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| jgriffith | meeting time? | 16:00 |
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| bswartz | hi | 16:00 |
| xyang | hi | 16:00 |
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| rushiagr | yeah! | 16:00 |
| winston-d | hi all | 16:00 |
| jgriffith | hmmm | 16:01 |
| rushiagr | winston-d: hi | 16:01 |
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| JM2 | hi | 16:01 |
| avishay | hi | 16:01 |
| jgriffith | #startmeeting cinder | 16:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jan 30 16:02:16 2013 UTC. The chair is jgriffith. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'cinder' | 16:02 |
| thingee | o/ | 16:02 |
| winston-d | rushiagr: hey~ | 16:02 |
| jgriffith | Hey everyone! | 16:02 |
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| jgriffith | Nice to see folks all ready to go :) | 16:02 |
| jgriffith | Here's the agenda: http://wiki.openstack.org/CinderMeetings | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | We'll also set aside some time to talk with hub_cap about multi-backend | 16:03 |
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| hub_cap | <3 | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | So let's get at it.. | 16:03 |
| jgriffith | #topic status of blue-prints | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "status of blue-prints (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:03 | |
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| jgriffith | Check out the g3 link | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | https://launchpad.net/cinder/+milestone/grizzly-3 | 16:04 |
| jgriffith | So we have a TON of bp's once again! | 16:05 |
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| jgriffith | I just wanted to make sure folks are making progress here | 16:05 |
| avishay | A lot of them seem to be driver-related, wouldn't get worried about those | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | thingee: let's start with you :) | 16:05 |
| JM2 | and we're getting close to the deadline, right? | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | avishay: easy for you to say :0 | 16:05 |
| avishay | jgriffith: :) | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | JM2: we'll get to that.. but yes | 16:05 |
| jgriffith | maybe thingee is busy... let's see... avishay ? | 16:06 |
| thingee | jgriffith: haven't started cinder client v2 work. already speced it out | 16:06 |
| thingee | jgriffith: not more than a days worth of work. | 16:06 |
| avishay | jgriffith: yes? | 16:06 |
| jgriffith | thingee: ok, great so we're on track | 16:06 |
| jgriffith | thingee: err... just mean that it's still a go | 16:06 |
| thingee | though it's cinder v2 work is not targetted anymore? | 16:06 |
| thingee | cinderclient* | 16:07 |
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| jgriffith | ummmmm | 16:07 |
| jgriffith | thingee: which one | 16:07 |
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| xyang | can doc get in after g3? | 16:07 |
| winston-d | jgriffith: please do... | 16:07 |
| jgriffith | ahhh | 16:07 |
| thingee | jgriffith: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/python-cinderclient/+spec/cinderclient-v2-support | 16:08 |
| jgriffith | Yeah the client stuff is a wreck | 16:08 |
| jgriffith | thingee: I'll fix that right now | 16:08 |
| thingee | as for docs for v1 and v2. I spent a great deal last weekend on this, especially learning to get oxygen to do what I need it to do and trying to create consistent docs like the other projects. | 16:09 |
| jgriffith | thingee: ahh... I remember, I have no milestones enabled for cinderclient proj in launchpad :) | 16:09 |
| jgriffith | thingee: isn't that fun :) | 16:09 |
| jgriffith | So it sounds like no big concerns with getting yor BP's in for G3 correct? | 16:09 |
| thingee | freeze is next week, I can switch to have cinderclient v2 done, and then focus back on docs since people might have opinions on wordage | 16:10 |
| thingee | jgriffith: I don't have doubts | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | thingee: That would be awesome if you have the time | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | Sounds great | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | eharney: around? | 16:10 |
| eharney | yup | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | So what do you think about LIO (other than hating me for me suggestion of migrations) :) | 16:10 |
| eharney | so, i'm getting back to the LIO stuff this week, going to look into migrations and commit changes from the latest review comments | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | eharney: sounds good | 16:11 |
| eharney | i am not too clear on what the migration thing will end up looking like, but going to investigate and see where i end up | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | eharney: If we can't get the migration path that's ok | 16:11 |
| eharney | yeah, hoping i can at least document how to do it | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | eharney: I'm not planning to switch default target or anything yet anyway | 16:11 |
| eharney | right | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | but it would be handy if folks could migrate existing volumes to try it out | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | it might just be an admin extension in cinderclient | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | Or worst case cinder-manage | 16:12 |
| eharney | hmm, yeah | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | TBH, I don't care... that's the one type of thing that I think cinder-manage is still useful for | 16:12 |
| eharney | seems reasonable to me | 16:13 |
| jgriffith | I'd like to see it pretty much go away some day but it's handy for db updates and this sort of thing.... but anyway I'm rambling | 16:13 |
| avishay | what is migrations about? | 16:13 |
| eharney | avishay: how to move from tgtd to LIO for the iSCSI target backend | 16:13 |
| jgriffith | avishay: I'd like to be able to convert existing systems using tgtd to LIO targets | 16:13 |
| avishay | eharney: gotcha | 16:13 |
| avishay | jgriffith: thakns | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | may be a stretch... but worht a shot | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | worth | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: :) | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | oh waitt... | 16:14 |
| jgriffith | eharney: anything else :0 | 16:14 |
| thingee | +1 for cinder-manage | 16:14 |
| eharney | not at this point | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | Ok thanks! | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: around? | 16:15 |
| hub_cap | hai | 16:15 |
| hub_cap | sry was talking to rnirmal | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: need me to come back to ya? | 16:15 |
| hub_cap | naw im good | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: So whatya think about multi-backends? | 16:15 |
| hub_cap | imma bout to push a 2nd review w/ all the necesssaries for volume | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | SWEEEETTTTTT!!! | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | I'm stoked man.... | 16:16 |
| hub_cap | but i still need to work out the weight/cost stuff in the scheduler | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | bah! | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:16 |
| hub_cap | but now it can say if u passed me lvm, i can get you to Q lvmblah | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | need any help from winston-d ? | 16:16 |
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| hub_cap | whens the cutoff? | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | next week... | 16:16 |
| jgriffith | but there is an exception process | 16:17 |
| hub_cap | like END of next week? | 16:17 |
| hub_cap | or what? | 16:17 |
| xyang | hub_cap: does the multiback end also work for other non-lvm drivers? | 16:17 |
| hub_cap | xyang: it will | 16:17 |
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| hub_cap | i just coded lvm cuz it was a "hey look at the review see if you like it" | 16:17 |
| hub_cap | il add to the rest | 16:17 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: you're far enough along that I'm not worried about the deadline here | 16:17 |
| hub_cap | k jgriffith im not worried too much about it iether | 16:17 |
| jgriffith | cool cool | 16:18 |
| hub_cap | im fixing up some tests i broke :) and ill push in like ~1 hr | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | I'm excited! | 16:18 |
| hub_cap | jgriffith: calmate ;) | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | hehe | 16:18 |
| hub_cap | lol | 16:18 |
| avishay | i will review tomorrow | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | alright.. anything else? | 16:18 |
| hub_cap | ill be aorund in cinder to chat about it, cool avishay | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | hub_cap: sounds good | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | Ok.... | 16:18 |
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| jgriffith | DuncanT: ping! | 16:18 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:18 |
| winston-d | yup, i'll remove tomorrow. | 16:18 |
| winston-d | s/remove/review | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | winston-d: remove :) | 16:19 |
| hub_cap | :) | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | don't do that... | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:19 |
| avishay | jgriffith: i have a few loose ends to finish up - the disconnect iscsi thing we discussed, generic iscsi implementation for backup/restore maybe | 16:19 |
| xyang | avishay: you have another patch coming? | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | avishay: ahhh yes... I got to you but then skipped and didn't come back around :) | 16:19 |
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| avishay | xyang: yes | 16:19 |
| jgriffith | avishay: You probably would like me to finish that patch I started for the san.py changes :) | 16:19 |
| avishay | jgriffith: that would be great :) | 16:20 |
| jgriffith | avishay: I'll do that today if folks promise to actually review it ;) | 16:20 |
| * jgriffith is foreshadowing an upcoming topic for the meeting | 16:20 | |
| avishay | jgriffith: i'm also working on an update for the storwize/svc driver for all the new features | 16:20 |
| xyang | avishay: can you tell me the function name that I need to implement to check if there are luns on target | 16:20 |
| avishay | i will review everything | 16:20 |
| jgriffith | Ok... doesn't seem DuncanT is available at the moment... | 16:20 |
| avishay | xyang: as soon as i start coding it (tomorrow?) i will :) | 16:21 |
| xyang | ok | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | Any HP folks around that are working on the swift backup patch? | 16:21 |
| frankm_ | Duncan's on vacation today | 16:21 |
| avishay | jgriffith: I think DuncanT is away traveling now | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: ahh... thanks :) | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | good for him | 16:21 |
| avishay | jgriffith: he's on my side of the pond :) | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | but now you're in the hot seat :) | 16:21 |
| frankm_ | no problem :-) | 16:21 |
| frankm_ | ah... | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: hehe... | 16:21 |
| smulcahy | me too! | 16:21 |
| smulcahy | :) | 16:21 |
| jgriffith | ahhh... well hello smulcahy ! | 16:21 |
| frankm_ | so I'm working through the review comments I got on the latest patch set for volume backups | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | alright... you guys have any updates on this? Seems to have stalled after the last go around | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: cool... any issues? Any ETA's? | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: or not that far yet :) | 16:22 |
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| frankm_ | no major issues so far | 16:22 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: great... any chance we'll see something updated today? | 16:22 |
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| smulcahy | I'd like to merge without possibly having fully resolved the scheduler question - does that seem reasonable? | 16:23 |
| frankm_ | should have a new patch set tomorrow I hope | 16:23 |
| jgriffith | frankm_: tomorrow sounds good... | 16:23 |
| smulcahy | I think thats part of a bigger discussion beyond just the backup/restore functionality | 16:23 |
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| jgriffith | smulcahy: refresh my memory please... | 16:23 |
| xyang | frankm: if we change the swift service to a different backend service and change the backup service flag, does it work for a different backend? | 16:24 |
| jgriffith | crickets.... | 16:25 |
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| smulcahy | some of the backup operations are passed out by the chance scheduler atm - which will not work for a driver without iscsi, but hardcoding all requests to the original host associated with it directly would seem to introduce a spof | 16:25 |
| jgriffith | smulcahy: ahhh yes | 16:26 |
| smulcahy | and this would seem to be an issue for other operations also - presumably the longer term fix is to determine the driver capabilities in the scheduler before deciding where to send the request | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | smulcahy: yeah, I think that's acceptable | 16:26 |
| smulcahy | but that seems bigger than "implement a basic volume backup service" ;) | 16:26 |
| avishay | smulcahy: it's not just capabilties - it's connectivity | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | smulcahy: ok, I think we can wiggle that around later | 16:26 |
| smulcahy | avishay: yes, I'm being imprecise in my problem description | 16:26 |
| smulcahy | but don't want to be mistaken for someone that fully understands this problem :) | 16:26 |
| jgriffith | and I think it's *ok* to go out with limited use cases and build on them | 16:26 |
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| jgriffith | smulcahy: haha | 16:27 |
| avishay | if we're in the iscsi world and everyone is connected to everyone, it's OK. LVM is definitely a problem and Fibre Channel might be too (might have more limited connectivity) | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | LVM uses iSCSI so no problem there ) | 16:27 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:27 |
| smulcahy | xyang: there are no other backends - what we've done is write the hooks to plug in other backends - but it may need some tweaking when someone introduces another backend | 16:27 |
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| jgriffith | Just temporary connections like we do for clones, image copies etc | 16:27 |
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| jgriffith | but I digress.... | 16:27 |
| smulcahy | xyang: not clear on whether its worth doing anything more until we see what another backend service looks like though | 16:27 |
| xyang | smulcahy: ok thanks | 16:28 |
| avishay | jgriffith: right, as long as the implementation in the driver goes via iscsi and not direct - maybe that's a good workaround for now | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | ok... smulcahy frankm_ anything else? | 16:28 |
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| jgriffith | avishay: true dat! | 16:28 |
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| xyang | smulcahy: we are looking into it | 16:28 |
| smulcahy | ah, our initial implementation may use local_path | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | Ok... next | 16:28 |
| avishay | jgriffith: smulcahy: maybe instead of the current LVM backup/restore implementation, make a generic iSCSI implementation for everyone? | 16:28 |
| jgriffith | xyang: ohla | 16:28 |
| smulcahy | avishay: so should we do that before merging or get what we have merged? | 16:29 |
| avishay | that way scheduling is not an issue for anyone | 16:29 |
| avishay | smulcahy: that's up to jgriffith :P | 16:29 |
| smulcahy | xyang: interesting - what will the backend talk to? a second backend would certainly help flush out rough edges in the plugging model | 16:29 |
| xyang | jgriffith: just see if it is possible to use a different backup service | 16:29 |
| jgriffith | avishay: smulcahy I would agree if you can do the generic iSCSI implementation that's ideal | 16:29 |
| avishay | the iscsi attach code just got merged today, so it shouldn't be too much work | 16:30 |
| avishay | (i hope) :D | 16:30 |
| xyang | smulcahy: it will be EMC's backup appliance. don't know if it is easy to use the framework you setup | 16:30 |
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| smulcahy | xyang: I expect it might need some incremental improvement - but better to do so with real examples rather than try to anticipate everything I think | 16:31 |
| xyang | smulcahy: we'll find out:) | 16:31 |
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| avishay | the API is very basic right now and should allow basic functionality to new drivers - I think that is the best way | 16:31 |
| avishay | in time, we can expand the API as necessary | 16:32 |
| smulcahy | avishay: agreed, that was the intention | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | smulcahy: ok... let's see if we can get the iSCSI case in. | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | I just took another look at the code and once the clone patch lands it should be a good template for you to use | 16:33 |
| jgriffith | Next... EMC drivers :) | 16:33 |
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| jgriffith | xyang: you're up :) | 16:33 |
| xyang | xyang: ? | 16:33 |
| avishay | smulcahy: if you need help with the iSCSI stuff let me know - I planned to do it in addition to the LVM implementation, but it makes more sense to do INSTEAD of the LVM implementation | 16:33 |
| xyang | the bp? | 16:33 |
| jgriffith | xyang: So there's a couple | 16:34 |
| jgriffith | One being the Fibre patch | 16:34 |
| jgriffith | The other being the isilon patch | 16:34 |
| xyang | jgriffith: we are working on FC driver and Isilon | 16:34 |
| smulcahy | avishay: will definitely need some examples to work off here I think - I guess we'll see when the clone patch lands - hopefully it should be obvious how to approach it | 16:34 |
| xyang | in good status | 16:34 |
| jgriffith | xyang: Do you have any status updates? | 16:34 |
| xyang | but still waiting for legal | 16:34 |
| jgriffith | good progress on both? | 16:34 |
| avishay | jgriffith: what clone patch? | 16:34 |
| jgriffith | ahh... stupid lawyers | 16:34 |
| xyang | yes, good progress on both | 16:34 |
| xyang | For FC, there's dependency | 16:35 |
| jgriffith | ok, I'll update the BP's to reflect your statement :) | 16:35 |
| kmartin | xyang: Still waiting on the FC nova changes to be reviewed | 16:35 |
| xyang | on HP's code. takes forever for the review to go through | 16:35 |
| avishay | jgriffith: i think we might need some flexibility in adding FC to drivers - we can't test until the nova code goes in | 16:35 |
| xyang | kmartin, yes | 16:35 |
| xyang | I got draft code form kmartin and it helps a lot. | 16:36 |
| jgriffith | xyang: avishay understood | 16:36 |
| avishay | The draft is great, but need to test as well :) | 16:36 |
| xyang | Yes | 16:36 |
| avishay | jgriffith: I have an issue with the FC mindset if we have a few minutes | 16:36 |
| kmartin | I should be able to get a new patch up today with the FC driver feedback that I got...thanks everyone for looking at it | 16:36 |
| jgriffith | The only thing I would point out is the statement I made in the HP patch | 16:36 |
| kmartin | sure | 16:36 |
| jgriffith | I think we should be extracting out any shared code possible into a fibre_channel.py | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | parent class | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | Something to enable other folks to use if they have FC devices going forward | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | I need to look again at how you guys handled provider location etc | 16:37 |
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| jgriffith | but I'll get back to that later | 16:37 |
| kmartin | jgriffith: sure, will work on that today. | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | kmartin: xyang make sense? | 16:38 |
| avishay | I don't understand why every connection type will be a new class | 16:38 |
| kmartin | yeah | 16:38 |
| jgriffith | kmartin: great... thanks | 16:38 |
| xyang | jgriffith: sure. I'll hear from legal on 2/7. hope that's not too late | 16:38 |
| jgriffith | avishay: why not? | 16:38 |
| avishay | If a back-end supports both, then we need two Cinder instances? | 16:38 |
| jgriffith | huh? | 16:38 |
| bswartz | xyang: wow, your legal team actually gives you dates? | 16:38 |
| avishay | Why not just see what the connection is, and initialize_connection will do the right thing? | 16:38 |
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| jgriffith | avishay: that's fine... | 16:39 |
| xyang | bswartz: I'm not dealing with them directly. that's what I heard:) | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | avishay: what I was getting at is any generic FC operations should be in a seperate module that can be imported | 16:39 |
| kmartin | jgriffith: +1 | 16:39 |
| avishay | jgriffith: and if i want to do that, i inherit from both the iscsidriver class and the fcdriver class? | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | avishay: Sure.. that's your call | 16:40 |
| xyang | +1 | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | personally blending the drivers seems a bit silly to me | 16:40 |
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| kmartin | avishay: I think hmna responded to you comment in the draft | 16:40 |
| xyang | I think they should be separate | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | I would prefer to see inheritance and overriding methods where needed | 16:40 |
| avishay | I think ideally there should only be VolumeDriver, and the rest are helper methods | 16:40 |
| avishay | OK, I guess I'm the minority here :) | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | avishay: hmmm..... | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | avishay: I think your point has meritt, but I am not sure I want to tackle that in Grizzly | 16:41 |
| jgriffith | avishay: also, to be clear I'm not saying there needs to be an FC-driver class | 16:41 |
| avishay | jgriffith: That's fine. I'm planning to keep my driver as 1 class. If people want 3+ classes that's fine, as long as it's not restrictive | 16:41 |
| jgriffith | avishay: I'm saying an FC module more in line with your suggestion here | 16:41 |
| avishay | jgriffith: OK great | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | avishay: fair | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | but from a maintenance perspective inheritance is our friend :) | 16:42 |
| avishay | jgriffith: agreed | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | that's all I'm getting at | 16:42 |
| avishay | OK, enough on this :P | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | Ok... we're probably in agreeemnt and don't even know it :) | 16:42 |
| avishay | exactly | 16:42 |
| kmartin | :) | 16:42 |
| jgriffith | Alright... | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: rushiagr you're up | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: rushiagr looks like your rewrites are about done | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: rushiagr Just needs to get through review | 16:43 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: you talking about the drivers? | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: Yeah, talking about the direct driver additions | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | sorry... that wasn't very clear | 16:44 |
| bswartz | the WIP for the NAS stuff should be in the next few days -- I don't have an exact date yet but I will VERY SOON | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | FYI, I'm just going down the list of the BP's on the G3 page if you're having trouble following me | 16:44 |
| Navneet | direct drivers ok | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | That's why I provided the link at the beginning of the topic :) | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: Ok | 16:44 |
| rushiagr | jgriffith: yes, really soon | 16:44 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: how are the bugs coming ? | 16:45 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: I'm under the impression that most are handled in these two BP's, is that the case? | 16:45 |
| avishay | bswartz: NAS stuff == new NAS service for guests? | 16:45 |
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| bswartz | I believe we're down to only a few bugs | 16:45 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder/+bugs?field.tag=netapp | 16:46 |
| bswartz | avishay: yes -- it's what I presented at the last conference | 16:46 |
| rushiagr | avishay: right | 16:46 |
| avishay | bswartz: rushiagr: OK great | 16:46 |
| Navneet | Jgrifithh:u talking about direct drivers or NAS enhancements? | 16:46 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: I'm not thrilled about introducing a bunch of new code if we're not even fixing the existing code | 16:46 |
| rushiagr | jgriffith: 2 in progress, two will be done in a week | 16:46 |
| rushiagr | in progress == reviews pending | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | rushiagr: Ok, so I'm going to target them all to G3... fair? | 16:47 |
| rushiagr | jgriffith: yes | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | great, those should be our priority right now IMO | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | rushiagr: have you triaged https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder/+bug/1098581 | 16:48 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1098581 in cinder "Netapp: create_volume_from_snapshot of a different size" [Undecided,New] | 16:48 |
| jgriffith | rushiagr: Ok... I'll catch you after the meeting and we can synch up on these :) | 16:49 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: we have a possible workaround for that -- the cause is well understood | 16:49 |
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| rushiagr | jgriffith: i am working on that bug, sorry, i forgot to assign it to myself | 16:49 |
| rushiagr | jgriffith: sure | 16:49 |
| jgriffith | rushiagr: :) No problem | 16:49 |
| jgriffith | rushiagr: Can you go ahead an update the status and add some notes to it when you get a chance please ? | 16:49 |
| rushiagr | jgriffith: sure, will do | 16:49 |
| jgriffith | Ok... we're running out of time as usual :) | 16:50 |
| jgriffith | #topic requirements for new drivers | 16:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "requirements for new drivers (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:50 | |
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| jgriffith | So we talked about this a bit but I was going to post a formal policy on this | 16:50 |
| jgriffith | Wanted to mention it to folks here before doing so ;) | 16:50 |
| jgriffith | My take on this is that anybody is welcome of course, however... | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | For a new driver to be accepted it must meet minimum functionality requirements | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | Those requirements are basicly the base operations in the LVM driver | 16:51 |
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| jgriffith | Ideally you'll offer *more* and have optimizations that make your back-end better | 16:52 |
| JM2 | it would be great to see this written somewhere | 16:52 |
| JM2 | I mean plain english, not just code :) | 16:52 |
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| jgriffith | but you must support the basic API calls: create/delete/attach/snapshot etc | 16:52 |
| smulcahy | jgriffith: so once we get backups merged, every new driver will be required to implement that functionality? | 16:52 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: do you have a stance on drivers that depend on additional nova features which are pending? | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | JM2: Agreed... I'll do it today unless there's a mutiny here ;) | 16:52 |
| smulcahy | jgriffith: not saying thats a bad thing, just wondering | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: example? | 16:52 |
| bswartz | like the coraid AoE stuff | 16:52 |
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| jgriffith | bswartz: so IMO that's a seperate issue from cinder functionality | 16:53 |
| bswartz | the question is would we accept the driver BEFORE the nova patches are accepted, or would we wait? | 16:53 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: we'd wait | 16:53 |
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| jgriffith | There's not much value IMO in having a driver in there that doesn't work with the rest of the project | 16:54 |
| kmartin | agree as long as the backend supports the basic APIs, they should be included in the first relase of the driver | 16:54 |
| bswartz | jgriffith: when you publish the policy it's probably worth explicitly stating that | 16:54 |
| jgriffith | bswartz: good point.. noted | 16:55 |
| jgriffith | alright, I'll see about putting a wiki up today and sending a link out on the openstack-dev ML | 16:55 |
| jgriffith | #topic closing out new drivers | 16:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "closing out new drivers (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:55 | |
| avishay | what about smulcahy 's question about backup/restore for new drivers, and other future features | 16:55 |
| JM2 | if emulation of eg. snapshots (with a slow copy) is allowed, it can useful to state it | 16:55 |
| JM2 | +be | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | JM2: Yup, I'll clarify that | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | I don't care how you implement it.... just that it's there | 16:56 |
| JM2 | ok | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | even if it's slow, ugly, uses duck tape etc :) | 16:56 |
| smulcahy | avishay: the logic for backup/restore should be easy to implement for a new driver, but do you want to *require* that for every driver? | 16:56 |
| avishay | jgriffith: backup/restore, other new features for new drivers? | 16:56 |
| JM2 | (no duck was harmed while cooking the scality driver) | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | avishay: Since backup restore isn't settled yet I don't think it's fair to try and make requirements for folks yet | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | JM2: hehe... good to know! | 16:57 |
| * jgriffith likes ducks | 16:57 | |
| jgriffith | avishay: make sense? | 16:57 |
| * JM2 loves duck liver | 16:57 | |
| * jgriffith mmmmmm | 16:57 | |
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| zykes- | FC SAN update | 16:57 |
| zykes- | ? ;) | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | zykes-: sorry you'll have to wait | 16:57 |
| jgriffith | zykes-: or read the meeting notes | 16:58 |
| avishay | jgriffith: definitely makes sense for now, but the question is if it will ever be a requirement...what about old drivers that won't implement new features? | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | but please don't hijack my meeting this week :) | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | avishay: correct... | 16:58 |
| jgriffith | avishay: my point was backup/restore isn't going to be part of those base requirements | 16:59 |
| jgriffith | avishay: we can figure out what to do going forward in Havana | 16:59 |
| * JM2 sighs in relief | 16:59 | |
| jgriffith | JM2: Yeah, that would be unfair, especially since the code hasn't landed yet IMO | 16:59 |
| jgriffith | avishay: does that make sense? Or am I still not being clear? | 16:59 |
| jgriffith | alright... two more things an 1 minute left | 17:00 |
| avishay | jgriffith: OK, i think the policy is good for now, and for Havana we'll need something more well-defined | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | Oh.. no minutes left | 17:00 |
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| jgriffith | I'm planning to stop accepting BP's for new drivers after this week | 17:00 |
| zykes- | jgriffith: yes sir | 17:00 |
| jgriffith | I should've published something for this earlier, and in the future I'll probably set an earlier timeline like halfway through H3. | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | Anyway... just wanted to give a heads up | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | #topic reviews | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 17:01 | |
| jgriffith | Everybody please, go to https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+cinder,n,z | 17:01 |
| jgriffith | Do a review, do 2, do 3... | 17:02 |
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| jgriffith | do whatever you can | 17:02 |
| jgriffith | The longer things sit the more trouble we have with merge conflicts etc | 17:02 |
| jgriffith | let's keep things rollin here please | 17:02 |
| jgriffith | and we're out of time... | 17:02 |
| jgriffith | Remember openstack-cinder or openstack-dev | 17:02 |
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| hemnafk | morning | 17:02 |
| jgriffith | Most of the folks here are there at all hours of the day | 17:03 |
| jgriffith | and now I'll turn it over to the Xen team | 17:03 |
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| jgriffith | #endmeeting | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 17:03 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jan 30 17:03:15 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-01-30-16.02.html | 17:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-01-30-16.02.txt | 17:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2013/cinder.2013-01-30-16.02.log.html | 17:03 |
| jgriffith | Thanks everyone! | 17:03 |
| JM2 | thanks john! | 17:03 |
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| rushiagr | jgriffith: thanks | 17:03 |
| avishay | Thanks! | 17:03 |
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| johnthetubaguy | hi all, sorry I am late | 17:08 |
| matelakat | hi :-) | 17:08 |
| ameade_ | hey | 17:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | #startmeeting XenAPI | 17:08 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jan 30 17:08:42 2013 UTC. The chair is johnthetubaguy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:08 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:08 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'xenapi' | 17:08 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so did people like the format last week? please +1 or -1 | 17:09 |
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| ameade_ | the meeting format? | 17:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | by which I mean should we use the formal agenda, or just raise questions at the start? | 17:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | yes, sorry I meant meeting format | 17:10 |
| ameade_ | +1 | 17:10 |
| ameade_ | for formal agenda | 17:10 |
| matelakat | +1 | 17:11 |
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| johnthetubaguy | OK, well didn't get any email about adding things to the agenda | 17:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | please to add to the wiki page | 17:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/XenAPI | 17:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | for future meetings :-) | 17:12 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I will try email the request next time | 17:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | Ok... | 17:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic Actions from last meeting | 17:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:12 | |
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| johnthetubaguy | the only action was for me | 17:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | I looked into the python situation in Dom0 | 17:12 |
| matelakat | The swift client, right? | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | just to report back... | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | installing EPEL breaks yum a little bit | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | but installing python 2.6 from EPEL is fine | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | they are independent issues really | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | speaking to some XenServer/XCP folks that is as expected | 17:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | I got a clean install of the swift client | 17:14 |
| ameade_ | I think your notes on it are good | 17:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | thanks, I should add that link... | 17:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/XenServer/PostInstall | 17:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | its documented above | 17:14 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool | 17:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | questions? | 17:15 |
| rainya | more a comment | 17:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | sure | 17:15 |
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| rainya | we haven't had a chance to try it out in our enviornments, but DO plan to pursue that path longer-term | 17:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | cool, sounds good | 17:15 |
| rainya | it seems like the right way to go about doing it, but we've got to see how it works at scale, etc, etc :) | 17:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | drop me a line if you have issues | 17:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | totally | 17:16 |
| matelakat | john, did you tried to use the swift client, or just did the installation? | 17:16 |
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| johnthetubaguy | matelakat: it seemed to work, but I honestly didn't try it out too much | 17:16 |
| rainya | i also want to ping our xenserver guy (who is out right now) to see what (if any) concerns he has for our environment | 17:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool | 17:16 |
| rainya | more to follow! that's all for now from us | 17:17 |
| matelakat | johnthetubaguy: ok | 17:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic blueprints | 17:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:17 | |
| ameade_ | johnthetubaguy: thanks for your help so far | 17:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | not got anything myself, anyone got anything they want to raise | 17:17 |
| matelakat | I have a sort of draft stuff. | 17:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | I was planning on having another XenAPI session at the summit, or at least submitting one | 17:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | so at some point we can thinking about Havana stuff | 17:18 |
| matelakat | but that's more about a review, not really the blueprint itself. | 17:18 |
| johnthetubaguy | anything people have hanging for Grizzly? | 17:18 |
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| johnthetubaguy | matelakat: OK feel free to post a link | 17:18 |
| matelakat | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/xenapinfs-glance-integration | 17:18 |
| matelakat | this is the bp, and the change is: #link https://review.openstack.org/20790 | 17:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | awesome, this is the integration between XenAPI, Cinder and the NFS SR | 17:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool stuff | 17:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK anything else? | 17:19 |
| matelakat | So if you guys have any comments on that, comment on that. | 17:19 |
| matelakat | no | 17:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #topic docs | 17:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "docs (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:20 | |
| johnthetubaguy | lots have lovely features have dropped, are we all OK getting some docs in? | 17:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | there is a nice getting started guide #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Documentation/HowTo | 17:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | and the reviewers have always been very kind to me! | 17:21 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ... silence ... we probably need someone to take this on | 17:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | #action advertise to get more help for XenAPI docs | 17:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | #topic QA | 17:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "QA (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:23 | |
| johnthetubaguy | Any pressing bugs, or reviews, or issues this week? | 17:23 |
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| matelakat | I am looking at the devstack readme at the moment, and try to add some comments to it, to make it easier to get started with devstac/XS | 17:23 |
| johnthetubaguy | sounds good | 17:23 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #topic AOB | 17:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:24 | |
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| johnthetubaguy | #topic Open Discussion | 17:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 17:24 | |
| johnthetubaguy | OK so any other questions from people? | 17:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | I assume people are OK with this time next week | 17:25 |
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| johnthetubaguy | feel free to edit the wiki to add any topics you have #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/XenAPI | 17:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | Ok, so there are some things we have | 17:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | XenAPI lib into Oslo | 17:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | to share between nova and cinder | 17:27 |
| johnthetubaguy | what do people think? | 17:27 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ?? | 17:29 |
| matelakat | So the lib, that would be pulled up, is a sort of xenapi interface, right? | 17:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am +1 for the idea | 17:29 |
| matelakat | At the moment looking at the cinder stuff. | 17:29 |
| matelakat | Let's look at the code, give me a sec.. | 17:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | yes, a layer on top of the very low level XenAPI python driver | 17:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | to share code between Cinder and Nova talking to XenAPI | 17:30 |
| matelakat | #link ttps://github.com/openstack/cinder/blob/master/cinder/volume/drivers/xenapi/lib.py | 17:30 |
| matelakat | #link https://github.com/openstack/cinder/blob/master/cinder/volume/drivers/xenapi/lib.py | 17:30 |
| matelakat | This is the candidate - at least from my side. | 17:30 |
| matelakat | But I wouldn't pull up the whole to oslo. | 17:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | At the same time, we were thinking about tidying up the exception handling | 17:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | XenAPI exceptions tend to pop out, and calling code needs to translate the codes, where as that should probably be part of that shared code, so calling code doesn't need to keep catching exceptions | 17:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | should be easier to test that way | 17:31 |
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| johnthetubaguy | So, we should probably raise this at the summit so it gets more attention | 17:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | And/or just submit things to Oslo for review | 17:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK, any more comments or questions? | 17:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | or random XenServer questions? | 17:33 |
| matelakat | How could we pull things up to oslo, I mean what is the procedure? | 17:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Oslo | 17:33 |
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| johnthetubaguy | OK, so I think we are done for this week | 17:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | thanks all | 17:34 |
| matelakat | thanks, bye | 17:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | same time next week | 17:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | #endmeeting | 17:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 17:35 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jan 30 17:35:21 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:35 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-01-30-17.08.html | 17:35 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-01-30-17.08.txt | 17:35 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2013/xenapi.2013-01-30-17.08.log.html | 17:35 |
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| gyee | dolphm, ayoung, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/20524 | 18:01 |
| gyee | can you guys go through it one more time? we need to close the loop on this one soon | 18:02 |
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| sdake_z | #startmeeting heat | 20:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jan 30 20:00:50 2013 UTC. The chair is sdake_z. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'heat' | 20:00 |
| sdake_z | i think we dont have a quorum because asalkeld, stevebaker, shadower, and shardy are at ocnferences | 20:01 |
| sdake_z | but lets give it a rollcall | 20:01 |
| zaneb | o/ | 20:01 |
| sdake_z | sdake here | 20:01 |
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| sdake_z | #info developers at LCA/FOSDEM/PTO | 20:02 |
| sdake_z | well, i'd just like to say please get cracking on blueprints | 20:02 |
| sdake_z | and keep up bug rate we got a ton of bugs | 20:02 |
| sdake_z | but i'll send out a tactical email on the topic | 20:02 |
| sdake_z | thanks zane for coming ;) | 20:03 |
| sdake_z | #endmeeting | 20:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 20:03 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jan 30 20:03:06 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-01-30-20.00.html | 20:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-01-30-20.00.txt | 20:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2013/heat.2013-01-30-20.00.log.html | 20:03 |
| zaneb | lol | 20:03 |
| sdake_z | 3 minutes ftw | 20:03 |
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| nijaba | #startmeeting Ceilometer | 21:00 |
| nijaba | #meetingtopic Ceilometer | 21:00 |
| nijaba | #chair nijaba | 21:00 |
| nijaba | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/MeteringAgenda | 21:00 |
| nijaba | ATTENTION: please keep discussion focused on topic until we reach the open discussion topic | 21:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jan 30 21:00:07 2013 UTC. The chair is nijaba. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ceilometer' | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | Current chairs: nijaba | 21:00 |
| nijaba | Hello everyone! Show of hands, who is around for the ceilometer meeting? | 21:00 |
| nijaba | o/ | 21:00 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 21:00 |
| n0ano | o/ | 21:00 |
| yjiang5_home | o/ | 21:00 |
| eglynn | o/ | 21:00 |
| apmelton | o/ | 21:00 |
| danspraggins | o/ | 21:00 |
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| jd__ | o/ | 21:00 |
| sandywalsh | o/ | 21:01 |
| nijaba | nice showup! thanks. asalkeld is at at linuxconf.au and may join us if he can. | 21:01 |
| nijaba | #topic actions from previous meeting | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "actions from previous meeting (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:01 | |
| nijaba | #topic nijaba to specify draft policy on wiki for units | 21:01 |
| nijaba | My deepest apologies, I still haven't been able to work on this | 21:01 |
| nijaba | #action nijaba to specify draft policy on wiki for units | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to specify draft policy on wiki for units (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:01 | |
| nijaba | I won't leave to much time for others to blame me :) | 21:02 |
| nijaba | #topic nijaba to untarget synaps bp for now | 21:02 |
| nijaba | #info That was done. | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to untarget synaps bp for now (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:02 | |
| nijaba | #nijaba to propose a doodle for helthmon meeting | 21:02 |
| nijaba | #info Done as well. The meeting occured today and allowed good progress. More to come at the summit. | 21:02 |
| nijaba | comments on this? | 21:02 |
| llu-laptop | o/ | 21:02 |
| nijaba | I guess not! | 21:03 |
| dhellmann | the meeting went well, and I'm looking forward to seeing the blueprints that come from it | 21:03 |
| sandywalsh | my gut says that healthmon, as proposed today, steps on a lot of other projects toes | 21:03 |
| sandywalsh | so getting them in the fold is key | 21:03 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: +1 | 21:03 |
| sandywalsh | and I think they'll span many projects | 21:03 |
| dhellmann | +1 again | 21:03 |
| nijaba | Good to see agreement! | 21:04 |
| nijaba | sounds like some interesting sessions for the summit | 21:04 |
| jd__ | +1 too fwiw | 21:04 |
| sandywalsh | yeah, the summit should be interesting ... lots of whiteboards :) | 21:04 |
| nijaba | hehe | 21:04 |
| nealph | good progress indeed...I was impressed by the open conversation. Look forward to hearing more. | 21:04 |
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| nijaba | moving on... | 21:05 |
| nijaba | #topic nijaba to formaly start ml thread about core dev startus for yjiang5_home and llu-laptop | 21:05 |
| nijaba | #info This was done. We'll discuss this is a moment | 21:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "nijaba to formaly start ml thread about core dev startus for yjiang5_home and llu-laptop (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:05 | |
| nijaba | #topic sandywalsh to start a thread about adopting https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/HACKING.rst | 21:05 |
| nijaba | #info This was done and we'll vote on the adoption in a moment | 21:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "sandywalsh to start a thread about adopting https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/HACKING.rst (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:05 | |
| nijaba | That's it for last week's actions | 21:06 |
| nijaba | #topic yjiang5 and llu-laptop are now core dev for ceilometer | 21:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "yjiang5 and llu-laptop are now core dev for ceilometer (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:06 | |
| nijaba | I would like to formally congratulate both of them, even though they are certainly asleep at this time. I just added them to the ceilometer driver's group. | 21:06 |
| nijaba | #info congratulations | 21:06 |
| sandywalsh | +1 | 21:06 |
| yjiang5_home | really thanks for your trust and will contribute more to the project :) | 21:06 |
| dhellmann | it's nice to see the team continuing to grow | 21:06 |
| sandywalsh | (or +2 I guess) | 21:06 |
| jd__ | that's good news | 21:06 |
| nijaba | yjiang5_home: llu-laptop: good to see you around at such a late time for you | 21:07 |
| eglynn | absolutely, welcome guys! | 21:07 |
| llu-laptop | thanks, looking forward to contirubte more. | 21:07 |
| * jd__ needs more +2 on his patches :-) | 21:07 | |
| * dhellmann needs more hours in the day | 21:07 | |
| * nijaba too | 21:07 | |
| * jd__ pats dhellmann | 21:07 | |
| jd__ | nijaba: has the technical side of adding them been done already? | 21:07 |
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| nijaba | jd__: just did | 21:08 |
| jd__ | awesome! | 21:08 |
| jd__ | llu-laptop: yjiang5_home: feel free to turn your past +1 in +2 then :) | 21:08 |
| yjiang5_home | jd__: :) | 21:08 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: yjiang5_home: please remember not to use the approve status unless you are the second one applying a +2 to a patch | 21:09 |
| jd__ | yeah, that can be tricky | 21:09 |
| jd__ | as soon as you set 'Approve' the patch is merged | 21:09 |
| dhellmann | right, no matter what the other setting is | 21:09 |
| yjiang5_home | nijaba: sure, thanks for reminding. we will learn the gerrit doc firstly. | 21:10 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: yjiang5_home: you know where to find us if you have any questions | 21:10 |
| yjiang5_home | yes | 21:11 |
| llu-laptop | looking in the gerrit, not find the +2 options :-( | 21:11 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: it may need some time for the group membership to propagate | 21:11 |
| nijaba | unless I missed something | 21:11 |
| dhellmann | I think there's a cron job that has to update that configuration setting. | 21:11 |
| jd__ | or maybe we were joking about adding you to the core team, you'll see | 21:12 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: you did receive and email with your new group membership, right? | 21:12 |
| nijaba | s/and/an | 21:12 |
| llu-laptop | nijaba: yes | 21:12 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: then it should propagate soon | 21:13 |
| nijaba | let's move on? | 21:13 |
| llu-laptop | nijaba: ok, i'll wait for that then :-) | 21:13 |
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| nijaba | #topic Vote on adopting the hacking guidelines | 21:14 |
| nijaba | #link https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/HACKING.rst | 21:14 |
| nijaba | Any comments before we vote on the subject | 21:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Vote on adopting the hacking guidelines (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:14 | |
| jd__ | yep | 21:14 |
| yjiang5_home | HACKING requires translation, I'm not sure if we are ready for that. | 21:14 |
| yjiang5_home | others should be ok | 21:14 |
| jd__ | I'm really not confortable having rules that should be detected automagically by rules | 21:14 |
| dhellmann | isn't there a tool for checking? | 21:15 |
| eglynn | how much of the HACKING guidelines are enforcable via the pep8 checks? | 21:15 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: what I'm thinking is typically the import alphabetical order | 21:15 |
| jd__ | this is a PITA, there's no tool for that currently | 21:15 |
| sandywalsh | there is hacking.py for checking | 21:15 |
| jd__ | and nitpicking in the review for that is going to make me cry | 21:15 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: can we put it with tox? | 21:15 |
| dhellmann | jd__: I thought hacking.py checked that | 21:15 |
| dhellmann | #link https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/tools/hacking.py | 21:16 |
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| sandywalsh | jd__: I don't see why not | 21:16 |
| jd__ | I don't know hacking.py, I only saw HACKING.rst :) | 21:16 |
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| jd__ | ok | 21:16 |
| eglynn | +1 for enforcement | 21:16 |
| llu-laptop | jiang5_home: the transaltion framework is already done. What we need to do is to annotate those strings to be translated with _(), and did the actual translation on transifex.com. All others will be done by jenkins. | 21:16 |
| sandywalsh | +1 | 21:16 |
| sandywalsh | (it's the openstack way) | 21:16 |
| dhellmann | if we do adopt it, we should only have hacking.py turned on non-voting in jenkins until we get it passing | 21:16 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann: +1 | 21:16 |
| jd__ | well as long as we can have tools helping us follow any hacking guide and not having humans nitpicking manually, I'm all good | 21:16 |
| dhellmann | I don't want to stop everything else just to fix style issues | 21:17 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: +1 | 21:17 |
| yjiang5_home | dhellmann: +1 | 21:17 |
| nijaba | ready to formally vote then? | 21:17 |
| jd__ | yes | 21:17 |
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| nijaba | #startvote adopt the hacking guidelines? yes, no, abstain | 21:17 |
| openstack | Begin voting on: adopt the hacking guidelines? Valid vote options are yes, no, abstain. | 21:17 |
| openstack | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | 21:17 |
| dhellmann | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| jd__ | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| eglynn | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| llu-laptop | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| yjiang5_home | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| sandywalsh | #vote yes | 21:17 |
| nijaba | #vote abstain | 21:17 |
| n0ano | #vote yes | 21:18 |
| danspraggins | #vote yes | 21:18 |
| nijaba | look like a done deal | 21:18 |
| nijaba | #vote no | 21:18 |
| nijaba | just because I can | 21:18 |
| sandywalsh | haha | 21:18 |
| jd__ | anyone wants to take #action for importing hacking.rst and hacking.py into our git and add this to a non-voting check in jenkins? (can be 2 #action) | 21:18 |
| apmelton | #vote yes | 21:18 |
| sandywalsh | thanks guys, it'll make code reviews cause less neck twitches | 21:18 |
| nijaba | #endvote | 21:19 |
| openstack | Voted on "adopt the hacking guidelines?" Results are | 21:19 |
| openstack | yes (9): apmelton, n0ano, sandywalsh, jd__, eglynn, llu-laptop, dhellmann, danspraggins, yjiang5_home | 21:19 |
| openstack | no (1): nijaba | 21:19 |
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| sandywalsh | #action sandy will integrate hacking.py | 21:19 |
| nijaba | thanks sandywalsh | 21:19 |
| sandywalsh | (since he caused this mess :) | 21:19 |
| jd__ | thanks sandywalsh :) | 21:20 |
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| dhellmann | yes, thanks! | 21:20 |
| nijaba | #topic Approve http://wiki.openstack.org/NewCeilometerAgent ? | 21:20 |
| nijaba | SandyWalsh would like to see this blueprint approved. | 21:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Approve http://wiki.openstack.org/NewCeilometerAgent ? (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:20 | |
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| nijaba | That seems a big change for me, late in the cycle | 21:20 |
| jd__ | We can approve without targetting at G, right? | 21:20 |
| sandywalsh | nijaba: the proposal is to do it in parallel, without upsetting the current agent | 21:21 |
| dhellmann | before we schedule it, let's discuss whether we want it at all | 21:21 |
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| sandywalsh | branches may land, but have no effect (it's like a experimental branch) | 21:21 |
| sandywalsh | *an | 21:21 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: to me, we want it if Nova offers the mechanism to do it | 21:21 |
| nijaba | sandywalsh: do you have the ressources to deliver it before g3? | 21:21 |
| sandywalsh | nijaba: I'm working on it now | 21:21 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: will it get into Nova for g3? | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | jd__: I do have a couple of issues | 21:22 |
| sandywalsh | jd__: we'll make sure nova will have what it needs | 21:22 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: raise, raise then :) | 21:22 |
| nijaba | sandywalsh: so, your proposal is to add this as a new mechanism, not to replace? | 21:22 |
| sandywalsh | nijaba: correct | 21:22 |
| dragondm | Yup, I'm working on nova for this too. | 21:22 |
| sandywalsh | nijaba: we can decide later on the best approach | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | well, for starters, the blueprint assumes that the only information we are interested in collecting from the hypervisor is information that nova is (or will) collect | 21:22 |
| nijaba | mmmh... that removes some of my objections then | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | when we tried to extend the hypervisor API in nova before to collect more data, we were rebuffed | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | so I'm not sure what will be different about that this time | 21:23 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann: myself and dragon have done a lot of stuff in those layers before | 21:23 |
| dragondm | yes. | 21:23 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: the objection was in principle, not over any specific patch or implementer | 21:23 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: yeah that's the point I raised to sandywalsh, but he seems confident to change things on Nova side :) | 21:23 |
| yjiang5_home | dhellmann: Will ceilometer monitor more host information like host utilization etc? | 21:23 |
| dhellmann | that is, they didn't want nova collecting the data | 21:23 |
| dhellmann | yjiang5_home: that is a long-term goal, yes | 21:24 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann: the precedent is already set on the xen side | 21:24 |
| yjiang5_home | dhellmann: then we have two point for this bp: a) will nova provide the instance information, b) will ceilometer need more information that possibly out of nova scope? | 21:24 |
| llu-laptop | dhellman: in that case, I dont think nova will provide enough information in a long-term goal. | 21:24 |
| nijaba | sandywalsh: you mean xcp? | 21:25 |
| sandywalsh | i mean, there is a chance we'll be rebuffed again, but it will make for a wonderful debate :) | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: I would have to go look at that email thread again to see what was being added before. eglynn may remember. | 21:25 |
| * nijaba takes it that sandywalsh loves a good debate | 21:25 | |
| asalkeld | hi | 21:25 |
| asalkeld | (sorry late) | 21:25 |
| nijaba | hey asalkeld | 21:25 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: I need to refresh my memory also | 21:25 |
| nijaba | asalkeld: hope the conf is good | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | if we do win the debate over the nova changes, that still leaves the issue of collecting data not related to instances | 21:26 |
| asalkeld | yea, thx | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | nova does some of that for the scheduler, and we've discussed the idea of moving that into ceilometer | 21:26 |
| sandywalsh | I think we've already determined that there is still a need for another agent. This proposal is the 90% we can cover ... the most common deploys | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | we could leave it in nova, except that then we have 2 projects doing data collection still | 21:26 |
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| sandywalsh | if there are situations where we can't get everything we need we may have to use an agent again, but I think they are very special cases | 21:27 |
| sandywalsh | and deployment specific | 21:27 |
| dhellmann | I'm not sure how collecting scheduler data is deployment specific. | 21:27 |
| sandywalsh | it's not related to the scheduler | 21:27 |
| sandywalsh | the stuff the scheduler needs is what's there now (ram + disk, cpus, etc) | 21:28 |
| sandywalsh | (I put it there :) | 21:28 |
| asalkeld | we were going to be the data collector for scheduler at some point | 21:28 |
| asalkeld | or some suggested it | 21:28 |
| jd__ | this can be an argument for sandywalsh | 21:28 |
| sandywalsh | sure, no reason why you still can't be ... depends on latency really | 21:28 |
| nijaba | asalkeld: vishy did | 21:29 |
| sandywalsh | the scheduler needs very timely data | 21:29 |
| sandywalsh | CM could be too slow for it | 21:29 |
| dhellmann | right, vishy and I discussed it briefly at the grizzly summit | 21:29 |
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| asalkeld | sandywalsh, just how timely | 21:29 |
| sandywalsh | asalkeld: near real-time | 21:29 |
| asalkeld | second/minute? | 21:29 |
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| sandywalsh | the longer the delay the more over allocations will occur | 21:30 |
| dhellmann | collecting the data in a separate process elimintes issues with nova operations affecting the timed process | 21:30 |
| sandywalsh | although some of that may be fixed with belliot's allocation code | 21:30 |
| sandywalsh | that's why we were using the fanout queues from the compute nodes to all the schedulers | 21:30 |
| sandywalsh | broadcast updates | 21:31 |
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| asalkeld | that change is not a simple one | 21:31 |
| sandywalsh | but, perhaps this is a discussion for another topic ... the core premise I think is still sound | 21:31 |
| n0ano | one issue, are we talking about going from a push (nodes send data to scheduler) to a pull model (scheduler asks CM for info)? | 21:31 |
| dhellmann | n0ano: not necessarily | 21:32 |
| sandywalsh | being: we can do most all we need with notifications and a simpler agent model | 21:32 |
| dhellmann | the mandate for this project is to collect and distribute this sort of data | 21:32 |
| sandywalsh | n0ano: there can be different schedulers do things different ways | 21:32 |
| n0ano | in some respects I like CM pushing data as it could send data about multiple nodes in a single message | 21:33 |
| sandywalsh | n0ano: it's just how they update their HostInfo records | 21:33 |
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| dhellmann | sandywalsh: does this plan also include some alternate solution for the instance delete event notifier plugin (mentioned in point 1 of the blueprint)? | 21:33 |
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| sandywalsh | dhellmann: it's just another event in the stream, shouldn't be any different than any other message | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | receiving that event is not, but the reason for the notifier is the race condition between generating it and the instance being deleted | 21:34 |
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| dhellmann | we want to collect final stats on the instance *before* it is deleted | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | and we don't want to charge users for the time it takes us to delete the thing | 21:34 |
| eglynn | we need to capture the last dying breath of the instance ;) | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | so the plugin blocks the operation, collects stats and sends them to the bus, then continues | 21:35 |
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| sandywalsh | dhellmann: in that case, nova should send the additional information in the delete notification. This would require a patch to nova, which we are willing to add. | 21:35 |
| sandywalsh | (in the .start event) | 21:35 |
| jd__ | sounds great | 21:35 |
| eglynn | yep, reasonable solution | 21:36 |
| apmelton | I think that's basically already there, if we want to change only up until the user tries to delete it, then timestamp on the start should suffice | 21:36 |
| dragondm | yah, we can always add data to a notification. | 21:36 |
| dhellmann | that would be fine. again, we had some of those sorts of changes rejected early on | 21:36 |
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| sandywalsh | apmelton is working on adding this to stacktach currently :) | 21:36 |
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| sandywalsh | I think this is a low-impact BP overall | 21:37 |
| sandywalsh | with great upside | 21:37 |
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| nijaba | I am not sure we have a consensus though | 21:37 |
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| nijaba | should we hava a core-dev only vote to check? | 21:38 |
| sandywalsh | I'm happy to ease your troubled minds :) | 21:38 |
| jd__ | I think we agree that Nova needs to have some code before this blueprint is doable | 21:38 |
| yjiang5_home | dhellmann: sandywalsh: can we take a step-by-step method ? If anything changed successfully in nova, we can remove the corresponding code in ceilometer, and in the end possibly the compute agent will have nothing to do. | 21:38 |
| sandywalsh | jd__: I agree with that | 21:38 |
| jd__ | yjiang5_home: yeah totally. | 21:38 |
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| dragondm | sounds good. | 21:38 |
| sandywalsh | jd__: they can be done in parallel | 21:38 |
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| eglynn | +1 | 21:38 |
| nijaba | now that sounds more like one | 21:38 |
| dhellmann | yjiang5_home: that makes sense | 21:38 |
| sandywalsh | yjiang5_home: the new agent is so small it hardly makes sense. it's easier to cut-and-run | 21:38 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: sure, but we won't merge anything in Ceilo until Nova has the parts we need though | 21:38 |
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| jd__ | nijaba: see how I can build a consensus by stating the obvious! :-) | 21:39 |
| nijaba | jd__: great job! | 21:39 |
| asalkeld | we used to support older versions | 21:39 |
| yjiang5_home | sandywalsh: can current notification code be used for your agent temply? | 21:39 |
| asalkeld | is that not an issue anymore | 21:39 |
| nijaba | asalkeld: until g2 | 21:39 |
| sandywalsh | this is sort of how we got zones/cells going, we merged the new functionality in but it was all disabled by default | 21:39 |
| sandywalsh | people could play with it if they wanted | 21:39 |
| sandywalsh | but otherwise had no idea it was there | 21:40 |
| nijaba | asalkeld: that's whart we agreed | 21:40 |
| asalkeld | ok | 21:40 |
| sandywalsh | yjiang5_home: for a lot of it yes | 21:40 |
| sandywalsh | yjiang5_home: the delete scenario might need some fix | 21:40 |
| sandywalsh | yjiang5_home: and the libvirt side might need some tweaks (dragondm is looking into that) | 21:40 |
| nijaba | jd__: care to write up the (#)agreed ? | 21:40 |
| jd__ | nijaba: sure | 21:41 |
| yjiang5_home | sandywalsh: so would it be possible that: a) change nove b) add to current notification code, c) in the end, remove compute agent, d) update the notification code as the type you suggested? | 21:41 |
| jd__ | #agreed sandywalsh & cie to work on implementing feature in Nova in order to deprecates the Ceilometer compute agent in favor of notifications consuming | 21:41 |
| nijaba | perfect, thanks | 21:42 |
| jd__ | does that cover enough for you sandywalsh? | 21:42 |
| sandywalsh | yjiang5_home: how about I get an agent working that stuffs all the current events into CM as they stand today (as a proof of concept) and in parallel we work on the nova changes? | 21:42 |
| sandywalsh | "_ | 21:42 |
| sandywalsh | :) | 21:42 |
| sandywalsh | jd__: cie? | 21:43 |
| nijaba | & co | 21:43 |
| sandywalsh | ah :) | 21:43 |
| asalkeld | so we can still use the compute agent, just not needed? | 21:43 |
| jd__ | yeah sorry | 21:43 |
| dragondm | :-> | 21:43 |
| nijaba | french... | 21:43 |
| jd__ | cie is probably French :D | 21:43 |
| asalkeld | (thinking of montoring) | 21:43 |
| * jd__ mixed up | 21:43 | |
| sandywalsh | asalkeld: yes, everything stays the same, this will be an alternative agent | 21:43 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: if nova generates the notifications, the existing collector should receive them without any major changes | 21:43 |
| dhellmann | although we need to make it listen to the error events | 21:43 |
| dragondm | yup | 21:43 |
| asalkeld | ok, cool with that | 21:44 |
| jd__ | next topic? | 21:44 |
| nijaba | yup | 21:44 |
| yjiang5_home | sandywalsh: dhellmann: yes | 21:44 |
| sandywalsh | jd__: your summary looks good to me | 21:44 |
| nijaba | #topic A note about https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+spec/use-new-rpc-messsage | 21:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "A note about https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+spec/use-new-rpc-messsage (Meeting topic: Ceilometer)" | 21:44 | |
| nijaba | jd__ wanted to bring up somethinkg about this: you have the floor. | 21:44 |
| asalkeld | (I need to head off to keynote) | 21:44 |
| asalkeld | later guys | 21:44 |
| nijaba | asalkeld: have fun | 21:45 |
| eglynn | asalkeld: see ya | 21:45 |
| jd__ | yeah, I've removed the target on this blueprint actually | 21:45 |
| sandywalsh | later asalkeld ... good questions | 21:45 |
| jd__ | it seems to me that the implementation for nova has been retargeted too | 21:45 |
| * dhellmann waves to asalkeld | 21:45 | |
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| jd__ | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/trusted-messaging has no goal/milestone target anymore | 21:45 |
| jd__ | so I think we won't have this for G | 21:45 |
| dhellmann | yes, that seems unlikely | 21:46 |
| nijaba | mmmm.. We should talk with Eric Windish.... | 21:46 |
| jd__ | so I just wanted you guys and our dear PTL to be aware | 21:46 |
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| dhellmann | I'm going to try to finally get to the notifications listener api next week, but I don't see us moving our meter messages away from rpc in time | 21:46 |
| jd__ | nijaba: I can take care of that | 21:46 |
| nijaba | jd__: sure. care to action yourself? | 21:47 |
| llu-laptop | do we know the reason of untarget for G? | 21:47 |
| llu-laptop | in nova | 21:47 |
| nijaba | llu-laptop: no, this is why we should talk to Eric | 21:47 |
| dhellmann | oh, wait, I'm confused, this is just about the new signing code? | 21:47 |
| jd__ | #action jd__ contact Eric Windisch about nova's trusted-messaging blueprint status | 21:47 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: yes that's it | 21:47 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: though it's not really far of what you talk about anyway | 21:47 |
| dhellmann | I think they're still trying to figure out which part of the library is supposed to do the serialization | 21:48 |
| dhellmann | there was some discussion about that today, maybe in a bug report | 21:48 |
| dragondm | iirc, there was issues with double serialization | 21:48 |
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| jd__ | ok, we'll clear it up with Eric I guess, anyway | 21:49 |
| nijaba | jd__: yep, that sounds like the right thing to do | 21:49 |
| dhellmann | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-January/005200.html | 21:49 |
| dhellmann | jd__: +1 | 21:50 |
| nijaba | let's move to open discussion? | 21:50 |
| jd__ | yup | 21:50 |
| nijaba | #topic Open discussion | 21:50 |
| * eglynn wonders whether we/I should refer to the new emerging "agent-less" architecture at FOSDEM this weekend? | 21:50 | |
| eglynn | (or stick to the existing architecture?) | 21:51 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: let's not "sell futures" | 21:51 |
| jd__ | eglynn: stick to current :) | 21:51 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: that's a good way of putting it | 21:51 |
| eglynn | fair enough, sounds reasonable | 21:51 |
| * sandywalsh is still waiting for his flying car | 21:52 | |
| * eglynn never got his hover-bike from Santa ... | 21:52 | |
| yjiang5_home | anyone working on Hyperv/VMWare support? | 21:52 |
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| * dragondm thinks if sandywalsh had a flying car, he'd have to spend all his time de-icing it... | 21:52 | |
| sandywalsh | hah! no kidding | 21:53 |
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| * nijaba does have his folding bike that only flies when on a plane | 21:53 | |
| sandywalsh | oh, and thanks to all you guys for putting up with my questions over the last week ... thanks for being patient! | 21:53 |
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| dragondm | yup. ditto. | 21:53 |
| jd__ | you're welcome :) | 21:54 |
| yjiang5_home | I have submit the patch for https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+spec/publisher-counters-frequency and hope more feedback on the implementation. | 21:54 |
| jd__ | yeah we need more review | 21:55 |
| dragondm | I'd be happy to look. | 21:55 |
| jd__ | though I think multi-publisher is going to be merged soon now that we've more +2-able folks on board | 21:55 |
| yjiang5_home | jd__: :-) | 21:56 |
| yjiang5_home | dragondm: thanks | 21:57 |
| nijaba | any final words before I close the meeting? | 21:57 |
| jd__ | banana | 21:57 |
| nijaba | ok. thanks everyone for another great meeting | 21:58 |
| sandywalsh | thanks y'all! | 21:58 |
| dragondm | thx | 21:58 |
| sandywalsh | o/ | 21:58 |
| nijaba | tty next week, and see some of you this we at fosdem! | 21:58 |
| eglynn | thx & bye! | 21:58 |
| nijaba | #endmeeting | 21:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 21:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jan 30 21:58:36 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-01-30-21.00.html | 21:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-01-30-21.00.txt | 21:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-01-30-21.00.log.html | 21:58 |
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