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| asalkeld | #startmeeting heat | 12:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 12:00:34 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is asalkeld. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 12:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 12:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'heat' | 12:00 |
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| asalkeld | ello | 12:00 |
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| shardy | o/ | 12:00 |
| tspatzier | Hi | 12:00 |
| asalkeld | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/HeatAgenda | 12:01 |
| asalkeld | #topic Adding items to the agenda | 12:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding items to the agenda (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:01 | |
| zaneb | o/ | 12:01 |
| ryansb | \o | 12:01 |
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| asalkeld | zaneb: you didn't get much sleep? | 12:02 |
| skraynev | o/ | 12:02 |
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| asalkeld | we can also add topics at the end | 12:02 |
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| asalkeld | #topic reviews to do before FF | 12:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews to do before FF (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:03 | |
| asalkeld | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/heat-kilo-releasenotes | 12:03 |
| zaneb | asalkeld: worse than that, I forgot daylight savings started so I was up for this meeting an hour ago | 12:03 |
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| ryansb | at least I'm not the only one | 12:03 |
| asalkeld | doh | 12:03 |
| ryansb | dst is the worst | 12:03 |
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| zaneb | ryansb: I dunno, those 7am meetings were starting to grate | 12:04 |
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| asalkeld | i am struggling to get decouple-nested in as it just seems to tip the scales timewise | 12:04 |
| asalkeld | (gate just times out) | 12:05 |
| asalkeld | see how it goes | 12:05 |
| shardy | asalkeld: should we have a section for deprecations? | 12:05 |
| asalkeld | shardy: sure | 12:05 |
| shardy | I think we've deprecated a few things, but I can't remember exactly what (CWLiteAlarm, HARestarter?) | 12:05 |
| asalkeld | shardy: i copied in a template | 12:05 |
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| shardy | it'd be good to communicate eventual removal of all the historical *watch stuff | 12:06 |
| skraynev | shardy: +1 for deprecation section | 12:06 |
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| asalkeld | shardy: we should be able to get some output from our support status | 12:06 |
| asalkeld | if someone wants to help with that... | 12:06 |
| asalkeld | i am not sure how to extract that | 12:06 |
| skraynev | asalkeld:may it be done as a part of deprecation bp? | 12:06 |
| asalkeld | skraynev: yeah - but that's a bit late for this time? | 12:07 |
| zaneb | hopefully it shows up in the docs and you can just Ctrl-F for it? | 12:07 |
| zaneb | otherwise we need to fix the docs generation ;) | 12:07 |
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| skraynev | zaneb, asalkeld: we may use already presented patch (on review) and just print in file all deprecation staff | 12:08 |
| asalkeld | zaneb: yeah, one point is who is the consumer of the release notes | 12:08 |
| skraynev | zaneb: ctrl+f works too | 12:08 |
| asalkeld | operator or user | 12:08 |
| asalkeld | if it's operator, then we don't really need to put template stuff in there | 12:09 |
| asalkeld | (i would have thought) | 12:09 |
| skraynev | asalkeld: I meant this one https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164677/ | 12:09 |
| ryansb | I think (at least some) users would once operators actually do the upgrade | 12:09 |
| skraynev | it will show what you want with minimal changes | 12:09 |
| skraynev | I suppose so | 12:09 |
| asalkeld | ok skraynev | 12:10 |
| asalkeld | anyways any help on the release notes is appreciated | 12:11 |
| skraynev | asalkeld: any estimate for it? | 12:11 |
| asalkeld | what do you mean? | 12:11 |
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| asalkeld | estimate on what? | 12:12 |
| skraynev | is it possible to do during this week? or we should finish this list today? | 12:12 |
| asalkeld | skraynev: no rush | 12:12 |
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| shardy | well it just needs to be done before the release presumably | 12:12 |
| skraynev | oh. ok | 12:12 |
| asalkeld | shardy: yeah rc1? | 12:12 |
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| skraynev | got it ;) just thought, that it should be "already " done | 12:13 |
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| shardy | asalkeld: Yeah, I guess having them somewhat finished by the first RC would be good | 12:13 |
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| asalkeld | so my topic and link got mixed up | 12:13 |
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| asalkeld | we seem to have done release notes | 12:14 |
| asalkeld | now lets do FF | 12:14 |
| asalkeld | #topic Last day before FF (highlight what needs to be done) | 12:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Last day before FF (highlight what needs to be done) (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:14 | |
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| asalkeld | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/heat-kilo-3-reviews | 12:14 |
| asalkeld | any last desperate review requests? | 12:14 |
| asalkeld | or blueprints that people need help with? | 12:15 |
| shardy | asalkeld: FYI I'm still working on the breakpo^W hooks ones | 12:15 |
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| asalkeld | ok | 12:15 |
| shardy | it ended up needing INIT_COMPLETE persisted, fixing bug #1319813 | 12:15 |
| openstack | bug 1319813 in heat "no event recorded for INIT_* resources" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1319813 - Assigned to Steven Hardy (shardy) | 12:15 |
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| shardy | that is proving harder than expected | 12:15 |
| asalkeld | ok | 12:16 |
| asalkeld | there is always FF exceptions | 12:16 |
| shardy | we may end up needing a FFE, but the feature patch is well reviewed, so I'll keep pushing on it | 12:16 |
| asalkeld | not sure how much time that buys you tho' | 12:16 |
| inc0_ | shardy, anything I can help you with? | 12:16 |
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| asalkeld | well i have a meeting with ttx in one day, to finalize this stuff | 12:17 |
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| asalkeld | if we need a FFE, let me know | 12:17 |
| zaneb | shardy: yeah, I'm available to help on that if you need | 12:17 |
| shardy | inc0_: I'm not sure tbh, I'm kinda down the rabbit hole trying to fix problems atm, more eyes may help if I don't get it sorted soon | 12:17 |
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| inc0_ | shardy, let me know | 12:17 |
| shardy | zaneb, inc0: thanks - I may ping you later today | 12:17 |
| zaneb | shardy: is it actually a problem, or do we just need to change the test? | 12:17 |
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| shardy | zaneb: it's actually a problem, because the point in time when Resource._store() gets called is significant | 12:18 |
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| shardy | because that's the only point when we resolve and store resource metadata | 12:18 |
| asalkeld | shardy: maybe we need a light weight version of _store | 12:19 |
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| asalkeld | that doesn't do and metadata | 12:19 |
| asalkeld | that doesn't do any metadata resolving | 12:19 |
| shardy | asalkeld: Actually I've gone the other way, I'm re-combined store into _store_or_update, so we can make the state-machine which exists on storing clearer | 12:19 |
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| shardy | then we just add the metadata when the update going into CREATE_IN_PROGRESS happens | 12:20 |
| shardy | but that's not the only problem unfortunately | 12:20 |
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| shardy | storing pre-create means anywhere doing if self.id assertions behaves differently | 12:20 |
| asalkeld | oo, that sounds "fun" | 12:21 |
| shardy | and InstanceGroups break in a weird way, the group member resources aren't stored at all | 12:21 |
| zaneb | yikes | 12:21 |
| shardy | basically I've been playing whack-a-mole with these three issues and breaking functional tests for the last day or so :\ | 12:21 |
| zaneb | on the bright side, we need this for convergence | 12:21 |
| zaneb | so probably good to get it sorted now I guess | 12:22 |
| shardy | Yeah, I figured this needs to be done so I'll stick with it | 12:22 |
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| shardy | more eyes may help, I'll beat the patches I have into shape first then we can discuss later | 12:22 |
| asalkeld | if someone is looking for some work: https://bugs.launchpad.net/heat/+bug/1433555 | 12:22 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1433555 in heat "functional tests are taking too long and cause false failures" [High,Triaged] | 12:22 |
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| asalkeld | ok moving on | 12:22 |
| asalkeld | #topic Any urgent bugs needed before rc1 | 12:22 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Any urgent bugs needed before rc1 (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:22 | |
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| asalkeld | if know of any important bugs please target to rc1 | 12:23 |
| asalkeld | (new'ish milestone) | 12:23 |
| skraynev | asalkeld: can I take this one bug for our team? | 12:23 |
| asalkeld | #link https://launchpad.net/heat/+milestone/kilo-rc1 | 12:23 |
| asalkeld | skraynev: ok | 12:23 |
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| asalkeld | #topic open discussion | 12:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: heat)" | 12:24 | |
| asalkeld | <free for all> | 12:24 |
| asalkeld | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Kilo_Release_Schedule | 12:25 |
| asalkeld | April 9 is rc1 | 12:25 |
| asalkeld | afaik | 12:25 |
| asalkeld | we can end early and go work/bed as needed? | 12:26 |
| asalkeld | bed time for me:-O | 12:27 |
| asalkeld | last chance ... | 12:27 |
| pas-ha | :) sure, I've nothing urgent to discuss | 12:27 |
| asalkeld | #endmeeting | 12:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 12:27 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 12:27:46 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 12:27 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2015/heat.2015-03-18-12.00.html | 12:27 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2015/heat.2015-03-18-12.00.txt | 12:27 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/heat/2015/heat.2015-03-18-12.00.log.html | 12:27 |
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| BobBall | #startmeeting XenAPI | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 15:00:22 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is BobBall. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'xenapi' | 15:00 |
| * johnthetubaguy waves | 15:00 | |
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| BobBall | Well hello there | 15:00 |
| *** Xyang has joined #openstack-meeting | 15:00 | |
| * BobBall waves back | 15:00 | |
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| BobBall | So - what have we got on the agenda today | 15:00 |
| BobBall | #topic libvirt+xen | 15:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "libvirt+xen (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:01 | |
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| * johnthetubaguy wonders if its time to rename the meeting… | 15:01 | |
| BobBall | Not really XenAPI but since we're both involved + interested in these things I wonder if we should change the meeting to Xen based | 15:01 |
| BobBall | to include XenAPI and libvirt+xen | 15:01 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am cool with it been a general Xen meeting | 15:01 |
| BobBall | It will, of course, change the location of the eavesdrop logs | 15:02 |
| BobBall | So just be aware | 15:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, ups and downs | 15:02 |
| BobBall | I'll send an email to openstack-dev if we are going to change to Xen-based | 15:02 |
| BobBall | Anyway | 15:02 |
| BobBall | #link http://zuul.openstack.xenproject.org/ | 15:02 |
| BobBall | Exciting things in the world of libvirt+xen | 15:03 |
| BobBall | I've set up a CI, above, which is running in the Rackspace cloud | 15:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | cools | 15:03 |
| BobBall | http://jenkins.openstack.xenproject.org:8080 is the jenkins | 15:03 |
| BobBall | (we have very original names | 15:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | so nested Xen+libvirt in XenServer? | 15:03 |
| BobBall | +) | 15:03 |
| BobBall | Well rackspace is running XenServer yes | 15:03 |
| BobBall | then we have an Ubuntu HVM guest | 15:04 |
| BobBall | and we're running libvirt+xen inside that | 15:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | right, cools, just checking | 15:04 |
| BobBall | i.e. the CI is testing libvirt+xen but the infrastructure is virtualised on XenServer | 15:04 |
| BobBall | http://jenkins.openstack.xenproject.org:8080/job/dsvm-tempest-xen/buildTimeTrend | 15:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | how are the neutron races going? | 15:04 |
| BobBall | As you can see from the build trend, which is not the prettiest of graphs, we still have some work to go on the pass rate | 15:05 |
| BobBall | Currently we're passing around 50%ish | 15:05 |
| BobBall | wait until we get to that item johnthetubaguy :) | 15:05 |
| BobBall | There is a request out on xen-devel for those who want to know more | 15:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | so libvirt+xen is doing neutron right now? | 15:05 |
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| BobBall | no - default devstack setup which is nova-network | 15:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK | 15:06 |
| BobBall | I believe | 15:06 |
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| BobBall | certainly still using the default | 15:06 |
| BobBall | which I am pretty sure is still nova-network | 15:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | that might not be the best choice, long term, but OK | 15:06 |
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| johnthetubaguy | you have to start somewhere | 15:06 |
| BobBall | but because it's libvirt we don't anticipate any issues with it running in neutron | 15:06 |
| BobBall | since architecturarlly it's the same | 15:06 |
| BobBall | Might be the odd missing function from libvirt's xen support | 15:07 |
| BobBall | but I don't have the details there | 15:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | you might find it works better, its hard to know I guess | 15:07 |
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| BobBall | These issues aren't networking related | 15:07 |
| BobBall | or at least do not seem to b | 15:07 |
| BobBall | +e | 15:07 |
| BobBall | http://osdir.com/ml/general/2015-03/msg12714.html | 15:07 |
| BobBall | That's the call for interest | 15:07 |
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| BobBall | If you want to join a walk through of the CI reply there or offline | 15:07 |
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| BobBall | Any questions on libvirt+xen? | 15:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | nothing more at this point | 15:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | leaving this mostly with ant | 15:08 |
| BobBall | #topic XenAPI CI | 15:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "XenAPI CI (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:08 | |
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| BobBall | I don't think there is anything to raise here except we're chugging along nicely ATM | 15:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | always a good sign | 15:09 |
| BobBall | We're still nova-network and 6.2 based, but I've not had any time to change either of those things | 15:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | yes, that could get tricky soon | 15:09 |
| BobBall | Soon when? | 15:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | I suspect liberty might be when you need neutron tests to be class B, if I were a betting man | 15:10 |
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| BobBall | Are we yet at the stage where nova-network might be deprecated in L? | 15:10 |
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| BobBall | Oh yes, that's well within our plan | 15:10 |
| BobBall | Of course, the biggest issue with neutron support is that we suspect recent changesets have broken the XenAPI integration | 15:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | in reality, its looking dodgy of L, its possible though | 15:10 |
| BobBall | but without a CI it's not reasonable to ask the cores to prevent breakages | 15:10 |
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| johnthetubaguy | agreed | 15:10 |
| BobBall | OK - well then we should still be in plenty of time then | 15:11 |
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| BobBall | We can move on to... | 15:11 |
| BobBall | #topic Recruiting | 15:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Recruiting (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:11 | |
| BobBall | So - Citrix is recruiting OpenStack developers in Nanjing, China | 15:11 |
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| BobBall | http://jobs.citrix.com/job/Nanjing-Sr_Software-Development-Engineer%28OpenStack%29/253527100/ | 15:12 |
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| BobBall | One of the first items this team will be doing is working on the Neutron support | 15:12 |
| BobBall | So if anyone wants to move to Nanjing... :) | 15:12 |
| BobBall | Or, more likely, if you know anyone in Nanjing looking for a new opportunity | 15:13 |
| BobBall | Worth applying. | 15:13 |
| * johnthetubaguy looks other direction | 15:13 | |
| johnthetubaguy | its quite a log commute | 15:13 |
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| BobBall | Hopefully we'll have a team ready to start even before the summit - in which case we might be able to fly a few of them over to Vancouver, but we'll see how that goes. | 15:14 |
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| BobBall | Oh - I forgot to mention on libvirt+xen CI... there's a change we desperately need | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | ah, interesting... | 15:15 |
| BobBall | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/159106/ | 15:15 |
| BobBall | libvirt+xen support was broken by a change a few weeks ago which dependended on a libvirt function the xen driver does not provide | 15:15 |
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| BobBall | The above change correctly works around this missing function | 15:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ah… doh | 15:16 |
| BobBall | yes so currently I've got our zuul merging that for every change | 15:16 |
| * BobBall loves cross-project dependencies | 15:16 | |
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| BobBall | But I think that's all I've got for today | 15:17 |
| BobBall | #topic AOB | 15:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 15:17 | |
| BobBall | Do you have anything johnthetubaguy? | 15:17 |
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| johnthetubaguy | BobBall: I just targeted that on RC1 | 15:17 |
| BobBall | Ah perfect - thanks | 15:18 |
| BobBall | Hoepfully that'll mean that Kilo doesn't ship with broken libvirt+xen support | 15:18 |
| BobBall | Are we done? | 15:19 |
| BobBall | I have one final point - I'm on vacation in a fortnight, so I suggest the next meeting is in 1 months time | 15:19 |
| BobBall | Specifically on the 15th April | 15:19 |
| BobBall | Any objections? | 15:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK | 15:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | all good | 15:21 |
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| BobBall | #info Next Meeting 15th April | 15:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | sorry, got pulled into another channel for a sec | 15:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | catch you later! | 15:21 |
| BobBall | I think we're done then | 15:21 |
| BobBall | #endmeeting | 15:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:21 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 15:21:44 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:21 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2015/xenapi.2015-03-18-15.00.html | 15:21 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2015/xenapi.2015-03-18-15.00.txt | 15:21 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2015/xenapi.2015-03-18-15.00.log.html | 15:21 |
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| thingee | #startmeeting cinder | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 16:00:55 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is thingee. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| e0ne | hi! | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:00 | |
| winston-d_ | o/ | 16:00 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'cinder' | 16:00 |
| kaisers1 | Hi | 16:01 |
| eharney | hi | 16:01 |
| geguileo | Hi | 16:01 |
| cebruns | Hi | 16:01 |
| jbernard | o/ | 16:01 |
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| rushil | \o | 16:01 |
| tbarron | hi | 16:01 |
| thingee | hello all! | 16:01 |
| patrickeast | hi | 16:01 |
| jungleboyj | o/ | 16:01 |
| yuriy_n17 | hi | 16:01 |
| jgriffith | 0/ | 16:01 |
| thingee | some usual announcements | 16:01 |
| hemna | mep | 16:01 |
| thingee | Third party ci | 16:01 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-January/054614.html | 16:01 |
| avishay | hello | 16:01 |
| jgravel | hi | 16:01 |
| thingee | Tomorrow is the last day | 16:01 |
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| rhe00 | hi | 16:02 |
| Swanson | hellop | 16:02 |
| Swanson | hello | 16:02 |
| bswartz | hi | 16:02 |
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| deepakcs | o/ | 16:02 |
| thingee | I will begin WIP patches that remove drivers out that have not responded back to me | 16:02 |
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| hemna | boom | 16:02 |
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| jgriffith | I think my favorite part is the 32 links included for reference :) | 16:02 |
| jungleboyj | Ok. | 16:02 |
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| thingee | jgriffith: just to cover my ass more or less | 16:02 |
| thingee | ;) | 16:02 |
| hemna | :) | 16:03 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: roger that | 16:03 |
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| thingee | so please talk to me | 16:03 |
| thingee | it's better to talk to me than be silent about the ci deadline | 16:03 |
| thingee | I will work with people | 16:03 |
| rhe00 | looks like a few CIs are missing from the wiki page | 16:03 |
| thingee | I will also be posting later today on the dev ML my report of all drivers of who is reporting | 16:03 |
| rhe00 | some that are already reporting | 16:03 |
| hemna | thingee, do you have a page of the drivers that haven't replied yet ? | 16:03 |
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| hemna | page/doc/public list ? | 16:04 |
| flip214 | thingee: #infra will take care about opensource drivers, is that still correct? | 16:04 |
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| thingee | hemna: I have a spread sheet, but it's out of date from eight emails I recieved just this week ;) | 16:04 |
| thingee | hemna: would like to update that before people get all up in arms about it | 16:04 |
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| hemna | probably should make that public ? | 16:04 |
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| kaisers1 | hemna: +1 | 16:04 |
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| thingee | hemna: I just said that earlier | 16:04 |
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| hemna | ok sorry | 16:04 |
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| thingee | 09:03:42 thingee | I will also be posting later today on the dev ML my report of all drivers │ andreykurilin | 16:05 |
| hemna | still ingesting coffee this a.m. | 16:05 |
| thingee | | of who is reporting | 16:05 |
| hemna | my bad | 16:05 |
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| thingee | ok, also deadlines | 16:05 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-February/056964.html | 16:05 |
| thingee | we're past new proposals | 16:05 |
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| andreykurilin | thingee: ? | 16:05 |
| thingee | Been still getting them. I've been giving them a -2 and I recommend everyone else to do the same | 16:05 |
| thingee | andreykurilin: my mistake in copy/paste | 16:06 |
| thingee | andreykurilin: sorry | 16:06 |
| andreykurilin | np:) | 16:06 |
| thingee | we're just accepting bug fixes at this point | 16:06 |
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| thingee | If you need to know what to review | 16:06 |
| thingee | go here https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Cinder#Review_Links | 16:06 |
| thingee | click the cinder review inbox link | 16:06 |
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| thingee | and review the group that is bug fixes | 16:07 |
| thingee | should greatly help in filtering what to review | 16:07 |
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| thingee | alright lets get started! | 16:07 |
| rhe00 | is tomorrow the last day for bug fixes? | 16:07 |
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| thingee | rhe00: oh yes thanks for reminding me | 16:07 |
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| hemna | so I have a question about a patch that really seems like a continuation of the new objects feature | 16:07 |
| hemna | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/161077/ | 16:08 |
| hemna | that guy | 16:08 |
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| thingee | rhe00: so I will be doing a cut at some point tomorrow. Hoping to not be late. Please lets work together on get our bug fixes through. | 16:08 |
| hemna | I'm not sure that should get in | 16:08 |
| thingee | I'm really relying on folks to help because I got a few security issues on my plate atm | 16:08 |
| hemna | unless something is broken w/o it | 16:08 |
| e0ne | hemna: good question | 16:08 |
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| hemna | I think it should get -2 unless others object | 16:08 |
| thingee | hemna: I don't think it should go in either | 16:08 |
| hemna | ok | 16:09 |
| thangp | hemna: it's just finishing the snapshot api | 16:09 |
| thingee | ok lets get started! | 16:09 |
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| hemna | ok done. | 16:09 |
| hemna | :P | 16:09 |
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| thingee | agenda! | 16:09 |
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| thingee | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/CinderMeetings#Weekly_Cinder_team_meeting | 16:09 |
| jgriffith | hemna: thingee WRT to the objects.... | 16:09 |
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| jgriffith | hemna: thingee I'd like to at least think about it if we could | 16:10 |
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| jungleboyj | thingee: Sorry, jsut want to clarify. We are taking bug fixes beyond tomorrow. Correct. | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | hemna: thingee we're in a funky place right now with a bunch of 1/2 in 1/2 out stuff | 16:10 |
| hemna | jgriffith, well yah that's why I was questioning it | 16:10 |
| hemna | if stuff is broken w/o this getting in.... | 16:10 |
| hemna | I can remove the -2 | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | hemna: thingee some object, some taskflow etc | 16:10 |
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| hemna | but it seems like a significant change at this point | 16:10 |
| jgriffith | hemna: well I don't think there's anyting "broken" | 16:10 |
| thingee | jgriffith: my only concern is how many bugs have been popping up with the object stuff. Just worried about stuff getting in the release. | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | hemna: but I hate having such inconsistency in our code base | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | hemna: and blocking progress for a month or so | 16:11 |
| thingee | sounds like we might have to revert back entirely? that might be sad though. | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | thingee: only a couple right? | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | bugs that is | 16:11 |
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| hemna | jgriffith, yah I get that too. | 16:11 |
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| jgriffith | and actually I think the default getter solved any issues I've seen | 16:11 |
| thingee | jgriffith: have they been mostly in drivers? Accept my apologies, I have been just observing the surface of what's reported. | 16:11 |
| jgriffith | anyway... just wanted to throw it out there | 16:11 |
| hemna | I can remove the -2 if you want | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | thingee: yeah, just drivers but I think my add will keep that from happening | 16:12 |
| hemna | I'm just concerned about the changes it makes now | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | thingee: so it's up to you all... I just wanted to throw it out there | 16:12 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: hemna if you guys think there's risk no worries | 16:12 |
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| thingee | jgriffith: ok, that's fair | 16:12 |
| jgriffith | we can wait | 16:12 |
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| thingee | I was under the impression we were hitting problems left and right, but if it's just drivers, we should be paying attention to the CI's right? | 16:13 |
| thingee | Which I think erlon brought up on the ML | 16:13 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: well, maybe I'm misinformed | 16:13 |
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| thingee | thangp: can you comment on the number of bugs that have been reported :P | 16:13 |
| jgriffith | ok... ignore what I said :) | 16:13 |
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| thangp | thingee: I think we fixed mose of them | 16:14 |
| thangp | thingee: and it was minor stuff, like getattr | 16:14 |
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| thingee | which jgriffith said his patch would take care of | 16:14 |
| thangp | thangp: I have not seen anything major | 16:14 |
| thingee | from preventing future problems | 16:14 |
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| thangp | thingee: correct, jgriffith patch fixed that | 16:15 |
| thingee | fixed or is going to fix? did it already land? | 16:15 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: landed | 16:15 |
| thangp | thingee: already landed and fixed it | 16:15 |
| jgriffith | while ago | 16:15 |
| thingee | jgriffith: oh ok | 16:15 |
| thangp | thingee: which other bugs have there been? | 16:15 |
| thangp | thingee: maybe we should tag them under "objects" or something to make it more identifiable | 16:16 |
| thingee | hemna, jgriffith: If it leaves us in a half state and makes things bad for us that we would have to revert everything that's already merged, perhaps we can consider letting this merge if we're certain we won't have regression in drivers. | 16:16 |
| thingee | hemna, jgriffith: do you mind if I leave it to you two for merge consideration today/tomorrow? | 16:16 |
| hemna | thingee, yah | 16:16 |
| hemna | it has a dep patch that needs to land first | 16:16 |
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| thingee | jgriffith: ? | 16:17 |
| hemna | the dep patch looks like a bug fix | 16:17 |
| jgriffith | thingee: yeah, that's fine | 16:17 |
| hemna | I can review it today | 16:17 |
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| thingee | #action hemna and jgriffith to consider merging snapshot object patch | 16:18 |
| thingee | thanks guys | 16:18 |
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| hemna | ok cool | 16:18 |
| thingee | #topic Modifying existing migrations | 16:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Modifying existing migrations (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:18 | |
| thingee | DuncanT: hi | 16:18 |
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| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/159854/ | 16:18 |
| DuncanT | Hi | 16:18 |
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| DuncanT | So we've had a long standing policy of not changing old migrations | 16:19 |
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| DuncanT | For the simple reason that some people might have run them | 16:19 |
| thingee | DuncanT: is that the right link in the agenda? | 16:19 |
| thingee | this looks like the utc change | 16:19 |
| DuncanT | The UTC change makes some functional changes to migrations | 16:19 |
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| DuncanT | 3 of them | 16:20 |
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| thingee | DuncanT: got it | 16:20 |
| e0ne | we could leave as is, but need to add a comment why it is not changed | 16:20 |
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| e0ne | and do not allow using not utc time in future migrations | 16:20 |
| DuncanT | e0ne: Makes sense. '#noqa' should stop the hacking check from puking too | 16:20 |
| e0ne | DuncanT: +1 | 16:21 |
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| hemna | patch needs a rebase at least | 16:21 |
| thingee | #info DuncanT thinks this looks fine, but needs more eyes | 16:21 |
| e0ne | i prefer to change only functional parts in migration | 16:21 |
| DuncanT | I'm not sure it actually causes any functional problems, but certainly we've been bitten by this sort of 'safe' change before, so I'd prefer to err on the side of safety | 16:21 |
| e0ne | we should not allow to chage data format in old migrations | 16:21 |
| thingee | we don't need to land this in k3 right? | 16:22 |
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| thingee | can we let this sit in gate l-1? | 16:22 |
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| DuncanT | It would be better to land it | 16:22 |
| DuncanT | It is a real bug | 16:22 |
| winston-d_ | i thought it was volume migration... | 16:22 |
| e0ne | DuncanT: we don't store timezone so it shouln'd break anything | 16:22 |
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| DuncanT | e0ne: I *think* the change is safe, I'm just not sure | 16:23 |
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| avishay | winston-d_: :) | 16:24 |
| e0ne | DuncanT: i've got your point. if it's not, we definatly should fix granade job | 16:24 |
| * thingee is going to say anything with schema migrations and time change this late is scary. | 16:24 | |
| DuncanT | e0ne: So leave it and #noqa in the migrations? | 16:25 |
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| e0ne | DuncanT: that is my point | 16:25 |
| DuncanT | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/159854/12/cinder/db/sqlalchemy/api.py should be landed, I think, it solves a real bug | 16:25 |
| DuncanT | e0ne: Ok, I'll update the review | 16:26 |
| thingee | DuncanT: can we just have that piece then? This will look weird after upgrade? | 16:26 |
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| hemna | separate patch just for that guy ? | 16:27 |
| hemna | DuncanT, is there a bug for that one specifically ? | 16:27 |
| DuncanT | thingee: If we drop the 3 migration changes, the rest are just unit test cleanups - I'd rather merge them and get the hacking check in | 16:27 |
| thingee | hemna: just of the sqlalchemy/api.py part | 16:27 |
| hemna | thingee, yah | 16:27 |
| thingee | sounds fine to me. | 16:27 |
| DuncanT | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/159854/12/cinder/volume/drivers/zfssa/zfssanfs.py might or might not result in a real bug, I haven't looked | 16:27 |
| thingee | DuncanT: still curious on upgrades though | 16:28 |
| DuncanT | Any reason not to fix up the unit tests too? | 16:28 |
| hemna | should be ok no ? | 16:28 |
| thingee | I'm asking because I think you'll have some entries wit UTC and others aren't | 16:28 |
| DuncanT | thingee: On upgrades, you just get a weird value in the the db... harmless I think | 16:28 |
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| DuncanT | thingee: The timezone doesn't seem to be stored in the db | 16:29 |
| thingee | anyone else have concerns? | 16:29 |
| e0ne | DuncanT: you're rigth. and the default value for datetime fields is datetime.utcnow() | 16:29 |
| jungleboyj | So, entries in the DB would not be UTC before the upgrade? | 16:29 |
| jgriffith | thingee: not yet :) | 16:29 |
| thingee | I would prefer this not go in K-3, mostly because there are unknowns it seems and would like this to sit in gate. | 16:30 |
| DuncanT | Missing k-3 is fine, missing the release is not IMO | 16:30 |
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| DuncanT | We've had this bug for a while, so it can't be /that/ major | 16:30 |
| jgriffith | DuncanT: by definition you miss K3 you miss release | 16:30 |
| jungleboyj | thingee: +1 | 16:30 |
| thingee | DuncanT: can't promise an RC though. | 16:30 |
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| jgriffith | If we get it in now we have plenty of soak time no? | 16:31 |
| jgriffith | especially if we're "looking" at it | 16:31 |
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| thingee | I suppose this would be a reason to do an RC if we notice issues :) | 16:31 |
| thingee | I just really want to know what happens with upgrades. | 16:31 |
| jbernard | is there a possibility there will be no RC ? | 16:32 |
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| thingee | jbernard: sure in a perfect world. | 16:32 |
| e0ne | thingee: by default, our models use utc timezone. current migrations use just datetime.now() | 16:32 |
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| winston-d_ | jbernard: not really. :) | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | jbernard: There's always one I think | 16:32 |
| jgriffith | jbernard: the real question is can you have "only one" :) | 16:33 |
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| thingee | ok lets go ahead and merge it today. soak, revisit in RC. | 16:33 |
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| DuncanT | I'll update it not to change the migrations and rebase | 16:33 |
| DuncanT | Should be done shortly | 16:33 |
| thingee | DuncanT: anything else? | 16:34 |
| DuncanT | Nope, thanks | 16:34 |
| thingee | #topic Non-eventlet WSGI endpoint for cinder-api | 16:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Non-eventlet WSGI endpoint for cinder-api (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:34 | |
| thingee | e0ne: hi! | 16:34 |
| thingee | e0ne: +1000 | 16:34 |
| e0ne | thingee: hi | 16:34 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-February/057359.html | 16:34 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/142659/ | 16:34 |
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| e0ne | one comment form my side | 16:34 |
| e0ne | it is not about _removing_ eventlet from cinder-api | 16:35 |
| e0ne | it's about addine one more option how could we deploy it | 16:35 |
| thingee | #info this is not about removing eventlet from cinder-api, this is adding another option for deploying | 16:36 |
| e0ne | DuncanT: pointed to me that it requires more tests for CI. I think we could do it in infra | 16:36 |
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| winston-d_ | e0ne: I can understand why keystone choose not to use eventlet, given the history | 16:36 |
| jgriffith | thingee: do we need more options :) | 16:36 |
| jgriffith | thingee: especially ones we won't test? | 16:36 |
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| jgriffith | this makes sense for keystone, they have a different problem to solve | 16:37 |
| e0ne | jgriffith: we will test it on gates, i hope | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | trying to figure out what's in it for us, so to speak | 16:37 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: but any real benefit adopting apache? | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | e0ne: I dunno... look at ZMQ and other things like that | 16:37 |
| thingee | morganfainberg: ^ | 16:37 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: test cinder with apache? | 16:37 |
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| e0ne | winston-d_: we've got process launcher now | 16:37 |
| jgriffith | wouldn't be so sure it'll get tested... but still leaves the main question from me: "What's in it for us" | 16:37 |
| e0ne | winston-d_: and we need to use haproxy or something else | 16:38 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: yes, i am well aware of that, so you were saying we should test multi Cinder workers in gate? | 16:38 |
| e0ne | winston-d_: apache/nginx + wsgi could be an option for deployment | 16:38 |
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| jgriffith | e0ne: is it a *better* option? | 16:39 |
| e0ne | winston-d_: it could be configured by devstack and we'll add new dsvm job | 16:39 |
| e0ne | jgriffith: we could test performance in our case | 16:39 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: you want apache/nginx option 'cos it works better with haproxy? | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | e0ne: don't get me wrong, I wouldn't be sad to see eventlet replaced, but that's if it can be replaced :) | 16:39 |
| jgriffith | winston-d_: ahhh.... that's the kind of thing I'm looking for | 16:40 |
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| e0ne | jgriffith: i'm talking only for wsgi app for cinder-api | 16:40 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: yes, i'd like understand the pros/cons | 16:40 |
| jgriffith | e0ne: hehe.. yeah, you prefaced the conversation with that and I ignored you :) sorry | 16:40 |
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| jgriffith | either way this is after L opens up right... so I think we can talk more later or try some stuff | 16:41 |
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| jgriffith | probably not wort me rat holing on the details today :) | 16:41 |
| jgriffith | wort | 16:41 |
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| thingee | #info have apache/nginx so cinder-api works better with haproxy | 16:41 |
| jgriffith | ARRRR H key popped out again!! | 16:41 |
| * jgriffith needs to get a new keyboard today | 16:42 | |
| e0ne | :) | 16:42 |
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| thingee | jgriffith: +1 | 16:42 |
| winston-d_ | thingee: well, that's a question from me... | 16:42 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: is that true or not? | 16:42 |
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| flip214 | jgriffith: vim without an "h" is _ard, right? | 16:42 |
| e0ne | winston-d_, thingee: it depends | 16:42 |
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| hemna | flip214, :) | 16:43 |
| e0ne | apache/nginx has more users than haproxy | 16:43 |
| winston-d_ | e0ne: so i need some education here, i appreciate if you can give me some pointers | 16:43 |
| jgriffith | flip214: Exactly!!! | 16:43 |
| jungleboyj | thingee: I need to step away. Just a quick question. | 16:43 |
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| thingee | I'm going to assume that e0ne will have give a better arguement of why he wants to see this option in the spec. | 16:43 |
| e0ne | so we could get more happy users to deploy it | 16:43 |
| thingee | there doesn't seem to be a reason give atm | 16:44 |
| thingee | given* | 16:44 |
| e0ne | thingee: sure, i'll do it. could you please crate an action itom? | 16:44 |
| e0ne | *item | 16:44 |
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| thingee | #action e0ne will create a spec that gives the actual reasons why a user would want another option for deploying cinder-api | 16:44 |
| e0ne | thingee: thanks | 16:44 |
| thingee | e0ne: anything else? | 16:45 |
| thingee | jungleboyj: I'll circle back to your topic | 16:45 |
| e0ne | thingee: thants all. i've got early feedback and could continue to work on it | 16:45 |
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| thingee | #topic Bugs triage | 16:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs triage (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:45 | |
| thingee | e0ne: hi | 16:45 |
| jungleboyj | thingee: Ok, I actually need to leave. So if you can just discuss it and I will catch up later. | 16:45 |
| jungleboyj | Thanks. | 16:45 |
| thingee | jungleboyj: k! | 16:45 |
| e0ne | thingee: hi :) | 16:46 |
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| e0ne | i want just to remind all to do it | 16:46 |
| thingee | so bug triage. I've been behind actually all this month. my bad | 16:46 |
| e0ne | i'm going to spend next day for it | 16:46 |
| jgriffith | did anybody else see the "quick question" ? | 16:46 |
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| jgriffith | Oh.. guess it's the question that he posed on agenda.... or thingee is psychic :) | 16:47 |
| flip214 | no, only the remark about the question | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | physic | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | BAHHHH | 16:47 |
| e0ne | imo, 135 new bugs is too big number | 16:47 |
| erlon | thingee: theres one more bug we would like to get in in this release, have created a bug, but not sure if it falls in any criteria to get it reviewed: https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder/+bug/1430782 | 16:47 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1430782 in Cinder "Error on LUN creation on HNAS iSCSI driver" [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to Erlon R. Cruz (sombrafam) | 16:47 |
| thingee | e0ne: agreed. I was on top of this, but I had to step away earlier this month and do some reviews here and there. Had some personal issues that came up. | 16:47 |
| kmartin | jgriffith, now the h key has moved? | 16:47 |
| flip214 | jgriffith: psychic was correct, wasn't it? | 16:47 |
| thingee | although bug triaging shouldn't just be me :) | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | kmartin: LOL | 16:47 |
| jgriffith | flip214: yes | 16:48 |
| e0ne | thingee: sure | 16:48 |
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| flip214 | sorry, gotta go. | 16:48 |
| e0ne | thingee: whats about send notification to openstack-dev? | 16:48 |
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| jgriffith | thingee: oh? | 16:49 |
| thingee | e0ne: if you want to send something to the ML, that's fine, but I don't think it's necessary. We're already full alert on bugs. I think I just need to get back to it, and maybe others can pitch in | 16:49 |
| e0ne | thingee: a lot of newcomers should be imformed:) | 16:49 |
| hemna | So do we have to get all of those bugs fixed by K-3? | 16:49 |
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| thingee | hemna: haha | 16:49 |
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| hemna | or do we have leeway after for RC. | 16:49 |
| thingee | hemna: we never have in any release | 16:50 |
| hemna | I have one on my plate that I'm not sure I can get in by tomorrow. | 16:50 |
| hemna | ok, I just wanted to be clear :) | 16:50 |
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| e0ne | hemna: after RC we should fix onli high/critical bugs, shouldn't we? | 16:50 |
| thingee | hemna: I think what's important is at least triaging and understanding if we blockers | 16:50 |
| e0ne | thingee: +1 | 16:50 |
| thingee | if we have blockers, bring it up in #openstack-cinder | 16:50 |
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| thingee | if we have blockers* | 16:50 |
| e0ne | btw, i have nothing to add to this topic. | 16:51 |
| thingee | e0ne: heh ok | 16:51 |
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| thingee | so sure, I'll be doing some triaginag later in RC time frame. | 16:51 |
| jgriffith | bugs are always fair game | 16:52 |
| thingee | e0ne: you can send somethign out if you like | 16:52 |
| jgriffith | up to thingee and core to weigh impact of the fix | 16:52 |
| e0ne | thingee: ok, i'll do | 16:52 |
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| jgriffith | but never stop working on bugs | 16:52 |
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| thingee | just right now top priority to me are issues bugs in k3 we know about and security bugs | 16:52 |
| * jgriffith thinks maybe that's why we have so many bugs | 16:52 | |
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| e0ne | jgriffith: i know few openstack newcomers that don't now anything about bugs triage. | 16:52 |
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| thingee | #action e0ne to email ML about bug triage in cinder | 16:53 |
| erlon | e0ne: o/ | 16:53 |
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| thingee | #topic Liberty Specs | 16:53 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Liberty Specs (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:53 | |
| thingee | jungleboyj original proposed this | 16:53 |
| thingee | I really want us to have a use case section in sepcs | 16:53 |
| thingee | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/149449/ | 16:53 |
| jgriffith | Just say NO | 16:53 |
| jgriffith | not regarding use cases... regarding L specs until we get to RC | 16:54 |
| jgriffith | :) | 16:54 |
| thingee | Not accepting Liberty specs right now. Would like to get through the K release atm | 16:54 |
| DuncanT | jgriffith: +1 | 16:54 |
| thingee | jgriffith: +1 | 16:54 |
| e0ne | jgriffith: RC or K-3? | 16:54 |
| hemna | jgriffith, you know what happened to that drug campaign, everyone ended up doing them. | 16:54 |
| thingee | heh | 16:54 |
| jgriffith | thingee: :) | 16:54 |
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| vilobhmm | thingee : about heirarchical multitenany do we have any plan for L release | 16:54 |
| hemna | jgriffith, +1 | 16:54 |
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| thingee | vilobhmm: if it's not security bugs in k-3, I don't know | 16:54 |
| cebruns | jgriffith: I thought you were saying "No" to Liberty. :) | 16:54 |
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| jgriffith | vivek-ebay: thingee I would like to work on that in L, or at least get it going | 16:55 |
| e0ne | people could start working on it, but we'll give -2 without review | 16:55 |
| thingee | vilobhmm: sec bugs are top priority right now | 16:55 |
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| vilobhmm | thingee : sure | 16:55 |
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| jgriffith | oops... vilobhmm ^^ | 16:55 |
| hemna | but we have other issues to iron out in L as well, replication, extra specs, nova -> cinder api issues, etc. | 16:55 |
| vilobhmm | as you mentioned few weeks back got it | 16:55 |
| vilobhmm | sure jgriffith | 16:55 |
| hemna | I'd like to get those solved before we start working on new cinder features | 16:55 |
| hemna | we seem to always churn on the new w/o solving some of our white elephants | 16:56 |
| e0ne | hemna: agree | 16:56 |
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| jgriffith | hemna: :) | 16:56 |
| vilobhmm | hemna : +1 | 16:56 |
| thingee | #topic Open discussion | 16:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: cinder)" | 16:56 | |
| bswartz | I don't understand how there could be no RC | 16:56 |
| morganfainberg | thingee: (a bit delayed) if you need help with wsgi (mod_wsgi etc) I can help or at least point you guys to resources in devstack and in the keystone tree for making it happen. | 16:56 |
| hemna | but that's just my take on it. | 16:56 |
| jgriffith | it's like ground hog day (the movie) | 16:56 |
| bswartz | (12:30:56 PM) thingee: DuncanT: can't promise an RC though. | 16:56 |
| hemna | jgriffith, yup | 16:56 |
| thingee | bswartz: :) | 16:56 |
| Swanson | "white elephants"? | 16:56 |
| morganfainberg | Let me know when you're looking at it (or whomever is). | 16:56 |
| e0ne | hemna: but i would like to get state machine or at least fault tolerance for all services in L | 16:56 |
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| thingee | morganfainberg: I think we were trying to understand why Cinder would need. while it's understood for keystone's use case. | 16:57 |
| vilobhmm | eone : +1 for fault tolerance; need to have it before adding more features i feel | 16:57 |
| thingee | morganfainberg: e0ne is proposing this right now, so he may reach out to you | 16:57 |
| hemna | e0ne, I would like a lot of stuff for L. it's up to the PTL really to help set the agenda...dunno. | 16:57 |
| hemna | I just would like to see others step up and help fix some of our existing known issues first. | 16:57 |
| e0ne | hemna: agree, it's fair | 16:57 |
| hemna | but I'm one to talk....mr. multiattach. bleh | 16:57 |
| morganfainberg | So for the api surface area, it allows Apache to manage the workers - and Apache does a good job of ssl termination. I can provide more details for e0ne when ready (down the line) | 16:58 |
| thingee | morganfainberg: thanks | 16:58 |
| morganfainberg | (Also no greenlet bugs in Apache wsgi mode) | 16:58 |
| e0ne | morganfainberg: thanks! i'll ping you | 16:58 |
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| thingee | thanks everyone! | 16:59 |
| thingee | #endmeeting | 17:00 |
| avishay | bye | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:00 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 17:00:01 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:00 |
| kaisers1 | bye | 17:00 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2015/cinder.2015-03-18-16.00.html | 17:00 |
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| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2015/cinder.2015-03-18-16.00.txt | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2015/cinder.2015-03-18-16.00.log.html | 17:00 |
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| geguileo | bye | 17:00 |
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| tjones1 | #startmeeting vmwareapi | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 17:00:31 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is tjones1. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'vmwareapi' | 17:00 |
| tjones1 | hi folks | 17:00 |
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| thangp | o/ | 17:00 |
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| tjones1 | hey thangp | 17:01 |
| browne | hi | 17:01 |
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| tjones1 | great with browne we have quorum (> 2 people) :-) | 17:02 |
| tjones1 | #topic kilo | 17:02 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "kilo (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:02 | |
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| tjones1 | tracking our kilo bug prio here https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/VMwareapi-kilo | 17:02 |
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| tjones1 | thangp: still no love from cores on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/142174/ | 17:03 |
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| thangp | tjones1: yeah...probably wont until liberty | 17:03 |
| tjones1 | yeah no doubt | 17:03 |
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| tjones1 | but https://review.openstack.org/#/c/128508/ merged | 17:04 |
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| thangp | tjones1: yup :) after asking on the nova channel | 17:04 |
| tjones1 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158269/ was abandoned :-( | 17:04 |
| browne | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158269/ abandoned | 17:04 |
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| Salman_ | Sean did you join today? | 17:04 |
| tjones1 | we should talk about that one i vancouver | 17:05 |
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| tjones1 | last but not least - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/159738 | 17:06 |
| Salman_ | Sarob | 17:06 |
| tjones1 | can you guys give this a review? | 17:06 |
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| tjones1 | Salman_: this is the vmwareapi meeting now | 17:06 |
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| browne | sure | 17:07 |
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| tjones1 | that bug would be a good one to get in - it fixes some issues with evacuating datastores | 17:07 |
| tjones1 | any other remaining kilo prio not mentioned so far? | 17:07 |
| thangp | not from me | 17:08 |
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| tjones1 | #topic liberty | 17:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "liberty (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:08 | |
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| tjones1 | i've started the etherpad to track our work | 17:09 |
| tjones1 | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vmwareapi-liberty | 17:09 |
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| tjones1 | i'd like to track things we want to discuss at the summit here too | 17:09 |
| tjones1 | i've added a summit topic header | 17:10 |
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| browne | guess we'll have to prioritize the list | 17:10 |
| tjones1 | yes :-) | 17:10 |
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| tjones1 | well now it is only 2 | 17:11 |
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| tjones1 | since we don't have gary, rado, or matt we can't really discuss the 1st one | 17:11 |
| tjones1 | that's all i have really. you guys have anything? | 17:12 |
| thangp | nope :) | 17:12 |
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| tjones1 | thangp: what timezone are you in? | 17:12 |
| thangp | EST | 17:12 |
| browne | what about this guy: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/vmware-image-os-identification | 17:12 |
| tjones1 | #topic open discussion | 17:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)" | 17:13 | |
| tjones1 | *looking* | 17:13 |
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| browne | is it already complete? isn't there a vmware_ostype? | 17:13 |
| tjones1 | yes there is that property | 17:14 |
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| tjones1 | that looks like an old bp | 17:14 |
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| tjones1 | 2 years ago | 17:14 |
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| browne | yeah, i think it should be marked complete | 17:14 |
| tjones1 | unforteunly i cannot do it | 17:15 |
| tjones1 | how about this one https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/vmware-encrypt-vcenter-passwords | 17:15 |
| browne | yeah, we should try to address for kilo in some form | 17:16 |
| tjones1 | can you add that to the summit topics? | 17:16 |
| browne | sorry liberty, not kilo | 17:16 |
| tjones1 | right | 17:16 |
| browne | sure | 17:16 |
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| tjones1 | this one too https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/deploy-vcenter-templates-from-vmware-nova-driver | 17:16 |
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| tjones1 | ok i think we are done | 17:18 |
| tjones1 | browne: anything else? | 17:18 |
| browne | not from me | 17:19 |
| tjones1 | ok thanks for attending | 17:19 |
| tjones1 | #endmeeting | 17:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:19 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 17:19:12 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:19 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2015/vmwareapi.2015-03-18-17.00.html | 17:19 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2015/vmwareapi.2015-03-18-17.00.txt | 17:19 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vmwareapi/2015/vmwareapi.2015-03-18-17.00.log.html | 17:19 |
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| sarob | #startmeeting trainers | 18:05 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 18:05:29 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sarob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:05 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: trainers)" | 18:05 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'trainers' | 18:05 |
| sarob | Anyone here today? | 18:05 |
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| sarob | I'm going to call this one | 18:08 |
| sarob | Good stuff happening with training guides and testing standards | 18:08 |
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| sarob | Update here next week | 18:08 |
| sarob | #endmeeting | 18:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:08 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 18:08:38 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:08 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trainers/2015/trainers.2015-03-18-18.05.html | 18:08 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trainers/2015/trainers.2015-03-18-18.05.txt | 18:08 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trainers/2015/trainers.2015-03-18-18.05.log.html | 18:08 |
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| notmyname | swift meeting time | 19:01 |
| notmyname | #startmeeting swift | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 19:01:05 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'swift' | 19:01 |
| notmyname | who's here for the swift team meeting? | 19:01 |
| mattoliverau | o/ | 19:01 |
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| tdasilva | hello | 19:01 |
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| kota_ | o/ | 19:01 |
| ho | hi | 19:01 |
| cutforth | o/ | 19:01 |
| peluse | hi | 19:01 |
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| acoles | here | 19:02 |
| notmyname | kota_: ho: it's 4am in Japan! I'm amazed you're here | 19:02 |
| torgomatic | 👋 | 19:02 |
| kota_ | :) | 19:02 |
| jrichli_ | here | 19:02 |
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| ho | ;) | 19:02 |
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| notmyname | ok, but topic this week is EC. we're getting close to kilo, and we've got a lot to do :-) | 19:03 |
| notmyname | #topic EC status | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "EC status (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:03 | |
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| notmyname | if you haven't figured out by now, EC (beta) for kilo is pretty much taking up about 90% of my brain right now | 19:03 |
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| notmyname | so here's where we are | 19:03 |
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| notmyname | the OpenStack kilo release date is April 30 | 19:04 |
| notmyname | that date is set in stone | 19:04 |
| notmyname | backing up from that date, there will need to be a release candidate (and time for a 2nd if needed) | 19:04 |
| notmyname | so that puts us to the vicinity of April 10 | 19:04 |
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| notmyname | to allow for testing of swift and for overall integration testing for the entire openstack release | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | we've agreed to a beta of EC in the kilo release | 19:05 |
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| notmyname | so backing up from April 10 and allowing for a 2 week merge window, that gets up to March 27 | 19:05 |
| notmyname | which is 1.5 weeks from today | 19:06 |
| notmyname | fun! | 19:06 |
| mattoliverau | wow, that sneaks up on ya | 19:06 |
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| notmyname | the march 27 and april 10 dates are somewhat arbitrary (ie not completely fixed), but you see where they come from | 19:06 |
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| notmyname | so, looking at what we have outstanding on the feature/ec branch, here's where we are: | 19:07 |
| notmyname | there are 4 patch chains right now that need to be reviewed and landed on feature/ec | 19:07 |
| notmyname | they are listed on https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Swift/PriorityReviews | 19:07 |
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| notmyname | https://review.openstack.org/164380 - start of chain for refactors and reconstructor | 19:07 |
| notmyname | this is what clayg and acoles are working on, and peluse will rebase his reconstructor on top of it | 19:07 |
| notmyname | https://review.openstack.org/164561 - refactor proxy PUT | 19:08 |
| notmyname | this is by tdasilva and helps clean stuff up to ease merging | 19:08 |
| notmyname | https://review.openstack.org/163620 - EC ranged GETs | 19:08 |
| notmyname | this is torgomatic's focus right now and is required for getting functional tests to pass against EC | 19:08 |
| notmyname | https://review.openstack.org/159205 - functests | 19:08 |
| notmyname | this is from acoles and is the start of functional tests | 19:08 |
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| notmyname | jrichli_ is also looking at some functional test updates to test EC, but the in-process ones are a good start | 19:09 |
| notmyname | those 4 patch chains are what to look at | 19:09 |
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| notmyname | they need to land asap (with reviews, of course) | 19:09 |
| notmyname | also, https://trello.com/board/swift-erasure-codes/51e0814d4ee9022d2b002a2c is up to date as of about 20 minutes ago | 19:10 |
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| notmyname | things tagged red are marked for the ec beta in kilo | 19:10 |
| notmyname | so....all that being said, what questions do you have :-) | 19:10 |
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| notmyname | ok then :-) | 19:12 |
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| mattoliverau | i think we're all reading trello (well i am) | 19:12 |
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| notmyname | in my opinion, there's a lot to do, and it's going to be tight to get all 4 of those landed on feature/ec by the end of next week. but I think it might happen | 19:13 |
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| torgomatic | I want to know why my brain can't hold all this code and I keep writing stupid bugs, but that's not specific to EC | 19:13 |
| notmyname | after feature/ec has all the stuff on it that we want in the beta, then we'll refactor that feature branch and propose it for merge to master (like we did with storage policies last june) | 19:14 |
| mattoliverau | depends on how long each chain is. We definittely need to get the reconstructer in, EC kinda needs it for the beta | 19:14 |
| tdasilva | notmyname: from following converstations earlier in the day on irc channel, it sounded like there were two "competing" chains on feature/ec , is that still the case? | 19:14 |
| notmyname | mattoliverau: of course | 19:14 |
| notmyname | tdasilva: not as much, but I haven't talked to clayg yet today. while I need to confirm with him, I think the "winner" is starred and linked above | 19:14 |
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| notmyname | right now, peluse, torgomatic, acoles (via phone), and cschwede (via phone) are together talking about all of this | 19:15 |
| notmyname | and that's the conclusion we had | 19:15 |
| tdasilva | notmyname: ok, so you are already taking that into account. | 19:15 |
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| notmyname | yes | 19:15 |
| notmyname | with the caveat of not having talked to clayg today :-) | 19:15 |
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| tdasilva | ok | 19:15 |
| notmyname | during the merge to master, we'll have a freeze on other stuff landing on master (except on a case-by-case basis) | 19:16 |
| notmyname | I want to talk about that more next week | 19:16 |
| notmyname | not this week | 19:16 |
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| mattoliverau | tdasilva: so I guess I need to move my review comments to your EC based putt refactor :) | 19:17 |
| notmyname | ok, so everyone ok with what's going on in EC? everyone know what needs done and what to work on? | 19:17 |
| mattoliverau | *put | 19:17 |
| * tdasilva is just wondering if it makes sense to have some sort of plan on how to "attack" those 4 chains so we make the best progress and don't duplicate/waste work | 19:17 | |
| notmyname | tdasilva: as in overlapping features? | 19:17 |
| notmyname | I think they're pretty isolated right now. at least as much as possible | 19:17 |
| tdasilva | ok | 19:18 |
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| mattoliverau | ok, I'll review the changes and then take a look at trello and see if there is an item that needs to be picked up.. let get this done! | 19:18 |
| notmyname | thanks | 19:19 |
| notmyname | ok, then moving on to other topics | 19:19 |
| notmyname | #topic encryption | 19:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "encryption (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:19 | |
| notmyname | acoles: did you put this on the agenda? I don't see a nick next to it | 19:19 |
| acoles | notmyname: yes i did, sorry | 19:19 |
| notmyname | no worries | 19:19 |
| notmyname | acoles: the floor is yours | 19:20 |
| acoles | and it is just for information, to let folks know that work has started | 19:20 |
| acoles | and we are tracking on trello https://trello.com/b/63l5zQhq/swift-encryption | 19:20 |
| acoles | and if anyone is bored of EC and wants an alternative review then come on over :) | 19:20 |
| tdasilva | haha | 19:21 |
| ho | :-) | 19:21 |
| notmyname | acoles: no! | 19:21 |
| notmyname | after EC! | 19:21 |
| acoles | i have cookies... | 19:21 |
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| notmyname | ;-) | 19:21 |
| mattoliverau | lol | 19:21 |
| kota_ | lol | 19:21 |
| cutforth | mmm... cookies | 19:21 |
| * acoles is being kicked by notmyname | 19:21 | |
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| notmyname | ther links are | 19:22 |
| notmyname | #linkhttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/154318/ | 19:22 |
| notmyname | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/154318/ | 19:22 |
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| notmyname | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/branch:feature/crypto+status:open,n,z | 19:22 |
| notmyname | those are the links to see what' going on with encryption | 19:22 |
| notmyname | any questions from anyone on encryption? | 19:22 |
| acoles | thats all, thank | 19:23 |
| notmyname | acoles: thanks for the info update | 19:23 |
| notmyname | #topic open discussion | 19:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: swift)" | 19:23 | |
| notmyname | OpenStack summit registration prices go up soon | 19:23 |
| notmyname | so if you haven't registered, do so quickly | 19:23 |
| mattoliverau | Got my ticket and travel all booked, so your going to have to put up with the noisy Australian again :P | 19:24 |
| notmyname | if you are an ATC (active technical contributor) then you should have a free pass | 19:24 |
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| notmyname | if you haven't gotten one, please let me know. either pm on IRC or email me@not.mn and I'll look into it for you | 19:24 |
| notmyname | anything else from anyone else? | 19:25 |
| tdasilva | trying not add confusion to patches to review but also answering matts questions about refactor patch. If I understand clayg's plan correctly, we would still like to see patch 156825 land on master | 19:25 |
| tdasilva | where is patchbot? | 19:26 |
| tdasilva | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/156825/ | 19:26 |
| notmyname | thanks | 19:26 |
| notmyname | patchbot isn't in here | 19:26 |
| tdasilva | hehe | 19:26 |
| gvernik | we uploaded spec related storlets...would be nice if people start review it | 19:26 |
| tdasilva | I think the plan is that if this lands on master, it would be easier to merge later ???? | 19:26 |
| notmyname | gvernik: thanks! | 19:26 |
| notmyname | tdasilva: ya, but what about https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164561/ | 19:27 |
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| notmyname | tdasilva: same refactor? | 19:27 |
| tdasilva | yeah, but this one is just simple break up into methods without any of the EC code | 19:27 |
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| tdasilva | so that in the ec branch, the new EC code will just go into ECObjectController | 19:28 |
| mattoliverau | gvernik: I saw that, EC reviews first, I'll take a look at the SPEC next (and try get to it today) | 19:28 |
| tdasilva | and the replica put path would not be disrupted (is that a word? ) | 19:28 |
| notmyname | tdasilva: ya, looking to the merge, whatever makes the merge easier is good | 19:28 |
| gvernik | thanks | 19:29 |
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| notmyname | gvernik: ya, I'm looking forward to seeing more in vancouver about it | 19:30 |
| mattoliverau | +1 | 19:30 |
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| notmyname | anything else? | 19:31 |
| peluse | lunch | 19:31 |
| notmyname | ok, thanks everyone for coming | 19:32 |
| mattoliverau | peluse: lol, your here.. and hungry obvousily :P | 19:32 |
| notmyname | please help out with code and reviews for EC | 19:32 |
| notmyname | thanks for working on swift | 19:32 |
| mattoliverau | sir, yes sir! | 19:32 |
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| notmyname | #endmeeting | 19:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:32 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 19:32:31 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:32 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2015/swift.2015-03-18-19.01.html | 19:32 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2015/swift.2015-03-18-19.01.txt | 19:32 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2015/swift.2015-03-18-19.01.log.html | 19:32 |
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| sgordon | #startmeeting telcowg | 22:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 22:01:07 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sgordon. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 22:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'telcowg' | 22:01 |
| sgordon | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nfv-meeting-agenda | 22:01 |
| sgordon | #topic roll call | 22:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 22:01 | |
| sgordon | \o/ | 22:01 |
| sgordon | any takers for the telco wg today | 22:02 |
| sgordon | or am i answering my own question about the PST-friendly meeting time ;) | 22:02 |
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| dcw | new telco wg member here | 22:02 |
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| sgordon | welcome, this may be a quick one ;) | 22:03 |
| dcw | looks like it :) | 22:03 |
| sgordon | #topic use cases | 22:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "use cases (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 22:03 | |
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| sgordon | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:stackforge/telcowg-usecases,n,z | 22:03 |
| sgordon | #info security segregation use case under review | 22:03 |
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| sgordon | #info vIMS use case under review | 22:03 |
| sgordon | the other order of business is moving the other use cases from the wiki/etherpads to gerrit | 22:04 |
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| dcw | is there any scope to introduce new use-cases? | 22:04 |
| sgordon | i will kick off an email thread to discuss dividing those up, aveiga and i are able to help with that | 22:04 |
| sgordon | always | 22:04 |
| dcw | i'm interested in contributing a SIP load-balancing use-case | 22:05 |
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| sgordon | the template we're using is here: | 22:05 |
| sgordon | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/stackforge/telcowg-usecases/tree/template.rst | 22:05 |
| dcw | is it cool to add to the wiki and figure out the Gerrit process later? | 22:05 |
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| sgordon | aveiga and i can walk you through actually adding it in #openstack-nfv at any time | 22:05 |
| sgordon | sure | 22:05 |
| bryan_att | Hi, it's Bryan from AT&T joining late, I'll be listening into the meeting | 22:06 |
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| sgordon | hiya | 22:06 |
| sgordon | bryan_att, as i said to dcw this may be a short one | 22:06 |
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| bryan_att | ok, I've just been trying to clear my calendar to join for a few weeks and finally did | 22:07 |
| sgordon | we were just highlighting that current use cases up for review are here: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:stackforge/telcowg-usecases,n,z | 22:07 |
| sgordon | we have a few others to copy across from the wiki/etherpad | 22:07 |
| sgordon | and dcw was planning to submit a new one | 22:07 |
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| sgordon | #action dcw to draft SIP load-balancing use-case for wiki/etherpad initially, will need assistance with git submission | 22:07 |
| sgordon | #action sgordon to email list asking to divide up other existing use cases for git submission | 22:08 |
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| sgordon | #topic OPNFV <> telco working group interaction | 22:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OPNFV <> telco working group interaction (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 22:08 | |
| sgordon | we discussed this at length last week with the broader group that attends the other time slot | 22:08 |
| sgordon | but two things i wanted to highlight | 22:08 |
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| sgordon | there is a thread i started on the opnfv tech list to try per the action item i took last week that is worth reading | 22:09 |
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| sgordon | #link http://lists.opnfv.org/pipermail/opnfv-tech-discuss/2015-March/thread.html#1525 | 22:09 |
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| sgordon | and also somewhat related there is a meeting tomorrow where opnfv submitted blueprints are going to be discussed (within the context of opnfv) | 22:09 |
| sgordon | #link https://wiki.opnfv.org/wiki/weekly_technical_discussion | 22:09 |
| sgordon | i am going to try attend and provide some feedback from an openstack point of view | 22:10 |
| bryan_att | I'm working on some blueprints related to policy as part of that | 22:10 |
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| sgordon | cool | 22:10 |
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| sgordon | so i think that will be a fairly relevant discussion as we try to work out how the two groups interact without duplicating each other's work :) | 22:11 |
| sgordon | the one other thing i had on the agenda today was meeting time | 22:11 |
| sgordon | dcw, bryan_att where are you based time zone wise? | 22:12 |
| bryan_att | just need to put them into your git template and dive a little deeper to ensure necessary detail. something we are still figuring out. we have the intent to work directly upstream rather than duplicate. | 22:12 |
| bryan_att | Seattle | 22:12 |
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| dcw | US eastern | 22:12 |
| sgordon | bryan_att, yes i think the template, or a template at least, is relevant regardless of where we ultimately store | 22:12 |
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| sgordon | ok | 22:12 |
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| sgordon | one of the things we have been noticing over a number of weeks now is that we have a lot more attendance at the other time slot | 22:13 |
| sgordon | we are wondering whether we need to re-evaluate the timing of this one | 22:13 |
| dcw | probably wise - it's 6pm on US east coast | 22:13 |
| dcw | might have been okay a few weeks ago before daylight savings | 22:14 |
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| sgordon | yeah | 22:14 |
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| sgordon | we used to still have two time slots but a little closer together | 22:14 |
| sgordon | so morning for PST | 22:15 |
| sgordon | and like 2 pm or something EST | 22:15 |
| sgordon | #action sgordon to try identify a potential earlier timeslot for the PST-friendly meeting | 22:15 |
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| sgordon | did either of you have any questions or items you would like to ask? | 22:16 |
| bryan_att | personally I'm OK with anytime other than midnite to 5 AM PDT - the rest is BAU and 5AM - 9AM PDT is very busy | 22:16 |
| sgordon | if we had more participants i might have dived into dividing up the review submissions but i think this is best done via email | 22:16 |
| sgordon | bryan_att, dw as a result my equivalent of 5AM - 9 AM PDT is also very busy ;) | 22:17 |
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| bryan_att | No items from me, yet - just trying to come on board. I'll look into the reviews needed to see if there's something I can comment on | 22:17 |
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| sgordon | ok no problem | 22:18 |
| sgordon | well welcome and thanks for coming along, hopefully we can get a few more people in and provide something more compelling for next time | 22:18 |
| sgordon | also looking forward to the opnfv discussion tomorrow | 22:18 |
| bryan_att | as we get closer to the summit I'm sure there will be more traffic | 22:18 |
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| bryan_att | we are rushing to get anything into the next release - it's a bit of a foot race right now and somewhat chaotic | 22:19 |
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| bryan_att | personally my eyes are on the subsequent release, but we don't want to delay unnecessarily and want to get starting contributing soon | 22:20 |
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| sgordon | ack | 22:20 |
| sgordon | makes sense | 22:20 |
| sgordon | #endmeeting | 22:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:20 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Mar 18 22:20:39 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:20 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-03-18-22.01.html | 22:20 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-03-18-22.01.txt | 22:20 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-03-18-22.01.log.html | 22:20 |
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| NarenNarendra | Hi Shamail | 22:48 |
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| Shamail | Hi NarenNarendra! | 22:48 |
| NarenNarendra | I also just joined.. not sure if the product mtg is still going on | 22:48 |
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| Shamail | It is, it will start in 12 minutes. | 22:48 |
| NarenNarendra | ah ok.. DST limbo | 22:48 |
| Shamail | Time changed for folks who observe DST | 22:49 |
| Shamail | Yep | 22:49 |
| NarenNarendra | good.. so i didnt miss it :) | 22:49 |
| Shamail | indeed!! | 22:49 |
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| Shamail | Going AFK for a bit, BBIAB. | 22:50 |
| NarenNarendra | same here | 22:50 |
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| sgordon | >.> | 23:00 |
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| sarob | #starting meeting product-team | 23:01 |
| sarob | #startmeeting product-team | 23:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Mar 18 23:01:18 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sarob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 23:01 |
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| barrett1 | Anyone here for the Product Work Group meeting? | 23:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 23:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: product-team)" | 23:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'product_team' | 23:01 |
| sarob | roll call | 23:01 |
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| Rockyg | o/ | 23:01 |
| barrett1 | Carol Barrett | 23:01 |
| rolandchan | Roland Chan | 23:01 |
| * sgordon here | 23:01 | |
| Shamail | Hi | 23:02 |
| * sarob \o/ | 23:02 | |
| gothicmindfood | o/ | 23:02 |
| sarob | excellent | 23:02 |
| sarob | agenda | 23:02 |
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| sarob | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/product-team | 23:02 |
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| sarob | barrett1: want to kick off what happenned at the ops midcycle? | 23:03 |
| Rockyg | go for it! | 23:04 |
| sarob | or anyone that was there... | 23:04 |
| barrett1 | Sure - I sent several emails to the group with info along the way | 23:04 |
| sarob | #topic ops midcycle | 23:04 |
| barrett1 | I also posted info in our etherpad | 23:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ops midcycle (Meeting topic: product-team)" | 23:04 | |
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| barrett1 | We were able to talk with Operators, PTLs/Developers and Foundation folks | 23:05 |
| sarob | which one? | 23:05 |
| sarob | etherpad | 23:05 |
| barrett1 | Checking | 23:05 |
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| barrett1 | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-product-management-socialization | 23:06 |
| sgordon | line 639 onwards | 23:06 |
| barrett1 | There was a placeholder at the end for feedback from Ops Meetup so I added the email info there | 23:06 |
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| sarob | im with you | 23:07 |
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| barrett1 | I also edited the wiki page to add a link to the roadmap that includes the PTL interview info and PTL comments about what the PWG could do for them | 23:07 |
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| barrett1 | We still are missing info on some key projects on intentions for K, L and M | 23:08 |
| sarob | better color, thx | 23:08 |
| sarob | i like the ttx feedback | 23:09 |
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| sarob | im confused to the not meeting with TC part | 23:10 |
| sarob | since the TC is a cross section of the PTLs mostly | 23:10 |
| rolandchan | yes, I think their buy in as a group is needed. | 23:10 |
| sgordon | mostly | 23:10 |
| sgordon | but i think what he is getting at is that is more coincidence than anything | 23:10 |
| barrett1 | Thierry didn't see a reason why we would need to meet with the TC, they don't approve this | 23:10 |
| sgordon | as the PTL = TC link is long gone | 23:10 |
| Rockyg | the xcpoject meeting, right after the TC meeting is where all the PTLs are supposed to gather and work together | 23:10 |
| sgordon | so there are PTLs, of projects which are likely important to us, who arent on the TC | 23:11 |
| sgordon | (plenty of them in fact) | 23:11 |
| sgordon | right | 23:11 |
| barrett1 | Thierry suggested the xproject team because all PTLs are there and it's their meeting. | 23:11 |
| sgordon | Rockyg +1 | 23:11 |
| sarob | rockyg: good point | 23:11 |
| rolandchan | support != approval | 23:11 |
| sarob | im fine starting with the xproject team | 23:11 |
| sarob | the same peoples | 23:11 |
| sarob | similar | 23:11 |
| sarob | rolandchan: meaning? | 23:12 |
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| rolandchan | meaning there is value in having the TC say they support something even if they aren't in an approval chain for that thing. | 23:13 |
| sarob | got it | 23:13 |
| sarob | like being responsible rather than accountable | 23:13 |
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| sarob | maybe consulted or informed is better example | 23:14 |
| barrett1 | What we could take into the xproject meeting is goals, process, sample roadmap (from interviews), sample use case (which would be based upon Operators feedback and be the basis for populating the roadmap). | 23:14 |
| Shamail | Wouldn't the TC want to be involved when a long-term roadmap is being proposed (based on PTL feedback) or since the roadmap is built using PTL feedback it doesn't require approval? | 23:14 |
| rolandchan | yep. I think "consulted" is perfect. | 23:14 |
| Rockyg | I believe that Thierry thinks if the PTLs all agree, he can feed the info back to th TC without issue (optimistically) | 23:14 |
| barrett1 | Does the TC "approve" the goals for each release for each project? | 23:15 |
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| sarob | barrett1: nope | 23:15 |
| sarob | PTLs job | 23:15 |
| sarob | PTLs rule | 23:15 |
| sarob | dude | 23:15 |
| Rockyg | sarob ++ | 23:15 |
| barrett1 | I don't understand why the TC would be involved with the Roadmap either | 23:15 |
| Shamail | Makes sense if we don't encounter disagreements. I guess the bigger question is do we think it will be instances where this agreement may arise? | 23:15 |
| Shamail | blah auto correct | 23:16 |
| sarob | i wanted to socialize with the TC what we are doing | 23:16 |
| sarob | rather than get approval | 23:16 |
| Shamail | This agreement = disagreements | 23:16 |
| Rockyg | There will be priority issues on getting mulitple PTLs on the same page | 23:16 |
| barrett1 | Rocky ++ | 23:16 |
| jogo | why not socialize on the openstack-dev ML? | 23:17 |
| barrett1 | The other thing the PTLs talked about was the need to balance new features with bug fixing - they struggle with this | 23:17 |
| sarob | there 2 | 23:17 |
| Shamail | sarob: I agree, we don't have to include them in the actual process but socialization would be great | 23:17 |
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| sarob | okay, lets follow ttx advice and start talking to the xproject group as we get the rough roadmap, use cases, workflow ready | 23:18 |
| sarob | while also publishing to openstack-dev ML | 23:18 |
| barrett1 | sarob ++ | 23:19 |
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| Rockyg | ++ | 23:19 |
| sgordon | wfm | 23:19 |
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| sarob | \o/ | 23:19 |
| Shamail | sarob: +1 | 23:20 |
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| sarob | #action team: once rough roadmap, use cases, workflow ready, we join the xproject meeting and publish URL to openstack-dev ML | 23:20 |
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| sarob | what deadline | 23:21 |
| Rockyg | might want to introduce the product team to the PTLs before that. In case some are up on our group | 23:21 |
| sarob | do we want to give ourselves? | 23:21 |
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| sgordon | so i think we are making a lot of progress on rough roadmap | 23:22 |
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| Rockyg | Just a hi, we're here, this is what we're working on. the next time you see us here on the agenda will be with the drafts... | 23:22 |
| sgordon | not as clear on where we are at on use cases / workflow | 23:22 |
| sarob | rockyg: we should at least have the rough workflow ready for review | 23:22 |
| barrett1 | for deadline how about intersecting the xprojec team meeting the week of 4/13 or 4/20? | 23:22 |
| sgordon | rough roadmap being = documenting existing priorities | 23:22 |
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| sarob | def before liberty summit | 23:23 |
| sgordon | (for now) | 23:23 |
| Shamail | Yep | 23:23 |
| sarob | sgordon: yes | 23:23 |
| barrett1 | Can we take work flow and rough roadmap (per Steve) to xproject meeting the week of 4/13? | 23:23 |
| Shamail | Agreed on both topics (sgordon and barrett1) | 23:23 |
| Rockyg | 4/20 might be hard, depending on how the RCs are going. 4/13 or about 3 weeks before summit would be good | 23:23 |
| sarob | we dont start thinking about new priorities and goal until the PTLs feel we are a responsible group | 23:24 |
| Shamail | sarob: +1 | 23:24 |
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| sarob | 4/13 is a month from now | 23:24 |
| Shamail | 4/13 sounds good | 23:24 |
| sarob | do we need that much time? | 23:24 |
| barrett1 | It seems like we could help the PTLs by bringing them Operators feedback in a consistent form and create Use Cases that utilize that feedback | 23:24 |
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| sarob | i was thinking like next week or the one after | 23:25 |
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| barrett1 | Sooner the better works for me | 23:25 |
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| Shamail | The challenge is also how much progress we want to make on the coordination piece by liberty. I'd like xproj feedback for sure on that portion of the workflow. | 23:25 |
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| sarob | we can loop back to xproject with summit ready stuff for 13apr maybe | 23:25 |
| sarob | shamail: +1 | 23:26 |
| barrett1 | +1 | 23:26 |
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| Rockyg | +1 | 23:26 |
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| barrett1 | Should we get a repository setup and post our docs there ahead of that meeting? | 23:27 |
| Shamail | The one after is good... It gives people time to leverage one full week to try and fill out as much of the rough roadmap as possible but still leaves time for work before summit | 23:27 |
| Shamail | barrett1: +1, happy to draft some use-cases as well | 23:27 |
| sarob | barrett1: we are planning on using the xproject repo right? | 23:27 |
| barrett1 | I'm hoping to have some we can use from WTE too | 23:28 |
| barrett1 | Does anyone have a format for Use Cases that they have used and like? | 23:28 |
| sgordon | well now... | 23:28 |
| Rockyg | We cod do a directory called product or product-wg under the xproject repo | 23:28 |
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| sgordon | http://git.openstack.org/cgit/stackforge/telcowg-usecases/tree/template.rst | 23:29 |
| barrett1 | sarob: OK, will we create a sub dir there? | 23:29 |
| Rockyg | go, sgordon! | 23:29 |
| barrett1 | rocky ++ | 23:29 |
| sgordon | the main thing i had an AI to add to it (from a telco wg perspective) was personas/user story section | 23:29 |
| sarob | barrett1: yup | 23:29 |
| Shamail | sgordon: +1 on the format | 23:29 |
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| Shamail | Would we have core reviewers in xproj? | 23:30 |
| barrett1 | steve ++ think the narative is helpful | 23:30 |
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| sarob | shamail: ugh, good point | 23:30 |
| sarob | shamail: yeah, we would need to | 23:30 |
| sarob | workflow details | 23:31 |
| sarob | #link https://docs.google.com/document/d/13JPDDiBGGXf5dtP0u8C-1So2Mjb3yEmGhv_ijVqyEf0/edit# | 23:31 |
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| sarob | soo, | 23:32 |
| Shamail | If we need core in xproj then we probably can't commit before reviewing with them. | 23:32 |
| sarob | shamail: yup | 23:32 |
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| sarob | so lets get the rough draft of what the workflow looks like ready for xproject review | 23:33 |
| barrett1 | On the process, what is the "community voting" in 1.ij? | 23:33 |
| sarob | within one to two weeks | 23:33 |
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| barrett1 | sarob ++ | 23:33 |
| sarob | every pass | 23:33 |
| sarob | the technical community reviews | 23:33 |
| barrett1 | OK | 23:34 |
| barrett1 | why the DefCore check? | 23:34 |
| sarob | random thought | 23:34 |
| sarob | that defcore state should be a quick double check | 23:34 |
| Shamail | That was teased out through doc comments... Probably no real relation to DefCore arm. | 23:34 |
| Shamail | Atm* | 23:34 |
| barrett1 | Given that DefCore applies to "adopted" capabilities, it's not always likely that these new features will be already included | 23:35 |
| sarob | defcore is going to spit out money | 23:35 |
| sarob | nice | 23:35 |
| Shamail | Sarob: 😄 | 23:35 |
| barrett1 | I suggest we take that box out | 23:36 |
| Shamail | barrett1: true... at best we might want to scan failed tests from DefCore to maybe find new items | 23:36 |
| sarob | barrett1: defcore and product work are on the opposite ends of the innovation cycle | 23:36 |
| barrett1 | sarob: Agree | 23:36 |
| sarob | i was keeping defcore in our thoughts as we work through the rough draft | 23:36 |
| Rockyg | The other check would be to see if defcore thinks it wants to deprecate something we have plans for in the future roadmap | 23:36 |
| sarob | was all | 23:36 |
| sarob | i dont think we should ask defcore for a review | 23:37 |
| sarob | just that the product team check to see the state of defcore | 23:37 |
| barrett1 | I think we'd need to create a matrix for each use case showing which projects are likely to be impacted | 23:37 |
| Shamail | barrett1: +1 | 23:37 |
| sarob | barrett1: interesting, id like to see how that would look | 23:38 |
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| Shamail | We could include it at the end of each use-case or commit message? | 23:38 |
| sarob | use case heatmaps? | 23:38 |
| barrett1 | sarob - I am working on one for Rolling Upgrades with Zero downtime. I can share it | 23:38 |
| sarob | barrett1: okay | 23:38 |
| sarob | more data good | 23:39 |
| Rockyg | kewl. I wanna see that one, too | 23:39 |
| barrett1 | Once we have the Use Case and the Matrix with appropriate core-reviewer approval, would that be the 1st milestone? | 23:39 |
| * sarob say more data good | 23:39 | |
| Shamail | Ditto | 23:39 |
| sarob | barrett1: umm, let me noodle that | 23:40 |
| sarob | lets continue this on the ML | 23:40 |
| barrett1 | My thought is, with that in hand, we could start the process of evaluating existing BPs for changes and creating new ones needed to implement the use case | 23:40 |
| sarob | so we can finish the agenda | 23:40 |
| sarob | sounds good | 23:41 |
| sarob | #topic state of tags, our purpose/focus | 23:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "state of tags, our purpose/focus (Meeting topic: product-team)" | 23:41 | |
| sarob | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/product-wg/2015-March/000198.html | 23:42 |
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| sarob | who wants to take this up for the group discussion? | 23:42 |
| sgordon | well, tl;dr we have a big tent and people coming into it to see what's what want some guidance via tags | 23:43 |
| Shamail | I can start but Rockyg and sgordon plz chime in | 23:43 |
| sgordon | what tags, who defines them, etc. | 23:43 |
| sgordon | is pretty much a blank slate | 23:43 |
| sgordon | in particular there does not seem to be a rush of people to be the who | 23:43 |
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| Shamail | There was a discussion on a specific tag "production ready" that Rocky sent over... I think we all agreed on the cons associated with such a tag. | 23:43 |
| Rockyg | My thoughts are that we have a unique perspective in that we are some of the most experienced in delivering product as opposed to code | 23:44 |
| barrett1 | From the Ops Meetup - it seems like there is a desire from Operators for a small form of an integrated release. And tags that describe the interoperability of other projects with that core. | 23:44 |
| Shamail | * apologizes for cell phone lag... Listening to others now. | 23:44 |
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| barrett1 | I wonder if there needs to be 2 (or more) classes of tags - One for developers and One for Operators? | 23:44 |
| sgordon | the other variation of this discussion which was raised on the -dev thread | 23:44 |
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| sgordon | was whether each of the "old" criteria the TC evaluated should be considered to see if it should be a possible tag | 23:45 |
| Rockyg | Shamail, and we also know the pitfalls of assigning the wrong words to a collection of code ;-) | 23:45 |
| Shamail | :-) | 23:45 |
| sgordon | barrett1, i see it as different groups defining tags rather than classes of tags | 23:45 |
| sgordon | so the user group would be a good example of a body that likely should set some | 23:45 |
| barrett1 | sgordon: what's an example of a group? | 23:45 |
| sgordon | similarly i think this body is well placed to provide a different perspective | 23:46 |
| barrett1 | If the Operators defined an OpenStack-Core tag, how would they cause it to be used by the developers? | 23:46 |
| Rockyg | sgordon: I think the TC have an idea of something like foundational, then other tags that can be applied to other projects that meet the old TC criteria but don't sound like check boxes | 23:46 |
| sgordon | what does used mean here barrett1 | 23:46 |
| sgordon | i mean really, to me, "using" them means going to the list of projects | 23:47 |
| sgordon | and see ooh this has tag-1, tag-2, and tag-3 | 23:47 |
| barrett1 | Having the tag associated with portions of code | 23:47 |
| sgordon | but we're not talking about tagging portions of code no? | 23:47 |
| sgordon | we're talking about tagging projects? | 23:47 |
| barrett1 | entire projects? | 23:48 |
| sgordon | if we have to have the tags set in code then i think we have a problem | 23:48 |
| Rockyg | Please let's not use "core". It's overloaded already. and if it were used, it would be nova, glance, keystone and either nova-network or neutron and cinder or swift | 23:48 |
| Shamail | Current scope is project... :) | 23:48 |
| sgordon | yeah | 23:48 |
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| barrett1 | rockyg: Based upon the the Ops feedback Horizon would be in that set too | 23:48 |
| Shamail | I think everyone has good points on tags and possible organization of tags... I would like to add another question: what's product WG's role (if any)? | 23:49 |
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| sgordon | well i was thinking about this earlier | 23:49 |
| barrett1 | Would our role be in using Tags to help Operators find implemented Use Cases? | 23:49 |
| sgordon | primarily i think we need to determine what we care about | 23:49 |
| Shamail | We can always participate as individuals or parts of other teams... But do we need a WG stance? | 23:49 |
| sgordon | e.g. stable api (i can use n-1 client against this project) | 23:50 |
| sgordon | just as an example | 23:50 |
| sgordon | we also dont necessarily have to decide right now, we may come up with common things we care about exposing via tags later | 23:50 |
| sgordon | my only concern (more generally) is again that in the absence of *anyone* stepping up and defining the tags it's kind of the wild west | 23:51 |
| barrett1 | sgordon: I like the idea of using tags to communicate what's important to Operators. | 23:51 |
| sgordon | and that is what the operators seemed to be concerned about as well | 23:51 |
| barrett1 | +1 | 23:51 |
| Shamail | Devils Advocate: that is moving us from a group sharing PTLs thoughts as use-cases to a group actually suggesting roadmap items (and how to tag them) | 23:51 |
| Shamail | sgordon: +1 | 23:51 |
| sgordon | Shamail, debatable - one of the tags from our pov might be "has roadmap" ;p | 23:52 |
| Shamail | Nice :) | 23:52 |
| rolandchan | shamail: I'm fine with that in any case. | 23:52 |
| barrett1 | shamail: If we're not suggesting roadmap items then I don't think we're helping the PTLs and the OpenStack | 23:52 |
| sgordon | there's a balance to be struck here but i see it actually as within what we discussed as our remit | 23:52 |
| Shamail | barrett1: agreed in the long-run but crawl, walk, run | 23:53 |
| sgordon | because it's ultimately about assisting consumers of openstack to interpret what's going on | 23:53 |
| sgordon | the roadmap activity obviously strikes at that | 23:53 |
| sgordon | i think tagging does too | 23:53 |
| sgordon | but like i said that doesnt mean we need a definitive list of tags today | 23:53 |
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| barrett1 | I thought tagging was more intended for people who want to build a version from the trunk...no? | 23:53 |
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| sgordon | i would imagine the list of tags, more generally, will grow over time anyway | 23:54 |
| barrett1 | And that they tags could somehow also help out with documentation... | 23:54 |
| sgordon | i believe it to be much more general than that | 23:54 |
| jogo | sgordon: for examples of what make good tags, I think the former gradation list, http://governance.openstack.org/reference/incubation-integration-requirements.html, could be turned into tags | 23:54 |
| Shamail | So if we decide we want to help with the tagging system... (E.g. Help tame or document the Wild West)... Any ideas on how to proceed? | 23:54 |
| sgordon | i mean put it this way | 23:54 |
| sgordon | was the integrated release only to help those building from trunk? | 23:55 |
| Shamail | sgordon: don't think so... It was also supposed to help consumers know that this code runs in production somewhere | 23:55 |
| sgordon | jogo, agreed - just as Rockyg said though that seems to be something actively being looked at in the -dev community already | 23:55 |
| Shamail | And follows the OpenStack way | 23:55 |
| sgordon | Shamail, right - if even that | 23:55 |
| sgordon | depending on which version of the integration requirements was used at a point in time :) | 23:56 |
| sarob | so can i bring it back | 23:56 |
| sarob | to what we are doing | 23:56 |
| Rockyg | I also think that we may be able to help provide a clearer path between the conversion to big tent and how the tags are used to define and the tent | 23:56 |
| sarob | i dont think tagging has much to do with our group right now | 23:57 |
| jogo | sgordon: yup, but tags along those lines could be useful. I as a dev am interested in the answer to: As an operator I will only look at projects that have the following tags | 23:57 |
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| sarob | we are creating a multirelease roadmap | 23:57 |
| barrett1 | I guess the question is how do we create a link from the roadmap to the projects? | 23:57 |
| sarob | maybe theme based tags could be one of the outputs | 23:58 |
| sarob | but other than that | 23:58 |
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| barrett1 | so someone could actually get the roadmapped capabilities in their deployment | 23:58 |
| sarob | tagging is out of scope for us i believe | 23:58 |
| Rockyg | The devs know that the one big integration approach is starting to collapse under its own weight and they think tags will help when the tests are more directed to limited collections of projects. They just don't haven't been able to connect the tent with the tags tightly yet. | 23:58 |
| Shamail | sarob: that's a good starting point at an intersection | 23:58 |
| sarob | we are in the last minutes | 23:59 |
| barrett1 | sarob: what's an example of a theme? | 23:59 |
| Rockyg | telco | 23:59 |
| sarob | CBP | 23:59 |
| Rockyg | storage cloud | 23:59 |
| barrett1 | sarob: CBP? | 23:59 |
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| Shamail | barrett1: the "ilities"... Availability, Scalability, etc. | 23:59 |
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| Rockyg | private cloud | 23:59 |
| sarob | oops, i mean thats a vertical using our | 23:59 |
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