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| markmcclain | hi | 13:59 |
|---|---|---|
| enikanorov-w | hi | 13:59 |
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| markmcclain | avishayb: around? | 13:59 |
| avishayb | hi | 13:59 |
| avishayb | I am here | 13:59 |
| markmcclain | so we're missing roman and sam right? | 14:00 |
| enikanorov-w | roman is here | 14:00 |
| obondarev | hi guys | 14:00 |
| SamuelB | Sam is gere | 14:00 |
| SamuelB | here | 14:00 |
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| markmcclain | alright let's start | 14:01 |
| markmcclain | #startmeeting lbaas | 14:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 14:01:23 2013 UTC. The chair is markmcclain. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: lbaas)" | 14:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'lbaas' | 14:01 |
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| enikanorov-w | does everyone agree with agendai've just sent? | 14:02 |
| ogelbukh | link it, enikanorov-w | 14:02 |
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| markmcclain | I got a copy but I liked to cover the items in a slightly different order | 14:02 |
| enikanorov-w | ogelbukh: that was in email to primary audience, sorry :) | 14:02 |
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| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: sure | 14:02 |
| SamuelB | Sure | 14:03 |
| SamuelB | 1) LBaaS development process 2) multi-vendor-support-for-lbaas blueprint implementation: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28245/ and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28289/ 3) LBaaS plan for Havana. | 14:03 |
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| enikanorov-w | hi Youcef | 14:03 |
| markmcclain | Can we cover 1) LBaaS Dev Process, 2) LBaaS plan for Havana 3) conflicting reviews 4) Code reorganization | 14:03 |
| enikanorov-w | of course | 14:03 |
| Youcef | Hi eugene | 14:03 |
| markmcclain | is everyone ok with that order? | 14:04 |
| ilyashakhat | + | 14:04 |
| avishayb | I am OK with the order | 14:04 |
| SamuelB | Sure | 14:04 |
| Youcef | yep | 14:04 |
| markmcclain | ok | 14:05 |
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| markmcclain | #topic LBaaS Development Process | 14:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "LBaaS Development Process (Meeting topic: lbaas)" | 14:05 | |
| enikanorov-w | ok, markmcclain you have something on (1) or can I stert? | 14:05 |
| enikanorov-w | *start | 14:05 |
| markmcclain | I wanted highlight that we've got a BP | 14:06 |
| markmcclain | that contains this doc: https://docs.google.com/a/dreamhost.com/document/d/1OT9m3bWl4yimvXLXTh_REQqONSS_f8jwplm7Y1iBxC8/edit | 14:06 |
| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: you can start | 14:06 |
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| enikanorov-w | ok, so in fact we need to discuss the process as we got in the case where we have overlapping patches for the same blueprint | 14:07 |
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| enikanorov-w | and I wanded to propose that everyone who is willingtoimplement a major feature post it's brief design on ML first | 14:08 |
| enikanorov-w | so others could take a look and discuss | 14:08 |
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| enikanorov-w | that was done on most major features | 14:08 |
| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: that is generally the purpose of blueprints | 14:08 |
| avishayb | I have posted this BP to the ML | 14:09 |
| enikanorov-w | I think having approved blueprint doesn't automatically mean everyone agrees on the design or implementation | 14:09 |
| enikanorov-w | it's rather acceptance into project plan | 14:09 |
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| enikanorov-w | that leads to a case where major design questions start to be discussed in gerrit, whish is not productive | 14:10 |
| enikanorov-w | *which | 14:10 |
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| enikanorov-w | So our team would like to see implementer participating in ML discussions and corresponding meetings (we already had one) | 14:11 |
| SamuelB | I actually disagree. For this specifci case. 1. we had this discussion prior to the summit 2. we have discussed this in the summit and agreed that this should be done in baby steps | 14:11 |
| SamuelB | 3. based on that Avishay has published the BP | 14:12 |
| SamuelB | And last the change was planned as small to make sure it is done and ready for H1 so that vendors could start to implement | 14:13 |
| enikanorov-w | I think we'll get there when we discuss patches | 14:13 |
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| SamuelB | This as far as I understnad the correct way to go. | 14:13 |
| enikanorov-w | right now the question is generic: would you agree that it's more productive to discuss on the meeting and ML than on gerrit? | 14:14 |
| SamuelB | markmcclain: did I miss anything? | 14:14 |
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| markmcclain | SamuelB: you're correct on the flow | 14:15 |
| enikanorov-w | so guys, you think, ML and meetings are needless? :) | 14:15 |
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| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: no both are useful | 14:16 |
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| enikanorov-w | ok, then our team would expect that everyone interested in lbaas would participate in public discussion | 14:16 |
| Youcef | If there are any design decisions to be discussed, I prefer them discussed on ML than on gerrit, as I for one don't follow the gerrit reviews closely. | 14:16 |
| SamuelB | What was not well understood is how a BL that was approved and got broken down to small bits to make sure we complete it, got a parallel implementation done by enikanorov-w which tries to achive the first two steps with the addition of Service Types that do not have an approved design and BL as one patch | 14:17 |
| enikanorov-w | Sam, i guess that relates to (3), lets discuss it a bit later | 14:17 |
| markmcclain | So in terms of process | 14:18 |
| ralekseenkov | guys, it's Roman. I think the issue Eugene is having is very simple | 14:18 |
| ralekseenkov | he would make LBaaS meeting to discuss the code, what should be done and how, and noone would come | 14:18 |
| SamuelB | As process goes this does not comply yo any process that I am aware of | 14:18 |
| ralekseenkov | the last one was 11 days ago on Monday | 14:18 |
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| enikanorov-w | right | 14:18 |
| ralekseenkov | so instead of having a productive live chat everyone fights on gerrit | 14:18 |
| markmcclain | does every agree on the basic flow? | 14:19 |
| ralekseenkov | I think we should agree that there is a standing meeting and all involved parties attend it | 14:19 |
| avishayb | I did not submit even 1 line of code before I had an approved BP... | 14:19 |
| markmcclain | we're getting ahead | 14:19 |
| markmcclain | meetings are next :) | 14:20 |
| markmcclain | general work flow is blueprints are accepted into the project plan | 14:20 |
| markmcclain | and the assignee is responsible for shepherding the blueprint to completion | 14:21 |
| Youcef | is the project plan published somewhere? | 14:21 |
| enikanorov-w | Youcef: yes | 14:21 |
| enikanorov-w | Youcef: thaths how we see it https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Quantum/LBaaS/HavanaPlan | 14:21 |
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| Youcef | enikanorov-w: thx | 14:22 |
| enikanorov-w | I have posted this plan on ML 3 weeks ago btw | 14:23 |
| markmcclain | that wiki is different from the blueprints | 14:24 |
| markmcclain | that are in Havana | 14:24 |
| enikanorov-w | so how we may get them accepted? I guess most of them have "proposed milestone" filled | 14:25 |
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| markmcclain | I'm the one who accepts them | 14:26 |
| markmcclain | my understanding was this was the first one to be implemented: | 14:26 |
| markmcclain | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/quantum/+spec/multi-vendor-support-for-lbaas | 14:26 |
| enikanorov-w | right | 14:27 |
| enikanorov-w | I was not aware of this BP filed until like 2 weeks ago | 14:27 |
| enikanorov-w | and the plan was created earlier | 14:27 |
| enikanorov-w | so I've added BP later | 14:28 |
| markmcclain | that blueprint matched my notes from summit which is my I approved it | 14:28 |
| enikanorov-w | the blueprint is usefull, no questions | 14:28 |
| enikanorov-w | however splitting it and those baby steps are what needed to be discussed | 14:29 |
| markmcclain | ok | 14:30 |
| markmcclain | let's wrap up process and then we can jump to next topics | 14:30 |
| enikanorov-w | i think the plan is just for everyone to consider and discuss | 14:30 |
| enikanorov-w | right | 14:30 |
| ralekseenkov | Eugene - the vision for lbaas in havana described on the wiki makes sense IMO. the action item is that you have to follow up with Mark over email and get the rest of the BPs justified, approved & scheduled. | 14:30 |
| markmcclain | general flow is approved blueprints is what the core expects to review | 14:31 |
| enikanorov-w | ok, btw, Mark, does launchpad allow you to subscribe for BPs? | 14:31 |
| enikanorov-w | or you have to manually browse for new ones | 14:31 |
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| markmcclain | I'm subscribed to all of them | 14:32 |
| enikanorov-w | ok | 14:32 |
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| markmcclain | so I get change deltas when items change | 14:33 |
| SamuelB | markmcclain: can you please summarize the process? | 14:33 |
| markmcclain | I also regularly review them to make sure the BP is on target for the linked milestone | 14:33 |
| enikanorov-w | let's move on discussing patches maybe? | 14:34 |
| markmcclain | process summary: the sub teams proposes blueprints that get evaluated and then approved for the cycle. The core team expects that the assigned person will be the one responsible for completing the task. | 14:36 |
| Youcef | markmcclain: Is the project plan above (wiki), the approved plan of record for LBaaS (are all approved blueprints for H there)? | 14:37 |
| markmcclain | Youcef: No. It's a nice overview, but the blueprints are the authoritative record. | 14:37 |
| SamuelB | I was actualy not aware on this wiki untill now | 14:37 |
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| enikanorov-w | ok, let's move to the patches | 14:39 |
| SamuelB | I do follow the blueprints for H | 14:39 |
| markmcclain | Blueprints that are approved when there's consensus. If you disagree with the approval two options 1) reach out to the assignee to discuss concerns. 2) Reach out to me. | 14:39 |
| markmcclain | So that's the process | 14:39 |
| markmcclain | Let' move onto the current plan | 14:39 |
| markmcclain | #topic Havana LBaaS Plan | 14:39 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Havana LBaaS Plan (Meeting topic: lbaas)" | 14:39 | |
| markmcclain | The one item that we need achieve is a working LBaaS implementation | 14:40 |
| enikanorov-w | right. | 14:40 |
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| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: can you review that wiki page and send out your thoughts? | 14:42 |
| markmcclain | my general thoughts are the same that I've been discussing with both the FW and VPN teams | 14:43 |
| markmcclain | we need simple first | 14:43 |
| SamuelB | enikanorov: please send the wiki on the ML. there were a couple of other items discussed at the summit that do not appear there | 14:43 |
| enikanorov-w | SamuelB: the plan was posted on ML | 14:44 |
| markmcclain | While service types and multi-vendor support is eventually where we want to go | 14:44 |
| markmcclain | we need to get working single vendor implemetations first | 14:44 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: current reference impl is working | 14:44 |
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| enikanorov-w | i think it is a good starting point | 14:44 |
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| enikanorov-w | and can be treated as 'single vendor' | 14:44 |
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| enikanorov-w | so i think that goal is almost reached. | 14:45 |
| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: it works, but we don't have any vendors who've written to that interface | 14:46 |
| Pattabi | Can we start the vendor implementation integration ? | 14:46 |
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| enikanorov-w | ok, let's discuss patches, because it seems to be quite related to what we're talking about | 14:46 |
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| Pattabi | markmcclain: we have been waiting for the framework to be available to integrate our vendor impl | 14:47 |
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| enikanorov-w | so, let me start still | 14:47 |
| markmcclain | Pattabi: that's is part of what we are discussing | 14:47 |
| markmcclain | Just wanted to give everyone warning that we've got about 12 mins until Ceilometer has the room | 14:48 |
| enikanorov-w | we have two patches which are technically complimentary | 14:48 |
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| enikanorov-w | and we would definitely agree on the code if it would consist of abstract_Driver and noop_driver | 14:49 |
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| enikanorov-w | other parts which introduce additional plugin can be omitted. | 14:49 |
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| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: I'm not sure they are fully complimentary | 14:50 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: by intent they are not | 14:50 |
| markmcclain | I'd like to see us focused on getting the driver done first | 14:50 |
| enikanorov-w | because avishayb tries to address in new plugin what i've addressed in existing plugin | 14:50 |
| markmcclain | that way Pattabi and others can begin work | 14:50 |
| enikanorov-w | ok, abstract driver is good, | 14:51 |
| enikanorov-w | driver for reference impl follows the interface | 14:51 |
| markmcclain | enikanorov-w: it does, but the other proposal seeks to tweak that interface a bit | 14:51 |
| markmcclain | I made a few design decisions that were HAProxy specific | 14:52 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: the driver for the reference impl will inherit from abstract, obviously | 14:52 |
| markmcclain | right | 14:52 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: i tried to make them mor generic | 14:52 |
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| enikanorov-w | would be nice if you could review it | 14:52 |
| enikanorov-w | also, we've tested it with devstack for different scenarious and got it working | 14:53 |
| enikanorov-w | (most logic is just unchanged) | 14:53 |
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| Pattabi | which patch should be used : https://review.openstack.org/28245 or https://review.openstack.org/28289 | 14:53 |
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| markmcclain | I think enikanorov-w is referring to 28289 | 14:54 |
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| markmcclain | I've read over both | 14:55 |
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| markmcclain | but withheld comments because I wanted to talk with everyone first | 14:55 |
| markmcclain | for H1.. we really need to focus on the driver interface | 14:56 |
| enikanorov-w | ok, so our opinion that we may just take abstract driver from avishay's patch, and derive the lbaas reference impl driver from that. | 14:56 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: no objections | 14:56 |
| enikanorov-w | but i would object agains introducing different plugin | 14:56 |
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| enikanorov-w | also I think even both patches together are now so big and could make it into h-1 | 14:57 |
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| avishayb | There is no diffrent plugin - after step1 we will end up with 1 plugin | 14:57 |
| enikanorov-w | especially because you are the author of 99% of code of my patch | 14:58 |
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| avishayb | Guys - i do not see any reason to hold my work (steps 0 & 1) - do you? | 14:58 |
| dhellmann | are you guys going to be wrapping up soon? we'll need the room soon for ceilometer | 14:58 |
| markmcclain | dhellmann: yeah we'll wrap up | 14:59 |
| dhellmann | thanks! | 14:59 |
| enikanorov-w | avishayb: i think driver interface definitely has a value, we need to merge it | 14:59 |
| Youcef | I think we all agree that we want one LBaaS plugin, and each vendor develop their own driver to the common driver interface. | 14:59 |
| markmcclain | Ok.. let me look at reviews and follow up with everyone the ML | 15:00 |
| enikanorov-w | markmcclain: thanks. | 15:00 |
| markmcclain | we have to yield the room | 15:00 |
| markmcclain | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 15:00 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 15:00:15 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/lbaas/2013/lbaas.2013-05-16-14.01.html | 15:00 |
| Guest14773 | o/ | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/lbaas/2013/lbaas.2013-05-16-14.01.txt | 15:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/lbaas/2013/lbaas.2013-05-16-14.01.log.html | 15:00 |
| jd__ | #startmeeting ceilometer | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 15:00:30 2013 UTC. The chair is jd__. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'ceilometer' | 15:00 |
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| jd__ | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/MeteringAgenda | 15:00 |
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| dhellmann | o/ | 15:01 |
| jd__ | hi everyone | 15:01 |
| flwang | o/ | 15:01 |
| apmelton | o/ | 15:01 |
| dragondm | o/ | 15:01 |
| flwang | hi jd__ | 15:01 |
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| sandywalsh | o/ | 15:01 |
| gordc | o/ | 15:01 |
| danspraggins | o/ | 15:01 |
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| n0ano | o/ | 15:01 |
| jd__ | as I already said, big agenda today, so let's try to focus :) | 15:01 |
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| jd__ | #topic Last week action: jd__ and dhellmann to write formal statement about limiting support for pre-grizzly versions of ceilometer | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Last week action: jd__ and dhellmann to write formal statement about limiting support for pre-grizzly versions of ceilometer (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:01 | |
| * jd__ whispers | 15:01 | |
| eglynn | o/ | 15:02 |
| dhellmann | I haven't had a chance to look at that :-( | 15:02 |
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| jd__ | I'll keep in #action too | 15:02 |
| jd__ | we can sync at a certain time if needed dhellmann | 15:02 |
| epende | o/ | 15:02 |
| jd__ | #action dhellmann and jd__ to write formal statement about limiting support for pre-grizzly versions of ceilometer | 15:02 |
| dhellmann | jd__: yeah, we can talk about it via email | 15:03 |
| litong | o/ | 15:03 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: works for me :) | 15:03 |
| jd__ | #topic Last week action: blueprint-owners, set milestones on all blueprints | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Last week action: blueprint-owners, set milestones on all blueprints (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:03 | |
| jd__ | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ceilometer/havana | 15:03 |
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| thomasem | o/ | 15:03 |
| jd__ | so it's almost ok now | 15:03 |
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| jd__ | and we're ambitious :) | 15:04 |
| jd__ | #topic Tracking of bug #1176017, releasing of MIM | 15:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tracking of bug #1176017, releasing of MIM (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:04 | |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1176017 in ceilometer "Reinstate MongoDB testing with ming" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1176017 | 15:04 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: I think this is done right? | 15:04 |
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| dhellmann | yes, I think that just landed earlier today | 15:05 |
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| gordc | awesome! finally have the mongo tests running again. | 15:05 |
| jd__ | yeah that's reaaaallly great | 15:05 |
| jd__ | thanks dhellmann for the good job :) | 15:06 |
| dhellmann | asalkeld made some great improvements to the tests lately, too, and we're trying to get those all working well | 15:06 |
| nealph | dhellmann: thumbs up | 15:06 |
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| dhellmann | moving to testr in particular will let us use scenarios, and not have to subclass for different configurations | 15:06 |
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| dhellmann | will be good for the db tests | 15:06 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: yeah I remember you talking about this to me | 15:07 |
| dhellmann | we'll get that in soon, but maybe not before h1 | 15:07 |
| jd__ | (and me never having time to dive into it) | 15:07 |
| dhellmann | having some issues with the notifier tests under testr | 15:07 |
| * jd__ thumbs up | 15:07 | |
| jd__ | #topic Review Havana-1 milestone | 15:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Havana-1 milestone (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:08 | |
| jd__ | talking about h1, let's take a look | 15:08 |
| jd__ | #link https://launchpad.net/ceilometer/+milestone/havana-1 | 15:08 |
| jd__ | we seem on good tracks | 15:08 |
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| jd__ | I'm only worried about monitoring-physical-devices, I emailed Toni this week to have status | 15:09 |
| jd__ | we're supposed to have the patchset before the end of the week | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | what's the difference between "fix committed" and "implemented" status? | 15:09 |
| jd__ | I'm very worried because I've the feeling it's going to be huged | 15:09 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: bug vs blueprint? | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | yeah, I don't know if there's going to be time to review that before the deadline | 15:09 |
| dhellmann | jd__: aha, yeah | 15:09 |
| jd__ | so I'm waiting for monitoring-physical-devices, and we'll see :( | 15:10 |
| jd__ | we may have to postpone to h2 if that doesn't arrive soon enough | 15:10 |
| dhellmann | is it better to just move that to h2, or wait and see when we get the patch? I *really* don't want to rush something big | 15:10 |
| sandywalsh | about 2wks to havana-1, yes? | 15:10 |
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| jd__ | I've still no idea how the patchset is going to be and I'm scared | 15:10 |
| dhellmann | yeah, h1 deadline is may 30 | 15:10 |
| eglynn | yeah punt to h2 sounds sensible if there's doubt | 15:11 |
| flwang | jd__ is it possible to let Toni submit some patch for review? | 15:11 |
| gordc | yeah, the blueprint reads like its a big patch. | 15:11 |
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| dhellmann | the patch can go in at any time, but if we move the target to h2 now then that's a signal we aren't going to rush the review | 15:11 |
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| jd__ | flwang: it's so possible that I begged him to, but he said "end of the week" :) | 15:11 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: agreed | 15:11 |
| flwang | haha, fine :) | 15:12 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: I'll wait tomorrow: if no patch or big patch, I'll move to h2 -- how does that sound? | 15:12 |
| flwang | based on my experience, it's a system management topic, I think it's a huge work | 15:12 |
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| dhellmann | jd__: that works for me | 15:12 |
| jd__ | #agreed jd__ to rescheduled monitoring-physical-devices if the patchset is too big or not sent to review before 17th may 2013 | 15:13 |
| jd__ | -ed | 15:13 |
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| jd__ | don't forget to review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28800/ | 15:14 |
| jd__ | it's for h1 | 15:14 |
| llu-laptop | o/ | 15:14 |
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| jd__ | #topic Releasing Ceilometer 2013.1.1 | 15:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Releasing Ceilometer 2013.1.1 (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:15 | |
| * dhellmann thinks jd__ should probably respond to comments | 15:15 | |
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| jd__ | dhellmann: I missed that then :( | 15:15 |
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| jd__ | I did, my bad, will do, pff | 15:16 |
| jd__ | about 2013.1.1, so it's going to be done soon finally | 15:16 |
| eglynn | for 2013.1.1 all the backports were done at the 11th hour, prolly should try to be more "ongoing" on this for 2013.1.2 | 15:16 |
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| eglynn | i.e. for each bug fix you get landed on master | 15:16 |
| eglynn | think about backporting potential | 15:17 |
| dhellmann | +1 | 15:17 |
| eglynn | and tag the bug if it's a good candidate | 15:17 |
| dhellmann | reviewers, too | 15:17 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: tag it in launchpad? | 15:17 |
| eglynn | even better, propose the backport yourself if it's a trivial cherrypick | 15:17 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: yep, grizzly-backport-potential | 15:17 |
| * jd__ nods | 15:18 | |
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| dhellmann | #info tag backportable bugs with grizzly-backport-potential | 15:18 |
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| eglynn | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StableBranch#Appropriate_Fixes | 15:19 |
| eglynn | ^^^ good summary of what's suitable for the stable branch | 15:19 |
| uvirtbot | eglynn: Error: "^^" is not a valid command. | 15:19 |
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| gordc | eglynn, thanks for link. very helpful. | 15:20 |
| jd__ | #topic Idea: using URL as publishing targets formats | 15:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Idea: using URL as publishing targets formats (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:21 | |
| jd__ | Rational: with the UDP publisher, we may have several UDP targets, so we need more than one option for the whole plugin; that wasn't needed for the RPC because we don't specify the host on Ceilometer side | 15:21 |
| jd__ | toughts? | 15:21 |
| dhellmann | seems reasonable to me | 15:21 |
| jd__ | thank you dhellmann, next topic then | 15:21 |
| * jd__ smiles | 15:21 | |
| dhellmann | we should come up with conventions | 15:21 |
| dhellmann | but not in this meeting :-) | 15:22 |
| jd__ | you mean, about agreeing with my ideas, or about URL? :-) | 15:22 |
| eglynn | so is the idea to invent a URI scheme for this? | 15:22 |
| jd__ | eglynn: udp://host:port doesn't look like a big invention | 15:22 |
| jd__ | rather than just 'udp' as it is now | 15:22 |
| eglynn | jd__: true that :) | 15:23 |
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| * eglynn wondering if there's prior art on this ... | 15:23 | |
| jd__ | meter would be replaced by meter:// in a first time -- later we could use real RPC URL | 15:23 |
| sandywalsh | what about destinations with no "standard" protocol? | 15:23 |
| sandywalsh | what would a graphite URI look like? | 15:23 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: graphite://whatyouwant | 15:23 |
| dhellmann | the scheme in the url should be the plugin name in our publisher plugins | 15:24 |
| sandywalsh | hmm | 15:24 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: basically it would bea <publishername>://<whatever> | 15:24 |
| jd__ | -a | 15:24 |
| dhellmann | and indeed, we might use statsd instead of udp, since those messages have to be formatted in a particular way, iirc | 15:24 |
| jd__ | dhellmann: exactly | 15:24 |
| sandywalsh | when why bother making it look like a URI, you could use any separator | 15:24 |
| jd__ | UDP doesn't tell you how I format the data inside | 15:24 |
| sandywalsh | s/when/then/ | 15:24 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: because 1. it's standard 2. it's going to be used by oslo.rpc at some point it seems | 15:24 |
| mrutkows | the use of a actual protocol (scheme) for URL and URI scheme should not be confused | 15:25 |
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| sandywalsh | hmm | 15:25 |
| dhellmann | we do this for the storage connection strings, too | 15:26 |
| * sandywalsh defers :) | 15:26 | |
| jd__ | yeah, everybody does it for storage that's true :) | 15:26 |
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| jd__ | ok, so I'll work on that at some point since it's going to be quickly a problem for UDP | 15:26 |
| dragondm | yah, that is the way, sqlalchemy, etc does cnnection string | 15:26 |
| jd__ | #agreed use URL for publisher target formats in pipeline | 15:27 |
| mrutkows | URI schemes can describe how path segments could be used for storage, but that is separate from protocol (transmission) | 15:27 |
| jd__ | mrutkows: the point being? | 15:28 |
| mrutkows | if u use udp scheme to describe transport protocol, it should not necessarily imply how the data should be stored | 15:28 |
| dhellmann | it won't | 15:29 |
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| dhellmann | interpreting anything other than the scheme in the url will be the responsibility of the publisher plugin | 15:29 |
| mrutkows | thanks ) | 15:29 |
| eglynn | slightly related point ... | 15:29 |
| eglynn | sqlalchemy/swift etc. also use the URI to carry credentials | 15:29 |
| eglynn | would anything of that ilk be required for UDP? | 15:29 |
| eglynn | (or do we rely on message payload signing?) | 15:29 |
| jd__ | eglynn: not at this point, maybe later yes | 15:29 |
| jd__ | eglynn: we can use query parameter in URI scheme | 15:30 |
| eglynn | jd__: fair enough | 15:30 |
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| jd__ | #topic Adding Gordon Chung to core reviewer team | 15:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding Gordon Chung to core reviewer team (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:30 | |
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| gordc | ... should i leave the room for this? | 15:30 |
| jd__ | lol, no | 15:31 |
| eglynn | gordc: stay! :) | 15:31 |
| jd__ | there's nothing to be done, I think the delay will pass tomorrow and I'll be able to add you since nobody objected | 15:31 |
| gordc | i'll close my eyes. be honest ppl.lol | 15:31 |
| jd__ | lol | 15:31 |
| litong | @gordc, congrats. | 15:31 |
| mrutkows | congrats Gordon | 15:32 |
| llu-laptop | gordc: congrats | 15:32 |
| eglynn | gordc: welcome to the inner sanctum! :) | 15:32 |
| gordc | thanks for the support folks! | 15:32 |
| flwang | @gordc, congrats | 15:32 |
| jd__ | hm I think I'll need nijaba_ on this one, I don't have the rights to do that lol | 15:32 |
| dhellmann | congrats and welcome, gordc! | 15:32 |
| jd__ | nijaba_: LET IT GO! GIVE ME MY RIGHTS! | 15:32 |
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| gordc | jd__, lol | 15:33 |
| * gordc will try not to muck this up. | 15:33 | |
| xingzhou | gordc, con! | 15:33 |
| jd__ | #topic Consider use of Diamond instead of the CM Pollster | 15:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Consider use of Diamond instead of the CM Pollster (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:33 | |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: floor is yours | 15:34 |
| sandywalsh | I'm going to reserve further comment for now. Look at Diamond and consider that it already does what we want. ... | 15:34 |
| sandywalsh | I'm going to be working on the notifier next, so I'll have a more informed opinion at the next meeting | 15:34 |
| sandywalsh | I'm a big fan of two things: | 15:35 |
| sandywalsh | 1. not duplicating effort | 15:35 |
| sandywalsh | 2. the trend that the "monitoring stack" is a set of Input-Do Something-Output components that fit together | 15:35 |
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| sandywalsh | which includes graphite, statsd, reimann, etc | 15:35 |
| sandywalsh | so I don't think we should be trying to built the entire stack ourselves | 15:36 |
| thomasem | https://github.com/BrightcoveOS/Diamond? | 15:36 |
| sandywalsh | thomasem, yep | 15:36 |
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| sandywalsh | so, something to ponder :) | 15:36 |
| dragondm | Yah, +1 to not duplicating effort. | 15:36 |
| eglynn | what about the identity issue, is diamond extensible to reporting native openstack UUIDs? | 15:36 |
| dragondm | ...and not re-inventing bugs | 15:36 |
| thomasem | :D | 15:37 |
| jd__ | sandywalsh: ok, then feel free to re-add this to the agenda whenever you've enough information to discuss it | 15:37 |
| eglynn | (for resources, users, tenants etc.) | 15:37 |
| gordc | thomasem, thanks, was just going to ask for a link. | 15:37 |
| thomasem | gordc: you bet | 15:37 |
| eglynn | well mainly for resources, I guess users and tenants could be figured out in a round-about way | 15:37 |
| sandywalsh | eglynn, I see it mostly as a tool for hypervisor/cpu/disk/etc polling ... not for openstack internals | 15:37 |
| sandywalsh | eglynn, I see notifications -> events -> meters for that | 15:37 |
| eglynn | sandywalsh: a-ha, OK | 15:38 |
| dhellmann | we need a way to collect data so our HPC customers can charge for %CPU of the host box (not the VM) | 15:38 |
| sandywalsh | eglynn, also, it's host-side, not instance/user-side ... but I suppose it could be too. | 15:38 |
| dhellmann | diamond doesn't know who owns the vm consuming that cpu | 15:38 |
| dragondm | it's easy enough to report the instanceid. | 15:39 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann, so, that would be something we would have to figure out anyway, so perhaps we would need a new diamond collector for that | 15:39 |
| nealph | anyone know if this is overlap with healthnmon capability? | 15:39 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: our current CPU collector already does this | 15:39 |
| eglynn | yep, so we'd need to add that info somewhere in the pipeline | 15:39 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann, so convert it to be a diamond module and leverage the strength of that community | 15:39 |
| sandywalsh | there is a counter-argument ... which depends on the architecture of the multi-publisher. | 15:40 |
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| dhellmann | if someone wants to do that, that's fine | 15:40 |
| dhellmann | I'm just trying to make sure we understand the requirements | 15:40 |
| dhellmann | it's not just "get the cpu utilization" | 15:40 |
| sandywalsh | and that, potentially we are building a proper input->do_something->output widget | 15:40 |
| dhellmann | it has to be tied to the instance owner for billing | 15:41 |
| dhellmann | it's not just about monitoring | 15:41 |
| jd__ | if you can't generate meters based on the Counter format we defined, it's basically useless | 15:41 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann, depends on how you tackle the problem of CPU usage. If the hypervisor allows you to cap cpu based on flavor. But that's a longer discussion | 15:42 |
| dhellmann | like I said, I don't care if we change this, but it has to do what we do now, not just collect monitoring data | 15:42 |
| dhellmann | we can't ignore that requirement | 15:42 |
| sandywalsh | jd__, by that logic we can't use ceilometer with any of the existing monitoring stack tools out there | 15:43 |
| dhellmann | sandywalsh: that depends entirely on whether you view ceilometer as the destination of data, or the source of data | 15:43 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann, agreed ... but I think the delta of effort is smaller than having to write all these collectors/handlers over again | 15:43 |
| sandywalsh | dhellmann, it should be both | 15:43 |
| dhellmann | I thought we agreed that for monitoring, we would be a source but not a destination | 15:43 |
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| dhellmann | for metering we are a destination | 15:43 |
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| eglynn | jd__: if it gives enough information to potentially *map* to the counter format, then that could work, no? | 15:44 |
| dhellmann | and for alarming, which is a subset of the monitoring data that's also tied to customer ids in a way that other tools don't do | 15:44 |
| sandywalsh | if it's input->do_something->output as the core architecture, there is no real limitation on that | 15:44 |
| dhellmann | the limitation is whether the thing collecting the data has all of the metadata, too | 15:44 |
| jd__ | eglynn: sure! | 15:45 |
| dhellmann | but we're running out of time in this meeting | 15:45 |
| sandywalsh | again ... just planting a seed for thought :) | 15:45 |
| jd__ | yeah, there's no harm in that :) | 15:45 |
| jd__ | #topic Open discussion | 15:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: ceilometer)" | 15:45 | |
| eglynn | 2013.1.1 just released! | 15:46 |
| eglynn | https://launchpad.net/ceilometer/grizzly/2013.1.1 | 15:46 |
| jd__ | amazing | 15:47 |
| eglynn | props to apevec! | 15:47 |
| jd__ | anything else or should I wrap up? | 15:48 |
| eglynn | nowt else from me | 15:48 |
| * dhellmann has nothing to add | 15:49 | |
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| jd__ | #endmeeting | 15:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 15:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 15:49:57 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-05-16-15.00.html | 15:49 |
| jd__ | thanks guys! | 15:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-05-16-15.00.txt | 15:50 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/ceilometer/2013/ceilometer.2013-05-16-15.00.log.html | 15:50 |
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| sandywalsh | o/ | 15:50 |
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| thomasem | cheers | 15:50 |
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| dhellmann | thanks, everyone | 15:50 |
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| romcheg | PY3 meeting now? | 16:06 |
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| romcheg | ewindisch: ping? | 16:08 |
| ewindisch | hello | 16:08 |
| ewindisch | is it time? | 16:09 |
| romcheg | I guess it is but I might be confused by summer time change | 16:10 |
| rpodolyaka | according to my Google Cal yes :) were there any changes to PY3 meetings time? | 16:10 |
| ewindisch | sorry about that | 16:10 |
| ewindisch | #startmeeting python3 | 16:10 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 16:10:43 2013 UTC. The chair is ewindisch. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:10 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: python3)" | 16:10 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'python3' | 16:10 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 16:10 |
| ewindisch | I just got back from 2 weeks of vacation, so my calendar and brain are a bit wonky | 16:11 |
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| ewindisch | I'm still on CST | 16:11 |
| ewindisch | I see that Chuck has been pushing a few interesting patches while I've been away. | 16:11 |
| zul | yeah i have been having problems with pymox with python3 | 16:12 |
| romcheg | I've made an investigation on tulip | 16:13 |
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| ewindisch | romcheg: cool. lets dedicate some time to that, but I'd like to hear about pymox first | 16:13 |
| ewindisch | #topic pymox | 16:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "pymox (Meeting topic: python3)" | 16:13 | |
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| ewindisch | zul: what is going on? I presume we're now using pymox in unit tests some/every-where? | 16:14 |
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| zul | ewindisch: so pymox is basically used everywhere and its quite old so i been looking at python-mock to replace it | 16:14 |
| zul | and im just learning python-mock right now | 16:15 |
| ewindisch | zul: Sure. I remember this coming up in the first meeting. How is that going? | 16:15 |
| romcheg | I've seen some efforts for making pymox working on py3 | 16:15 |
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| ewindisch | ah | 16:15 |
| zul | however, there is a pymox fork called mimic which is a drop in replacement of pymox | 16:15 |
| dhellmann | mock and mox work differently enough, it seems like changing would probably take a lot of work, wouldn't it? | 16:16 |
| ewindisch | "Experimental python3 support" -- that is somewhat encouraging | 16:16 |
| zul | so last night i tried replacing pymox with mimic in oslo.config and it work great but the version on pypi doesnt support python3 | 16:16 |
| zul | i was looking at that this morning | 16:16 |
| dhellmann | maybe we can help them get a release done? | 16:16 |
| ewindisch | yeah, sounds like they might just need a bump. Having openstack using it will help eliminate that "experimental" modifier, too. | 16:17 |
| zul | i think that would be a good idea im stuck in UDS this week and started looking at finishing off the mimic python3 port | 16:17 |
| zul | so yeah thats where i am right now | 16:18 |
| zul | comments or questions? | 16:18 |
| ewindisch | interestingly, mimic seems to have added then removed python3 from the list of supported versions. There might be some regression we don't know about. | 16:18 |
| dhellmann | seems like you're on the right track | 16:18 |
| ewindisch | zul: I agree that mimic seems the best option. | 16:18 |
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| ewindisch | #link mimic-group http://groups.google.com/group/mox-discuss | 16:19 |
| ewindisch | thanks zul | 16:20 |
| zul | no worries | 16:20 |
| ewindisch | Lets chat eventlet a bit then... | 16:20 |
| ewindisch | #topic tulip investigation | 16:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "tulip investigation (Meeting topic: python3)" | 16:20 | |
| ewindisch | romcheg: feedback? | 16:20 |
| romcheg | yup | 16:20 |
| romcheg | Some bad news comming | 16:20 |
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| ewindisch | ? | 16:21 |
| romcheg | According to my investigation tulip cannot be used as an asynchronous I/O framework for openstack | 16:21 |
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| ewindisch | romcheg: ever? | 16:22 |
| dhellmann | yeah, you really have to be more detailed than that | 16:22 |
| romcheg | Well, we need to either re-write all blocking code in OpenStack itself | 16:22 |
| rpodolyaka | the real problem is SQLAlchemy we heavily rely on. Here is a very interesting answer on StackOverflow from Mike Bayer http://stackoverflow.com/questions/16491564/how-to-make-sqlalchemy-in-tornado-to-be-async/16503103#16503103 | 16:23 |
| ewindisch | rpodolyaka: we have those same problems with eventlet now, anyway. | 16:23 |
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| romcheg | It is possible to use eventlet's event loop for fixing that issue but then comes a problem with monkey patching | 16:24 |
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| ewindisch | a big one problem in whatever we do about eventlet is RPC, but I think we're on the right track with replacing the RPC api. The new API should make it a bit easier to swap out the async library. | 16:24 |
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| dhellmann | I can't find the reference, but they did update the tuplip pep (3156) at some point to remove the part that said eventlet support wasn't going to be included | 16:25 |
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| dhellmann | searching mercurial logs | 16:25 |
| ewindisch | romcheg: couldn't someone write a monkey-patching module based on tulip? | 16:25 |
| ewindisch | basically an eventlet-like solution that used tulip instead of greenlet? | 16:25 |
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| romcheg | ewindisch: I guess it might be easier to fix eventlet's patching then implement a new one | 16:26 |
| dhellmann | right | 16:26 |
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| ewindisch | romcheg: basically the result is that tulip itself won't be a drop-in replacement in and of itself. | 16:27 |
| ewindisch | so we still need eventlet fixed/improved or code around tulip that might be just as much or more effort. | 16:28 |
| ewindisch | anything else on async lib? | 16:29 |
| ewindisch | #topic grants | 16:29 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "grants (Meeting topic: python3)" | 16:29 | |
| romcheg | Well, in general a lot of code has to be written/re-written anyway | 16:30 |
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| ewindisch | I still have no solid ideas for grant requests. | 16:31 |
| ewindisch | my best ideas are generally, "sprints" and "fixing async" | 16:31 |
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| dhellmann | yeah, it seems like we have a lot we can do at this point without needing grants and that when we do need them, the reason will become clear | 16:32 |
| ewindisch | agreed. | 16:32 |
| ewindisch | anything else, other topics? | 16:33 |
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| ewindisch | #topic open discussion | 16:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: python3)" | 16:33 | |
| ewindisch | I'm back from vacation now, so I'll be more engaged again, although I have a hefty responsibility on the rpc stuff at present. Again, that will help relieve the eventlet burden there, should we replace it. | 16:35 |
| dhellmann | yeah, the new design should make eventlet less prominent in the rpc api and driver implementations | 16:35 |
| ewindisch | zul, others… enjoy UDS. | 16:35 |
| zul | tjamls | 16:36 |
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| ewindisch | oh, I forgot… has anyone made progress on gate tests? | 16:36 |
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| ewindisch | I'll take that as a 'no'. I'll follow up with Dave Ripton. IIRC, he was looking into it, but I'll check the meeting notes to be sure. | 16:37 |
| ewindisch | #endmeeting | 16:38 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 16:38 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 16:38:01 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:38 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/python3/2013/python3.2013-05-16-16.10.html | 16:38 |
| ewindisch | thanks everyone | 16:38 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/python3/2013/python3.2013-05-16-16.10.txt | 16:38 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/python3/2013/python3.2013-05-16-16.10.log.html | 16:38 |
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| dhellmann | ewindisch: found it, just too late to show up in the meeting logs: http://hg.python.org/peps/diff/26a98d94bb4c/pep-3156.txt | 16:39 |
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| jaypipes | QAers, unite! | 17:00 |
| sdague | o/ | 17:00 |
| tkammer | lol | 17:00 |
| jaypipes | sdague: you wanna #startmeeting? | 17:01 |
| sdague | but they cannot take... our freedom! | 17:01 |
| sdague | #startmeeting qa | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 17:01:16 2013 UTC. The chair is sdague. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'qa' | 17:01 |
| jaypipes | sdague: I was thinking more along Voltron lines... :) | 17:01 |
| sdague | ok, who's here for QA meeting | 17:01 |
| sdague | jaypipes: awesome :) | 17:01 |
| jaypipes | o/ | 17:01 |
| mlavalle | I am | 17:01 |
| * tkammer waves | 17:01 | |
| jaypipes | davidkranz is away... | 17:01 |
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| afazekas | hi | 17:02 |
| sdague | appologies for not pulling an agenda together in advance, was down in NYC at a Linux Foundation event the last couple of days | 17:02 |
| jaypipes | no worries. | 17:02 |
| sdague | so here's my thoughts on agenda | 17:02 |
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| sdague | 1) blueprints | 17:02 |
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| sdague | 2) any critical reviews/bugs to look at | 17:02 |
| sdague | 3) open meeting | 17:02 |
| sdague | #topic blueprints for H1 | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints for H1 (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:03 | |
| sdague | #link https://launchpad.net/tempest/+milestone/havana-1 | 17:03 |
| sdague | for me, the launchpad cleanup is coming along good. will finally complete that tomorrow | 17:04 |
| jaypipes | great job. | 17:04 |
| afazekas | +1 | 17:04 |
| sdague | the tempest restructure is about 1/3 in, 1/3 in review, and 1/3 to go | 17:04 |
| sdague | currently blocked on this volumes race we uncovered | 17:04 |
| jaypipes | sdague: yeah, I saw that. anything I can do to help? | 17:04 |
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| sdague | which giulivo and jgriffith are helping get to the bottom of | 17:04 |
| giulivo | I've got it sdague | 17:05 |
| sdague | jaypipes: right now, I don't think so. we've got all the right folks on it | 17:05 |
| sdague | giulivo: awesome | 17:05 |
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| jaypipes | excellent. | 17:05 |
| giulivo | the scheduler updates the volume status every minute, which is too long for the tests execution | 17:05 |
| jaypipes | ah | 17:05 |
| sdague | giulivo: nice find | 17:05 |
| sdague | giulivo: so do we have a way to tune that for gate? | 17:05 |
| jaypipes | Is Bagashree Lokare here, by any chance? | 17:05 |
| giulivo | look for "Received volume service update" in the sched log | 17:05 |
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| giulivo | not sure, probably it is configurable behaviour | 17:05 |
| giulivo | haven't checked yet | 17:06 |
| sdague | ok, cool. well I'll count that as problem sorted, we just need to get the right fix together | 17:06 |
| sdague | nice job on that | 17:06 |
| sdague | any other blueprints people are working for for H1 that they want to report in on? | 17:06 |
| sdague | ok... I'll take that as a no :) | 17:07 |
| sdague | next week we'll plan to do rollcall on that, because any non completed (or close ones) we'll need to push to h2 | 17:07 |
| afazekas | IMHO https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/ssh-auth-strategy this should be approved | 17:08 |
| jaypipes | sdague: hoping that Shree will set a priority and status on her 5 blueprints | 17:08 |
| sdague | afazekas: sure | 17:08 |
| afazekas | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-basic-heat-tests this too | 17:08 |
| sdague | afazekas: can you ping that author to but the detailed specification in the wiki instead of etherpad? | 17:09 |
| sdague | etherpads are too easy to get borked | 17:09 |
| sdague | then I'll happily move it to an approved state | 17:09 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: ++ on ssh auth strategy. But I would love to see the blueprint title by more descriptive of the actual task. As it sounds, it seems like the blueprint is about the Keystone endpoints, but it's about SSHing into a VM (whitebox testing) | 17:09 |
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| jaypipes | RAX-Sam: hola. | 17:09 |
| jaypipes | RAX-Sam: wish Daryl a happy birthday from us. :) | 17:09 |
| RAX-Sam | Hey Jay | 17:09 |
| jaypipes | belated... | 17:09 |
| sdague | afazekas: I'm good with https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-basic-heat-tests as well | 17:10 |
| afazekas | sdague: I'll ask him | 17:10 |
| RAX-Sam | :-D He is here just having trouble connecting to Freenode... :-) | 17:10 |
| sdague | afazekas: thanks | 17:10 |
| jaypipes | ah :) | 17:10 |
| sdague | ok, any other blueprint updates? | 17:10 |
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| sdague | ok, next topic | 17:11 |
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| sdague | #topic critical reviews | 17:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "critical reviews (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:11 | |
| sdague | any reviews we need to jump on that aren't getting enough eyes right now? | 17:11 |
| giulivo | doh had two blueprints to ask about: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-snapshot-tests | 17:12 |
| giulivo | and https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/set-gate-attribute | 17:12 |
| jaypipes | sdague: yeah, I also still have a few bluepriont-related things.. | 17:12 |
| giulivo | the second one looks tricky as it gets into the labeling 'discussion' | 17:12 |
| sdague | jaypipes: oops, sorry for jumping the gun :) | 17:12 |
| jaypipes | no worries :) | 17:13 |
| sdague | #topic blueprints | 17:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:13 | |
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| jaypipes | sdague: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-scenario-tests seems to be overlapped with your in-progress https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/tempest-repo-restructure | 17:13 |
| sdague | giulivo: I think we have enough rought concensus on the gate attribute for now. If we need to make a change in the future, we can | 17:13 |
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| sdague | jaypipes: partially | 17:13 |
| sdague | I think that blueprint was for some new scenario tests | 17:13 |
| afazekas | so how to use the smoke flag ? | 17:13 |
| afazekas | Do we need services related flags ? | 17:14 |
| jaypipes | sdague: and https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/quantum-quota-basic-tests and https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/quantum-quota-extension-test seem to also be identical. | 17:14 |
| sdague | jaypipes: yes, there are massively duplicated quantum ones | 17:14 |
| jaypipes | sdague: on the scenario tests, then, I would like to see more details on the former. | 17:14 |
| sdague | mlavalle, were you going to try to condense those | 17:14 |
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| mlavalle | sdague: Yes, I was too busy this week, moving my family from Houston to San Antonio | 17:15 |
| mlavalle | sdague: But I will follow up with this | 17:15 |
| sdague | jaypipes: I'm happy with that as feedback to the author on the scenario tests before it moves to approved, would you like to provide it? | 17:15 |
| sdague | mlavalle: thanks | 17:15 |
| jaypipes | sdague: OK to approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-logging-configuration? It's in code review now... | 17:15 |
| sdague | jaypipes: +1 on that | 17:16 |
| jaypipes | sdague: yes on scenario. | 17:16 |
| jaypipes | will provide feedback on whiteboard. | 17:16 |
| sdague | #action jaypipes to provide feedback on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-scenario-tests | 17:16 |
| sdague | great, thanks | 17:16 |
| sdague | we lost one of giulivo's | 17:17 |
| jaypipes | sdague: logging config BP approved. | 17:17 |
| sdague | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-snapshot-tests | 17:17 |
| sdague | jaypipes: thanks! | 17:17 |
| sdague | I'm good with approving https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tempest/+spec/add-snapshot-tests | 17:17 |
| sdague | any objections? | 17:17 |
| jaypipes | looking... | 17:17 |
| giulivo | it is "slow" | 17:18 |
| sdague | giulivo: we may have to not put the 'gate' tag on it | 17:18 |
| giulivo | I think this could be experimental for the labeling thing | 17:18 |
| giulivo | yeah indeed | 17:18 |
| jaypipes | sdague: I renamed it to add-volume-snapshot-tests | 17:18 |
| jaypipes | sdague: need to be specific :) | 17:18 |
| sdague | jaypipes: great | 17:18 |
| jaypipes | sdague: and +1 from me. | 17:18 |
| sdague | yes, that's goodness | 17:18 |
| afazekas | giulivo: did you turned of the secure delete option ? | 17:18 |
| dwalleck | ahh, better :-) I was confused there for a sec too | 17:18 |
| jaypipes | IIRC, giulivo is already pretty much done with that | 17:18 |
| sdague | afazekas: secure delete is off in the gate | 17:19 |
| afazekas | without secure delete it is not too slow AFAIK | 17:19 |
| jaypipes | giulivo, sdague: k, updated status of add-volume-snapshot-tests | 17:19 |
| sdague | jaypipes: great, thanks | 17:19 |
| sdague | other blueprint issues .... ? | 17:20 |
| jaypipes | well, just the Shree ones, but doesn't look like Ravi is here to provide feedback | 17:20 |
| jaypipes | so no :) | 17:20 |
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| jgriffith | sdague: giulivo I'm looking at adding a forced check of capacity update on your race condition | 17:21 |
| sdague | ok, I'll take a todo to send out an email asking about H1 status by the end of the week | 17:21 |
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| sdague | #action sdague to email openstack-qa to get remaining updates on blueprint (especially quantum ones) this week | 17:21 |
| sdague | jgriffith: nice, thanks | 17:22 |
| sdague | ok... so probably enough on the blueprints front | 17:22 |
| jaypipes | ya, sounds like it. | 17:22 |
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| sdague | #topic outstanding important reviews | 17:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "outstanding important reviews (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:22 | |
| sdague | now is the time to pimp reviews that need more eyes | 17:23 |
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| sdague | anyone have items? | 17:23 |
| afazekas | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28505/ | 17:24 |
| sdague | I did a run down through the review queue earlier in the week, and hit my opinions on most of them. The gate tags I still need to take a look on, but I'll do that after we get through the cinder bug | 17:24 |
| sdague | afazekas: ok, I'll take a look at that | 17:25 |
| afazekas | sdague: the cinder is probably configuration issue about the periodic tasks (and with the jitter config) | 17:25 |
| sdague | any other reviews? | 17:26 |
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| * jaypipes actually had some time this week to do some reviews \o/ will do some more today. | 17:26 | |
| sdague | going once.... | 17:26 |
| sdague | jaypipes: awesome | 17:26 |
| sdague | #topic open discussion | 17:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: qa)" | 17:26 | |
| sdague | ok, any other topics people want to bring up? | 17:26 |
| jaypipes | this gate tag... | 17:26 |
| sdague | fire away | 17:26 |
| jaypipes | could you give us a quick summary of the discussion so far and any decisions made? | 17:27 |
| sdague | so... since grizzly rc1 our tempest run time has grown from 35 - 40 mins to 45 - 50 mins | 17:27 |
| sdague | and continues to grow as new tests come in | 17:27 |
| jaypipes | yes, noted. | 17:28 |
| sdague | we've gotten grumbles and pushback from some of the nova team about the gate getting too long to merge complicated changesets | 17:28 |
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| sdague | which might have rebase conflicts | 17:28 |
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| sdague | so a knob that we could have, is make an explicit gate tag | 17:28 |
| jaypipes | sdague: sorry, how does having a rebase conflict have to do with tempest runtime? | 17:28 |
| afazekas | can we run multiple nosetests process in the same time ? | 17:29 |
| sdague | jaypipes: because when you have a 5 patch series in zuul | 17:29 |
| sdague | competing with other people's 5 patch series | 17:29 |
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| dwalleck | afazekas: You should be able to | 17:30 |
| sdague | anything that causes a gate reset, be it a bad merge, a flakey test, a flakey thing in infra, gets compounded | 17:30 |
| jaypipes | sdague: k, understood. | 17:30 |
| sdague | it's O(1) in theory, but not in practice | 17:30 |
| jaypipes | gotcha | 17:30 |
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| sdague | it also means that time to first feedback on a patch, for reviewers to get to it quick, is long | 17:30 |
| dwalleck | If you programatically loaded the test groups and spin up nosetest processes for each module, you'd get some pretty good relief | 17:30 |
| jaypipes | sdague: so the solution to this is to improve the runtime using parallelization (poor man's or otherwise), no? | 17:31 |
| sdague | afazekas: there are lots of other approaches | 17:31 |
| sdague | jaypipes: parallel clearly gets us wins | 17:31 |
| afazekas | It is the lowest cost approach | 17:31 |
| jaypipes | dwalleck: ah, hi there :) happy belated b-day! | 17:31 |
| dwalleck | jaypipes: thanks man! | 17:31 |
| sdague | I guess the question is will parallel, poor man's or otherwise, ever guaruntee that we stay ahead of desired test growth? | 17:31 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: so, I've recommended this a couple times, but it seems to me splitting the gate into an XML and a JSON run would give us approximately a 50% reduction in runtime | 17:32 |
| sdague | jaypipes: well, it wouldn't :) | 17:32 |
| sdague | it will help | 17:32 |
| jaypipes | sdague: and that seems like it would be very easy to do. | 17:32 |
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| afazekas | jaypipes: we have other than just nova tests | 17:32 |
| sdague | I'm totally cool with anyone else running after any other approaches | 17:33 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: sure, but big chunks of time are in nova compute tests :) | 17:33 |
| sdague | jaypipes: less than you think :) | 17:33 |
| afazekas | We should split in competent and/or directory bases | 17:33 |
| sdague | the gate tag was something we could get to quickyl | 17:33 |
| jaypipes | sdague: my concern with the gate tag is that it means one more thing we need to keep track of -- kind of like skips. | 17:33 |
| sdague | jaypipes: sure | 17:33 |
| sdague | long term it just opens a question | 17:34 |
| jaypipes | but I suppose things have gotten to the point where something needs to be done ASAP. | 17:34 |
| jaypipes | so I will support any solutions, like you said. | 17:34 |
| sdague | do we restrict content in tempest to what can run in a gate time limit | 17:34 |
| sdague | I like the idea of having another knob so we can say it doesn't need to be | 17:34 |
| jaypipes | sure. | 17:35 |
| giulivo | that, combined with a full daily run | 17:35 |
| sdague | giulivo: exactly | 17:35 |
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| sdague | because I do believe that any code in tempest does need to run at least once a day | 17:35 |
| sdague | otherwise it bit rots | 17:35 |
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| sdague | eg: the old stress tests | 17:35 |
| giulivo | maybe at that point we could even turn the know to 15mins | 17:35 |
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| giulivo | s/know/knob/ | 17:36 |
| jaypipes | agreed, sdague | 17:36 |
| sdague | giulivo: right, but we can make that decision later | 17:36 |
| sdague | right now we don't have a tool to even debate that | 17:36 |
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| sdague | anyway, so the gate tag seemed prudent and easy | 17:36 |
| sdague | however if someone else wants to sign up for solving it a different way by H1, I'll back off of promoting it | 17:36 |
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| sdague | but we are talking about needing a solution for H1 | 17:37 |
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| giulivo | still maybe there should be some agreement on when to use smoke on a testcase? | 17:37 |
| sdague | because we're running long right now | 17:37 |
| sdague | giulivo: yes, we need some time auditing things | 17:37 |
| giulivo | oh so setting two barriers you mean | 17:37 |
| sdague | my proposal is gate tag now. Spin up periodic jobs again for full. (all H1) | 17:38 |
| jaypipes | sdague: understood. I would volunteer to work on a the XML/JSON split, but unfortunately, I cannot promise to make the 5/30 deadline. | 17:38 |
| jaypipes | sdague: sounds like a good plan for H1 | 17:38 |
| RAX-Sam | I think that parallelization (poor man's or otherwise) will help short term, but it doesn't solve a long term problem. Ultimately I figure it should be a multi-part solution. I.E. Poor man's parallelization, split XML & JSON, maybe carve up further into multiple jobs (gate job, daily job, etc...) being very careful about tests that create expensive resources, etc... | 17:38 |
| sdague | then push for real parallel for H2 with testr | 17:38 |
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| afazekas | sdague: Somehow we should document what covered by which test case in order to select correctly test cases for a shorter run | 17:38 |
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| sdague | then see what other optimizations we can make for H3 to get as much in the gate as we can | 17:38 |
| jaypipes | RAX-Sam: agreed. my poor man's parallel == Split XML and JSON runs ;) | 17:39 |
| sdague | afazekas: you volunteering? | 17:39 |
| jaypipes | really poor man ;) | 17:39 |
| sdague | heh | 17:39 |
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| giulivo | afazekas, ++ ! | 17:39 |
| sdague | hey, poor man's parallel is fine, I just haven't seen volunteers for it :) | 17:39 |
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| jaypipes | sdague: I will give a stab at PMP with XML/JSON | 17:40 |
| sdague | jaypipes: awesome | 17:40 |
| sdague | thanks! | 17:40 |
| jaypipes | sdague: #action me. | 17:40 |
| jaypipes | I don't suppose it will be any code patches to tempest itself... just devstack-gate | 17:40 |
| sdague | #action jaypipes to do PiMP XML / JSON tests | 17:40 |
| sdague | :) | 17:40 |
| jaypipes | hehe | 17:40 |
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| sdague | jaypipes: actually, now that the d-g running is in tox, you'll need to do it in tempest + zuul config | 17:41 |
| sdague | that's actually probably something to fyi folks on | 17:41 |
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| afazekas | sdague:after I can figure out what is the normal format of doing that, yes. But first I should add same doc stings to the base classes | 17:41 |
| sdague | devstack-gate is now just calling tox -e'....' into tempest to run tests | 17:42 |
| sdague | so we don't have to patch d-g when we move things around | 17:42 |
| jaypipes | sdague: no problem. I have enough experience with that in th epast couple weeks doing the chef cookbook stuff ;) | 17:42 |
| sdague | currently we have -esmoke and -efull | 17:42 |
| giulivo | afazekas, docstrings in the base classes for which purpose? | 17:42 |
| afazekas | jaypipes: the 'challenge' is the proper log out output | 17:43 |
| sdague | jaypipes: coolio | 17:43 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: I wouldn' | 17:43 |
| jaypipes | t be changing any log output... | 17:43 |
| sdague | yeh, it would be separate jobs | 17:43 |
| afazekas | giulivo: documenting the functions used by the test cases | 17:43 |
| sdague | ok, additional topics? | 17:44 |
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| sdague | going once... | 17:45 |
| sdague | going twice... | 17:45 |
| afazekas | http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-qa/2013-February/000219.html | 17:45 |
| jaypipes | sold. | 17:45 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: suggestion... | 17:45 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: that email is likely too long to have an effective conversation about all the points. I would recommend splitting into separate emails for each point. | 17:46 |
| afazekas | jaypipes: ok | 17:46 |
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| jaypipes | afazekas: possibly putting that original email in an etherpad and referring to it from the followup single-topic emails. | 17:46 |
| sdague | afazekas: yeh, we've gotten active on our ML recently, so I think if it came in new in chunks, we'd get a good discussion | 17:46 |
| jaypipes | ++ | 17:47 |
| jaypipes | afazekas: because they are all good points, just got lost in the shuffle too easily in a big email like that | 17:47 |
| afazekas | I see :) | 17:47 |
| sdague | ok, with that I think I'll call it a meeting. We can take additional topics to #openstack-qa or the mailing list | 17:47 |
| sdague | #endmeeting | 17:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 17:47 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 17:47:44 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:47 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-05-16-17.01.html | 17:47 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-05-16-17.01.txt | 17:47 |
| sdague | thanks for coming call | 17:47 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/qa/2013/qa.2013-05-16-17.01.log.html | 17:47 |
| afazekas | wait :) | 17:47 |
| sdague | coming all | 17:47 |
| sdague | oh, sorry... | 17:48 |
| afazekas | We should check our bug tracker | 17:48 |
| afazekas | we have a lot of new bug | 17:48 |
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| afazekas | end | 17:48 |
| sdague | ok, good point. but lets take it to #openstack-qa | 17:48 |
| sdague | because I ended the meeting early .... sorry :( | 17:48 |
| afazekas | np | 17:48 |
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| bdpayne | #startmeeting OpenStack Security Group | 18:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 18:00:16 2013 UTC. The chair is bdpayne. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_security_group' | 18:00 |
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| bdpayne | hi everyone | 18:00 |
| malini1 | Greetings | 18:00 |
| bdpayne | Bryan Payne from Nebula here | 18:00 |
| bdpayne | who else do we have? | 18:00 |
| noslzzp | Greetings.. Basil from Red Hat. | 18:01 |
| malini1 | Basil -- hope you did get some sleep! | 18:01 |
| noslzzp | A bit! | 18:01 |
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| bdpayne | ha, nice | 18:01 |
| bdpayne | ok, we'll get started | 18:01 |
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| bdpayne | I'm sure more will join as we go | 18:02 |
| bdpayne | #topic Doc Sprint | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Doc Sprint (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:02 | |
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| bdpayne | so we have dates locked in: June 24-28 | 18:02 |
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| * annegentle waves | 18:02 | |
| bdpayne | we have a location locked in (near BWI) | 18:02 |
| bdpayne | hi annegentle | 18:02 |
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| annegentle | psyched for the doc sprint y'all! | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | and we have about 12 people committed to participating | 18:03 |
| bdpayne | noslzzp I'd like to explore getting a hotel block | 18:04 |
| bdpayne | and we have some logistics to work our regarding food and such | 18:04 |
| noslzzp | It's complicated. :) | 18:04 |
| bdpayne | complicated? | 18:04 |
| noslzzp | So, because we have a sponsor from the IC, the address is sensitive. | 18:05 |
| bdpayne | heh | 18:05 |
| noslzzp | The last meeting we had there, we didn't get final address details until late. | 18:05 |
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| bdpayne | well, people will need to book a hotel, right? | 18:05 |
| noslzzp | I've asked Shawn to join here real quick. | 18:06 |
| swells | noslzzp: i'm here | 18:06 |
| bdpayne | and we'd like to be as close to the site as possible… walking distance is ideal | 18:06 |
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| mtesauro | who is "the IC" - I missed the last meeting | 18:07 |
| noslzzp | Ok.. So I've been the facility in mind. And it's walking distance from 2-3 hotels. | 18:07 |
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| noslzzp | "IC" = intelligence community. | 18:07 |
| noslzzp | The location is very good for us. Good wifi, large room, quiet and decent restaurants. | 18:07 |
| bdpayne | could we still get a block at one of those hotels and not disclose the actual meeting location until last minute? | 18:08 |
| noslzzp | Give me 48 hours to get confirmation from our sponsor. I'd like to keep protocol in place. | 18:08 |
| bdpayne | fair enough | 18:09 |
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| bdpayne | we can discuss offline once you know more noslzzp | 18:09 |
| noslzzp | Shawn is helping with the coordination. | 18:09 |
| bdpayne | #action noslzzp / swells to confirm our ability to setup hotel block | 18:09 |
| noslzzp | bdpayne, yes, offline as soon as we're fully cleared to share the address. | 18:09 |
| noslzzp | Sorry this is so complicated. :) | 18:10 |
| bdpayne | no problem | 18:10 |
| bdpayne | I used to live in that world, I understand at a deeper level than I care to admit | 18:10 |
| noslzzp | heh | 18:10 |
| bdpayne | ok, so bottom line here is that logistics are starting to come together | 18:11 |
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| bdpayne | and we have a great team put together to do the guide | 18:11 |
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| bdpayne | any other things to discuss regarding the doc sprint? | 18:11 |
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| bdpayne | ok, we can move forward then | 18:12 |
| bdpayne | #topic Ongoing Security Projects | 18:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ongoing Security Projects (Meeting topic: OpenStack Security Group)" | 18:12 | |
| bdpayne | Anyone here that can provide an update on RPC security, key manager, and/or volume encryption work? | 18:12 |
| joel-coffman | I can speak to the volume encryption work | 18:13 |
| malini1 | Key manager: malini | 18:13 |
| bdpayne | joel-coffman let's start with you then | 18:13 |
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| joel-coffman | We expect to (re)submit our code in another couple of weeks | 18:14 |
| mtesauro | I know key manager is actively being developed - I'm on the github and see the commit/pull requests/etc. | 18:14 |
| joel-coffman | We're working to incorporate changes requested at the summit | 18:14 |
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| bdpayne | joel-coffman what can we expect from a functionality perspective from this new code submition? | 18:15 |
| joel-coffman | The encryption part should be fully-functional | 18:15 |
| bdpayne | without integration into a key manager? | 18:16 |
| bdpayne | or with? | 18:16 |
| joel-coffman | until the key manager is ready, I don't know how useful it will be in a deployed environment | 18:16 |
| bdpayne | right, ok | 18:16 |
| malini1 | Key manager goal is to have enough in git by May 31 for joel-coffman to get a key and use | 18:16 |
| joel-coffman | we aren't quite ready to integrate with the key manager yet | 18:16 |
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| joel-coffman | that timeline sounds about perfect | 18:17 |
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| malini1 | key manger will support "put" secret, "get" secret | 18:17 |
| bdpayne | joel-coffman if you put "SecurityImpact" in your git commit message for the PR, then it will automatically email the security list for review when your code goes up | 18:17 |
| malini1 | May 31 is Havana-1 deadline, and July 18 havana-2, meeting 1&2 ensures incubation success | 18:17 |
| joel-coffman | okay | 18:18 |
| bdpayne | sounds good, let us know if there's anything else the security group can do to help there | 18:18 |
| bdpayne | malini1 any other details on the key manager work? | 18:18 |
| malini1 | I am working on keystone integration for key manager | 18:18 |
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| malini1 | and it is coming along | 18:19 |
| malini1 | jarret from rackspace is working on a client, so slowly all the pieces are coming togeher | 18:19 |
| bdpayne | is the architecture / design of the key manager with regards to keystone available anyware? | 18:19 |
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| malini1 | yes, https://github.com/cloudkeep/barbican/wiki/_pages | 18:20 |
| mtesauro | Malini - when you say client - do you mean the JS client? | 18:20 |
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| mtesauro | aka Palisade? | 18:21 |
| malini1 | the only piece I am not too thrilled is that the rackspace design has a notion of "order", which is asynch to create a key | 18:21 |
| malini1 | that fits in better for pki private/public and certificate, for a simple asymmetric key that feels like too much overhead | 18:21 |
| mtesauro | I suspect that if for SSL cert mgmt. That process has to be async if dealing with a third party CA | 18:21 |
| malini1 | the alternative is for the service wanting a secret key to just create it and "put" it into keymanager | 18:22 |
| bdpayne | perhaps async is a reasonable first step? with an optimization available for symmetric keys down the road? | 18:22 |
| malini1 | exactly, it is for ssl-cert management, but users such as cinder, swift etc are seeking symmetric keys | 18:22 |
| malini1 | yes, would like support for pitching a fast-pass for symmetric keys | 18:23 |
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| bdpayne | so is the key store creating the keys.. or just storing them? | 18:23 |
| malini1 | having a fast-pass for symmetric would better support a use model where there is say and HSM to back the key manager | 18:23 |
| malini1 | both models support, creating and storing | 18:23 |
| bdpayne | ok | 18:23 |
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| malini1 | because storing is supported, do not need to use the asynch path for symmetric keys | 18:24 |
| mtesauro | I am a short walk away from Jarret - I can talk to him about this. | 18:24 |
| bdpayne | personally, I like creating b/c I suspect that many users will make mistakes in trying to create keys | 18:24 |
| bdpayne | mtesauro that would be great | 18:24 |
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| bdpayne | #action joel-coffman to aim for Havana-1 deadline for submission of volume encryption code | 18:25 |
| joel-coffman | will do | 18:25 |
| bdpayne | #action mtesauro to discuss symmetric keys use case with Jarret, sync back with malini1 | 18:26 |
| bdpayne | anything else to discuss? | 18:26 |
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| bdpayne | ok then… thanks everyone for attending | 18:26 |
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| bdpayne | I believe we are done for today | 18:27 |
| malini1 | the point of creation needs to have a good supply of entropy for random numbers, so if the keymanager client has an api call for create key, that would work, most service endpoints for key creation will be on host machines | 18:27 |
| malini1 | with the necessary entropy | 18:27 |
| malini1 | thanks everyone | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | exactly… and then the key manager could get the entropy correctly | 18:28 |
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| bdpayne | whereas the clients may not use a proper rng | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | which is a pretty common mistake | 18:28 |
| bdpayne | #endmeeting | 18:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 18:29 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 18:29:11 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:29 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-05-16-18.00.html | 18:29 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-05-16-18.00.txt | 18:29 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_security_group/2013/openstack_security_group.2013-05-16-18.00.log.html | 18:29 |
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| clarkb | jeblair: there it is | 18:33 |
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| jeblair | #startmeeting test | 18:34 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 18:34:08 2013 UTC. The chair is jeblair. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:34 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: test)" | 18:34 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'test' | 18:34 |
| jeblair | test meeting! | 18:34 |
| jeblair | #endmeeting | 18:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 18:34 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 18:34:20 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:34 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/test/2013/test.2013-05-16-18.34.html | 18:34 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/test/2013/test.2013-05-16-18.34.txt | 18:34 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/test/2013/test.2013-05-16-18.34.log.html | 18:34 |
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| harlowja | #startmeeting state-management | 20:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 20:00:29 2013 UTC. The chair is harlowja. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: state-management)" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'state_management' | 20:00 |
| harlowja | howday all! | 20:00 |
| adrian_otto | hi | 20:00 |
| kebray | hi | 20:00 |
| harlowja | hi hi | 20:00 |
| changbl | hello~ | 20:01 |
| jlucci | howdy | 20:01 |
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| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/StateManagement#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 20:01 |
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| harlowja | jgriffith yt | 20:01 |
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| nsavin | hi | 20:02 |
| harlowja | hey, so i guess we can start, anyone else can wonder in :) | 20:02 |
| ipersky | hi | 20:02 |
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| harlowja | so lots of good stuff happening, where to start! :) | 20:02 |
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| ipersky | :) | 20:03 |
| harlowja | i think there is enough activity that we decided to go directly to stackforge, and then as we flush out cinder (And elsewhere) we can start hooking it in there | 20:03 |
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| harlowja | jlucci from rackspace is helping get the stackforge stuff going | 20:03 |
| harlowja | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1179754 | 20:04 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1179754 in openstack-ci "Create taskflow-core gerrit group" [Wishlist,Incomplete] | 20:04 |
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| harlowja | i started that, but it seems like its more of the gerrit config files that matters, so thats good news, pretty self-service | 20:04 |
| harlowja | so as far as cinder integration, jgriffith has written up some useful initial diagrams of what cinder is doing and the issues it has | 20:05 |
| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflows#Cinder | 20:05 |
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| harlowja | create volume and create snapshot currently suffer from the lack of abilitiy to revert correctly it seems | 20:06 |
| harlowja | the ntt folks have also updated evacuate/migrate in https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflows#Nova as well for those that are interested | 20:06 |
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| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflows#Nova | 20:06 |
| harlowja | so thats all good stuff, and shows that we are making progress in step #1, understanding the problems to fix :) | 20:07 |
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| harlowja | if anyone is interested they can add there potential use case there also :) | 20:08 |
| ipersky | wow | 20:08 |
| ipersky | RunInstance diagram looks impressive | 20:08 |
| harlowja | scary or impressive ;) | 20:08 |
| harlowja | scary impressive, lol | 20:08 |
| ipersky | ) | 20:09 |
| harlowja | i also updated the primitives wiki with some minor changes | 20:09 |
| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflowPrimitives | 20:09 |
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| harlowja | added the concept of a 'job claim' which is how a job gets claimed by somethign about to work on it | 20:09 |
| harlowja | *could be ZK based, DB based... | 20:09 |
| harlowja | also started adding some of the underlying patterns that taskflow might be able to help organize code 'states' with | 20:10 |
| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflowPrimitives#Patterns | 20:10 |
| alexheneveld | hi -- sorry late. but just in time -- that was the question i was going to ask | 20:10 |
| alexheneveld | can some of this be tied in to the existing DB entities somehow… | 20:11 |
| harlowja | thats the plan | 20:11 |
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| alexheneveld | excellent! | 20:11 |
| harlowja | we'll see what kind of schema changes might have to happen, but hopefuly not so many :) | 20:12 |
| adrian_otto | guys, that is not going to work for lock management | 20:12 |
| harlowja | agreed | 20:12 |
| adrian_otto | it works fine for persisting state, but not for managing concurrency. | 20:12 |
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| harlowja | right, but i can see certain uses (say in nova) where they don't have much of a concurrency to begin with, so they can still take advantage of the other parts of the library (just not the cocurrent job claiming stuff) | 20:13 |
| adrian_otto | so if the only expectation is that a single thread in a single sequence is going to use the DB to track state transitions, then fine | 20:13 |
| harlowja | right | 20:13 |
| adrian_otto | but as soon as you bring in multiple workers, that breaks down | 20:13 |
| harlowja | yup | 20:13 |
| harlowja | i think we need to put a big warning on the DB implementations that say that | 20:14 |
| alexheneveld | adrian_otto: some db's let you … but is the concern portabiliity? | 20:14 |
| adrian_otto | yes | 20:14 |
| nsavin | but zk should be fine for concurrency | 20:14 |
| adrian_otto | there is a feature in MySQL to do applicaiton locks, but you can't expect to put an ORM in front of that | 20:14 |
| jlucci | We don't want to commit to zk | 20:14 |
| adrian_otto | I'm not suggesting zk | 20:14 |
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| adrian_otto | but that you can't rely on SQLite or MySQL to act as a backing store for a locking implementation | 20:15 |
| alexheneveld | some generic mutex / notify service | 20:15 |
| alexheneveld | ? | 20:15 |
| adrian_otto | because of MVCC | 20:15 |
| adrian_otto | yes, something as simple as something with a backend on a single node with flock() or fcntl() would even work | 20:16 |
| adrian_otto | but we need to thing of solving concurrency control and data persistence as separate implementations | 20:16 |
| adrian_otto | s/thing/think/ | 20:16 |
| adrian_otto | that are coordinated. | 20:16 |
| harlowja | so i think there are 2 pieces of this library that it will provide, 1 is the job posting, ownership, concurrency stuff, which likely a DB is not gonna work, but then there is the task/workflow organization, which can be used almost seperatly from the distributed stuff in a way | 20:16 |
| maoy | i must be missing something. orchestration tasks are long running, it's probably a bad idea to hold db lock for that long. need to use some entries to "safeguard" instead | 20:16 |
| adrian_otto | harlowja: exactly. | 20:17 |
| harlowja | cool, i think seeing an example might help :) | 20:18 |
| adrian_otto | maoy: we need a lock primitive. Regardless if they are coarse locks or fine grained locks. | 20:18 |
| alexheneveld | harlowja: could job posting + ownership still be done in the DB ? just have a very lightweight concurrency control service. | 20:18 |
| adrian_otto | yes | 20:18 |
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| harlowja | alexheneveld i believe so, it really depends on the tasks that compose the workflow, simple stuff like in most of openstack i think can be made pretty lightweight, but more complicated things like user-defined workflows shouldn't be restricted by the same code, we should try to enable both :) | 20:19 |
| harlowja | say like for most of openstack, u could get away with posting (which is really a mq message) and ownership can be setting a field in a db | 20:20 |
| harlowja | that works ok, but then said owner isn't resilent to failure | 20:20 |
| harlowja | *which might be ok for openstack binaries which can be restarted by init.d and such | 20:20 |
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| alexheneveld | harlowja: but you can have a health check process which determines whether owner is gone away and/or timeout on the job... | 20:21 |
| hemna | for the first drop of this, I'd like to see something simple | 20:21 |
| harlowja | yes, which might be fine for openstack, but not acceptable for users i think | 20:21 |
| alexheneveld | which touches on scheduler… the two are pretty closely related i think | 20:21 |
| hemna | and not over engineered | 20:21 |
| harlowja | hemna agreed | 20:21 |
| harlowja | but we should discuss the complex cases, since it will come up | 20:22 |
| hemna | lets not solve world hunger here | 20:22 |
| harlowja | imho the complex cases are just more advanced primitives | 20:22 |
| harlowja | the simple cases just use dumbed-down primitives :) | 20:22 |
| adrian_otto | agreed | 20:22 |
| nsavin | agreed | 20:22 |
| harlowja | so thats why having a solid primitive foundation is pretty important | 20:22 |
| hemna | I'm fine with using a db backing for starters. | 20:22 |
| harlowja | agreed | 20:23 |
| harlowja | so the taskflow library right now has a memory backed part to start, new this week, mostly works :-P | 20:23 |
| hemna | :) | 20:23 |
| harlowja | example usage | 20:23 |
| harlowja | #link http://paste.openstack.org/show/37363/ | 20:23 |
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| harlowja | that would be something like the cinder workflow that they have | 20:24 |
| * harlowja let people digest that for a sec | 20:24 | |
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| * hemna chews | 20:25 | |
| harlowja | using the primitives, even with simple memory backends we can experiment with reverting, resumption and all that | 20:25 |
| harlowja | it gets interesting when u start using a database backed logbook for example | 20:26 |
| adrian_otto | looks good to me. I like that as a simple starting point. | 20:26 |
| harlowja | *note that there is no concurrency there, no distributed jobs and such | 20:26 |
| harlowja | but imho u get alot just with this type of usage | 20:27 |
| hemna | yah I think that's good | 20:27 |
| adrian_otto | yep, we can start with this, and revisit the concurrency stuff in a subsequent effort | 20:27 |
| harlowja | well jlucci is helping make the distributed stuff work :) so its all happening ;) | 20:28 |
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| harlowja | but i think the distributed stuff is a seperate 'pattern', not the only pattern, but one of them | 20:28 |
| adrian_otto | yep | 20:28 |
| harlowja | some peoples usage will just be the simple case, like cinder for example, don't care about distributing your job, just want to have a workflow revert, then this might work fine (or almost be fine +- some other changes) | 20:28 |
| harlowja | nova i think is similar with conductor | 20:29 |
| harlowja | since they have there own 'job posting/disribution' mechanisms | 20:29 |
| harlowja | *distribution | 20:29 |
| harlowja | its not perfect yet, but i think the example there shows the potential :) | 20:29 |
| alexheneveld | harlowja: code looks clean | 20:29 |
| harlowja | thx! | 20:29 |
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| harlowja | so i am hoping to add some more tests and such, there are a few, and then getting a db based logbook, which will allow for resumption across a process (but not concurrently acting on it) | 20:31 |
| ipersky | harlowja: i like it too. is there some parts i can help implement? backends maybe? | 20:31 |
| harlowja | sure ipersky if u want to start on the db backend stuff, that might be neat :) | 20:31 |
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| harlowja | i think we need that one before we can hook-in to cinder, although i think we can start working with jgriffith and getting some code in even at this stage | 20:32 |
| jlucci | +1 for backend work. :D | 20:32 |
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| alexheneveld | harlowja: could this be backed by celery? should it? | 20:32 |
| harlowja | after it moves to stackforge, and we all think its ok, we can pypi it and start using it in nova, cinder, ... | 20:32 |
| harlowja | alexheneveld so excellent question | 20:33 |
| harlowja | jlucci :) | 20:33 |
| kebray | I think jlucci may be working on some celery goodness, no? | 20:33 |
| jlucci | ha | 20:33 |
| jlucci | Yeah | 20:33 |
| jlucci | So the distributed pattern right now is using celery | 20:33 |
| alexheneveld | cool | 20:33 |
| harlowja | jlucci is helping alot in making sure the primitives work there, or if not, how can we adjust them so that it does | 20:34 |
| hemna | I'll start looking at the usages for it and see if it makes sense to dink with cinder yet | 20:34 |
| harlowja | since i think celery (the distributed pattern) should also be possible if people want to use it that way | 20:34 |
| jlucci | And so far the primitives seem to translate pretty well | 20:34 |
| harlowja | hemna thanks, it might be a few weeks off, but the foundation i think is getting less slushy | 20:34 |
| harlowja | jlucci is having to put up with me changing it, sorry jlucci :) | 20:34 |
| hemna | ok | 20:35 |
| jlucci | S'all good. :P | 20:35 |
| hemna | it might be a good exercize for me just to start learning the api and where stuff might go in cinder | 20:35 |
| harlowja | sure, feel free to mess around with it | 20:35 |
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| harlowja | #link https://github.com/Yahoo/TaskFlow/ | 20:35 |
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| harlowja | it will proably end up at stackforge soon | 20:36 |
| harlowja | if anyone wants to try a ZK backend, it might be neat also | 20:36 |
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| harlowja | or think about how conductor could start to use this, i have some ideas, i think john barriet (sp?) might have some to | 20:36 |
| ipersky | I'd like to look into it | 20:37 |
| ipersky | i mean ZK ) | 20:37 |
| harlowja | ipersky cool | 20:37 |
| harlowja | any new use cases would be really cool, the more the better :) | 20:37 |
| harlowja | more betterness for all ;) | 20:37 |
| adrian_otto | ipersky: did you see the little zk code stub that's already in there? | 20:38 |
| ipersky | well, still first have to read the code/docs and ast a lot of dumb questions | 20:38 |
| ipersky | s/ast/ask/ | 20:38 |
| adrian_otto | there is a place to hang that once you look at the source | 20:38 |
| harlowja | ipersky i can connect u with the nttdata folks also, they were working with the prototype nova code and zk | 20:38 |
| harlowja | it might be a 'easy' move into this library (not sure) | 20:39 |
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| harlowja | adrian_otto are u talking about that code, or the nova zk code? | 20:39 |
| harlowja | *which is the service group stuff | 20:39 |
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| changbl | harlowja, ipersky , i can also help with zk backend | 20:40 |
| harlowja | changbl great :) | 20:40 |
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| harlowja | awesome stuff :) | 20:41 |
| adrian_otto | harlowja: I was referring to what I saw in gerrit for Nova | 20:41 |
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| harlowja | kk | 20:41 |
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| harlowja | afaik there is some ongoing work to move to 1 zk library in nova, so that if taskflow gets used it won't pull in a secondary zk library | 20:41 |
| harlowja | kazoo seems to be the library thats the best supported nowadays | 20:42 |
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| adrian_otto | yes | 20:42 |
| harlowja | #link https://github.com/python-zk/kazoo/ | 20:42 |
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| harlowja | cool, so lets open for any other discussion, i think we covered all i want to talk about, unless others have topics :) | 20:42 |
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| harlowja | great progress is happening imho :) | 20:43 |
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| harlowja | #topic open-discussion | 20:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open-discussion (Meeting topic: state-management)" | 20:43 | |
| jlucci | agreed - I'll try to have an example of a celery/distributed pattern soon for people to see | 20:43 |
| harlowja | btw, some example that i was working on last night that people might like | 20:44 |
| adrian_otto | jlucci: thanks for your efforts on this. I know you've really been cranking on it. | 20:44 |
| harlowja | yes thanks jlucci :) | 20:44 |
| alexheneveld | jlucci: looking forward to it | 20:44 |
| jlucci | haha np Glad to be helping. It's an exciting project | 20:44 |
| ipersky | changbl great i'll add you to discussion when start asking dumb questions on backend design | 20:44 |
| ipersky | ) | 20:44 |
| kebray | Do we have a target timeline/goal in mind for delivering a solid use case (e.g. for Cinder, or Heat, etc.) that we should be aware that we are working toward? | 20:44 |
| harlowja | hmmm, hemna any thoughts? | 20:45 |
| harlowja | #link #link https://github.com/harlowja/TaskFlow/blob/new-hotness/taskflow/tests/unit/test_memory.py#L161 for the neat local threaded jobboard workflow stuff if anyone is interested | 20:45 |
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| hemna | good progress, I'd just like to start playing with it and see how it fits in | 20:45 |
| harlowja | i think havana-1 is soon right, so my guess not that one | 20:46 |
| harlowja | havana-2 maybe? | 20:46 |
| hemna | when is the H1 date? | 20:46 |
| adrian_otto | very close | 20:46 |
| harlowja | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Havana_Release_Schedule | 20:46 |
| adrian_otto | next week | 20:46 |
| adrian_otto | H2: July 19 | 20:46 |
| hemna | ok H2 sounds more reasonable | 20:46 |
| harlowja | i think H2 is more realistic :) | 20:46 |
| harlowja | H1 could happen, but i think that would be pushing to hard | 20:47 |
| hemna | next week is kinda a wash for most folks anyway with the US holiday | 20:47 |
| kebray | ok, cool. no pressure, just good to have goals :-) | 20:47 |
| harlowja | def | 20:47 |
| changbl | ipersky, np~ | 20:47 |
| adrian_otto | shoot for getting basic primitives in H1 | 20:47 |
| adrian_otto | and then code that implements them in H2 | 20:47 |
| harlowja | sure, so that brings up a good question that i'm not sure about | 20:47 |
| hemna | would it make any sense to pull this into cinder as is for H1 ? | 20:48 |
| harlowja | do stackforge projects follow h1,h2... | 20:48 |
| harlowja | we can of course make sure we follow that | 20:48 |
| harlowja | hemna i don't think so | 20:48 |
| hemna | ok | 20:48 |
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| harlowja | needs a little more time to mature i think | 20:48 |
| harlowja | but i think its 'playground ready' | 20:49 |
| jlucci | +1 for h2 | 20:49 |
| harlowja | +1 | 20:49 |
| nsavin | +1 for h2 | 20:49 |
| hemna | I just thought it'd be nice to get in the gating and all. But didn't we already say that stackforge can do the same? | 20:49 |
| harlowja | hemna ya | 20:49 |
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| hemna | ok, then +1 for H2 then | 20:49 |
| harlowja | stackforge does all the gating, and ci tests and such | 20:49 |
| hemna | I'd like to see if I can get a few simple use cases plugged in for cinder at H2 as well | 20:49 |
| hemna | volume creation, snapshot creation | 20:50 |
| harlowja | def | 20:50 |
| harlowja | hemna https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StructuredWorkflows#Cinder | 20:50 |
| hemna | I don't want to wait for H3 to get this used :) | 20:50 |
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| harlowja | john put some of those up, so we can have a place to track them | 20:50 |
| hemna | ok cool | 20:50 |
| harlowja | H2 sounds reasonable to me | 20:51 |
| harlowja | and lets it mature to a decent level | 20:51 |
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| hemna | ok lets plan on getting it in H2 along with create volume and create snapshot | 20:51 |
| adrian_otto | +1 | 20:51 |
| harlowja | cool | 20:51 |
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| harlowja | also for ongoing discussions we can use the #openstack-state-management room | 20:52 |
| harlowja | probably easier than email and such | 20:52 |
| hemna | we'll have a better idea on the api as well as the work required to cover the rest of cinder for H3 then | 20:52 |
| hemna | ok | 20:52 |
| harlowja | hemna sounds great :) | 20:53 |
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| harlowja | if all of cinder would use this, that would be incredible imho | 20:53 |
| * harlowja would be super happy | 20:53 | |
| hemna | that's the plan :) | 20:53 |
| harlowja | very cool | 20:53 |
| harlowja | #agreed aim for a few use-cases for cinder in H2 | 20:54 |
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| * adrian_otto departing to catch a flight | 20:54 | |
| harlowja | if anyone wants to try it in nova and such, that'd be cool to, i might be able to try that out, we'll see | 20:55 |
| harlowja | or reddwarf, or anywhere people feel :) | 20:55 |
| harlowja | ok dokie, any other stuff to talk about? | 20:55 |
| hemna | nice job man | 20:55 |
| harlowja | thx! | 20:55 |
| harlowja | #endmeeting | 20:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 20:56 | |
| kebray | I sit next to the lead for Reddwarf. I'll follow up with Michael Basnight. #action kebray to follow up with Baz on Reddwarf dependency of TaskFlow for H2 | 20:56 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 20:56:05 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/state_management/2013/state_management.2013-05-16-20.00.html | 20:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/state_management/2013/state_management.2013-05-16-20.00.txt | 20:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/state_management/2013/state_management.2013-05-16-20.00.log.html | 20:56 |
| harlowja | kebray, oops, cut u off, sorry :) | 20:56 |
| kebray | no worries. | 20:56 |
| kebray | I type slow. | 20:56 |
| harlowja | :) | 20:56 |
| harlowja | i thought 500wpm | 20:56 |
| kebray | haha. | 20:56 |
| kebray | We'll check the log. either way, I'll follow up. | 20:56 |
| harlowja | great! | 20:56 |
| harlowja | bb, gotta get food before nova meeting :) | 20:57 |
| harlowja | keep in touch everyone | 20:57 |
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| *** cyeoh_ is now known as cyeoh | 21:00 | |
| devananda | \o | 21:00 |
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| russellb | ohai! | 21:00 |
| senhuang | hello! | 21:01 |
| russellb | #startmeeting nova | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 21:01:04 2013 UTC. The chair is russellb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova' | 21:01 |
| mikal | Heya! | 21:01 |
| russellb | Well hello, everyone! | 21:01 |
| russellb | who's around to chat? | 21:01 |
| hartsocks | hey | 21:01 |
| comstud | o/ | 21:01 |
| alaski | o/ | 21:01 |
| n0ano | o/ | 21:01 |
| beagles | hi | 21:01 |
| jog0 | o/ | 21:01 |
| devananda | \o | 21:01 |
| dripton | hi | 21:01 |
| russellb | throw your ascii hands in the air like you just don't care | 21:01 |
| cyeoh | hi | 21:01 |
| mikal | \o/ | 21:01 |
| russellb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Nova | 21:02 |
| russellb | #topic blueprints | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:02 | |
| russellb | let's take a look at havana-1 status | 21:02 |
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| russellb | #link https://launchpad.net/nova/+milestone/havana-1 | 21:02 |
| russellb | so time is flying by on this | 21:02 |
| russellb | merge deadline is only 1.5 weeks away | 21:02 |
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| russellb | which means that ideally anything targeted for havana-1 should be up for review in about ... 0.5 weeks | 21:02 |
| mikal | Ugh | 21:03 |
| cburgess | here | 21:03 |
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| comstud | Whole stole our time? | 21:03 |
| comstud | who | 21:03 |
| russellb | to give time for the review process | 21:03 |
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| russellb | comstud: ikr? | 21:03 |
| russellb | so please take a look at this list and 1) ensure that the status is accurate | 21:03 |
| russellb | 2) try to get this stuff up for review by early/mid next week | 21:04 |
| russellb | 3) if not #2, let me know as soon as you think it's going to slip so we can update the blueprint to push it back for havana-2 | 21:04 |
| mikal | I will not be completing 6 bps in the next week. I shall move some to havana-2. | 21:04 |
| russellb | mikal: great, thank you sir | 21:04 |
| russellb | just need to keep this up to date so we have an accurate picture of the road to havana-1 | 21:04 |
| russellb | and for reference, the full havana list is here ... | 21:05 |
| russellb | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/havana | 21:05 |
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| comstud | is there an easy way to see which are targeted for -1 ? | 21:05 |
| russellb | comstud: the first link | 21:05 |
| russellb | https://launchpad.net/nova/+milestone/havana-1 | 21:05 |
| comstud | ty | 21:06 |
| russellb | you can also see what needs code review there | 21:06 |
| russellb | which is handy for prioritizing reviews | 21:06 |
| senhuang | the link also have bug fixes which are targeted for H-1 | 21:06 |
| russellb | since ideally we can land the stuff targeted at havana-1 with some priority | 21:06 |
| russellb | senhuang: good point, indeed it does | 21:07 |
| russellb | any questions on the blueprints or havana-1 status stuff? | 21:07 |
| comstud | mikal: I only see 1 assigned to you.. what's the other 5? | 21:07 |
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| comstud | (Looking at where I can help) | 21:07 |
| mikal | comstud: Oh, I see. That number includes bugs apparently. | 21:08 |
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| mikal | 1 bp, 5 bugs. | 21:08 |
| comstud | yeah it does | 21:08 |
| comstud | cools :) | 21:08 |
| russellb | k, also yell if you need help :) | 21:09 |
| russellb | #topic bugs | 21:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:09 | |
| russellb | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?search=Search&field.status=New | 21:09 |
| russellb | looks like our new bug count is rising quickly, so any triage is always helpful :-) | 21:09 |
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| russellb | speaking of which, a big opportunity for making a significant contribution to the nova project is someone to focus on bug triage to make sure we stay on top of it | 21:10 |
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| russellb | #help need bug triage, as usual | 21:10 |
| cburgess | russellb: Do we have a guide for triage? | 21:10 |
| russellb | cburgess: we surrrrre do! | 21:10 |
| russellb | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/BugTriage | 21:10 |
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| cburgess | While I'm not promising anything, I'm happy to help with a guide | 21:10 |
| cburgess | Cool.. bookmarked. | 21:11 |
| russellb | yeah, it's something you can do with as little or as much time as you want | 21:11 |
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| devananda | fwiw, lifeless uncovered and filed a lot of bugs against the baremetal driver. they are, i believe all triaged, but most are pretty serious and marked High priority. | 21:11 |
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| russellb | interesting | 21:11 |
| devananda | I'm picking them off as solutions become apparent, but if anyone else doing a POC with baremetal wants to hack on them | 21:12 |
| devananda | poke me or folks in #tripleo if you need tips | 21:12 |
| mikal | Also, I think we're down for another bug day Wednesday next week? | 21:12 |
| russellb | all tagged as baremetal presumably? | 21:12 |
| russellb | mikal: sounds great to me | 21:12 |
| devananda | russellb: yes, i believe so | 21:12 |
| dripton | bug day! | 21:12 |
| senhuang | yes | 21:12 |
| russellb | #help could use help fixing bugs in baremetal: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bugs?field.tag=baremetal | 21:12 |
| russellb | #note bug day next wednesday, May 22 | 21:13 |
| russellb | anything else on bugs? | 21:13 |
| russellb | #topic sub-team reports | 21:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "sub-team reports (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:14 | |
| russellb | ok so this time i'd first just like to know who'd like to give a report | 21:14 |
| russellb | and then i'll call on each one | 21:14 |
| russellb | so we don't step on each other | 21:14 |
| russellb | devananda: I think an Ironic update would be good in this section each week | 21:14 |
| devananda | russellb: ack | 21:14 |
| hartsocks | I can report on VMwareAPI team having actually met. Next meeting coming up the 22nd. | 21:15 |
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| devananda | russellb: so then i'd like to give an update :) | 21:15 |
| russellb | ok cool, anyone else who wants to report, just ping me and i'll put you in the queue | 21:15 |
| russellb | devananda: you're up! | 21:15 |
| devananda | ok! | 21:15 |
| senhuang | i can report the scheduling subteam | 21:15 |
| n0ano | scheduler - what if we give a meeting an nobody comes :-) Due to various issues we kind of missed this week. | 21:15 |
| devananda | baremetal - | 21:15 |
| devananda | folks in #tripleo have been pounding on it. it mostly works | 21:16 |
| devananda | on a whole rack | 21:16 |
| senhuang | n0ano: sorry i missed the meeting due to webchat connection issue | 21:16 |
| devananda | but doesn't recover from errors | 21:16 |
| devananda | hence bugs ^ :) | 21:16 |
| devananda | ironic - | 21:16 |
| devananda | it's alive! there's code in gerrit and unit tests | 21:16 |
| n0ano | senhuang, multiple people (including me) had connectivity issues, we hope to do better next week. | 21:16 |
| devananda | and once I figure out how to tell jenkins, it'll have pep8 and stuff | 21:16 |
| devananda | also, i'm not sure i can write it all by Havana, | 21:17 |
| senhuang | n0ano: my issue was that i used the webchat client which was down on tuesday.. | 21:17 |
| devananda | so i'm hoping more people will start writing (and they're stepping forward this week) | 21:17 |
| devananda | db - dripton asked for meetings to start again | 21:17 |
| devananda | [eol] | 21:17 |
| harlowja | as far as stuff that i'm doing, good progress :) | 21:17 |
| harlowja | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/state_management/2013/state_management.2013-05-16-20.00.html | 21:17 |
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| harlowja | hoping to target cinder for H2 with some cases, nova if people can to | 21:18 |
| rmk | We need a libvirt subteam. Don't know what the process is for forming one. | 21:18 |
| mikal | rmk: I think you just start one! | 21:18 |
| harlowja | the cinder people want to hopefully use the library for all workflows in cinder by end of H, we'll see :) | 21:18 |
| mikal | rmk: I'm come to your meetings if they're at an ok time for me. | 21:18 |
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| rmk | Great. Then I have a report. Many brokens! We must fix! | 21:18 |
| cburgess | lol | 21:18 |
| n0ano | rmk, all it takes is one committed person to find a spot and organize things on the mailing list. | 21:19 |
| senhuang | For the instancegroup api extension blueprint, gary has submitted a set of patches for reviews. | 21:19 |
| senhuang | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28880/ | 21:20 |
| russellb | sorry, was gone for a few minutes, internet died and had to switch to tethering :( | 21:20 |
| rmk | Joking aside, this is a major issue and we need to figure out what the appropriate direction is for a fix -- https://review.openstack.org/28503 | 21:20 |
| russellb | rmk: ok, can come back to it in open discussion in a bit | 21:21 |
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| rmk | OK, cool. | 21:21 |
| russellb | senhuang: done with scheduling? | 21:21 |
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| senhuang | russellb: yep | 21:21 |
| russellb | hartsocks: did you get to go (missed a few minutes) | 21:22 |
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| hartsocks | russellb: The VMwareAPI guys are just getting rolling. Not much to say yet. | 21:22 |
| russellb | hartsocks: alright, thanks | 21:22 |
| harlowja | russellb crap, didn't see that u were gonna call in order, my fault | 21:22 |
| russellb | but you have a weekly meeting going, that's good to see | 21:22 |
| russellb | harlowja: did you already go? | 21:22 |
| harlowja | ah, ya, i put some stuff on, my fault, didn't see the we are ordering this message | 21:23 |
| russellb | it's ok | 21:23 |
| hartsocks | I'll just leave this here if anybody is interested. | 21:24 |
| hartsocks | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/VMwareAPI | 21:24 |
| russellb | hartsocks: cool | 21:24 |
| russellb | #topic open discussion | 21:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: nova)" | 21:24 | |
| russellb | mikal: any thoughts on the bug rmk posted a bit ago? | 21:24 |
| comstud | should we discuss anything about these dynamic flavors? | 21:24 |
| comstud | or just leave it on-list? | 21:24 |
| mikal | russellb: /me looks | 21:24 |
| russellb | comstud: we can, can be next topic | 21:25 |
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| comstud | #vote no | 21:25 |
| russellb | no vote for you. | 21:25 |
| rmk | So the problem here is that right now any pre-grizzly instances will fail to live block migrate on Grizzly. | 21:25 |
| russellb | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/28503/ | 21:25 |
| mikal | rmk: I have a change out for this too | 21:25 |
| rmk | mikal: I linked the change unless there's a new one? | 21:26 |
| mikal | rmk: oh wait, that _is_ my change | 21:26 |
| russellb | mikal: LaunchpadSync ate it | 21:26 |
| mikal | rmk: LOL | 21:26 |
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| mikal | rmk: I was going to pick that one up again today | 21:26 |
| russellb | mikal: awesome | 21:26 |
| rmk | mikal: Yes. It was abandoned, so I figured we should discuss what needs to be done to get it moving forward. | 21:26 |
| rmk | OK works for me | 21:26 |
| mikal | rmk: that was about be being super busy, not a lack of intent | 21:27 |
| russellb | to be clear, my comment on there wasn't a -1 to the approach | 21:27 |
| mikal | I am full of intent, just lacking in the action department | 21:27 |
| russellb | just that you have to tweak the handling to not throw random exceptions if the data isn't there | 21:27 |
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| rmk | Just figured if there was an architectural concern about the approach it would be a good time to discuss | 21:27 |
| russellb | mikal just needs minions | 21:27 |
| mikal | I think its minor, I just need to get around to doing the tweak | 21:27 |
| rmk | sounds good | 21:28 |
| russellb | cool, and if for some reason you can't get to it, yell and i'll help find someone else to take it | 21:28 |
| russellb | but sounds like it's not too much | 21:28 |
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| mikal | For sure | 21:28 |
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| russellb | k, so comstud suggested we talk dynamic flavors | 21:29 |
| russellb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-May/009055.html | 21:29 |
| russellb | a thread is going on openstack-dev about this | 21:29 |
| russellb | comstud: comments? | 21:29 |
| harlowja | i can also suggest we talk about state-management stuff :) | 21:29 |
| russellb | harlowja: that's what the state mgmt meeting is for :) | 21:30 |
| comstud | well, i didn't really suggest it | 21:30 |
| comstud | I asked if we *should* talk about it | 21:30 |
| comstud | :) | 21:30 |
| russellb | comstud: heh, ok.. | 21:30 |
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| comstud | I dunno if there's enough people here to do it or not | 21:30 |
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| russellb | well. take a look, review the proposal, and review dansmith's suggestion for a slightly different approach | 21:30 |
| russellb | post comments to the thread if you have them | 21:30 |
| comstud | but thought I'd bring it up if enough people had interest in discussing it | 21:30 |
| comstud | nod | 21:30 |
| comstud | Mainly I guess it's good to just bring attention to it here | 21:31 |
| russellb | yeah, to go into much detail we need the most active people on the thread | 21:31 |
| comstud | like you just did! | 21:31 |
| russellb | yeah, that's good | 21:31 |
| russellb | hard to catch every thread, so good to bring attention to important ones for nova | 21:31 |
| comstud | [done] | 21:31 |
| comstud | nod | 21:31 |
| russellb | any other topics for open discussion? | 21:31 |
| russellb | one other thread that's worth looking at is 'virt driver management' | 21:32 |
| russellb | some ideas being thrown around on the future of how to support things that aren't really nova managing a hypervisor node directlyh | 21:32 |
| russellb | more like connecting to existing virt management systems | 21:32 |
| russellb | so, could impact vCenter, future hyper-v work, oVirt if that code gets submitted (was presented at summit), and others, i'm sure | 21:33 |
| jog0 | some food for thought about: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1178008 comstud has a good comment on it. | 21:33 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1178008 in nova "publish_service_capabilities does a fanout to all nova-compute" [Undecided,Triaged] | 21:33 |
| russellb | yes, i want that to die | 21:33 |
| russellb | i pretty much want fanout to die | 21:34 |
| jog0 | I am hoping to attack this in H2 timeframe | 21:34 |
| jog0 | but welcome to others jumping in | 21:34 |
| russellb | that's great | 21:34 |
| hartsocks | interesting problem | 21:34 |
| russellb | we actually have fanout going both directions between compute <-> scheduler | 21:34 |
| russellb | would be nice to remove both | 21:35 |
| devananda | ++ | 21:35 |
| jog0 | russellb: what fans out the other way? | 21:35 |
| russellb | which way | 21:35 |
| jog0 | scheduler -> compute fanout | 21:36 |
| russellb | scheduler does a fanout to say "HEY COMPUTES, GIMME YO STATE" | 21:36 |
| russellb | when a scheduler node first starts up | 21:36 |
| jog0 | russellb: ahh | 21:36 |
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| comstud | on startup | 21:36 |
| comstud | yeah | 21:36 |
| jog0 | oh right | 21:36 |
| russellb | it's just once ... but still | 21:36 |
| hartsocks | so… why not pub-sub? | 21:36 |
| russellb | well, it is pub-sub, actually ... | 21:37 |
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| comstud | heh yeah, it is | 21:37 |
| senhuang | it is hard-corded pub-sub | 21:37 |
| russellb | pretty much :-) | 21:37 |
| comstud | There's not much reason for these messages anymore.. | 21:37 |
| russellb | yeah that's good to know | 21:37 |
| comstud | the scheduler gets most of it from the DB now | 21:37 |
| comstud | and I think the remaining shit should move there too | 21:38 |
| jog0 | ++ | 21:38 |
| hartsocks | Okay. NOW I get it. | 21:38 |
| senhuang | ++ | 21:38 |
| russellb | jog0: thanks for chasing this | 21:38 |
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| russellb | i think there's only one more use of fanout_cast in nova | 21:38 |
| russellb | in network somewhere IIRC ... | 21:38 |
| jog0 | russellb: np | 21:38 |
| russellb | update_dns() | 21:38 |
| comstud | I do use fanout for cells broadcasts | 21:39 |
| russellb | but i'm less concerned about fanout for nova-network, since it's being deprecated | 21:39 |
| russellb | comstud: orly ... well in that case we expect a relatively small number of cells services | 21:39 |
| russellb | so not a huge deal | 21:39 |
| comstud | yes, it's not a problem | 21:39 |
| comstud | or at least should not be | 21:39 |
| comstud | i use it to broadcast capabilities and capacities.. | 21:40 |
| russellb | on a somewhat related note ... i think quantum agents (the things that run on compute nodes) consume notifications for every time anything gets created/updated/deleted on the quantum server :-( | 21:40 |
| russellb | whcih is basically fanout to every compute node ... | 21:40 |
| comstud | but it's from very few nova-cells to very few nova-cells | 21:40 |
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| * jog0 sighs | 21:40 | |
| russellb | comstud: yeah, so i think that's ok | 21:40 |
| comstud | they come from the immediately children cells only. | 21:40 |
| comstud | not every single cell. | 21:40 |
| comstud | for instance. | 21:41 |
| russellb | jog0: yeah ... at least for the open source plugins (linux bridge, openvswitch, AFAIK) | 21:41 |
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| jog0 | russellb: I am not sure what bluehost did for quantum, but they said for nova they replaced the scheduler because fanouts from 16k compute nodes to single threaded nova-schedulers broke them | 21:41 |
| jog0 | but I bet bluehost did something about the fanouts in quantum too | 21:42 |
| russellb | jog0: they have large failure rates for the quantum messaging | 21:42 |
| russellb | it's bad | 21:42 |
| jog0 | russellb: heh | 21:42 |
| russellb | something to keep in mind for our nova-network -> quantum migration ... i think ti's going to be a scale issue | 21:42 |
| senhuang | jog0: they used mysql slaves for read requests | 21:43 |
| russellb | comstud: so the only other problem with fanout is with the trusted-messaging work. | 21:43 |
| russellb | comstud: when a message doesn't have a single recipient, you can't secure it quite the same | 21:43 |
| jog0 | senhuang: I think that was only part of the solution | 21:43 |
| comstud | russellb: this is true | 21:43 |
| russellb | comstud: but i'm sure we could update the cells stuff to message cells directly for that when we come to it | 21:44 |
| comstud | but | 21:44 |
| comstud | i think it's nearly the same problem.. | 21:44 |
| comstud | as a general topic consumer ? | 21:44 |
| senhuang | jog0: true. they also changed the queueing mechanism? i | 21:44 |
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| comstud | or maybe it's not a problem? | 21:44 |
| russellb | comstud: same problem | 21:44 |
| russellb | "problem" | 21:44 |
| russellb | limitation, really | 21:45 |
| comstud | yeha | 21:45 |
| comstud | ok | 21:45 |
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| russellb | what else can we rant about? :-) | 21:45 |
| cburgess | Thats a dangerous question. | 21:45 |
| hartsocks | water is very wet... | 21:46 |
| comstud | moist | 21:46 |
| jog0 | senhuang: here is there code https://github.com/JunPark/quantum/commits/bluehost/master | 21:46 |
| russellb | gerrit was down for a few minutes today, i didn't know what to do with myself | 21:46 |
| russellb | the mysql read slave thing is being worked on to go into havana-1 | 21:46 |
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| russellb | yay for that. | 21:46 |
| senhuang | yay | 21:47 |
| senhuang | jog0: nice. their work is indeed very interesting! | 21:47 |
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| russellb | geekinutah is from there, and has been hanging out in -nova, feel free to thank him for sharing :-) | 21:48 |
| russellb | alright, thank you all for coming. #openstack-nova is open all week for spontaneous discussion | 21:49 |
| russellb | bye! | 21:49 |
| russellb | #endmeeting | 21:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 21:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 21:49:16 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-05-16-21.01.html | 21:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-05-16-21.01.txt | 21:49 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova/2013/nova.2013-05-16-21.01.log.html | 21:49 |
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| devananda | any folks around who want to talk about db-specific stuff in a few minutes? | 21:55 |
| devananda | not that I've prepared anything, but dripton brought it up on -dev earlier ... :) | 21:55 |
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| dripton | I'm here if anyone else is. | 21:56 |
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| nati_ueno | devananda: sorry OpenStack Networking VPN team want to use here from 3 pm | 21:58 |
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| pcm__ | nati_ueno: hi! | 21:58 |
| nati_ueno | hi! | 21:58 |
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| devananda | nati_ueno: oh! i haven't seen that on the calendar | 21:58 |
| nati_ueno | devananda: Ah sorry, i didn't updated the calendar | 21:59 |
| markmcclain | hi | 21:59 |
| devananda | nati_ueno: i've proposed to move db team meeting to a different time for next week anyhow | 21:59 |
| Swami | hi | 21:59 |
| nati_ueno | devananda: Ah sorry I thought DB team meeting is from 2pm - 3pm (PST) | 21:59 |
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| devananda | folks here forr db discussion, let's go back to nova | 21:59 |
| dripton | devananda: ack | 21:59 |
| devananda | nati_ueno: nova meeting is 2 - 3pm | 21:59 |
| nati_ueno | devananda: and DB meeting is 3 - 4pm ? | 22:00 |
| nati_ueno | devananda: if so we will move | 22:00 |
| nati_ueno | for #openstack-meeting-alt | 22:00 |
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| devananda | nati_ueno: it was :) no worries, we already want to move to another time. you can stay :) | 22:00 |
| geekinutah | devananda: back to #openstack-nova ? | 22:01 |
| nati_ueno | devananda: ah sorry about that. Thanks! | 22:01 |
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| nati_ueno | pcm__: markmcclain: Swami: hi | 22:01 |
| pcm__ | hi all | 22:01 |
| Swami | hi everyone | 22:02 |
| markmcclain | hi | 22:02 |
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| nati_ueno | ok let's get started | 22:03 |
| nati_ueno | #startmeeting OpenStack Networking (VPN) | 22:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Thu May 16 22:03:36 2013 UTC. The chair is nati_ueno. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: OpenStack Networking (VPN))" | 22:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_networking__vpn_' | 22:03 |
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| nati_ueno | This is today's agenda https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1J7k1eI13-3pQVwp5XgZDWPfzUvuSqczRdK0lEZKQOKk/edit#slide=id.gc2779960_400 | 22:04 |
| nati_ueno | it looks like Satin is not yet | 22:05 |
| nati_ueno | so let's start reviewing from Driver archtecture https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1uoYMl2fAEHTpogAe27xtGpPcbhm7Y3tlHIw_G1Dy5aQ/edit | 22:05 |
| Swami | ok | 22:05 |
| nati_ueno | #topic ipsec driver archtecture | 22:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ipsec driver archtecture (Meeting topic: OpenStack Networking (VPN))" | 22:05 | |
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| nati_ueno | So do you have comment's for this bp? | 22:06 |
| sthakkar | hi folks sorry running a few min late | 22:06 |
| Swami | nachi: I don't see any issues with your design, I think it follows the existing LBaaS model | 22:07 |
| nati_ueno | sthakkar: noop :) we are discussing Driver archtecture https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1uoYMl2fAEHTpogAe27xtGpPcbhm7Y3tlHIw_G1Dy5aQ/edit | 22:07 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: do you have comments on this? | 22:07 |
| nati_ueno | sthakkar: This is today's agenda This is today's agenda https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1J7k1eI13-3pQVwp5XgZDWPfzUvuSqczRdK0lEZKQOKk/edit#slide=id.gc2779960_400 | 22:08 |
| markmcclain | sorry this is first time I've had a chance to look at it | 22:08 |
| markmcclain | I'll a bit of time to digest it :) | 22:08 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: gotcha | 22:08 |
| pcm__ | nati_ueno: just some Qs (to give Mark tiem to look :) | 22:08 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: OK please | 22:08 |
| pcm__ | on the create, the driver gets the host that the router is running on. | 22:09 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: yes | 22:09 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1uoYMl2fAEHTpogAe27xtGpPcbhm7Y3tlHIw_G1Dy5aQ/edit#slide=id.gc2bc6c2e_024 | 22:09 |
| pcm__ | Then checks the port is created. Is this the port on the network side of the router, vs VM side? | 22:09 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: router side | 22:10 |
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| pcm__ | if not created, what happens? | 22:10 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: set status of the VPNService error state | 22:10 |
| pcm__ | ok. | 22:11 |
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| Swami | nachi: In your slide 3 you mentioned that create vpn service calls the IPsecVPNDriver, in my opinion, only if there is a connection associated with the VPNService we need to call the Driver, otherwise we don't need to call the driver. | 22:12 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: ah no. We will call agent when connection associated | 22:12 |
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| nati_ueno | OK anyway i'll start implementation on next week or next next week. | 22:14 |
| Swami | Nachi: In your slide 3 there are two drivers one "IPSecVPNDriver" before the agent and another driver "StrongSwan Driver". - why do we need two drivers. | 22:14 |
| nati_ueno | so please give me your feedbacks | 22:14 |
| markmcclain | yeah.. I was going to ask the same time | 22:14 |
| markmcclain | *thing | 22:14 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: IPSecVPNDriver is server side driver | 22:14 |
| markmcclain | the StrongSwan driver should be subclass of IPSecDriver | 22:14 |
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| nati_ueno | StrongSwan Driver is agent side driver | 22:15 |
| nati_ueno | so API is different | 22:15 |
| pcm__ | On the dwg on page 2, both drivers are in the agent block? | 22:15 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: page2 is wrong. sorry I updated it | 22:16 |
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| nati_ueno | so may be in future IPSecDriver will call another implementation of agent side driver | 22:16 |
| pcm__ | just trying to understand the mapping of the block diagram to the items in the ladder diagram (and where the RPC boundary is - sorry not yet familiar with LBaaS and others) | 22:16 |
| Swami | Instead of calling it as IPseDriver just name it as IPsecCallback functions | 22:16 |
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| nati_ueno | Swami: We will add another VPN's driver here. SSLDriver, MPLSDriver. so "driver" illustrates what's we wanna do | 22:17 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: callback sound | 22:18 |
| nati_ueno | 's not plugablle | 22:18 |
| Swami | ok | 22:18 |
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| nati_ueno | May be I should call StrongSwanDriver as StrongSwanDeviceDriver | 22:19 |
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| Swami | that works | 22:19 |
| markmcclain | yeah I think that seems reasonable | 22:19 |
| nati_ueno | gotcha | 22:19 |
| nati_ueno | OK anyway i'll start implementation on next week or next next week, so please keep review it :) | 22:20 |
| nati_ueno | I wanna also have quick discussion of https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1e85n2IE38XoYwlsqNvqhKFLox6O01SbguZXq7SnSSGo/edit#slide=id.p | 22:20 |
| nati_ueno | so how we create agent | 22:21 |
| nati_ueno | vpn-agent | 22:21 |
| nati_ueno | I believe current proposal is https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1e85n2IE38XoYwlsqNvqhKFLox6O01SbguZXq7SnSSGo/edit#slide=id.gc2c671fc_035 | 22:21 |
| nati_ueno | However https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1e85n2IE38XoYwlsqNvqhKFLox6O01SbguZXq7SnSSGo/edit#slide=id.gc2c671fc_089 looks more good for me | 22:21 |
| markmcclain | do we need a separate agent or should this service be colocated with the l3 namespace? | 22:21 |
| nati_ueno | the service should be colocated with the l3 namespace | 22:21 |
| nati_ueno | for first implementation | 22:22 |
| markmcclain | right.. so it's a subclass of the l3_agent? | 22:22 |
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| nati_ueno | markmcclain: it is under the discussion. May be two different process will manage one namespace such as Option3 in the google doc | 22:23 |
| markmcclain | having two processes manage the namespace will introduce different race conditions | 22:23 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: yes. I agree | 22:23 |
| nati_ueno | so I prefer Option2-2 in the google doc | 22:24 |
| Swami | Are other services following the same model | 22:25 |
| markmcclain | Swami: no | 22:25 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: yes. let's keep discussion on the mailing list about this service agent one | 22:25 |
| markmcclain | FWaaS will be implemented in L3 agent | 22:25 |
| Swami | do we need to align with other services | 22:25 |
| markmcclain | yes.. but that alignment will happen in H2 | 22:25 |
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| markmcclain | that's why think we should go option 1 for now | 22:26 |
| nati_ueno | I'm start discussion with Sumit also | 22:26 |
| nati_ueno | FWaaS looks https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1e85n2IE38XoYwlsqNvqhKFLox6O01SbguZXq7SnSSGo/edit#slide=id.gc2c671fc_022 | 22:26 |
| markmcclain | nati_ueno: it's actually more than just a discussion with Sumit | 22:26 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: ah discussion means in the mailing list | 22:27 |
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| markmcclain | yeah.. but I don't want to bog either team down discussing option2 yet | 22:27 |
| markmcclain | because it introduces complexities that can really hamper progress | 22:27 |
| markmcclain | remember we need to start simple and get things working end to end | 22:28 |
| markmcclain | if we do thing right we can move the logic in option to support services in option 2 later | 22:28 |
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| nati_ueno | markmcclain: I got your point. so we start implement directory in the l3-agent? | 22:28 |
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| markmcclain | that's my preference | 22:28 |
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| markmcclain | gives us a chance to validate api and driver interface | 22:29 |
| nati_ueno | Ok so how about implement vpn also in the l3-agent? | 22:29 |
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| nati_ueno | If vpn-agent will touch the router namespace, we should do it in the l3-agent | 22:29 |
| markmcclain | yeah.. a subclass of the l3 agent should work to start out | 22:29 |
| markmcclain | we can clean things up later in the cycle | 22:29 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: +1 | 22:29 |
| Swami | that makes sense | 22:29 |
| nati_ueno | OK next topic is | 22:30 |
| pcm__ | markmcclain: You mentions FWaaS doing option 1? How far are they (as in, is there something I can look at)? | 22:30 |
| nati_ueno | #topic local_subnet vs local_cidr | 22:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "local_subnet vs local_cidr (Meeting topic: OpenStack Networking (VPN))" | 22:30 | |
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| nati_ueno | pcm__: They just started, so IMO there is no code yet | 22:31 |
| markmcclain | pcm__: they're not too far in yet | 22:31 |
| pcm__ | nati_ueno: Is LBaaS there? | 22:31 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: not yet | 22:32 |
| markmcclain | LBaaS uses a 1 arm model | 22:32 |
| pcm__ | (just looking for reference material) | 22:32 |
| markmcclain | so it's not routed yet | 22:32 |
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| nati_ueno | OK let's continue discussion of local_subnet vs local_cidr | 22:32 |
| nati_ueno | In previous meeting, we discussed local_subnet vs local_cidr | 22:33 |
| nati_ueno | also we should use "cidr" value or "Subnet ID" | 22:33 |
| markmcclain | so I've been thinking about this :) | 22:33 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: Thanks. so do you have update? | 22:33 |
| sthakkar | so basically do we integrate with the ipam system or use explicit values | 22:33 |
| nati_ueno | sthakkar: exactly | 22:33 |
| sthakkar | what would happen if we support both? | 22:34 |
| nati_ueno | sthakkar: That's one option | 22:34 |
| markmcclain | sthakkar: it's messy | 22:34 |
| sthakkar | true | 22:34 |
| sthakkar | but im worried if we integrate with ipam we lose a few folks in the shuffle | 22:34 |
| Swami | we should stick on to the cidr for now | 22:34 |
| markmcclain | sthakkar: we don't necessarily have to integrate with IPAM | 22:34 |
| nati_ueno | so we need to satisfy Usecase1 sub-area of cidr Usecase2 aggregation | 22:34 |
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| markmcclain | but the cidrs on the local end should be defined in one place | 22:35 |
| markmcclain | nati_ueno: the problem with say using a /27 of /24 | 22:35 |
| markmcclain | is how is traffic routed? | 22:35 |
| nati_ueno | in the remote side | 22:35 |
| nati_ueno | so let's say 10.0.0.0/27 is routed to the OpenStack side | 22:36 |
| markmcclain | not the remote side | 22:36 |
| markmcclain | on the local side | 22:36 |
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| nati_ueno | This is local subnets which is sent to the remote side. | 22:36 |
| nati_ueno | so it is not used in the local side | 22:36 |
| markmcclain | right but that introduces routing issues | 22:37 |
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| nati_ueno | markmcclain: which kind of routing issue? | 22:37 |
| markmcclain | so if declare a smaller subnet on the local end | 22:38 |
| markmcclain | there will be instances where a guest will think the address is local | 22:38 |
| markmcclain | so won't forward the packet the gateway | 22:38 |
| nati_ueno | you mean remote side? | 22:39 |
| markmcclain | I thought the local cidrs could be smaller than the local subnet | 22:40 |
| nati_ueno | I wrote diagram https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1J7k1eI13-3pQVwp5XgZDWPfzUvuSqczRdK0lEZKQOKk/edit#slide=id.gc2779960_410 | 22:42 |
| nati_ueno | let's use this slide as whiteboard | 22:42 |
| markmcclain | what slide #? | 22:44 |
| nati_ueno | page 3 | 22:44 |
| nati_ueno | This is what is in my mental model | 22:45 |
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| nati_ueno | And I suppose it works | 22:45 |
| Swami | This should work | 22:45 |
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| markmcclain | I not sure I under why you'd export a /30 to the remote end | 22:46 |
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| markmcclain | how does the remote talk to something that within the /24 | 22:47 |
| markmcclain | what happens if the there's a guest that has an address that shares the net address of the /30? | 22:47 |
| nati_ueno | remote can talk only within /30 | 22:47 |
| nati_ueno | this is intent of the usecase | 22:48 |
| markmcclain | but that use case is different from VPC | 22:49 |
| pcm__ | so tenant may want to provide VPN only for some clients? | 22:49 |
| markmcclain | or even if you're following say a vyatta instance locally | 22:49 |
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| nati_ueno | pcm__: yes | 22:49 |
| nati_ueno | I added application on the VM | 22:50 |
| markmcclain | it seems if someone wants to provide VPN only they can create a subnet special for the client | 22:50 |
| pcm__ | markmcclain: Does VPC just do whole subnet? | 22:50 |
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| markmcclain | yes | 22:51 |
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| Swami | VPC does not provide an option for the local side but it only requests prefixes for the remote side | 22:51 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: so which local side subnet will be advatized? | 22:51 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: ah this is not bgp, so we need manual configuration for remote side? | 22:51 |
| Swami | Yes | 22:52 |
| nati_ueno | so why we need local_cidr for first implementation if it has no bgp | 22:52 |
| nati_ueno | ? | 22:52 |
| nati_ueno | Swami: any thought? | 22:53 |
| markmcclain | sthakkar or pcm__ too? | 22:54 |
| Swami | I thought we can just live it as it is for now. | 22:54 |
| pcm__ | markmcclain: got nothing here :) | 22:55 |
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| markmcclain | if we drop the field right now we won't have to write validation code | 22:55 |
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| nati_ueno | markmcclain: I agree | 22:55 |
| markmcclain | if we need it later on.. migrations are fairly easy to implement | 22:56 |
| sthakkar | I think looking through most systems | 22:56 |
| sthakkar | its the full subnet | 22:56 |
| Swami | so in this case we will fetch the full subnet from the subnet id and just drop the local_cidr field | 22:56 |
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| nati_ueno | +1 for first step | 22:56 |
| Swami | +1 agreed | 22:56 |
| nati_ueno | And let's keep discussion for this until we start implement bgp mode | 22:57 |
| nati_ueno | however we should agree on peer_cidr or peer_subnet | 22:57 |
| markmcclain | +1 for first step | 22:57 |
| markmcclain | peer_cidr | 22:57 |
| nati_ueno | so subnet on peer is out of management of quantum ipam | 22:57 |
| markmcclain | the subnet term is too overload within Quantum | 22:57 |
| nati_ueno | ok I should say | 22:58 |
| nati_ueno | so cidr on peer is out of management of quantum ipam | 22:58 |
| nati_ueno | so we should use cidr value for peer_cidr | 22:58 |
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| Swami | +1 for peer_cidr | 22:58 |
| markmcclain | yeah.. otherwise we'd have to add the notion of remote networks and subnets to Quantum | 22:58 |
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| sthakkar | i think qin's comparison was primarily for standardization with other devices as _subnets or _networks | 22:58 |
| nati_ueno | +1 for peer_cidr | 22:58 |
| markmcclain | that is another discussion for another time :) | 22:58 |
| sthakkar | but we could potentially go for _ipsubnets as well | 22:59 |
| sthakkar | im okay whichever way for this name, users will figure it out | 22:59 |
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| sthakkar | ok lets leave it as cidrs then for now | 23:00 |
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| nati_ueno | ok so let's keep peer_cidr | 23:00 |
| Swami | +1 | 23:00 |
| markmcclain | remember the first version is somewhat experiment | 23:00 |
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| pcm__ | and can be > 1? | 23:00 |
| markmcclain | if the feedback comes back that we need remote_subnets we can change it | 23:00 |
| nati_ueno | ok | 23:01 |
| nati_ueno | so it looks 1 hour goes | 23:01 |
| nati_ueno | When we discuss next time? | 23:01 |
| nati_ueno | we should move over the other discussion in next time or mailing list. | 23:01 |
| nati_ueno | Next monday 5PM (PST) ? | 23:02 |
| pcm__ | OK for me. | 23:02 |
| sthakkar | lets start discussing over the mailer | 23:02 |
| sthakkar | im fine for 5pm monday | 23:02 |
| Swami | works for me. | 23:02 |
| sthakkar | if we need another session | 23:02 |
| markmcclain | yeah.. I good for 5pm | 23:02 |
| markmcclain | we do have a good direction, so it might make sense to skip a week and let some work be done | 23:02 |
| nati_ueno | OK so next time is 5/21 5pm PST | 23:03 |
| markmcclain | the dev process might raise some ?s that we can kick around | 23:03 |
| sthakkar | yea im fine with that too | 23:03 |
| Swami | You mentioned Monday - it is 5/20 | 23:03 |
| nati_ueno | markmcclain: I'm start feeling too | 23:03 |
| sthakkar | go mailer only for the next 7-10 days | 23:03 |
| sthakkar | and if there are a ton of open questions during dev | 23:03 |
| sthakkar | we schedule a follow up | 23:03 |
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| nati_ueno | OK so let's continue discussion on the Swami's review requirement or mine | 23:03 |
| nati_ueno | I feel We are making good progress :) | 23:04 |
| Swami | nachi: Our next meeting is on Monday or tuesday | 23:04 |
| nati_ueno | #endmeeting | 23:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings || Development in #openstack-dev || Help in #openstack" | 23:04 | |
| pcm__ | Guy, any suggestions on other feature's code I should look at for a reference model, of sorts? | 23:04 |
| sthakkar | sounds good. sorry i may have missed it earlier in the meeting, Swami is your code out for review yet? | 23:04 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Thu May 16 23:04:26 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 23:04 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_networking__vpn_/2013/openstack_networking__vpn_.2013-05-16-22.03.html | 23:04 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_networking__vpn_/2013/openstack_networking__vpn_.2013-05-16-22.03.txt | 23:04 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_networking__vpn_/2013/openstack_networking__vpn_.2013-05-16-22.03.log.html | 23:04 |
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| nati_ueno | Swami: next meeting is canceled | 23:04 |
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| Swami | sthakkar: I will upload the code on Monday, I am doing some clean up work | 23:05 |
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| sthakkar | kk cool thanks | 23:05 |
| sthakkar | ok guys until next time | 23:05 |
| Swami | bye | 23:05 |
| nati_ueno | see you! bye! | 23:05 |
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| pcm__ | nachi_ueno: Any suggestions of feature's code I should look at as a ref model? | 23:06 |
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| nati_ueno | pcm__: let's start write it together after we finish Swami's patch | 23:07 |
| nati_ueno | pcm__: Until them, dhcp-agent l3-agent lbbas-agent code will be ref model | 23:07 |
| pcm__ | nachi_ueno: Thanks. Just need to start seeing how these typically go together. | 23:08 |
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| nati_ueno | pcm__: gotcha :) | 23:10 |
| pcm__ | nati_ueno: TTLY | 23:11 |
| pcm__ | ttyl | 23:11 |
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| nati_ueno | pleia2: ttyl! | 23:37 |
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