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| markwash | good morning glance folks | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
| markwash | or evening | 14:00 |
| markwash | or afternoon | 14:00 |
| ameade | hola | 14:00 |
| rosmaita | yo! | 14:00 |
| ativelkov | hi! | 14:00 |
| flwang | o/ | 14:00 |
| arnaud | o/ | 14:00 |
| flwang | arnaud: congrats :D | 14:01 |
| markwash | okay cool let's start it | 14:01 |
| arnaud | thanks flwang :) :) :) :) | 14:01 |
| markwash | #startmeeting glance | 14:01 |
| scottda_ | hi | 14:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 13 14:01:31 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is markwash. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'glance' | 14:01 |
| flwang | arnaud: welcome to join the team, though you're already at here | 14:01 |
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| markwash | team meeting agenda follows | 14:02 |
| markwash | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/glance-team-meeting-agenda | 14:02 |
| markwash | but there's not much there yet | 14:02 |
| markwash | I'll say a few quick project-y update things and then yield to other agenda items | 14:02 |
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| markwash | as a warning, I need to leave at 45 past the hour | 14:03 |
| markwash | so, we are in feature freeze, as everyone knows | 14:03 |
| markwash | we can still fix bugs or tweak tests | 14:03 |
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| markwash | if there are any especially important bugs, please mark their priority accordingly and put them into the icehouse-rc1 | 14:04 |
| markwash | https://launchpad.net/glance/+milestone/icehouse-rc1 | 14:04 |
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| markwash | that's about it from me | 14:05 |
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| markwash | we have one agenda item otherwise so far | 14:05 |
| markwash | #topic vm template support | 14:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "vm template support (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:05 | |
| markwash | who will start us off on this topic? | 14:05 |
| arnaud | markwash: the deadline for rc1 is April 17th? | 14:05 |
| zhiyan | it's trying to figure out a way to make vm template support in glance, then nova could provision vm from it. | 14:06 |
| arnaud | or March 27th | 14:06 |
| arnaud | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Icehouse_Release_Schedule | 14:06 |
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| markwash | arnaud: ideally march 27th but there is a window in there for rc2/rc3 as needed | 14:07 |
| arnaud | got it | 14:07 |
| markwash | sorry zhiyan, go ahead | 14:07 |
| zhiyan | IMHO we can use existing location mechanism to implements it. i have wrote the whole design in the etherpad, like to know team's input/comments. | 14:08 |
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| markwash | it seems similar to what was being discussed around artifacts -> server templates | 14:10 |
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| markwash | I'm not sure I like putting more overloaded meanings into the existing image schema | 14:10 |
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| arnaud | I think the key point here is that for a template the location would redirect to a metadata file and not the actual image | 14:11 |
| zhiyan | probably artifacts could cover this case, but iiuc, current it's not clear | 14:11 |
| arnaud | it is supposed to be the case for ovf in the current implementation, but afaik ovf is not used anywhere | 14:11 |
| markwash | oh, also I might be mistaken. . are VM templates a specific technology? | 14:11 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: yes, but as we discussed, if artifacts does not support >1 bulks, the similar limitation will be happened as well | 14:11 |
| zhiyan | yes, hypervisor specified | 14:12 |
| arnaud | markwash: vmware specific at this point | 14:12 |
| arnaud | there is also for hyper-v | 14:12 |
| arnaud | for sure | 14:12 |
| arnaud | but it seems like it would be hard to find a representation that satisfies both | 14:13 |
| markwash | zhiyan: artifacts will definitely support >1 bulk data components I believe | 14:13 |
| markwash | it depends on the schema of the artifact type | 14:13 |
| zhiyan | markwash: ok. so do you think we should going to wait artifacts? and make template concept fit it? | 14:13 |
| ativelkov | by "bulk data components" you mean the binaries? | 14:13 |
| markwash | ativelkov: yup | 14:14 |
| ativelkov | As I see them - yes, they should | 14:14 |
| flwang | zhiyan: for short term, any known issue if we just leverage the multi location to implement the template? | 14:14 |
| arnaud | zhiyan: we could have VMwareTemplateArtifact, HyperVArtifact if both of them cannot be represented in 1 model | 14:14 |
| markwash | zhiyan: I think part of the motivation for artifacts is that its very hard to put all of these types of things in the same schema | 14:15 |
| markwash | disk images, vm templates, etc | 14:15 |
| ativelkov | However, the exact amount of them should be defined by the particular plugin | 14:15 |
| zhiyan | markwash: arnaud, ativelkov: seems we need a clear doc to know its details | 14:15 |
| markwash | it should give us the opportunity to expand out from a single type of object, while simultaneously increasing the clarity around each type of object | 14:16 |
| arnaud | +1 | 14:16 |
| zhiyan | is there a doc to introduce artifacts current design/shape? | 14:17 |
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| ativelkov | I am writing the API spec at apiary | 14:17 |
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| zhiyan | i'm ok if team like to go artifacts way. | 14:18 |
| markwash | so if we use locations for this, the idea is to have one location be the template metadata and other locations be any disk images that are needed? | 14:18 |
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| zhiyan | markwash: no. | 14:19 |
| flwang | markwash: I think there is no disk image | 14:19 |
| arnaud | flwang: there is *-flat.vmdk | 14:19 |
| zhiyan | markwash: all the location point to metadata | 14:19 |
| ativelkov | http://docs.artifacts.apiary.io | 14:19 |
| ativelkov | But it is still a work in progress | 14:19 |
| ativelkov | And I definetly have to update the FAQ page | 14:19 |
| flwang | arnaud: on glance side? | 14:19 |
| zhiyan | markwash: for vmware case, it's VMTX file | 14:19 |
| arnaud | oh sorry I meant in the template | 14:19 |
| zhiyan | but disk (vmdk) file | 14:19 |
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| flwang | arnaud: ok | 14:20 |
| rosmaita | fwiw, my opinion is artifacts: +1, locations: -1 | 14:20 |
| markwash | how could it work if there are no disk images? wouldn't a useful template refer to a disk image somewhere? | 14:20 |
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| arnaud | the metadata file refers to the disk markwash | 14:20 |
| zhiyan | markwash: under my idea, those disk files are already been stored in backend | 14:20 |
| arnaud | the vmware driver in nova can leverage the location of just having the *.vmtx afaik | 14:21 |
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| zhiyan | markwash: in vmware case, those vmdk files which belongs to template are all be pre-prepared in datastore | 14:21 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: yes, a handler | 14:21 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: oh, maybe not. we can do it in driver directly | 14:21 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: sorry, i mean leverage "clone" api | 14:22 |
| arnaud | zhiyan: yes | 14:22 |
| zhiyan | anyway, those functions will use standard glance api, leverage location information | 14:22 |
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| markwash | it seems like those image data references would do better living in the api than in a file you retrieve from the api | 14:22 |
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| hemanth | haha/win 41 | 14:23 |
| hemanth | oops | 14:23 |
| zhiyan | markwash: iiuc, this vm template case is very similar with current OVF case | 14:24 |
| arnaud | markwash: I think the question is also to know when we expect the artifacts to be implemented | 14:24 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: and how to be implemented | 14:24 |
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| ativelkov_web | sorry folks, my irc proxy suddenly died | 14:25 |
| arnaud | ativelkov_web: what is your timeframe for artifacts? | 14:26 |
| arnaud | you expect it to land in juno? | 14:26 |
| markwash | I guess it seems like supporting ova makes sense in the short term | 14:26 |
| markwash | but supporting other true template formats rather than container formats really conflicts with the artifacts approach | 14:26 |
| ativelkov_web | arnaud: yes | 14:26 |
| markwash | the goal of which is to make things like instance templates totally above-board, rather than hiding them down in the image format | 14:27 |
| ativelkov_web | In short-term I plan to complete the API spec draft by the mid of next week. Want to discuss it on the next meeting and start implementing | 14:27 |
| arnaud | ativelkov_web: I fear that there will be a lot more discussions than just a week | 14:28 |
| markwash | it is likely | 14:28 |
| ativelkov_web | arnaud: sure. I mean, it takes too long for the initial draft, so I want to complete it asap | 14:29 |
| ativelkov_web | Then the discussion will take what it takes | 14:29 |
| arnaud | ok ok | 14:29 |
| markwash | the issue with using a template as the image data is that when you delete the template, glance will not delete any of the underlying disks | 14:29 |
| markwash | e.g. | 14:29 |
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| zhiyan | ativelkov_web: thanks | 14:29 |
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| markwash | but I suppose I'm going a bit farther than is needed | 14:29 |
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| zhiyan | markwash: nod, it's valid point | 14:30 |
| zhiyan | markwash: and seems OVF has same "problem", for delete case | 14:30 |
| markwash | zhiyan: yes | 14:30 |
| flwang | markwash: so can the artifacts approach resolve this issue? | 14:31 |
| zhiyan | ok, np markwash, seems you like to see it wait a while? | 14:31 |
| markwash | flwang: yes, definitely | 14:31 |
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| markwash | jbernard was pursuing something along these lines | 14:31 |
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| zhiyan | tbh, i think probably we need a whole J cycle to make artifacts feature be stable.. | 14:32 |
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| markwash | that is most likely true | 14:32 |
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| ameade | +1, double whatever estimates we make | 14:32 |
| markwash | but I'm happier with waiting for a objects that are well defined vs overloading more possible meanings into Images | 14:32 |
| zhiyan | hmm..if so can we just try to do it by location approach first? (just a quick ask, not really sure for go that way) | 14:33 |
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| ativelkov_web | What I want is to have some MVP to work by the end of J | 14:33 |
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| ativelkov_web | so other projects may start using it | 14:33 |
| rosmaita | zhiyan: -1 locations for this | 14:33 |
| zhiyan | rosmaita: noticed | 14:34 |
| rosmaita | :) | 14:34 |
| markwash | yeah I don't want to see locations used for this either | 14:34 |
| markwash | I'm not sure locations can even help us with multiple formats at this point | 14:34 |
| zhiyan | rosmaita: anyway actually i think even it be there (with location way), the result just like OVF, not a big deal | 14:34 |
| markwash | the images resource that locations live in just prevents it, it cannot be extended in this way | 14:34 |
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| zhiyan | and artifacts can make it again if we like, by a plugin iiuc | 14:35 |
| markwash | zhiyan: I guess I was not aware we were using ovf quite in this manner | 14:35 |
| zhiyan | ok, i got it. | 14:35 |
| arnaud | markwash: I don't think the ovf container format is used in nova | 14:36 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: yes, it's sure currently | 14:36 |
| arnaud | ova will be in Juno for the vmware driver | 14:36 |
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| markwash | ova and ovf are different though in terms of how the disks are stored, correct? | 14:38 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: ova is cool, but i think a key situation is that there are a lot of vm template in customer's exist deployment. | 14:38 |
| markwash | let's take this offline as needed, I think we've reached a conclusion for the moment | 14:38 |
| markwash | #topic open discussion | 14:38 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: glance)" | 14:38 | |
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| zhiyan | markwash: seems glance v2 stuff in nova is turning to a big blocker for us.. | 14:40 |
| markwash | yes, our deprecation plans are back quite a bit now | 14:41 |
| zhiyan | markwash: it failed our all interesting stuff | 14:41 |
| markwash | though I suppose that with the way the nova v2/v3 discussion is going perhaps we should revisit the plan | 14:41 |
| zhiyan | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/use-glance-v2-api | 14:42 |
| zhiyan | i'd like to do some works for that, to make it landing asap | 14:42 |
| ameade | markwash: is the way that is going is to hold off on v3? | 14:43 |
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| arnaud | zhiyan: +1! | 14:44 |
| markwash | that was the sense that I got but I kinda dropped off the thread after the 100th message | 14:44 |
| zhiyan | arnaud: he | 14:44 |
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| ameade | markwash: i think it's good for us to pay attention to how hard it is to change versions across the board | 14:45 |
| markwash | yeah | 14:45 |
| markwash | and to think about all the client libraries out there in the world :-/ | 14:45 |
| ameade | heh yeah | 14:45 |
| flwang | markwash: so how about just combine all the client library like I mentioned with you? | 14:46 |
| flwang | markwash: and hide the difference between api version in the common library | 14:46 |
| flwang | for now and future | 14:46 |
| ameade | zhiyan: we should ask esheffie1d what the status is on that, shouldn't be too far off | 14:46 |
| zhiyan | ameade: yes, but i already synced up with him on my morning | 14:47 |
| markwash | flwang: I think that's an important strategy | 14:47 |
| markwash | I was also thinking of jclouds which I've been having to use recently | 14:47 |
| markwash | anyway, I have to go catch a bus | 14:47 |
| markwash | thanks everybody | 14:47 |
| flwang | markwash: yep, but if it's right, why not? | 14:47 |
| zhiyan | ameade: actually i have already put two "pull-request" patchs there, to follow his current change. | 14:47 |
| markwash | thanks zhiyan for the discussion | 14:47 |
| markwash | #endmeeting | 14:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:47 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 13 14:47:51 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:47 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2014/glance.2014-03-13-14.01.html | 14:47 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2014/glance.2014-03-13-14.01.txt | 14:47 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/glance/2014/glance.2014-03-13-14.01.log.html | 14:47 |
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| bswartz1 | is anyone here? | 15:05 |
| xyang1 | hi | 15:05 |
| vponomaryov | yes | 15:05 |
| shamail | Yes sir. | 15:05 |
| bswartz1 | I seem to be having technical difficulties | 15:05 |
| vponomaryov | hi | 15:05 |
| bswartz1 | I've been trying to start the meeting for 5 minutes with no luck | 15:05 |
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| bswartz1 | I think my packets were getting eaten | 15:05 |
| bswartz1 | and i couldn't see anything anyone was saying | 15:06 |
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| bswartz1 | my old nick should timeout in a moment | 15:06 |
| yportnova | hi | 15:06 |
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| bswartz | #startmeeting manila | 15:07 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 13 15:07:25 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is bswartz. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:07 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:07 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'manila' | 15:07 |
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| bswartz | there we go | 15:07 |
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| csaba | hi | 15:07 |
| Scottda_mobile | Hi | 15:07 |
| bswartz | okay sorry we're starting late -- it was an IRC server problem | 15:08 |
| rraja | hi | 15:08 |
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| bswartz | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/ManilaMeetings | 15:08 |
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| bswartz | ignore the first item | 15:08 |
| bswartz | the activate stuff is being merged | 15:09 |
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| bswartz | csaba: do you have update on the image? | 15:09 |
| bswartz | #topic manila generic driver service vm image | 15:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "manila generic driver service vm image (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:09 | |
| bswartz | csaba: or is this agenda item out of date? | 15:10 |
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| csaba | bswartz: yep we got finally a working setup with the ubuntu image courtesy of vponomaryov | 15:11 |
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| csaba | now we are sorting out how to adjust cirros to the expected behavior | 15:11 |
| bswartz | yeah I know about the ubuntu image, and I'm glad to have that | 15:11 |
| bswartz | are we close to having a cirros-derived image though | 15:11 |
| bswartz | for the purpose of tempest testing it's important to have a lightweight image | 15:12 |
| csaba | we've seen to have a lot of refinements going into devstack integration, that really helped! | 15:12 |
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| csaba | yes I think we are close to it | 15:13 |
| bswartz | cool | 15:13 |
| bswartz | anything to discuss on that? do you need any help? | 15:13 |
| csaba | rraja just has a prognostisation of geting it working by Monday, I'm a bit more cautious than to tell dates :) | 15:13 |
| bswartz | heh okay | 15:14 |
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| bswartz | #topic modularization of the generic driver | 15:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "modularization of the generic driver (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:14 | |
| csaba | well the instumentation is heavily ubuntuistic, probably we could make it more generic.. but that will be the cleanup part | 15:14 |
| xyang1 | csaba: are we running nfs-kernel-server on a VM from this cirros image? | 15:15 |
| bswartz | this came up yesterday and I though we might talk about it briefly | 15:15 |
| csaba | xyang1: yes | 15:15 |
| csaba | that's what we are to do | 15:15 |
| xyang1 | csaba: thanks | 15:15 |
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| bswartz | csaba: what about ganesha-nfs support in the cirros image? is that something we're going to punt on so people will have to use something different? | 15:16 |
| csaba | that would be the next step | 15:17 |
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| bswartz | okay well let's not hold up anything for ganesha support | 15:17 |
| bswartz | I'd rather have an image that only works with nfs-kernel-server than wait | 15:17 |
| bswartz | but ganesha support is clearly worth doing soon afterwards | 15:18 |
| bswartz | okay so xyang1 brought up modularization yesterday | 15:18 |
| bswartz | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/74154/ | 15:18 |
| xyang1 | csaba: for a backend to work with nfs-ganesha, is it required for us to make changes in the nfs-ganesha project itself? | 15:18 |
| bswartz | pleaser review this change | 15:18 |
| csaba | xyang1: ATM I don't see now a need for that, we'll see | 15:19 |
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| csaba | bswartz: sorry, should have done / will do | 15:20 |
| bswartz | okay so general dev status | 15:20 |
| bswartz | #topic dev status | 15:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "dev status (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:20 | |
| xyang1 | csaba: I thought there were code changes from glusterfs in the nfs-ganesha project for it to work with nfs-ganesha, but I can be wrong | 15:20 |
| bswartz | vponomaryov | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | Dev status: | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | 1) NetApp Cmode driver: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/59100/ | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | Unittest refactor is in progress. Expected to be updated today. | 15:21 |
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| vponomaryov | 2) Generic driver's modularity: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/74154/ | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | Ready for merge. If no one has any objections, then can be merged. | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | 3) Tempest job for manila and python-manilaclient projects | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | Now, we have devstack installation with generic driver and tempest tests in one job - gate-manila-tempest-dsvm-neutron | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | For 'manila' project - CLI and API tests (~150) | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | For 'manilaclient' project - CLI tests (29) | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | It fails for now due to little bug with exceeding of resources, fix for infra project has been commited - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79867/ | 15:21 |
| vponomaryov | Code for tempest stored in manila as plugin: https://github.com/stackforge/manila/tree/master/contrib/tempest | 15:21 |
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| vponomaryov | TODO: | 15:22 |
| vponomaryov | 1) Make drivers (Generic, Cmode) use activation/deactivation API | 15:22 |
| vponomaryov | - generic driver depends on merge of modularity commit - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/74154/ | 15:22 |
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| vponomaryov | 2) (generic driver) Change service instance connectivity directly to private subnet | 15:22 |
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| vponomaryov | 3) Update Horizon extension for Manila due to API changes, bugfixing | 15:22 |
| vponomaryov | 4) Implement volume types server side | 15:22 |
| vponomaryov | 5) Implement quota for activation of share-networks | 15:22 |
| vponomaryov | thats all | 15:23 |
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| bswartz | vponomaryov: ty! | 15:23 |
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| bswartz | I have yet to review the modularization change, I'll do that soon | 15:24 |
| bswartz | the rest looks like it's on track | 15:24 |
| rraja | vponmaryov: could you talk more on 2) (generic driver) Change service instance connectivity directly to private subnet? | 15:25 |
| bswartz | vponomaryov: are you working on the "Change service instance connectivity directly to private subnet" thing? | 15:25 |
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| vponomaryov | bswartz: No, not exactly me | 15:26 |
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| bswartz | do you have a sense of how much work that is? | 15:26 |
| vponomaryov | rraja: now driver uses router | 15:26 |
| bswartz | rraja: you know that right now the generic driver connects to the tenant network across a router, right? | 15:26 |
| rraja | bswartz: yes :) | 15:27 |
| bswartz | rraja: we agreed we wanted to change is to connect directly to tenant network like the hardware-based drivers do | 15:27 |
| vponomaryov | bswartz: sorry, don't have estimate for this | 15:27 |
| bswartz | the main argument is for consistency | 15:27 |
| bswartz | I've heard arguments that using a virtual router may be better though so we can discuss that if anyone is opposed | 15:28 |
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| rraja | bswartz: but there weren't there issues with direct connectivity and that's the reason we opted for the router? | 15:28 |
| bswartz | vponomaryov: the main reason I brought it up is because I think the horizon changes are higher priority | 15:28 |
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| bswartz | rraja: there were, but found a workaround I believe | 15:29 |
| bswartz | we* found a workaround | 15:29 |
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| rraja | bswartz: which was/is ? | 15:29 |
| vponomaryov | bswartz: I see, activation wil laffect horizon | 15:29 |
| vponomaryov | we can postpone it | 15:30 |
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| vponomaryov | if needed | 15:30 |
| bswartz | yportnova: do you know the answer? | 15:30 |
| yportnova | bswartz: can not give the estimate now | 15:31 |
| bswartz | yportnova: no, about what the plan is to connect the generic driver directly to tenant network | 15:31 |
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| bswartz | yportnova: it was one of your peers who figured out a solution for that | 15:31 |
| yportnova | bswartz: aostapenko was reasarching this connectivity issue. I do not have information right now | 15:32 |
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| bswartz | okay we should probably capture that in a BP | 15:34 |
| bswartz | thanks yportnova | 15:34 |
| bswartz | #topic Discussion on service VM role for generic driver and other (hypothetical) multitenant drivers | 15:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discussion on service VM role for generic driver and other (hypothetical) multitenant drivers (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:35 | |
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| bswartz | csaba: did you have more you wanted to say about this | 15:35 |
| csaba | bswartz: not at the moment | 15:36 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: so once the modulization change is reviewed and merged, we are ready for adding multitenancy support through a gateway driver? | 15:36 |
| bswartz | okay there was another item on the meeting agenda -- I guess I need to clean up the agenda better from week to week | 15:36 |
| bswartz | xyang1: yeah that's the next step | 15:37 |
| bswartz | given how much there is to do I'm not sure if that will get tacked before the conference | 15:38 |
| bswartz | I hope we can make progress on it, but I expect we can have some discussions about it in Atlanta | 15:38 |
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| bswartz | we'll be having at least one more unconference session on manila, maybe a few if we have enough interest and thing to discuss | 15:39 |
| bswartz | this is on top of the regular conference sessions on manila | 15:39 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: you mean we may not be able to finish adding multitenancy support for drivers that need gateway service? | 15:39 |
| bswartz | the unconference sessions will be more like design-summit sessions | 15:40 |
| bswartz | xyang1: I'm saying that unless someone steps up to complete the work it may take a while | 15:40 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: ok, thanks | 15:41 |
| bswartz | the focus is primarily on drivers for hardware which has native multitenancy support | 15:41 |
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| bswartz | because that's something we know we can do well | 15:41 |
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| bswartz | #topic open discussion | 15:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: manila)" | 15:42 | |
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| bswartz | anyone have anything else to discuss for today | 15:42 |
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| xyang1 | bswartz: when will we know whether the Manila session is selected | 15:42 |
| bswartz | does anyone know when voting on conf sessions ends and the winners are announced? | 15:43 |
| bswartz | xyang1: what I can tell you is that there _will_ be a session, but it's more of a questions of how many | 15:44 |
| xyang1 | bswartz: ok | 15:44 |
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| bswartz | okay thanks everyone | 15:44 |
| xyang1 | thanks | 15:45 |
| vponomaryov | thanks | 15:45 |
| shamail | Thanks, take care | 15:45 |
| rraja | thanks | 15:45 |
| bswartz | #endmeeting | 15:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:45 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 13 15:45:21 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:45 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/manila/2014/manila.2014-03-13-15.07.html | 15:45 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/manila/2014/manila.2014-03-13-15.07.txt | 15:45 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/manila/2014/manila.2014-03-13-15.07.log.html | 15:45 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | hey savanna/sahara folks | 18:03 |
| crobertsrh | Hi | 18:03 |
| alazarev | o/ | 18:03 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #startmeeting sahara | 18:04 |
| elmiko | hi | 18:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 13 18:04:15 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SergeyLukjanov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: sahara)" | 18:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'sahara' | 18:04 |
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| aignatov | o/ | 18:04 |
| SergeyLukjanov | yeah, I've typed sahara, not savanna! | 18:04 |
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| mattf | sav^hhara | 18:04 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/SaharaAgenda | 18:05 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #topic News / updates | 18:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "News / updates (Meeting topic: sahara)" | 18:05 | |
| SergeyLukjanov | folks, please | 18:05 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #info graduation review tc meeting logs http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-11-20.03.html | 18:06 |
| tmckay | I think the client renaming is done | 18:06 |
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| crobertsrh | Mostly renaming activities for sahara-dashboard with occasional touchpoints on the other projects. Getting closer to done. | 18:06 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #info there are no concerns raised on tc meeting, waiting for voting | 18:06 |
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| mattf | waiting waiting waiting | 18:06 |
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| ErikB2 | Good progress on AMBARI-1783. Will plan to incorporate into HDP plugin once GA. | 18:06 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, yeah | 18:07 |
| aignatov | actually I was 5 day off this week but started to rename main savanna service | 18:07 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, voting next week? | 18:07 |
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| tmckay | aignatov, I can help you if you need it | 18:07 |
| mattf | ErikB2, are you removing puppet in that same effort? | 18:07 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, technically, it's already started, but looks like tc folks waiting for review from ttx | 18:07 |
| ErikB2 | The last TC meeting was pretty smooth (compare that to the incubation meeting, jeesh) | 18:07 |
| ruhe | couldn't be smoother | 18:08 |
| aignatov | tmckay: ok, we have a questions about backward compat | 18:08 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, yup, the awosome progress | 18:08 |
| mattf | it was amazingly smooth | 18:08 |
| alazarev | I've added support of multi-regions (on review, but for J) and added integration tests for IDH 3.0.2 (on review as well) | 18:08 |
| SergeyLukjanov | awesome* | 18:08 |
| ErikB2 | mattf, not in the same motion, that will happen later (or not by us) | 18:08 |
| mattf | maybe they were tired from beating up on DinaBelova | 18:08 |
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| alazarev | or were preparing to neutron :) | 18:09 |
| ErikB2 | aignatov, once heat becomes the default provisioning engine, will the Nova stuff still be there, or will that be removed? | 18:09 |
| aignatov | mattf: no, it's because our excellent work since incubation | 18:09 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, ++ | 18:09 |
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| mattf | aignatov, that certainly didn't hurt | 18:09 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, depends on feature parity, but the plan is to remove it in J | 18:10 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | any other news? | 18:10 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, I would vote to not remove. | 18:10 |
| aignatov | ErikB2: I'll do my best to apply nova for heat, actually there are some bugs/bps in heat which can help tightly integrate heat engine with both neutron-nova | 18:10 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, why? | 18:11 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, there are some distros out there that have chosen not to include heat. | 18:11 |
| mattf | removing isn't unreasonable, so long as we have feature parity | 18:11 |
| * mattf hmmmmms | 18:11 | |
| aignatov | guys, actually there are no huge efforts to be done to include nova with heat, really | 18:11 |
| SergeyLukjanov | it's integrated project, I think all distros will include it eventually | 18:11 |
| SergeyLukjanov | it's a big question for us for summit / Juno about removing/keeping direct engine | 18:12 |
| SergeyLukjanov | let's move on now | 18:12 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #topic Project naming status | 18:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Project naming status (Meeting topic: sahara)" | 18:12 | |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, I agree eventually that will happen, but it makes it impossible to use Savanna on anything w/out Heat. | 18:12 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #info all repos / lp projects / wiki spaces / teams / groups / mls / etc has been removed | 18:13 |
| mattf | ErikB2, this may be the first real upstream/downstream conflict. is the distro supporting sahara? | 18:13 |
| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov: there are still 3 minor issues on the wiki, 2 on Sahara/How_To_Release, 1 on Sahara/BugTriage | 18:14 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #info gate is now blocked, I'm working on unblocking it | 18:14 |
| SergeyLukjanov | elmiko, it's on me, I remember | 18:14 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #info savanna-ci is now quite broken too (neutron issue) | 18:14 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I hope it'll be fixed tomorrow ^^ | 18:14 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | currently we collected a lot of CRs for renaming | 18:15 |
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| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov: as for sahara-image-elements, it's been merged but we are waiting on a HortonWorks rename for the hadoop-swift image before we can eliminate all references to savanna | 18:15 |
| SergeyLukjanov | elmiko, great | 18:15 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I'll start merging some CRs when see gate working correctly and notify all team members about it | 18:16 |
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| aignatov | I'd prefer to merge all sahara main patches only WITH savanna-ci's +1 | 18:16 |
| tmckay | aignatov, ++ | 18:16 |
| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, sure, we shouldn't brake own project :) | 18:16 |
| tmckay | I am putting my trust in ci for thos | 18:16 |
| aignatov | yesterday I sent patch for renaming swift-edp configs and now it fight with me: I can't understand - is it my patch introduce some bugs or intermittent issues with ci | 18:17 |
| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, I'm afraid that neutron isn't working atm on savanna-ci | 18:17 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I'll check it after the meeting | 18:18 |
| NikitaKonovalov | dashboard tests are giving -1 now due to an old image in a testing lab | 18:18 |
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| tmckay | aignatov, so, how will hadoop itself be fixed? Doesn't the ".savanna" part of the url get handled in hadoop? Or am I wrong? | 18:18 |
| tmckay | for swift, I mean | 18:18 |
| SergeyLukjanov | NikitaKonovalov, and so it was tested manually by aignatov and NikitaKonovalov | 18:18 |
| NikitaKonovalov | that will go away when nodepool rebuilds the snapshot | 18:18 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | tmckay, it's about backward compat, next topic | 18:19 |
| SergeyLukjanov | any thoughts on renaming except backward compat? | 18:19 |
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| aignatov | tmckay: ".savanna" is handled in hadoop but just renaming to any word should work I hoped | 18:19 |
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| aignatov | I mean there is no hardcode ".savanna" in hadoop-swift.jar | 18:19 |
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| aignatov | only in openstack/savanna | 18:20 |
| tmckay | aignatov, ah, okay. I wasn't sure how that happened. Nice. | 18:20 |
| SergeyLukjanov | sahara* | 18:20 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #topic Backward compatibility for renaming | 18:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Backward compatibility for renaming (Meeting topic: sahara)" | 18:20 | |
| tmckay | we need to put bitcoins in a jar every time someone says savanna :) | 18:20 |
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| elmiko | lol | 18:20 |
| mattf | lol | 18:20 |
| SergeyLukjanov | :) | 18:21 |
| SergeyLukjanov | so, let's discuss backward compat | 18:21 |
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| aignatov | tmckay: the latest savanna-ci run show me that edp works at least in vanilla but in HDP it didn't go to SUCCEEDED :( | 18:21 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | note: we already break it several times in Icehouse cycle (API, client) | 18:21 |
| aignatov | and IDH went to Error...RRRRR | 18:21 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | note: we introduced migrations in I, so, no way to migrate from 0.3 to Icehouse | 18:22 |
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| tmckay | aignatov, hmmm. do you want help debugging? | 18:22 |
| mattf | do we all agree that compat becomes of paramount importance once we've graduated? | 18:22 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | note: it's a good practice to squash migrations for release to one migration "icehouse_release" | 18:22 |
| aignatov | SergeyLukjanov: I'd prefer to forget about compatibility :) | 18:22 |
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| tmckay | I have my trusty laptop, which is easy to run integration tests on :) | 18:22 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, ++ | 18:23 |
| tmckay | mattf, ++ | 18:23 |
| dmitryme | mattf, agree | 18:23 |
| elmiko | mattf, +1 | 18:23 |
| aignatov | tmckay: it would be great, especially EDP+not vanilla | 18:23 |
| crobertsrh | yes | 18:23 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, in case of graduation, Juno will be our first integrated release and so, we'll need to keep backward compat after it | 18:23 |
| mattf | if we decide compat isn't important w/ this rename then we should not even pretend -- we should not have a savannaclient at all, only saharaclient | 18:23 |
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| elmiko | mattf, what is the scope of breaking backward compat? | 18:24 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, yup, just use them for transition and then remove | 18:24 |
| mattf | it's worse to provide a savannaclient that breaks api than it is to provide no attempt at compat | 18:24 |
| tmckay | aignatov, okay. I've never successfully run one of the plugins locally on Fedora, but now is maybe the time to try (or get a RHEL box) | 18:24 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, agreed | 18:24 |
| ErikB2 | mattf, +1 | 18:24 |
| tmckay | mattf, ++, all or nothing, absolutely | 18:24 |
| mattf | elmiko, that's a good question. the api is an easy answer, but i don't think that's a complete answer. | 18:24 |
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| elmiko | mattf, i agree about providing a broken savannaclient worse than no compat | 18:25 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #startvote No backward compat for renaming? Yes, No, Abstain | 18:25 |
| openstack | Begin voting on: No backward compat for renaming? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain. | 18:25 |
| openstack | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | 18:25 |
| SergeyLukjanov | to have it in logs | 18:25 |
| mattf | hold up | 18:25 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, ? | 18:26 |
| mattf | what's the motivation for psuedo-compat savannaclient? | 18:26 |
| dmitryme | #vote yes | 18:26 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, you said somethng about "transition" - what's the motivation and scope for that transition | 18:26 |
| tmckay | elmiko, some existing objects in the savanna db might fail after upgrade | 18:26 |
| tmckay | elmiko, strings that contain savanna (bitcoin) | 18:26 |
| alazarev | #vote yes | 18:26 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, only to go through the gate | 18:26 |
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| dmitryme | am, I thought we are not going to keep savannaclient | 18:27 |
| dmitryme | only saharaclient | 18:27 |
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| elmiko | tmckay, wouldn't we want to catch those and upgrade them asap? | 18:27 |
| dmitryme | SergeyLukjanov: so once gate issues resolved, we will drop it, right? | 18:27 |
| alazarev | savannaclient < 0.5 should exist | 18:27 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, because of circular dependency between sahara / sahara-client / devstack / devstack-gate / tempest | 18:27 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, so we either have a single commit we force through the gate or we have a commit that passes the gate and a second commit that removes the compat? | 18:27 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, the second option | 18:27 |
| SergeyLukjanov | dmitryme, yu[ | 18:27 |
| tmckay | elmiko, well, to catch them means an alembic database migration script. To have 0 backward compat means, they fail. | 18:28 |
| NikitaKonovalov | #vote abstain | 18:28 |
| tmckay | Make a new database | 18:28 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, those are the 2 options though? | 18:28 |
| elmiko | tmckay, got it | 18:28 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, it'll make us able to always pass CI | 18:28 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, I mean that we'll "we have a commit that passes the gate and a second commit that removes the compat" | 18:28 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #vote yes | 18:28 |
| sreshetnyak | #vote yes | 18:28 |
| ruhe | #vote yes | 18:29 |
| crobertsrh | #vote abstain | 18:29 |
| mattf | related to this is if we should just scrap all db migrations, after renaming just have folks recreate their db --- no compat | 18:29 |
| elmiko | #vote abstain | 18:29 |
| * mattf feels very railroaded | 18:29 | |
| tmckay | mattf, that is a good question. | 18:29 |
| mattf | it's not clear to me that we understand the scope of what we're voting on | 18:29 |
| tmckay | does a no kill the vote? | 18:29 |
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| elmiko | mattf, i know i don't... | 18:30 |
| crobertsrh | I agree that perhaps I'm just not clear enough to make a yes vote out of me. | 18:30 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | we're voting to not keep backward compat, we could discuss details separately | 18:30 |
| SergeyLukjanov | such as migrations | 18:30 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I can close it and we'll vote after discussing details | 18:30 |
| tmckay | I think I would at least endorse migrations. It's painless. | 18:30 |
| mattf | if we vote to do no compat that means we don't provide migrations | 18:31 |
| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov: i like the idea of killing backward compat, but i really don't know the scope of that decision well enough | 18:31 |
| SergeyLukjanov | tmckay, I don't like data manipulations inside the migrations | 18:31 |
| mattf | we can't do a blanket vote and then piecemeal details. | 18:31 |
| tmckay | having to dump a database because of code change is really, really bad form. I used to make users do it in another project, until I fixed it :) | 18:31 |
| mattf | cant/shouldnt | 18:31 |
| SergeyLukjanov | tmckay, we'll need to have a good tests for it | 18:31 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, it's about overall approach | 18:32 |
| tmckay | SergeyLukjanov, ack | 18:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #closevote | 18:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #endvote | 18:32 |
| openstack | Voted on "No backward compat for renaming?" Results are | 18:32 |
| openstack | Yes (5): ruhe, alazarev, dmitryme, SergeyLukjanov, sreshetnyak | 18:32 |
| openstack | Abstain (3): NikitaKonovalov, elmiko, crobertsrh | 18:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #undo | 18:32 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Vote object at 0x2b43490> | 18:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #undo | 18:32 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Topic object at 0x2ab63d0> | 18:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #topic Backward compatibility for renaming | 18:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Backward compatibility for renaming (Meeting topic: sahara)" | 18:32 | |
| mattf | what are the specific areas where compat is in question? | 18:32 |
| ErikB2 | API | 18:33 |
| aignatov | savanna-db | 18:33 |
| mattf | we have client, we have db, ui urls | 18:33 |
| tmckay | EDP database objects | 18:33 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #1 migrations for .savanna suffix and savanna-db prefix | 18:33 |
| aignatov | savanna_url | 18:33 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, API isn't changed | 18:33 |
| mattf | savanna_use_neutron etc...config | 18:33 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, property names will | 18:33 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #2 configs like SAVANNA_USE_NEUTRON in dashboard | 18:33 |
| ErikB2 | Also Swift | 18:33 |
| aignatov | .savanna in Swift, yes | 18:34 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, aignatov, it's #1 that I mentioned | 18:34 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, yez | 18:34 |
| aignatov | but I don't know how to test all it today | 18:34 |
| tmckay | The "savanna_url" param in the Client.__init__() method. | 18:34 |
| SergeyLukjanov | personally, I think that it's useless to keep #2 old-named configs | 18:34 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, let's build the list first | 18:35 |
| SergeyLukjanov | tmckay, we've agreed that there is no need to keep savannaclient, so, there is no need to keep savanna_url in saharaclient | 18:35 |
| mattf | what i'd give for a notepad | 18:35 |
| ErikB2 | SergeyLukjanov, I agree. I would like to see us move forward with as little baggage as possible | 18:35 |
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| tmckay | SergeyLukjanov, ack | 18:35 |
| * SergeyLukjanov creating an etherpad to list options | 18:35 | |
| SergeyLukjanov | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/savanna-renaming-backward-compat | 18:36 |
| mattf | API (payloads), savanna-db, EDP db obks, client (modules and api), config (e.g. SAVANNA_URL etc) | 18:36 |
| aignatov | guys, the most important thins that there is no much time to do good backward-compat code since release is coming | 18:36 |
| mattf | API (payloads), savanna-db, EDP db objs, client (modules and api), config (e.g. SAVANNA_URL etc) | 18:36 |
| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, agreed, and additionally, it sounds useless due to the fact that Icehouse is our first aligned release | 18:37 |
| mattf | API (payloads), savanna-db, EDP db objs, client (modules and api), config (e.g. SAVANNA_URL etc), swift integration | 18:37 |
| dmitryme | aignatov: I think people want to have a clear view of what we will miss if we drop compatibility | 18:37 |
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| mattf | anything missing from ^^? | 18:37 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, please, add to the etherpdad | 18:37 |
| mattf | sure | 18:37 |
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| aignatov | mattf: docs with cleat description | 18:38 |
| aignatov | *clear | 18:38 |
| aignatov | I mean if we'll keep compat we should add notes to all compat points, we need to describe that here you can use savanna_url and sahara_url as well | 18:39 |
| aignatov | just for example | 18:39 |
| aignatov | it's time | 18:39 |
| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, and we'll need to remove this compat anyway | 18:39 |
| SergeyLukjanov | to continue improving project | 18:39 |
| bob_nettleton | elmiko, regarding the savanna-image-elements change you mentioned earlier, can you be more specific about "we are waiting on a HortonWorks rename for the hadoop-swift image before we can eliminate all references to savanna" ? What exactly needs to be changed? | 18:41 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, what's the REST API payloads? | 18:41 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, the json prop names ErikB2 mentioned | 18:41 |
| mattf | e.g. tags | 18:41 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, Image Regitry | 18:41 |
| SergeyLukjanov | I'll add a separated point for it | 18:41 |
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| mattf | k | 18:42 |
| elmiko | bob_nettleton: in the file elements/hadoop-hdp/source-repository-hadoopswift, the link to the hortonworks s3 contains a savanna dir name. that's it | 18:42 |
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| bob_nettleton | elmiko, ok, thanks for clarifying this. | 18:42 |
| elmiko | bob_nettleton: np :) | 18:42 |
| aignatov | so what would be our final decision about compatibility? | 18:43 |
| mattf | configuration, python client, rest api, all database storage, documentation | 18:43 |
| mattf | ^^ my high level summary | 18:43 |
| SergeyLukjanov | documentation seems strange in this list | 18:44 |
| mattf | a decision for no compat will essentially mean you cannot upgrade across the rename | 18:44 |
| mattf | you'll have to create your db | 18:44 |
| mattf | update all your scripts to use new names | 18:44 |
| mattf | handle any diff in rest calls | 18:44 |
| mattf | use new configuration | 18:44 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, yeah, but it's true | 18:44 |
| mattf | am i missing anything? | 18:44 |
| SergeyLukjanov | the latest released savanna version is 0.3 and you already need to do all stuff mattf mentions | 18:44 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, yup, but now we're part of openstack. we should at least go into the decision with all the relevant information. | 18:45 |
| mattf | i'm not advocating either way atm. i just want us to make an informed decision | 18:45 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, sure | 18:45 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, I'm not against this discussion | 18:45 |
| mattf | let's give it another minute to see if anyone thinks of something missing from the list | 18:46 |
| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov, mattf, what is the downside to carrying backward compat into Icehouse and the removing before the next major release? | 18:46 |
| mattf | elmiko, it's not clear that we currently have a mandate to maintain compat and it's a lot of work | 18:46 |
| alazarev | mattf: but I don't see other options, adding compat will take a lot of efforts | 18:46 |
| SergeyLukjanov | elmiko, we'll need weeks of coding and testing to make it | 18:47 |
| aignatov | one missed point is new tests, I mean if we want to keep compat we need to write more tests around that | 18:47 |
| elmiko | got it, thanks | 18:47 |
| mattf | ok, sounds like we agree that the list is complete enough | 18:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | and it's not clear for me what's the starting point for such backward compat - 0.3 or mid Icehouse | 18:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, + urls in UI probably is a bit important too | 18:48 |
| mattf | ErikB2, no compat may have the biggest impact on you. what's your opinion? | 18:48 |
| aignatov | SergeyLukjanov: it seems that 0.3 is already lost :) | 18:48 |
| ErikB2 | mattf, perhaps, but my vote would be for no compat until start of juno | 18:48 |
| aignatov | I remember one my patch that breaks.... hmm...ok... I will silent | 18:49 |
| mattf | ErikB2, ok | 18:49 |
| alazarev | aignatov: it breaks even working 0.3 now :) | 18:49 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ErikB2, ++ | 18:49 |
| mattf | and it's been raised a number of times that compat is very expensive right now | 18:49 |
| aignatov | alazarev: psst, silence | 18:50 |
| aignatov | xD | 18:50 |
| mattf | SergeyLukjanov, and we agree that our mandate for compat really starts after integration? | 18:50 |
| SergeyLukjanov | the backward compat is veey important starting from Juno release, especially API compat | 18:50 |
| SergeyLukjanov | mattf, first integrated release I think | 18:50 |
| aignatov | mattf: ++ | 18:50 |
| alazarev | +1 on starting compat from I release | 18:50 |
| mattf | anyone have any questions about what we're voting on when we say no compat? | 18:50 |
| aignatov | +1 on start compat from Icehouse, yes | 18:51 |
| crobertsrh | Nope, I feel better about voting now | 18:51 |
| SergeyLukjanov | there is a diff between starting from I release vs. starting from J (first integrated release) | 18:51 |
| elmiko | mattf, we vote "yes" for no compat? | 18:51 |
| SergeyLukjanov | so, any thoughts on I vs. J? | 18:51 |
| aignatov | so I vote "yes" for no compat as well | 18:51 |
| alazarev | SergeyLukjanov: you mean I release, or I start? | 18:51 |
| mattf | elmiko, i'm just curious if there are any more questions before we vote | 18:51 |
| elmiko | mattf, none from me, i feel better about the scope now | 18:52 |
| alazarev | SergeyLukjanov: or mid | 18:52 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ok, let's re-word | 18:52 |
| SergeyLukjanov | would we like to have migrations and other compat stuff from Icehouse tag to Juno tag | 18:52 |
| tmckay | "icehouse can break everything" --- reworded :) | 18:52 |
| SergeyLukjanov | or starting from Juno tag (potentially first integrated release) | 18:52 |
| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov: what do you mean by integration release? | 18:53 |
| SergeyLukjanov | integrated release is the first release being the integrated project | 18:53 |
| SergeyLukjanov | with sync gate | 18:53 |
| SergeyLukjanov | and etc. | 18:53 |
| alazarev | let's define compat-start point, everything before it is not upgradable | 18:53 |
| elmiko | that means integrated into full openstack? | 18:53 |
| SergeyLukjanov | elmiko, it means that we'll graduate from incubation and release | 18:54 |
| elmiko | SergeyLukjanov: ok, understood ty | 18:54 |
| mattf | alazarev, +1 | 18:54 |
| SergeyLukjanov | elmiko, Juno is the first release when we could be part of | 18:54 |
| aignatov | will we vote today again? | 18:54 |
| SergeyLukjanov | aignatov, yep | 18:54 |
| aignatov | 5 mins left | 18:54 |
| * elmiko still getting up to speed on terminology | 18:54 | |
| mattf | elmiko, it's a little funky | 18:55 |
| alazarev | SergeyLukjanov: do you mean j-1? | 18:55 |
| SergeyLukjanov | alazarev, nope | 18:55 |
| SergeyLukjanov | dev releases are dev releases :) | 18:55 |
| alazarev | SergeyLukjanov: sahara release at time of I release (non-integrated)? | 18:55 |
| aignatov | lets move this topic to some design session and discuss all rules about compatibility | 18:56 |
| SergeyLukjanov | let's vote for not keeping backward compat for renaming | 18:56 |
| mattf | ack | 18:56 |
| SergeyLukjanov | and than decide the start point for keeping full backwark compat | 18:56 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | #startvote Should we keep backward compat for renaming? Yes, No, Abstain | 18:56 |
| openstack | Begin voting on: Should we keep backward compat for renaming? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain. | 18:56 |
| openstack | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | 18:56 |
| mattf | aignatov, alazarev, it may be easier to just define a date when we start maintaining compat | 18:56 |
| mattf | #vote no | 18:57 |
| crobertsrh | #vote no | 18:57 |
| elmiko | #voite no | 18:57 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #vote no | 18:57 |
| elmiko | #vote no | 18:57 |
| dmitryme | #vote no | 18:57 |
| ErikB2 | #vote no | 18:57 |
| aignatov | #vote no | 18:57 |
| tmckay | #vote no | 18:57 |
| sreshetnyak | #vote no | 18:57 |
| NikitaKonovalov | #vote no | 18:57 |
| ErikB2 | *expecting mattf to vote for himself* | 18:58 |
| mattf | ErikB2, that's so last week! | 18:58 |
| ErikB2 | I know | 18:58 |
| alazarev | #vore no | 18:58 |
| alazarev | #vote no | 18:58 |
| bob_nettleton | #vote no | 18:58 |
| aignatov | #vote yes | 18:58 |
| aignatov | just for some drama :) | 18:58 |
| elmiko | lol | 18:58 |
| SergeyLukjanov | :) | 18:58 |
| mattf | aignatov, i think we already filled the drama quota | 18:58 |
| crobertsrh | New vote...aignatov handles all pre-renaming backward compatability changes. | 18:59 |
| SergeyLukjanov | 30 secs more | 18:59 |
| aignatov | mattf: lol, exactly | 18:59 |
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| mattf | vote yes | 18:59 |
| SergeyLukjanov | crobertsrh ++ | 18:59 |
| elmiko | crobertsrh: +1 | 18:59 |
| tmckay | no compat means I have mess with one of my patches again, sigh | 18:59 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #endvote | 18:59 |
| openstack | Voted on "Should we keep backward compat for renaming?" Results are | 18:59 |
| openstack | Yes (1): aignatov | 18:59 |
| mattf | tmckay, yeah | 18:59 |
| openstack | No (11): bob_nettleton, NikitaKonovalov, dmitryme, elmiko, ErikB2, crobertsrh, tmckay, mattf, SergeyLukjanov, alazarev, sreshetnyak | 18:59 |
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| aignatov | crobertsrh: lol! | 18:59 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | so, let's start next meeting from discussion about the starting point for full backward compat | 19:00 |
| SergeyLukjanov | than you all folks | 19:00 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #endmeeting | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 13 19:00:12 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/sahara/2014/sahara.2014-03-13-18.04.html | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/sahara/2014/sahara.2014-03-13-18.04.txt | 19:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/sahara/2014/sahara.2014-03-13-18.04.log.html | 19:00 |
| mattf | thanks folks | 19:00 |
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| mattf | time to go rip out the backward compat code! | 19:00 |
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| mattf | ciao | 19:00 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | Hi Neutron groupies! ;-) | 19:03 |
| banix | Hi group policy crowd! | 19:03 |
| banix | :) | 19:03 |
| cgoncalves | greetings everyone! | 19:03 |
| s3wong | hello everyone! | 19:03 |
| SumitNaiksatam | sorry we are a little late, previous meeting ran over | 19:03 |
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| rkukura | hi | 19:03 |
| nbouthors | hello | 19:03 |
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| thinrichs | Hi all | 19:03 |
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| banix | Kyle is not around | 19:03 |
| banix | on PTO | 19:03 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: yeah, he is away | 19:04 |
| s3wong | mestery is on vacation, so I guess SumitNaiksatam will chair today? | 19:04 |
| mandeep | hi banix SumitNaiksatam cgoncalves s3wong rkukura thinrichs nbouthors | 19:04 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | banix: i will start the meeting | 19:04 |
| banix | cool | 19:04 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | #startmeeting networking_policy | 19:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 13 19:04:32 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SumitNaiksatam. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking_policy)" | 19:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_policy' | 19:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i think the previous meeting was pretty taxing | 19:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so probably we will keep today's meeting short, give people a chance to catch a breath before the ODL meeting | 19:05 |
| banix | but made some progress :) in discussiong important items | 19:05 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: hence not making it back to back with group-policy would be ideal :-) | 19:05 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | banix s3wong: :-) | 19:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so action items from last time | 19:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | (it helps that i did not have any :-P) | 19:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Action Item Review | 19:05 |
| cgoncalves | SumitNaiksatam: quick question: ODL meeting focusing on group policy and/or chaining? | 19:06 |
| s3wong | cgoncalves: group policy for ODL | 19:06 |
| s3wong | independent of Neutron | 19:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | cgoncalves: ^^^ | 19:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so the action item was for the team - Group Policy members to comment on the document here for next week | 19:07 |
| mandeep | cgoncalves: (ODL => OpenDayLight) | 19:07 |
| cgoncalves | s3wong: I will have to find where the meeting is at and which time. thanks | 19:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://docs.google.com/a/noironetworks.com/presentation/d/1Nn1HjghAvk2RTPwvltSrnCUJkidWKWY2ckU7OYAVNpo/edit#slide=id.g1c910cf8b_00 | 19:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we got a few comments, and i responded to them | 19:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | cgoncalves s3wong: make sense? | 19:07 |
| s3wong | I did my part and posted a bunch of comments, in which SumitNaiksatam responded to all | 19:07 |
| banix | I think we were waiting for a more complete document first; no? | 19:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: yes, you are off the hook ;-P | 19:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: yes sure | 19:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: unfortunately did not make as much progress as expected | 19:08 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: yes, terminology changed, and I would like to see how a composite of actions is represented | 19:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: but you an still comment if you feel comfortable | 19:08 |
| mandeep | banix: Yes. | 19:08 |
| banix | no problem | 19:08 |
| s3wong | but overall, your responses were good | 19:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: i am not too worried about the definition of actions | 19:08 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: i think we can collectively enumerate | 19:09 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: ok | 19:09 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: easy for you to say, I was originally tasked to define various types of actions :-) | 19:09 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: ha (i am trying to punt it, as you can tell) | 19:09 |
| banix | are we still thinking along the 3 or 4 actions we had looked at? | 19:09 |
| banix | security, redirection, qos | 19:09 |
| s3wong | banix: I believe so | 19:10 |
| s3wong | let's start with those first | 19:10 |
| banix | sounds good | 19:10 |
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| s3wong | though we are only committed to security for the PoC :-) | 19:10 |
| mandeep | more like: allow, redirect, add-label, qos-level, etc | 19:10 |
| nbouthors | what about a comment from Carlos Gonsalves on missing name attributes. It seems to be gone | 19:10 |
| banix | I think in the context of redirect we will need to see how we relate to services, insertion, chaining, etc | 19:10 |
| s3wong | mandeep: do we want to introduct label now? or should we focus on what we can achieve for the PoC? | 19:11 |
| mandeep | banix: IMO security would not be an action, but a call of actions | 19:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix mandeep: i think we have the same semantics in mind, terminlogy | 19:11 |
| mandeep | s3wong: We can define those, but implement what we need for PoC | 19:11 |
| s3wong | mandeep: security is a fundamental action type - as 'deny' is default, but tenants can set 'allow' | 19:11 |
| SumitNaiksatam | mandeep: yeah i agree | 19:11 |
| mandeep | (makes understanding the roadmap easier) | 19:11 |
| hemanthravi | will contract also address derivation of service_context? | 19:12 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: yes, i think what mandeep is saying is the action name should probably be allow, deny, etc | 19:12 |
| hemanthravi | service_context from the adv-services | 19:12 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: the term "security" does not sound like an action | 19:12 |
| banix | hemanthravi: that is what we need to discuss | 19:12 |
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| prasadv | I agree with sumit and mandeep wrt to naming security | 19:13 |
| banix | SumitNaiksatam: get on with the old terminology :) | 19:13 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: I am open to other term. But 'allow' needs to be allowed | 19:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong banix absolutely | 19:13 |
| mandeep | hemanthravi: That needs to be represented for"matching"/"providing" service, but not clear in my mind yet as to how we can expose it | 19:13 |
| banix | get on board :) just kidding | 19:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: :-) | 19:13 |
| banix | Yes we can of course come up with better names but that's not that important | 19:14 |
| mandeep | banix: agreed | 19:14 |
| banix | As I see it, we need to finalize the model first to get going | 19:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: agreed, agreed don't want to rat hole on the names | 19:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so hemanth's point | 19:14 |
| prasadv | banix: I agree | 19:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: agree | 19:15 |
| s3wong | what is hemanthravi 's point? | 19:15 |
| s3wong | sorry :-) | 19:15 |
| banix | So is the main issue that seems to need more discussion is integration with advanced services? or we are punting on that at the moment? | 19:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i meant hemanthravi's question | 19:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: good point | 19:16 |
| mandeep | s3wong: He was asking how is the service-context exposed in a contarct (or that that is what I understood) | 19:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: i think the model comes first | 19:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | adv services' integration comes next | 19:16 |
| mandeep | SumitNaiksatam: Agreed | 19:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: i think thats how you see it, right? | 19:16 |
| banix | yes | 19:17 |
| s3wong | mandeep: OK | 19:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i mean stating the obvious | 19:17 |
| hemanthravi | mandeep: yes, I thought contract when realized by provider will give the info for the service_context | 19:17 |
| banix | just wanted to see what are the things we need to address and then go after them | 19:17 |
| banix | SumitNaiksatam: yes | 19:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i believe hemanthravi's point is that to validate the contract model, we need to consider all aspects | 19:17 |
| mandeep | hemanthravi: I agree that is required, just not clear on how to represent it best | 19:17 |
| s3wong | hemanthravi: I don't know how service insertion points can be represented here, really. Since our classifier is L4 based | 19:17 |
| mandeep | s3wong: We do not need to limit the model to L4 based classifiers. That just may be a limitation of a PoC | 19:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | btw, let me check the topic | 19:18 |
| banix | I had earlier suggested that a policy can be the insertion point for a chain but Sumit was suggesting that may not be the case | 19:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Model review | 19:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Model review (Meeting topic: networking_policy)" | 19:19 | |
| hemanthravi | s3wong: agree, not sure how either, but might be the right object to define this | 19:19 |
| banix | Shall we have a goal of finalizing the model to the extent that is reasonable by next week? | 19:19 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | banix: i think what you say makes sense | 19:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: i do not recall what i said earlier :-) | 19:19 |
| s3wong | mandeep: I think in earlier days, prasadv wanted to have IP address in classifier; which we collectively rejected (sorry, prasadv) | 19:20 |
| prasadv | mandeep: earlier discussion we had, classifier is limited to L4 | 19:20 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok guys one sec, banix's question first | 19:20 |
| prasadv | i wanted to have IP and we had some discussion around that | 19:20 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: yes, i agree i think its a good goal for next week, | 19:20 |
| s3wong | if we want to extend classifier, it would be above L4, not below. Since we want to hide location addressing scheme from policy | 19:20 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: sorry | 19:21 |
| mandeep | We need to create policy in terms of content, not identity. So above L4 is what I was thinking | 19:21 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action Team to finalize the model by next week, SumitNaiksatam to get back with filling any holes | 19:21 |
| banix | Let us (looking at myself) have a complete review of the model in the coming days and try to resolve any issues remaining in the meeting next week. | 19:21 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #undo | 19:21 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Action object at 0x2bad990> | 19:21 |
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| banix | no that was a good action item sumit | 19:22 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | #action Team to review/finalize the model by next week, SumitNaiksatam to get back with filling any holes | 19:22 |
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| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: can we get writable right on the document? | 19:22 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: yeah sure, i thought it was open to anyone with link | 19:22 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: i can check back | 19:22 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: no, it says comments only | 19:23 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: you did not like the action item? | 19:23 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | banix: oh sorry, i misread your statement | 19:23 |
| banix | I did; I did not undoing it | 19:23 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix: sorry, rephrasing :-) | 19:23 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok so what else do we want to discuss on the model (after that we will discuss the services' aspect) | 19:24 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | i discuss based on the extent that you could review the current version | 19:24 |
| SumitNaiksatam | *i meant | 19:24 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: mandeep wants us to introduce label into the model, anyone brave enough to take that step :-) ? | 19:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: ha | 19:25 |
| mandeep | SumitNaiksatam: We just need to get more work done there ... I have been delinquent this week! | 19:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | mandeep: i think mandeep volunteered | 19:25 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: cool, great for mandeep :-) | 19:25 |
| mandeep | Yes | 19:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: i meant mandeep volunteered :-) | 19:26 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok next topic | 19:26 |
| s3wong | don't forget to both subject label and consumption label :-) | 19:26 |
| banix | s3wong, man deep: are we talking about labels as they are defined in the ODL group policy? | 19:26 |
| banix | sure | 19:26 |
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| s3wong | banix: that's the only label I know of :-) | 19:26 |
| SumitNaiksatam | banix s3wong go ahead | 19:26 |
| mandeep | banix: maybe a subset first | 19:26 |
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| banix | mandeep: makes sense | 19:27 |
| nbouthors | There is an n-m relation between Endpoint Group and Contract, does that mean that there should be a way to get back the Endpoint Groups related to a specific Contract? (List a list attribute back) | 19:27 |
| banix | I think so | 19:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | nbouthors: yeah, i think so to | 19:28 |
| s3wong | nbouthors: in the endpoint group definition page, there are struct to access both provided_contracts and consumed_cotracts | 19:28 |
| s3wong | so you should be able to get to contracts via endpoint group | 19:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: i think nbouthors is asking can be go back from contracts to EPG | 19:29 |
| banix | yes that can be done as well | 19:29 |
| banix | I san we can do the db model such that it can be done | 19:29 |
| banix | I mean | 19:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i think what we don't want is the consuming EPG directly referencing the providing EPG | 19:30 |
| marun | uh | 19:30 |
| marun | so an endpoint group can be 0..1 with a network but endpoint is 1:1 with port | 19:30 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: hmm... at least I guess what contracts the EPG provides should be in the EPG object | 19:30 |
| marun | does that imply that an endpoint group has to have a network if it has any endpoints? | 19:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: yes | 19:30 |
| banix | SumitNaiksatam: agree | 19:31 |
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| mandeep | marun: no | 19:31 |
| marun | or is the relationship between neutron port/network not necessary reflected in the relationship between endpoint and endpoint group? | 19:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | marun: perhaps in the legacy mapping | 19:31 |
| mandeep | marun: The relationship on that end is 1..0 | 19:31 |
| marun | mandeep: maybe i need to rephrase | 19:32 |
| mandeep | marun: So for every Neutron network, we will create a corresponding End Point Group, but not vice-versa | 19:32 |
| banix | s3wong: not necessarily; we should be able to get that information but that does not require the list of contracts being part of EPG | 19:32 |
| marun | mandeep: I get that | 19:32 |
| banix | but i see that is part of the model | 19:32 |
| s3wong | banix: how so? | 19:32 |
| marun | mandeep: I'm asking if, for an endpoint group associated with a network, that all endpoints in the group are associated with ports in that network | 19:32 |
| mandeep | marun: Yes | 19:33 |
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| banix | from having policies associated with EPGs in a separate table; (may be i am referring to something different.) | 19:33 |
| mandeep | marun: That is the implied semantics to keep policy consistent with current implemntation of Neutron | 19:33 |
| marun | mandeep: so what would come first? would an endpoint group have to be associated with a network before an endpoint could be created? | 19:34 |
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| marun | mandeep: the 1:1 between endpoint and port would seem to imply this | 19:34 |
| marun | mandeep: or can an endpoint exist without a port? | 19:34 |
| s3wong | banix: so I found out about that recently also. Our old policy is now contract :-) but as nbouthors suggested, is there anyway to get from EPG to contract | 19:34 |
| mandeep | marun: An end point can not exist without a port. | 19:34 |
| s3wong | and we probably don't want to walk through all contracts to get to matching EPG, right? | 19:35 |
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| marun | mandeep: ok. and an endpoint group without a network would be useful for defining the policy side of things without a target. gotcha | 19:35 |
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| mandeep | marun: (for now, eventually we could allow physical ports to be members of endpointgroups - to allow bare metal integration) | 19:36 |
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| banix | s3wong: correct wrt not walking through policies. the current model suggests peg has list of associated policies/contracts | 19:36 |
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| marun | mandeep: ok | 19:36 |
| s3wong | banix: right, that was what we talked about. EPG (or peg) has to maintain a list of provided contracts, at the very least | 19:37 |
| s3wong | BTW, sorry for branching off to another discussion, guys | 19:38 |
| prasadv | can we end this meeting 15 minutes early, some of us are going to ODL group policy meeting | 19:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok do we want to switch gears to integration with advanced services? | 19:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: ah ok | 19:38 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: should we talk about that in the adv. service meeting? | 19:38 |
| banix | s3wong: just referring to the implementation aspects of how to do that. | 19:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets discuss for 5mins | 19:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | and we can finish early | 19:38 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: or do you think the adv. srv. meeting is too busy as is :-_ | 19:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Integration with advanced services | 19:39 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Integration with advanced services (Meeting topic: networking_policy)" | 19:39 | |
| s3wong | banix: OK | 19:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yeah, i could not bring this up though i had in the agenda in the last meeting | 19:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so essentially, would like to hear what your thoughts are on this | 19:39 |
| prasadv | the integration will come only with redirect action right? | 19:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: ah thats the kind of discussion we want to have | 19:40 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: there were suggestions that we can build a linear chain via the 'redirect' list | 19:40 |
| banix | prasadv: that's what we have discussed so far | 19:40 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | there is a pragmatic side to things, as to what we want to achieve for the PoC | 19:40 |
| s3wong | and "insert" a service also via 'redirect' action | 19:40 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | but our model needs to be robust that it can extend beyond that | 19:41 |
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| prasadv | s3wong: I thought you said that list is a copy list? not a chain | 19:41 |
| s3wong | and 'deny' the traffic to the destination EPG initially | 19:41 |
| s3wong | prasadv: I think there was never any consensus on whether or not the list should be ordered | 19:41 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | #action SumitNaiksatam to check with s3wong, prasadv on what was discussed before in the context of service chains | 19:42 |
| prasadv | s3wong: if advanced services defines a chain, shoudnt we use that ? | 19:42 |
| banix | prasadv: yes | 19:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: i would have imagined that would be the case | 19:42 |
| s3wong | if the 'redirect' list contains element only for mirroring traffic, then order should not matter | 19:42 |
| mandeep | prasadv: agreed | 19:42 |
| banix | I think that's a reasonable choice | 19:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: since what we are building is the policy framework which should ideally leverage other neutron primitives | 19:43 |
| s3wong | prasadv: that was the original case, where service chain is defined outside of policy framework | 19:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: ok makes sense | 19:43 |
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| banix | I think if we know there is a mechanism to define a service chain we should use it | 19:43 |
| prasadv | does advanced services include chain definition to have tap type device | 19:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: yes that was the proposal | 19:43 |
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| s3wong | banix: I think Anees was the one who wanted the 'redirect' action to have hook for service chain definition :-) | 19:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | prasadv: separate attribute for tap | 19:44 |
| prasadv | since that involves mirroring and forwarding at the same time | 19:44 |
| mandeep | s3wong: ideally we have a different actions for tap (mirror) vs. redirect (say to a firewall that can drop the traffic) | 19:44 |
| s3wong | prosadv: that can be controlled by 'allow' or 'deny' on a different action-type | 19:44 |
| prasadv | mandeep: if the chain has say snort and firewall | 19:45 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | ok so we did gather some preliminary requirements from this short dicussion | 19:45 |
| banix | s3wongL yes, so far we have essentially have punted on how the service chain is defined within our policy framework; assuming we will pick it up from services workk | 19:45 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | per earlier request, lets stop here for today | 19:45 |
| prasadv | sumit: thanks | 19:45 |
| s3wong | mandeep: that should be controlled by whether users want to 'deny' traffic or still 'allow' them to the dst EPG | 19:45 |
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| mandeep | s3wong: Let me read the document again. I think I might just be confused | 19:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action advanced services discussion to be continued for next meeting, perhaps with a longer time allocation | 19:45 |
| s3wong | SumitNaiksatam: agreed :-) let's plant these seeds for now | 19:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | s3wong: we will end up growing a forest at this rate | 19:46 |
| mandeep | ;-) | 19:46 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok thanks guys! | 19:46 |
| prasadv | bye | 19:46 |
| s3wong | thanks! | 19:46 |
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| banix | Let's review the model as much as we can this week! Bring up any concerns. on the doc, ML. | 19:46 |
| mandeep | Many plants, but no fruits! | 19:46 |
| mandeep | (yet) | 19:46 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | #endmeeting | 19:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:47 | |
| banix | thanks everybody | 19:47 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 13 19:47:02 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:47 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_policy/2014/networking_policy.2014-03-13-19.04.html | 19:47 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_policy/2014/networking_policy.2014-03-13-19.04.txt | 19:47 |
| s3wong | And please let us write to the document :-) ensure chaos! | 19:47 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_policy/2014/networking_policy.2014-03-13-19.04.log.html | 19:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | thanks all, bye | 19:47 |
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| rockyg | #startmeeting RefStack | 22:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu Mar 13 22:00:33 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rockyg. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: RefStack)" | 22:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'refstack' | 22:00 |
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| rockyg | Roll call | 22:01 |
| davidlenwell | oh did the time shift with day light savings? | 22:01 |
| rockyg | Yup. | 22:01 |
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| davidlenwell | we've all been talking in #refstack for about an hour | 22:01 |
| fcarpenter | that makes sense | 22:01 |
| davidlenwell | yeah .. its all utc | 22:02 |
| davidlenwell | emerica! | 22:02 |
| davidlenwell | here! | 22:02 |
| rockyg | I caught the tail. I'm fighting a network driver incompatibility in Ubuntu. Frustrating and getting me to that obsessive, kill all mode | 22:02 |
| catherineD | here | 22:02 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: drivers in ubuntu can have that effect | 22:02 |
| fcarpenter | here | 22:02 |
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| tedchang | hrer | 22:03 |
| tedchang | here | 22:03 |
| rockyg | Except for the kernel. The driver hangs, goes zombie to the point that the machine needs a hard boot to get it back. Won't soft reboot | 22:03 |
| catherineD | Raymond is also here | 22:03 |
| davidlenwell | I think rob is on vacation so its just us .. | 22:03 |
| davidlenwell | agenda: status, goals | 22:04 |
| rockyg | Cool. Forgot to come up with an agenda as usual, but I think a current stat of cod would be a good start. | 22:04 |
| rockyg | #topic Status | 22:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Status (Meeting topic: RefStack)" | 22:04 | |
| davidlenwell | progress!!! | 22:04 |
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| davidlenwell | we've landed a few important commits in the last week | 22:04 |
| rockyg | Yay! I've seen a number of check ins | 22:04 |
| rockyg | and read the DB schema checkin | 22:04 |
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| davidlenwell | also the api public function for recieving results | 22:05 |
| RaymondWong | i am going to check in that "read the DB" code today. | 22:05 |
| rockyg | I see the hardcoding is giving way to better methods. | 22:05 |
| davidlenwell | that part hasn't fully landed yet | 22:05 |
| rockyg | Yeah. But some great learning and education about python best practices going on. | 22:06 |
| davidlenwell | catherineD, tedchang and raymod have put up some blue prints and some initial commits .. but we are getting close | 22:06 |
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| davidlenwell | thanks to fcarpenter | 22:06 |
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| davidlenwell | who is an excelent code reviewer | 22:06 |
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| fcarpenter | i do my best | 22:06 |
| rockyg | and probably knows how to spell excellent | 22:06 |
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| rockyg | ;-) | 22:07 |
| fcarpenter | e-x-c-something something | 22:07 |
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| davidlenwell | ha.. my irc is in a terminal and does not have the spell check that macos has made me rely on so heavily | 22:07 |
| davidlenwell | moving along | 22:08 |
| davidlenwell | goals before next week? | 22:08 |
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| rockyg | It's Thursday and lots has been happening, but my question is: how close are we to me being able to run a refstack test against a devstack cloud? | 22:08 |
| davidlenwell | I'd say by next thursday you'll be able to do that and see an html score card | 22:08 |
| rockyg | YYEESSSSSS! | 22:09 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: at that time you and I should plan some facetime to pimp out our docs and wikis | 22:09 |
| davidlenwell | from there we'll need to load test and set some goals for getting us managed by infra | 22:09 |
| rockyg | So, I think we have our goals identified. next question is: from RefStack.org gui or from package I install? | 22:10 |
| davidlenwell | not yet .. will have that going by monday | 22:10 |
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| davidlenwell | both | 22:10 |
| rockyg | I'm really looking to get deeper doc stuff. I am a top down and bottom up kinda engineer, so the middle out is the hardest for me. | 22:10 |
| davidlenwell | by that I mean that on monday I'll have things publishing live as they merge | 22:11 |
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| davidlenwell | so that when code reviews happen and things merge they are on refstack.org shorly after | 22:11 |
| rockyg | Fantastic. | 22:11 |
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| davidlenwell | the goal all along is to have both remote and internal official testing | 22:12 |
| rockyg | Another part of status: the fits mailing list and should we send an email to the dev list to let folks know who/where/what we are? Sounds like next Friday or Monday for the dev email? | 22:12 |
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| rockyg | fcarpenter: is there a python way to generate a db schema doc from the code? | 22:13 |
| davidlenwell | spynx | 22:14 |
| rockyg | OK. I'll spend time digging deeper into it. | 22:14 |
| davidlenwell | and that should be another engineering task .. setup auto generation of docs | 22:14 |
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| davidlenwell | it can actually be easily done in the merge process with a commit to the infra-config repo .. I think .. < fungi?? | 22:15 |
| davidlenwell | I think that puts docs in the correct place on openstack.org or something unless I just made that up .. | 22:15 |
| rockyg | :-) | 22:16 |
| davidlenwell | I did attend an infra boot camp . but I've slept since then | 22:16 |
| rockyg | I want to link to it from the wiki, but will need it to be a live link that changes with the merges. | 22:17 |
| fungi | well, if you're talking about generating/updating code documentation on each commit, we do that currently for api docs | 22:17 |
| rockyg | Sounds like that's what I need. Infra bootcamp. | 22:17 |
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| davidlenwell | fungi: yes .. that is what I am reffering to | 22:17 |
| rockyg | DB schema docs, too. | 22:17 |
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| fungi | the docs below http://api.openstack.org/api-ref.html | 22:18 |
| fungi | like http://api.openstack.org/api-ref-compute.html | 22:18 |
| rockyg | OK. anything else on status? Runnable local and remote refstack working by 3/20 CoB? | 22:19 |
| fungi | those are dynamically generated using sphinx from jenkins jobs run after each commit merges | 22:19 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: sounds right | 22:19 |
| rockyg | So we just need to provide location for the api file (pretty obvious) and the DB file (less obvious, but we can workit out) | 22:20 |
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| davidlenwell | do you mean a url? | 22:20 |
| davidlenwell | oh .. that | 22:21 |
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| davidlenwell | yeah | 22:21 |
| davidlenwell | we need to move all the api calls into the api file .. right now they are in web.py | 22:21 |
| davidlenwell | I can do that | 22:21 |
| davidlenwell | and catherineD can you guys please put any new api calls into that file ? | 22:21 |
| rockyg | OK. That covers status and short term goals. What about long term davidlenwell: yeah. URLs for the auto-genned docs. | 22:21 |
| davidlenwell | I'll make sure they get loaded correctly | 22:21 |
| catherineD | sure will do | 22:22 |
| catherineD | for the new API | 22:22 |
| davidlenwell | interface | 22:22 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: .. we have a lot of work to do on the ui | 22:22 |
| davidlenwell | we should have a ftf ux planning event and work out how this app will look behave and provide | 22:23 |
| rockyg | Do we want a default of some small number of tests for the refstack runs? Do we already have that? | 22:23 |
| davidlenwell | rob has a lot of opinions about that so we'll need to coordinate with him | 22:23 |
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| davidlenwell | by default we want refstack to always run all tests | 22:23 |
| davidlenwell | right now we are limiting it because we want to be able to debug faster | 22:23 |
| rockyg | Right, but this is for trial run purposes | 22:23 |
| davidlenwell | correct | 22:24 |
| rockyg | Maybe the gui defaults to show trial and you could select full as an alternative? | 22:24 |
| rockyg | Until we are farther along. | 22:24 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: thats certaily an option.. want to file it as a blue print and put some stuff in the whiteboard | 22:25 |
| davidlenwell | we'll define it more clearly and get it into the pipeline | 22:25 |
| rockyg | Sure. also, have we figured out how we are going to let users select test sets? | 22:25 |
| davidlenwell | im not sure we're going to | 22:26 |
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| RaymondWong | if they are running local copy, they can set the test sets in the config file. | 22:26 |
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| davidlenwell | I was speaking for refstack.org | 22:26 |
| rockyg | Maybe submit a config file to refstack.org? | 22:27 |
| davidlenwell | I wouldn't want to do that | 22:27 |
| davidlenwell | if they want custom config they can run a local copy | 22:27 |
| davidlenwell | refstack.org will be for official testing only | 22:27 |
| rockyg | OK. | 22:27 |
| davidlenwell | by verified vendors | 22:27 |
| davidlenwell | vendors who want an official openstack seal on their website | 22:28 |
| davidlenwell | that will link into a report card on refstack | 22:28 |
| davidlenwell | but we still want all the results from everyone | 22:28 |
| davidlenwell | then we can built interesting interop maps and really give users fun tools that are useful | 22:28 |
| rockyg | Then users and ops would run the package instead. | 22:28 |
| davidlenwell | yes | 22:29 |
| rockyg | #action I'm gonna make sure this gets captured in the requirements | 22:30 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: thank you | 22:30 |
| davidlenwell | anything else? | 22:31 |
| rockyg | #topic open discussion | 22:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: RefStack)" | 22:31 | |
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| rockyg | Don't forget to sign up to fits@lists.openstack.org | 22:32 |
| davidlenwell | I think I did that the day they brought it up | 22:32 |
| catherineD | thx rockyg: | 22:32 |
| rockyg | :-) | 22:33 |
| catherineD | any status about Rally? | 22:33 |
| catherineD | are we (RefStack and Rally) working together | 22:33 |
| rockyg | Have not seen any dev list postings. I heard that Mirantis is going to join us in force soon. That's why I want to make sure we're using the mailing list instead of our internal collected emails. but, I haven't seen many new people jump on board. | 22:34 |
| davidlenwell | nobody from rally has talked to me directly | 22:34 |
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| davidlenwell | I would encourage them to do so if we are supposed to work together | 22:35 |
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| rockyg | Oh, I have a request for davidlenwell and/or fcarpenter: could one/both of you write a simple unit test so that catherine and team has a good example to start from? | 22:36 |
| davidlenwell | probably won't have the head space for it until wednesday .. but I can make that happen | 22:36 |
| davidlenwell | file a blue print | 22:36 |
| davidlenwell | that is what I am going to work from | 22:36 |
| rockyg | Knowing the system makes it easier to write more by others. And, I will file a blueprint;-) | 22:37 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: agreed | 22:37 |
| davidlenwell | there is a stub of a test in there.. needed it to get into stackforge .. but its just a stub | 22:37 |
| rockyg | #action two blueprints: unit test and auto gen docs and ?? I think there's one more. | 22:39 |
| davidlenwell | actually if we are going to do this right we should have unit tests updated for every merge | 22:39 |
| davidlenwell | shouldn't pass review if it doesn't have propper test coverage.. it can just be labor intensive and I am horrible about keeping upt hat habit my self | 22:40 |
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| davidlenwell | but we'll reach a critical mass of code where we'll need to rely on those tests to make sure things aren't broken | 22:41 |
| davidlenwell | and I'd rather start now than have to rush it all in later | 22:41 |
| rockyg | Well, once the working demo is landed, hopefully there will be a little more time to write tests. | 22:41 |
| davidlenwell | but this should probably be a goal for the next sprint | 22:41 |
| davidlenwell | I digress | 22:41 |
| rockyg | Especially now that we are moving from hardcoded to configurable. | 22:41 |
| fcarpenter | educate the new guy: what's the sprint schedule for refstack (begin/end)? | 22:42 |
| rockyg | topic is open discussion. | 22:42 |
| davidlenwell | its two weeks fcarpenter.. we are midway now | 22:42 |
| fcarpenter | thank you | 22:42 |
| rockyg | mid term goal is RefStack for Havana by Icehouse summit | 22:42 |
| davidlenwell | should line up with piston | 22:42 |
| rockyg | But, we're not great on getting our stories straight;-) Right now, it's tasks. | 22:43 |
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| davidlenwell | rockyg: correct | 22:44 |
| davidlenwell | infra is working on something called storyboard | 22:44 |
| davidlenwell | its going to give openstack more real scrum than lp | 22:44 |
| rockyg | Yeah. Attended the IRC this morning. but I thought it was a replacement for BPs and bugs and project management.... | 22:45 |
| rockyg | It sounds like HP is hiring a UI guy for the effort. | 22:45 |
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| davidlenwell | rockyg: yaeh .. they're all about it | 22:46 |
| davidlenwell | I hope they build in a migration path from pivotal tracker and piston can use them .. "hope" | 22:46 |
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| davidlenwell | okay . im good with ending now . have to get back to packing | 22:47 |
| rockyg | Considering I think LP BPs and bugs system is one of the worst I've had to navigate in quite a while, I was hoping they would do something like use Pivitol's tools. | 22:47 |
| tedchang__ | good luck :) | 22:47 |
| davidlenwell | its not open source | 22:47 |
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| davidlenwell | rockyg: infra won't adopt anything new that isn't open source .. period | 22:47 |
| davidlenwell | and apache lic .. I think | 22:48 |
| rockyg | When you make it up here, consider dropping by for some wine in my backyard on some Saturday. goes for everyone here. | 22:48 |
| davidlenwell | are you in south bay rocky? | 22:48 |
| rockyg | Yup. | 22:48 |
| rockyg | Easy access from highways. It's supposed to get to 78 Saturday. | 22:49 |
| fcarpenter | davidlenwell: I can drive you ;) | 22:49 |
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| rockyg | Know where you're going to rent yet? Pacifica? | 22:50 |
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| rockyg | #endmeeting See you guys on refstack. | 22:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:50 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu Mar 13 22:50:40 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:50 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-13-22.00.html | 22:50 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-13-22.00.txt | 22:50 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2014/refstack.2014-03-13-22.00.log.html | 22:50 |
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