Monday, 2013-06-03

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yamahataarosen, pong?09:24
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devanandahi! who all's here for the Ironic meeting?19:01
* NobodyCam is19:01
* pleia2 waves19:01
michchapI am :)19:01
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harlowjayo yo19:01
romchegI am19:01
devananda#startmeeting ironic19:02
openstackMeeting started Mon Jun  3 19:02:14 2013 UTC.  The chair is devananda. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'ironic'19:02
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martyntaylorromcheg: wow must be getting late in your neck of the woods19:02
devanandaso, agenda for the meeting is, as usual, in the wiki19:02
devananda#topic documentation19:02
*** openstack changes topic to "documentation (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:02
devanandafirst an announcement -- our docs are live and auto built now19:02
romchegmartyntaylor: yup. Trying to combine meeting and sushi ;)19:03
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devanandathere's a bug in PBR that is breaking the auto doc parts currently19:03
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1186834 in pbr "auto-docs build incorrectly with pbr <= 0.5.11" [Undecided,New]19:03
harlowjanot enough system architecutre pictures, haha19:04
NobodyCamvery nice docs.. +1 to all who had a hand in making them so nice19:04
devanandabut please start trying to write good inline docs, and comment on reviews if they lack docs :)19:04
devanandaas soon as mordred tags another PBR release, we should have autodocs :)19:04
devanandaany questions on docs?19:04
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devanandaharlowja: yea, we need architecture / diagrams ...19:05
devanandaok, moving on kinda quickly19:05
devananda#topic meetup?19:05
*** openstack changes topic to "meetup? (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:05
devanandai raised the question informally last week19:05
devanandashould we try to ge tothether and hack / sort things out / etc?19:06
devanandaand if so, whena nd wehere?19:06
anteayashould we? yes19:06
devanandaideas so far are NYC and Amsterdam19:06
mordredI'll be arranging a location for the CI bootcamp June 27/28 in NYC19:06
mordredwe obviously can't share hte same room - but overall logistics could theoretically be shared19:07
romcheg+1 for Amsterdam19:07
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harlowja+1 for hawaii19:07
anteayaI would love to do a boot camp with CI19:07
anteayadidn't know that was a possibility19:07
harlowjai'd like to to be ;)19:08
harlowja*it to be19:08
anteayawould be like going to the emerald city19:08
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NobodyCamemerald city eaiset for /me19:08
devanandaharlowja: we have a good group from EU that i would like to include, so hawaii is probably not going to work ...19:08
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harlowjaah, durn19:08
gherivero2im in europe and dont care about haeaii:)19:09
devanandamartyntaylor: since you're taking on a lot of the API stuff, i would like to see you included19:09
anteayaso far romcheg likes Amsterdam, I would like NY and no one else has identified they would like to attend19:09
romchegI'm in Ukraine and getting a visa to the US is a pain for me :)19:10
anteayaromcheg: I hear that19:10
anteayamordred: any change CI would boot camp in Amsterdam?19:10
devanandaharlowja: what's the likelyhood of you making it to NYC for a couple days?19:10
anteayamordred: had to ask19:10
mordredanteaya: fair. :)19:10
harlowjanot so likely, but i can try to ask19:11
mordredanteaya: we're doing NYC because I'm sick of travel19:11
martyntaylordevananda: I'll certainly ask about it, I would imagine Amsterdamn would be a lot easier to justify19:11
devanandamordred: hah! you?19:11
anteayamordred: ah yes, that is well understood19:11
mordreddevananda: :)19:11
harlowjadevananda let me get back to u on that19:11
devanandamartyntaylor: k, please let me know.19:11
devanandamartyntaylor: also, iirc, jayg is east-coast-US, so if you couldn' tmake it to NYC, could jayg?19:12
anteayacan we do a show of hands of who is considering attending?19:12
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devanandalet's break this in half19:12
devanandashow of hands for those who could attend US east coast19:12
* NobodyCam could19:13
devanandaanyone else?19:13
anteayanot much of a boot camp with just 3 of us19:13
anteayaI'd still like to meet you though NobodyCam19:14
martyntaylordevananda: quite possib ly19:14
devanandaok, thanks19:14
devanandashow of hands for those who could attend amsterdam?19:14
* NobodyCam could also19:15
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devanandait seems that, besides myself and NobodyCam and gherivero, we have 1 definite for NYC and 2 definite for Amsterdam19:16
devanandadprince: hi!19:16
martyntaylor<confirmation required, travel budget is tight here>19:16
lifelesso/ sorry i'm late19:16
dprincemordred: is this the same bootcamp as the infra stuff?19:17
anteayalifeless: are you saying hello or is your hand in the air saying you could attend an ironic bootcamp in Amsterdam?19:17
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devanandadprince: we're discussing having an overlapping ironic bootcamp in NYC19:18
mordreddprince: I was suggesting that we potentially co-locate infra bootcamp and ironic meeting - as arranging space for two meetings is about the same effort as for one19:18
dprince++ sounds like a wonderful idea19:18
anteayamordred: if I can't attend the ironic bootcamp can I crash the CI one?19:19
lifelessanteaya: bit of column a, bit of column b. My travel stuff is weird :)19:19
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anteayalifeless: very good19:19
anteayaso maybe lifeless for Amsterdam19:20
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devanandaso as much as I'd like to accomodate everyone, it seems like NYC is simpler19:21
devanandaand can get enough folks19:21
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devanandaif we can get jayg there, that'll cover the API side19:21
anteayaromcheg: is applying for a VISA a possibility?19:21
romchegIt is. Not sure if I can get a visa in time19:22
anteayathey don't make it easy19:22
devanandamordred: is that ^ something you or the foundation could help with, and in time?19:22
romchegWhen exactly do you plan to meet up?19:23
devanandaIIRC, June 27 - 29 are the CI bootcamp dates19:23
martyntaylorjayg: we are talking about a potential meetup19:23
anteayaromcheg: another time, how much advance notice to you need in order to apply for a VISA?19:23
mordreddevananda: if we're talking visas, probably no19:23
martyntaylorjayg: in NYC19:23
devanandamordred: ack :(19:23
mordreddevananda: BUT - it's always worth asking the foundatoin about it19:23
martyntaylorjayg:  not sure if you can make it?19:24
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mordredlet me know if you want me to start a thread19:24
martyntaylordevananda: if not we could always do a hangout or something similar19:24
jayghangout would likely work better for me19:24
anteayayou do realize they redesigned the hangouts19:24
anteayarendering them unusable for my needs19:24
devanandaso we can also do hangouts any time19:24
jayganteaya: unusable how?19:25
michchapI can make a webex meeting if that is helpful.19:25
anteayayou have to be signed on to google+ to receive the call19:25
anteayalike skype19:25
anteayaI used to be able to start an empty hangout and share the url19:25
anteayaso the async factor has been sharply reduced from what I can see19:26
* jayg has never used a hangout w/o being signed in, didnt realize it was not always like that19:26
anteayaso perhaps I am the only one who noticed a difference19:26
NobodyCamwe are sidetracking19:26
devanandaso, i think we've side tracked - i'm happy to webex or hangout to knowledge share, but let's take that up after the meeting :)19:26
romcheganteaya: 2 months. But I will ask the embassy about urgent visas19:27
devanandai'm going to go forward with plans for crashing infra's bootcamp, and let's all try to get there if we can19:27
anteayaromcheg: okay, thanks19:27
devanandaand let's try to capture what we do for thsoe who can't make it19:27
devanandamoving on19:27
devanandasince there are a few more big things to talk about19:27
devananda#topic stuff in progress19:28
*** openstack changes topic to "stuff in progress (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:28
devanandawe have a whole bunch of new BPs :)19:28
devanandasome big, some small19:28
devanandamostly i want to call out these 4 areas of work19:28
devananda- DB object model19:28
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devananda- API & RPC implementation19:28
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devananda- image utils refactoring from nova/cinder19:28
devananda- PXE driver19:28
devanandaas outstanding things before Ironic becomes minimally functional19:28
devanandamartyntaylor seems to have a handle on the API parts19:29
devanandaanything you'd like to say? questions, comments, etc?19:29
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martyntaylordevananda: we are blocked on the db model object19:30
romchegI am keen to work on that19:30
devanandaah, i see19:30
devanandaromcheg: on the api, or the db object model?19:30
romchegObject model19:30
devanandaromcheg: great. dansmith implemented this in Nova -- feel free to port his work to Ironic19:30
martyntaylorwe can still play around with the other things, like adding routes etc... but really we can't make a great deal of process until we get that piece19:30
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martyntayloronce that is done, there is a ton of stuff that can be done in parrallel19:31
devanandaso actually, i can probably port that in a day or less.19:31
romchegdevananda: was about to start working on that19:31
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GheRiveroo/ i'm back19:31
devanandai also have plenty else to do :)19:31
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devanandaromcheg: so please post your work to gerrit early, so we can iterate quickly and unblock martyntaylor19:32
devananda#action romcheg to port db object model19:32
martyntaylorother than that19:32
martyntaylorI hope I've broken down the work load into sizable chunks so much so that if anyone has any free cycles they can pick up the odd task here and there19:32
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devanandamartyntaylor: i'm going to go through today and condense those blueprints...19:33
devanandafor reference, a blueprint doesn't have to be assigned to you for you to work on it19:33
devanandaeg, one BP could encompass multiple "work items"19:33
martyntaylordevananda: ah sure19:34
devanandait just indicates who is the primary contact for that work19:34
martyntaylorI see19:34
martyntaylormy appologies my launchpad skills are not up to scratch, I'm more used to things like Redmine and JIRA19:34
devanandaso if others want to work on the API, at this point, they should probably be talking to you regardless of what BP they have assigned to them (or not)19:34
devanandamartyntaylor: no worries :) it's a different tool, and has its limitations ...19:35
devanandaGheRivero: niec work on the glance image utils. any estimation of how much more there is to do?19:35
lifelessNYC and amsterdam are about equal for me19:35
GheRivero1 or 2 days top if everything goes smoothly19:36
devanandaso after that, i'll start helping with the PXE driver work19:36
devanandaany more questions/comments about the open blueprints, ongoing work, etc, before I move on?19:37
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NobodyCamlooking for reviews on
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devanandaok, moving on19:38
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devananda#topic task flows19:38
*** openstack changes topic to "task flows (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:38
devanandaso, this bears a little explanation before we discuss19:38
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devanandai jotted down some (lengthy) notes about the issue19:39
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harlowjaworkflows, nice19:39
devanandatl;dr is that the nova baremetal driver implemented 2 types of "sub drivers"19:39
devanandapower and deployment19:39
devanandai followed that model when laying out the skeleton for ironic19:39
devanandabut it's looking pretty clear that it doesn't address the needs of most vendor-extensions19:39
anteayawhat vendor-extentions does nova bare-metal drivers support now?19:40
devanandaanteaya: none19:40
devanandaanother approach that may work better is to use workflows19:41
harlowja*really likes how this workflow stuff is being thought ahead of time :)19:41
harlowja*thought about*19:41
harlowjadevananda thx u thx u19:41
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devanandaharlowja: well, there's a good idea under here19:42
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devanandai dont like complicating ironic more than is necessary, but we also need to support different work flows for all the things19:42
devanandachanging the RAID config with IPMI+PXE will be a radically different workflow than doing the same thing with iLO or DRAC19:43
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devanandathe current approach of putting that logic inside the ManagerService, calling down to the drivers via the current API, doesn't seem to work19:43
devanandabecause the assumption taht different drivers will follow the same work flow is flawed19:43
devanandathey wont19:43
devanandadeploying an image via iLO doesn't require 2 reboots, for example19:44
devanandathat's a pretty significant difference19:44
devanandathat shouldn't be exposed outside of the Ironic API, at least not in my opinion19:44
harlowjaya, its a nice ideal to have (the one api ideal) but i agree that its never really reality19:44
devanandalifeless: i imagine you'll also have thoughts on all this (if you're around)19:45
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devanandaharlowja: i dont think the API clients should need to do different things depending on the driver that Ironic is using19:45
devanandaharlowja: that'd be like expecting nova clients to send different commands for Xen vs. libvirt :)19:46
harlowjaagreed, its internal to ironic, which is fine, but has to be flexible in ironic19:46
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harlowjaand that begs the question of how flexible, haha19:46
lifelessdevananda: I am; sec - catching up19:47
devanandaharlowja: so my idea is roughly sketched at the end of that etherpad19:47
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devanandaworkflows are created for known sets of drivers19:47
harlowjaya, can u describe the weighting stuff19:47
lifelessdevananda: I had assumed that the deploy driver would take a ref to the power driver instance.19:48
devanandalifeless: yes, it does that today19:48
lifelessdevananda: and so could do whatever it wanted, whether thats one power on or three.19:48
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lifelessdevananda: or vendor specific can just do $whatever and ignore the power driver19:48
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devanandalifeless: current model doesn't seem to work if one driver does it all (eg, iLO)19:49
lifelessdevananda: At a guess, that means you don't have enough control passed to the driver19:50
lifelessdevananda: the workflow thing might be good, but it seems orthogonal to thise specific point?19:50
devanandaharlowja: idea about weights: each Driver's pubic method can be queried whether it can act on a given Node (ie, if it's got all the configuration, and whether current state prevents it)19:51
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harlowjahmmm, don't call that method, haha19:52
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devanandaand if multiple drivers happen to both be capable, manager picks the "best" one19:52
devanandaeg, PXE driver requires reboot to do $foo, but iLO doesn't19:52
harlowjakk, makes sense19:53
lifelessdevananda: So, I need to see code where this is a problem.19:53
lifelessdevananda: I don't understand why it matters at all19:53
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devanandalifeless: at the manager level, "deploy this image" is19:53
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devananda<insert some hand waving>19:54
jbjohnsodevananda, huh? why would you use power_driver to reboot after deploy?19:54
jbjohnsodevananda, wouldn't the deploy just do reboot internally?19:54
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NobodyCam5 minute warrning bell19:55
devanandajbjohnso: it does that today, actually, but we ran into an issue with some HW19:55
devanandajbjohnso: reboot from in-ramdisk occasionally got stuck....19:55
jbjohnsodevananda, reboot -f?19:55
jbjohnsodevananda, or reboot?19:55
jbjohnsodevananda, not kidding, fyi19:55
devanandanot sure atm19:55
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jbjohnsodevananda, we went to 'reboot -f'19:55
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jbjohnsodevananda, which resolved a lot of weirdness in corner cases19:55
devanandaso the same thing applies to "set this BIOS setting"19:55
devanandaPXE driver must: prepare. reboot. deploy special ramdisk. unprepare.19:56
devanandaiLO driver would just: send message to iLO19:56
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lifelessdevananda: so I'm saying at the manager level it shoudl be19:56
lifelessdevananda: control_driver.deply(image_ref, node_ref, power_driver_instance)19:56
lifelessdevananda: -done-19:57
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lifelessdevananda: and that your problem is you are violating the control driver abstraction today.19:57
lifelessdevananda: for which the fix is simple :).19:57
lifelessdevananda: now, you'll tell me why I'm wrong!19:57
devanandaperhaps after your meeting :)19:57
devanandalet's continue this in #-ironic if fokls want to19:57
devananda#topic open discussion19:58
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: ironic)"19:58
devanandawe have 2 minutes left :)19:58
lifelesstick tock :>19:58
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harlowjaso maybe more writeup will help here :)19:59
harlowjaand maybe some small code examples?19:59
devanandai'll add stuff to the etherpad19:59
devanandathanks everyone!19:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings"19:59
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jun  3 19:59:46 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)19:59
openstackMinutes (text):
lifeless#startmeeting tripleo20:00
openstackMeeting started Mon Jun  3 20:00:21 2013 UTC.  The chair is lifeless. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tripleo'20:00
lifeless     bugs20:00
lifeless    Grizzly test rack progress20:00
lifeless    CI virtualized testing progress20:00
lifeless    open discussion20:00
lifeless#topic agenda20:00
*** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:00
lifeless     bugs20:01
lifeless    Grizzly test rack progress20:01
lifeless    CI virtualized testing progress20:01
lifeless    open discussion20:01
lifeless#topic bugs20:01
*** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:01
lifeless10 criticals20:02
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lifeless4 in progress20:02
lifelessSpamapS: am I wrong, or do you have 1182249 too ?20:02
lifelessand 1182732 and 1182737 ?20:03
lifelessand 1183442 ? :)20:03
SpamapSI believe 1182249 yes20:03
Nglifeless: which bug? :)20:04
lifeless#action lifeless I will add it to the discussion about defaults on the -dev list.20:04
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1184484 in tripleo "Quantum default settings will cause deadlocks due to overflow of sqlalchemy_pool" [Critical,Triaged]20:04
lifelessNg: iLO20:04
SpamapSNot sure if my patches in review handle 118273220:04
SpamapSI do have 118344220:05
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SpamapSis there some reason gerrit doesn't manage LP projects for stackforge?20:06
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lifelessunlinking - we have a separate workaround task.20:07
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1182732 in quantum "bad dependency on quantumclient breaks metadata agent" [High,Confirmed]20:07
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lifelessSpamapS: it will20:07
lifelessSpamapS: if it's configured correctly20:07
lifelessSpamapS: we should be configured correctly now; clarkb gave us a hand last week to sort it out20:08
SpamapSgood, will cross my fingers :)20:09
lifelessNg: specifically20:09
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1178112 in tripleo "baremetal kernel boot options make console inaccessible on ILO environments" [Critical,Triaged]20:09
lifelessso that leaves two20:11
lifelessone is a workaround issue20:11
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lifelessnot a lot we can do; clearly quantum hasn't been used at moderate scale20:11
lifelessthats bug20:11
lifelessbug 118448420:11
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1184484 in tripleo "Quantum default settings will cause deadlocks due to overflow of sqlalchemy_pool" [Critical,Triaged]
lifelessand I'm fairly sure we have to have 1182737 fixed to bring up an automated overcloud20:12
Nglifeless: repointed at the commit that landed in dib and market as fix committed20:12
lifelessNg: \o/ - as dib isn't doing releases yet, just fix released please.20:12
lifelessSpamapS: as you sure you're not installing git trunk of quantumclient yet ?20:12
SpamapSlifeless: was just looking20:13
lifelessSpamapS: I thought you brought up an overcloud in fully automated fashion and it worked?20:13
SpamapSlifeless: 99% automated.. still getting stuck at booting an instance and having metadata because of a lack of routers..20:13
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SpamapSlifeless: in my notes I have "install quantumclient from trunk in quantum venv"20:14
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lifelessSpamapS: I will debug that with you later today?20:14
lifelessso, bugs done to death I think; lots of high, but lets get the fire drill sorted before we worry about that.20:14
SpamapSlifeless: yes I've got it working well with very straight forward manual steps20:15
lifeless#topic Grizzly test rack POC20:15
*** openstack changes topic to "Grizzly test rack POC (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:15
SpamapSlifeless: also we should lean on quantumclient maintainers maybe?20:15
lifelessSo, we have a live working grizzly cloud.20:15
lifelessSpamapS: we should.20:15
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lifelessbut we have no monitoring in place.20:16
SpamapSlifeless: I need to lean on the keystoneclient maintainers for similar reasons. :)20:16
lifelessNg: GheRivero: perhaps thats something you guys have lots of experience and would like to take up the mantle for?20:16
SpamapSlifeless: sure we do, our POC users will phone us if it breaks. ;)20:16
* SpamapS hides20:16
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Nglifeless: monitoring? sure. do we have any ideas about what we want?20:17
GheRiverolifeless: yeah, sure (don't know what, but if you say so... :)20:18
lifelessicinga or nagios perhaps? NobodyCam had the start of an element, but it's stalled AFAICT'20:18
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lifelessperhaps work with him on that, and on the heat template for same20:18
jog0I assume alerting is included in monitoring?20:19
cody-somervilleI can also give a hand there.20:19
lifelesscody-somerville: cool20:19
SpamapSI'd love to have an icinga-heat bit that, given heat read credentials, can interpret a heat stack and generate all of the monitoring.20:19
lifelessSpamapS: +1, and I welcome our strong AI overlords.20:19
NobodyCamI ment to get back to the nagios ... but got side tracked on ironic20:19
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lifelessso, we've three weeks of POC to go; be really good to have monitoring sooner rather than earlier.20:20
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lifelessjog0: oh yeah, HI20:20
lifelesswhat do we want?20:20
lifelessI think we want base level hardware/OS monitoring.20:20
lifelessWe want cloud health - have we maxed out any resource20:20
* jog0 waves to lifeless and the rest of the room20:20
lifelessWe want API health: are all the API endpoints answering, and doing so in a reasonable timeframe.20:21
lifelessWe want functional monitoring - is spinning up/down instances working, is networking working.20:21
lifelessit's likely we want more than one tool; but a consolidated view of their data.20:21
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lifelessshould I turn this into a blueprint/etherpad?20:21
Ngwe should probably have this captured somewhere20:22
lifelessI'd love it if someone can pick it up and run with it; dragging other folk in as needed.20:22
jog0lifeless: and cloud health also detects if a box dies?20:22
lifelessjog0: the base hardware/os layer stuff would capture that20:23
lifelessjog0: I'm inclined to worry about automated remedial actions at a later date20:23
jog0ah, perhaps we should sync up offline, so I can get up to speed20:23
lifelessjog0: sure; though we have some time here.20:24
SpamapSNote that Heat wants to be able to do some of that remedial action stuff too.20:24
lifelessBasically, tripleo aims to deliver a production ready cloud; having *an* answer for monitoring is an important thing.20:24
lifelessSpamapS: right20:24
lifelessSpamapS: I'm thinking an icinga endpoint can be the canary check.20:24
SpamapSyes indeed20:24
lifelessSpamapS: at 10000ft view20:24
lifelessjog0: the other thing as SpamapS just brought up, is that solid service monitoring is a key part of safe deployment automation.20:25
lifelessjog0: so you can stop a deploy mid-way if things go pear shaped.20:25
lifelessright now we have nothing; so we need someting20:26
lifeless#action lifeless to capture 10000ft view of monitoring needs in a blueprint20:26
lifeless#action someone to take point on monitoring20:26
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lifelessI have an open todo to track down the missing machines; echohead gave me a spreadsheet, but I don't know [yet] the network topology20:27
lifelessanything else about the test rack?20:27
SpamapSnext topic: 2nd test rack? :)20:29
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:29
lifeless#topic CI virtualized testing progress20:29
*** openstack changes topic to "CI virtualized testing progress (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:29
pleia2so, this one is lots of fun20:29
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lifelessSpamapS: once we can bring up and pull down parallel clouds in this rack I'll ask for a test row.20:29
pleia2a couple months ago I was tasked with testing nova-baremtal
lifelesspleia2: tag, you're it20:29
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1082795 in openstack-ci "Add baremetal testing" [High,Triaged]20:29
pleia2as we all know, a ton has changed since then, ironic and all20:29
pleia2but I've still been focusing on tripleo to do virtualized testing of the soundness of launching these test bmnodes20:30
pleia2so two things20:30
pleia21. This is difficult, I tried just straight toci that dprince worked on, but our virtualized environment don't really allow for this (they don't have kvm, and qemu is way way too slow)20:30
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lifelesshow slow?20:31
lifelessLike, can we get working-but-slow, and then iterate?20:31
pleia2openstack starts exhibiting strange timeout bugs slow, not usable20:31
pleia22 minutes to ssh in20:31
lifelessok, thats pretty messed up.20:32
pleia22. Am I still on the right track here at all by using tripleo? If I use lifeless' takeover node I end up pulling out so much virtualization that I'm really just testing dib and launching of nodes (and haven't quite figured out networking on that)20:32
pleia2which isn't really tripleo anymore, but probably is where I want to be testing baremetal-wise (I think)20:32
SpamapSpleia2: I have working nested kvm on my i7 laptop20:33
lifelesspleia2: so, what code path do you want to test ?20:33
SpamapSpleia2: using boot-stack20:33
lifelessSpamapS: cloud test environments are rackspace/HPCS.20:33
lifelessSpamapS: so thats interesting but irrelevant20:33
pleia2SpamapS: me too, but not on hpcloud20:33
pleia2can't even load kvm module on hpcloud20:33
SpamapSyeah didn't realize thats what we were talking about20:33
lifelesspleia2: what codepath are you aiming to test.20:33
pleia2lifeless: so that's what I realized this morning - I don't know, nova-baremetal is now ironic (and doesn't yet have a nova driver afaik)20:34
lifelessnova-baremetal still exists.20:34
lifelessironic is coming together.20:34
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pleia2right, and it's a goal for ironic to have a driver which I assume will behave the same way20:34
pleia2+for nova20:34
lifelessonce ironic is integrated, we'll still want to know that the use case of 'nova boot baremetal' still works.20:34
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lifelessso, lets ignore ironic.20:35
lifelessif we do that, what codepath do you want to test?20:35
lifelessso the minimum you need for that is20:36
lifelessthe nova code20:36
lifelessconfigured for baremetal20:36
* pleia2 nods20:36
lifelessyou need a dedicated network20:36
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lifelesswith 'physical' machines on it w/PXE boot configured20:36
pleia2yes, this is my current challenge when trying to do this virtualized without nesting20:36
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lifelessand you need a power driver capable of turning them on / off.20:36
lifelessI suggest that a solid 'it worked' test is to boot a vanilla ubuntu image, ssh in with metadata supplied ssh key.20:37
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lifelesstripleo's boot-stack is neither here nor there w.r.t. to testing this specific code path.20:37
SpamapSJust a thought. Have we ever tried lxc as a way around the nesting problems?20:37
pleia2SpamapS: nope20:38
lifelessSpamapS: lxc container set to pxe boot ?20:38
lifelessSpamapS: with a different kernel....20:38
pleia2just qemu (drop in for kvm, easy to test)20:38
lifelessSpamapS: I don't think its a fit.20:38
lifelessSpamapS: though it's an interesting idea20:38
SpamapSlifeless: oh well if we're testing _that_ part yeah there's no point.20:38
pleia2so I've had a few ideas, but they end up being so weird that we don't end up testing what we think we're testing (and the tests could break in weird ways)20:38
lifelesspleia2: so, *tripleo* want to test the full path.20:39
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lifelesspleia2: one reason you've been steered at tripleo, I think, is so that you can kill two birds with one stone.20:39
lifelesspleia2: a) nova baremetal functional/integration test. b) tripleo boot-stack functional/integration test.20:39
lifelesspleia2: I'll let -infra folk weigh in on the relative importance of that, but...20:40
pleia2yeah, and it also tests dib20:40
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lifelesspleia2: for my part, I think 'lets get /a/ test in place and upgrade it later'20:40
pleia2(or, is potentially broken by dib :))20:40
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lifelessnow, in the absence of a test cloud with nested vm enabled.... which btw the grizzly POC rack could be setup20:40
lifelessor a bare metal test cloud20:41
lifelesswe're going to have nested KVM for the baremetal node you boot20:41
lifelesswe don't have to have nested KVM for the boot-stack node.20:41
lifelessSpamapS: oh, I may have misinterpreted you....20:41
pleia2so my thought was to spin up 3 hpcloud/rackspace instances20:41
lifelesspleia2: we could run the boot-stack image in lxc perhaps.20:41
lifelessSpamapS: ^ is that what you meant ?20:42
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pleia2one would be what usually is physical hardware, then boot-stack then the baremetal node, but those are all public machines, not a private lan where they all talk20:42
lifelessI don't think it will buy you anything20:43
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pleia2yeah, it's a mess20:43
lifelessas they'll have to run a VPN to get the layer 2 network to do PXE20:43
lifelessand that implies nested KVM on each machine20:43
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lifelessexcept the boot-stack on; but - see lxc.20:43
lifelesssp, SpamapS is afk ;). I'll riff20:43
lifelessuse dib to build a boot-stack image. loopback mount it and lxc boot it - no nested kvm20:44
pleia2hah, so lxc container inside the hpcloud instance?20:44
lifelesswe document 'use kvm to boot the seed cloud'20:44
lifelesswe can also document 'use lxc to boot the seed cloud', just as well20:44
lifelessbmnodes will still be nested kvm20:44
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lifelessand you'll still have a br99 or whatever between the bm nodes and eth1 in the boot-stack container.20:45
SpamapSsorry yeah had local interrupt20:45
pleia2well, qemu, right?20:45
pleia2since we can't do nested kvm20:45
lifelesspleia2: ack20:45
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SpamapSlifeless: and yes I meant run boot-stack in lxc20:45
lifelessSpamapS: so yeah, I misinterpreted you :(.20:45
lifelessSpamapS: argue more, dammit!20:45
SpamapSlifeless: I was mid-argument when wife needed muscles20:46
lifelesspleia2: what do you think ?20:47
pleia2ok, so instead of booting boot-stack as a kvm instance, we make it lxc (can lxc boot qcow2?), right?20:47
pleia2then we just create the bmnode as usual (except with qemu rather than kvm)20:47
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NobodyCamjust I run boot-stack setup on three virtual box vms, dib,boot-stack,bm-node.... no nested vms at all20:48
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lifelessNobodyCam: those are nested when your host is a cloud instance20:48
lifelessNobodyCam: thats the issue20:48
pleia2yeah, we're doing this on a public cloud20:48
lifelesspleia2: yes. And qemu-nbd can loopback mount qcow2.20:48
pleia2lifeless: ok, cool20:48
pleia2ok, I have a plan, thanks lifeless and SpamapS20:49
pleia2(now to learn more about lxc :))20:49
lifeless#topic open discussion20:49
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: tripleo)"20:49
SpamapSso many bugs20:50
SpamapSso little time :)20:50
SpamapS(I think that may mean tripleo is healthy)20:50
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SpamapSos-config-applier is now os-apply-config20:51
SpamapSalso I was thinking o-a-c should have a way to reference instance metadata the same way it references heat metadata.20:52
lifelesswhat about a thing to suck instance metadata down to disk as json20:52
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lifelessand oac unions in some well defined manner multiple json files?20:53
SpamapSyeah thats the way I was thinking of doing it actually.20:53
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SpamapSlocal_ip = {{instance_metadata.private_ip}} or something like that.20:53
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lifelesssob, you want to kill my sed ?:)20:54
lifelessshould we namespace the heat variables too ?20:54
lifeless{{}} ?20:54
SpamapSYeah thats what pops into my head as well20:54
SpamapSthough another thought is to just reserve some namespaces20:55
lifelesswhat I was thinking was that neither was namespaced20:55
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lifelessand we define what happens on conflicts in a formal predictable manner20:55
sthakkarhey guys20:55
lifelessso that you can locally override something20:55
lifelesssthakkar: hi ?20:55
* mestery thinks sthakkar is early for the next meeting. :)20:56
sthakkarmestery is right. sorry guys :)20:56
SpamapSlifeless: well I will put together a bug about the need for access to metadata.. the design can come later.20:56
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lifelessok, so I think thats a wrap then.20:57
lifelesslast call20:57
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings"20:57
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jun  3 20:57:57 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)20:57
openstackMinutes (text):
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salv-orlandoarmax: moon-ez21:01
shivhi all21:01
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SumitNaiksatamhi all!21:02
mlavalleque onda!!21:02
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markmcclainok.. looks like we're missing garyk, arosen, and marun21:03
emaganamore spanish!!  muy bien!21:03
markmcclainhopefully they'll join soon21:03
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markmcclain#startmeeting Networking21:03
openstackMeeting started Mon Jun  3 21:03:28 2013 UTC.  The chair is markmcclain. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.21:03
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:03
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'networking'21:03
danwentarmax: you're closest to arosen, can you kick him :)21:03
armaxhang on :)21:03
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gongyshwhat a long leg ...21:04
* salv-orlando if my leg was 6,000 miles long I could have kicked him21:04
markmcclainany changes to the agenda before we get going?21:05
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markmcclain#topic Announcements21:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:05
markmcclain#info H1 was released last week21:05
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garykhi, all21:06
markmcclainH1 included the initial work commit for ML221:06
markmcclainif you have some spare cycles take a moment to test the builds and report back any findings21:06
markmcclainH2 will be released July 18th21:07
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amotokihi all21:07
markmcclainwe have 50 blueprints targeted21:07
markmcclainand is way over our normal velocity21:07
* salv-orlando is having a laugh21:07
markmcclainI'd like to ask that the subteam leads take a look through the H2 blueprint list and refine the items that need to be in H221:08
markmcclainalso we have glut of Medium blueprints21:08
markmcclainWith that let's run through the sub teams reports21:09
markmcclain#topic API21:09
*** openstack changes topic to "API (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:10
salv-orlandonothing major to report if not that we've merged a few patches.21:10
salv-orlandoI will refine blueprints targeting H-2 as suggested by markmcclain21:10
salv-orlandoand unless I've missed it, we do not have any major bug21:11
markmcclainok.. cool21:11
gongyshwe need more testing to find some21:12
markmcclainwe've got one bug I've highlighted, but we can talk about it when we talk Nova21:12
markmcclainAny questions for salv-orlando?21:13
salv-orlandogongysh: yeah the API lacks coverage especially when it comes to scale and performance21:13
salv-orlandobut that involves several components, not just the API layer.21:13
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markmcclainmarun is also work on improving the API test coverage too21:14
markmcclain#topic VPNaaS21:14
*** openstack changes topic to "VPNaaS (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:14
markmcclainnati_ueno: how are things progressing21:15
mlavallemarkmcclain: we are doing our bit with Tempest also21:15
markmcclainlooks like StrongSwan is back?21:15
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markmcclainmlavalle: good point21:15
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markmcclainnati_ueno: around?21:16
markmcclainWe'll skip to Nova and come back to VPN when he returns21:17
markmcclain#topic Nova21:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Nova (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:17
nati_uenoMay I report it ?21:17
markmcclainnati_ueno: sure21:17
nati_uenoVPN has two important bp for H221:17
nati_uenomarkmcclain: Thanks21:17
nati_ueno[1] CRUD API and DB model for IPSec
nati_uenoIn review21:18
nati_uenoQuantum Advanced Service Plugin for VPNaas (Patchset 5)
nati_uenoQuantum Client for VPNaaS (Patchset 3)
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nati_ueno[2] Agent Impl
nati_uenoAbout to finish investigation. I'm start implementing21:18
nati_uenoAs mark said, it looks like we can use strongswan21:18
nati_uenousing nswrap script by Francois21:19
nati_uenoThat's all from me21:19
markmcclaincool.. thanks for the update21:19
markmcclainany VPNaaS questions?21:20
garykMarkAtwood: there is an open review for the host parameter to the plugin21:20
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garykMarkAtwood: i saw Nova21:21
garykmarkmcclain: we talking about nova now?21:21
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markmcclaingaryk: you're talking about the extension to notify quantum of the host?21:22
garykmarkmcclain: yes. i'll post the review in a sec21:22
garykthis is really holding back the multi host feature21:22
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gongyshwe need some core review on nova side21:23
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markmcclainright.. let me work on getting Nova cores to review it21:24
garykmarkmcclain: thanks21:24
markmcclainI also wanted to ask who can look into this bug:
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1160442 in quantum "when boot many vms with quantum, nova sometimes allocates two quantum ports rather than one" [High,Incomplete]21:25
garykmarkmcclain: this is on my to do list for tomorrow.21:25
emaganamarkmcclain: I was able to reproduce that one21:25
markmcclainok.. also looks like arosen has been digging into to it too21:25
arosenI've actually seen this occur on our cloud too but haven't had time to track it down :/21:26
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emaganamarkmcclain: suppose to provide more logs to arosen and gary21:26
markmcclainemagana: ok.. thanks for posting the first set21:26
arosenI was supprised emagana was able to reproduce this with just one HV. I haven't been able to do that.21:26
garykmarkmcclain: arosen emagana: i'll work on this tomorrow.21:26
emaganajust got stuck into tasks but I will update the launchpad page21:26
gongyshit seems we have already minds on it before I want to jump in.21:27
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SumitNaiksatami had earlier posted the logs in the launchpad anwers21:27
SumitNaiksatamdifficult to figure out with just the logs21:27
SumitNaiksatamneed to put debug statement21:27
markmcclainok.. I just wanted to make sure we've got folks working on it as it's current rated high21:28
markmcclaingaryk: any update on Nova migration?21:28
garykmarkmcclain: sorry, no.21:28
markmcclainAny other Nova items?21:29
garykmarkmcclain: there is a little update which may be worth exploring21:29
markmcclainsure.. what's the update?21:29
garykmarkmcclain: it may be libvirt centric, but there may be a flag in libvirt whcih can be set which can enable a tap device to be moved from a linux bridge to an open vswitch.21:30
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garykmarkmcclain: i need to investigate a little more. if so then mabe we need to move that support to nova and later this be leveraged to enable a migration.21:30
garykit is still early days21:30
markmcclainoh cool.. that would help out21:31
markmcclain#topic Security Groups21:31
*** openstack changes topic to "Security Groups (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:31
markmcclainarosen: any updates?21:31
arosenno updates from me21:31
markmcclain#topic FWaaS21:32
*** openstack changes topic to "FWaaS (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:32
markmcclainSumitNaiksatam: quick update?21:32
SumitNaiksatammore progress in the past week21:32
SumitNaiksatamRajeshMohan has posted a patch for the iptables driver for the ref impl21:32
SumitNaiksatamKC has started work on client and CLI21:32
SumitNaiksatami need to do more work on the API patch21:33
SumitNaiksatamboth iptables driver and cli is being documented in the same fwaas google doc as before:
SumitNaiksatamRajeshMohan: u there for an update?21:33
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RajeshMohan you covered it all - nothing from me21:33
SumitNaiksatamok, i think there is good info in the google doc21:34
SumitNaiksatampl check and comment21:34
gongyshis the link in the BP desc?21:34
SumitNaiksatamwe might have to rework the review patch since it currently is not based off the API patch21:34
SumitNaiksatamgongysh: yeah, its in the bp21:34
SumitNaiksatamwe are actually using the same google doc that we used for the other fwaas bp21:35
gongyshok, I don't want to scan the meeting log to find the doc.21:35
SumitNaiksatamjust want to make sure that we find all info in one place21:35
RajeshMohanThe description for IPTables BP has the li nk21:35
markmcclainSumitNaiksatam: ok21:35
SumitNaiksatamthats the quick update21:35
markmcclainSumitNaiksatam: can you update the blueprint assignees with person leading the dev work? right now you're still listed for a few of them21:36
SumitNaiksatamyeah, i will be posting patches for those (plugin and agent)21:36
SumitNaiksatamother bps already assigned21:36
markmcclainoh.. I that was farmed out to others on the team21:36
amotokiSumitNaiksatam: gongysh: each BP has the spec link, but there is no list which covers all of FWaaS.... It is better to have a summary page.21:36
markmcclainwe're good then21:36
SumitNaiksatamplugin and agent might be smaller patches so i was thinning of rolling them into the api patch, might make it easier to test21:37
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SumitNaiksatamamotoki: summary page is already present21:38
SumitNaiksatamjust finding the link, one sec21:38
markmcclainyeah it nicer to be able to test end to end21:38
markmcclainI think the summary is here:21:38
SumitNaiksatammarkmcclain: thanks, that too21:39
markmcclainok any other FWaaS questions?21:39
amotokiSumitNaiksatam: thanks, good summary!21:39
markmcclainSumitNaiksatam: thanks for the update21:40
markmcclain#topic LBaaS21:40
*** openstack changes topic to "LBaaS (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:40
markmcclainLBaaS is bit behind schedule21:40
markmcclainto get back on track the team is going to focus on getting this blueprint done21:41
markmcclainonce this step is complete others who want to write drivers will have stable base to work from21:41
markmcclainThis is currently in review:
markmcclainAlso once this step is complete, LBaaS team will resume working on some of the other items on on the roadmap21:42
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markmcclainAny LBaaS questions?21:42
nati_uenoIs there any conclusion for inherit VS composition ?21:42
garyki have started t review
garykonce again i am sleeping. i have a really minor nit with the last pacth21:43
markmcclaincomposition is something we really should look at, but we need to do this on a project wide basis21:43
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nati_uenomarkmcclain: I agree. so this is related to VPN code also. We should do composition in new code ? or wait some big refactoring?21:44
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markmcclainI expect there is going to be some necessary refactoring21:44
gongyshall mixin into components?21:44
markmcclainthat is ahead in the future for us to align with the other projects that moving to Pecan & WSME21:45
markmcclainthe current wsgi framework which we inherited is planned for deprecation in Oslo and other projects21:45
markmcclainI expect to talk about this in Hong Kong more than what we touched on in Portland21:45
markmcclainnati_ueno: to answer your question specifically, I think we should strive to be consistent for now21:46
nati_uenoso you are expecting we will work on the refactoring in next release?21:46
nati_uenomarkmcclain: OK so we should choose inherit for now?21:46
markmcclainthe nice thing about drivers is that we should be able to refactor with minimal disruption to vendor impls21:46
salv-orlandonati_ueno: I think the gist of the discussion is: whatever you choose there's going to a major refactoring (likely to happen over 2 release cycles)21:47
markmcclainnati_ueno: refactoring will be a large task21:47
nati_uenoI got it21:48
markmcclainsalv-orlando is correct.. this will be a long term process21:48
markmcclain#topic ML221:48
*** openstack changes topic to "ML2 (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:48
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rkukurathe initial ml2 code was merged, but we still need core reviewers for the devstack patch:
rkukurawithout this, the ml2 plugin isn't going to get sufficient testing as various merges change it21:50
markmcclaingaryk: can you take a look at it?21:50
garykmarkmcclain: sure21:50
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markmcclainAny other ML2 updates?21:51
rkukurasalv-orlando had looked at an earlier version, so I'd appreciate if he takes another look21:51
nati_uenoso new feature for ovs and linuxbridge plugin should go to ml2?21:51
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salv-orlandorkukura: np. That patch worked well for me.21:51
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markmcclainnati_ueno: ideally once we're at fully parity yes21:51
gongyshwill we set ML2 plugin as default one in devstack?21:51
rkukuraTo get to full parity, we need
nati_uenomarkmcclain: so kyle is going to add VXLan for ovs, this work should go to ml2 or not?21:52
markmcclaingongysh: eventually yes.. as there will be only one OpenSource plugin21:52
nati_uenorkukura: ah I got it, after the ml2-gre, we will quit to get new feature for ovs and linuxbridge.21:52
rkukuraI've been focusing on trying to make sure the agent side of the various tunnel-related work will all work with ml221:53
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markmcclainnati_ueno: there will be a few bits of overlap21:53
rkukuraSo there is vxlan work going on right now for both agents, plus work on partial mesh and l2-population21:53
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rkukuraAll of these potentially effect the tunnel management RPCs that ml2 needs to implement for gre21:54
markmcclainthe vxlan work for the current plugin is relatively small21:54
nati_uenomarkmcclain: rkukura: OK please let me know when we quit to add new feature for ovs and lb.21:54
markmcclainI think it makes sense to still review it21:54
rkukuraIts been suggested to have a weekly IRC meeting on all this21:54
markmcclainrkukura: do we need a weekly meeting21:55
rkukuraAlso, I filed 5 BPs today for H-221:55
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markmcclainor one time meeting to get the next steps organized and then move back to the ML?21:55
markmcclain*mailing list21:55
rkukuraWe can't do all that without more people involved, so a weekly meeting might make sense21:55
rkukuraOf the BPs, only the GRE one is high priority21:56
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markmcclainAnything else?21:56
rkukuraSo I'd really like to get names on most of these soon, or take them off h-221:56
gongyshWhy is GRE  so different?21:56
rkukurathat covers it for now - see the agenda for links, etc.21:57
rkukuraGRE is needed for parity right now.21:57
gongyshI mean the implementation21:57
markmcclaingongysh: we'll have to talk about GRE offline as we're running short on time21:57
rkukuraThere's a BP for VXLAN, which would be needed for parity if it gets in openvswitch first21:57
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markmcclain#topic CLI21:58
*** openstack changes topic to "CLI (Meeting topic: Networking)"21:58
markmcclainA tarball for 2.2.2a was created last week21:58
gongyshI still cannot see it in
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gongyshany problems found with the tarball?21:58
markmcclaingongysh: since it was tagged as an alpha21:58
markmcclainit won't show up in PYPI21:59
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markmcclainis the link for folks that want to test21:59
markmcclainI hope to push it out to PyPI later today21:59
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markmcclain#topic Testing22:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Testing (Meeting topic: Networking)"22:00
markmcclainmlavalle: Quick update?22:00
mlavalleI will send an email to the ML with what will be delivered for Havana in Tempest22:00
mlavallethis week22:00
markmcclainawesome.. we'll be on the lookout for it22:01
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markmcclain#topic Horizon22:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Horizon (Meeting topic: Networking)"22:01
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mlavalleI am also cleaning up gate-tempest-devstack-vm-quantum-full22:01
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mlavalleand I need help from arisen this week22:01
arosenmlavalle: sure. If this on the security group stuff and ping?22:02
markmcclaincool.. will this make the gate more stable?22:02
mlavalleyes, security groups22:02
arosenmlavalle: lets talk in #openstack-dev after and i'm happy to help.22:02
nati_uenomlavalle: let's me help too22:02
mlavallearosen: ;-)22:02
mlavallenati_ueno: ;-)22:02
markmcclainamotoki: Looks like you've got assignees for the Quantum related blueprints in Horizon22:03
amotokiyes. i updated Wiki. no big progress from last week. H-2 started, so i will check the target and progress of each blueprint this week.22:03
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amotokithat's all from me this week.22:03
markmcclaingreat.. thanks for the update22:04
markmcclain#topic Open Discussion22:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Networking)"22:05
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garyki am going to crash. good night all22:05
nati_uenomarkmcclain: IMO, we should also manage service framework progress22:05
markmcclaingaryk: night22:05
nati_uenogaryk: have a good dream :)22:05
emaganaciao ciao22:06
markmcclainthanks for the all of the hard work on H122:06
markmcclainnext week we'll look that blueprints since 50 is way too many22:07
markmcclainhave a great week everyone22:07
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openstackMeeting ended Mon Jun  3 22:07:41 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)22:07
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