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| SushilKM | hello all needed small help .... | 16:23 |
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| dguitarbite | hello | 17:00 |
| rl | hi | 17:01 |
| dguitarbite | rl: hi, sup? | 17:01 |
| rl | mostly good :-) | 17:02 |
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| rl | no meeting today? it's usually on time. | 17:02 |
| dguitarbite | kool | 17:02 |
| dguitarbite | yeah | 17:02 |
| dguitarbite | dunno, may be sarob and colin are busy of something | 17:03 |
| dguitarbite | do you have any agenda on your mind? | 17:03 |
| rl | sort of. installer stuff. | 17:04 |
| dguitarbite | ok | 17:04 |
| rl | the web page doesn't say anything about there not being a meeting. | 17:04 |
| rl | maybe we should just start one. | 17:04 |
| dguitarbite | yeah, ill start the meting | 17:04 |
| dguitarbite | just a sec | 17:04 |
| dguitarbite | yep :) | 17:05 |
| rl | #startmeeting training-manuals | 17:06 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon May 26 17:06:03 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rl. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:06 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: training-manuals)" | 17:06 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'training_manuals' | 17:06 |
| rl | so, anyone else besides dguitarbite and me? | 17:06 |
| dguitarbite | roll call | 17:06 |
| dguitarbite | #topic training-labs | 17:06 |
| rl | right. have you seen the etherpad updates? | 17:07 |
| dguitarbite | nope, link pelase | 17:07 |
| dguitarbite | *please | 17:07 |
| dguitarbite | have been really busy past couple of weeks | 17:07 |
| rl | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/training-labs-scripts | 17:07 |
| dguitarbite | whats your progress in training labs? | 17:08 |
| rl | I implemented preliminary support for Fedora 20. | 17:08 |
| rl | Just to see what it takes to support an rpm-based distro, too. | 17:09 |
| dguitarbite | awesome | 17:09 |
| rl | Host-side I have covered. | 17:09 |
| rl | There are some issues, but I can work them out. | 17:09 |
| dguitarbite | we could come up with some good way to reduce boilerplate for cross platform installation commands | 17:10 |
| rl | Guest side is a different story. | 17:10 |
| dguitarbite | did you patch them upstream? | 17:10 |
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| rl | Well, I submitted one detailed but report to Oracle about VirtualBox, but I have yet to hear from them. | 17:10 |
| dguitarbite | what exactly seems to be the issue? | 17:11 |
| rl | There's a work-around. | 17:11 |
| rl | Oh, there's plenty. | 17:11 |
| dguitarbite | just add them as info | 17:11 |
| dguitarbite | #info Virtual Box issues | 17:11 |
| rl | CDs not ejecting, consoles not displaying, kernels not updating, dkms not being installed etc. | 17:11 |
| dguitarbite | lets try to see if we can hack our way around them | 17:11 |
| rl | Most of it is fixed. | 17:11 |
| rl | The real issue is guest side. | 17:12 |
| dguitarbite | what is the guest side issue? | 17:12 |
| rl | The cross-platform boilerplate stuff you mentioned, it exists. | 17:12 |
| rl | That's what puppet and chef do, pretty much. | 17:12 |
| dguitarbite | yeah, I know puppet can do that | 17:12 |
| rl | And devstack does it, too. | 17:12 |
| dguitarbite | but can we do that in shell scripts? | 17:12 |
| rl | I started re-using some of the devstack libs. | 17:13 |
| rl | Problem is, they are not designed to be used that way. | 17:13 |
| dguitarbite | #action reuse devstack scripts in training-labs | 17:13 |
| dguitarbite | #action figure-out puppet-openstack scripts for training labs | 17:13 |
| rl | Also, I don't know what sort of distribution methods we want to support. | 17:14 |
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| dguitarbite | I think supporting Ubuntu and CentOS/Fedora should be enough | 17:14 |
| rl | matjazp thinks the batch scripts for Windows are useful. | 17:14 |
| dguitarbite | training should be kept as simple as possible by eliminating all the cross platform stuff | 17:15 |
| rl | We can do Vagrant, of course. | 17:15 |
| dguitarbite | batch scripts for Windows? | 17:15 |
| dguitarbite | I didn understand this | 17:15 |
| dguitarbite | do you mean PowerShell commands? | 17:15 |
| dguitarbite | *Powershell Scripts | 17:15 |
| rl | I wish. Old Windows shell. | 17:15 |
| rl | Let me explain: | 17:15 |
| dguitarbite | ok | 17:15 |
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| rl | The install scripts run on Linux or Mac. | 17:16 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: hello | 17:16 |
| rl | While they run, they can write a batch file that will do the same thing on Windows. | 17:16 |
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| sarob | Sorry about that | 17:16 |
| rl | No need for Vagrant or ssh. | 17:17 |
| dguitarbite | rl: do we need that? | 17:17 |
| dguitarbite | no one uses Windows server as base OS for OpenStack deployments | 17:17 |
| rl | That is exactly one of the questions I asked (also mentioned on the etherpad). | 17:17 |
| dguitarbite | we need to eliminate complex stuff and try to make it simple | 17:18 |
| sarob | Agreed | 17:18 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: show must go on ;) ... no issues we were discussing Training-Labs blueprint hoping that you will join in :) | 17:18 |
| sarob | Thanks | 17:18 |
| sarob | Keeping the assoc and oper guides up to date is critical | 17:19 |
| sarob | Can you take lead on that? | 17:19 |
| dguitarbite | yes | 17:19 |
| sarob | I'll focus on getting help from intel and comcast? | 17:20 |
| dguitarbite | I will do that | 17:20 |
| dguitarbite | #action dguitarbite track progress and update Associate and Operator Guide upto date | 17:20 |
| sarob | :) | 17:20 |
| dguitarbite | I might me able to convince my new employer to give me some resources for this | 17:20 |
| sarob | #action sarob get assoc and oper contributors from comcast and intel | 17:20 |
| dguitarbite | but I should be able to do it regardless of their support | 17:20 |
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| sarob | Do what you can | 17:21 |
| sarob | If I can get a few training devs | 17:21 |
| sarob | Then we will be in good shape | 17:21 |
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| sarob | Then I can work with stef tom loic on develop guide | 17:22 |
| dguitarbite | ok | 17:22 |
| dguitarbite | I am going to come up with OpenStack Koans | 17:22 |
| dguitarbite | I have approached some of the online python tutorial designers | 17:23 |
| rl | sorry, misclicked. | 17:23 |
| rl | matjazp found the Windows shell scripts useful, because many students have Windows on their machines. | 17:23 |
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| dguitarbite | to discuss how to design Dev. Training Labs | 17:23 |
| sarob | Cool | 17:23 |
| dguitarbite | rl: using VirtualBOx should be better on Windows Machiens | 17:23 |
| sarob | Show them the Dev design off wiki | 17:23 |
| dguitarbite | *machines | 17:23 |
| rl | dguitarbite, better than what? | 17:24 |
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| dguitarbite | better than just running the scripts on windows directly | 17:24 |
| dguitarbite | also you can emulate multi-node and cool stuff | 17:24 |
| dguitarbite | on single machine | 17:24 |
| rl | Oh, the scripts just do what they do on Linux. They set up a training cluster in VirtualBox VMs. | 17:24 |
| sarob | We should consider prebuilt as well | 17:25 |
| dguitarbite | rl: ok, then its fine | 17:25 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: yes | 17:25 |
| dguitarbite | rl: who will maintain these scripts? | 17:25 |
| sarob | Scripts for DIY and ready made ubuntu VMs | 17:25 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: DIY? | 17:25 |
| sarob | Do it yourself | 17:26 |
| rl | good question. host-side, there shouldn't be much maintenance necessary, once they work. | 17:26 |
| dguitarbite | ok | 17:26 |
| sarob | We should assume trainers | 17:26 |
| rl | the real work is going to be one the guest side. | 17:26 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: is it feasible to rely on trainers? | 17:26 |
| rl | every OpenStack release, every operating system you want to support. | 17:26 |
| sarob | Will not be scripters | 17:26 |
| dguitarbite | rl: guest side, we have to try n re-use devstack and puppet-openstack | 17:26 |
| sarob | For training? | 17:27 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: usually trainers may not get the time and funding for working on scripts | 17:27 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: unless you can convince someone like Hastexo | 17:27 |
| dguitarbite | who do it really well | 17:27 |
| sarob | We agree | 17:28 |
| sarob | We publish scripts | 17:28 |
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| sarob | But assume first choice to use trainer VMs | 17:28 |
| rl | sarob, can I also point you to the etherpad and ask you to add any comments, thoughts, questions you may have? | 17:28 |
| rl | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/training-labs-scripts | 17:28 |
| sarob | That are result of scripts | 17:28 |
| rl | sarob: the scripts can produce a three-node OVA right now. | 17:29 |
| rl | one image, three VMs with shared COW disks. | 17:29 |
| sarob | Hmm, not bad | 17:29 |
| rl | (well, base disk is shared, the COW disks obviously not) | 17:30 |
| dguitarbite | I can maintain the pre-built images | 17:30 |
| dguitarbite | but were do we upload them? | 17:30 |
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| rl | matjazp offered to host them for the time being. | 17:30 |
| dguitarbite | #action dguitarbite figure out how to create vagrantbox for training-labs | 17:30 |
| dguitarbite | rl: sounds good | 17:30 |
| dguitarbite | may be we could get to a point where we provide these images as vagrantboxes | 17:31 |
| sarob | I can prob find dropbox space off infra | 17:31 |
| dguitarbite | to make it really simple | 17:31 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: sounds good too | 17:31 |
| sarob | Use matjazp space for now | 17:31 |
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| dguitarbite | ok | 17:32 |
| sarob | rj add etherpad link to wiki | 17:32 |
| sarob | Good stuff | 17:32 |
| dguitarbite | #action dguitarbite create MultiNode/Single Node ova's for Havana/IceHouse release | 17:32 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: Associate and Operators is still on Havana? | 17:33 |
| rl | sarob, I added it to the training-labs blueprint. I didn't find a training-labs wiki page. Only training-manuals. | 17:33 |
| dguitarbite | or have we ported it to Icehouse ? | 17:33 |
| dguitarbite | rl: training-manuals will do for now | 17:34 |
| rl | dguitarbite, Okay | 17:34 |
| sarob | #action sarob find trainer script vm results | 17:34 |
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| sarob | #action sarob find trainer script vm results location for trainers to pull from | 17:35 |
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| rl | sarob: what's vm results? | 17:36 |
| sarob | rl VMs that result from script | 17:36 |
| sarob | A bit wordy | 17:36 |
| rl | oh, okay. | 17:36 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: deep thinker! | 17:37 |
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| sarob | Wiki linked off blueprint to here #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Training-manuals | 17:37 |
| sarob | Wiki should link to all ideas and plans | 17:37 |
| sarob | I want n00bs to start at the wiki | 17:38 |
| dguitarbite | #action dguitarbite, rl create training-labs wiki page based on training-labs blueprint | 17:38 |
| dguitarbite | yep | 17:38 |
| rl | ack | 17:38 |
| sarob | :) | 17:38 |
| sarob | So I had talks with comcast and intel | 17:39 |
| sarob | At the summit | 17:39 |
| sarob | Not the devs but those that would task the devs | 17:39 |
| dguitarbite | how interested are they? | 17:39 |
| sarob | Seems very | 17:40 |
| dguitarbite | hmmm... intel seems to be doing lot of processor optimization for OpenStack | 17:40 |
| sarob | I need to translate that interest into actual commitments | 17:40 |
| sarob | Intel is thrashing around to get involved | 17:40 |
| rl | processor optimization for OpenStack? for real? what would they do? | 17:41 |
| sarob | I jam to aim them in direction that helps us | 17:41 |
| dguitarbite | their input will be really valuable | 17:41 |
| sarob | I aim to aim | 17:41 |
| sarob | Damn spell chk | 17:41 |
| dguitarbite | I would have jammed with you : | 17:41 |
| dguitarbite | :| | 17:41 |
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| sarob | well that two | 17:42 |
| sarob | Or too | 17:42 |
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| dguitarbite | rl: Im not sure how exactly they are doing processor optimization for OpenStack but may be they are making openstack core libs run better on their processors | 17:42 |
| rl | I thought they were adding a Python interpreter into CPU microcode :-). | 17:43 |
| dguitarbite | rl: that would be python optimization | 17:44 |
| dguitarbite | rl: I cannot say much on this topic, I dont know much in this area | 17:44 |
| sarob | Python run faster would be okay, but speed was never a big issue for infrastructure usually measured in days | 17:44 |
| rl | Hence my question. | 17:44 |
| sarob | Ovs and openflow however different issue | 17:45 |
| rl | Right. | 17:45 |
| dguitarbite | well, reducing overhead and other similar things make an attractive selling point and advantage over their competitors | 17:45 |
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| sarob | Network flows both data and control plane speed a big deal | 17:45 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: agree, or be ready for storms n congestions | 17:45 |
| sarob | Which intel is already battling broadcom | 17:46 |
| dguitarbite | makes sense | 17:46 |
| sarob | Openstack we need to befriend intel folks and direct their energies for critical projects | 17:47 |
| sarob | Like training | 17:47 |
| rl | Hear, hear. | 17:47 |
| sarob | Nova net neutron feature parity | 17:47 |
| sarob | Congress and the like | 17:47 |
| dguitarbite | ok, and what about comcast? | 17:48 |
| sarob | They are deploying internally | 17:49 |
| sarob | Dev nfv | 17:49 |
| sarob | Both | 17:49 |
| sarob | Big push for them | 17:49 |
| sarob | They need to train their people | 17:49 |
| sarob | They want to own the training | 17:50 |
| sarob | Our approach allows them to do that | 17:50 |
| rl | It will. | 17:50 |
| dguitarbite | yeah, I am happy with the progress in Associate and Operators | 17:50 |
| dguitarbite | they can tweak dev training to their needs | 17:50 |
| dguitarbite | *as per their needs | 17:51 |
| sarob | I need to get another core reviewer | 17:51 |
| sarob | Spinning us off to separate project is prob the only way | 17:51 |
| * rl wonders if the scripts could be integrated with devstack | 17:52 | |
| sarob | So that's the plan for this cycle | 17:53 |
| sarob | rl hmm, that's a good idea | 17:53 |
| rl | The big remaining issue is guest side scripts. I started looking into devstack, because it does a lot of the heavy lifting (installing and configuring OpenStack components). | 17:53 |
| dguitarbite | rl, may be ... but I dont think so | 17:53 |
| dguitarbite | we need to use devstack and may be use it as a submodule | 17:53 |
| rl | My favorite solution is for devstack to accept patches that make it easier to use part of their stuff as a library. | 17:54 |
| sarob | I leave to you guys to figure it out | 17:54 |
| dguitarbite | sarob: ok | 17:54 |
| sarob | I trust you | 17:54 |
| dguitarbite | rl: lets sit this weekend and discuss this out properly | 17:54 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: :) | 17:54 |
| sarob | #action sarob publish training-manual incubated plan | 17:55 |
| rl | Okay. I'll send you the scripts towards the end of the week so you'll know what we are talking about. | 17:55 |
| sarob | Me run now | 17:55 |
| dguitarbite | me too | 17:55 |
| sarob | Thanks you guys! | 17:55 |
| dguitarbite | its getting late here | 17:55 |
| dguitarbite | nice talking to you guys, have fun | 17:55 |
| dguitarbite | #endmeeting | 17:56 |
| rl | #endmeeting | 17:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon May 26 17:56:45 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2014/training_manuals.2014-05-26-17.06.html | 17:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2014/training_manuals.2014-05-26-17.06.txt | 17:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2014/training_manuals.2014-05-26-17.06.log.html | 17:56 |
| dguitarbite | ohh, is is cuz you started the meeting? | 17:57 |
| rl | heh. I'm chair! | 17:57 |
| dguitarbite | haha | 17:57 |
| dguitarbite | bow down with respect ;) | 17:57 |
| dguitarbite | bye | 17:57 |
| rl | bye | 17:57 |
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