
| sergmelikyan | I think copy-pasting murano-common may be not so good. | 17:22 |
| ativelkov | what do you propose instead? | 17:22 |
| sergmelikyan | We will end-up not only copying existing functionality to murano-agent, but also all other functionality that is currently provided by packages that is not available in global-requirements | 17:23 |
| ativelkov | what is this funcitonality? | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | bunch? | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | deepcopy? | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | deep? | 17:24 |
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| ativelkov | we need to consider them one by one | 17:24 |
| xwizard_ | we should remove these dependencies | 17:24 |
| ativelkov | probably we may either find other ways of doing that, or publish them | 17:24 |
| tsufiev | sergmelikyan: do you propose to first remove the dependencies and then copy-paste the result? | 17:24 |
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| stanlagun | maybe we can merge agent with the rest of murano repositories and leave murano-common as a module within this unified repository | 17:26 |
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| sergmelikyan | tsufiev, I am not sure why we need to have this troubles at all (with copy-pasting). We expect to have troubles to publish murano-common in global-requirements if Murano will be incubated before migration on other agent implementation? | 17:26 |
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| ativelkov | But this will mean that the agent will be have to install everything, including engine and apis | 17:26 |
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| ativelkov | Hm, folks, a funny idea... what about putting that "utils" block into the python-muranoclient? | 17:27 |
| sergmelikyan | ativelkov, anyway when you installing API you will also install engine | 17:27 |
| ativelkov | sergmelikyan: that's ok for a service node, which may even change its roles on the fly. It may be not ok for the client | 17:28 |
| ativelkov | s/client/agent | 17:28 |
| stanlagun | maybe we can find a way to customize installation somehow | 17:29 |
| ativelkov | probably | 17:29 |
| stanlagun | this would be also useful for API vs Engine | 17:29 |
| ativelkov | But I am still not convinced about the need to use all those dependencies in the Agent | 17:30 |
| sergmelikyan | I suggest to postpone merging murano-common code ether to murano repo or murano-agent | 17:30 |
| ativelkov | sergmelikyan: +1 | 17:30 |
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| ativelkov | actually we already agreed on that | 17:30 |
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| ativelkov | We are not in a rush | 17:30 |
| ativelkov | the only problem which is really hot is Puka | 17:31 |
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| sergmelikyan | I have already submitted patch for Puka | 17:31 |
| stanlagun | Anyway lets try to avoid copy-pasting by all means possible. | 17:31 |
| sergmelikyan | https://review.openstack.org/79639 | 17:31 |
| ativelkov | As soon as openstack-infra updates tox on their CI, we'll get everything broken for Murano | 17:31 |
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| ativelkov | As new tox will bring new pip with it, and the new pip is unable to install from untrusted sources | 17:32 |
| sergmelikyan | ativelkov, I have found one more issue today (it is already fixed), but had no time to fully test this patch on a lab. | 17:32 |
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| ativelkov | sergmelikyan: that's good. Let's speed-up this process | 17:32 |
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| sergmelikyan | So I believe we can ger rid of Puka in a matter of days | 17:32 |
| tsufiev | ativelkov: you mean the dev versions? | 17:32 |
| ativelkov | tsufiev: no, everything | 17:33 |
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| tsufiev | :( | 17:33 |
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| ativelkov | Jenkins runs tox, tox runs pip install -r requirements.txt, and it fails if pip is 1.5.4 | 17:34 |
| stanlagun | There is always a temporary solution - to use regular puka instead of custom fork | 17:34 |
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| ativelkov | stanlagun: I would prefer permanent solutions :) | 17:34 |
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| ativelkov | As sergmelikyan has almost got one ready, I would wait for it | 17:35 |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: me too. Consider it as plan B | 17:35 |
| ativelkov | Got it | 17:35 |
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| ativelkov | So, are we all agree on the repositories? | 17:36 |
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| sergmelikyan | + | 17:36 |
| katyafervent | + | 17:37 |
| tsufiev | + | 17:37 |
| ativelkov | No objections. Cool ) Let's move on | 17:37 |
| ativelkov | #topic ApplicationCatalog API | 17:37 |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: +1 for merging but so that it would be possible to choose what deamon runs at each place. And without copy-paste | 17:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ApplicationCatalog API (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:37 | |
| ativelkov | So, as far as I understand, gokrokve has some proposal on the repository APIs | 17:38 |
| gokrokve | yes | 17:38 |
| ativelkov | But we have already designed an API and started implementing it | 17:38 |
| gokrokve | I still want to split APi and have artifacts API which will be moved to Galnce | 17:38 |
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| gokrokve | and Catalog API with handles Catalog specific actions | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | What do you mean? | 17:39 |
| ativelkov | I think that Catalog API will wrap artifact API | 17:39 |
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| ativelkov | At least during the transition period | 17:40 |
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| stanlagun | gokrokve: so we will have 3 APIs for the near future? | 17:41 |
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| gokrokve | Yoa are right it will wrap | 17:41 |
| gokrokve | We will | 17:41 |
| ativelkov | stanlagun: Glance API will not appear in the nearest future | 17:41 |
| gokrokve | One APi will be Glance artifacts repository API | 17:41 |
| ativelkov | not till the mid of summer | 17:41 |
| gokrokve | and Murano will have its own API for catalog | 17:42 |
| gokrokve | As we don't want to change API again when artifacts API will move | 17:42 |
| stanlagun | Why don't we split them as soon as Glance API becomes available? | 17:42 |
| ativelkov | From my point of view, there may be two possible approaches: 1) murano user interacts only with Murano API for both catalog and deployment tasks, while Murano API wraps some of this calls and sends them to Glance | 17:42 |
| gokrokve | then I suggest to have a clear separation now | 17:42 |
| gokrokve | stanlagun: We can't change APi frequently | 17:43 |
| gokrokve | If we design it properly now, we will need to change endpoint instead of making a new PAI version | 17:43 |
| ativelkov | 2) There are no catalog APIs in Murano at all, everything related to catalogization is done via a glance-plugin, while murano just handles the "deployment", same as nova does it now for images | 17:44 |
| stanlagun | We would not have to if Glance API is left as an implementation detail. UI should not talk to Glance directly. At least if Murano API didn't explicitly told it to do so | 17:44 |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: +1 for 1) | 17:45 |
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| ativelkov | gokrokve: I don't understand how do you suppose to use glance | 17:45 |
| gokrokve | I don't say that | 17:45 |
| gokrokve | I am ok with wrapping Glance API | 17:45 |
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| gokrokve | but we need to design this properly | 17:45 |
| sergmelikyan | ativelkov, +1 for 1 | 17:46 |
| katyafervent | ativelkov, +1 the way of Glance usage | 17:46 |
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| katyafervent | api version could be v1.1 or even v1.1.1 | 17:46 |
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| tsufiev | wrapping Glance is fine to me | 17:46 |
| ativelkov | gokrokve: if we stick to p1 above, Glance becomes a back-end for us | 17:46 |
| ativelkov | So, we will not have to change the API when we move to Glance | 17:47 |
| gokrokve | ok | 17:47 |
| ativelkov | Say, there is a POST /v?/catalog/packages call to publish a package | 17:47 |
| ativelkov | it is in our API | 17:47 |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: not neccessary | 17:48 |
| stanlagun | it may change | 17:48 |
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| ativelkov | then it may either store the package in our db (as it does now), OR it may extract the archive, inspect-validate-preprocess it - and then make a glance/v2/artifacts/.. call | 17:48 |
| ativelkov | (By "as it does now" I mean "as it is designed in the version being currently developed") | 17:49 |
| ativelkov | stanlagun: I would prefern not to change the APIs unless absolutely nesessary | 17:49 |
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| ativelkov | Actually, it depends on the actual logic we put there | 17:50 |
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| ativelkov | I still see a possibility of the direct interaction with Glance (p2 in my "options" above) | 17:51 |
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| ativelkov | I like this option less then option 1, but it has its pros as well | 17:51 |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: yes. But there are no guarantee we will not have too unless Murano API would proxy all Glance traffic. Murano API may still tell UI/Engine/Whatever do doenload something directly from Glance. Especially large files | 17:51 |
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| ativelkov | stanlagun: in the case of large files it is more likely that they will be doesnloaded from the storage | 17:52 |
| ativelkov | directly, I mean, not via glance | 17:52 |
| stanlagun | Isn't Glance would be our storage frontend? | 17:52 |
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| stanlagun | Glance abstracts Swift and other storages | 17:53 |
| stanlagun | I don't really want to write support for all possible storage backends | 17:54 |
| ativelkov | Glance does indeed provide such an abstraction | 17:54 |
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| ativelkov | But download link provided by it may target directly to the storage | 17:55 |
| ativelkov | But I am not sure yet | 17:55 |
| ativelkov | This needs to be verified | 17:55 |
| ativelkov | So, we are almost run out of time | 17:56 |
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| ativelkov | 4 mins left, and still one agenda item | 17:56 |
| ativelkov | #topic UI for the Application Catalog | 17:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "UI for the Application Catalog (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:56 | |
| stanlagun | ativelkov: Again I agee on p1. Just wanted to tell that it doesn't guarantee we don't make breaking API changes once we move to Glance | 17:56 |
| ativelkov | So, any questions of the new UI drafts? | 17:57 |
| tsufiev | so we started implementing new UI layout for AppCatalog | 17:57 |
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| tsufiev | it uses tile layout instead of tables | 17:58 |
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| ativelkov | Yes, did we share the UI design anywhere? | 17:58 |
| tsufiev | not yet | 17:58 |
| ativelkov | I am sure we need to | 17:59 |
| ativelkov | We dont' have much time left to discuss it here | 17:59 |
| ativelkov | So I suggest either to move to the ML or to #murano channel | 17:59 |
| katyafervent | Will we remove the Service Definition tab right? | 18:00 |
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| tsufiev | more to say, the UI discussion doesn't look like a fruitful one | 18:00 |
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| ativelkov | It worth discussing, but now here anyway | 18:00 |
| ativelkov | Thanks everybody | 18:00 |
| ativelkov | #endmeeting | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 11 18:00:47 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-03-11-17.00.html | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-03-11-17.00.txt | 18:00 |
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| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-03-11-17.00.log.html | 18:00 |
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| SpamapS | helleeewwwww? | 19:00 |
| jdob | o/ | 19:00 |
| lsmola2 | hello | 19:00 |
| dprince | yo yo yo | 19:00 |
| bnemec | o/ | 19:00 |
| rpodolyaka | hey! | 19:00 |
| jdob | at the appropriate time because I'm not a naive american who forgets about DST | 19:00 |
| marios | o/ hey tripleoers | 19:01 |
| GheRivero | hi all | 19:01 |
| greghaynes | hihi | 19:01 |
| SpamapS | lifeless seems MIA today so I will run it | 19:01 |
| slagle | hi | 19:01 |
| SpamapS | #startmeeting tripleo | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 11 19:01:35 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SpamapS. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tripleo' | 19:01 |
| SpamapS | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TripleO | 19:02 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: I am here, but thanks! | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: well you're late and quiet. ;) | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | I sense a ruse.. ;) | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #topic bugs | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:02 | |
| tchaypo | morning | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/ | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/ | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-refresh-config | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-collect-config | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar | 19:02 |
| SpamapS | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-tuskarclient | 19:02 |
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| SpamapS | we are _swimming_ in criticals | 19:03 |
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| SpamapS | https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1290969 in particular has broken our CI | 19:04 |
| SpamapS | revert was submitted upstream, but we're also dealing with it by listing the stores we need | 19:04 |
| SpamapS | fix is winding through CI now | 19:04 |
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| SpamapS | There are so many, I'm not sure which ones to call out. | 19:06 |
| slagle | why not +A the tripleo fix? | 19:06 |
| slagle | (for the glance one) | 19:06 |
| SpamapS | slagle: Waiting for it to pass. :) | 19:06 |
| slagle | looks like it hit some other issue | 19:07 |
| slagle | unrelated | 19:07 |
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| lifeless | yay breaking changes | 19:08 |
| slagle | http://logs.openstack.org/31/79631/4/check-tripleo/check-tripleo-overcloud-precise/d2ff806/console.html | 19:08 |
| slagle | not sure if anyone has seen that one before ^^ | 19:08 |
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| slagle | "Authentication required" after creating endpoints, failed the overcloud job | 19:09 |
| lifeless | oh *fun* | 19:09 |
| slagle | so, now that's blocking the fix for glance | 19:09 |
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| * slagle files | 19:09 | |
| lifeless | pragmatism vs fear interact in my head :) | 19:10 |
| SpamapS | moar criticals | 19:10 |
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| SpamapS | suffice to say, we are a bit under water right now with openstack bugs breaking us as much as anything else | 19:10 |
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| SpamapS | in theory "the process is working" .. as we're feeding fixes into OpenStack.. achieving the goal that a deployment system built on OpenStack will improve OpenStack. :-P | 19:11 |
| SpamapS | but it burnssss ussssss | 19:11 |
| jdob | is that common this late in a cycle or a side effect of us having our feet under us better? | 19:11 |
| slagle | we just need to convince everyone else :) | 19:11 |
| lifeless | jdob: feature freeze generally breaks the world | 19:12 |
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| jdob | sounds familiar | 19:12 |
| lifeless | jdob: I hate it with a passion, but the only folk that understand are deployers. | 19:12 |
| lifeless | everyone else seetakes the view that this is a good thing | 19:12 |
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| lifeless | I'm now focused on getting in the gate and helping them understand in a more visceral way | 19:12 |
| SpamapS | right so, bugs there are many | 19:13 |
| SpamapS | Triage seems to be happening more now than it was | 19:13 |
| SpamapS | moving on? | 19:13 |
| lifeless | DO ALL HDo all the criticals have volunteers against them ? | 19:14 |
| * SpamapS wishes launchpad would tell him that without opening them all :-P | 19:15 | |
| lifeless | SpamapS: turn on the assignee column via the cog. | 19:15 |
| SpamapS | https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1270646 - no | 19:15 |
| greghaynes | https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1285269 no | 19:15 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: DOHHHHH | 19:15 |
| SpamapS | ok so you can all do that | 19:16 |
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| SpamapS | Looks like none of the triaged/confirmed ones have assignees | 19:16 |
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| SpamapS | so, if you are twiddling your thumbs in #tripleo.. -> grab a critical today | 19:16 |
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| lifeless | slagle: that authentication required is super odd | 19:17 |
| lifeless | slagle: since its in the middle of setup-endpoints | 19:17 |
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| SpamapS | I suspect something crashed | 19:18 |
| SpamapS | ENEEDLOGS BADLY | 19:18 |
| slagle | likely | 19:18 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: bug 1290759 | 19:19 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: there are two bugs there | 19:20 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: one is log levels.. the other is actually shipping the logs back to jenkins | 19:20 |
| SpamapS | or logstash.. or something | 19:20 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: we get the logs for seed and undercloud atm | 19:20 |
| SpamapS | because AFAIK, we don't have the logs from the overcloud or undercloud when something like init-keystone fails. | 19:21 |
| SpamapS | oh we have undercloud now? that I missed. | 19:21 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: check toci :) | 19:21 |
| SpamapS | 2014-03-11 18:52:11.226 2774 WARNING keystone.common.wsgi [-] You are not authorized to perform the requested action, identity:revocation_list. | 19:23 |
| SpamapS | 2014-03-11 18:52:11.697 2774 WARNING keystone.common.wsgi [-] You are not authorized to perform the requested action, identity:revocation_list. | 19:23 |
| SpamapS | I bet we need a new policy.json | 19:23 |
| SpamapS | anyway, should we move on or are there other bugs people want to discuss? | 19:23 |
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| lifeless | onwards and upwards | 19:24 |
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| tchaypo | and twirling | 19:25 |
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| bnemec | ENOSPAMAPS | 19:27 |
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| pblaho | o/ | 19:27 |
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| SpamapS | doh | 19:28 |
| SpamapS | my IRC host just went down | 19:28 |
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| lifeless | what did it go down on? | 19:28 |
| * SpamapS has no snark for that | 19:29 | |
| SpamapS | Anyway, I may have missed the "yes lets move on" | 19:29 |
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| *** SpamapS_ is now known as SpamapS | 19:30 | |
| SpamapS | aand we're back | 19:30 |
| SpamapS | #topic reviews | 19:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:30 | |
| SpamapS | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-openreviews.html | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-30.txt | 19:31 |
| marios | they dont work any more | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-90.txt | 19:31 |
| lifeless | still down | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | oh | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | lovely | 19:31 |
| jistr | seems like Russel took that down | 19:31 |
| slagle | russel must have about a million hits on that blog post by now | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | there's a different one | 19:31 |
| jistr | slagle: lol yes | 19:31 |
| lifeless | it was OIOOOmin his VM | 19:31 |
| lifeless | ooming | 19:31 |
| russellb | yes | 19:32 |
| russellb | and i've been too busy with feature freeze / icehouse to deal with it | 19:32 |
| russellb | so i just pulled it | 19:32 |
| russellb | and would rather bring it back up in -infra | 19:32 |
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| bnemec | Oh, that's probably what killed my VM the other day. | 19:32 |
| ccrouch | fwiw | 19:33 |
| ccrouch | http://www.stackalytics.com/report/reviews/tripleo-group/open | 19:33 |
| ccrouch | http://www.stackalytics.com/report/contribution/tripleo-group/30 | 19:33 |
| SpamapS | mikal: didn't you have a review stat thing too? | 19:33 |
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| SpamapS | so, our stats are going to be weird as far as landing changes right now | 19:34 |
| SpamapS | because CI is like, always broken | 19:34 |
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| jistr | ccrouch: neat. i know about stackalytics but i missed these charts | 19:34 |
| marios | indeed, thanks charles | 19:35 |
| SpamapS | so in summary.. | 19:36 |
| SpamapS | 1) Keep reviewing! | 19:36 |
| SpamapS | 2) Don't +A without CI passing! | 19:36 |
| SpamapS | 3) Keep calm and recheck no bug | 19:36 |
| SpamapS | zomg. new t-shirt. | 19:36 |
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| lifeless | so, I think that derekh is probably right about https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79502/ being key to stability | 19:37 |
| lifeless | spI like | 19:37 |
| lifeless | bah | 19:37 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: I like | 19:38 |
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| SpamapS | that and "wow. such recheck. much no bug. very SUCCESS." | 19:38 |
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| SpamapS | anyway.. on a more serious note.. sdague was just reminding me that it will take a long long time to get tripleo into the gate | 19:39 |
| SpamapS | and we have some really big hurdles.. | 19:39 |
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| SpamapS | the biggest one is probably that we really need to start using ironic. | 19:39 |
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| ccrouch | surely that cant be the *biggest* hurdle | 19:39 |
| SpamapS | ccrouch: it is huge | 19:39 |
| SpamapS | nova baremetal is effectively deprecated | 19:40 |
| SpamapS | and ironic is not graduated yet | 19:40 |
| SpamapS | and we're not allowed to have not-graduated openstack things in the gate | 19:40 |
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| ccrouch | i guess I meant "biggest" == "most difficult for us to achieve" | 19:40 |
| SpamapS | there are some real challenges | 19:40 |
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| lifeless | nova bm isn't deprecated, thats waiting for Ironic to incubate | 19:40 |
| SpamapS | to switching ot Ironic I mean. | 19:40 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: s/incubate/graduate/ | 19:41 |
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| SpamapS | oh | 19:41 |
| SpamapS | same diff | 19:41 |
| SpamapS | n/m | 19:41 |
| devananda | afaict, it's going to be a source of pain for tripleo for all of the J cycle | 19:41 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: not the same, and I was being precise :) | 19:41 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: but possibly wrong :) | 19:41 |
| ccrouch | can i we make being in the gate a target for J ? | 19:41 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: if we don't switch to Ironic now, we can get in the gate sooner you think? | 19:41 |
| ccrouch | s/i// | 19:41 |
| devananda | SpamapS: lifeless is correct. russellb has expclitly _not_ frozen the baremetal driver | 19:41 |
| tchaypo | lifeless: definitely being saucy | 19:41 |
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| lifeless | SpamapS: our being in the gate is now primarily limited by tripleo-test-cloud scale | 19:42 |
| devananda | ccrouch: it can be a target for K, aiui, but not J, because ironic will not be graduated until then | 19:42 |
| devananda | lifeless: ^ | 19:42 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: yes, but if we added ironic, we'd also be limited by Ironic's status. | 19:42 |
| SpamapS | hang on let me switch topics | 19:42 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: for which, when the patches to make ci-overcloud regions be fully straightforward to deploy, I think we need to go hit up the folk that offered hardware and have a serious talk | 19:43 |
| SpamapS | #topic Ironic and being in the gate | 19:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ironic and being in the gate (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:43 | |
| devananda | shall i summarize? | 19:43 |
| ccrouch | devananda: please | 19:43 |
| devananda | integrated projects can't gate on non-integrated projects | 19:43 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: Ironic's status is chicken and egg, and if we use Ironic, and are in the gate, we deliver all the criteria AFAIK, subject to Nova merging the patch. | 19:43 |
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| devananda | ironic is not integrated (and probably wont be until teh start of the K cycle) | 19:43 |
| devananda | thus, if tripleo depends on ironic, it can't be in teh gate until ironic can be in the gate | 19:44 |
| devananda | ergo, not in the J cycle | 19:44 |
| lifeless | devananda: they can once the project is in incubation, because the incubation cycle is the cycle where the symmetric gating is setup. | 19:44 |
| devananda | no | 19:44 |
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| lifeless | no? | 19:44 |
| SpamapS | so this seems like something where we need to get aligned and moving forward _now_ | 19:44 |
| devananda | lifeless: this is a point ive continually run into | 19:44 |
| devananda | lifeless: the TC and -infra teams have made it VER Yclear to me | 19:44 |
| bnemec | This seems like a serious flaw in our incubation process. | 19:44 |
| lifeless | sdague: ^ help me understand please | 19:44 |
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| devananda | ironic needs to remain ASYMMTETRRICALLY gated until AFTER graduation | 19:44 |
| devananda | which means for all of J, ironic's gate is likely to break based on changes in nova, glance, keystone, neutron, etc .... | 19:45 |
| lifeless | devananda: or presumably consume releases and treat Ironic like every other third party external dependency? | 19:45 |
| devananda | lifeless: that's a possibility as well | 19:45 |
| lifeless | except that the link to Nova internal API is a huge issue there. | 19:45 |
| devananda | right | 19:45 |
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| devananda | bnemec: i agree | 19:46 |
| SpamapS | So I think this is a really big, important conversation that we need to have, perhaps inviting the right people so we don't miss any nuances. | 19:47 |
| ccrouch | apologies for missing this: but if we can't get into the gate with ironic until K, why cant we get into the gate using nova-bm? | 19:47 |
| devananda | fwiw, i raised this on the list here: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-February/028459.html | 19:47 |
| lifeless | ccrouch: we can | 19:47 |
| devananda | where this == asymmetric gate pain | 19:47 |
| SpamapS | But IMO, this is the biggest thing standing in the way of TripleO. If we're not in the gate... we have to run our own git mirrors and gate openstack ourselves or our velocity will drop to a ridiculously low level. | 19:48 |
| lifeless | ccrouch: and since we want to support H for at least a cycle, we just need to use both nova-bm and Ironic, and not gate on Ironic. | 19:48 |
| SpamapS | (which it already has...) | 19:48 |
| lifeless | we can trivially run non-voting Ironic jobs | 19:48 |
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| ccrouch | lifeless: ok, great. So is that the intermediate goal, i.e. a goal for J ? To gate with nova-bm? | 19:48 |
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| devananda | lifeless: your goal is gate tripleo with nova-bm for J, and with ironic for K ? | 19:49 |
| devananda | that is not what I thought your plan was | 19:49 |
| lifeless | devananda: my goal is to get in the gate *anyway we can* | 19:49 |
| devananda | ah | 19:49 |
| devananda | heh | 19:49 |
| ccrouch | lifeless: +10 :-) | 19:49 |
| SpamapS | what he said. ;) | 19:49 |
| lifeless | devananda: honestly, the baremetal backend used in nova is not the problem | 19:49 |
| lifeless | as I said above | 19:49 |
| devananda | sure | 19:49 |
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| lifeless | our problem is test capacity | 19:49 |
| SpamapS | What I'd like to get confirmation on .. | 19:49 |
| lifeless | any other discussion is solvable via code | 19:49 |
| devananda | it's just a feature-limitation for tripleo itself -- not a gate limitation | 19:49 |
| lifeless | that one isn't | 19:49 |
| SpamapS | is whether we can switch to Ironic and still remain in the gate. :-P | 19:49 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: Can I reframe that? | 19:50 |
| devananda | lifeless: so if you want features taht ironic has AND you want tripleo in the gate | 19:50 |
| devananda | lifeless: i think there's a conflict of interest in deprecating nova-bm | 19:50 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: yes, but I do suspect there is a rabbit in your hat. ;) | 19:50 |
| lifeless | devananda: go on | 19:50 |
| devananda | lifeless: i thought that was pretty clear | 19:50 |
| * lifeless raises both hands palms up with a quizzical expression on his face | 19:51 | |
| devananda | hehe | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | ~o~ | 19:52 |
| devananda | ok, i'll rephrase | 19:52 |
| ccrouch | devananda: is saying we cant have both: if we move to ironic, we get kicked out of the gate | 19:52 |
| ccrouch | iiuc | 19:52 |
| devananda | aiui, tripleo needs certain features taht nova-bm does not have | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | so let's not speculate | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | Can we pose this quiestion to infra? | 19:52 |
| devananda | some are inherently in ironic, some need to be implemented | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | question too | 19:52 |
| devananda | SpamapS: ++ | 19:52 |
| lifeless | so | 19:52 |
| lifeless | I still don't understand 'move to Ironic' | 19:52 |
| lifeless | thats like saying 'move to glusterfs' | 19:52 |
| devananda | erm | 19:53 |
| ccrouch | sigh | 19:53 |
| * devananda is confused | 19:53 | |
| ccrouch | you know what i mean :-) | 19:53 |
| lifeless | we support nova-bm today | 19:53 |
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| devananda | lifeless: i thought we talked about "move to ironic" last week extensively | 19:53 |
| devananda | perhaps not as extensively as other things | 19:53 |
| lifeless | devananda: I deeply desire the ability to say that TripleO can a) deploy using and b) deploy, Ironic. | 19:53 |
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| devananda | sure | 19:54 |
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| ccrouch | i think he's drawing the distinction about tripleo would support both nova-bm and ironic | 19:54 |
| lifeless | devananda: neither a) nor b) imply that TripleO cannot c) deploy using and d) deploy, Nova-BM | 19:54 |
| devananda | indeed | 19:54 |
| lifeless | Symmetric gating may be limited to making statements about c) and d) | 19:54 |
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| lifeless | but that in no way implies that a) and b) will not work, nor that we cannot do check jobs for them. | 19:55 |
| devananda | lifeless: so my question becomes, does it matter to tripleo if the features which ironic and nova-bm provide are substantially different? | 19:55 |
| devananda | for a case in point, the need for ephemeral (which, yes, is now in both) | 19:55 |
| devananda | and then, wil tripleo be able to support back-porting those changes to nova-bm | 19:55 |
| devananda | and hwo does nova feel about that | 19:55 |
| lifeless | devananda: so there are threes ways Ironic might differ; it might be better (more secure/faster/leaner/more robust) | 19:55 |
| lifeless | it might have additional features (e.g. UEFI) | 19:56 |
| lifeless | it might have less features (e.g. missing nova rebuild --preserve-ephemeral) | 19:56 |
| * devananda sighs | 19:56 | |
| lifeless | In my mind for TripleO we have a subset of Nova-BM features (perhaps all of them minus Tilera :)) | 19:56 |
| lifeless | those are what we have to have to say that a) above works | 19:57 |
| lifeless | but there's nothing holding Ironic back | 19:57 |
| devananda | lifeless: when tripleo needs a given feature, and that feature is not in nova-bm, please, do not add it | 19:57 |
| devananda | unless you guys can also add it to ironic | 19:57 |
| devananda | first | 19:57 |
| devananda | :) | 19:57 |
| SpamapS | right so I want to summarize and then we're out of time.. | 19:57 |
| devananda | the more feature-ful that nova-bm becomes, the harder the testing and upgrade path becomes, and the more i get concerned taht our community fragments the way n-net and neutron did | 19:58 |
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| SpamapS | - We are likely to find ourselves testing with nova-baremetal and ironic for all or at least most of the J cycle. | 19:58 |
| lifeless | devananda: so lets get Ironic in the gate. I just don't see how that impacts getting TripleO in the gate - a,c are distinct from c,d. | 19:58 |
| SpamapS | - We should exercise rigor and not expand nova-baremetal anymore so as to not prolong that any further. | 19:58 |
| devananda | lifeless: agreed. except ironic can't get in the gate until K, for political reasons | 19:59 |
| devananda | or s/politic/policy/ | 19:59 |
| devananda | depending on your POV | 19:59 |
| SpamapS | - There is a question as to whether TripleO's gate jobs can make use of an incubated but not integrated project, like Ironic, that needs answering. | 19:59 |
| lifeless | devananda: if you're incubated then nova-bm is deprecated | 19:59 |
| lifeless | devananda: so J should see us right there. | 19:59 |
| devananda | lifeless: no. we are incubated. nova-bm is not deprecated. | 19:59 |
| lifeless | up, next meeting time | 20:00 |
| SpamapS | Alright, fun times | 20:00 |
| SpamapS | #endmeeting | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 11 20:00:24 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-03-11-19.01.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-03-11-19.01.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-03-11-19.01.log.html | 20:00 |
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| jistr | thanks, bye | 20:00 |
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| lsmola2 | thanks, good night | 20:03 |
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