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| * kmalloc lurks while coffee is brewing. | 16:00 | |
| cmurphy | #startmeeting keystone | 16:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Apr 16 16:00:23 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is cmurphy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** bhavikdbavishi has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 16:00 | |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 16:00 |
| vishakha | o/ | 16:00 |
| cmurphy | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting agenda | 16:00 |
| cmurphy | hiya | 16:00 |
| cmurphy | please go ahead and add things to the agenda | 16:01 |
| lbragstad | o/ | 16:01 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 16:02 |
| cmurphy | #topic Summit/PTG planning | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Summit/PTG planning (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:03 | |
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| cmurphy | I created a team dinner poll | 16:04 |
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| cmurphy | #link https://framadate.org/BHNNU9S3f9N3lasH team dinner poll | 16:04 |
| cmurphy | please fill it out :) | 16:04 |
| kmalloc | i wont be there =/ | 16:05 |
| cmurphy | :'( | 16:05 |
| kmalloc | have food / drink for me! | 16:05 |
| cmurphy | will do :) | 16:06 |
| cmurphy | I'm looking forward to hanging out with the team, without the PTGs it feels like forever since we were last together | 16:07 |
| vishakha | kmalloc: would not be able to meet you :( | 16:07 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 16:07 |
| gagehugo | only 2x a year now | 16:08 |
| cmurphy | might want to think about midcycles again | 16:09 |
| cmurphy | that's all I had on that | 16:09 |
| cmurphy | #topic Cycle schedule | 16:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Cycle schedule (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:10 | |
| kmalloc | a virtual midcycle would be a good thing to consider as well | 16:10 |
| cmurphy | ++ | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | just help with the avoid travel but dedicate time with video/face-to-face work. | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | high-bandwidth comms is what matters, not physical presence unless most people are all in one location. | 16:11 |
| cmurphy | aligning timezones would be a little tricky though | 16:11 |
| vishakha | may be remote PTG for those who cannot join? | 16:11 |
| kmalloc | I'm inclined to say if we plan it out, timezones can be worked around. I'd personally have no issue doing night-work. | 16:12 |
| kmalloc | since it's dedicated time(s) for this and not recurring like a weekly-meeting | 16:12 |
| gagehugo | I can be flexible as well with times for this | 16:12 |
| cmurphy | awesome :) | 16:13 |
| kmalloc | it would be ~2-3 days of adjusted schedule at most. | 16:13 |
| cmurphy | well let's get past this upcoming in-person ptg and then we can start planning out a virtual midcycle | 16:13 |
| kmalloc | wfm. | 16:13 |
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| lbragstad | "get past" == "survive", right? | 16:14 |
| gagehugo | yes | 16:14 |
| cmurphy | lol yes | 16:14 |
| cmurphy | regarding the milestone schedule, does anyone have feedback about the deadlines we set for last cycle? spec freeze, feature freeze, etc? | 16:15 |
| cmurphy | since train is already started we kind of have to start planning that out now rather than waiting to do it at the ptg i think | 16:15 |
| lbragstad | #link https://releases.openstack.org/rocky/schedule.html rocky schedule for reference | 16:15 |
| lbragstad | #link https://releases.openstack.org/stein/schedule.html stein schedule for reference | 16:15 |
| cmurphy | thanks lbragstad | 16:15 |
| lbragstad | was the only difference between rocky and stein that we bumped feature freeze back to milestone 3? | 16:16 |
| cmurphy | it looks like it | 16:17 |
| cmurphy | stein was a longer cycle though, which might have been why | 16:17 |
| lbragstad | yeah.. i think we were also a bit leary of another situation like we had in queens | 16:17 |
| lbragstad | but zuul has stabilized since then | 16:18 |
| cmurphy | it definitely wasn't as bad this time | 16:18 |
| * lbragstad is thankful for that | 16:19 | |
| lbragstad | i know a lot of what i was working on crept past feature freeze and ultimately required subsequent RCs (apologies) | 16:19 |
| kmalloc | eh. it wasn't bad. | 16:20 |
| cmurphy | it was useful to have those changes in, but we might want to try to avoid it next time and treat the RC period as a real freeze | 16:21 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 16:21 |
| lbragstad | my hope is that we can clean up the remaining scope work and default roles work early in train | 16:21 |
| cmurphy | ++ | 16:21 |
| lbragstad | so we don't have a mad rush for that kind of stuff | 16:22 |
| cmurphy | what about spec proposal freeze/spec freeze? should we leave those at milestones 1 and 2 or shift them? | 16:22 |
| kmalloc | i prefer that work being in Stein so we can work on in being useful in train | 16:22 |
| cmurphy | ++ | 16:22 |
| kmalloc | if it hadn't landed, i don't think we'd be lined up for real use in the release beyond train. | 16:23 |
| kmalloc | and semi-used in train. we run ~2 cycles ahead of feature use. | 16:23 |
| gagehugo | if we follow the milestone then spec freeze will be june 03-07 for train | 16:23 |
| lbragstad | re: spf and sf - i think exceptions for specs has been pretty rare | 16:24 |
| lbragstad | specifically over the last couple releases, that could be an indication that the dates are working(?) | 16:24 |
| cmurphy | that makes sense | 16:24 |
| kmalloc | I think the dates work. | 16:25 |
| cmurphy | gagehugo: spec proposal freeze would be that week, spec freeze wouldn't be until jul 22-26 | 16:25 |
| gagehugo | oh yeah, I forgot a word | 16:25 |
| gagehugo | so ~1 month post PTG for spec proposals | 16:26 |
| gagehugo | should be fine imo, unless there's a need for more time | 16:26 |
| cmurphy | my issue was always that it feels like the spec freeze is real close to feature freeze and if you leave things to the last minute (which i do) then you're gonna be overworked at the end of the cycle | 16:27 |
| cmurphy | but obviously having the spec freeze date at m-2 doesn't actually mean you can't start working on the code sooner | 16:27 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 16:28 |
| cmurphy | so, sounds like the dates are fine but i encourage people (myself included) to start coding work early | 16:28 |
| cmurphy | anything else to add on this topic? | 16:29 |
| ayoung | sounds good | 16:29 |
| cmurphy | speaking of specs | 16:30 |
| cmurphy | #topic spec review | 16:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "spec review (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:30 | |
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| cmurphy | we already have some specs proposed so it would be good to start looking at them in advance of the ptg | 16:31 |
| cmurphy | #link https://review.openstack.org/650126 Repropose unfinished Stein specs for Train | 16:31 |
| cmurphy | ^ that i think is an easy one to merge nowish | 16:31 |
| cmurphy | there are quite a few more that are being worked on | 16:33 |
| cmurphy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/is:open+project:openstack/keystone-specs Open specs | 16:33 |
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| cmurphy | I linked a bunch more in the agenda, does anyone want to highlight any that are ready or need discussion? | 16:34 |
| cmurphy | there are some old ones that look interesting | 16:34 |
| cmurphy | ayoung: lbragstad there's a -1 on https://review.openstack.org/612099 but i think it's something we agree we want to move toward, can we get that resolved? | 16:36 |
| lbragstad | yeah - i can take a look | 16:36 |
| cmurphy | thanks | 16:38 |
| cmurphy | there's also a bunch of cruft in the ongoing and backlog specs that we should try to clean out or promote | 16:38 |
| cmurphy | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/keystone-specs/specs/keystone/backlog/ Backlog | 16:38 |
| cmurphy | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/keystone-specs/specs/keystone/ongoing/ Ongoing | 16:38 |
| cmurphy | please have a look and we can discuss them more at the ptg | 16:39 |
| cmurphy | #topic open reviews | 16:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open reviews (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:40 | |
| cmurphy | anyone want to highlight reviews that are ready? | 16:40 |
| kmalloc | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/347972/ this one is worth it | 16:40 |
| cmurphy | :) | 16:41 |
| cmurphy | i started going through the review queue back to front and abandoning things that weren't applicable any more and polishing the low hanging fruit | 16:41 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 16:42 |
| kmalloc | That one doesn't join everything. btw | 16:43 |
| kmalloc | but it's a good start | 16:43 |
| cmurphy | kmalloc has thoughts about https://review.openstack.org/441652 updating endpoints via bootstrap, anyone else want to weight in? | 16:43 |
| lbragstad | i wonder if 347972 should have a release note | 16:43 |
| ayoung | Yeah. So, I think most predictable IDs are going to work as is. THe issue that kmalloc raises is with immutable, which is an issue for projects | 16:44 |
| cmurphy | lbragstad: to highlight the performance improvement? | 16:44 |
| ayoung | I think we need a unified approach to multisite. That is going to include service catalog. | 16:44 |
| lbragstad | cmurphy yeah - probably not a huge deal though | 16:44 |
| cmurphy | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 16:45 |
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| ayoung | The general flow I think is going to be something like this: | 16:46 |
| ayoung | we have a central set of services. Maybe just Keystone and horizon | 16:46 |
| ayoung | Keystone needs to be able to talk to the various sites, at differing levels of openstack version | 16:46 |
| ayoung | so, the service catalog in the center needs to identity endpoints at the sites | 16:46 |
| ayoung | but, I think only that | 16:47 |
| ayoung | if IDs are the same, you can use a token from the center at the sites. Otherwise, something like K2K would be necessary | 16:47 |
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| ayoung | that is the general pattern I am seeing among customers today, and all the reviews and discussions I am working on are around those use patterns. ANyone else seeing this? | 16:48 |
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| lbragstad | would setting a project ID be limited to system administrators? | 16:50 |
| lbragstad | even if domain users are allowed to create projects namespaced to their domain, do we expect them to set IDs? | 16:50 |
| kmalloc | I would like to see it as a SystemScope locked action | 16:50 |
| kmalloc | to start* | 16:50 |
| kmalloc | IDs are intended to be generated/managed by keystone | 16:51 |
| kmalloc | but a cloud-admin might have access to the DB and could update it directly if needed | 16:51 |
| cmurphy | i thought we were making project IDs predictable, not settable? | 16:51 |
| kmalloc | a domain admin has no real need for that. | 16:51 |
| cmurphy | domain IDs are settable now | 16:51 |
| kmalloc | i would rather see IDs predictable | 16:51 |
| kmalloc | than explicitly settable though* | 16:51 |
| lbragstad | my concern and the concerns people expressed in the past is that this is changing the API in order to make up for database replication issues | 16:51 |
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| kmalloc | hence System Scope locked. | 16:52 |
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| * lbragstad needs to go back and read the specification | 16:53 | |
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| cmurphy | skimming https://review.openstack.org/#/c/612099/ i only see it talking about predictability | 16:53 |
| kmalloc | as it should | 16:54 |
| kmalloc | i was commenting that if it becomes settable, it needs to be system-scope only | 16:54 |
| cmurphy | i don't think there should be a need for it to be settable, ayoung ? | 16:54 |
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| cmurphy | 5 minute warning | 16:55 |
| lbragstad | also - it looks like projects aren't addressed in that specification | 16:55 |
| lbragstad | but everything else is | 16:55 |
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| cmurphy | oh hmm | 16:56 |
| ayoung | yep. | 16:58 |
| ayoung | there are a few ways we can sync IDs. Predictable is only one of them | 16:58 |
| ayoung | explicitly settable is the other. I can't think of another alternative | 16:59 |
| lbragstad | ayoung what's the reason for projects having their own specification for this problem? | 16:59 |
| ayoung | lbragstad, cuz its HARD | 16:59 |
| cmurphy | project names are mutable :( | 16:59 |
| lbragstad | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/612099/4/specs/keystone/ongoing/predictable-ids.rst@68 | 16:59 |
| lbragstad | ah | 16:59 |
| cmurphy | okay let's finish this in #openstack-keystone | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | i'll take a deeper look at this today | 17:00 |
| cmurphy | #endmeeting | 17:00 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Apr 16 17:00:26 2019 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:00 |
| cmurphy | thanks everyone | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2019/keystone.2019-04-16-16.00.html | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2019/keystone.2019-04-16-16.00.txt | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2019/keystone.2019-04-16-16.00.log.html | 17:00 |
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