Monday, 2015-07-06

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jaypipesedleafe, lxsli: scheduler meeting now, right?13:03
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lxsliin alt I think13:05
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boris-42#startmeeting Rally14:00
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 14:00:49 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is boris-42. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'rally'14:00
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boris-42yfried: stpierre ping14:01
yfriedboris-42: hi14:01
skraynevhi all14:02
boris-42skraynev: hi there14:02
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boris-42e0ne: hi14:02
temujinhi all14:02
skraynevboris-42: try to split mind on two sync-ups :)14:02
boris-42amaretskiy: ping14:03
boris-42yingjun: hi hi14:03
andreykurilin temujin: o////////14:03
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e0neboris-42: hi14:04
boris-42okay let's get start)14:04
boris-42#topic Rally Meeting Agenda (finally we did it)14:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Rally Meeting Agenda (finally we did it) (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:05
boris-42rvasilets: Thank you for you hard work on this not so interesting task14:05
e0neboris-42: please post a link14:05
boris-42rvasilets: could you explain how it is organized ? and what you did14:05
rvasiletsboris-42, sure14:06
* yfried will be back in 10min14:06
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rvasiletsWe could find a link in priject info in wiki Rally page14:06
rvasiletsthere is Project meetings14:06
rvasiletsBefore every weekly meeting we should post our suggestion to agenda. After a meeting I will briefly summarize our meeting in Previous Meetings14:08
boris-42rvasilets: as well we should add that meeting manager will be changed each 2 weeks14:08
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boris-42rvasilets: so nobody will get to tired from doing this work14:09
e0nervasilets: why you don't use meeting notes for summary?14:09
boris-42e0ne: because it's not human written14:09
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boris-42e0ne: the same why we don't use release notes that are auto generated14:09
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e0negood point:)14:10
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andreykuriline0ne: the same why we don't use tempest for testing rally14:10
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boris-42andreykurilin: LOL14:11
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boris-42okay so the idea is next14:11
boris-42if you want to discuss something you should add it to agenda14:11
boris-42in such way we will have more organized and useful meeting14:11
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e0neboris-42: +!14:12
e0neboris-42: +114:12
boris-42skraynev: yingjun stpierre redixin ^14:12
skraynevboris-42: ok. currently is nothing from me14:12
yingjunlooks good14:13
redixinI thought it is already like that ^14:13
boris-42redixin: hehe14:14
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redixinbtw, IMO we should try to use all this meetbot stuff, and not bother people with making meeting summary by hand14:14
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andreykurilinredixin: something like:14:15
boris-42redixin: this is good point to have better logs of meeting (but I would still prefer to have human written summaries)14:15
andreykurilin#idea we should try to use all this meetbot stuff, and not bother people with making meeting summary by hand14:15
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redixinandreykurilin, yep14:16
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rvasiletsyhis bot is very limited14:17
rvasiletsI don't now what tag to use when I whant to summerazi the topic14:18
rvasiletsfor example14:18
rvasilets* now=>know14:18
boris-42#agreed We should use tags14:19
rvasiletsok its good idea14:19
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rvasiletsdon;t forget to use them then!14:19
boris-42#agreed We should write summaries by hand14:19
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boris-42#agreed we should rotate each 2 weeks meeting manager14:19
boris-42#action We should create list of people who would like to help with task14:20
boris-42okay let's move to the first topic14:20
e0ne40 minutes reminder :)14:20
boris-42#topic Ironic benchmarks14:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Ironic benchmarks (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:20
boris-42rvasilets: so?14:20
rvasiletsokey. I tried to add first Ironic benchmark and I thought that its done, but...14:21
rvasiletsI found some problem  that I cant solve14:22
rvasiletsI got recursion and I don't know why!14:23
rvasiletsNeed help14:23
rvasiletsThis patch is desired for Ironic team to enable Rally job in Ironic tests14:23
boris-42rvasilets: wrong link14:23
boris-42 rvasilets this one shoudl work14:23
boris-42btw you should use14:23
boris-42rvasilets: btw you forgot to send link to the patch actually*14:24
rvasiletsokey. Sorry for that. The link is #link for the patch that need help14:24
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rvasiletsIs there someone who can help me with that?14:25
rvasilets#help Is there someone who can help me with that?14:26
boris-42rvasilets: so did you take a look at the code of python ironic client?14:26
boris-42rvasilets: did you try to run by hands this commands and so on?14:26
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boris-42rvasilets: and they work?14:26
rvasiletscli of Ironic is working14:27
boris-42rvasilets: not CLI14:27
boris-42rvasilets: did you use it as python client (lib)14:27
boris-42rvasilets: in exactly the same way as rally use it14:27
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boris-42rvasilets: so try it firstly (to repeat the same commands)14:28
boris-42rvasilets: if they work then there is some difference between what you did in rally and by hand14:29
boris-42rvasilets: if they doesn't work there is difference between CLI and what you are doing14:29
boris-42rvasilets: in any case I will try to take a look at this14:29
rvasiletsBut there is one more step to find that difference!14:30
boris-42#action rvasilets will try to understand why Ironic benchmarks doesn't work and why CLI of ironic works14:30
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boris-42#action boris-42 will review Ironic patch
boris-42okay let's move to next topic14:30
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boris-42#topic Use DDT framework in tests14:31
*** openstack changes topic to "Use DDT framework in tests (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:31
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boris-42Okay guys let's use DDT framework for testing and rewrite all the tests on it14:31
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boris-42This framework is really nice14:31
rvasilets#idea tag?)14:31
amaretskiywe can not use ddt in all tests - only where that is usefult14:31
boris-42rvasilets: nope because it's topic14:31
boris-42amaretskiy: yep but there is a lot of places where it is useful =)14:32
andreykurilinvponomaryov: ^14:32
amaretskiyboris-42: ok :)14:32
boris-42amaretskiy: part of group of tests can be rewritten on it14:32
yfriedboris-42: what is DDT? what's its adv?14:32
stpierrethis ?14:32
boris-42yfried: let me show the sample14:32
boris-42#link sample of DDT way to test
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boris-42this module btw can be replaced with DDT
amaretskiyboris-42: 100%14:35
stpierreseems like in some cases it'd be very useful, and in others can provide some marginal benefit by easily multiplying test cases (and thus hopefully increasing edge-case coverage)14:35
stpierrebut i don't think we need to be quite so dogmatic as rewriting *all* the tests with ddt :)14:35
* yfried agrees with stpierre14:35
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stpierrebut it'd certainly simplify any of the cases where we have a _test_foo() function, and that's called from test_foo() and test_foo_failure() and test_foo_with_bar() and ....14:36
boris-42stpierre: yfried rewritting *all* the tests that should be rewriten14:36
yfriedwe have enough on our plate without rewriting existing tests14:36
yfriedboris-42: rally coverage seems excellent already14:36
boris-42yfried: house keeping is very important task14:36
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boris-42yfried: I mean it looks like not important task, but it's actually curcial14:37
yfriedboris-42: I don't disagree, it's just priorities...14:37
stpierrewe should definitely keep ddt in mind for code reviews, and it'd be nice to rewrite obvious low-hanging fruit so that we have examples to point at14:37
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boris-42stpierre: yep14:37
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boris-42stpierre: these tasks are quite good for newbies14:37
boris-42stpierre: what we need is just set of bugs14:37
stpierreand some of us seem to have a particular masochistic bent for working on unit tests14:37
boris-42stpierre: LOL14:37
yfriedboris-42: stpierre: I guess if someone volunteered to flag all refactor candidates and tag them as low-hanging fruits we can pick it up later14:38
boris-42#info yfried: so what we need for now is to block intorducing new cases where DDT should be used14:38
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yingjun#agree using ddt for newly added tests, low priority to rewite14:39
boris-42everybody agree ^ ?14:39
yfriedboris-42: I'll have to look into DDT to know this for blocking new patches. could you please provide a good link?14:39
boris-42yfried: so this thing is quite simple14:40
boris-42it's just decorator that creates N times the same method with different arguments14:40
boris-42I belive the best sample is to take a look at manila plugins tests14:40
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yfriedboris-42: ack14:41
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stpierrewhy don't we try to get a couple of existing tests converted as well, then we'll have a larger body of examples14:42
yfriedstpierre: good #idea14:42
stpierrewe don't need to do them all right now, but a couple more would be nice14:42
boris-42stpierre: yfried btw kiran can refactor14:43
boris-42stpierre: yfried own tests to use DDT14:43
boris-42and we will have a sample of patch that refactors part of tests14:43
yfriedboris-42: if kiran is willing to be the guinee pig :)14:43
boris-42that we can show to other14:43
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boris-42yfried: I think he likes to learn new stuff14:44
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boris-42okay let's move to next topic14:45
boris-42#topic Optimize Rally imports14:45
*** openstack changes topic to "Optimize Rally imports (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:45
boris-42Okay guys I did everything that was possible14:46
boris-42(without changing other libs)14:46
boris-42#link and here is the result of my work14:46
boris-42yfried: ^14:47
yfriedboris-42: +214:47
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yfriedboris-42: it's a good patch14:48
boris-42The only thing that I am worried is that we are able to introduce regression in future14:48
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boris-42but there are part of really good changes e.g. lazy db that saves most of the time=)14:48
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boris-42okay let's move to next topic14:49
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boris-42#agree That patch should be merged =)14:49
boris-42#agreed That patch should be merged =)14:49
boris-42#topic Some review work update14:49
boris-42kun_huang: ping14:49
*** openstack changes topic to "Some review work update (Meeting topic: Rally)"14:49
kun_huangboris-42: pong14:50
kun_huangthere some patches need to track14:50
kun_huangthe one who submit sahara related patches seems leaving14:51
yfriedkun_huang: why do we need this?
boris-42yfried: uh oh=)14:51
kun_huangyfried: I know this, it not 100% enough14:51
yfriedboris-42: kun_huang: tried to post the link to boris-42's nice board14:51
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boris-42yfried: here is google short url
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boris-42kun_huang: so maybe we can extend that dashboard?14:52
kun_huangboris-42: yep, I will try it14:52
boris-42kun_huang: .e.g. if I mark patch with star it will become important one14:52
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boris-42kun_huang: if it has +2 it is close to merge (e.g. in separated column)14:52
boris-42kun_huang: we can add you to the people who can manage important patches14:53
boris-42kun_huang: if you would like to maintain this kind of work14:53
kun_huangboris-42: :-)14:53
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boris-42kun_huang: so what do you think?14:54
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kun_huangboris-42: “people who can manage important patches” means core?14:54
boris-42kun_huang: nope it's all by hand ...14:54
boris-42kun_huang: btw I belive we can put acl group14:55
boris-42kun_huang: or create new one specially for this14:55
boris-42kun_huang: I will try to play with it14:55
kun_huangboris-42: me too, I would love to have a try on it14:55
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kun_huanglet's go back to my topic it self first14:56
boris-42#action Do the changes with rally dashboard to fit kun_huang requirments)14:56
kun_huangsome came to rally and contribute their patches14:56
boris-42kun_huang: we have only 4 minute s=)14:56
boris-42kun_huang: so be fast=)14:56
kun_huangsome of patches seems be ignored and they are leaving14:57
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kun_huang(my network broken just now)14:57
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boris-42kun_huang: so we are trying not to ignore stuff14:58
boris-42kun_huang: at least me...14:58
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boris-42kun_huang: so in any case we should add new rule14:59
boris-42#idea e.g. review the oldest patches firstly *14:59
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yfriedboris-42: kun_huang: I believe the dashboard should be able to show verifed patches that haven't been reivewd for a long while14:59
boris-42yfried: yep exactly14:59
kun_huanggood idea14:59
amaretskiy#agree - review the oldest patches firstly14:59
boris-42kun_huang: we will try to add some kind of sort14:59
boris-42like latest review from core15:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"15:00
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 15:00:05 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:00
openstackMinutes (text):
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anteaya#startmeeting third-party15:01
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 15:01:42 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is anteaya. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: third-party)"15:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'third_party'15:01
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anteayahello folks15:02
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anteayaso to start off let's remember that asselin's sprint is the end of this week15:04
anteayaand I see many of you have signed up15:04
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anteayaso it will be great to work with you on Thursday and Friday to get as much done as we are able15:04
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anteayaany questions on the sprint?15:05
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anteayajogo created this table15:06
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anteayait works for me in chrome and not in firefox15:07
anteayawhich is a nice compliment to patrickeast's tool here15:07
anteayaso with that out of the way15:07
anteayadoes anyone have anything they would like to discuss today?15:08
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anteayaeantyshev: did your looping issue return?15:09
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eantyshevanteaya: nope, but I have a little patch to discover why does it happen:
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anteayaeantyshev: nicely done15:11
anteayathank you15:11
eantyshevanteaya: so when it is merged, I'll be able to tell the reason of failures15:12
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anteayayes, more logging is helpful15:12
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anteayaif anyone else is able to review that patch, that would be wonderful15:12
anteayaanything more on this topic?15:12
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eantyshevanteaya: no15:12
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anteayaokay great, thank you15:13
anteayadoes anyone have anything else they would like to discuss?15:13
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anteayawe don't seem very chatty today15:14
anteayaas a group15:14
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anteayaperhaps everyone really enjoyed a long weekend15:14
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anteayawell no need to keep you if we have nothing to discuss15:14
anteayaeveryone knows to join the sprint channel for the sprint15:14
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anteayajust show up and you will get further instructions during the sprint15:15
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anteayayou don't have to prepare, just attend15:15
anteayawell thank you all for your attendance and particpation today15:15
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anteayaenjoy the rest of the day/evening/night15:16
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anteayaand see you at the sprint15:16
anteayaand next week15:16
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"15:16
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 15:16:16 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:16
openstackMinutes (text):
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rakhmerov#startmeeting Mistral16:01
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 16:01:36 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is rakhmerov. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Mistral)"16:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'mistral'16:01
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^Gal^Hi everyone16:02
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^Gal^I've just uploaded the Executions Screen Blueprint
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rakhmerovlet's wait a little bit for others16:02
rakhmerovok, good16:03
rakhmerovlet me see16:03
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LimorStotlandhi all16:03
rakhmerovhi )16:03
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rakhmerovok, let's start our meeting16:04
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NikolayMhi everyone !16:04
rakhmerovthe agenda of the meeting is at
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rakhmerovhi Nikolay16:05
rakhmerov#topic Review action items16:05
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rakhmerov1. NikolayM: talk to Stan Lagun about YAQL 1.0 inclusion into global requirements16:05
rakhmerovthis is one basically done, Stan is about to get it solved soon (1-2 weeks)16:06
rakhmerov2. xylan_kong: proposal to replace utils.wf_trace with oslo.log16:06
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rakhmerovxylan_kong: you're here?16:06
rakhmerovjust in case16:06
xylan_konghi, guys16:07
rakhmerovanyway, I see this item is done. He sent out the email in ML with subject [openstack-dev] [Mistral] Proposing to remove mistral.utils.wf_trace module16:07
xylan_kong sorry i'm late16:07
rakhmerovxylan_kong: no problem )16:07
xylan_kongi wrote a spec for using oslo.log to substitude wf_trace module, but with no response, so i gave up the atempt to work on that.16:08
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rakhmerovxylan_kong: I saw your proposal but I personally didn't have a chance to look at it closer. Someone else might have16:08
xylan_kongrakhmerov: myabe it's not so necessary16:08
rakhmerovxylan_kong: don't give up ) We'll get it reviewed and answered16:08
xylan_kongand not so urgent16:08
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xylan_kongrakhmerov: ok, i'm ok16:08
rakhmerovat least we can discuss it, create a BP and prioritize, right?16:09
xylan_kongyep, sure16:09
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rakhmerov#action rakhmerov, others: review and discuss Lingxian's proposal about removing wf_trace module16:09
rakhmerov3. rakhmerov: check Winson's info about deadlocks occurring in scheduler16:10
rakhmerovthere's really a problem there, I'm about to start working on it16:10
rakhmerov#action rakhmerov: start working on deadlock problem in scheduler16:10
dziminehi, sorry I'm late.16:10
rakhmerovhi dzimine!16:10
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LimorStotlandrakhmerov  : do you know what the problem already?16:11
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rakhmerovnope, I have only assumptions16:11
rakhmerovthey need to be checked16:11
rakhmerov4. m4dcoder: send conf files for Mistral and Postgres to investigate deadlocks in scheduler16:11
rakhmerov5. rakhmerov: create a BP to make Mistral work with qpid behind oslo.messaging16:11
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rakhmerovand 6. xylan_kong, m4dcoder, NikolayM, LimorStotland: send a list of desired BPs and bugs for Liberty-2 so that we could plan16:12
xylan_kongsorry for chipping in, for yaql, you may take a look at
rakhmerovbasically done16:12
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rakhmerovxylan_kong: yes, it's being figured out16:12
xylan_kongrakhmerov: ok16:13
rakhmerovwill be solved tomorrow16:13
rakhmerovor today16:13
xylan_kongrakhmerov: good to know that16:13
NikolayMxylan_kong, yes, there a wrong yaql version is installed on devstack16:13
xylan_kongNikolayM: yep, i saw16:13
rakhmerov#action NikolayM, akuznetsova: finish fixing
rakhmerovok, let's move on16:14
rakhmerov#topic Current status (done last week, roadblocks etc.)16:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Current status (done last week, roadblocks etc.) (Meeting topic: Mistral)"16:14
rakhmerovlet's quickly report our statuses16:14
xylan_kongmy status: except review work, i wrote a spec for using oslo.log to substitude wf_trace module in openstack-dev; continue to work on service api implementation, see the series of patches
rakhmerovmy status: last week was mostly doing reviews and helping other team member, was also doing liberty-2 planning and corresponding meetings16:15
LimorStotlandmy status:  I am still on the puppet installation. i am having some issues with the db installation16:15
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[1]melishaI am working on BP and spec for cleaning DB scheduler16:15
m4dcoderI'll continue with the error-resume bp continuing with current solution to transition ERROR->RUNNING. i'll fix the unit test and resubmit the postgresql patch. i found a bug with last task being repeated when transition declare a non-existent task. i will file that shortly.16:16
rakhmerov[1]melisha: awesome, looking forward to see the spec16:16
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^Gal^I did some reviews and wrote a ui blueprint16:16
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NikolayMmy status: I am working on alternative RPC implementation (using kombu).16:17
noa_koffmanmy status: working on bug 1467969, writing tests16:17
openstackbug 1467969 in Mistral "Error in start_workflow call inside periodic modules" [High,In progress] - Assigned to noa (noa-koffman)16:17
xylan_kongnoa_koffman: please see my comments16:17
xylan_kongmaybe helpful to you16:17
rakhmerovok, anyone else?16:18
noa_koffmanok thanks16:18
rakhmerovI think everyone did16:18
rakhmerovthanks a lot16:18
rakhmerovtoday I mostly wanted to talk about Mistral Dashboard because a number of people decided to help with it last week (more over, on the same day!)16:20
rakhmerov#topic Mistral Dashboard plans and blueprints16:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Mistral Dashboard plans and blueprints (Meeting topic: Mistral)"16:20
^Gal^yey :) dashboard ftw!16:20
rakhmerovyeah :)16:20
rakhmerovso I'd like to outline quickly the plan on UI16:20
rakhmerovand discuss what we think are the most important things that we need to achieve in a short term for UI16:21
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^Gal^what are your views regarding AngularJS development?16:21
rakhmerovwhat do you mean specifically?16:22
^Gal^regarding dashboard implementation16:22
rakhmerovyou mean "Do we need to use AngularJS or not?"?16:23
[1]melisharakhmerov: Old Horizon code was written using Django framework. All new modules should be written in AngularJS16:23
^Gal^that is correct16:23
xylan_kongyes, i heard from zhenguo16:23
rakhmerovok, looks like you know much more about it :)16:23
^Gal^cool :)16:24
rakhmerovI don't have any opinion on that except I saw AngularJS a little bit and it seems like a good stuff16:24
^Gal^yeah it's a great framework16:24
rakhmerovbut it may be a matter of taste though..16:24
^Gal^it'll be perfect for openstack16:24
rakhmerovgreat )16:24
xylan_kongit's a trend :-)16:25
^Gal^it is :) but a good one16:25
rakhmerovso then I guess it's not even what we need to discuss if it's already decided16:25
^Gal^I use it daily16:25
rakhmerovor there's something that's not clear there?16:25
^Gal^nah, just wanted to get your view and approval16:25
rakhmerovI see16:26
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rakhmerovjust to be clear: I know very little about Horizon so don't have an expert opinion16:26
^Gal^oh ok, np16:26
rakhmerovand this is why I'm so glad you joined and are ready to help with it16:26
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^Gal^sure :) np16:27
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rakhmerovso specifically on Mistral16:27
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rakhmerovcurrently we have
rakhmerovto CRUDify all Mistral entities exposed via API16:27
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rakhmerovthe current state is that we have not all of them CRUDified16:27
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rakhmerovonly workflows, executions (wf executions), tasks (task executions), workbooks16:28
rakhmerovwe also need to add action executions, action definitions, cron triggers, environments16:28
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rakhmerovand even existing are pretty obsolete16:29
xylan_kongrakhmerov: what's more, maybe services :-)16:29
[1]melisharakhmerov: We checked the executions screen and it does not work at all. Even listing existing executions is not working propertly. Gal's BP will fix it16:29
rakhmerovone more BP is registered today by ^Gal^:
rakhmerovxylan_kong: yes, right. I was just talking about really short term16:29
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rakhmerov[1]melisha: yeah-yeah, you're right16:30
rakhmerovso zhenguo from Huawei already started repairing UI but it's not repaired on 100% yet16:30
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rakhmerovso I see that our primary short term goal is to simply CRUDify everything16:31
rakhmerovw/o any advanced features16:31
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rakhmerovjust so that Mistral UI has feature parity with Mistral CLI16:31
[1]melisharakhmerov: I agree. We just need to split the work so we won't do duplicate work and won't mess up things to each other16:32
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rakhmerovfor that to do we got a suggestion from Alcatel folks to register individual BPs for each entity16:32
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rakhmerov[1]melisha: yes, right16:32
[1]melisharakhmerov: We will be able to allocate 2 UI developers for this purpose16:32
rakhmerovvery cool16:33
rakhmerovI couldn't even dream about it just a week ago )16:33
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xylan_kongso it's a pity zhenguo is not here now, he really devote himself to that work, and he has a lot of ideas about our UI. hope we could coorperate very well16:34
rakhmerov[1]melisha: you mentioned that you can file all required BPs under
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rakhmerovcan you still do that?16:34
rakhmerovor ^Gal^16:34
[1]melisharakhmerov: Yes. Just let's approve the Executions BP first so we will have a good reference for all others16:35
rakhmerovbtw, zhenguo is already working on "Workflows" view now so that we can reuse his code to complete others16:35
rakhmerov[1]melisha: yes, ok, no problem16:35
xylan_kongrakhmerov: for UI work, i suggest we use etherpad to sync with each other to avoid duplicate work16:36
^Gal^I wonder if he uses AngularJS or django16:36
^Gal^yeah, we sure should16:36
rakhmerov#action rakhmerov, xylan_kong, NikolayM: review BP on Tue16:36
rakhmerovxylan_kong: sure, I'll create an etherpad16:36
xylan_kongrakhmerov: seems you're very busy :-)16:37
^Gal^lol that was quick16:37
rakhmerovlet's use it to gather all our ideas there16:37
rakhmerovxylan_kong: everyone's busy I guess16:38
rakhmerovok, do you guys have to say anything else in addition?16:38
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rakhmerovfor it looks pretty clear at the high level, I think we just need to get into the battle as soon as possible16:39
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rakhmerovand work with details16:39
xylan_kongsounds exciting16:39
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rakhmerov^Gal^: btw, please try to communicate with zhenguo directly at #openstack-mistral so that you know better each other's status16:40
^Gal^will do, tnx16:40
rakhmerovbtw, [1]melisha: do you know who else is going to contribute into UI from your side except ^Gal^?16:41
^Gal^yeah, Liat Fried16:41
^Gal^a fellow developer16:41
[1]melishaShe is just now starting the process of registering and contirbuting16:41
rakhmerovI just need to know the pool of UI developers now :)16:41
rakhmerovbecause looks like we have a bunch of them all of a sudden )16:42
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rakhmerov[1]melisha: that's fine16:42
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rakhmerovwell, to be serious: we seem to have 3 UI engineers and 1 more wants to join16:43
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rakhmerovone more thing on UI16:43
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rakhmerovwe also touched a topic related to Workbook Builder based on Merlin framework that's currently being built by Timur Sufief (tsufiev) and others16:44
rakhmerovso just FYI: Workbook Builder is an advanced mechanism that allows to build new workflows easier16:44
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rakhmerovhe provides web UI based "rails" for new workflows: validation, content assist etc.16:45
rakhmerovWB builder is now in a POC state (was demonstrated in Vancouver first) and tsufiev is now working on integrating it into Mistral Dashboard16:46
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rakhmerovit makes sense for you to look at the existing materials on Merlin and Mistral WB Builder and:16:46
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rakhmerov1. Leave your feedback on the idea itself (whether it's worth efforts or not, what can be improved etc.)16:47
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rakhmerov2. See if you can help with it because the whole initiative is suffering from the lack of resources even though, IMO, the idea is very good, it just requires a good accurate implementation16:48
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rakhmerovfrom my side: I need to help with communication between you, tsufiev and whoever else needed16:49
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rakhmerovand provide all initial links16:49
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xylan_kongrakhmerov: ok, i'll forward to zhenguo16:49
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rakhmerov#action rakhmerov, tsufiev: provide all initial links on Merlin and Workbook Builder16:50
rakhmerovxylan_kong: thanks, appreciate16:50
xylan_kongnp :-)16:50
rakhmerovany question about that?16:50
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rakhmerovi guess there will be a lot when you look at it16:50
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rakhmerovso my plan was to start with WB builder actively in Liberty-316:51
rakhmerovin Liberty 2 we need to get CRUD stuff done at least16:51
[1]melisharakhmerov: We will look at it and try to give our feedback on the workflow builder. It will be easier to work on it once it is part of mistral-dashboard16:52
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[1]melisharakhmerov: We also hope to finish CRUD stuff in Liberty-216:52
rakhmerovyes, right, I actually forgot to mention that it's not a part of Mistral UI now, it's a separate stuff16:52
rakhmerovwe will16:52
rakhmerovso as far as WB builder that will the task #1 for it: to get it integrated into Mistral Dashboard16:53
rakhmerov#action rakhmerov: make sure to create a BP about integrating WB Builder into Mistral Dashboard project16:53
rakhmerovso and the last thing I wanted to mention is what I now call "Management console16:54
rakhmerovxylan_kong already started working on it, right?16:54
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xylan_kongrakhmerov: yes16:54
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xylan_kongrakhmerov: code is on review16:54
rakhmerovhe initially wanted to have a UI in Mistral to manage/monitor executors' state in the system16:55
rakhmerovbut as far as I understand you are now working on more general idea, right?16:55
rakhmerovincluding not only executors but also other components16:55
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xylan_kongrakhmerov:  yes, we get all the services info through api16:55
rakhmerov(sorry, I didn't review your code yet)16:55
xylan_kongalthough only serivce type and servic name for now16:56
[1]melisharakhmerov, xylan_kong: Sounds very cool16:56
rakhmerovso [1]melisha: please also get involved in it and review Lingxian's patches16:56
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[1]melisharakhmerov: Will do.16:56
rakhmerovI think once we've done with it it'll be a very useful stuff16:56
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[1]melisha#action [1]melisha: review Lingxian's patches16:57
rakhmerovfor example, it would be cool if we could see usage statistics for executors16:57
rakhmerovlike average actions per unit of time16:57
rakhmerovetc. etc.16:57
xylan_kongrakhmerov:  good idear16:58
rakhmerovwe could even manage some configuration params on the fly and relaunch those components16:58
rakhmerovso the whole lot of ideas16:58
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rakhmerovbasically we could manage physical components of Mistral16:59
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rakhmerovyeah, ok. I'm glad that we're all now more aware of the plans and the current status16:59
rakhmerova lot of exciting work ahead :)16:59
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rakhmerovso it's time to shut down the meeting17:00
rakhmerovmany thanks to all you guys for coming today :)17:00
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^Gal^bye all - have a great week17:00
NikolayMbye everyone!17:00
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LimorStotlandgoodbye all17:00
xylan_kongthanks rakhmerov for holding17:00
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rakhmerovplease go to our channel #openstack-mistral, see you there tomorrow17:00
xylan_kongsee you17:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:01
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 17:01:00 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:01
openstackMinutes (text):
davidlenwell#startmeeting akanda17:01
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 17:01:10 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is davidlenwell. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:01
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'akanda'17:01
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davidlenwellSean is on a fishing trip with his brother today.. He's asked me to run the meeting.17:03
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davidlenwellWe also have several other members out today.. I don't feel like we can accomplish mush with just markmcclain and /me ..17:08
rluethiyou guys are an hour early and hijacked our slot :-/.17:08
davidlenwellsorry about that!17:08
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:09
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 17:09:08 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:09
openstackMinutes (text):
rluethimatjazp: are you going to chair?17:09
matjazp#startmeeting training_guides17:10
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 17:10:15 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is matjazp. Information about MeetBot at
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openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:10
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: training_guides)"17:10
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matjazproll call17:10
* rluethi hears crickets chirping17:11
matjazpI was a bit surprised, I thought you guys postponed the meeting time17:11
matjazppranav just said he can't make it17:11
rluethimatjazp: I was surprised, too :-)17:11
rluethiI knew there was talk of changing the slot, but I don't think anything has been agreed on.17:12
matjazpyou know if sayali will be comming?17:12
rluethino idea.17:12
rluethiisn't she travelling?17:12
rluethior was that last week?17:12
* rluethi shrugs17:13
matjazpanyhow, lets just look at the agenda..17:13
matjazpoh, a standard one :)17:13
rluethiyeah, let's :-)17:13
matjazp#topic reviews17:13
*** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: training_guides)"17:13
matjazppranav submitted a patch for tox that publishes training guides in the drafts17:14
rluethiI didn't see that. Lemme check.17:14
matjazphe still needs to polish it a bit, he has a typo and maybe he should also insert a associate guide folder17:14
matjazpnow you can just click in the gate and you can see the training guides slides17:15
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rluethiwhich gate?17:16
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matjazpit will be easier to review content17:17
rluethinot obvious for newcomers, but very cool for those who know the trick.17:18
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matjazpwell it's the standard way of publishing drafts for the whole docs project17:18
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rluethiI always thought something like this should exist, but I didn't know that it did.17:19
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matjazpwhat do you think, do we need to add "associate-guide" or "associate" folder?17:20
matjazpwe will need it later, so maybe we can add it now17:20
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rluethiyes, I was about to add a comment agreeing with you.17:20
matjazplater= when we add content for developer guide and operator guide17:21
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matjazpis there anything new about labs?17:22
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rluethinot really, we were busy celebrating the latest bug fix :-).17:23
rluethithere was some planning for the future.17:23
rluethipranav and sayali worked on the python port.17:23
rluethiI wanted to port my KVM backend to master, but it takes more time than I currently have.17:24
matjazpI know taht we discussed this already a few times, but I stil think that maybe vagrant could be a good option... it has MANY providers already (KVM, vBox, OpenStack, etc.)17:24
matjazpso you have KVM bash port and there's also a python/KVM labs port?17:25
rluethiI hacked together a KVM backend for osbash, but it's only a PoC (i.e. breaks the virtualbox code) and needs work.17:26
rluethipython is also at PoC stage.17:27
rluethithe problem with vagrant is that it's a pretty substantial dependency.17:27
rluethisomething we've been trying to avoid.17:27
rluethiso it would be an alternative, not a replacement.17:28
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matjazprluethi: yes, it is, but it also solves some major pain point we have17:28
rluethithat would mean we maintain yet another backend.17:28
matjazpeg. different providers17:28
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matjazpI'm experimenting a bit with KVM backend and multinode devstack with vagrant17:30
rluethimaybe. I am skeptical. I like vagrant, don't get me wrong, but right now osbash is much easier to use than setting up vagrant.17:30
matjazprluethi: for developer's guide labs, we will probably need devstack too, not just install form packages17:31
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rluethiwell, devstack already does that, doesn't it?17:32
matjazpanyway, I just remembered about all that stuff we already discussed when I needed to reboot machine during provisioning17:32
matjazprluethi: yes, but it is much easier to install multinode devstack with vagrant17:33
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rluethiI'll take your word for it.17:33
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matjazpand for some things, you need multinode, allin-one is not enough (eg. showing scheduling, networking, etc17:33
rluethiI wonder if we could leverage the devstack code instead of vagrant.17:34
rluethiwe do have a multinode setup, what we don't have is the install from git repos.17:34
matjazposbash that calls devstack directly? maybe17:35
matjazpit would preserve osbash workflow17:36
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matjazpbut back to reviews... thats it, right?17:36
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rluethiwe're done.17:36
matjazp#topic any other business17:37
*** openstack changes topic to "any other business (Meeting topic: training_guides)"17:37
matjazpI'm just curious, would you prefer the meeting an hour or two later?17:38
rluethinot really.17:38
rluethifor me it's alright.17:38
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matjazpand others? Is the only problem Monday, or is it also the time slot?17:39
rluethii will let others decide and try to be there for the meeting if I can.17:39
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rluethiI dunno.17:39
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rluethiI was curious about that, too, and I expected to read more on the mailing list, but there was nothing. zilch. nada.17:40
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matjazphmm... you have anything else?17:41
rluethinope. I'm good.17:41
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rluethiwrap up.17:41
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matjazpok, so let's wrap this17:41
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:42
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 17:42:04 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:42
openstackMinutes (text):
rluethithanks for chairing :-)17:42
vigneshvarsee ya. bye17:42
rluethihey, vigneshvar, didn't see you there.17:42
matjazpoh, vigneshvar, I missed you at roll call...17:42
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rluethibe louder next time, please.17:42
vigneshvari was late. sure17:42
rluethihave a good week, everyone.17:43
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matjazpsee you next monday... if we don't change the time slot or it doesn't get hijacked ;)17:43
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* davidlenwell is sorry for the mixup 17:56
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davidlenwell#startmeeting akanda18:01
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 18:01:07 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is davidlenwell. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.18:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: akanda)"18:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'akanda'18:01
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davidlenwellSean and adam are out today..18:02
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davidlenwellthis is the slated agenda
markmcclainhi again18:02
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davidlenwellsorry about the scheduling mixup18:02
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davidlenwellwe'll give it a few minutes to see if anyone else is here.18:04
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davidlenwellI move that we defer this meeting for lack of attendance.18:06
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davidlenwellany objections?18:07
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davidlenwellokay .. lets pick this up next week when less folks are on vacation/out18:09
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"18:10
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 18:10:07 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)18:10
openstackMinutes (text):
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Shamailhi geoffarnold18:59
geoffarnoldgood morning (just)18:59
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Shamailhi Rockyg18:59
ShamailThanks for arranging the mid-cycle18:59
geoffarnoldMy pleasure18:59
Rockygjust morning or just good?19:00
ShamailHi MeganR19:00
MeganRHi Shamail19:00
cloudrancherHi y'all19:00
geoffarnoldjust morning... oops, afternoon19:00
barrett1Hi All19:00
ShamailHi cloudrancher, Arkady_Kanevsky19:00
ShamailHi barrett119:00
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barrett1Looks like the gangs all here, let's get going!19:00
barrett1#startmeeting Product Working Group19:01
ShamailDallas in August... bring t-shirts.19:01
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 19:01:00 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is barrett1. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:01
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'product_working_group'19:01
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barrett1Let's start will roll call, for the record.19:01
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barrett11st agenda item is Tokyo Session Proposals19:02
barrett1#topic Tokyo Session Proposals19:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Tokyo Session Proposals (Meeting topic: Product Working Group)"19:02
barrett1You can find the google doc at the link.19:03
ShamailI have a few questions...19:03
barrett1Go for it19:03
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Shamail1) Are the two that I proposed ones that the team wants to move forward with?  Any questions on the concepts?19:03
Shamail2) Anyone else want to volunteer to co-present/create material19:04
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Shamail3) Do we want to at least add one more session that we can use to show PTL support?  A follow-up to state of PM if you will.19:04
ShamailEnd of my list :)19:04
geoffarnoldInteresting q. I was thinking of two possible additions (1) at the PTL interface, (2) at the user WG interface19:05
jimhaselmaierRe Shamail's #2:  I'd be more than willing to be a co-presenter on the "Contributing as an OpenStack User" topic.19:05
Shamailgeoffarnold: I was hoping session #2 would cover user WG interface19:05
barrett1Shamail: I added a working session for this team, meant to be similar to Thursday's meeting in Vancover.19:05
Shamailalong with which work groups exists, user story template, repo submission instructions etc19:06
ShamailThanks barrett1!19:06
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ShamailThanks jimhaselmaier19:06
ShamailAnyone willing to co-present roadmap?  Should I reach out on the mailing list instead?19:06
geoffarnoldOK, as long as there's a rep from a user group to talk about their experience of the interface19:06
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barrett1Shamail - I'll join you for What's Next on the Roadmap session and content prep19:06
geoffarnoldOf course with Win The Enterprise we have that covered19:07
RockygRoadmap title needs to be xexxed up19:07
Shamailgeoffarnold: user WG = user committee right?  I just want to make sure we are talking about the same thing19:07
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ShamailAgreed Rockyg, definitely need to re-work both title and abstract19:07
mscohensorry, late to the party. i’m happy to help with the roadmap presentation as well19:07
geoffarnoldyes - well, user committee and/or vertical19:07
Shamailthanks geoffarnold19:07
Shamailwelcome mscohen and thanks.19:07
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barrett1Shamail: I'm not following the PTL thread...?19:08
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MeganRShamail: I am happy to help with the presentation, not certain if I'll be available to help with the presenting part.19:08
ShamailWe had spoken about doing a session where we would ask PTL(s) to get on stage with Product WG19:08
Shamailto discuss how this WG/process is meaningful/helpful to their design cycles19:08
RockygMe too.  I can present19:08
ShamailMeganR: which one?  #2?19:09
MeganRsorry - yes, #219:09
ShamailMeganR: Thanks19:09
geoffarnoldRight. People understand how PTLs operate (well.....), so they need to understand how PTLs consume our work19:09
barrett1Shamail - Gotcha, it's the process part of things where we want to include PTLs and User Committee folks (though from the email thread, I'm not sure this makes sense)19:09
RockygHow we glue the two together19:10
barrett1rockyg: gotcha19:10
ShamailAh, process part we can discuss next week (when workflow is further along)19:10
ShamailSo we don't need a session anymore to have P-WG and PTLs on-stage together?19:10
geoffarnoldNot all together19:11
ShamailThe high-level jist will be covered in #2 anyway19:11
barrett1Shamail: I think we do want to have a session that talks about how User Stories are created, posted, reviewed and feed into Design Summits19:11
ShamailYes, that is #219:11
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barrett1Shamail: Understand..think that's where we want the PTLs, User Committee participation19:12
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ShamailTo expand on #2: It will provide an overview of UC, the WGs that exist currently (to let users know others share their interest and hopefully spark additional members), overview of user story template, our repo (how to contribute), and how the process works to get their user stories to the devs19:12
ShamailGot it... I'll make sure to reach out to UC and a few PTLs so they can be there and provide a quote or two.19:13
jimhaselmaierI hope we can get at least one PTL to participate in that session.19:13
jimhaselmaierIt will be so much more powerful if we do.19:13
ShamailI think johnthetubaguy has already expressed support/interest... I will follow-up with him.19:13
barrett1Shamail: +119:14
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barrett1Anything else on Tokyo Sessions?19:14
ShamailIs there one that we mentioned but didnt document?19:14
ShamailCan everyone take a quick look at the spreadsheet and see we got everything before we move on please?  We will have to work on submission this week.19:15
RockygWe'll think about it.  We still have time but need to start on these19:15
ShamailThanks barrett1, I think we are done with this topic.19:15
barrett1Shamail: I'll write up the submission for #1, if you want... Are you going to write-up #2?19:16
ShamailSure.  Sounds like a plan barrett119:16
barrett1#action: Carol to draft submission for Session #119:16
mscohenbarrett1.  happy to help on #1 if you’d like (or i can just review)19:17
barrett1#action Shamail to draft submission for session #219:17
barrett1mscohen: Great!19:17
RockygI can help on 319:17
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barrett1RockyG: Thanks19:17
barrett1#topic User Story Repo Update19:18
*** openstack changes topic to "User Story Repo Update (Meeting topic: Product Working Group)"19:18
barrett1Rocky - Can you give folks an update on this?19:18
barrett1Or Sean19:18
RockygSo, the reviews have been filed, but I need to update the one for infra (repository creation).19:18
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Rockygand, I want to put forth this idea:  it seems it would be easier for us to be a "project" as the Product working Group because the repositories are all tied to projects19:19
RockygSo, if that's ok, I'll modify the review commit message to TC for that19:19
ShamailRockyg: I read the comments by ttx19:20
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RockygDid I mention I hate git?  Gotta amend the infra files, but git merges backward from what I consider intuitive, so my local repository is all messed up.  I'll get Doug Hellmann to help straighten it out.19:21
ShamailIt seems that he was saying if we want to be under TC, we should consider applying as a project OR we can add the repo to the existing user committee file.19:21
RockygShamail: Oh, haven't seen theirs yet19:21
RockygKewl.  So, how do we want to go?19:21
barrett1Shamail: Thanks19:21
ShamailThe question I have is can we have openstack repos under UC?19:22
ShamailIf so then my vote would be going that route (since we are already aligning with UC)19:22
ShamailIf not then we might want to consider a project proposal....19:22
ShamailI think the repo should be under "openstack" and not "stackforge" to help it be perceived as more official.19:22
barrett1I've been assuming that the Operators Tag info would be posted under the User Committee...19:23
sgordoni assume you can19:23
sgordonotherwise they wouldnt be in governance19:23
RockygOh, we've appliled under openstack, with it to reside at openstack/openstack-user-stories19:23
barrett1Agree with openstack instead of stackforge19:23
sgordonthe stackforge repos are handled separately atm19:23
Shamailsgordon: true19:23
Rockygstackforge is going away19:23
sgordon(that is why you wont find telco in that governance repo)19:23
Shamailthanks sgordon19:23
Shamaildidn't know that Rockyg19:23
sgordonif by going away19:24
barrett1sgordon: What repo does the telco wg use?19:24
sgordonyou mean most things will become openstack namespaced19:24
sgordonthen yes19:24
Rockyginfra is trying to  get rid of it and have a review up.19:24
sgordongoing away is a bit incendiary ;)19:24
geoffarnoldThe big tent is getting VERY big19:24
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RockygThey want everyone interested to just migrate to OpenStack.  and if not, to find another host.19:24
ShamailSo Rockyg, if we can talk to UC and get an openstack repo added for user-stories under their file then that's ideal19:24
sgordonbarrett1, per the link - on stackforge19:24
Shamailif not then we might have to make a case for a separate file/project19:25
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geoffarnoldIt's not a bad way to weed out the moribund projects, though19:25
RockygI'll contact a few UC folks and ask them to be at the TC meeting tomorrow.19:25
ShamailRockyg: You're on the agenda tomorrow for the TC meeting to discuss this19:25
RockygThen we can get it done tomorrow.19:25
ShamailAwesome, thanks Rockyg19:25
Rockygfirgured I would be;-)19:25
barrett1Thanks Rockyg19:26
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barrett1One Q: do we want to wait for the repo to be created to post, review & comment on User Stories? Or do we want to use a temp location to get going on this part of things?19:27
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MeganRwill there be any difference between a temp location and the repo?19:27
MeganRdon't want to create additional work19:28
RockygIf we use a temp location, then we'd have to migrate.  If you're ok with moving the files without the histories, that would be easy.19:28
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RockygOh, and if we become a project, or go under UC, we still need a Lanuchpad site.19:28
geoffarnoldNeed that either way19:28
sgordonbarrett1, depends what your proposal for a temp location is19:28
barrett1Rockyg: I think that's the basic challenge, tracking comments aside from the gerrit system19:28
RockygI can get that started as soon as the TC vote.  It will inform us where to build the LP site19:28
Shamailbarrett1: I think that is the main question: do we want history?19:28
sgordonbarrett1, we found with the telco stuff most other solutions become unweildy19:28
sgordonas you need version control and comment tracking19:29
barrett1sgordon: google docs directory - but open to other options19:29
Arkady_Kanevskydo we have a pointer to a template for usecases? to review and vote on the format?19:29
Shamailsgordon: +119:29
Rockygsgordon: good info19:29
ShamailThat is one of the topics later today Arkady_Kanevsky19:29
sgordonthat is what made us explore gerrit19:29
Arkady_KanevskyI have a simple usecase I got from Vancouver I would like to use for test drive.19:29
sgordonas we were quickly going insane19:29
barrett1Ok, sounds like waiting for the repo is the way to go19:30
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Arkady_Kanevsky+1 on gerrit19:30
barrett1I'm just watching time go by... our original plan was to complete the prioritization by July 8...19:30
geoffarnoldTo get people to move from stackforge there will have to be tools that preserve history. So we can go for stackforge now and wait for the tools.....19:31
geoffarnoldI'm not moving my project until the tools exist19:31
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sgordongeoffarnold, indeed - it will be if thousands of voices cried out at once and were suddenly silenced... ;p19:32
Shamailthat's a good idea geoffarnold19:32
geoffarnoldWaiting for a controversial decision with no natural deadline seems risky19:32
ShamailStart w/ StackForge and move to OpenStack once the new repo is available.  We can keep the old one for history until migration tools exist.19:32
barrett1geoffarnold: Has someone committed to creating the tools?19:32
Shamailessentially, our stackforge will become archive once openstack repo is up.19:32
geoffarnoldNot yet. But then they haven't committed to the mandatory move yet, AFAIK19:33
Rockyggeoffarnold: so, the repo can be up within a day of the TC vote if there is no repository to move from Stackforge.  If a move is required, they have to schedule it for a weekend.19:33
sgordoni cant actually find the patch proposal19:33
sgordonand there are in fact new project requests in the review queue still19:33
barrett1Rockyg: the TC vote is for a stackforge repo?19:34
Arkady_Kanevskycan you post a pointer to stackforge repos?19:34
geoffarnoldThere are LOTS of them19:34
RockygNo TC needed for stackforge.  TC vote tomorrow for OpenStack19:34
sgordonhere is the proposal for stackforge going away
ShamailHow about we wait until Wednesday (after TC meeting)?19:34
sgordonnot exactly unanimous just yet ;p19:34
barrett1Rockyg: Thanks. How about you send out an update on the ML after the TC meeting and give folks a pointer to where they can post?19:35
ShamailIf there is no progress on actual repo then we proceed with stackforge for now19:35
geoffarnoldHmmm  Even more -1's than the last time I looked19:35
Arkady_Kanevskyno product repo there19:35
Rockygbarrett1: will do.  And if it's under the UC, it will be even easier to get the rest done.19:35
barrett1#action Rockgy to send out an update on Repo after TC meeting on the 7th19:35
Arkady_KanevskySee telcowg19:36
barrett1Thanks Rockyg19:36
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barrett1Anything else on this topic?19:36
barrett1Ok moving along19:37
barrett1#topic Taxonomy & User Story Template19:37
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barrett1Shamail - pls take it away!19:37
ShamailLet's discuss the user story template first... I posted some ideas to the ML and got great feedback from sgordon.19:38
ShamailI didn't realize that telco had an updated template and it looks like the new template aligns better to the sections that we would want to use as well.19:38
sgordoni believe the revision was after the ops midcycle19:38
ShamailMy take-away from the discussion on the ML is that product WG is aiming to create a normalized template for capturing user stories but certain WG (e.g. telco) might have additional details that are needed due to the complexity of the space/apps they are dealing with.  In this sense, sgordon raised the question of whether something would be getting lost if telco-wg submits user stories to product-wg.19:38
ShamailIt looks good :)19:38
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ShamailThe main dilemma is how do we normalize (because not all WGs will have the same amount of detail as a telco-wg user story) while accommodating groups that have additional information.19:38
ShamailUpdated Proposal:  Can we use the new telco-wg template and make sections that might constitute too much detail as optional.  This will allow teams to add a minimum amount while other teams can add more details (and not have them get lost as we move the user story forward).  Can we still add meta-data fields as mentioned in ML to track WGs supporting the user story and rename some items (e.g. rename examples19:38
Shamailto scenarios)?  If this sounds reasonable, I can craft another ML reply with more details about this updated proposal.19:38
sgordonindeed, that is what i am getting at19:39
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sgordontelco happens to have a template19:39
sgordonproduct wg will have a template which will likely be loosely aligned19:39
ShamailThe template fits well sgordon, does the updated proposal sound like a good compromise?19:39
sgordonbut we will invariably have some differences19:39
sgordonyes, i also took a note that i need to make it clearer they are optional in the telco template19:39
ShamailEssentially, we leverage the same template as you (I will be asking for certain sections to be renamed) but then make most of the more detailed sections optional19:39
sgordonso thats all good19:39
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sgordonnext question is if we have other WGs engaged to do same19:40
Arkady_Kanevskywe need a section on known project impacted/requierd for the usecase19:40
barrett1Shamail: I like the updated proposal. Having a common format would make it easier for all of us.19:40
Arkady_Kanevsky+1 on common format19:40
ShamailThat will be a part of the "gaps" sections but maybe its a separate section altogether19:40
ShamailWe basically leave gaps as is and add "Projects Impacted"19:41
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Arkady_Kanevskystrongly recommend that we us standard openstrack process to submit format proposal and review/vote on it19:41
barrett1sgordon: do you know if other wgs are drafting user stories?19:41
ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: +1 thats the plan19:41
RockygShamail: so the telco case is the reason I originally thought we needed WG subdirs19:41
Arkady_KanevskyBut we need one for our group not telco one.19:41
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sgordonbarrett1, negative19:41
Arkady_KanevskyWe do not them or us to be confused what we are rvewing and asking to change. We are no asking to change teloc format19:41
RockygBut, if we link to the WG repos, then we bring *together* the parts that cross WGs19:41
jimhaselmaierI'm a little concerned about Product WG specifying projects impacted.  The projects, in some cases, may know better what is impacted.19:42
ShamailRockyg: If we can get everyone on the same format then we can get other teams to support the same user story.  The reason I was against seperate dirs is because then if telco and enterprise share a user story19:42
Shamailthey will be forced to submit two different files for the same story (because they will land in diff. dirs)19:42
geoffarnold+1 Shamail19:42
Shamailjimhaselmaier: this is high-level... e.g. nova, cinder, glance, etc.19:42
Arkady_KanevskyWe are not speciyfing. We arsk asking submitter ot use case to list project he/she knows about that are/willbe impcated by the use case19:42
jimhaselmaierI don't have a problem having impacted projects in our Use Case template, but determining which projects are impacted needs some project assessment I would think.19:42
RockygRight.  Which is addressed by just linking to the WGs' repos and creating a "merged" story19:42
ShamailIt is so the teams know which projects they need to contact INITIALLY.  The project team could redirect us after hearing the user story.19:43
geoffarnoldThe user stories will often be cross-project, though - can't align with existing OpenStack projects19:43
jimhaselmaier@Shamail:  Got it.19:43
ShamailRockyg: If they are using the same format then what value will dirs provide?  It just increases the number of steps to create a merged user story.19:43
geoffarnoldE.g. service federation touch identity, quotas, policy....19:43
Arkady_KanevskyI think it will be to use to generate blueprint(s) for peoject based on use case once it is voted in19:44
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ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: This brings up a good point about the workflow we have to discuss19:44
RockygShamail:  i'm also saying no dirs.  The already exist.  The other WG's repos *are*those dirs19:44
ShamailRockyg: Ah, got it.19:44
Arkady_Kanevskygeoffarnold: which repo in sourceforge you are using for productWG usecase stories or proposals?19:45
ShamailRockyg: So you're saying that each WG get a folder in the repo... they work against that folder as their active location...19:45
ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: doesn't exist yet19:45
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ShamailI will move the updated proposal through the ML again.  Sounds good?19:45
geoffarnoldWhat shamail said - waiting to find out!19:46
Arkady_KanevskyRockyg: I suggest we do not have directories in our repo for other WG. we just create links in use case to bluepritns/ specs in outher projects19:46
ShamailWe can discuss the repo structure and workflow impact as a part of the workflow discussion.19:46
barrett1arkady_kanevsky: I'm using this directory to collect enterprise user stories right now:
RockygShamail: Actually, no.  Either they work in the general folder, as the Product_wg has set up, or if they have their own repo, they work there, and build a cross wg user story in the Product WG repo19:46
Arkady_KanevskyBarrett1 - thank you19:46
ShamailRockyg: I'll follow up with you on email to better understand.19:47
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ShamailCan you make a proposal that captures your thoughts and send it to the ML?19:47
RockygArkady_Kanevsky: What geoffarnold said:  There will most likely be cross-project spec that will lead to project specs and/or bps19:47
Shamailbarrett1: Can you give me an action item to send updated template proposal?19:47
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ShamailSo this is probably a good segue to taxonomy (as we are getting into cross project stuff)19:48
Arkady_Kanevskydo we go top down starting from use cases or bottom up from spec/blueprints per project?19:48
barrett1#action Shamail Create an updated proposal for Repo & User Stories and send out to ML19:48
RockygShamail: +1 on AI and talk19:48
ShamailPlease give Rockyg an AI too barrett1 :)19:48
barrett1Shamail: Gladly..19:48
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barrett1#action RockyG work with Shamail to send out an updated Repo plan that addresses cross WG and cross Project needs19:49
ShamailOkay, moving on to taxonomy which might help with this cross-project discussion we were just having...19:49
geoffarnoldArkady_Kanevsky strongly prefer top down19:49
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ShamailI have started creating the basis of a page that will eventually be on our wiki.19:49
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Rockyggeoffarnold: ++ top down19:50
ShamailI have gotten as far as explaining what the terms/hierarchy looks like in agile19:50
Arkady_Kanevskyme too in favor of top down starting from use case19:50
ShamailI will be working on mapping those terms to our stuff next19:50
ShamailIf you scroll to the bottom of that document that I linked. It has a starting proposal for how the requirements might be categorized/collected and what each contains19:51
ShamailAt the very top, we will have a theme19:51
Shamailthe theme, for us, will be definitions that we and the foundation have agreed upon.19:51
Arkady_Kanevskydo we need to classify use cases in into themes?19:52
ShamailSide note: The foundation is working to define themes too as they move to themes based releases.19:52
ShamailThey will want to work with us to make sure our themes and theirs are aligned.19:53
ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: Yes, but we need to define the themes first19:53
barrett1Arkday_Kanevsky: Yes19:53
ShamailSo after themes is the part that has a ? for me19:53
Arkady_Kanevskytheme will spend multiple releases.19:53
ShamailWe need to group user stories into epics...19:53
Arkady_KanevskyAnd with new tag process I am not usre what release is in this connotation.19:53
ShamailThemes will probably be very long-lived... epics will span releases.19:53
ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: +119:54
ShamailSo as far as epics are concerned, we can go two ways19:54
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Shamail1) We can take an approach (as mentioned by johnthetubaguy) and build epics based on service user types19:54
Shamaile.g.: 1 epic for cloud native19:54
Shamail1 epic for legacy19:54
Shamailsince the theme of "HA" would mean different things19:55
ShamailWe can use epics to define attributes of themes (e.g. controller HA, data plane HA, etc.)19:55
barrett15 min warning...19:55
Shamailand then map user stories to attributes19:55
Shamailthx barrett119:55
ShamailWhich way makes more sense?19:55
barrett1I like the Theme of HA with different epics beneath it...19:56
RockygI suspect we'll pick one, then modify as we learn more....19:56
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Arkady_Kanevskyboth rae having issues.19:56
RockygArkady_Kanevsky: ++19:56
Arkady_Kanevskyrae -> are19:56
cloudrancherSecond makes more sense to me19:56
Shamailthe user stories are simple -> they map to our files in the repo based on the templates...  Tasks in our sense would be blueprints (each task/blueprint will be in one project but a user story can have multiple tasks/blueprints spanning projects)19:56
geoffarnold+1 shamail19:56
ShamailThanks, so we'll proceed with documenting the second one first19:56
geoffarnold.... while remaining agile19:57
Shamailfinally, there is a notion of an acceptance test... which is broader than tempest but in our case its the best we can do.19:57
Rockyghigh level interrupt:  Just want to put out there that we get much more done on the phone than on IRC.  Just sayin'19:57
Arkady_Kanevskyit may sound crazy but maybe tagging for epic is a better way...19:57
ShamailWe want to ensure there are tests that span the user story to reduce gaps in coverage from the beginning.19:57
barrett1#action Shamail to document Theme/Epic/ User Story approach as starting point for M design summit pilot19:58
Arkady_Kanevskywhere do we put tests? Rally?19:58
ShamailArkady_Kanevsky: that might be the implementation.  We would still have to define what those tags mean... that is what I was intending to capture.19:58
barrett1RockyG: +119:58
ShamailRockyg: +119:58
Arkady_Kanevskyit does not fit into Tempest CI since it span multiple projects19:58
RockygShamail: It might be worth having a session with QA in the design summit about user oriented tests19:58
ShamailAfter I finish this document, we can schedule a call.19:58
ShamailRockyg: +119:58
RockygArkady_Kanevsky: scenario tests19:58
barrett1Do we want to add a voice line for next week's meeting?19:58
Shamailbarrett1: +119:58
Arkady_Kanevsky+1 on voice19:58
Rockygplease, please, please!19:58
ShamailCan we extend the time too?19:59
ShamailNext week, we will be at crunch time for multiple items19:59
RockygThe foundation has some sort of voice solution, too.19:59
barrett190 mins? or 2 hrs?19:59
Shamailstarting to review user stories, taxonomy, user template, sessions, etc.19:59
Shamailall will be at crit19:59
MeganRI have a voice bridge we can use if needed19:59
ShamailWhat is the teams vote?   I can do up to 2 hours.20:00
barrett1OK - Let's go with 2 hrs, and if some folks have to drop they will. I'll update the wiki with phone info too20:00
ShamailThanks barrett120:00
barrett1We're out of time....20:00
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Arkady_Kanevsky2 hours is fine20:00
ShamailPlease give feedback on the document I just shared too :)20:00
barrett1We'll use the ML to get ourselves set for a long working session for next week.20:00
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barrett1Thanks everyone!20:00
ShamailSorry for going over.20:00
geoffarnoldAnd before we go.... Mid-cycle: please update if you're participating20:00
barrett1Thanks Geoffarnold20:01
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openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 20:01:05 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)20:01
openstackMinutes (text):
Rockygthanks all!20:01
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mesteryhi neutron folks!20:59
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emaganahello all...20:59
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hoangcxHi all21:00
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mestery#startmeeting networking21:00
openstackMeeting started Mon Jul  6 21:00:37 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is mestery. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.21:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking)"21:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'networking'21:00
mestery#link Agenda21:00
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mesteryWe have an "On-Demand" heavy agenda today, so lets get rolling!21:00
mestery#topic Announcements21:01
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mesteryI actually have nothing huge to announce today, which is a first. Does anyone have an announcement for the team this week?21:01
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ZZelleHi everyone21:01
mesteryMust be the US holday weekend, lets move along21:02
mestery#topic Bugs21:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (Meeting topic: networking)"21:02
mesteryFirst up:21:02
openstackLaunchpad bug 1465434 in neutron "DVR issues with supporting multiple subnets per network on DVR routers - PortbindingContext does not have the status." [Critical,Confirmed] - Assigned to Swaminathan Vasudevan (swaminathan-vasudevan)21:02
mesterySwami: Any updates on the DVR issues plauging the gate?21:02
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mesteryLooks like the first patch for 1465434 needs some reivew love21:03
Swamimestery: I have a patch up for review and I will be pushing another one today. That would fix the problem that we are seeing now in upstream with respect to the tempest failure.21:03
mesterySwami: Excellent!21:03
mesterySwami: That's it, right?21:03
SwamiYes, once that patch goes in then we can make the job voting.21:04
mesteryAlso, once we get this fixed, lets monitor the DVR job very closely with the goal of getting it voting once it's stabilized21:04
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mesteryIt will prevent us from getting into this situation again once it's voting21:04
Swamimestery: Sure21:04
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mesterySwami: Thanks!21:05
mesteryNext up21:05
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openstackLaunchpad bug 1465837 in neutron "Linux bridge: Dnsmasq is being passed None as an interface" [Critical,New] - Assigned to Sean M. Collins (scollins)21:05
mesterysc68cal: How goes the Linuxbridge struggle?21:05
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mesterysc68cal: Is this one still Critical?21:06
mesteryAlso, for what it's worth for those following along in the linuxbridge saga:21:06
sc68calmestery: I think 1465837 can be de-escalated to medium21:07
mesterysc68cal: Cool, doing it!21:07
mesterysc68cal: Any other LB parity bugs you'd like to highlight here?21:07
sc68calNope, that tag has pretty much what we're seeing so far21:08
mesteryAny other bugs anyone wants to highlight? Those are the main ones I wanted to highlight this week21:08
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openstackLaunchpad bug 1471316 in neutron "_get_subnetpool_id does not return None when a cidr is specified and a subnetpool_id isn't." [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to John Davidge (john-davidge)21:09
john-davidgewould like to get some more eyes on that21:09
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john-davidgesome differing opinions so far on what is considered a breaking api chnages21:09
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mesteryjohn-davidge: I've marked it as "High" for now while we're investigating21:10
john-davidgemestery: thanks21:10
mesteryLets move along and see if emagana has any doc updates for us this week21:10
mestery#topic Docs21:10
*** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: networking)"21:10
emaganaHi mestery!21:10
mesteryemagana: Hi there! I hope you're getting some sleep now ;)21:10
emaganamestery: getting better....  ;-)21:11
emaganaLast Friday was holiday in USA so we did not have the Doc meeting... besides what I have already updated in the wiki.. got nothing else..21:11
emaganamestery: you can take this time for the rest of the agenda21:11
mesteryAwesome! I'll refer folks to the wiki for updates21:11
mestery#info Doc updates for this week on the wiki21:12
mesteryThanks emagana!21:12
mesteryOK, lets move along and try not to wake many more people up as we finish this thing21:12
mestery#topic ACLs for Neutron sub-projects21:12
*** openstack changes topic to "ACLs for Neutron sub-projects (Meeting topic: networking)"21:12
mesteryThe tl;dr here is that I'm proposing passing control of things like merge commits, tags, and releases to the OpenStack release team for ann Neutron sub-projects21:13
mesteryPlease review the patch series if you have interest here21:13
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dougwigmestery: i think it should just be a requirement of being in the neutron tent.  and if we haven't stated that, let's update the devref.21:13
mesteryMy thinking is that projects in the Neutron Stadium are under OpenStack governance, and this makes things more consistent, especially with regards to stable backports21:13
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russellbmestery: i assume you talked to thierry/doug about this (release team) ?21:13
mestery#action mestery to update devref with information on being in the tent21:13
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mesteryrussellb: I tried this morning, but got no response, but I added them to the review and will pign them during office horus tomorrow21:14
russellbotherwise seems fine ... it's so many that it might be good to have someone from neutron with access to all of that21:14
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Sukhdevdougwig: +1 for devref documentation21:14
mesteryrussellb: I am good with updating the team which can do this as people ahve interest21:14
russellbneutron release team or something, that works with global release team21:14
russellbanyway, intention all seems good21:15
mesterythanks russellb21:15
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mestery#topic Partial Upgrade Support21:16
*** openstack changes topic to "Partial Upgrade Support (Meeting topic: networking)"21:16
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mesteryarmax: You put this on the agenda, I know you sent an email, can you update the team?21:16
armaxmestery: sure21:16
mesteryI think this in reply/conjunction with russellb as well21:16
mesterythanks armax21:16
armaxI was hoping we could get some momentum back into this21:16
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russellbto be completely transparent, i was happy to whip up the patches to make a job that does the same thing as the nova job21:17
russellbbut if it requires a big rework to do it a new way, i'm not likely to do it21:17
russellbso anyone else interested should feel free to jump in21:18
mesteryI understand completely, thanks for jumping in on this russellb21:18
armaxmestery: this is the mail I sent this morning:21:18
russellbpatches i did are still up for review, but blocked basically21:18
dougwigthat was kinda dirty pool, IMO.21:18
armaxI tried to summarize the state of the union21:18
armaxit’d be good to get a sense from sdague on where we are21:18
mesteryI appreciate russellb and armax trying to move the ball forward here given the constraints21:18
mesteryarmax: Hopefully your ML post generates some discussion. Thanks for that.21:19
sc68calI think we're talking in -infra currently about some parts of that work21:19
armaxmestery: until we find a volunteer to work on adding multinode support to Grenade, then we’re in limbo21:19
mesteryarmax: Agreed21:19
mesterysc68cal: Thanks for keeping an eye on that21:19
sc68calthe main thing is if DVR is a component in the multinode grenade job21:19
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mesterysc68cal: For that to happen, we need Swami's fixes and a stable DVR itself21:20
sc68calmeaning is that the point of the job, or is a configuration without DVR sufficient just to test partial upgrades21:20
mestery*stable DVR job21:20
armaxsc68cal: that can be added at a later date, it can be just a config switch21:20
sc68caland then later enable DVR21:20
Swamimestery: yes I agree21:20
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armaxthe building blocks to wire everything together are there, afaik21:20
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mesteryYes, someone needs the Ikea instruction sheet to move forward at this point21:20
mesteryOK, lets move further discussion to the ML21:21
mestery#topic Flow Classifier Work21:21
*** openstack changes topic to "Flow Classifier Work (Meeting topic: networking)"21:21
mesteryvikram: Are you around?21:21
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mesteryOK, lets table that one for next week or Open Discussion in case vikram shows up21:22
mestery#topic Packet Logging API for Neutron21:23
openstackLaunchpad bug 1468366 in neutron "RFE - Packet logging API for Neutron" [Undecided,Confirmed] - Assigned to Yushiro FURUKAWA (y-furukawa-2)21:23
*** openstack changes topic to "Packet Logging API for Neutron (Meeting topic: networking)"21:23
mesteryI'm not sure who added this to the agenda to be honest21:23
hoangcxsc68cal: I got sc68cal explanation about the difference between our SG API and Amazon AWS in mailing list.21:23
mesteryhoangcx: Excellent!21:23
hoangcxSo I would like to continue discuss and get decision about which approach [support NEW packet logging API or extend current SG API] should be ok for approval?21:23
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hoangcxmestery: It is Yushiro. I am on behalf of Yushiro. He has a problem with his condition today :-(21:24
mesteryIf we're leaning towards not deviating from AWS, then it seems like the natural way forward is a new API21:24
hoangcxmestery: yeah. I think so. Thanks21:24
amotokiprecisely speaking, as sc68cal says, there is differences between neutron and aws sg Api, so I think we cannot make sg api fully compat.21:25
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hoangcxSo i will concentrate to support NEW logging API.21:25
ZZellehoangcx, it should also be coherent with ?21:25
sc68calmost of the differences are the attribute names21:25
amotokiimho we should keep the basic concept of SG api compat with aws.21:25
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sc68calbut the concepts are fairly, if not completely similar21:25
hoangcxZZelle: I will look on it. Thanks21:26
hoangcxamotoki: Thanks. I see.21:26
ZZellehoangcx, great21:26
amotokiat least we should not consider applying SG to a network like firewall :-)     I am not sure we need to keep all compat.21:26
mesteryamotoki: Point is well taken21:27
mestery#topic Open Discussion21:27
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: networking)"21:27
amotokiperhasp we don't have a consensus and more broader discussion seems needed.21:27
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mesteryamotoki: Lets iterate on the RFE bug for that21:28
amotokiyes. go ahead for open discussion21:28
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ajmillerI have two open discussion items:21:28
mesteryajmiller: Please, go ahead!21:29
mestery#link Flavor Framework review21:29
ajmiller^^Flavor framework patch.  madhu_ak has just fixed merged conflicts and it is in the check tests now.  We wold appreciate reviews on it, and feel it is ready21:29
mesteryajmiller: Ack on that, it would be good to get this one in. I encourage folks to review this ASAP21:29
mesteryThis slipped Kilo and would be ideal for Liberty21:30
ajmillerAlso FWaaS Use case discussion
ajmillerPlease read the use cases, comment, add as necessary!21:30
pc_mWould be nice to get review of RFE #link
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mesteryajmiller: That's a good one to bringup as well!21:30
dougwigit's worth noting that the fwaas use cases/api gap discussion will be happening at the services midcycle next week.21:30
pc_mCould use direction on three options proposed.21:31
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mestery#info FWaaS use case/API gap analysis at services midcycle next week21:31
mesterydougwig: Will you provide a way for remote participants to take part in this?21:31
s3wongdougwig: remote participation?21:32
mesterydougwig: Given a lot of people can't travel, this would be ideal if possible21:32
dougwigmestery: absolutely, if there's interest, which it sounds like there is.21:32
mestery#action dougwig to ensure remote vehicle for participation for FWaaS discussion next week21:32
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regXboican we get a link for the service midcycle into the minutes?21:32
mesterydougwig: ^^^21:33
russellbwhere's the meetup21:33
bloganyes seattle21:34
kevinbentonwhere is seattle?21:34
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Sukhdevkevinbenton: in Siberia :-)21:34
ajmillerSeattle - I'm looking for the link...21:35
bloganajmiller: ^^21:35
s3wongkevinbenton: where IS Seattle, or where IN Seattle?21:35
ajmillerHP office21:35
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ajmiller701 Pike St, Suite 900, corner of 7th and Pike21:35
mesteryIt's a wonderfully awesome office within a 30 minute train ride straight north FWIW21:36
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ajmillerWe are in an office tower attached to the Washington State Convention Center.  Details in the link mestery pasted21:36
ajmillerYes, anyone coming, don't bother renting a care.21:36
blogangood, no chance of getting towed21:36
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* kevinbenton thinks he planned his trip home poorly. missing seattle and the nova mid cycle...21:37
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mesterykevinbenton: For some definition of horrible, perhaps21:37
mesteryOK, thanks everyone!21:37
mesteryLets keep the train rolling towards Liberty-2 with a final touchdown near Liberty-3 for most things, and a bumpy landing for things landing in the FF. :)21:38
mesterySee you all on the ML and IRC!21:38
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"21:38
openstackMeeting ended Mon Jul  6 21:38:18 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)21:38
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kevinbentonGOOD BYE!21:38
emaganaciao ciao!21:39
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