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| * edleafe knocks on door "Anyone here?" | 14:01 | |
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| n0ano | #startmeeting nova-meeting | 14:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 5 14:01:56 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is n0ano. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova-meeting)" | 14:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova_meeting' | 14:02 |
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| edleafe | need more coffee, n0ano? | 14:02 |
| n0ano | clearly too early in the morning :-( | 14:02 |
| n0ano | I drinking it, just not fast enough :-) | 14:02 |
| bauzas | \o | 14:02 |
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| edleafe | wrong meeting title, eh? | 14:02 |
| n0ano | #endmeeting | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:03 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 5 14:03:05 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_meeting/2015/nova_meeting.2015-10-05-14.01.html | 14:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_meeting/2015/nova_meeting.2015-10-05-14.01.txt | 14:03 |
| n0ano | #startmeeting nova-scheduler | 14:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_meeting/2015/nova_meeting.2015-10-05-14.01.log.html | 14:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 5 14:03:11 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is n0ano. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)" | 14:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova_scheduler' | 14:03 |
| edleafe | third time's a charm | 14:03 |
| n0ano | OK, what else can I screw up this morning | 14:03 |
| * bauzas waves again | 14:03 | |
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| n0ano | n0ano, waves back | 14:03 |
| n0ano | #topic Mitaka planning | 14:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Mitaka planning (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)" | 14:04 | |
| n0ano | So, I read the two specs pointed out last week and they're a good start | 14:04 |
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| n0ano | the one, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/192260/8 , scheduler plans, mainly talks about stuff we know and are doing | 14:05 |
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| bauzas | that's technically a backlog spec and a devref change, but anyway :) | 14:05 |
| n0ano | the other, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/191914/6 , parallel scheduler for V2, I' | 14:06 |
| n0ano | s/I'/I'm concerned might be overkill | 14:06 |
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| n0ano | to me, we've all said along that DB access is the problem but I don't know that we've measured exactly how bad it is, especially with the caching scheduler that we have | 14:07 |
| n0ano | I'd like to see some real perfmance number before we try and do major changes | 14:07 |
| bauzas | n0ano: the parallel scheduler is actually needed for the cells effort | 14:07 |
| bauzas | n0ano: just from a design tenets PoV, it just makes sense without figures | 14:08 |
| n0ano | bauzas, so it's a functional need with maybe a performance benefit | 14:08 |
| bauzas | n0ano: it's more a scalability feature than a performance feature if you prefer | 14:08 |
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| bauzas | I'm a little bit concerned by the word 'paralled', I would have preferred 'distributed' but that's fine | 14:09 |
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| bauzas | the thing is, we need to document what is our christmas list | 14:10 |
| n0ano | a closely related thing in this environment, if the scheduler was fast enough you wouldn't need to distribute it but that's kind of nit picky | 14:10 |
| bauzas | not zactly discussing about how we 'll build the super train that daddy bought us | 14:10 |
| edleafe | christmas shopping in october? bleh | 14:10 |
| bauzas | n0ano: that's debatable | 14:10 |
| n0ano | I agree, lets get the current stuff completed before we get distracted by the new shiny | 14:11 |
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| bauzas | edleafe: speak of that, our malls are now full of advent calendars | 14:11 |
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| n0ano | bauzas, I agree and I'm willing to not debate it right now | 14:11 |
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| n0ano | bauzas, they mail you those, we have buy them at the grocery store :-) | 14:12 |
| bauzas | n0ano: sure, it's just about snapshotting a necessary move and the ideas behind | 14:12 |
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| bauzas | not yet discussing about which one to pick | 14:12 |
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| bauzas | n0ano: heh, our calendars are lego-ones, so I guess it's why - the chicken stopped producing chocolate ones like years ago | 14:13 |
| bauzas | anyway, diverting | 14:13 |
| n0ano | bauzas, heresy, chocolate is a requirement :-) but ignoring that | 14:14 |
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| n0ano | I'd like to kind of keep us focused, to me the progression is: | 14:15 |
| n0ano | 1) finish the API clean up... | 14:15 |
| n0ano | 2) split out the scheduler... | 14:15 |
| n0ano | 3) consider performance/scalability | 14:15 |
| n0ano | if we try and do too many of those at the same time nothing will happen | 14:15 |
| bauzas | the #2 is still debatable :) | 14:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | the problem is claims I think, did we work out how that impacts the scheduler API yet? | 14:16 |
| bauzas | while the #3 is a benefit anyway :) | 14:16 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's a good point | 14:16 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: a distributed scheduler needs to address how to claim properly | 14:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | do we have a concrete plan there yet? claims wise I mean | 14:17 |
| n0ano | I think 3) will be much more doable after 2) (ignoring the cross project benefits of 2) so it's still a priority to me | 14:17 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: nothing we agreed | 14:17 |
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| johnthetubaguy | there was some talk of moving that into the scheduler, mostly for the parallel bit | 14:17 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: right, that's why I'd like to address #3 before #2 | 14:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | n0ano: my worry is getting (1) completed, its hard to evolve that API once its split out | 14:17 |
| edleafe | johnthetubaguy: +1 | 14:18 |
| johnthetubaguy | the parallel bit is more about availability than speed, if we get it working well enough, FWIW | 14:18 |
| n0ano | johnthetubaguy, APIs can change, that's no impossible and it's probably better that it requires thought to make a change | 14:18 |
| edleafe | I would like an API that isn't nova-specific | 14:18 |
| edleafe | otherwise, what's the point of a split? | 14:18 |
| * bauzas feels we discussed of that a couple of times before :) | 14:19 | |
| johnthetubaguy | so there is a chicken and egg thing here, honestly, both *could* be made to work, its a cases of working out the trade-offs | 14:19 |
| n0ano | I'm with bauzas I thought it was pretty generic | 14:19 |
| bauzas | don't get me wrong, here is my take | 14:19 |
| bauzas | #1 we know that we should address the distributed thing, just because we're blocking cells v2 at least | 14:20 |
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| bauzas | #2 we know we should consider heterogenous resources provided to the scheduler | 14:20 |
| bauzas | #3 we never yet agreed on a split and how | 14:20 |
| bauzas | that's what I considered the consensus | 14:21 |
| n0ano | in re #3 - my understanding is we did agree, clean up the APIs through the current effort and then do the mechanics of a split | 14:21 |
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| n0ano | in re #2 - are heterogenious resources a problem with the current design? | 14:22 |
| bauzas | so the deal was to fix the API and discuss whether we split and how | 14:22 |
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| bauzas | n0ano: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/075403.html | 14:23 |
| bauzas | to answer your question | 14:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so I thought we agreed, get the APIs sorted, then look again at the split, but I don't think its worth fixating on the difference, or lack there of, between those two positions | 14:23 |
| n0ano | johnthetubaguy, +1 | 14:24 |
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| johnthetubaguy | volume capacity, IP capacity and how it relates to compute capacity is an age old issue here really, it would be good to get that fixed up | 14:25 |
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| johnthetubaguy | availability zones and relating different pools of resources is certainly a common requirement | 14:26 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: so I guess you better explain my position, because I +1 | 14:27 |
| n0ano | johnthetubaguy, to me those capacities are just metrics (e.g. numbers), from a scheduler perspective that's pretty simple - how you measure them is not so simple | 14:27 |
| bauzas | what I'm trying to explain is that we agreed on refactoring the APIs and reconsider once that done whether it was necessary to split | 14:27 |
| bauzas | but in the meantime, there are many other topics coming in, and I'm really not convinced by the idea of splitting could just solve all our problmes | 14:28 |
| edleafe | bauzas: splitting by itself doesn't get us any improvement | 14:28 |
| n0ano | it won't solve our problems but I do believe it will make working on a lot of them easier | 14:28 |
| bauzas | edleafe: ezactly | 14:28 |
| edleafe | cleaning up so that a split *could* happen does | 14:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | n0ano: so this is more about error handling | 14:28 |
| n0ano | johnthetubaguy, not following you | 14:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | say you pick where the volume goes, or where the compute goes, and that means you can only get some of your resources, you need to pick something else | 14:29 |
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| johnthetubaguy | its logically separate pools of resources you need to claim, that have a dependency relationship described in their metrics | 14:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | so the request spec would be for both compute, volume and networking resources, in an extreme case | 14:30 |
| n0ano | the way we currently work you wouldn't pick a host unless it satisfied all of the resource requirements, the scheduler just has to know about all of those resources | 14:30 |
| bauzas | that's why the plan was to clean up our APIs first, then identify what could be needed for cross-project scheduling, then identify how to provide those and only by then, decide whether we split or just add another endpoint | 14:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | its about picking a compute host, and a volume az, and a neutron network segment that all are able to give you a claim, and retry if not, right? | 14:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | its multiple related items, its not just picking a compute node at this point | 14:31 |
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| edleafe | johnthetubaguy: and doing it in a non-racy way | 14:31 |
| bauzas | edleafe: that I'm cautious | 14:31 |
| bauzas | edleafe: I mean, we need retries | 14:32 |
| edleafe | bauzas: yes, we will always need them with the current approach | 14:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | edleafe: well, optionally, yes, claims would help make the retries inside the scheduler, and the expensive of a quick choice | 14:32 |
| edleafe | but we should improve things so that they are kept to a minimum | 14:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | we need to be more prepared to offer choice here, being less racy will be crazy important for some users, and a big slow down for other users, depends on your needs and resource usage patterns really | 14:33 |
| bauzas | are we looping back ? | 14:33 |
| n0ano | I think we're in violent agreement, retries are necessary but if we do too many of them we have a problem. | 14:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am just trying to define the problem for the multi resource pool scheduling here | 14:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | its been a long standing requirement, that seems to be getting more important, rather than less important | 14:34 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's why your backlog spec is worthwhile | 14:34 |
| bauzas | and that's why I'd like to consider it before splitting | 14:34 |
| n0ano | johnthetubaguy, do you know if anyone has written up anything about this (multi resource pools) | 14:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | I probably should create a different one for this issue | 14:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | n0ano: there have been a few ML posts and things, not seen anything written up | 14:35 |
| bauzas | there is a spec | 14:35 |
| bauzas | from jay | 14:35 |
| bauzas | sec | 14:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | n0ano: basically volume must be local to compute AZ, IP capacity must be local to compute AZ | 14:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: ah, cool, do you have a link for that one? | 14:35 |
| edleafe | n0ano: I'm almost finished with my radical rewrite proposal, if that helps :) | 14:35 |
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| bauzas | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225546/ | 14:35 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: n0ano^ | 14:36 |
| johnthetubaguy | edleafe: please present that as an alternative scheduler that could be in tree, no throwing away what we have, for now | 14:36 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: ah, sweet | 14:36 |
| edleafe | johnthetubaguy: understood, but no, there's no way it could be in tree | 14:36 |
| edleafe | johnthetubaguy: I realize that it won't ever happen | 14:37 |
| edleafe | I just want people to think about the root causes of our issues | 14:37 |
| bauzas | jaypipes: around ? | 14:37 |
| n0ano | bauzas, probably not, he would have jumped in by now | 14:38 |
| bauzas | let's call him 5 times in front of a mirror | 14:38 |
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| bauzas | jaypipes jaypipes jaypipes jaypipes jaypipes | 14:39 |
| johnthetubaguy | edleafe: so I have done a lot of experiments with a decent rack of servers, with belliott that lead to the caching scheduler and tuning the greenlet workers down, thats mostly what I am basing that parallel work on, but that idea still needs testing out, anyways | 14:39 |
| n0ano | looks like we have a lot to discuss in Tokyo | 14:39 |
| johnthetubaguy | so the key bit here, is we have a spec up, so lets get it reviewed | 14:39 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225546/ | 14:39 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: +1 | 14:39 |
| bauzas | that's an iterative process | 14:39 |
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| bauzas | we have johnthetubaguy's spec and devref, we also have jaypipes spec | 14:39 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so the parallel one is not very actionable right now, I think resource pools are more important right now | 14:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | the claims piece still need some specific solutions being discussed I feel | 14:42 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's a good question | 14:42 |
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| johnthetubaguy | honestly, once we have those two piece, I will feel better about our API | 14:42 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: we haven't yet finished to implement the resouce-object BP | 14:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | by API I mean the scheduler interface | 14:43 |
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| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: very true, that needs review now, its up for review right? | 14:43 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: and that spec is actually an extension to the resource-objects BP | 14:43 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: totally agreed | 14:43 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: so yes, we can somehow identify that what we agreed (ie. refactor our APIs) is still valid for Mitaka | 14:43 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: re: the resource-objects, I saw some patches from jaypipes but I guess he had not all the work ready | 14:44 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: at least, I can find the objects creation, not their usage | 14:44 |
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| n0ano | well, I think I need to distill all the different issues from this thread and propose a scheduler session in Tokyo to discuss them | 14:45 |
| bauzas | well | 14:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | so the deadline for session proposals is tomorrow I think | 14:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | if I remember correctly | 14:45 |
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| * bauzas looking | 14:45 | |
| n0ano | NP, I'll get it done today | 14:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | we need something concrete to discuss ideally | 14:45 |
| n0ano | we have some specific specs to discuss plus some more speculative stuff | 14:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think we have some agreement on the list of issues (solid API, inc resource pools, inc claims in scheduler) | 14:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | For me the list is: (solid API, inc resource pools, inc claims in scheduler) | 14:47 |
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| bauzas | quoting johnthetubaguy "The deadline for proposals will likely be Tuesday 6th October, 23.59 UTC," | 14:47 |
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| bauzas | today EOB :) | 14:47 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: scheduler claims are part of the parallel (ie. distributed) scheduler discussion I feel | 14:48 |
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| n0ano | bauzas, today's the 5th, that should be EOB tomorrow | 14:48 |
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| bauzas | right, we're on Monday | 14:48 |
| * bauzas facepalm | 14:48 | |
| bauzas | I thought we were Tuesday | 14:48 |
| bauzas | anyway | 14:48 |
| bauzas | so I was saying | 14:48 |
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| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: thats true, I am thinking call out claims as they impact parallel and resource pools really | 14:49 |
| bauzas | solid APIs is surely one thing to address (at least the missing bits considering that reqspec-obj is on its way) | 14:49 |
| bauzas | distributed scheduling (incl. sched claims) are IMHO a second part to address | 14:49 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: but I see your point | 14:49 |
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| bauzas | what I'm a bit worried is to defer the necessary talk for a scaling-out scheduler would mean that we'd defer cells v2 | 14:50 |
| bauzas | because we can't hardly assume that one single scheduler could boil the ocean, er. the whole cloud | 14:51 |
| bauzas | 8 mins to the end of that meeting also | 14:51 |
| johnthetubaguy | so it only affects multi-cell v2 | 14:52 |
| johnthetubaguy | and that feels like its release + 1 still | 14:52 |
| johnthetubaguy | but ideally we would have a prototype ready during mitaka | 14:52 |
| n0ano | bauzas, yeah, those concerns should be addressed at a session and no, we're running out of time | 14:52 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: erm, the idea is that the n-api would have one scheduler to address all cells | 14:52 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: but that's certainly debatable | 14:53 |
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| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: well it just works for the single cell case, its just the same API as today | 14:53 |
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| n0ano | getting late guys, let's move on | 14:53 |
| n0ano | #topic opens | 14:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "opens (Meeting topic: nova-scheduler)" | 14:54 | |
| n0ano | so, only two weeks until Tokyo, do we want to meet next week & after or should we just re-convene at the summit? | 14:54 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/nova-specs/specs/liberty/approved/cells-scheduling-interaction.html was that I was thinking about | 14:54 |
| bauzas | but sure, we can move on | 14:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, lets move on | 14:55 |
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| bauzas | n0ano: I can attend the next one, not the one before the Summit | 14:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: sharding doesn't affect the API really | 14:55 |
| bauzas | (enjoying Tokyo with family, eh) | 14:55 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: sure | 14:56 |
| n0ano | I'm willing to talk IRC next week and then defer to the summit, that's doable | 14:56 |
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| bauzas | I'd be interested in gathering feedback from cinder and neutron folks about what they'd like to send to us | 14:57 |
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| bauzas | given we're discussing about https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225546/1/specs/mitaka/approved/resource-providers.rst,cm | 14:57 |
| bauzas | but that's a bit premature | 14:57 |
| n0ano | bauzas, me too, we asked about 2 summits ago and haven't gotten much back | 14:57 |
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| n0ano | well, I have to run (next meeting), tnx everyone, talk next week | 14:58 |
| n0ano | #endmeeting | 14:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:58 | |
| johnthetubaguy | I think we have to just ask them for what we need | 14:58 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 5 14:58:35 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2015/nova_scheduler.2015-10-05-14.03.html | 14:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2015/nova_scheduler.2015-10-05-14.03.txt | 14:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_scheduler/2015/nova_scheduler.2015-10-05-14.03.log.html | 14:58 |
| bauzas | n0ano: you take to propose one sched talk about discussing on 2 concrete items (eg. the resource-provider talk and the parallel sched) ? | 14:58 |
| bauzas | ideally, I'd like to defer that to someone else since I already proposed 2 sessions | 14:59 |
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| dims_ | #startmeeting oslo | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 5 16:00:07 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dims_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| dims_ | courtesy ping for GheRivero, amotoki, amrith, bknudson, bnemec, dansmith, dhellmann, dougwig, e0ne, flaper87, garyk, harlowja, haypo, | 16:00 |
| dims_ | courtesy ping for ihrachyshka, jd__, jecarey, johnsom, jungleboyj, kgiusti, kragniz, lifeless, lintan, ozamiatin, redrobot, rpodolyaka, | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| dims_ | courtesy ping for sergmelikyan, sreshetnyak, sileht, sreshetnyak, stevemar, therve, thinrichs, toabctl, viktors, zhiyan, zzzeek | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:00 | |
| dhellmann | o/ | 16:00 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'oslo' | 16:00 |
| e0ne | hi | 16:00 |
| jungleboyj | o/ | 16:00 |
| jecarey | 0/ | 16:00 |
| bknudson | hi | 16:00 |
| ozamiatin | o/ | 16:00 |
| johnsom | o/ | 16:00 |
| toabctl | hi | 16:00 |
| harlowja_at_home | sup | 16:00 |
| dims_ | #topic Red flags for/from liaisons | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Red flags for/from liaisons (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:01 | |
| johnsom | No issues | 16:01 |
| bknudson | nothing for keystone | 16:01 |
| dims_ | bknudson: johnsom: glad to hear | 16:01 |
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| jungleboyj | Nothing for Cinder. | 16:02 |
| dims_ | thanks jungleboyj | 16:02 |
| dims_ | #topic Releases for Mitaka | 16:02 |
| dims_ | Is there any libraries that really need releases from master asap? | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Releases for Mitaka (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:02 | |
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| stevemar_ | 2o/ | 16:02 |
| dims_ | hey stevemar_ | 16:02 |
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| stevemar_ | err o/ | 16:02 |
| stevemar_ | hi dims_! | 16:02 |
| stevemar_ | we're the cool underscore guys | 16:02 |
| dims_ | haha | 16:03 |
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| harlowja_at_home | oh, i'd like to get taskflow out, i guess i can submit a change for that ? | 16:03 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: yes, please go ahead | 16:03 |
| harlowja_at_home | to release repo or something | 16:03 |
| harlowja_at_home | k, will do | 16:03 |
| kzaitsev_mb | . | 16:03 |
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| dims_ | #topic oslo.service liberty/grenade scenario problem | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "oslo.service liberty/grenade scenario problem (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:03 | |
| dims_ | sdague: eezhova: ping | 16:04 |
| dims_ | https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.service/+bug/1446583 | 16:04 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1446583 in oslo.service "services no longer reliably stop in stable/liberty / master" [Critical,New] | 16:04 |
| stevemar_ | ugh, going right into the hard one | 16:04 |
| dims_ | not sure if either of them are here. but worth a shout out :) | 16:04 |
| bknudson | I guess I didn't fix that one. | 16:04 |
| harlowja_at_home | ya, i wonder why thats happening | 16:04 |
| sdague | dims_: increasing the shutdown time has helped some, but it's still around a bit | 16:04 |
| dims_ | sdague: ah. | 16:04 |
| sdague | the fix so far was moving the timeout from 10s to 30s for shutdown | 16:04 |
| harlowja_at_home | can it be locally reproduced without requiring nova, like in a small example? | 16:05 |
| sdague | however, it's still popping up | 16:05 |
| bknudson | seems like if you tell something to shut down it should shut down, but then it looked like some people don't like things shutting down. | 16:05 |
| dims_ | last update seems to be https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.service/+bug/1446583/comments/54 | 16:05 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1446583 in oslo.service "services no longer reliably stop in stable/liberty / master" [Critical,New] | 16:05 |
| sdague | so, the real issue seems to be children with in flight work, which is why it's a race | 16:05 |
| dims_ | hence pops up in grenade test | 16:06 |
| bknudson | the gate tests don't care about the in-flight work? | 16:06 |
| dhellmann | that comment about killing the process group seems interesting | 16:06 |
| sdague | harlowja_at_home: eezhova said they reproduced it locally, but you do need real services, plus them doing real work | 16:06 |
| harlowja_at_home | k | 16:06 |
| harlowja_at_home | services doing fake work :-P | 16:06 |
| harlowja_at_home | *computing PI | 16:06 |
| sdague | dhellmann: yes, I'm getting some patches up to see what that looks like | 16:06 |
| dims_ | sdague: ack, will keep an ear out for eezhova's updates | 16:06 |
| sdague | and if it makes things better | 16:06 |
| dhellmann | sdague: ++ | 16:07 |
| amrith | anybody home? | 16:07 |
| dims_ | amrith: yes, we are talking :) | 16:07 |
| amrith | is there an oslo meeting today? | 16:07 |
| bknudson | kill -9 will shut things down. | 16:07 |
| haypo | amrith: yes, it's here, right now :) | 16:07 |
| dims_ | ok switching topics | 16:08 |
| dims_ | #topic openstack spec reviews - rabbitmq driver using pika | 16:08 |
| dims_ | #lin khttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/228992/ | 16:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "openstack spec reviews - rabbitmq driver using pika (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:08 | |
| dims_ | reviews please! | 16:08 |
| sdague | bknudson: right, but then what we're saying is we expect all init scripts to kill -9 | 16:08 |
| dims_ | dukhlov has a few reviews up with code in oslo.messaging, devstack as well | 16:09 |
| dims_ | my feeling is to start the code into a feature branch and get tempest up and running | 16:09 |
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| dims_ | like zmq | 16:09 |
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| harlowja_at_home | i like that to dims_ | 16:09 |
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| dims_ | thanks harlowja_at_home | 16:10 |
| harlowja_at_home | will be interesting to see where this goes | 16:10 |
| bknudson | we should make more use of feature branches but there's maintenance work required. | 16:10 |
| dims_ | anyone objections? (i.e. only after the spec gets merged as usual) | 16:10 |
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| bknudson | so kombu is done? | 16:11 |
| dims_ | bknudson: not a replacement | 16:11 |
| harlowja_at_home | define done | 16:11 |
| haypo | dims_: a feature branch sounds like a good idea | 16:11 |
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| bknudson | it's not supported. | 16:11 |
| harlowja_at_home | i think we need experience with pika to say much of anything 'done' vs 'not done' | 16:11 |
| harlowja_at_home | i would hope not, this is an alternative that imho needs to prove itself | 16:11 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: right | 16:11 |
| ozamiatin | dims_: my only trouble with feature branch were that I could't merge master into it (only release team can) | 16:11 |
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| bknudson | the spec says kombu isn't supported | 16:11 |
| harlowja_at_home | yes, i commented on that | 16:12 |
| dims_ | ozamiatin: i can do that i think else will request for karma to do that | 16:12 |
| bknudson | you can get auth to merge to feature branch | 16:12 |
| ozamiatin | dims_: yeah, so we need to merge things time after time to keep gates up | 16:12 |
| dhellmann | dims_: this is a new driver, right, not a reimplementation of the existing driver? | 16:12 |
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| dims_ | dhellmann: yes, new driver that does the same thing that the old driver does | 16:12 |
| harlowja_at_home | bknudson, i wouldn't exactly call kombu not supported, seeing that its used and is actively worked on (unless the git repo is lying to me), which is why i objected to that statement in the spec | 16:12 |
| * dhellmann apologizes if that's covered in the spec | 16:12 | |
| dims_ | dhellmann: and supports same config options | 16:13 |
| bknudson | weird. | 16:13 |
| harlowja_at_home | flaper87, is kombu dead? | 16:13 |
| bknudson | why have 2 drivers for rabbit? | 16:13 |
| ozamiatin | bknudson: pivotal recommended pika AFAIK | 16:13 |
| dhellmann | harlowja_at_home: that's a good point, the folks from rabbit brought that up at the summit and it wasn't clear why pika is really considered better | 16:14 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: hence the trial | 16:14 |
| harlowja_at_home | right, pika imho needs to prove itself, which i'm fine with, thats life :-P | 16:14 |
| bknudson | pivotal can't work with kombu? | 16:14 |
| dhellmann | dims_: is this just a matter of them wanting us to use a lib they control vs. one they don't? | 16:14 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: we can't tell if it's better unless we try especially HA destructive scenarios with rabbitmq | 16:14 |
| dhellmann | ah, ok, so pika may handle some failure cases better? | 16:14 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: they know it better so they can help us fix things btter | 16:14 |
| harlowja_at_home | bknudson, stop asking all the hard questions, lol | 16:15 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: y that's what they say | 16:15 |
| dhellmann | dims_: ok, it would be good to get some more detail about that in this spec, I think | 16:15 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: right, so dmitry is exploring all of that using actual code | 16:15 |
| harlowja_at_home | funny comment from the spec imho | 16:15 |
| harlowja_at_home | 'About kombu. You can continue use it if it works fine. But in our case we have problems with RabbitMQ stable work in HA mode. And when we asked RabbitQM developers for help in bugfixing they said that it is possible but first of all update your environment to recommended library stack. It is mane reason of developing this driver.' (from dimitry) | 16:15 |
| jungleboyj | harlowja_at_home: That is what bknudson does. | 16:16 |
| dhellmann | dims_: ack | 16:16 |
| harlowja_at_home | ;) | 16:16 |
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| bknudson | I'm not a fan of having to support 2 drivers indefinitely, so I don't think we should pick up a new driver unless we're really planning on deprecating kombu/rabbit. | 16:16 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: y, it's been brought up by pivotal folks in a lot of occasions | 16:16 |
| harlowja_at_home | dims_, anyway we can get a comment from pivotal on this, it seems a little odd to me | 16:16 |
| harlowja_at_home | upgrade to pika, or we won't help u | 16:17 |
| harlowja_at_home | that seems weird :-/ | 16:17 |
| dims_ | bknudson: hence the feature branch | 16:17 |
| dims_ | bknudson: so decision to deprecate the existing one can be taken later | 16:17 |
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| dims_ | so let's debate on the spec :) | 16:17 |
| harlowja_at_home | i will offer kombu support for half the price pivotal will :-P | 16:17 |
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| harlowja_at_home | (j/k) | 16:18 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: yes, i requested Michael Klishin to respond on the spec | 16:18 |
| harlowja_at_home | cools, let's see where this ship takes us, haha | 16:18 |
| dims_ | #link https://github.com/rabbitmq/rabbitmq-website/issues/6 | 16:18 |
| dhellmann | dims_: I like the idea of a feature branch | 16:18 |
| haypo | for me, it's ok to support the two drivers during a few cycles | 16:18 |
| haypo | it's hard to estimate which one will be the best right now | 16:19 |
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| haypo | (it's hard to estimate right now which one will be the best) | 16:19 |
| harlowja_at_home | haypo, agreed | 16:19 |
| dims_ | haypo: we can decide around milestone-2 to merge into master or leave it in feature branch | 16:19 |
| haypo | a driver is not 100k of code, it's much smaller :-p | 16:20 |
| dims_ | #topic summit request for sessions | 16:20 |
| dims_ | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mitaka-oslo-summit-planning | 16:20 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "summit request for sessions (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:20 | |
| harlowja_at_home | more sessions! | 16:20 |
| harlowja_at_home | dims_, do we have a count of how many we can actually have yet? to help prune that etherpad down | 16:21 |
| haypo | (oh, i didn't propose asynio this time :-) i abandonned my idea to replace eventlet with asyncio. i will retry in 10 years when openstack will drop python 2 support) | 16:21 |
| haypo | asyncio* | 16:21 |
| dims_ | #link current layout https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tpLN5emWhcMmSmkn8z_HuclcjnEPevP77BhdnFN9KCs/pubhtml?gid=5&single=true | 16:21 |
| harlowja_at_home | haypo, lol | 16:21 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: ^^ | 16:21 |
| harlowja_at_home | dims_, thx | 16:21 |
| bknudson | keystone can drop eventlet support this release. | 16:21 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: haha | 16:21 |
| haypo | and i didn't propose python 3 this time... because all libraries are now compatible with python 3 \o/ | 16:21 |
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| dims_ | bknudson: ++ | 16:21 |
| haypo | bknudson: cool | 16:21 |
| harlowja_at_home | haypo, i'm pretty sure the retrying library can help u with that retry | 16:21 |
| dims_ | bknudson: along with /v2 :) | 16:22 |
| dims_ | haypo: yay! | 16:22 |
| harlowja_at_home | retry(again="10 years") | 16:22 |
| bknudson | we didn't deprecate /v2 yet. | 16:22 |
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| haypo | harlowja_at_home: lol | 16:22 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: 3 fishbowls and 5 work sessions | 16:22 |
| harlowja_at_home | cool | 16:22 |
| haypo | oh, someone really wrote "Anything we can do with python3?" | 16:23 |
| haypo | FYI i proposed a cross-project session to discuss how to enable functional tests on python 3 | 16:23 |
| haypo | it's the next major step for python 3 | 16:23 |
| dims_ | haypo: nice | 16:23 |
| dims_ | haypo: sirushti is doing good with that devstack patch from dhellmann. so yay for that too | 16:23 |
| harlowja_at_home | so 8 sessions, that maps pretty nicely to that etherpad i think | 16:23 |
| haypo | i'm not sure that it's required to discuss that in an oslo meeting. what do you think? | 16:23 |
| dhellmann | yay, sirushti!! | 16:24 |
| dims_ | :) celebrate awesomeness has no limits | 16:24 |
| dims_ | #topic feedback from other teams | 16:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "feedback from other teams (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:24 | |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: please paste your etherpad link | 16:24 |
| harlowja_at_home | oh ya, locating | 16:24 |
| dims_ | sorry i did not give you feedback last week | 16:25 |
| harlowja_at_home | np, just gotta find the link, ha | 16:25 |
| dims_ | dhellmann: other than liaisons is there any other way to get some feedback from other dev teams that you would recommend? | 16:26 |
| harlowja_at_home | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/oslo-mikata-survey | 16:26 |
| harlowja_at_home | found it! | 16:26 |
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| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: thanks | 16:26 |
| harlowja_at_home | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/oslo-mikata-survey | 16:26 |
| harlowja_at_home | so that was just some ideas i was thinking about | 16:26 |
| dims_ | folks please look ^^^ | 16:26 |
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| harlowja_at_home | see if can get feedback that people may not usually give | 16:26 |
| harlowja_at_home | in a forum that we can propose questions, and all that, without having people be shy about answering.. | 16:27 |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: should we ask people to respond inline on the etherpad? | 16:27 |
| harlowja_at_home | sure | 16:27 |
| dhellmann | dims_: maybe talking to liaisons/PTLs/cores 1:1 ? that's time-consuming | 16:27 |
| harlowja_at_home | mutate the etherpad if u want, or can be done differently | 16:27 |
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| dims_ | dhellmann: we can try an email to openstack-dev first and then try to raise the question in different weekly meetings | 16:28 |
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| haypo | we should maybe add a question on API stability to the survey? | 16:28 |
| harlowja_at_home | haypo, sure | 16:28 |
| dims_ | haypo: +1 please throw it in | 16:28 |
| haypo | maybe with a time limit: do you think that the Oslo API were stable enough last 12 months? | 16:28 |
| harlowja_at_home | haypo, sounds good to me | 16:29 |
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| * harlowja_at_home wants to get negative feedback as well, if people don't like things, i'd rather have them say it, so we can fix it... | 16:29 | |
| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: so let's work on the etherpad and send it out say on wed and we can ask liaisons to raise it in their weekly meetings | 16:29 |
| harlowja_at_home | dims_, sounds good to me | 16:29 |
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| dims_ | harlowja_at_home: we can ask them to email both of us direct for negative feedback if necessary | 16:29 |
| bknudson | it might be more interesting to hear from the other devs rather than the liaisons. | 16:29 |
| harlowja_at_home | thats fine to | 16:29 |
| haypo | i added my question, please modify it directly :) | 16:30 |
| dims_ | bknudson: liaisons ask in their weekly meetings and get us feeback from the cores of those projects... | 16:30 |
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| dims_ | thanks haypo | 16:30 |
| harlowja_at_home | bknudson, ya, if we can get people to tell us positive/negative, thats great, even if there is some 'spam' involved, thats ok to, feedback is good | 16:30 |
| dims_ | k. let's try it! | 16:30 |
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| dims_ | thanks for ideas everyone | 16:30 |
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| dims_ | #topic Open discussion | 16:31 |
| dims_ | #endmeeting | 16:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: oslo)" | 16:31 | |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:31 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 5 16:31:12 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:31 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/oslo/2015/oslo.2015-10-05-16.00.html | 16:31 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/oslo/2015/oslo.2015-10-05-16.00.txt | 16:31 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/oslo/2015/oslo.2015-10-05-16.00.log.html | 16:31 |
| dims_ | oops! | 16:31 |
| harlowja_at_home | quickest open discussion ever | 16:31 |
| harlowja_at_home | lol | 16:31 |
| harlowja_at_home | :) | 16:31 |
| haypo | oh, the meeting is already done? | 16:31 |
| haypo | cool, i like short meetings | 16:31 |
| harlowja_at_home | lol | 16:31 |
| haypo | oslo is very efficient | 16:31 |
| dhellmann | heh | 16:31 |
| jungleboyj | Thanks! | 16:32 |
| harlowja_at_home | +1 for efficent | 16:32 |
| harlowja_at_home | lol | 16:32 |
| dims_ | oops! bad cut n paste, we can continue on #openstack-oslo :) | 16:32 |
| haypo | oslo makes your meetings 2 times quicker | 16:32 |
| harlowja_at_home | with 1/2 the fat | 16:32 |
| johnsom | quote him on that | 16:32 |
| haypo | harlowja_at_home: lol | 16:32 |
| dims_ | LOL | 16:32 |
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| harlowja_at_home | alright, guess oslo, bbl (heading in to work land) | 16:32 |
| haypo | there is no "oops, let me continue" bot command? | 16:32 |
| harlowja_at_home | #endmeeting i think is deadly | 16:33 |
| harlowja_at_home | lol | 16:33 |
| harlowja_at_home | like kill -9 | 16:33 |
| harlowja_at_home | ha | 16:33 |
| harlowja_at_home | bb | 16:33 |
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| dims_ | :) | 16:33 |
| haypo | we can continue on #openstack-oslo | 16:33 |
| haypo | it's up to you dims_ | 16:33 |
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| dims_ | haypo: y switched there | 16:35 |
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| lifeless | dims_: o/ | 17:43 |
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| catherineD | #startmeeting refstack | 19:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 5 19:00:17 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is catherineD. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'refstack' | 19:00 |
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| catherineD | roll call | 19:00 |
| pvaneck | o/ | 19:00 |
| catherineD | #link meeting agenda and notes, please feel free to add items https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/refstack-meeting-15-10-05 | 19:01 |
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| rockyg | 0/ | 19:03 |
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| sslypushenko__ | o/ | 19:03 |
| catherineD | hi everyone ... let's start .. | 19:03 |
| catherineD | #topic Infra hosting | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Infra hosting (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:04 | |
| catherineD | #link Infra hosting https://review.openstack.org/#/c/198869/ | 19:04 |
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| catherineD | latest is we need to parameterize db variable to use Trove | 19:05 |
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| pvaneck | currently working on modifying puppet-refstack to allow mysql_host paramt to be passed in | 19:05 |
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| pvaneck | i think that should be it | 19:05 |
| rockyg | cool | 19:05 |
| catherineD | pvaneck: great ... thank you! | 19:05 |
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| catherineD | it has been a long journey ... we have been working on this since June .... | 19:06 |
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| catherineD | #topic High priority bugs | 19:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "High priority bugs (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:06 | |
| pvaneck | off and on | 19:06 |
| catherineD | #link RefStack sign-in sometimes slow ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/refstack/+bug/1499542 ) | 19:07 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1499542 in refstack "RefStack sign in sometimes slow" [High,Confirmed] | 19:07 |
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| hogepodge | o/ | 19:07 |
| dwalleck_ | o/ (ack, was in wrong room) | 19:08 |
| rockyg | :-) | 19:08 |
| catherineD | I have tried it serveral time ... it is intermitten .. | 19:08 |
| pvaneck | to recreate this bug, just try logging in and out a bunch of times on refstack.net | 19:08 |
| davidlenwell | o/ | 19:08 |
| rockyg | It might be the service, not our app. | 19:08 |
| sslypushenko__ | I hited this bug several times | 19:09 |
| catherineD | hey davidlenwell: | 19:09 |
| davidlenwell | hey everyone | 19:09 |
| * rockyg waves to davidlenwell | 19:09 | |
| catherineD | according to pvaneck: it happened during verification .... | 19:09 |
| pvaneck | everytime is it slow, it always take ~128 seconds to return, which makes me think it is a delay security measure | 19:10 |
| rockyg | or a timeout | 19:10 |
| pvaneck | yea | 19:10 |
| rockyg | but security to avoid DOS also sounds right | 19:11 |
| sslypushenko__ | openstackid.org is running on PHP, so I'm not wondered) | 19:11 |
| pvaneck | however, I can not recreate this on my local refstack server which also uses the official openstackid service | 19:12 |
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| sslypushenko__ | We can talk with infra about it | 19:12 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: but I do not have that issue when log into OpenStack .. | 19:12 |
| rockyg | Yup. davidlenwell, which company's hosting service do you use, again? | 19:13 |
| sslypushenko__ | There is some other kind of auth there | 19:13 |
| davidlenwell | its on dreamhost compute right now | 19:13 |
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| davidlenwell | because its free to me | 19:13 |
| rockyg | Ah. So, maybe we need to talk to one of those guys. reed is one of them, now. | 19:13 |
| pvaneck | how necessary is the verification post request to openstackid? | 19:14 |
| sslypushenko__ | catherineD Openstack.org don't send verify request I think, I can checked it for sure | 19:14 |
| rockyg | And, uh, so are you, davidlenwell | 19:14 |
| reed | wazzup rockyg? | 19:14 |
| rockyg | I forgot. | 19:14 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: that is why we think we may be over kill with verification? | 19:14 |
| rockyg | reed, question about dreamhost and some timeout issues where seeing. | 19:14 |
| sslypushenko__ | pvaneck I don't know) I found that storyboard is doing same request | 19:14 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: thx pls check ... | 19:14 |
| * reed checks #1499542 | 19:15 | |
| sslypushenko__ | to launchpad... | 19:15 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: I think I used to have same experience with long log in time with storyboard ... | 19:15 |
| pvaneck | rockyg, don't think it is a timeout, since openstackid does actually return a valid response | 19:15 |
| davidlenwell | I don't think it could be an issue with dream compute | 19:16 |
| pvaneck | don't think so either | 19:16 |
| rockyg | Yeah, that's why reed is reading the bug.... | 19:16 |
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| davidlenwell | well .. since dream compute is running the akanda stack .. and any network related timeout woult fall into that.. I really don't think thats it.. | 19:17 |
| reed | i have no idea why that happens | 19:18 |
| catherineD | so may be we should look into the necessity of the verification step by first checking with infra? | 19:18 |
| rockyg | Wondering if it could be some type of protectionf for DOS. But, it might be on the verification side. | 19:18 |
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| davidlenwell | I can run some tests locally.. I have a sort of mirror of the dream compute stack here | 19:18 |
| reed | i'd pull in the openstack-web project | 19:18 |
| sslypushenko__ | catherineD Good idea | 19:19 |
| catherineD | davidlenwell: it is intermittent ... on and off | 19:19 |
| rockyg | Yeah. The question is really, where in the pipeline the delay really happens. | 19:19 |
| * davidlenwell will look at the code today | 19:19 | |
| davidlenwell | could be lots of things | 19:19 |
| rockyg | logs on the vm and hosting service should be able to say whether internal or external to dreamhost | 19:19 |
| catherineD | thx davidlenwell: for look at the code ... | 19:20 |
| sslypushenko__ | catherineD Also we can do kind of workaroud... Run verification in background and revoke sign-in if it fails | 19:20 |
| reed | davidlenwell, you can also ask fungi for help to look at openstackid | 19:20 |
| fungi | yep | 19:20 |
| davidlenwell | rockyg: I use vm's on the same cloud for all my personal hosting and this irc bouncer im using right now.. I really don't think its a problem with the hosting company or configs there | 19:21 |
| rockyg | great! | 19:21 |
| rockyg | so, off to fungi and openstackid logs | 19:21 |
| reed | or try and use the dev server, openstackid-dev.openstack.org to isolate | 19:21 |
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| davidlenwell | reed: good call | 19:21 |
| reed | the dev server should have the same code as openstackid or close enough | 19:21 |
| fungi | yeah, sync up with me outside the meeting and i can review logs | 19:22 |
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| pvaneck | sure | 19:22 |
| rockyg | best way it probably to get together with fungi, make it happen, then have the time box to look at logs. | 19:22 |
| catherineD | #action Check with Infra on the necessity of the verification step | 19:23 |
| catherineD | #action Consider debug with openstackid-dev to isolate issues .. | 19:24 |
| catherineD | any other actions? | 19:24 |
| rockyg | yeah, sync with infra for a test session | 19:24 |
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| catherineD | the issue here is it does no happen all the time .... | 19:25 |
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| davidlenwell | I feel like its a browser thing if it isn't consistant | 19:26 |
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| pvaneck | it is easily recreatable, just takes a few login attempts | 19:26 |
| * davidlenwell is trying to stand up a test in a vm now.. might ping pvaneck if I get stuck | 19:27 | |
| pvaneck | and i've verified it gets hung up on the verification post request in the apache logs | 19:27 |
| davidlenwell | ahh .. | 19:27 |
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| catherineD | anything else? move on to the next topic ..? | 19:28 |
| pvaneck | go ahead | 19:28 |
| rockyg | pvaneck, could you add the info about the post request to the bug? | 19:28 |
| catherineD | #topic refstack-client fails to run when using an accounts file for Tempest ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/refstack/+bug/1501903 ) | 19:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "refstack-client fails to run when using an accounts file for Tempest ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/refstack/+bug/1501903 ) (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:28 | |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1501903 in refstack "refstack-client fails to run when using an accounts file for Tempest" [High,Confirmed] - Assigned to Daryl Walleck (dwalleck) | 19:28 |
| pvaneck | rockyg, sure. i'll elaborate more | 19:29 |
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| dwalleck_ | I'm working on adding the requested additional tests. I'm trying to avoid adding any new files to do that | 19:29 |
| dwalleck_ | Or only one at least | 19:29 |
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| catherineD | dwalleck_: thx for submit the bug and provide a patch for fix . | 19:29 |
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| sslypushenko__ | dwalleck_ adding fake_accounts.yaml is ok | 19:30 |
| dwalleck_ | sslypushenko__: Thanks, I was hoping so. That still leaves the empty file case, but I can try to be creative | 19:31 |
| dwalleck_ | I'll wrap that up this afternoon | 19:31 |
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| catherineD | I think we are in good hands on this one ... | 19:32 |
| catherineD | moving on .. | 19:32 |
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| catherineD | #topic Check for RSA key existence before accepting uploading data.( https://review.openstack.org/#/c/228565/ ) | 19:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Check for RSA key existence before accepting uploading data.( https://review.openstack.org/#/c/228565/ ) (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:32 | |
| catherineD | To me there are 2 aspects to this spec ... | 19:32 |
| rockyg | might need to check for both rsa and dsa if no rsa present | 19:33 |
| catherineD | The most important aspect for me at this time is .. currently our data is associated to key ... data will be lost if key not uploaded or deleted ... | 19:34 |
| sslypushenko__ | catherineD data will be unowned, not lost) | 19:34 |
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| rockyg | so, do you really need the key for anything but upload? | 19:35 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: once data is unowned we will not be able to access it .... | 19:35 |
| sslypushenko__ | I was planning to add general_admin role to RefStack with right to see and manage all unowned results. | 19:35 |
| catherineD | At the minimum, we should update to associate data to userid ... | 19:35 |
| rockyg | always keep email address associated with the dat once uploaded. | 19:35 |
| sslypushenko__ | catherineD Agreed | 19:36 |
| rockyg | even if email address no longer is an approved user. | 19:36 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: great! I think that is the first step we should do .... associate data to userid ... | 19:37 |
| sslypushenko__ | After results become owned, it should marked in DB some how | 19:37 |
| rockyg | makes it easier for both general admin and corporate admin | 19:37 |
| catherineD | rockyg: from email we will be able to get userid which is guarantee unique in RefStack | 19:38 |
| rockyg | yup. userid works fine, too. Just don't need to worry about key after upload is successful. | 19:38 |
| catherineD | sslypushenko__: agree on once data is associated with user then we can work on authorization parts ... | 19:38 |
| rockyg | Don't need to store key, either. | 19:38 |
| catherineD | now the next aspect is Verification of key existence ... | 19:39 |
| catherineD | we can keep they way we implemented now .... which is only check for key ... this will imply that user to key is 1 to 1 ... and no 2 users can have the same key .. | 19:40 |
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| sslypushenko__ | catherineD agreed | 19:40 |
| rockyg | yup | 19:41 |
| davidlenwell | +1 | 19:42 |
| catherineD | or Option 2: we can add one more parameter (email) to refstack-client to check whether the user has the key ... this lift the 1-1 user to key relationship ... | 19:42 |
| rockyg | KISS | 19:42 |
| catherineD | so option 1: keep what we implement today which is only check for key which has to be unique? | 19:42 |
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| catherineD | may be easier by voting ... | 19:43 |
| davidlenwell | I don't feel like I fully understand option 2 | 19:43 |
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| rockyg | That's why we should keep it simple ;-) | 19:43 |
| davidlenwell | so by adding the email option you are allowing a user to do what ? | 19:43 |
| davidlenwell | assosiate themselves with more than one key? why is the email needed to do that? | 19:44 |
| catherineD | ok so right now when uploading data with signed the only requriement is the user uploads the data with private key ... at the server side we only check whether the key exists in refstack | 19:45 |
| catherineD | we do not check who that key belongs to ... | 19:45 |
| catherineD | that is option 1 | 19:45 |
| davidlenwell | why does it matter who it belongs to? | 19:45 |
| catherineD | option 2 is refstack-client will require both user email and key ... | 19:45 |
| davidlenwell | I don't like option 2.. it doesn't mean anything | 19:45 |
| catherineD | refstack server side wiill check whether that key belong to that user | 19:46 |
| davidlenwell | a key can be passed on to another user if you get re-assigned or change jobs | 19:46 |
| pvaneck | davidlenwell: option 2 just allows multiple users to have the same key since we have the user via the specified email | 19:46 |
| davidlenwell | yeah .. but for what purpose ? | 19:46 |
| catherineD | to associate data to user | 19:47 |
| davidlenwell | so .. multiple users could be assosiated with the same key | 19:47 |
| catherineD | so for me key is like password which is used for authentication ... | 19:47 |
| davidlenwell | the client doesn't need to verify it | 19:47 |
| catherineD | key or password can change ... | 19:47 |
| rockyg | davidlenwell, +1 | 19:47 |
| catherineD | verification is done at the server side not the client side ... | 19:48 |
| davidlenwell | thats not what I mean.. verification is not a nescesarry step | 19:48 |
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| catherineD | which verification? | 19:48 |
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| rockyg | davidlenwell, right. You verify by decrypting the file with the public key stored in Openstack | 19:48 |
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| davidlenwell | verifying tht the user knows the right email address and has the key is pointless | 19:49 |
| catherineD | davidlenwell: the only verification is at the server side | 19:49 |
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| rockyg | If they file can't be decyrpted, it doesn't go in DB. | 19:49 |
| davidlenwell | the key on its own is enough | 19:49 |
| catherineD | davidlenwell: that is not what we verify ... | 19:49 |
| davidlenwell | I know all of your email addresses | 19:49 |
| davidlenwell | just trying to understand what this gains for us | 19:49 |
| rockyg | me too | 19:50 |
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| davidlenwell | I think what it does now is good enough and actually simple and elegant | 19:50 |
| rockyg | are we using the key for decrypting the uploaded files? | 19:50 |
| davidlenwell | I don't think so | 19:50 |
| davidlenwell | its just signing the submission | 19:51 |
| catherineD | from security point of view we are all set with key ... | 19:51 |
| davidlenwell | so that it can be considered valid | 19:51 |
| davidlenwell | okay .. | 19:51 |
| catherineD | the issue here is once the data lands in refstack server ... who own it? | 19:51 |
| rockyg | That would be the right way to do it. Not valid if not decryt]ptable | 19:51 |
| pvaneck | right now, we want the key to be used as a mechanism for associating test results with a user | 19:51 |
| davidlenwell | so it sounds like maybe you are trying to make the system smart enough to accept submission from anyone with the key.. but to also id who used the key by email address | 19:51 |
| rockyg | The server owns it, but the userID that goes with the upload is associated with it. | 19:52 |
| catherineD | today's implementation ... we accept submission from anyone with the key ... | 19:52 |
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| davidlenwell | what I am looking for a clearer understanding of the use case this addresses | 19:52 |
| davidlenwell | trying to back it up for a second | 19:52 |
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| davidlenwell | not trying to be difficult.. I know I've been checked out for a little bit.. | 19:53 |
| rockyg | everybody should have their own keys, shouldn't they? Especially if private | 19:53 |
| rockyg | davidlenwell, me too on this one | 19:53 |
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| davidlenwell | because it seems to me that we have other use cases that we can spend cycles solving | 19:54 |
| catherineD | davidlenwell: yup ... this is a very important topic ... so let's take a much time to discuss so everyone understand what we are trying to sovle | 19:54 |
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| davidlenwell | okay | 19:54 |
| rockyg | I think the server should work the same way review.openstack.org works. | 19:54 |
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| davidlenwell | we can chat offline | 19:54 |
| catherineD | ok let's chat offline ... | 19:55 |
| rockyg | File get encrypted with user's private key and decrypted by o.o | 19:55 |
| davidlenwell | rocky.. that isn't how it works | 19:55 |
| rockyg | I just figured that out. That' | 19:55 |
| davidlenwell | signing and enqryption are different | 19:55 |
| rockyg | s what I had thought the keys were for. :( | 19:55 |
| catherineD | #action RefStack team to discuss Verification of key existence in RefStack IRC | 19:56 |
| catherineD | 4 minutes left ... | 19:56 |
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| rockyg | OH, well. Other online discussion in Refstack | 19:56 |
| catherineD | #topic Open discussion | 19:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: refstack)" | 19:56 | |
| davidlenwell | how many of you will be at the sumimt? | 19:56 |
| catherineD | +1 | 19:56 |
| dwalleck_ | o/ | 19:56 |
| rockyg | o/ | 19:57 |
| pvaneck | o/ | 19:57 |
| davidlenwell | look forward to seeing you all again | 19:57 |
| rockyg | :-) | 19:57 |
| catherineD | yup ... I will create a agenda for the RefStack sessions ... we have 2 slots | 19:57 |
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| catherineD | anything else? | 19:58 |
| hogepodge | o/ | 19:58 |
| catherineD | if not we can end this meeting and continue our discussion in RefStack IRC about the key and user topic ... | 19:59 |
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| catherineD | #endmeeting | 19:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 5 19:59:36 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2015/refstack.2015-10-05-19.00.html | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2015/refstack.2015-10-05-19.00.txt | 19:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/refstack/2015/refstack.2015-10-05-19.00.log.html | 19:59 |
| catherineD | thank you all!!! | 19:59 |
| redrobot | #startmeeting barbican | 20:00 |
| redrobot | ... | 20:00 |
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| * woodster_ o/? | 20:01 | |
| elmiko | o/ | 20:01 |
| arunkant | o/ | 20:01 |
| redrobot | is the meetbot asleep? | 20:01 |
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| redrobot | openstack hey | 20:01 |
| redrobot | openstack I said | 20:01 |
| redrobot | openstack #startmeeting barbican | 20:01 |
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| redrobot | ... | 20:01 |
| rm_work | o/ | 20:02 |
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| rm_work | kinda half here | 20:02 |
| * woodster_ meetbot zzzzz... | 20:02 | |
| rm_work | lol meeetbot | 20:02 |
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| woodster_ | o/ | 20:02 |
| jhfeng | 0/ | 20:02 |
| redrobot | oh well | 20:02 |
| kfarr | o/ | 20:02 |
| dave-mccowan | o/ | 20:02 |
| silos1 | o/ | 20:02 |
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| redrobot | let's keep going and pretend the meetbot is working correctly | 20:02 |
| redrobot | #topic Roll Call | 20:03 |
| redrobot | as usual today's agenda can be found here: | 20:03 |
| redrobot | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Barbican | 20:03 |
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| kfarr | redrobot, did you have an extra space when you said startmeeting? | 20:04 |
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| redrobot | #startmeeting barbican | 20:04 |
| openstack | Meeting started Mon Oct 5 20:04:24 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is redrobot. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:04 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:04 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'barbican' | 20:04 |
| dave-mccowan | o/ | 20:04 |
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| * redrobot is confused | 20:04 | |
| arunkant | o/ | 20:04 |
| rm_work | o/ | 20:05 |
| redrobot | #topic Roll Call | 20:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:05 | |
| redrobot | as usual today's agenda can be found here: | 20:05 |
| redrobot | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Barbican | 20:05 |
| kfarr | o/ | 20:05 |
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| redrobot | kfarr I think you're right | 20:05 |
| woodster_ | o/ | 20:05 |
| redrobot | sorry about that folks | 20:05 |
| spotz | o/ | 20:05 |
| redrobot | ok, let's get this party started | 20:05 |
| redrobot | #topic Liberty RC2 | 20:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Liberty RC2 (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:05 | |
| redrobot | In case you missed it, the release management team released RC2 earlier today: | 20:06 |
| redrobot | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-October/076189.html | 20:06 |
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| woodster_ | nice! | 20:06 |
| redrobot | for details on the bugs that were fixed between RC1 and RC2 see | 20:06 |
| redrobot | #link https://launchpad.net/barbican/liberty/liberty-rc2 | 20:06 |
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| alee | o/ | 20:07 |
| redrobot | Hopefully no critical bugs will be found, and this will end up being Liberty final release | 20:07 |
| edtubill | o/ | 20:07 |
| redrobot | any questions/comments about Liberty RC2 ? | 20:08 |
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| alee | redrobot, sorry - was late - you said it was released, right? | 20:08 |
| redrobot | alee yes, was released earlier today | 20:09 |
| arunkant | redrobot: So barbican is going to be listed as one of services in liberty release notes ? | 20:09 |
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| alee | redrobot, sweet - link? | 20:09 |
| redrobot | arunkant should be... we do have the release-managed tag | 20:09 |
| arunkant | redrobot: Okay..just checking as barbican was not present in kilo release notes.. | 20:10 |
| redrobot | arunkant https://github.com/openstack/governance/blob/master/reference/projects.yaml#L16 | 20:10 |
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| jkf | o/ | 20:10 |
| redrobot | alee see meeting notes for the link | 20:11 |
| alee | redrobot, k thanks | 20:11 |
| redrobot | any other questions re: RC2? | 20:11 |
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| redrobot | ok, moving on | 20:12 |
| redrobot | #topic Mitaka Blueprints | 20:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Mitaka Blueprints (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:12 | |
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| redrobot | Just wanted to remind y'all that the Mitaka cycle is now open, so feel free to submit Mitaka blueprints ahead of the summit. | 20:12 |
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| redrobot | and we actually already have one for review | 20:15 |
| redrobot | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/207317/ | 20:15 |
| redrobot | any questions/comments re: mitaka blueprints? | 20:15 |
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| redrobot | ok, moving on | 20:16 |
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| redrobot | #topic Tokyo Summit | 20:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tokyo Summit (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:17 | |
| redrobot | The Tokyo summit is just over 3 weeks away | 20:17 |
| jkf | How much of the core team is going to be at the summit? | 20:18 |
| redrobot | I don't have anything in particular to talk about... just wanted to give everyone a chance to bring stuff up / ask questions about the summit now. | 20:18 |
| redrobot | jkf good question | 20:18 |
| dave-mccowan | redrobot shall we start an etherpad to add topic for the working sessions? | 20:19 |
| redrobot | jkf I know from Rackspace we're sending all of our core reviewers | 20:19 |
| redrobot | dave-mccowan I think we already have one | 20:19 |
| redrobot | dave-mccowan let me dig up the link | 20:19 |
| redrobot | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/barbican-m-design-sessions | 20:20 |
| redrobot | feel free to add topics to the etherpad | 20:21 |
| dave-mccowan | will do. | 20:21 |
| alee | redrobot, mightbe worth putting in a "who will be there" section perhaps? | 20:21 |
| redrobot | alee +1. just added it | 20:23 |
| jkf | redrobot: Great! I need to chat with Paul and John V about the work theyre doing on the pkcs11 module and compare notes. | 20:23 |
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| redrobot | loos like we'll have a good group going out there | 20:26 |
| redrobot | should be a lot of fun :) | 20:26 |
| redrobot | That's all I had on the agenda for today | 20:26 |
| redrobot | #topic Open Discussion | 20:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: barbican)" | 20:26 | |
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| dave-mccowan | does anyone have any example Heat templates using Barbican resources? | 20:27 |
| redrobot | dave-mccowan never played with Heat before :-\ | 20:29 |
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| silos1 | what should we be preparing for the fishbowl on federated barbican? edtubill and diazjf and myself have a list of use cases and possible solutions to add to the wiki. But since I've never been to the Summit I don't really know what to bring to the fishbowl. | 20:30 |
| woodster_ | dave-mccowan: I think they have a gate job with us...they might have an example there | 20:30 |
| dave-mccowan | i found some racker blogs that had some heat examples but no cloudkeep/barbican | 20:30 |
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| dave-mccowan | woodster_ thanks. i'll look at the heat test code. | 20:31 |
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| redrobot | silos1 fishbowl should be more-or-less like the mid-cycle | 20:31 |
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| redrobot | silos1 except in a big room | 20:31 |
| redrobot | silos1 I'd suggest keep making diagrams, or maybe start a blueprint with the usecases | 20:32 |
| redrobot | silos1 and be ready to talk about it during the fishbowl. | 20:32 |
| silos1 | redrobot: ok. thanks. I'll try and get everything updated in the wiki. | 20:33 |
| redrobot | silos1 with the RCs out of the way, I should have some time soon to diagram the use cases that Joe Savik and I talked about. | 20:33 |
| silos1 | redrobot: awesome. | 20:33 |
| redrobot | silos1 I'll ping you as soon as I have something up | 20:34 |
| redrobot | any other topics? If not we can end the meeting a bit early this week. | 20:34 |
| jkf | Out of curiosity, did anyone get a Barbican talk on standby? | 20:35 |
| jkf | I was surprised to see my talk as the only dedicated Barbican talk at the summit. | 20:36 |
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| redrobot | jkf I'm on a federation panel, but none of my barbican-specific talks were picked :-\ | 20:37 |
| * redrobot makes a note to check the schedule | 20:38 | |
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| redrobot | Alright y'all... looks like we all get 20 minutes of our day back. :) | 20:38 |
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| redrobot | thanks for coming! | 20:39 |
| redrobot | #endmeeting | 20:39 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:39 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Mon Oct 5 20:39:09 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:39 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/barbican/2015/barbican.2015-10-05-20.04.html | 20:39 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/barbican/2015/barbican.2015-10-05-20.04.txt | 20:39 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/barbican/2015/barbican.2015-10-05-20.04.log.html | 20:39 |
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| elmiko | thanks redrobot | 20:39 |
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