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| oneswig | Greetings, shall we get going? | 07:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| oneswig | #startmeeting scientific_wg | 07:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 07:00:47 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is oneswig. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 07:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 07:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'scientific_wg' | 07:00 |
| oneswig | #chair blair | 07:01 |
| openstack | Current chairs: blair oneswig | 07:01 |
| oneswig | #link minutes to meeting https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Scientific_working_group#IRC_Meeting_June_22nd_2016 | 07:01 |
| oneswig | Oops I mean agenda... | 07:01 |
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| oneswig | #topic roll call | 07:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:02 | |
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| oneswig | Hi all, who is here? | 07:02 |
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| oneswig | #chair b1airo | 07:02 |
| b1airo | howdy | 07:02 |
| openstack | Current chairs: b1airo blair oneswig | 07:02 |
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| oneswig | Evening Blair | 07:02 |
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| b1airo | i'm just heading to the bus so might drop out a bit | 07:03 |
| oneswig | np, looks like a quiet one so far... | 07:04 |
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| verdurin | Morning - Adam from Francis Crick here | 07:05 |
| oneswig | Hi Adam, just three of us at present | 07:05 |
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| oneswig | verdurin: there will be an HPC/Research speaker track at Barcelona, are you planning to submit a talk? | 07:07 |
| verdurin | oneswig: yes, hope so | 07:08 |
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| oneswig | Same theme do you think? | 07:10 |
| verdurin | Similar, yes. | 07:10 |
| verdurin | Of course, we're all a little older and wiser now | 07:10 |
| oneswig | :-) | 07:10 |
| oneswig | I'm certainly older! | 07:10 |
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| oneswig | Let's cover the agenda items, perhaps others will join mid-session like last time | 07:11 |
| b1airo | copy | 07:12 |
| aloga | hi all | 07:12 |
| oneswig | #topic Supercomputing 2016 | 07:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Supercomputing 2016 (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:12 | |
| oneswig | Hi aloga | 07:12 |
| b1airo | oneswig, have you got a copy of the agenda handy - good to paste | 07:12 |
| oneswig | Yeah, I accidentally posted as minutes earlier, here it comes | 07:12 |
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| oneswig | Scientific OpenStack at Supercomputing 2016. OpenStack activities related to HPC and research computing at the annual Supercomputing conference in Salt Lake City in November. | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Possibility of organisations with booths providing space for OpenStack-related content | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Panel session on OpenStack for HPC & research computing | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Proposal for a Birds-of-Feather session | 07:13 |
| oneswig | White paper on OpenStack and HPC | 07:13 |
| oneswig | HPC / Research track at OpenStack Barcelona summit | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Deadline for presentation submissions | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Cross-promotion of the HPC/Research track in other channels | 07:13 |
| oneswig | Use cases and reference architectures | 07:13 |
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| b1airo | so i guess we could save the SC topic till last then | 07:14 |
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| oneswig | b1airo: Ok, fine by me | 07:14 |
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| b1airo | just in case others come in | 07:14 |
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| oneswig | #topic HPC/Research track at Barcelona | 07:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "HPC/Research track at Barcelona (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:14 | |
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| oneswig | After the success of the track at Austin, there's going to be another at Barcelona, hooray! | 07:15 |
| verdurin | Good news. | 07:15 |
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| verdurin | Does it have to be "justified" each time? | 07:15 |
| oneswig | The hope is that people cross-post details on the track in any other related channels | 07:15 |
| verdurin | Or can it become a standing track? | 07:16 |
| b1airo | good question verdurin - by the time i heard about the track proposal process it was already listed | 07:16 |
| oneswig | verdurin: not sure. The fact that it was so successful has to be positive | 07:16 |
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| oneswig | verdurin: and the realisation that so much of the user base is research-oriented! | 07:17 |
| verdurin | oneswig: definitely - I would certainly prefer it to be a permanent feature of the Summits | 07:17 |
| b1airo | so yes, there is a process for deciding on tracks, but no, i don't think it is necessarily widely known or well publicised (given neither oneswig or i knew about it) | 07:17 |
| b1airo | probably something we should ask dfflanders or tom about | 07:18 |
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| verdurin | Do you have a theme in mind? | 07:18 |
| oneswig | aloga: will you be proposing to talk about OPIE at the summit? | 07:18 |
| aloga | oneswig: yes | 07:18 |
| b1airo | great! | 07:19 |
| oneswig | verdurin: Going from last time, the talks were selected for widest subject coverage rather than focusing on a theme. Thoughts on that? | 07:19 |
| aloga | taking into account the removal of all the extensions plumbing from the OpenStack API, it won't be sustainable as a standalone project | 07:19 |
| aloga | so yes, I need to push for it :) | 07:19 |
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| verdurin | oneswig: that makes sense to me | 07:20 |
| oneswig | aloga: That sounds like a good talk to seek out, good luck with the process | 07:20 |
| oneswig | Last time for example I saw there were cross-posts to mailing lists I didn't know of, like UK Cloud SIG | 07:21 |
| aloga | oneswig: thanks | 07:21 |
| b1airo | so any thoughts about where to promote the track? i was wondering about lists like hpc-announce, but need to be clear about what we want (i.e., not Cloud Computing Research) | 07:21 |
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| aloga | probably we will submit another one on the TOSCA usage, together with CERN | 07:22 |
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| oneswig | b1airo: no ideas from here but I'll keep thinking | 07:23 |
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| verdurin | I can mention it on the UK HPC-SIG list, if oneswig wasn't already planning to do so | 07:24 |
| b1airo | i wonder if we want to try and draft a generic message? | 07:24 |
| aloga | probably the EGI federated cloud is a good place to ask as wekk | 07:24 |
| aloga | s/wekk/well/ | 07:24 |
| aloga | s/ask/announce/ | 07:24 |
| oneswig | verdurin: please do, I'm not on that list | 07:24 |
| oneswig | aloga: are you in that group? Would be good if you could promote that | 07:25 |
| verdurin | b1airo: yes, a generic message would be useful | 07:25 |
| aloga | oneswig: yes | 07:26 |
| oneswig | b1airo: agreed | 07:26 |
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| aloga | b1airo: I do agree with the generic message | 07:27 |
| oneswig | The main items to cover would be a couple of sentences on the last track | 07:27 |
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| aloga | b1airo: kind of a "call for participation" | 07:27 |
| oneswig | and to note the deadline and link to the submission form | 07:27 |
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| oneswig | aloga: exactly, but perhaps not so readily deleteable | 07:27 |
| oneswig | :-) | 07:27 |
| aloga | oneswig: thats why I used the colons ;) | 07:28 |
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| b1airo | hehe | 07:29 |
| aloga | I mean, if somebody could draft some boilerplate message that could be easily be adapted for each target group (so that it does not seem like generic spam) that would be great | 07:29 |
| oneswig | aloga: I don't have an email for you if we follow-up on this after the meeting | 07:29 |
| oneswig | 1 sec | 07:29 |
| aloga | oneswig: https://launchpad.net/~aloga | 07:29 |
| oneswig | aloga: cool thanks | 07:30 |
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| aloga | oneswig: anyway I'm always on freenode, so I would read any private message sooner or later | 07:31 |
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| oneswig | #action oneswig b1airo aloga verdurin to work on draft email for HPC/Research for circulation | 07:32 |
| oneswig | #link This might be how to start https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/hpc-research-circulation-email | 07:33 |
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| b1airo | good idea oneswig | 07:34 |
| aloga | we (EGI fedcloud) have a meeting next week, so I think that I could even encourage people in the group not only by email O:-) | 07:34 |
| oneswig | aloga: great, please do | 07:34 |
| oneswig | b1airo: shall we cover user stories? | 07:34 |
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| b1airo | oneswig, yep sounds good | 07:34 |
| oneswig | #topic Use cases and reference architectures | 07:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Use cases and reference architectures (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:34 | |
| oneswig | b1airo: you had some specific thoughts to cover? | 07:35 |
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| b1airo | was thinking about who our intended audience is | 07:37 |
| b1airo | i think for the most part it's probably OS newbies | 07:37 |
| oneswig | Likely so - new to OpenStack but very familiar with research computing | 07:38 |
| b1airo | so i think the approach you're taking for the cambridge whitepaper is probably very much applicable | 07:38 |
| oneswig | Great, I hope so | 07:38 |
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| b1airo | e.g., the filesystem integration focus area might generate a few use-cases with a few solution architecture options - not "reference architectures" per se, just lightweight, here's a way to do this in openstack and here's the relevant docs etc | 07:40 |
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| aloga | do you have a link to that whitepaper? | 07:40 |
| b1airo | aloga, it doesn't exist yet - oneswig is working on it :-) | 07:40 |
| oneswig | aloga: still early planning, it doesn't exist in any meaningful form yet | 07:40 |
| oneswig | I'm also working on documenting some of the config we are deploying at the moment. Those things have a short lifespan - will probably go into some blog posts | 07:41 |
| oneswig | b1airo: is there a blog for monarch? | 07:41 |
| oneswig | verdurin: or the Crick? | 07:41 |
| oneswig | I'm interested to read about how other people approach these infrastructure challenges | 07:42 |
| b1airo | there is some material but it's not very technical (and also the compuute node hosting our blog's DB went down today and i haven't brought the blog back up yet ;-) ) | 07:42 |
| verdurin | oneswig: not yet, no - would like to have one, though | 07:42 |
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| oneswig | b1airo: self-hosted documentation has to have limitations when there's trouble! | 07:44 |
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| oneswig | In the long term a kind of Scientific WG "planet" aggregation of activity would be a good thing | 07:45 |
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| b1airo | it's clouds all the way down oneswig | 07:45 |
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| oneswig | b1airo: somewhere beneath the clouds I believe there is concrete, into which your crater is formed! | 07:46 |
| oneswig | Anyway, shall we cover SC? | 07:46 |
| b1airo | sure | 07:47 |
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| oneswig | #topic Supercomputing 2016 | 07:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Supercomputing 2016 (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:47 | |
| b1airo | so we have two booth coop opportunities now | 07:47 |
| oneswig | In the discussion in the other timezone last week there were some people from organisations who take out booths at SC | 07:47 |
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| oneswig | b1airo: go ahead | 07:47 |
| b1airo | yeah was going to say what i think you were oneswig | 07:48 |
| b1airo | i.e., does anyone have an SC booth in which | 07:48 |
| aloga | regarding the previous topic, http://www.egi.eu/blog/tags/cloud/ may be useful as well | 07:48 |
| b1airo | they'd be happy to donate some space to OpenStack "things" | 07:48 |
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| oneswig | AFAIK Cambridge doesn't do anything like renting a booth, does anybody else's org? | 07:50 |
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| b1airo | what those "things" are need to be determined, but the foundation does not have a booth, so we're looking for options | 07:50 |
| verdurin | We don't. | 07:50 |
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| oneswig | I heard talk of giving demos, but I'm not sure if that was initiated by the foundation or the WG members | 07:52 |
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| b1airo | i think it was more dfflanders making suggestions, but i'm not sure whether there is something canned or he wanted to develop material | 07:53 |
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| oneswig | Otherwise I guess it's about leaflets etc. - sections of the whitepaper perhaps | 07:53 |
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| b1airo | i can't see us (Monash) being able to do much there, though perhaps something about MASSIVE and CVL on OpenStack | 07:54 |
| b1airo | timelines are likely to be a problem | 07:54 |
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| oneswig | right. November's not actually that far out for making these things | 07:54 |
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| b1airo | indeed, especially when you're working on building the platforms o_0 | 07:55 |
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| b1airo | oh and re. SC, for folks that might not be aware, we have an OpenStack HPC/Research panel | 07:56 |
| b1airo | and are working on a BoF proposal | 07:56 |
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| b1airo | not that i've got near looking at that yet this week | 07:56 |
| oneswig | b1airo: do you recall the deadline for that? | 07:57 |
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| b1airo | still a ways off, maybe another 5 weeks | 07:57 |
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| b1airo | #topic Other Business | 07:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Other Business (Meeting topic: scientific_wg)" | 07:58 | |
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| b1airo | better wrap up, especially as i'm standing at the bus stop freezing | 07:58 |
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| oneswig | You're in Australia, man, stop complaining :-) | 07:59 |
| oneswig | Nothing more from me | 07:59 |
| verdurin | Nor me. | 07:59 |
| b1airo | true true, it's a very chilly 8 degrees C or so | 07:59 |
| oneswig | Fair enough. Let's finish a minute early to get you on your way | 08:00 |
| aloga | are we free to add our clouds here https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Science_Clouds? | 08:00 |
| b1airo | so my shorts, singlet and things are letting me down a bit :-P | 08:00 |
| b1airo | aloga, yes please! | 08:00 |
| oneswig | aloga: great idea, b1airo is maintaining that | 08:00 |
| b1airo | i haven't finished copying the list from the etherpad yet but do go ahead | 08:00 |
| oneswig | OK we are out of time. Thanks b1airo verdurin aloga | 08:00 |
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| oneswig | #endmeeting | 08:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 08:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 08:01:13 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 08:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-06-22-07.00.html | 08:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-06-22-07.00.txt | 08:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scientific_wg/2016/scientific_wg.2016-06-22-07.00.log.html | 08:01 |
| b1airo | cheers folks | 08:01 |
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| BobBall | #startmeeting XenAPI | 09:30 |
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| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 09:30:16 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is BobBall. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 09:30 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 09:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 09:30 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'xenapi' | 09:30 |
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| BobBall | johnthetubaguy, jianghuaw, huazhihao, huanxie | 09:30 |
| BobBall | Morning / afternoon :) | 09:30 |
| jianghuaw | Hi, Bob. | 09:30 |
| * johnthetubaguy waves | 09:30 | |
| BobBall | #topic Newton (Blueprints / Bugs) | 09:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Newton (Blueprints / Bugs) (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 09:30 | |
| BobBall | So - first fun topic first... | 09:31 |
| jianghuaw | johnthetubaguy: good morning. | 09:31 |
| BobBall | I'll talk about XenAPI independent compute blueprint first | 09:31 |
| BobBall | All code is up and "ready for review". Three patches and the first in the series is entirely ready. Second and third have UT failures and missing UT that I need to add, but code is good and works | 09:31 |
| BobBall | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/331254/ is the big change and is the one ready for core review now | 09:32 |
| BobBall | The other two just tidy a few things up. | 09:32 |
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| BobBall | Can this be added to your review list please johnthetubaguy ? :) | 09:32 |
| BobBall | Getting very close to non-priority feature freeze, so any review time you have would be greately appreciated. | 09:32 |
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| * BobBall pokes johnthetubaguy gently | 09:34 | |
| johnthetubaguy | possibly, by frankly my list is stupid long already with the OSIC priorities | 09:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | (and general upstream priorities) | 09:34 |
| BobBall | What can we do to help reduce that list so you have time to look at these? | 09:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | review the centralise configurations options work, and live-migrate works I guess | 09:35 |
| BobBall | Links? | 09:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/centralize-config-options-newton+status:open | 09:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/newton-nova-priorities-tracking (particuarly live-migrate) | 09:36 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am also currently coding | 09:36 |
| johnthetubaguy | trying to meet the deadline for the neutron refactor | 09:36 |
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| BobBall | Can we do a deal - if we do 3 reviews, can we exchange it for one of yours on our BP / bugfix? :) | 09:36 |
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| johnthetubaguy | (and sorting out summit presentations for Rackspace OpenStack engineering...) | 09:36 |
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| BobBall | Yeah; those two are things that would be harder to jump in and help with ;) | 09:37 |
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| johnthetubaguy | its on my radar, for sure, I do hope to get to those things | 09:37 |
| johnthetubaguy | the neutron stuff, is probably going to have to be paused, at this point, not getting any review on it | 09:37 |
| johnthetubaguy | actually, thats a good point, eyes on that would help me out too: | 09:38 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#q,topic:bp/prep-for-network-aware-scheduling,n,z | 09:38 |
| BobBall | Understood. | 09:38 |
| BobBall | A high level review of https://review.openstack.org/331254 would be good to see if you're happy with the general approach even if you don't have time today to do a more detailed review. | 09:39 |
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| BobBall | Next BP - Neutron security groups. | 09:39 |
| BobBall | huan / jianghuaw: What's the status of those? | 09:39 |
| huanxie | Neutron security group source code is ready for review | 09:40 |
| huanxie | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/251271/ | 09:40 |
| BobBall | Depends on a bugfix from jianghuaw which already has one +2 https://review.openstack.org/#/c/242846 | 09:40 |
| BobBall | So a second +2 would be much appreciated for that bugfix so we can then focus on getting reviews for the Security Group blueprint | 09:41 |
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| jianghuaw | yeah. I hope it won't cost @johnthetubaguy much time as you reviewed it before:-) | 09:42 |
| BobBall | So - I think long story short, any review time you have would be greatly appreciated on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/242846 and https://review.openstack.org/331254 as these two are the basis of the two blueprints which were approved for Newton. | 09:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, agreed | 09:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | do we have this all on a dashboard or etherpad somewhere handy? | 09:43 |
| johnthetubaguy | I recon we should delete those struck out ones | 09:43 |
| BobBall | Guess where | 09:43 |
| BobBall | Just updated it :) | 09:43 |
| BobBall | Deleted | 09:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool, that looks better | 09:44 |
| BobBall | Awesome, etherpad really loves numbering. | 09:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | so that spec will need moving to octa now right? | 09:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, I tend to go for bullets | 09:44 |
| BobBall | Yup; although from what I hear it's not got much of a chance to get in Octa | 09:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | right | 09:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyways, thanks, thats looking more complete now | 09:45 |
| BobBall | OK - so I'll do 3+ reviews on centralise config options today | 09:46 |
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| johnthetubaguy | thanks, that would be a big help | 09:46 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I suspect there could be xenapi ones up there, but I don't remember right now | 09:46 |
| BobBall | Already - do we have AOB to discuss | 09:46 |
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| BobBall | #topic AOB | 09:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: XenAPI)" | 09:47 | |
| BobBall | There was a bugfix for domid=-1 which has already gone in, but that's likely important for deployed envs as well | 09:47 |
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| BobBall | I think we'll backport it to Mitaka | 09:48 |
| BobBall | but not planning to backport further. | 09:48 |
| BobBall | Anything else we should cover? | 09:48 |
| huanxie | none for me | 09:49 |
| BobBall | Awesome. We'll close there and give johnthetubaguy 10 minutes of time back. | 09:49 |
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| BobBall | Thanks all | 09:49 |
| BobBall | #endmeeting | 09:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 09:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 09:49:44 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 09:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2016/xenapi.2016-06-22-09.30.html | 09:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2016/xenapi.2016-06-22-09.30.txt | 09:49 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/xenapi/2016/xenapi.2016-06-22-09.30.log.html | 09:49 |
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| tonyb | #startmeeting requirements | 12:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 12:00:47 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is tonyb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 12:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 12:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'requirements' | 12:00 |
| tonyb | #topic roll call | 12:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:00 | |
| coolsvap | o/ | 12:00 |
| sigmavirus24 | o/ | 12:00 |
| tonyb | Who | 12:00 |
| number80 | o/ | 12:01 |
| number80 | hguemar | 12:01 |
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| tonyb | 's here | 12:01 |
| prometheanfire | o/ | 12:01 |
| tonyb | wow laggy | 12:01 |
| tonyb | Okay late commers can catch up .... | 12:02 |
| tonyb | #topic Any controversies in the Queue? | 12:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Any controversies in the Queue? (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:02 | |
| tonyb | number80: You had something didn't you? | 12:02 |
| coolsvap | I think one showed up right before the meeting | 12:02 |
| coolsvap | https://review.openstack.org/325932 | 12:02 |
| number80 | yes | 12:02 |
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| prometheanfire | selector needs abandoning | 12:02 |
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| prometheanfire | oh, new | 12:03 |
| number80 | I checked the project, and though upstream maintainer is still active on other projects in github, he hasn't made a commit, commented a review or issue for a year | 12:03 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: That's the direction it's going but I don't think it's gone yet | 12:03 |
| prometheanfire | coolsvap: not really controversial, I think that's a -2 til questions are answered | 12:04 |
| prometheanfire | tonyb: ya, I'm just impatient | 12:04 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: hehe | 12:04 |
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| number80 | well, I also sent a review for a linter tool for requirements files | 12:04 |
| coolsvap | prometheanfire, ack but concern of number80 is valid which is enough to stop it | 12:05 |
| prometheanfire | number80: ya, I like that | 12:05 |
| coolsvap | number80, the linter thing is good | 12:05 |
| tonyb | WRT sphinx-argparse ... WHat are other projects using to do that thing? | 12:05 |
| coreycb | o/ | 12:05 |
| prometheanfire | coolsvap: those are the questions I'm refrencing (sphinx-argparse) | 12:05 |
| * tonyb looks forward to reviewing the linter | 12:06 | |
| coolsvap | currently none | 12:06 |
| number80 | tonyb: sahara-client | 12:06 |
| number80 | http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/python-saharaclient/tree/tox.ini#n15 | 12:06 |
| tonyb | number80: yeah but it's not the first clien that wants to documwnt it's cli | 12:06 |
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| number80 | Yup, not a good reason enough to include it | 12:06 |
| sigmavirus24 | tonyb: sure, but sphinx has good CLI documentation bits already | 12:06 |
| sigmavirus24 | tonyb: do they really need to auto-generate their CLI docs? | 12:06 |
| sigmavirus24 | Does it change so frequently that they need it autogenerated to avoid drift? | 12:07 |
| sigmavirus24 | I mean look at what flake8 is doing: https://gitlab.com/pycqa/flake8/raw/proposed/3.0/docs/source/user/options.rst | 12:08 |
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| tonyb | Hmmm If they want to do something "different" and we don't have anythign else that covers that area then I'm okay with that (assuming it is otehrwise okay) | 12:09 |
| * dims peeks | 12:09 | |
| tonyb | I guess we'll be looking at python-saharaclient code ;P | 12:10 |
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| prometheanfire | they py3 aspect means it's still bad though | 12:10 |
| tonyb | dims: peeks ate the meetign or the review? | 12:10 |
| coolsvap | prometheanfire, +1 | 12:10 |
| dims | the meeting :) | 12:11 |
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| number80 | *nods* | 12:11 |
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| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: so they were testing with tox and Travis CI on python 3 | 12:11 |
| sigmavirus24 | so I think that's wrong | 12:11 |
| sigmavirus24 | (The last update to the tox.ini was to add Python 3.4) | 12:12 |
| prometheanfire | oh, neato | 12:12 |
| sigmavirus24 | That said, it *is* unmaintained | 12:12 |
| sigmavirus24 | (That part is clear) | 12:12 |
| tonyb | well that'd make it a -1 right there. | 12:12 |
| sigmavirus24 | So unless someone knows Alex and will volunteer to take it over, I don't think it makes sense to include it | 12:13 |
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| number80 | yup | 12:13 |
| tonyb | okay I think we're on the same page there | 12:13 |
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| tonyb | also the selector thing is "working out" | 12:13 |
| sigmavirus24 | I mena even minor typographical errors are not being merged: https://github.com/ribozz/sphinx-argparse/pull/35/files | 12:13 |
| tonyb | anything else? before we move on? | 12:14 |
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| tonyb | #topic Tasks from Etherpad | 12:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tasks from Etherpad (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:15 | |
| tonyb | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/requirements-tasks | 12:15 |
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| tonyb | So thanks to dims we have new requirements cores :) | 12:16 |
| dims | tonyb : yay! welcome aboard folks | 12:16 |
| tonyb | dims: :) | 12:16 |
| sigmavirus24 | I would tease you all about poor life decisions, but I don't actually mean it | 12:16 |
| tonyb | sigmavirus24: :) | 12:17 |
| dims | please figure out who wants to be the PTL in a few weeks and we can get a separate team under governance | 12:17 |
| tonyb | dims: hehe you're a funny man :) | 12:17 |
| prometheanfire | tonyb: thanks for volunteering | 12:18 |
| tonyb | *wants* he says :) | 12:18 |
| * coolsvap shakes hand with tonyb :) | 12:18 | |
| dims | LOL | 12:18 |
| tonyb | If others are keen then I'm not "mad for power" | 12:18 |
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| dims | what? no election? tsk tsk | 12:19 |
| dims | added another task - "Figure out the best home for the bot/wip script - https://gist.github.com/dims/094ac0e8d8bd8c4a096b6b391157aef5" | 12:19 |
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| prometheanfire | I do have a question though, about possibly better testing | 12:19 |
| tonyb | dims: Yeah that's a good point | 12:19 |
| dims | needs a cron that runs overnight and team members should be able to run it on demand (say after fixing up the bot specified review) | 12:19 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: you have the floor | 12:19 |
| number80 | dims: how about a requirements-bots repo? | 12:20 |
| coolsvap | i think all the scripts we have should be in the requirements reop | 12:20 |
| prometheanfire | currently we don't merge updated generate constraints until a custom job is run | 12:20 |
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| tonyb | It's more about the run-time than the code location | 12:20 |
| prometheanfire | I think dims runs it? | 12:20 |
| number80 | ack | 12:20 |
| tonyb | I agree we can add it to the repo but .... | 12:20 |
| dims | i have a cron and i also run it by hand now. | 12:21 |
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| dims | when needed | 12:21 |
| prometheanfire | is there a way we can trust testing more? | 12:21 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: rigth now that is true. I think we need a less personal location | 12:21 |
| prometheanfire | I think using openstack-ansible might help here, odyssey4me ping | 12:21 |
| tonyb | Well we *can* make any change to u-c run extra tests | 12:21 |
| coolsvap | dims i think we should add it in repo and add a simple gate task which invokes the script | 12:22 |
| tonyb | the issue is havign confidence that we have good coverage ... beyond what dsvm-full gives us | 12:22 |
| dims | coolsvap : i'll let you all figure it out :) | 12:22 |
| coolsvap | the script is pretty much self driven | 12:22 |
| prometheanfire | ya, if we don't trust just dsvm-full then we need to add another test imo | 12:22 |
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| dims | just tell me when i can switch off my cron :) | 12:22 |
| tonyb | dims: will do, thanks for creatign that thing and looking after it | 12:23 |
| prometheanfire | atm I don't really touch the automated updates because of the custom testing being done | 12:23 |
| tonyb | I did a little analysis in Austin and if we take defcore+horizon+swift we cover abotu 50% of g-r | 12:23 |
| prometheanfire | how much does a 'full' osa run cover? | 12:24 |
| tonyb | You need to add a bunch of projects t get past that | 12:24 |
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| prometheanfire | I'd imagine it's a bit more | 12:24 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: we can work on doign that analysis | 12:24 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: short answer is I don't know | 12:24 |
| prometheanfire | ya, I guess I'll add a task | 12:25 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: one of the challenges is balancing confidence with gate times | 12:25 |
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| tonyb | prometheanfire: If you can give me the tempest config I can work it out | 12:25 |
| prometheanfire | I'm happy with a longer gate for this | 12:25 |
| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: a "full OSA run" is really undefined | 12:25 |
| prometheanfire | sigmavirus24: ya, hence the quotes | 12:25 |
| prometheanfire | it was just an idea to get more confidence | 12:26 |
| sigmavirus24 | because OSA really doesn't have a definition, but it has roles for several projects in varying states of maintenance | 12:26 |
| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: for what it's worth, OSA's tests don't cover nearly enough either | 12:26 |
| sigmavirus24 | I've found some config templates being egregiously wrong with the gate not noticing that for OSA | 12:26 |
| tonyb | We'd probably use stable/mitaka as opposed to master for that reason but I'm making that up as I go along | 12:26 |
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| prometheanfire | true, but I think we at least cover defcore/horizon/swift | 12:26 |
| sigmavirus24 | (Because they just test if the service "works") | 12:27 |
| prometheanfire | ah, nice | 12:27 |
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| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: we could, yes. I still don't think OSA is any better than dvsm | 12:27 |
| * dims has to run so throwing this for "open discussion" for later - we need to follow up on this http://markmail.org/message/tdw7zzyzbxnkipwe (python-kafka) | 12:27 | |
| tonyb | dims: noted | 12:28 |
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| dims | thanks tonyb | 12:28 |
| tonyb | dims: do you litterally mean "run" ? | 12:28 |
| prometheanfire | yep | 12:29 |
| tonyb | Anyway ... prometheanfire did we cover what you wanted to know talk abiyt re testing or did we take a tangent? | 12:29 |
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| prometheanfire | ya, can you make a todo note? | 12:30 |
| * prometheanfire needs to look up the bot's commands | 12:30 | |
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| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: you mean an #action? | 12:31 |
| prometheanfire | sure | 12:31 |
| tonyb | #action fix testing of constraints changes | 12:31 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: does that cover it? | 12:31 |
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| tonyb | okay ... | 12:32 |
| prometheanfire | yes | 12:32 |
| tonyb | #topic Volunteer for next 2 meetings | 12:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Volunteer for next 2 meetings (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:32 | |
| tonyb | anyone? | 12:33 |
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| coolsvap | +1 | 12:33 |
| prometheanfire | I'll take the second one | 12:33 |
| tonyb | okay so coolsvap you're up next week | 12:34 |
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| dirk | Wfm | 12:34 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: you're next fortnight | 12:34 |
| * tonyb wanders off to update the etherpad ... please hold | 12:34 | |
| number80 | wfm | 12:34 |
| tonyb | #topic Open Discussion | 12:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: requirements)" | 12:36 | |
| sigmavirus24 | Aww, I thought I had the next meeting | 12:36 |
| tonyb | sigmavirus24: Oh yeah .... | 12:36 |
| sigmavirus24 | No worries | 12:36 |
| coolsvap | sigmavirus24, here you go take it | 12:36 |
| sigmavirus24 | :P | 12:36 |
| prometheanfire | I'll have to leave soon, picking kevin up | 12:36 |
| tonyb | I'll fix it and add it to the etherpad | 12:36 |
| sigmavirus24 | prometheanfire: who's kevin? | 12:36 |
| sigmavirus24 | :P | 12:37 |
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| tonyb | #link http://markmail.org/message/tdw7zzyzbxnkipwe | 12:37 |
| tonyb | dims: dropped that in | 12:37 |
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| tonyb | basically we need to work with oslo.messaging and monasca to allow python-kafka to move forward | 12:38 |
| coolsvap | tonyb, which etherpad you are updating? | 12:38 |
| tonyb | I think rigth now that just means payign attention to the list thread | 12:38 |
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| prometheanfire | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/requirements-tasks | 12:38 |
| tonyb | coolsvap: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/requirements-tasks | 12:38 |
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| tonyb | coolsvap: near the bottom | 12:39 |
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| tonyb | it's very rough as I'm bad with calendars | 12:39 |
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| tonyb | does anyone have a "gut feel" on the kafka thread? | 12:39 |
| prometheanfire | seems we are blocked on the kafka project getting added to projects.txt? | 12:40 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: not quite | 12:40 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: kafka is in there but pinned to 1.x IIRC | 12:40 |
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| tonyb | oslo.messaging *really* want 2.x but that breaks monasca | 12:41 |
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| prometheanfire | I get that | 12:41 |
| tonyb | monasca are trying to be part of requirements | 12:41 |
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| prometheanfire | once they are part of requirements they (messaging and monasca) can then work together more 'officially' is what I mean | 12:42 |
| tonyb | so we're soft frozen on the kafka requirement | 12:42 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: right | 12:42 |
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| tonyb | prometheanfire: but *we* need to help them understand what that looks like | 12:42 |
| tonyb | and what the pain points are | 12:42 |
| prometheanfire | ah | 12:43 |
| tonyb | for example can monasca use an abstraction layer to be less tied to 1.x is that any better than doing the 2.x port etc | 12:43 |
| prometheanfire | well, ml thread should help | 12:43 |
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| tonyb | prometheanfire: yup | 12:43 |
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| dirk | Who from the Oslo.messaging team could help them with that? | 12:43 |
| prometheanfire | ok, I have to run, cya tomorrow | 12:43 |
| dirk | It seems monasca just doing the jump to 2.x might be a possibility | 12:44 |
| prometheanfire | or in a hour or so | 12:44 |
| tonyb | prometheanfire: cya | 12:44 |
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| dirk | If that is easy enough | 12:44 |
| prometheanfire | dirk: prefered I think | 12:44 |
| tonyb | dirk: right we need to help them asses and be prepared to land compat code in monasca to make that a thing | 12:45 |
| tonyb | dirk: clearly we're not the experts yet | 12:45 |
| dirk | Yeah, that's true for me at least | 12:45 |
| dirk | Maybe a topic for cross.project team? | 12:46 |
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| dirk | If it cannot be solved quickly | 12:46 |
| dirk | I wonder why they consume Kafka directly rather than via Oslo.messaging | 12:47 |
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| tonyb | dirk: perhaps they can help with the co-ordination but I think the 3 teams will need to do the heavy lifting | 12:47 |
| sigmavirus24 | dirk: that's a good question | 12:47 |
| tonyb | dirk: that's a good question and one we'll need to answer | 12:48 |
| sigmavirus24 | tonyb: we might need to organize something in #openstack-meeting-cp | 12:48 |
| tonyb | sigmavirus24: Yup | 12:48 |
| * sigmavirus24 wonders if oslo.messaging can be configured for multiple transports | 12:48 | |
| sigmavirus24 | (that could be a reason to not use oslo.messaging for kafka) | 12:48 |
| tonyb | Lets keep the thread alive but work on the assumption that monasca will be part of requirements RSN | 12:48 |
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| dirk | +1 | 12:49 |
| sigmavirus24 | Agreed tonyb | 12:49 |
| number80 | *nods* | 12:49 |
| coolsvap | +1 | 12:49 |
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| tonyb | \o/ | 12:49 |
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| tonyb | Anything else for open discussion? | 12:49 |
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| dirk | Do we want to talk about the non-master core approver topic? | 12:50 |
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| tonyb | dirk: Sure 'sup? | 12:50 |
| dirk | I think it was on our channel yesterday | 12:50 |
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| dirk | Whether it is intentional that the approver group for requirements master and stable/ is non overlapping | 12:51 |
| dirk | I personally don't care much.. I forgot who brought it ip | 12:51 |
| dirk | Up | 12:51 |
| tonyb | dirk: I don't *know* the history but I'd assume it's somewhat initentional | 12:51 |
| sigmavirus24 | I would suspect the same | 12:52 |
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| tonyb | dirk: in the same way that nova has a diffeent set poepl people (albeit with slightly more overlap) | 12:52 |
| sigmavirus24 | I would prefer it stay this way for a while too | 12:52 |
| sigmavirus24 | at least until there's a need for them to overlap | 12:52 |
| coolsvap | sigmavirus24, +1 | 12:53 |
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| coolsvap | i would like it to be non-overlapping until required | 12:53 |
| tonyb | It would be good to be revieing the stable changes as time permits we could easily grow a requirements-stable-maint team | 12:53 |
| dirk | I agree to all of that. I guess the point of the question was that sometimes blocking out a new pypi release should be done quickly to unbreakable gating | 12:53 |
| sigmavirus24 | No offense to the cores that dims added, but I saw a lot of overeager +1s/+2s on reviews that would be *very* bad for stable/* | 12:53 |
| number80 | well, the team is fairly new and stable branches is sensitive | 12:53 |
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| sigmavirus24 | dirk: sure, but is the stable/* team too small to be able to react to that? | 12:54 |
| dirk | I don't know | 12:54 |
| dirk | It seems.we're all in agreement so let's note it down and move on 😉 | 12:54 |
| tonyb | dirk: well the next thing is # endmeeting so .... | 12:55 |
| number80 | sigmavirus24: if you have any suggestion on improving reviews, you're welcome to tell us :) | 12:55 |
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| dirk | Yeah, workflow approval has been pretty quick lately | 12:55 |
| dims | good problem to have :) | 12:56 |
| dirk | At least for me when I sometimes do other stuff for a.couple of hours | 12:56 |
| coolsvap | the approval process we need to revamp to 2*+2 +W | 12:56 |
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| coolsvap | but we need more active reviewers for that | 12:56 |
| number80 | sounds sensible | 12:56 |
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| dirk | coolsvap: I'm happy to do the 2nd +2 when I have time to react | 12:57 |
| tonyb | I'm genuinely curious about stable backlogs | 12:57 |
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| dirk | 10h or so should be an acceptable waiting time unless we just broke everything | 12:57 |
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| coolsvap | tonyb, we need mentoring by existing stable cores like we had for master | 12:58 |
| sigmavirus24 | number80: certainly, not sure it needs to be discussed this instant or here | 12:58 |
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| number80 | sigmavirus24: I mean in our usual channel or even by mail | 12:58 |
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| coolsvap | i think the current core team which stepped up for master can also step up the quality of reviews in stable branches | 12:58 |
| tonyb | #action look a stable backlog and review times | 12:58 |
| tonyb | we're outta time | 12:58 |
| tonyb | Thanks Everyone | 12:59 |
| tonyb | #endmeeting | 12:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 12:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 12:59:06 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 12:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/requirements/2016/requirements.2016-06-22-12.00.html | 12:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/requirements/2016/requirements.2016-06-22-12.00.txt | 12:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/requirements/2016/requirements.2016-06-22-12.00.log.html | 12:59 |
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| coolsvap | thanks tonyb :) | 12:59 |
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| number80 | thanks everyone! | 12:59 |
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| jokke_ | zhiyan: that worked well :( | 13:25 |
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| zhiyan | jokke_: what's up? | 13:30 |
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| jokke_ | 14:03 < zhiyuan> /msg NickServ identify 163 | 13:30 |
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| jokke_ | zhiyan: I hope you changed that pass already | 13:30 |
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| zhiyan | that's zhiyuan not me.. | 13:31 |
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| jokke_ | sorry ... autofill+lazy read | 13:31 |
| zhiyan | np | 13:31 |
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| jokke_ | just wanted to flag out in case it went unnoticed | 13:32 |
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| zhiyan | thanks | 13:34 |
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| krotscheck | #startmeeting javascript | 14:00 |
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| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 14:00:33 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is krotscheck. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| krotscheck | Good morning everyone! | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'javascript' | 14:00 |
| betherly | o/ | 14:00 |
| krotscheck | Agenda: | 14:00 |
| SotK | o/ | 14:00 |
| krotscheck | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/javascript-meeting-2016-06-22 | 14:00 |
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| Zara | o/ | 14:01 |
| timothyb89 | hello! | 14:01 |
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| krotscheck | #topic Core elections! | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Core elections! (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:01 | |
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| jaranovich | hi! | 14:01 |
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| msmol | hello all | 14:02 |
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| krotscheck | betherly, SotK, Zara, timothyb89, jaranovich, msmol : Hi everyone! | 14:02 |
| vkramskikh | hi | 14:02 |
| SotK | hi! | 14:02 |
| azemlyanov | hello! | 14:02 |
| Zara | hi krotscheck! | 14:02 |
| krotscheck | At the moment I'm the only core for js-openstack-lib and js-generator-openstack, and, well, I'd like not to be. | 14:02 |
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| krotscheck | I've gone through and picked all the people who have, to date, performed code reviews on those project. | 14:03 |
| krotscheck | And I nominate all of them! | 14:03 |
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| krotscheck | With two caveats: | 14:03 |
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| krotscheck | 1- they have to want it (aka- go through the list on the etherpad and remove yourself if you don't want it) | 14:03 |
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| krotscheck | (or, if you're not here, I'll reach out to you later) | 14:03 |
| krotscheck | 2- We agree on a reasonable baseline for the # of reviews. | 14:04 |
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| Zara | okay, I'm gonna remove myself, since I don't think I know enough, and also don't think I'll be able to give it the attention it warrants | 14:06 |
| krotscheck | Zara: That's fair. | 14:06 |
| krotscheck | Does anyone disagree with me setting the bottom bar for reviews at > 2? | 14:06 |
| jprivard | same for me, I'm brand new in this :) | 14:06 |
| jprivard | fine by me | 14:06 |
| Zara | I'm happy to +1 stuff. if later on there's a core-shortage, maybe we can talk xD | 14:06 |
| Zara | but yeah, not a good idea for anyone yet. | 14:06 |
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| msmol | for what it's worth, that all sounds good to me | 14:07 |
| betherly | sounds good to me | 14:07 |
| vkramskikh | i'm fine with it | 14:07 |
| krotscheck | Alrightey, so that sets the nominee list for js-openstack-lib to vkramskikh. | 14:07 |
| krotscheck | vkramskikh: Would you like to be core? | 14:07 |
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| vkramskikh | krotscheck: yes I would, I'm really interested in the project | 14:07 |
| krotscheck | all: does anyone disagree? | 14:08 |
| * krotscheck waits 30 seconds | 14:08 | |
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| krotscheck | Alrightey, core #1 is vkramskikh! | 14:08 |
| Zara | \o/ | 14:09 |
| vkramskikh | woohoo | 14:09 |
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| azemlyanov | +1 | 14:09 |
| jaranovich | congrats, vkramskikh! | 14:09 |
| nbogdanov | yay! | 14:09 |
| krotscheck | Next: js-generator-openstack | 14:09 |
| SotK | congrats! | 14:09 |
| krotscheck | The current nominee list are yujunz (not present, late in shanghai), betherly, and notmars. | 14:09 |
| krotscheck | (notmars is bruno). | 14:10 |
| krotscheck | betherly: Would you like to be core? | 14:10 |
| cardeois | he's not present too early for him | 14:10 |
| krotscheck | cardeois: What's his timezone? | 14:10 |
| betherly | congrats vkramskikh :) | 14:10 |
| cardeois | (for notmars) | 14:10 |
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| betherly | im happy to be | 14:11 |
| cardeois | EST but he's not a morning guy | 14:11 |
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| krotscheck | cardeois: I can relate. | 14:11 |
| krotscheck | Alright, does anyone have disagreements with betherly as a core for generator-openstack? | 14:11 |
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| jprivard | I'm all for it | 14:11 |
| krotscheck | Let's just do all at once: Does anyone have reservations about notmars, betherly, and yujunz being core? I'll wait 30 seconds, and check with them once they come online. | 14:12 |
| * krotscheck waits 30 seconds | 14:12 | |
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| krotscheck | ALrightey! | 14:13 |
| krotscheck | congrats betherly! | 14:13 |
| * krotscheck will ping the others | 14:13 | |
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| Zara | yaaaaaaay! congratulations, betherly! | 14:13 |
| betherly | thanks :) | 14:13 |
| jaranovich | congrats betherly :) | 14:13 |
| krotscheck | #action krotscheck Add vkramskikh as core to js-openstack-lib | 14:13 |
| Zara | (and hopefully congratulations yujunz and notmars, will see!) | 14:13 |
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| vkramskikh | congrats :) | 14:13 |
| krotscheck | #action krotscheck add betherly as core to js-generator-openstack | 14:13 |
| SotK | congrats betherly! | 14:13 |
| krotscheck | #action reach out to notmars and yujunz for their consent as project cores on js-generator-openstack | 14:13 |
| krotscheck | Who would like to be responsible for updating the meeting chairs on eavesdrop? | 14:14 |
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| krotscheck | #action krotscheck reach out to notmars and yujunz for their consent as project cores on js-generator-openstack | 14:14 |
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| krotscheck | If nobody volunteers, I'm going to nominate vkramskikh to do that :D | 14:15 |
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| vkramskikh | ok, just please explain how to do that :) | 14:15 |
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| krotscheck | vkramskikh: Submnit a patch to the openstack-meetings repository that updates the javascript-sdk meeting chairs | 14:15 |
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| krotscheck | #action vkramskikh Update javascript meeting chairs in openstack-meetings | 14:16 |
| krotscheck | #topic js-openstack-lib design: Isomorphism | 14:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "js-openstack-lib design: Isomorphism (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:16 | |
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| krotscheck | "Isomorphic" in this case means a library that works both in the browser and in a node.js runtime. | 14:16 |
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| vkramskikh | I think it was already discussed in #openstack-javascript and everybody agreed that it should be isomorphic :) | 14:17 |
| krotscheck | I have no experience on how to do this successfully, and therefore can't really speak to how much additional effort it might be. | 14:17 |
| cardeois | Yes I think it's a must have | 14:17 |
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| krotscheck | At this time, I've only heard demand for browser clients though. | 14:17 |
| vkramskikh | I also don't have much experience, but don't see any obstacles | 14:17 |
| azemlyanov | any pure JS lib is isomorphic | 14:17 |
| krotscheck | azemlyanov: Are you volunteering to build our HTTP request abstraction? ;D | 14:18 |
| azemlyanov | fetch API? | 14:18 |
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| krotscheck | azemlyanov: http://caniuse.com/#search=fetch | 14:18 |
| krotscheck | 53% support in browsers. | 14:18 |
| krotscheck | One more note though: | 14:19 |
| azemlyanov | I heard vkramskikh had desire to do it | 14:19 |
| krotscheck | We only support what we can test, and IE/Safari are not open source. | 14:19 |
| krotscheck | So we cannot support them. | 14:19 |
| msmol | jQuery for http? | 14:19 |
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| vkramskikh | yes I do, I'll express my thoughts on it when time comes (we have this item in agenda) | 14:19 |
| krotscheck | In other words, the fetch api is available and supported on all the browsers we can test. | 14:19 |
| azemlyanov | fetch API is modern, plofill for obsolete browsers | 14:19 |
| cardeois | Well I think there is fetchAPI implementations in npm | 14:19 |
| cardeois | to support browser not supporting them | 14:19 |
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| krotscheck | Alright, we'll table this for the later discussion. At the moment, all I hear is a devil's advocate for isomorphism (myself), and i'm jsut doing that because nobody else is. | 14:20 |
| cardeois | or what azemlyanov said | 14:20 |
| krotscheck | DOes anyone disagree? | 14:20 |
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| krotscheck | (Does anyone disagree with openstack-lib's need to be isomorphic?) | 14:20 |
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| krotscheck | #agreed js-openstack-lib should be isomorphic. | 14:21 |
| krotscheck | #topic js-openstack-lib design: ES5 or ES6 (ES2015) | 14:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "js-openstack-lib design: ES5 or ES6 (ES2015) (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:21 | |
| vkramskikh | I think we should definitely start using complete ES6 syntax, since latest node.js and Chrome/Firefox support almost all ES6 features, and Babel is quite mature. As for non-syntax stuff like Proxies, I think we should stick to ES6 features that could be polyfilled to run in ES5 envs - there is still quite big share of node 0.x, IE <11, Safari, etc. I've also heard that it's not possible to upload ES6 code to NPM, so we need to use | 14:21 |
| vkramskikh | Babel anyway. | 14:21 |
| msmol | +1 | 14:22 |
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| azemlyanov | ES5 is pretty old, no classes, no iterators, destructuring | 14:22 |
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| betherly | I agree with vkramskikh. Was just typing that I think ES6 should be the direction we go in | 14:22 |
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| betherly | sets the right precedence moving forwards as well | 14:22 |
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| cardeois | I think ES6 could be used but for ES5 compatibily, we should provide a ES5 compiled version of our lib to people using our lib. As compiling with babel takes about 400MB of node_modules | 14:23 |
| krotscheck | My only ask is that we ship all versions of the library in our release artifacts, though the default will likely be node.js ES5 transpiled. | 14:23 |
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| krotscheck | cardeois: Whoa, 400MB? That's ridiculous! | 14:23 |
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| betherly | ugh :/ | 14:23 |
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| tsufiev | hey, folks | 14:23 |
| krotscheck | tsufiev: Hi there! | 14:24 |
| vkramskikh | modern Babels 6.8+ are quite "slim" (about 50mb) | 14:24 |
| cardeois | yeah it is, I discovered that with babel using ES2015, but maybe there's a better way | 14:24 |
| krotscheck | This might be related: | 14:24 |
| krotscheck | #link https://blog.nodeswat.com/what-i-learned-from-analysing-1-65m-versions-of-node-js-modules-in-npm-a0299a614318 | 14:24 |
| tsufiev | do you know that meeting places are contradictory in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/javascript-meeting-2016-06-22 vs https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/javascript-meeting-agenda ;)? | 14:24 |
| cardeois | oh cool vkramskikh will try that | 14:24 |
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| krotscheck | tsufiev: Good catch, thanks! Fixed. | 14:24 |
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| krotscheck | It doesn't sound like anyone disagrees with ES6 as the base language. | 14:25 |
| msmol | Can't we just supply the ES6 version and let people transpile it themselves in their projects should they choose? | 14:25 |
| krotscheck | It also sounds like generator-openstack is stuck in ES5 land for the time being. | 14:25 |
| azemlyanov | es5 is subset of es6 | 14:25 |
| krotscheck | msmol: I don't think so. In a native node app, engineers are going to assume that require('openstack-lib') will "just work" (tm) | 14:26 |
| cardeois | Well vkramskikh was saying we can't upload ES6 to NPM is that true? | 14:26 |
| vkramskikh | msmol: we need to research about NPM's restriction for ES6 code - AFAIK it just doesn't allow to upload non-transpiled ES6 code | 14:26 |
| krotscheck | And I don't know if requirejs supports that... | 14:26 |
| azemlyanov | npm does't care | 14:26 |
| krotscheck | Does requirejs care? | 14:26 |
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| krotscheck | Sounds like we need some research. | 14:27 |
| vkramskikh | requirejs can parse es6 code, but it's really painful to setup all that properly | 14:27 |
| msmol | Hmm, I wasn't aware of that npm restriction, and as for native node apps, node supports ES6... there is even less reason to use ES5 in a node app than in the browser | 14:27 |
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| cardeois | Yeah maybe to avoid complex setup for people using the lib I think it's better to provide the transpiled version | 14:27 |
| vkramskikh | with babel plugin which is not officially supporte | 14:27 |
| vkramskikh | d | 14:27 |
| azemlyanov | requirejs is going away nowadays | 14:27 |
| timothyb89 | to my knowledge there's no real issues with es6 in npm, though it's common to flag a project as es6-supported using a 'js:next' flag instead of 'main' in package.json | 14:27 |
| timothyb89 | (instead of / in addition to) | 14:27 |
| cardeois | ok then we could eventually provide both if we can | 14:28 |
| timothyb89 | for example d3 is es6 and also npm published: https://github.com/d3/d3-format/blob/master/package.json | 14:28 |
| azemlyanov | I had no problems with es6 and es5 is a single npm package | 14:28 |
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| krotscheck | azemlyanov: That's encouraging. | 14:29 |
| krotscheck | We can set the engine flag in the package as well, right? | 14:29 |
| krotscheck | How much of ES6 is supported by Node4 LTS? | 14:29 |
| azemlyanov | many npm packages have 'dist' folder with minified or customized versions | 14:29 |
| * krotscheck remembers the answer to that being "not much" | 14:29 | |
| vkramskikh | https://kangax.github.io/compat-table/es6/ about a half | 14:30 |
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| krotscheck | #link https://kangax.github.io/compat-table/es6/ | 14:30 |
| krotscheck | Well, looks like we'd have to transpile anyway until we shift to Node6 LTS | 14:30 |
| vkramskikh | 50% for node4 vs 93% for node6 | 14:30 |
| azemlyanov | quite poor support. node v6 is some >95% | 14:31 |
| krotscheck | SO, it sounds like we're trying to get to as much of ES6 as possible | 14:31 |
| cardeois | agreed | 14:31 |
| krotscheck | However we have the added constraint that infra right now only supports Node4, and is unlikely to upgrade in the Newton cycle. | 14:31 |
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| krotscheck | Meaning we'd have to polyfill/shim/transpile anyway | 14:32 |
| msmol | so then how will we test the non-transpiled version? | 14:32 |
| krotscheck | msmol: Good question. | 14:32 |
| vkramskikh | probably we won't | 14:33 |
| krotscheck | We could teach infra how to do nodeenv. | 14:33 |
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| krotscheck | The nodejs install right now exists in an on-demand infra macro. We could add a new one that installs Node6, and parameterize it in some way | 14:34 |
| cardeois | I guess if we assume babel is doing its job correctly, we could only test the transpiled version until a better node version is available | 14:34 |
| krotscheck | cardeois: True, but then our coverage metrics are going to be meaningless. | 14:34 |
| vkramskikh | krotscheck: why? | 14:34 |
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| krotscheck | vkramskikh: We'd have to run instanbul's code annotation first, then pipe it through the transpiler. | 14:35 |
| krotscheck | I'm not confident that the transpiler won't munge and destroy the code annotations. | 14:35 |
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| vkramskikh | research is also needed here, but I believe there is a solution for this | 14:36 |
| vkramskikh | both babel and istanbul are quite popular | 14:36 |
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| cardeois | vkramskikh: agreed | 14:36 |
| cardeois | Btw what test framework do we want to use? (or should we have a different topic about it?) | 14:36 |
| krotscheck | cardeois: Probably a different topic. | 14:37 |
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| krotscheck | Ok, so we need more research. We already have a spec up for review here: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332458/ | 14:37 |
| krotscheck | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332458/ | 14:37 |
| krotscheck | That's probably the best place to leave comments, reviews, and updates. vkramskikh, would you like to take on the research? YOu can modify the spec directly if you'd like. | 14:37 |
| vkramskikh | yes I would | 14:38 |
| cardeois | #link https://onsen.io/blog/mocha-chaijs-unit-test-coverage-es6/ | 14:38 |
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| cardeois | seems like it's possible | 14:38 |
| krotscheck | vkramskikh: excellent. I'll be able to provide any necessary support vis-a-vis infra. | 14:38 |
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| krotscheck | #action vkramskikh Research ES6 transpiling options with regards to Node4, Node6, npm publishing, and update spec. | 14:39 |
| krotscheck | Overall I think we're agreed that we want as much ES6 as possible. | 14:39 |
| krotscheck | #agreed As much ES6 as possible. | 14:40 |
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| krotscheck | I'd like to move on, any other comments on this topic? | 14:40 |
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| jprivard | none on my side | 14:40 |
| krotscheck | #topic js-openstack-lib design: What is server interaction approach? | 14:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "js-openstack-lib design: What is server interaction approach? (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:40 | |
| vkramskikh | I think we should use fetch() to interact with OpenStack services. fetch() is a modern XMLHTTPRequest with frendlier interface, which is supported by majority of the browsers and easily polyfillable. For node.js there are a few modules that implement fetch() interface, such as https://github.com/bitinn/node-fetch and https://github.com/matthew-andrews/isomorphic-fetch . I also think there should be mechanism to override/specify cus | 14:40 |
| vkramskikh | tom request function, which must implement fetch() interface - I think this mechanism should be used for node.js envs to specify node-fetch or isomorphic-fetch. I'm going to write a spec for this. | 14:40 |
| azemlyanov | fetch polyfills are available everywhere | 14:41 |
| krotscheck | Can the polyfill be handled in the transpiler? | 14:42 |
| vkramskikh | don't think polyfill has anything to do with the transpiler - it's just a module/js file which can be included in the project to support older browsers | 14:43 |
| * larainema late, read back the log | 14:43 | |
| vkramskikh | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/331772/ here's how we switched to fetch in fuel | 14:43 |
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| vkramskikh | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/331772/1/webpack.config.js that's what was necessary to add polyfill to the project | 14:44 |
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| krotscheck | vkramskikh: It's not browsers I'm concerned about. It's browsers vs. node. | 14:44 |
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| msmol | there's also superagent which is a quite popular project supporting both browser + node | 14:44 |
| vkramskikh | nothing different here - transpliers are usually configured not to mangle non-project code | 14:45 |
| krotscheck | vkramskikh: THe example you gave me a few days ago had the line "require('node-fetch')" in it. | 14:45 |
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| krotscheck | Is that not necessary? | 14:45 |
| vkramskikh | yes it is, but I still don't understand what it has to do with transpilers :) | 14:46 |
| krotscheck | vkramskikh: Well, first of all, you're making the assumption that we're using webpack. | 14:46 |
| vkramskikh | superagent seems to be quite popular, worth researching | 14:46 |
| krotscheck | That hasn't really been decided yet. | 14:46 |
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| krotscheck | It might just be the projec tname. To me, "node-fetch" says "This is a library designed to be run in a node runtime, and if loaded into a browser it will fail spectacularly" | 14:47 |
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| krotscheck | Hi there, larainema! | 14:47 |
| vkramskikh | yes, but that's yet another thing that has nothing to do either with transpilers and polyfills :) | 14:47 |
| vkramskikh | they are quite independent | 14:47 |
| krotscheck | vkramskikh: We can't get the transpiler to automatically add node-fetch so we don't have to require() it? | 14:47 |
| vkramskikh | I think I could explain in more thoroughly in the spec | 14:47 |
| azemlyanov | orthogonal ;-) | 14:47 |
| krotscheck | That's probably a good idea. | 14:47 |
| krotscheck | I guess the real question I'm asking is: What runtime will our original source code target. | 14:48 |
| msmol | isomorphic-fetch: https://github.com/matthew-andrews/isomorphic-fetch just found on google, no idea of it's quality | 14:48 |
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| cardeois | krotscheck: what do you mean runtime? | 14:50 |
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| krotscheck | cardeois: It's with regards to node-fetch style modules. If the library's isomorphic, we can't use those. | 14:50 |
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| krotscheck | We could use the one msmol just found, or adapt our own. | 14:50 |
| cardeois | Yeah I guess we could do some research about it | 14:51 |
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| azemlyanov | it's rather build process to determine runtime and external deps | 14:51 |
| krotscheck | Or, maybe, there's a compilation step that says "Oh, you're using fetch(), but your target language/runtime doesn't support it, lemme add a polyfill for you" | 14:51 |
| vkramskikh | I think for node there should be a way to provide custom transport function which can be utilized in node.js envs to sepcifiy node-fetch or isomorphic-fetch or anything else | 14:51 |
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| krotscheck | (which to me seems like a transpiler thing, but it could be wrong) | 14:51 |
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| krotscheck | 8 minutes left | 14:52 |
| krotscheck | More research? | 14:52 |
| vkramskikh | yep, let's move on | 14:52 |
| jprivard | indeed | 14:52 |
| krotscheck | Alrighty. | 14:52 |
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| krotscheck | js-openstack-lib design: Configuring The Library | 14:53 |
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| krotscheck | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/331801/ | 14:53 |
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| krotscheck | My recommendation is that we use os-client-config's clouds.yaml format. It's already a well established format, no need to reinvent the wheel. | 14:54 |
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| krotscheck | Actually, I don't think we have enough time to discuss this properly, so let's take that discussion to the review, and we'll bring it up again next week. | 14:54 |
| vkramskikh | didn't read the spec completely, but at the first glance I don't think the library should be able to search files and try to parse yaml, just accepting config as a JS object | 14:54 |
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| azemlyanov | JS does not support yaml natively | 14:54 |
| krotscheck | That is correct, it does not. js-yaml would be required. | 14:54 |
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| vkramskikh | I'll finish reading the spec and put my comments there | 14:55 |
| krotscheck | Alright, let's skip to open discussion, we'll pick up at the first unrelolved topic next week and go from there. | 14:56 |
| krotscheck | #topic Open Discussion | 14:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: javascript)" | 14:56 | |
| azemlyanov | 3000 lines and 100kb | 14:56 |
| krotscheck | azemlyanov: You mean js-yaml? | 14:57 |
| azemlyanov | yep | 14:57 |
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| krotscheck | Understood. | 14:58 |
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| krotscheck | What other open discussion items do we have? | 14:58 |
| cardeois | About test framework can we speak about it in this open discussion? or rather wait for next meeting? | 14:58 |
| krotscheck | Here's good | 14:58 |
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| azemlyanov | test framework is a very big topic | 14:58 |
| krotscheck | It really is. | 14:58 |
| * krotscheck is not expecting a resolution | 14:59 | |
| cardeois | azemlyanov but we could start at least. Like do we want to run the tests in-browser? or in node only? or both? | 14:59 |
| krotscheck | cardeois: We test what we ship. Infra has harnesses for xfvb and browser launching. | 14:59 |
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| azemlyanov | you forgot phantomjs | 15:00 |
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| krotscheck | We don' thave selenium yet, but that's on my roadmap. | 15:00 |
| krotscheck | Ok, we're out of time | 15:00 |
| cardeois | ok | 15:00 |
| vkramskikh | since we're targeting node and browsers, we need to test on node and browsers :) | 15:00 |
| krotscheck | cardeois. azemlyanov: Get you rnotes on the etherpad and we'll pick it up next week. | 15:00 |
| krotscheck | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 15:00:45 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/javascript/2016/javascript.2016-06-22-14.00.html | 15:00 |
| krotscheck | Thanks everyone! | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/javascript/2016/javascript.2016-06-22-14.00.txt | 15:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/javascript/2016/javascript.2016-06-22-14.00.log.html | 15:00 |
| cardeois | Thanks bye ! | 15:01 |
| azemlyanov | bye! | 15:01 |
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| Zara | anyone about for the storyboard meeting? | 15:01 |
| SotK | o/ | 15:01 |
| anteaya | hello | 15:01 |
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| Zara | hi! | 15:02 |
| Zara | #startmeeting storyboard | 15:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 15:02:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Zara. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: storyboard)" | 15:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'storyboard' | 15:02 |
| Zara | sorry we're a little late | 15:02 |
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| Zara | #topic Announcements | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: storyboard)" | 15:02 | |
| Zara | none on agenda, but... | 15:02 |
| Zara | review-dev is now talking to storyboard-dev | 15:02 |
| SotK | \o/ | 15:02 |
| Zara | via zaro's gerrit plugin! | 15:02 |
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| Zara | I hope we can update it to do wonderful task status things | 15:03 |
| Zara | AT SOME POINT | 15:03 |
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| SotK | thanks for that zaro, anteaya, pleia2, and others who were involved | 15:03 |
| Zara | yes! | 15:03 |
| anteaya | yay | 15:03 |
| Zara | other things... | 15:03 |
| Zara | the storyboard bugsquash is ongoing! | 15:03 |
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| anteaya | yay | 15:03 |
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| Zara | SotK has been squashing api bugs | 15:03 |
| anteaya | yay | 15:04 |
| Zara | I've been listing all the ui bugs that I keep forgetting to list | 15:04 |
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| Zara | will hopefully get round to actually *squashing* some | 15:04 |
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| Zara | any announcements I missed? | 15:04 |
| anteaya | to clarify we have the channel for 48 hours | 15:05 |
| anteaya | wednesday and thursday | 15:05 |
| anteaya | so the bug squash is two days | 15:05 |
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| Zara | ohh, I had it down as 11:00 UTC to 11:00 UTC 22nd-23rd | 15:05 |
| anteaya | but folks can spend as much time on it as they please | 15:05 |
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| anteaya | well if folks are around after 11:00 utc on the 23rd I'll still be around to help | 15:05 |
| Zara | SURPRISE EXTENDED BUGSQUASH | 15:06 |
| anteaya | I had it down as two days | 15:06 |
| Zara | well it's business as usual for us anyway | 15:06 |
| Zara | so that's fine | 15:06 |
| anteaya | woooo | 15:06 |
| anteaya | :) | 15:06 |
| Zara | if nobody else has taken the channel | 15:06 |
| Zara | betherly ^ I was wrong before! | 15:06 |
| anteaya | I booked it for 2 days | 15:06 |
| Zara | fine by me | 15:06 |
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| Zara | anything else? | 15:07 |
| SotK | I don't know of anything | 15:07 |
| Zara | #topic urgent items | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "urgent items (Meeting topic: storyboard)" | 15:07 | |
| Zara | urgency is against the ethos of storyboard. | 15:08 |
| Zara | but saying that, any urgent items? | 15:08 |
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| SotK | I got nothing | 15:08 |
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| Zara | #topic in-progress work | 15:09 |
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| Zara | I'm working on updating some of my old patches and things | 15:09 |
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| Zara | I rarely get a big block of time to focus long enough to see anything complex through, so we'll see how far I get. | 15:10 |
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| anteaya | storyboard and gerrit can talk to each other now, that was my in progress thing | 15:11 |
| SotK | I'm looking at making comments editable, as the next part of the timeline rework adventure | 15:11 |
| Zara | :) | 15:11 |
| SotK | they already are editable, but not in the UI | 15:11 |
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| anteaya | patches still need to be merged for this to be puppeted but it is up on dev servers now | 15:11 |
| anteaya | thanks zaro | 15:11 |
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| Zara | yeah, I think it's a good first step | 15:11 |
| anteaya | oh I had thought that ensuring comments were not editable was important to the timeline | 15:12 |
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| anteaya | fungi: can you confirm this | 15:12 |
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| persia | SotK: is there an audit trail for comment edits? | 15:12 |
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| anteaya | in launchpad a comment can not be edited so it is valuable as a preservation of history | 15:12 |
| SotK | persia: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332208/ exists to provide that | 15:12 |
| anteaya | it would disrupt the flow of conversation if someone could go back and edit a comment | 15:12 |
| SotK | comments have been editable via the api the whole time | 15:12 |
| Zara | the gerrit work is a good first step; I want it to update task statuses so hopefully can get to that next week | 15:13 |
| persia | Then that should make it safe. | 15:13 |
| Zara | unless anyone else volunteers | 15:13 |
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| anteaya | okay I did not know the api allowed a comment to be edited | 15:13 |
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| fungi | anteaya: i don't recall saying that comments shouldn't be editable, but if you know who did they would be the ones to ask about that concern | 15:14 |
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| fungi | i know lp (and most other bug trackers) don't allow you to change comments after the fact | 15:14 |
| anteaya | fungi: oh okay so as far are you are concerned, being able to edit a comment is fine? | 15:14 |
| fungi | i hadn't thought about it, to be honest | 15:14 |
| anteaya | ah sorry | 15:14 |
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| anteaya | perhaps it was jeblair who said something about it | 15:14 |
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| fungi | i just assumed they weren't editable since that's not typical of most bug trackers | 15:14 |
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| fungi | it definitely alters some dynamics of teh system if people can go back and change what they said in the conversation (even if there is an audit trail to be able to find out they changed it, assuming you know to look) | 15:15 |
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| persia | From my perspective, it is important to know what was originally written, for all sorts of reasons, but that is not always the best presentation (especially when people comment angry or tired). | 15:16 |
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| SotK | I agree with persia | 15:16 |
| fungi | i tend to view comments on a bug report as similar to a mailing list where people won't know to go back and reread what you said earlier to see if it changed, they tend to just assume conversations are append-only | 15:16 |
| persia | For example, many forums have an edit feature, but make it clear that edit happened. | 15:16 |
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| anteaya | I'm in the append only camp | 15:17 |
| anteaya | if a comment discussion is long and has a history I think the history needs to be preserved | 15:17 |
| anteaya | folks get tired posting to mailing lists too | 15:17 |
| persia | LP has only-admin-can-edit, which mostly means admin-deletes-iffensive-statements. | 15:17 |
| anteaya | I'm not opposed to a storyboard admin being able to delete spam comments | 15:18 |
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| anteaya | I'm not in favour of someone posting something, kicking off a larger conversation, and then going back and changing the original comment | 15:18 |
| persia | I still want an audit trail, but have no strong objection to ACLs for edit. | 15:18 |
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| SotK | my plan was/is to make it clear that a comment has been edited, when the edit happens | 15:19 |
| SotK | and have all versions available to see in the UI | 15:19 |
| fungi | i'd mostly be concerned about confusion if people who were following the original conversation have a divergent recollection/understanding from people who come later and catch up reading the altered comments, and then start talking past each other because they don't realize they're working from two different versions of a discussion | 15:19 |
| persia | Good point. | 15:20 |
| fungi | it might not be an issue for a story with a dozen comments, but when it has hundreds people won't necessarily know to go back and find the modified comments they'd previously read | 15:20 |
| anteaya | or the audit trail | 15:20 |
| persia | Especially if some people are participating.ostly be email notifications. | 15:20 |
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| fungi | so you may make it obvious to people who are just now reading those comments that they've been changed, but the people who read them before won't necessarily be aware (perhaps active notification via e-mail solves for some of that?) | 15:21 |
| anteaya | I can see this creating a lot of frustration | 15:22 |
| anteaya | rather than clarity | 15:22 |
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| * SotK finds being unable to go back and fix formatting/bad wording really annoying too | 15:22 | |
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| anteaya | well we have a preview button | 15:22 |
| persia | Active notification by email might just confuse more: out-of-order typo fixes might appear to be reiterations. | 15:22 |
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| anteaya | and the link to the markdown guide | 15:22 |
| persia | The above notwithstanding, I think I like "comments are editable only by API users" least if all the options. | 15:23 |
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| fungi | i find being unable to "fix" previous comments is a concern shared mostly by people who didn't spend decades relying mostly on usenet and mailing lists, where once you've said something it's out there forever. after a while you realize that your typos and errors are no worse than anyone else's, but you do hopefully think twice (and double-check) before you post something | 15:24 |
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| persia | Which is an increasing proportion of the population, sadly. | 15:25 |
| fungi | that said, if there are stakeholders in storyboard for whom being able to treat it more like a web forum with mutable commentary is a desirable use case, i see no reason not to make it a configurable option | 15:25 |
| anteaya | yeah expecting our users to constantly re-read entire timelines is unrealistic I think | 15:25 |
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| anteaya | I don't see bug reports as a forum | 15:26 |
| fungi | so we could have storyboard.openstack.org configured not to allow non-admins to alter comments but someone else deploying a storyboard instance could enable mutable comments | 15:26 |
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| anteaya | a global config option perhaps | 15:26 |
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| persia | fungi: do you envision UI for the editing admins? | 15:27 |
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| jeblair | i don't recall if i ever said anything about editing comments, but if you asked me now, i would say i don't think they should be editable | 15:27 |
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| fungi | persia: hadn't really thought about it. honestly for sb.o.o we would probably get away fine with a "hide comment" feature, or even just an api call | 15:28 |
| fungi | persia: in fact, if there was no feature for it at all, we would likely just use sql queries | 15:28 |
| fungi | in the (hopefully very rare) cases where it becomes necessary | 15:28 |
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| anteaya | jeblair: oh sorry if I mis-remembered but thanks for sharing your thoughts on the topic now | 15:29 |
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| persia | I believe the current state to be "comments can only be edited via API". This seems to be from long ago. I do not have a strong opinion about who should edit, but I want to +1 an audit trail patch, or -1 it in favour of admin-only on the API and no UI. | 15:30 |
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| persia | The current situation seems the least good. | 15:30 |
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| SotK | I'm not sure its really worth the effort of making it configurable, if we don't want editable comments we may as well just remove the PUT endpoint for comments imo | 15:30 |
| anteaya | can we disable comments can be edited via the api? | 15:30 |
| jeblair | persia: ++ | 15:30 |
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| anteaya | SotK: I'm in favour of that direction | 15:31 |
| persia | SotK: is removal easier than admin-only? | 15:31 |
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| SotK | equal ease, less susceptible to accidentally being broken | 15:32 |
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| persia | If admins usually have DB access, then removal seems safer. | 15:33 |
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| Zara | the nova bugs team were keen on having the ability to edit, iirc | 15:34 |
| * Zara looks for etherpad | 15:34 | |
| Zara | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nova-bugs-team | 15:34 |
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| Zara | might be a bit old by now | 15:35 |
| * SotK also wonders why editing comments is any worse than editing the description of a story | 15:35 | |
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| Zara | but that's how the task ended up listed in the first place, iirc | 15:35 |
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| anteaya | Zara: perhaps you and I can check with marcus from nova after the meeting | 15:37 |
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| anteaya | and get some clarity | 15:37 |
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| anteaya | if he is around this week | 15:37 |
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| anteaya | SotK: the description of a story isn't a conversation | 15:37 |
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| anteaya | like channel logs often I talk to you about something that I talked with someone else about yesterday | 15:38 |
| anteaya | and link you to the channel logs so you can read the converstaion | 15:38 |
| SotK | but it is still the thing which causes the conversation, and the thing the conversation is about | 15:38 |
| anteaya | if the channel logs change between my recollection and your reading of them, you and I don't have the same starting point for our converstaion | 15:38 |
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| anteaya | Zara: I see it on line 110: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nova-bugs-team | 15:40 |
| anteaya | perhaps we can share the log of this meeting with marcus and then get his thoughts | 15:40 |
| anteaya | SotK: I can't defend editing a story description | 15:40 |
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| Zara | I'd really rather have an example implementation in review, then if people find it causes problems, we change it | 15:43 |
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| SotK | I think that comment threads and references to previous conversations are two different kinds of discussion | 15:43 |
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| Zara | otherwise we'll just keep discussing it. | 15:43 |
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| SotK | anteaya: +1 for getting the thoughts of the nova bugs folk before making a decision | 15:43 |
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| SotK | I'll continue approaching a solution that allows history and such to be displayed until we make that decision, since I've already done most of the work anyway | 15:45 |
| anteaya | okay fair enough | 15:46 |
| anteaya | thanks | 15:46 |
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| Zara | np :) | 15:47 |
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| fungi | worth noting (not saying lp feature parity is a requirement) but you can edit bug descriptions in lp | 15:47 |
| fungi | just not the comments after them | 15:48 |
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| anteaya | in a disagreement I would advocate lp feature parity would be the deciding factor | 15:48 |
| anteaya | as the community already understands that behaviour | 15:48 |
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| Zara | my general approach is "wait and see what sotk does, and then cross the 'this doesn't match what people want' bridge if I have to", because he tends to be very good at guessing. | 15:49 |
| anteaya | okay once we have a reference impliemenation for folks to look at we can gather more info | 15:49 |
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| Zara | okay, any other in-progress work? | 15:50 |
| Zara | that ended up being a discussion topic :) | 15:51 |
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| SotK | xD | 15:51 |
| Zara | #topic Open Discussion | 15:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: storyboard)" | 15:51 | |
| Zara | 10 mins, go for it! | 15:51 |
| Zara | 9 mins now | 15:51 |
| SotK | in other timeline news, there is now no pagination | 15:51 |
| Zara | oh yeah! | 15:52 |
| Zara | nice one | 15:52 |
| SotK | and there is permalinking to comments | 15:52 |
| Zara | yup | 15:52 |
| SotK | and I sent patches for improving filtering a little | 15:52 |
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| Zara | ... whiiich I haven't got to yet | 15:52 |
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| Zara | well I glanced at the ui and I had some comments to make but I'll look a bit closer first. | 15:53 |
| anteaya | yay no pagination | 15:53 |
| anteaya | and yay permalinking | 15:53 |
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| anteaya | are we just waiting for the clock to wind down? | 15:57 |
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| SotK | I suspect so | 15:57 |
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| fungi | i'm happy to answer any questions i missed in these last two minutes if you need | 15:58 |
| anteaya | okay well thanks for the meeting, see you in the sprint I have to go do something now | 15:58 |
| anteaya | back in a few | 15:58 |
| fungi | but yeah, see you all in the sprint! | 15:58 |
| Zara | hehe, sure | 15:58 |
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| Zara | I don't think I have any questions right now | 15:58 |
| Zara | will probably remember afterward | 15:58 |
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| Zara | and yeah, kept the meeting open in case someone wanted to discuss something | 15:58 |
| Zara | but I am not that someone | 15:59 |
| Zara | anyway, it's open discussion all day every day in #storyboard! | 15:59 |
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| Zara | hope to see you all there! | 15:59 |
| Zara | and in #openstack-meeting for an extra day, apparently | 15:59 |
| Zara | :P | 15:59 |
| Zara | sorry about that again | 15:59 |
| Zara | will end this meeting now | 15:59 |
| Zara | #endmeeting | 15:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 15:59:41 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2016/storyboard.2016-06-22-15.02.html | 15:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2016/storyboard.2016-06-22-15.02.txt | 15:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2016/storyboard.2016-06-22-15.02.log.html | 15:59 |
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| smcginnis | #startmeeting Cinder | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 16:00:07 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is smcginnis. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:00 | |
| smcginnis | ping dulek duncant eharney geguileo winston-d e0ne jungleboyj jgriffith thingee smcginnis hemna xyang tbarron scottda erlon rhedlind jbernard _alastor_ vincent_hou kmartin patrickeast sheel dongwenjuan JaniceLee cFouts Thelo vivekd adrianofr mtanino yuriy_n17 karlamrhein diablo_rojo jay.xu jgregor baumann rajinir wilson-l reduxio wanghao | 16:00 |
| yuriy_n17 | hi | 16:00 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'cinder' | 16:00 |
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| e0ne | hi | 16:00 |
| geguileo | Hi! | 16:00 |
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| cknight | hi | 16:00 |
| ntpttr | hi | 16:00 |
| smcginnis | Hey everyone | 16:00 |
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| e0ne | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/CinderMeetings#Next_meeting | 16:00 |
| patrickeast | o/ | 16:00 |
| adrianofr | hi | 16:00 |
| tbarron | hi | 16:00 |
| _alastor_ | \o | 16:00 |
| diablo_rojo | Hello :) | 16:00 |
| scottda | hey | 16:00 |
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| eharney | hi | 16:00 |
| * DuncanT waves | 16:00 | |
| wanghao_ | hi | 16:00 |
| smcginnis | #topic Announcements | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:00 | |
| Swanson | hello | 16:00 |
| xyang | hi | 16:00 |
| smcginnis | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/cinder-spec-review-tracking Review focus | 16:00 |
| dulek | o/ | 16:00 |
| erlon | hey | 16:01 |
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| smcginnis | Please take a look at the review focus etherpad. | 16:01 |
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| smcginnis | Cores in particular - if we can spend some time working on the new drivers submissions - it would be great to get a few more of those out of there. | 16:01 |
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| smcginnis | Though with the lack of activity on some responding to comments I'm sure a few of those are not going to make it. | 16:01 |
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| smcginnis | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/newton-cinder-midcycle | 16:02 |
| dulek | geguileo: Can you update list of patches related to c-vol A/A there? | 16:02 |
| * jungleboyj is having to drop off for other commitments. Will catch up on the notes later. | 16:02 | |
| smcginnis | Just another reminder on the midcycle. Sign up if you are going, and please add any topics there. | 16:02 |
| smcginnis | jungleboyj: Fine, be that way. | 16:02 |
| smcginnis | :P | 16:02 |
| erlon | smcginnis: do they all have the CI running ok? | 16:02 |
| smcginnis | erlon: Not all of them yet. | 16:02 |
| jungleboyj | smcginnis: I will. | 16:02 |
| geguileo | dulek: Do you want a list or just the first in the series? | 16:02 |
| * jungleboyj stomps off pouting. | 16:02 | |
| smcginnis | :) | 16:02 |
| smcginnis | geguileo, dulek: Yeah, that could help. | 16:03 |
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| smcginnis | That's another one I would like to see get through and be done with. | 16:03 |
| dulek | geguileo: Good question. A list makes it easier to asses size by just looking at the Etherpad. | 16:03 |
| dulek | geguileo: …I think. | 16:03 |
| smcginnis | #info Gerrit outage July 1 @ 20:00 UTC for upgrades. | 16:03 |
| geguileo | dulek: Ok, list it is | 16:03 |
| smcginnis | Gerrit will be offline for upgrades. | 16:03 |
| xyang | smcginnis: midcycle is the week of 7/18, newton-2 is 7/12 when all specs are supposed to be approved. these dates are reversed:) | 16:03 |
| smcginnis | xyang: Yeah, as usual, not good timing. :] | 16:04 |
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| smcginnis | I would really like to try to finalize specs by then | 16:04 |
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| smcginnis | But like last time - at the discretion of the core team whether to accept any more after that point. | 16:04 |
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| xyang | smcginnis: sure | 16:05 |
| hemna | yough | 16:05 |
| smcginnis | Hopefully no last minute rewrites of major features related to desserts though. ;) | 16:05 |
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| xyang | smcginnis: right, we delayed the midcycle due to some tournaments in Fort Collins | 16:05 |
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| xyang | :) | 16:05 |
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| smcginnis | #topic Refactor quota reservation in managing volume/snapshot | 16:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Refactor quota reservation in managing volume/snapshot (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:05 | |
| smcginnis | wanghao_: Hi | 16:06 |
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| wanghao_ | hi | 16:06 |
| smcginnis | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/cinder/+spec/refactor-quota-reservation-in-managing-vol Blueprint | 16:06 |
| smcginnis | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder/+bug/1504007 Quota bug | 16:06 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1504007 in Cinder "unmanage volume/snapshot reduce quota incorrectly" [Medium,In progress] - Assigned to wanghao (wanghao749) | 16:06 |
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| smcginnis | wanghao_: Was there something you wanted to discuss with this? | 16:07 |
| wanghao_ | I talked this bug with michal, we think to fix this bug completely, need to refactor the managing existing volume/snapshots. | 16:07 |
| smcginnis | Oh? | 16:07 |
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| wanghao_ | So want to hear guy's opinion. | 16:08 |
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| smcginnis | wanghao_: Can you describe a little what is needed to be done for that? | 16:08 |
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| wanghao_ | Want to make quota reservation and commit in cinder-api instead of in cinder-volume. | 16:08 |
| dulek | Quotas on manage are broken because we don't know the size of a volume being managed in c-api. | 16:09 |
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| dulek | So we're reserving them in c-vol. | 16:09 |
| dulek | And it's hard to revert things properly in c-vol. | 16:09 |
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| xyang | dulek: should we know more about the volume size in cinder volume rather than cinder api? | 16:09 |
| smcginnis | dulek: Ah. So by the time we manage it it's too late? | 16:09 |
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| dulek | (if not impossible) | 16:09 |
| wanghao_ | yes, that means we need to call getting-size in cinder-api. | 16:09 |
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| wanghao_ | smcginnis: | 16:10 |
| smcginnis | So from c-api we would call down to get size first, then call down to manage if quotas check out? | 16:10 |
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| wanghao_ | smcginnis: yeah | 16:10 |
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| dulek | I think this was an anti-pattern in the past, that's why I wanted that to be discussed on a meeting. | 16:11 |
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| dulek | Now we have list managable volume which also works as call to c-vol. | 16:12 |
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| smcginnis | I think it makes sense, but would be interested in hearing from others on any reasons why not to do it that way. | 16:12 |
| DuncanT | list managable is not implemented everywhere, and is low performance | 16:12 |
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| wanghao_ | The point is getting volume size, since quota reservation needs that. | 16:13 |
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| xyang | how do you know the size without making a call to the backend? | 16:14 |
| xyang | this should go to scheduler first? | 16:14 |
| cknight | Why is it "hard to revert things properly in c-vol"? | 16:14 |
| geguileo | xyang: I agree | 16:14 |
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| wanghao_ | xyang: we don't know it, so we want to do it first in cinder-api not cinder-volume. | 16:15 |
| xyang | wanghao_: scheduler is involved in manage volume | 16:15 |
| DuncanT | Moving this to c-api seems not to be the right way forward, honestly | 16:16 |
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| xyang | wanghao_: I think that is why it is done in cinder volume. cinder api -> scheduler -> cinder volume | 16:16 |
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| cknight | DuncanT: +1 | 16:16 |
| dulek | xyang: When doing manage you need to specify host, backend and pool, so no scheduler needed I think. | 16:16 |
| xyang | I don’t know how you get the size in cinder api? | 16:16 |
| hemna | that can take a 'long time' to have the c-api wait for the array to report size | 16:16 |
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| hemna | c-api -> c-vol -> array and back | 16:16 |
| xyang | dulek: scheduler is involved | 16:16 |
| hemna | can be very slow | 16:16 |
| sheel | dulek:right | 16:16 |
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| xyang | dulek: it goes to scheduler first. | 16:17 |
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| smcginnis | This adds APIs for getting details: https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/cinder-specs/specs/newton/list-manage-existing.html | 16:17 |
| dulek | xyang: Oh, it only validates the host specified by the user. CHecks if a volume will fit there with filters. | 16:18 |
| smcginnis | A little different scenario, but similar. | 16:18 |
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| dulek | Okay, so here's why it's hard to do things correctly in c-vol. | 16:18 |
| dulek | It's because DB entry is already created. | 16:18 |
| dulek | (by c-api) | 16:19 |
| dulek | In other places quotas are validated before creating a DB row for a volume. | 16:19 |
| DuncanT | We can just put the volume in error if the quota reservation fails in c-vol though... it's an admin only call | 16:20 |
| dulek | So we don't have a problem - should we decrement quota counters when deleting a volume. | 16:20 |
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| dulek | Sure, but now do I decrement the quota or not when deleting? | 16:20 |
| dulek | How do I know when it failed? | 16:20 |
| DuncanT | Hmmm, a valid point | 16:21 |
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| dulek | Another option could (probably) be special error status that is set on failure modes not requiring quota decrement. | 16:21 |
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| DuncanT | error_managing? | 16:22 |
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| wanghao_ | DuncanT: that why the bug is here, we need to cover some cases, but maybe can't fix it completing. | 16:22 |
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| dulek | DuncanT: Naming isn't a problem here. ;) | 16:23 |
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| DuncanT | wanghao_: I think a special error status is less messy than moving the quota reservation, in this case | 16:24 |
| dulek | DuncanT: I don't know if new state would cover all cases. Like when volume message was lost in a way to c-vol… What do we do? Do we decrement? | 16:24 |
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| DuncanT | dulek: No, since we haven't reserved yet | 16:25 |
| dulek | We have creating status. It's like we would need "managing" status as well. | 16:25 |
| xyang | DuncanT: Is there a reason that we cannot decrement the quota reserve when it fails? | 16:25 |
| xyang | DuncanT: in cinder volume | 16:25 |
| DuncanT | "managing" seems reasonable | 16:25 |
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| DuncanT | xyang: Because we decrement quota when deleting volumes in error state | 16:26 |
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| cknight | Manila did the same thing. There are states for 'managing' and 'manage_error'. | 16:26 |
| dulek | cknight: Ouch, was it to fix the same problem? | 16:26 |
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| cknight | dulek: I don't recall, honestly. | 16:27 |
| wanghao_ | cknight: emm, that's a useful info. | 16:27 |
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| smcginnis | cknight: Do you know if there was a reason for manage_error rather than just error. Just to be clear? | 16:27 |
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| DuncanT | 'managing' matches more closely what we have with other operations, though the quota management is still different | 16:27 |
| cknight | smcginnis: I'll check. | 16:27 |
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| smcginnis | cknight: No worries, I was just curious if you happened to know. | 16:28 |
| cknight | But a managing volume has size of 0 until it succeeds, so I don't know why it's an issue with quota reservations. | 16:28 |
| wanghao_ | DuncanT: if manageing, we don't decrement the quota, and if error_manage, decrement it, right? | 16:28 |
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| DuncanT | smcginnis: Don't delete quota when deleting a volume in manage_error for us.... | 16:28 |
| dulek | cknight: It's about volume number quota I think. | 16:28 |
| smcginnis | DuncanT: Yeah, it could be a way to differentiate that operation. | 16:28 |
| hemna | DuncanT, we should be able to decrement the quota for failed manage calls though in c-vol | 16:28 |
| wanghao_ | DuncanT: | 16:28 |
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| hemna | we shouldn't have to wait for a delete | 16:28 |
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| smcginnis | hemna: +1 | 16:28 |
| cknight | dulek: Sure, so it goes to error and the quota is decremented on delete. | 16:29 |
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| dulek | Well, if Manila already tried the pattern, then why don't we? | 16:29 |
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| cknight | dulek: I discussed this with bswartz at the time, and his feeling was that a failed manage results in an errored volume that counts against quota until it is deleted. | 16:30 |
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| cknight | dulek: Since manage is admin only, the admin can always delete or force-delete as needed. | 16:30 |
| smcginnis | cknight: I wonder why. The volume was already there before on the backend. | 16:30 |
| hemna | cknight, but we don't know and may never know how much quota (space) to count against that volume | 16:31 |
| smcginnis | cknight: Seems strange to now count it against quota if it's not actually managed. | 16:31 |
| hemna | it's broken all the way around | 16:31 |
| dulek | admin-only-ness is controlled by policy.json, so I don't think we should make such assumptions. | 16:31 |
| cknight | smcginnis: Yes, but it's all consistent. Every non-deleted volume in the db counts against quota. | 16:31 |
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| dulek | hemna: Quotas are for tenants, not backends. | 16:32 |
| dulek | hemna: I think you're thinking of capacity here. | 16:32 |
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| smcginnis | cknight: I guess I can see that argument. Not saying I buy into it, but I can see the point. ;) | 16:32 |
| hemna | dulek, there are capacity quotas as well | 16:32 |
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| hemna | and counts of volumes | 16:32 |
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| xyang | DuncanT: so if we only change this for manage volume, it seems inconsistent? for everything else, we only decrement quota in delete_volume | 16:33 |
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| dulek | Volume is already on the backend, so capacity is decreased. But tenant's quotas aren't related to capacity of a single backend. | 16:33 |
| DuncanT | xyang: For everything else, we know the size early | 16:33 |
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| hemna | dulek, not sure that makes much sense to me sorry. | 16:34 |
| xyang | hemna: so our quota management does not look at capacity on the backend. they are not synced up at all:( | 16:34 |
| smcginnis | hemna: I think he's saying the reported capacity of the backend never changes in this case because it's space already consumed. | 16:34 |
| dulek | xyang: Which isn't a problem. | 16:34 |
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| hemna | I don't care about the capacity on the array | 16:35 |
| hemna | we have a size quota in cinder related to the volume sizes | 16:35 |
| hemna | anyway | 16:35 |
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| hemna | nm | 16:35 |
| DuncanT | xyang: There's lots of reasons not to sync them up.... arrays can be shared | 16:35 |
| erlon | overcommited | 16:36 |
| erlon | overprovisioned | 16:36 |
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| wanghao_ | How about to get the size from driver first, and then go to scheduler->volume? | 16:36 |
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| cknight | wanghao_: Are you suggesting a synchronous call from c-api to c-vol? | 16:37 |
| hemna | and if the driver fails to get the size? | 16:37 |
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| tbarron | cknight: +1 | 16:37 |
| wanghao_ | yes | 16:37 |
| hemna | cknight, :( | 16:37 |
| hemna | that can take a long time | 16:37 |
| tbarron | i don't like that | 16:37 |
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| cknight | wanghao_: -1 Gotta be async. https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/BasicDesignTenets | 16:37 |
| tbarron | cknight: +1 | 16:37 |
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| DuncanT | There's a sync call in on transfer volume BTW, that should be fixed if anybody wants to take a look | 16:38 |
| dulek | cknight: Whoa, cool page. | 16:38 |
| * tbarron thinks this is the kind of issue that is driving jaypipes to propose doing away with reservations (which can be rolled back and expire) in favor of claims | 16:38 | |
| * tbarron isn't sure which bandaid fix is best, but let's not change basic design patterns | 16:39 | |
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| smcginnis | So how do we move this forward? | 16:39 |
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| cknight | I see a couple options. Handle the reservations in c-vol like now (also like Manila does it). Or require a size parameter in the manage API (failing in c-vol if the number turns out to be wrong). | 16:40 |
| tbarron | maybe we live with a bug till we can do something clean and architecturally sound | 16:40 |
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| DuncanT | tbarron: That work is not going to be usable this cycle. | 16:40 |
| tbarron | DuncanT: +1 | 16:40 |
| cknight | (or wait, like Tom says) | 16:40 |
| smcginnis | cknight: I'm a fan of consistency, so following the Manila approach seems reasonable to me. | 16:41 |
| tbarron | but maybe sometimes fixiing something is just pushing on a balloon | 16:41 |
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| DuncanT | I'd prefer the state based approach - it seems least intrusive | 16:41 |
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| smcginnis | DuncanT: That manila state based approach, right? | 16:42 |
| wanghao_ | cknight: I prefer the first option too if we can't do somthing in cinder-api. | 16:42 |
| DuncanT | smcginnis: Sounds like it, yes - I haven't looked at their code | 16:42 |
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| dulek | Starting to require size would be a microversion, so we still could end up with broken quotas. | 16:42 |
| smcginnis | DuncanT: Me neither, but at least at a high level it sounds alright. | 16:42 |
| dulek | If user used older client. | 16:42 |
| cknight | DuncanT: I'll send you a link to it. | 16:42 |
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| dulek | So states seem to make sense. | 16:43 |
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| smcginnis | dulek: Passing in the expected size to the API call? | 16:43 |
| smcginnis | dulek: OK, nevermind, I see what you're saying. | 16:43 |
| dulek | "Or require a size parameter in the manage API (failing in c-vol if the number turns out to be wrong)." | 16:43 |
| dulek | I was referring to this. | 16:43 |
| wanghao_ | smcginnis: it will break the api too I think... | 16:43 |
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| smcginnis | wanghao_: Does this make sense to you? Can you take a look at the manila approach and see if you can use that for Cinder? | 16:44 |
| DuncanT | cknight: I've got it checked out, I've just not looked yet - will do after the meeting | 16:44 |
| wanghao_ | smcginnis: sure | 16:44 |
| cknight | DuncanT: ok | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | wanghao_: OK, let's leave it at that then and move on. | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | #action wanghao_ to review Manila's approach | 16:44 |
| smcginnis | #topic Fixes of 'extend volume' should'n be merged without tempest dependency | 16:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Fixes of 'extend volume' should'n be merged without tempest dependency (Meeting topic: Cinder)" | 16:44 | |
| smcginnis | erlon: Hey | 16:44 |
| erlon | Hi | 16:44 |
| erlon | this is quick | 16:45 |
| erlon | So, there are some bugfixes in the queue that seems to be trivial, but they need to be some specific backend testing to make sure all that work. | 16:45 |
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| erlon | https://bugs.launchpad.net/cinder?field.searchtext=honor&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&field.status%3Alist=INPROGRESS&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.omit_dup | 16:45 |
| erlon | es=on&field.has_patch=&field.has_no_package= | 16:45 |
| erlon | Tempest does not cover this 'path' yet, so, I added this test there: | 16:45 |
| erlon | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/310061/ | 16:45 |
| hemna | goosh | 16:46 |
| erlon | https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/4lQP2TGT/ | 16:46 |
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| hemna | tinyurl.... | 16:46 |
| erlon | sorry, I re | 16:46 |
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| erlon | I the wiki has a problem with goo.gl | 16:47 |
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| erlon | did't tried any other | 16:47 |
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| erlon | but that's it just to cores be aware | 16:47 |
| scottda | So, I believe erlon has pointed out that some patches for that fix already merged, and that those patches will fail this in-flight tempest test (because the merged patches have a bug). Am I correct here, erlon ? | 16:47 |
| smcginnis | erlon: Yeah, the wiki will block shortened URLs. | 16:47 |
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| smcginnis | erlon: OK, so you just need eyes on that. | 16:48 |
| smcginnis | Once it passes Jenkins... | 16:48 |
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| erlon | scottda: yes, some patches that should fix that have entered already, when the test get merged on tempest they can potentially break | 16:48 |
| xyang | erlon: is there a bug on what the problem in those merged patches? | 16:49 |
| erlon | xyang: it can be, but not necessarily , some BE have problems with the adopted fix. Others might have not | 16:50 |
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| xyang | erlon: I guess I don’t know what the problem is:). I may have approved some of the merged patches, but don’t know what is wrong with them | 16:50 |
| xyang | erlon: some explanation would help | 16:51 |
| smcginnis | erlon: It's not clear, so the idea is to get tempest coverage on that so we know for sure, correct? | 16:51 |
| hemna | that patch is failing liberty | 16:51 |
| hemna | is that expected to pass ? | 16:51 |
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| erlon | In general lines, the fixes that people are sending can driver.extend() from inside the driver, but, the object volume, at that point still does not have the provider_location saved, and code inside driver.extend() might try to access it | 16:52 |
| erlon | s/can/call/ | 16:52 |
| hemna | and that isn't going to get fixed in liberty | 16:52 |
| hemna | if the liberty tempest test is a real failure (due to the patch) | 16:52 |
| erlon | smcginnis: yes | 16:53 |
| hemna | that liberty failure looks like a neutron problem from what I can tell | 16:53 |
| erlon | smcginnis: I'll also add the Depends-on and recheck those patches, so, they run the test that is in tempest | 16:54 |
| hemna | gerrit seems really slow | 16:54 |
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| erlon | hemna: liberty? | 16:54 |
| smcginnis | hemna: I'm shocked. ;) | 16:54 |
| hemna | erlon, yah on your tempest patch, there is a liberty job | 16:55 |
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| hemna | huh, now I can't pull gerrit up at a ll | 16:55 |
| erlon | hemna: hmmm, | 16:56 |
| smcginnis | 3 minute warning | 16:56 |
| hemna | gate-tempest-dsvm-neutron-full-liberty | 16:56 |
| smcginnis | Anything more needed to discuss in the meeting? | 16:56 |
| hemna | FAILURE in 52m 20s | 16:56 |
| hemna | anyway, recheck should fix that one | 16:56 |
| erlon | hemna: it might be because the test is failing in the point it is now testing, the extend() | 16:57 |
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| erlon | hemna: I'll check that out, haven't looked yet | 16:57 |
| smcginnis | OK, anything else? | 16:57 |
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| erlon | smcginnis: for me its all | 16:58 |
| smcginnis | erlon: Thanks! | 16:58 |
| smcginnis | Thanks everyone. | 16:58 |
| smcginnis | #endmeeting | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 16:58:33 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2016/cinder.2016-06-22-16.00.html | 16:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2016/cinder.2016-06-22-16.00.txt | 16:58 |
| geguileo | Thanks | 16:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/cinder/2016/cinder.2016-06-22-16.00.log.html | 16:58 |
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| ShillaSaebi | #startmeeting docteam | 19:07 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 19:07:58 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ShillaSaebi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:07 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 19:08 | |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'docteam' | 19:08 |
| ShillaSaebi | hello | 19:08 |
| ShillaSaebi | anyone here for the docs team meeting | 19:08 |
| DevonBoatwright | Hello! | 19:08 |
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| vhoward | o/ | 19:08 |
| ShillaSaebi | hola | 19:08 |
| strigazi | Spyros Trigazis (magnum) | 19:08 |
| ShillaSaebi | hello :) | 19:08 |
| * smcginnis is lurking in a corner | 19:08 | |
| vhoward | ༼ノಠل͟ಠ༽ノ-︵-┻━┻ | 19:09 |
| rosmaita | o/ | 19:09 |
| ShillaSaebi | hi everyone | 19:10 |
| ShillaSaebi | #topic Specs in review #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/docs-specs,n,z | 19:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs in review #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/docs-specs,n,z (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 19:10 | |
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| ShillaSaebi | feel free to review when you can | 19:11 |
| ShillaSaebi | #topic Speciality teams: #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/Speciality_Team_Reports | 19:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Speciality teams: #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/Speciality_Team_Reports (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 19:11 | |
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| ShillaSaebi | anyone here from any of the specialty teams that wants to give us an update? | 19:12 |
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| emagana | hi all! | 19:12 |
| ShillaSaebi | The Etherpad link i posted above should have updates from the specialty team leads but if anyones here that wants to discuss anything on the specialty teams that would be great | 19:12 |
| ShillaSaebi | hi emagana! | 19:12 |
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| ShillaSaebi | I can provide an update on the ops/arch guide | 19:13 |
| emagana | I have not updates from the networking guide teams this week | 19:13 |
| ShillaSaebi | We have uploaded some enterprise docs and we are currently looking through them to see if we can add them to the ops/arch guide | 19:13 |
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| ShillaSaebi | vhoward and DevonBoatwright are planning on joining ops meetings to see if we can find volunteers to help | 19:13 |
| DevonBoatwright | Yup! | 19:14 |
| ShillaSaebi | when are those meetings happening | 19:14 |
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| DevonBoatwright | Tomorrow at 10am I'll be at the Operators Tag meeting | 19:14 |
| ShillaSaebi | ok cool | 19:14 |
| strigazi | for the project install-guide, heat and trove are merged magnum and manila are WIP | 19:15 |
| ShillaSaebi | ok great thanks | 19:15 |
| ShillaSaebi | anyone have anything else to add or update us with on specialty teams? | 19:15 |
| ShillaSaebi | #topic Countdown to release: #link http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/launch?iso=20161006T00&p0=1440&msg=OpenStack+Newton+Launch+Date&font=slab | 19:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Countdown to release: #link http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/launch?iso=20161006T00&p0=1440&msg=OpenStack+Newton+Launch+Date&font=slab (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 19:16 | |
| ShillaSaebi | 105 days | 19:16 |
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| ShillaSaebi | here are the Newton deliverables: #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/NewtonDeliverables | 19:17 |
| ShillaSaebi | any questions on this? | 19:17 |
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| ShillaSaebi | looks like were making good progress | 19:17 |
| ShillaSaebi | ok if no questions moving along | 19:18 |
| ShillaSaebi | wow quick meeting today | 19:18 |
| ShillaSaebi | #topic Open discussion | 19:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: docteam)" | 19:18 | |
| ShillaSaebi | does anyone have anything they would like to bring up | 19:18 |
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| strigazi | Fishing reviewers https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332161/ | 19:19 |
| ShillaSaebi | great ok | 19:19 |
| emagana | no from me | 19:20 |
| ShillaSaebi | anyone have anything else to bring up? | 19:20 |
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| ShillaSaebi | if not, then you guys can have your time back! | 19:21 |
| ShillaSaebi | it was a quick meeting today | 19:21 |
| ShillaSaebi | see you all next time and thank you for joining | 19:21 |
| ShillaSaebi | #endmeeting | 19:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:21 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 19:21:27 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:21 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2016/docteam.2016-06-22-19.07.html | 19:21 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2016/docteam.2016-06-22-19.07.txt | 19:21 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteam/2016/docteam.2016-06-22-19.07.log.html | 19:21 |
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| notmyname | swift team meeting time | 21:00 |
| notmyname | #startmeeting swift | 21:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Jun 22 21:00:24 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:00 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: swift)" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'swift' | 21:00 |
| notmyname | who's here for the swift team meeting? | 21:00 |
| mattoliverau | o/ | 21:00 |
| m_kazuhiro | o/ | 21:00 |
| kota_ | here | 21:00 |
| cschwede | o/ | 21:00 |
| timburke | o/ | 21:00 |
| dmorita | hi | 21:00 |
| hosanai | o/ | 21:00 |
| kei_yama | o/ | 21:00 |
| mathiasb | o/ | 21:00 |
| jrichli | . | 21:00 |
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| acoles | here | 21:01 |
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| notmyname | welcome, everyone | 21:01 |
| tdasilva | hi | 21:01 |
| notmyname | agenda for this week is at | 21:01 |
| notmyname | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Swift | 21:01 |
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| notmyname | because it's already midnight for oshritf_, we'll start with container sync first | 21:02 |
| notmyname | #topic container sync patches | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "container sync patches (Meeting topic: swift)" | 21:02 | |
| oshritf_ | :) | 21:02 |
| notmyname | this week, oshritf_ brought up these patches (again) | 21:02 |
| notmyname | patch 210099 | 21:02 |
| patchbot | notmyname: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/210099/ - swift - Add process level concurrency to container sync | 21:02 |
| notmyname | patch 225338 | 21:02 |
| patchbot | notmyname: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225338/ - swift - Add thread level concurrency to container sync | 21:02 |
| notmyname | and also oshritf_ has some performance results! | 21:03 |
| mattoliverau | cool | 21:03 |
| notmyname | #link https://ibm.app.box.com/s/bf43b9vhupjg3mz2f0pik1fjj5ugd4ca | 21:03 |
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| notmyname | summary is basically "land the patches. it's a *lot* faster":-) | 21:03 |
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| notmyname | oshritf_: do these patches apply cleanly on top of the crypto work (the crypto-review branch) or are there merge conflicts? | 21:04 |
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| oshritf_ | right, thanks John! We spent the last few weeks on performance measurements, and the results looks good - so wanted to discuss it with you guys again | 21:04 |
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| oshritf_ | I worked on applying it on crypto branch today, pushed the first patch-set not long ago | 21:05 |
| notmyname | my opinion is the same as it was in bristol: please let's land these quickly. that's slightly confounded at this very moment by the crypto merge process going on | 21:05 |
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| notmyname | oshritf_: were there merge conflicts? | 21:06 |
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| mattoliverau | oshritf_: an initial glance at the numbers, wow, that looks great, nice work! | 21:06 |
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| notmyname | mattoliverau: I know, right?! | 21:06 |
| oshritf_ | yes, I resoved them. Merged it all in one patch - processes + threads together | 21:06 |
| notmyname | oshritf_: oh, interesting. ok | 21:07 |
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| cschwede | impressive stuff! | 21:07 |
| notmyname | I don't think proposing the patch to the feature/crypto-review branch is a good idea. but I'm trying to think quickly here about a different process that might work | 21:07 |
| notmyname | maybe proposing to master with merge conflicts resolved but with the depends-on tag int he commit message? | 21:08 |
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| notmyname | but i'm not sure if resolving the conflicts would allow it to be proposed to master if the crypto stuff isn't on master | 21:09 |
| notmyname | oshritf_: the plan is to get the crypto stuff landed soon. we'll be taking up that topic later this meeting. and if you have one merged patch that has the conflicts resolved, I'd love to see that land right after crypto | 21:10 |
| mattoliverau | hmm, yeah, the fact that there were things to resolve might mean waiting for crypto to land | 21:10 |
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| mattoliverau | +1 | 21:10 |
| notmyname | but I don't know if there a way to propose the resolved patch before crypto lands or not. the alternative would be to keep it local or publish it somewhere else until crypto lands | 21:10 |
| acoles | oshritf_: where were the conflicts? looking at those patches I don't immediately see where they would be | 21:10 |
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| notmyname | hmm...I wonder if they were with crypto or with other stuff that's landed on master | 21:11 |
| acoles | internal_client maybe? can't remember if we touched that | 21:11 |
| oshritf_ | I wasnt expecting any conflicts, I wonder if I applied the right git commands | 21:11 |
| acoles | if we trust gerrit it does not report any conflicts (top right corner) but not sure if it is checking for conflicts across feature branches | 21:12 |
| oshritf_ | only sync.py and test container sync prob | 21:12 |
| oshritf_ | no conflicts with other patches | 21:13 |
| notmyname | ugh. hope I didn't miss anything. I just managed to kick my computer plug out of the wall with my feet | 21:13 |
| notmyname | crypto isn't touching those, is it? | 21:13 |
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| acoles | looking... | 21:14 |
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| notmyname | not according to `git diff --name-only master | grep sync` | 21:14 |
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| oshritf_ | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332985/ | 21:15 |
| patchbot | oshritf_: patch 332985 - swift (feature/crypto-review) - Add thread level concurrency to container sync | 21:15 |
| notmyname | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/332985/ is the one you proposed earlier today to crypto-review | 21:15 |
| patchbot | notmyname: patch 332985 - swift (feature/crypto-review) - Add thread level concurrency to container sync | 21:15 |
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| notmyname | :-) | 21:15 |
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| notmyname | oshritf_: can you propose that to master tomorrow? (instead of crypto-review) | 21:15 |
| acoles | notmyname: git diff --stat master doesnt show us touching those sync files | 21:16 |
| oshritf_ | it's on master https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225338/ | 21:16 |
| patchbot | oshritf_: patch 225338 - swift - Add thread level concurrency to container sync | 21:16 |
| notmyname | oshritf_: oh, is that one combined with the process concurrency on? | 21:16 |
| notmyname | *one | 21:16 |
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| oshritf_ | not combined on master | 21:17 |
| notmyname | ok | 21:17 |
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| notmyname | ok, so from my perspective, I'd like to see the crypto review branch land, I don't think non-crypto patches should be proposed to crypto-review, and I'd like to see the container sync stuff here land right after crypto | 21:18 |
| notmyname | also, IMo oshritf_ has done a great job being patient and also giving the great performance info | 21:18 |
| notmyname | does that make sense to everyone? or is there anything wrong with any of that? | 21:19 |
| mattoliverau | yup, i agree | 21:19 |
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| notmyname | oshritf_: how does that sound to you? | 21:19 |
| jrichli | sounds good! | 21:20 |
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| oshritf_ | I'm pro crypto too, right after crypto sounds good | 21:20 |
| notmyname | oshritf_: ok great | 21:20 |
| notmyname | thanks again for your work on this and for bringing it up again (I do feel bad that it's taken so long) | 21:21 |
| notmyname | let's move on | 21:21 |
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| notmyname | oshritf_: thanks for staying up so late | 21:21 |
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| notmyname | #topic hackathon | 21:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "hackathon (Meeting topic: swift)" | 21:21 | |
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| notmyname | if you're coming and haven't registered, please do so asap https://www.eventbrite.com/e/openstack-swift-july-2016-hackathon-tickets-25913773795 | 21:21 |
| acoles | i just cherry-picked patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/225338/ onto the crypto-review patch chain and it does create conflicts | 21:21 |
| patchbot | acoles: patch 225338 - swift - Add thread level concurrency to container sync | 21:21 |
| notmyname | acoles: ah, ok. thanks | 21:22 |
| notmyname | if you haven't gotten a hotel room yet for the hackathon, do so asap. there's a room block available, and you should register soon | 21:22 |
| mattoliverau | acoles: awesome | 21:22 |
| notmyname | hurricanerix: any updates or info on logistics for the hackathon? | 21:22 |
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| notmyname | hmm... hurricanerix may not be online | 21:23 |
| mattoliverau | the aloft already offers a shuttle to and from the castle. They can also pick you up from the airport if its at a reasonible hour. | 21:23 |
| notmyname | cool | 21:23 |
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| mattoliverau | no idea what hurricanerix has organised tho | 21:23 |
| notmyname | last I knew he was checking on the hotel room block to verify when it closes | 21:23 |
| mattoliverau | I've just stayed there a few time :) | 21:23 |
| notmyname | yeah, that's one reason he chose that hotel | 21:24 |
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| mattoliverau | I arrive at stupid o'clock so I'll need to uber. | 21:24 |
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| notmyname | any questions from anyone about the hackathon? | 21:24 |
| torgomatic | is there gonna be transportation from hotel to office-space, or should i get a car? | 21:25 |
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| notmyname | that's what mattoliverau was just saying. seems there is a shuttle from aloft to the castle (rax office) | 21:25 |
| notmyname | but I'll check with hurricanerix about that | 21:25 |
| acoles | my network has been dropping, sorry I may have missed some of container sync the stuff | 21:25 |
| notmyname | acoles: we're good. on to hackathon now (and just about to get to crypto) | 21:26 |
| mathiasb | how does it work with proposing topics/work items for the hackathon? | 21:26 |
| mattoliverau | acoles: if only yhe meeting had eventual consistancy.. oh yeah it does.. eavesdrop :P | 21:26 |
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| acoles | heh | 21:26 |
| timburke | as far as verifying when the hotel block closes, the site says july 4 | 21:26 |
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| notmyname | timburke: right, but that needs to be validated ;-) | 21:26 |
| torgomatic | ah, that's what "the castle" refers to :p | 21:27 |
| notmyname | mathiasb: we need to set up an etherpad soon to start collecting stuff. but the first agenda item is always "set the topics for the week" | 21:27 |
| torgomatic | I don't know, maybe San Antonio has an old medieval fortification for reasons | 21:27 |
| tdasilva | holding the hackathon at an old medieval castle would be kinda fun | 21:27 |
| notmyname | the neighborhood it's in is named from king arthur stories | 21:27 |
| notmyname | tdasilva: we'll have to go visit acoles again for that, I think | 21:28 |
| mattoliverau | I'm in | 21:28 |
| notmyname | (which sounds totally awesome for me) | 21:28 |
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| tdasilva | romans baths were also great! ;) | 21:28 |
| acoles | notmyname: I may be older than you but calling me medieval is a bit much ;) | 21:28 |
| notmyname | lol | 21:28 |
| mattoliverau | lol | 21:28 |
| joeljwright | :) | 21:28 |
| notmyname | ok, one other thing slightly related to the hackathon is some other midcycle stuff | 21:29 |
| notmyname | I just found out this today, so I wanted to pass it along | 21:29 |
| notmyname | the ops midcycle is in NYC august 25-26 | 21:29 |
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| notmyname | I've been to several of them, and I'm planning on going to this one too. generally good to hear from operators, and there's normally a little swift content there | 21:30 |
| tdasilva | oh, right after openstack east | 21:30 |
| notmyname | also, that same week is openstack east | 21:30 |
| notmyname | which is a like a little mini-conference | 21:30 |
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| notmyname | not really a full summit thing, but if 6 months between summits is too long to go between vendor booths, this one is for you :-) | 21:30 |
| tdasilva | notmyname: do you know if there will be any swift content at openstack east? | 21:31 |
| notmyname | but seriously, it could be interesting http://www.openstackeast.com | 21:31 |
| notmyname | tdasilva: not according to the current agenda | 21:31 |
| notmyname | however, I'm planning on going (and today is the last day for early-bird registration) | 21:31 |
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| notmyname | it's the same week as the ops summit and a few blocks away, so I'll be in NYC that week | 21:31 |
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| notmyname | and I'm looking forward to seeing a lot of other people in the community and very likely talking about the golang stuff | 21:32 |
| notmyname | I think it will be very good to do that before barcelona | 21:32 |
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| notmyname | anyway, if you're interested, I wanted to pass along the info on those events | 21:32 |
| notmyname | especially because the price for openstack east goes up tomorrow | 21:32 |
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| notmyname | tdasilva: seems theres a keynote on "openstack project governance". so no direct swift content, but stuff that pertains to us :-) | 21:33 |
| notmyname | anyway...let's move on :-) | 21:34 |
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| notmyname | #topic crypto review status | 21:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "crypto review status (Meeting topic: swift)" | 21:34 | |
| notmyname | acoles has been doing a great job managing the patch chain | 21:34 |
| notmyname | thanks acoles | 21:34 |
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| jrichli | +2 | 21:34 |
| notmyname | and to everyone reviewing, it's been looking great | 21:34 |
| kota_ | +2 | 21:34 |
| acoles | thanks for all the review comments | 21:34 |
| notmyname | (to everyone not yet reviewing, GET TO IT!) | 21:34 |
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| notmyname | acoles: from your perspective, where do we stand? | 21:35 |
| acoles | I didn't get through the updates to patch 328208 today so no new patch versions today | 21:35 |
| patchbot | acoles: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/328208/ - swift (feature/crypto-review) - Enable object body and metadata encryption | 21:35 |
| acoles | That is where we have substantial issues to work through ^^ | 21:36 |
| notmyname | ok | 21:36 |
| acoles | on etag encryption strategy, derived ivs etc | 21:36 |
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| acoles | jrichli: is seting up a call to discuss some of that | 21:37 |
| notmyname | jrichli: you wanted to set up a phone call on friday about that, right? | 21:37 |
| jrichli | acoles notmyname: yes. I have sent out an email to an initial list. If you are interested in attending, please let me know | 21:37 |
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| kota_ | jrichli: friday... morning/evening? | 21:38 |
| jrichli | I am thinking 1:45 pm UTC | 21:38 |
| notmyname | jrichli: yeah, kota_ should definitely be on that list :-) | 21:38 |
| kota_ | notmyname: is that midnight in my time, maybe? | 21:39 |
| kota_ | it's ok though. | 21:39 |
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| notmyname | close to it I think. it's before 6am my time | 21:39 |
| jrichli | I was sort of thinking 1:30 pm UTC. maybe that is better. | 21:39 |
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| jrichli | notmyname: yes, that is an issue. is there any way you would be able to make it? | 21:40 |
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| notmyname | yeah, I will be there | 21:40 |
| notmyname | if oshritf_ can stay up til midnight for this meeting (and cschwede nearly so), then I can get up early to get crypto landed ;-) | 21:41 |
| jrichli | great. I'd love to hear what torgomatic is thinking about all this too | 21:41 |
| timburke | notmyname: shortly before 7 for us, no? DST and all | 21:41 |
| acoles | I hope we can make some progress on the patch before then in gerrit and irc, I think we know there is a problem to fix with the derived iv. And there are some other comments for me to address. | 21:41 |
| notmyname | oh. I can't keep PDT and PST straight. normally I log into a server set to UTC and run `date` and then do the math ;-) | 21:41 |
| notmyname | acoles: +1 | 21:41 |
| mattoliverau | lol | 21:41 |
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| mattoliverau | word time buddy | 21:42 |
| mattoliverau | *world | 21:42 |
| joeljwright | it is easier being close to UTC :) | 21:42 |
| notmyname | acoles: from a logistics process, anything that needs to change for crypto-review? | 21:42 |
| mattoliverau | or set a calandar to iceland (who are UTC and have no daylight savings changes) | 21:42 |
| notmyname | acoles: or is it going as well as can be expected? | 21:42 |
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| acoles | notmyname: for me mostly yes, how about for reviewers? | 21:43 |
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| notmyname | IMO it's been going well | 21:43 |
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| kota_ | probably, I've not reached the final patch yet :/ | 21:44 |
| notmyname | jrichli: kota_: mattoliverau: torgomatic: timburke: logistics of crypto-review workign well for you? | 21:44 |
| kota_ | but, yes, I will be able to walk through by friday. | 21:45 |
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| torgomatic | so far, so good... I've already produced a 300-line patch that we're not gonna use :p | 21:45 |
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| mattoliverau | I'm a week behind due to moving, so still loading crypto in my head.. but so far so good :) | 21:45 |
| jrichli | going well. | 21:45 |
| notmyname | good | 21:45 |
| notmyname | last logistics thing I wanted to cover about crypto-review is timing | 21:45 |
| acoles | on patch 328204, torgomatic has suggested a change to unify the Putter classes that I have not yet processed | 21:45 |
| patchbot | acoles: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/328204/ - swift (feature/crypto-review) - Support for http footers - Replication and EC | 21:45 |
| mattoliverau | nice work torgomatic :P | 21:45 |
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| acoles | patches 328206 and 328207 have had v little review yet | 21:46 |
| notmyname | when we started crypto-review, we set an initial 2 week window for soft-freeze of master and a goal of landing it by the end | 21:46 |
| notmyname | that initial 2 week period expires on friday | 21:46 |
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| timburke | seems to be going well. i think first patch is pretty well settled now, with the second (and maybe third) nearly so. the cumulative changes are a little distracting when looking at say the fifth patch and wanting to compare patchsets 3 and 7, but it hasn't gotten to the point of me diffing `git diff` output, so that's good | 21:46 |
| notmyname | IMO, it seems highly unlikely we'll get a consensus of positive reviews by friday | 21:46 |
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| acoles | agree | 21:47 |
| notmyname | anyone disagree and think we have a good shot of landing this patch chain this week? | 21:47 |
| mattoliverau | lets see what we can do, but /me thinks this'll definitely stretch into next week | 21:47 |
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| acoles | notmyname: unfortunately I will be away immediately after the phone conf on Friday | 21:48 |
| notmyname | well, me too, but that's because I'll need to shower and eat breakfast ;-) | 21:48 |
| mattoliverau | acoles: taking the weekend off! | 21:48 |
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| notmyname | acoles: when will you be back? monday? | 21:49 |
| acoles | yes | 21:49 |
| notmyname | ok | 21:49 |
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| notmyname | here's a proposal. please say if you agree or disagree. I propose we extend the soft freeze through the end of next week, again with the goal of landing crypto-review to master at the end of next week | 21:49 |
| acoles | and like I said there's a couple of patches with no review yet | 21:50 |
| acoles | agree | 21:50 |
| mattoliverau | agress | 21:50 |
| mattoliverau | agree even | 21:50 |
| jrichli | agree | 21:50 |
| torgomatic | argee | 21:50 |
| kota_ | agree | 21:50 |
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| torgomatic | eh, you know waht I mean | 21:50 |
| torgomatic | ffs | 21:50 |
| notmyname | great :-) | 21:51 |
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| notmyname | acoles: I'd like to look at the proposed docs patches. https://review.openstack.org/#/c/312315/ and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/330070/ | 21:51 |
| patchbot | notmyname: patch 312315 - swift - Adds migrated API reference files | 21:51 |
| patchbot | notmyname: patch 330070 - swift - Add install-guide for swift | 21:51 |
| notmyname | acoles: if they look reasonable and don't conflict, then I'd like to consider landing them on master | 21:52 |
| notmyname | before crypto. since the docs team is waiting on us for that | 21:52 |
| acoles | notmyname: sure, that should be fine, IIRC its all in a new dir? | 21:52 |
| notmyname | acoles: but basically, I just want to look at them and talk with you about that | 21:52 |
| notmyname | yeah, IIRC | 21:52 |
| mattoliverau | notmyname: yes! Lana pinged me about those | 21:52 |
| notmyname | mattoliverau: yeah, and I talked witht eh -docs team yesterday (2 days ago?) about it | 21:52 |
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| mattoliverau | cool | 21:53 |
| notmyname | mattoliverau: just tell her "crypto!" | 21:53 |
| mattoliverau | I have and she's ok with that.. it seems | 21:53 |
| mattoliverau | I said soft freeze, I'll help shepherd them post | 21:53 |
| notmyname | anything else about crypto anyone wants to bring up? any questions? | 21:53 |
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| notmyname | #topic open discussion | 21:54 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: swift)" | 21:54 | |
| notmyname | anything else to bring up this week? | 21:54 |
| acoles | I know I have missed some comments along the way - if I do, please tell me, it's not deliberate! | 21:54 |
| notmyname | acoles: you're doing great | 21:55 |
| * acoles looks to timburke | 21:55 | |
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| timburke | acoles: don't worry, when i look at a new patchset, i go back through all my old comments and carry them forward if they haven't been addressed | 21:55 |
| notmyname | ok, then let's adjourn until next week | 21:56 |
| acoles | timburke: that's the way | 21:56 |
| notmyname | thanks everyone for your work on swift | 21:56 |
| loquacities | hi! happy to hold off on those swift patches if it's not too long :)O | 21:56 |
| loquacities | :) | 21:56 |
| notmyname | and, everyone, please go review crypto-review | 21:56 |
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| notmyname | loquacities: the docs ones? | 21:56 |
| loquacities | yeah | 21:56 |
| notmyname | loquacities: ack. thanks | 21:56 |
| notmyname | #endmeeting | 21:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Jun 22 21:56:51 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:56 |
| loquacities | :) | 21:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2016/swift.2016-06-22-21.00.html | 21:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2016/swift.2016-06-22-21.00.txt | 21:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/swift/2016/swift.2016-06-22-21.00.log.html | 21:56 |
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