Wednesday, 2016-07-27

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JRobinson__hello all o/ the OpenStack Docs meeting for APAC will start in about 15 minutes00:14
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JRobinson__APAC docs meeting starting in a moment,00:30
loquacitieshi everyone!00:31
loquacitiesready for a docs meeting?00:31
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loquacities#startmeeting docteam00:31
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 00:31:29 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is loquacities. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.00:31
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docteam)"00:31
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'docteam'00:31
loquacitiesheya Sam-I-Am00:31
loquacitieshaven't seen you in this tz for a while ;)00:31
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loquacitieswho do we have here?00:32
Sam-I-Amyeah, sort of trying to cut back on crazy hours... and have some other things going on in the evenings.00:32
loquacitiessounds smart!00:32
loquacitiesheya darrenc00:32
Sam-I-Ambut alas, i'm around tonight00:32
loquacitieswell, our gain, anyway :)00:32
Sam-I-Amseems kind of quiet00:34
loquacitiesit does00:34
loquacitiesno sign of katomo?00:34
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loquacitiesoh hi!00:34
katomogood morning :)00:34
loquacitiesok, we can probably call that quorum00:34
JRobinson__good morning00:34
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JRobinson__Yep, five contributors here.00:34
loquacities#topic Action items from the last meeting00:35
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loquacitiesdoesn't look like we have any00:35
loquacities#topic Specs in review00:35
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loquacitiesthis is on release notes guidelines00:36
loquacitiesand this is anne's spec about fixing hyphenation in RST filenames00:36
loquacitiesso both of those are worth a look00:36
Sam-I-Amthe first one seems useful. release notes are usually awful.00:36
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loquacitiesyeah, that's come out of discussions at summit00:36
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JRobinson__The filename spec lists exactly what docs need adjustment in the work items00:37
loquacitiesyes, i believe anne is going to enlist the relevant speciality teams00:37
JRobinson__I can work on some of the User Guide items, and Olena has also offered help00:37
JRobinson__I think it's fixable for Newton00:37
loquacitiesok, let's move on00:38
loquacities#topic Speciality teams00:38
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loquacitiesso, we have a new leader looking after the HA Guide now00:38
loquacitiesAndrew Beekhof00:39
loquacitieshopefully that will help get that book going again00:39
Sam-I-Amsure hope so00:39
JRobinson__Good to have a new leader.00:39
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loquacitiesotherwise, anne's been working hard on apip guides00:39
loquacitiesoh, and the arch guide working group is worth mentioning, too00:40
Sam-I-Amnow the user guide needs some love with the osc :)00:40
katomoSam-I-Am: good point00:41
JRobinson__Sam-I-Am, yes I'm adding the osc item to a spec00:41
loquacitieswe probably need a push to get some more contributors to that team00:41
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loquacitiesi think JRobinson__ is feeling a little lonely ;)00:41
JRobinson__The spec is for small IA and consistency edits carried over from mitaka00:41
JRobinson__loquacities, I'll have an update for the newsletter this week too00:41
Sam-I-Amwe need more contributors of original content, in general00:42
JRobinson__Only other user guide item is this bug:
openstackLaunchpad bug 1375506 in openstack-manuals "Manual recovery in cloud admin guide - assumes shared storage" [Wishlist,Confirmed] - Assigned to Joseph Robinson (joseph-r-email)00:42
loquacitiesi'll send the reminder out about speciality team reports after this meeting00:42
JRobinson__^I contacted Sean Dague and Michael Still for Docs Liason help.00:42
loquacitiesgood plan00:42
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loquacitiesany other questions/comments on speciality teams?00:43
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loquacitiesoh, actually00:43
loquacitiesSam-I-Am and JRobinson__ i got contacted by a networking guy who wants to get started committing to docs00:43
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loquacitiesname of Vijay Oks00:43
loquacitiesi pointed him in your (respective) direction00:44
Sam-I-Amnetworking guy...00:44
loquacitiesthat's about all i know about him00:44
JRobinson__good to know, thank you.00:44
loquacitiesi might send an email intro for you both00:44
loquacitiesok, let's move on then00:44
loquacities#topic Countdown to release00:45
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loquacities#info 70 days00:45
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JRobinson__10 weeks exactly.00:45
Sam-I-Amthey come around too quickly00:45
loquacitiesit's true00:45
loquacitiesso, i'm actually feeling pretty good about the deliverables list at this point00:46
loquacitiesdoes anyone have any questions or concerns on release tasks?00:46
JRobinson__Not at the moment. I think I can still complete the User Guide Newton items.00:47
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JRobinson__There's no large scale reorg this release.00:47
loquacitiesyeah, it helps :)00:47
Sam-I-Amthe net guide got a somewhat unexpected reorg :)00:47
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loquacitiesheh, yeah, i saw that :P00:48
Sam-I-AmMinor Changes00:48
loquacitiesok, that brings us to ...00:48
loquacities#topic Open discussion00:48
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Sam-I-Amshould we backport the net guide reorg to mitaka?00:49
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loquacitieswhat's the argument for doing it?00:49
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Sam-I-Amits a mess now, and a lot of people will continue to use mitaka for the forseeable future00:49
Sam-I-Amplus it makes changes to mitaka easier00:49
loquacitiesthat's a reasonable argument00:50
loquacitiesis it difficult to do?00:50
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JRobinson__Depending on the use stats for Mitaka, it might be useful.00:50
Sam-I-Ambackporting changes in general or backporting this change?00:50
loquacitiesthis one in particular00:50
Sam-I-Amits easy to do00:51
Sam-I-Amjust need to supply redirects00:51
loquacitiesin that case, it's probably worth doing00:51
Sam-I-Amaight, guess i'll submit it and see what happens00:52
Sam-I-Amand a separate patch for the redirs00:52
loquacitiesgood luck, and godspeed00:52
loquacitiesok, anything else?00:52
katomogreat work00:53
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Sam-I-Ami'm also planning to update the scenarios when i get some time00:53
loquacitiescool, ok, thanks everyone :)00:53
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openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 00:54:04 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)00:54
openstackMinutes (text):
Sam-I-Amtime to un-work for the night... later00:54
katomothanks, all00:54
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JRobinson__Thanks everyone :)00:54
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darrencthanks everyone00:54
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therve#startmeeting heat08:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 08:00:21 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is therve. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.08:00
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*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)"08:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'heat'08:00
therve#topic Roll call08:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Roll call (Meeting topic: heat)"08:00
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therveramishra, Around?08:02
therveThat'll be a quick one :)08:03
therve#topic Adding items to agenda08:03
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therve#topic Gate status08:04
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therveIt seems relatively bad these past couple of days, but it doesn't look like our fault08:05
therveInfra seems particularly slow08:05
therveramishra, Noticed anything?08:06
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thervestevebaker, Yeah not sure there is a bug in there per se08:06
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therveNodes are just super super slow and we timeout a lot08:06
stevebakerBug 1546431 may have gotten worse after ramishra's last change landed, but it may be completely unrelated08:06
openstackbug 1546431 in heat "Tests fails with SQL error 'Command Out of Sync'" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Rabi Mishra (rabi)08:06
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thervestevebaker, Where have you seen it?08:07
stevebakertherve: I've seen a couple of fedora image download timeouts08:07
therveYeah... Still better than the previous download I think08:07
stevebakertherve: in the chart on
therveAnd at least it fails fast :)08:07
ramishraAre we on to the first topic?08:07
therveAh :/08:07
stevebakertherve: we could get the fedora image cached on AFS08:07
therveramishra, The topic should be in the topic :)08:08
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thervestevebaker, I've seen that error somewhat related to infra performance, so hopefully that's just the link08:10
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stevebakertherve: you mean the image download?08:10
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thervestevebaker, No the out of sync error08:11
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stevebakerhmm, I guess a slow node could make the race more likely08:11
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therveI think so yeah08:11
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ramishrasorry guys, my network is terrible today.08:12
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therveAnyway there is not much we can do when a node takes 45 mins to setup08:12
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therve#topic N3 status08:13
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therveWe're moving sloooowwwwwly08:13
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thervePlease review more stuff :/08:14
ramishratherve: should we maintain priority reviews etherpad like we used to do in ealrier cycles?08:15
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therveramishra, I'm not a giant fan, but maybe we'll have to do it08:15
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therve#topic Open discussion08:17
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stevebakerI've started playing with gabbi today, and have it doing some basic stack operations08:18
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thervestevebaker, Is that... useful?08:19
stevebakerI'd like to propose that we write a full REST API test suite in gabbi. therve what do you think that would need to discuss? a blueprint? a wishlist bug?08:19
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stevebakertherve: having decarative REST API tests will be nice I think. And I suspect it will be the easiest thing to get into tempest core for defcore08:20
thervestevebaker, What's the point exactly?08:20
therveI though using tempest was the best for defcore08:20
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stevebakertherve: nobody maintains the REST API tests in tempest core, and they're incomplete so they're not a great start for defcore08:22
therveI guess I have enough questions that he deserves a spec08:22
therveAlso, we should probably do that in the next cycle unless there is a real rush08:22
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stevebakerno rush I think at this point, I'm just seeing if its feasible08:22
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thervestevebaker, Yeah but I wonder why rewriting stuff with another tool will make it maintenable08:23
therveInstead of improving what's already there08:23
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stevebakertesting REST APIs with declaritive yaml is *really* nice08:24
stevebakerit will likely show some issues with our api-ref because its so clear to see what is going on08:24
therveAnything else?08:26
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therveAlright, thanks08:28
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"08:28
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 08:28:19 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)08:28
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dirk#startmeeting requirements11:59
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 11:59:41 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is dirk. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.11:59
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: requirements)"11:59
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'requirements'11:59
dirk#topic rollcall11:59
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dirkif anyone has agenda items to add, please add it to #link
* tonyb has a hard stop in an hour because I have a bus to catch12:01
prometheanfiretonyb: phone :P12:01
prometheanfirewe have as well12:01
prometheanfirewe need to decide that today12:02
tonybprometheanfire: If I need to I can switch to that using the hotel wifi now so there will be a blip12:02
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dirkprometheanfire: ok, good point12:02
dirk#topic agenda12:02
*** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:02
dirkanything else for the agenda?12:03
prometheanfiredirk: it is in the open discussion section12:03
dirk#topic Any controversies in the Queue?12:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Any controversies in the Queue? (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:03
tonybJust the oslo.context stuff12:04
number80except continuing oslo.context, no12:04
coolsvapi think oslo.context12:04
prometheanfireI'd like to get in12:04
prometheanfireCheck for missing run-time requirements12:04
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dirkprometheanfire: I like it12:04
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prometheanfirebut ya, oslo.context is ever the bear12:05
number80prometheanfire: yep, it's ripe for merging12:05
dirkI guess we need to followup with a infra change creating the job ?12:05
tonybIt will be an issue until we get the "key people" in a room at the summit12:05
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tonybdirk: for the pip thing? Yeah it's pretty simple12:05
prometheanfiretonyb: cross repo stuff will help12:06
dirktonyb: yep; I was talking about the pip thing. sorry for causing confusion12:06
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tonybprometheanfire: to an extent that is true but there is a base disagreement as to what the API is and therefore what users can depend on12:06
prometheanfireya, the pip/setuptools/etc stuff will need outside talking12:06
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dirkso what can we do with oslo.context as a next action?12:07
prometheanfiretonyb: we talking about pip or cross repo?12:07
tonybpip/setuptools/etc ? what's that?12:07
tonybprometheanfire: I *thought* we were talkign about oslo.context12:07
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prometheanfireadding pip/setuptools/etc to requirements12:07
prometheanfireok, holding off on that for now12:07
tonybwe can't do that12:08
prometheanfireright, thought we discussed that already12:08
coolsvapprometheanfire: yes we need to wait for the PoC12:08
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dirk#topic controversities in the queue: oslo.context12:08
*** openstack changes topic to "controversities in the queue: oslo.context (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:09
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tonybwe can't bump oslo.context yet12:09
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tonybwe had a plan we need to get back to that12:09
dirkis the plan documented somwhere?12:09
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tonybthat will unblock people and then we can resolve it with a ml thread or a design summit session12:10
tonybdirk: in the IRC logs12:10
prometheanfirewe should send that to the ML then12:10
tonybI have a draft email ready to send but I got distracted with testing stuff12:10
tonybprometheanfire: sure I messed up12:10
prometheanfiretonyb: you are busy :P12:11
dirktonyb: can you paste the sample email into some etherpad/pastebin if you don't have time to finish it?12:11
dirkmaybe we can continue from there12:11
coolsvaptonyb: or can you send the mail12:11
tonybcoolsvap: sure12:11
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tonybIf I'd done that 2 weeks ago we wouldn't be here12:12
prometheanfireanyway, guess that's the next step for oslo.context12:12
coolsvapwe can have more discussion over mailing list thread12:12
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coolsvapi got couple of PM request for oslo.context bump12:12
dirkok so tonyb has action to send email?12:12
tonybIn short we can't land oslo.context changes right now12:12
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tonybdirk: ACK12:12
coolsvaptonyb: ack!12:12
dirk#action tonyb send mail to devel list with the action plan for updating oslo.context12:12
prometheanfirecoolsvap: ack12:12
dirkwhat is the next controversity?12:13
prometheanfirethat's it for me12:13
coolsvapi don think anything else is controversial12:13
dirk#topic Review Queue cleanup12:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Review Queue cleanup (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:14
tonybelasticsearch requires care but it isn't a big problem12:14
prometheanfireI think we've made good progress there (queue cleanup)12:14
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dirkyep, it looks great12:14
dirkI can't even keep up with reviews, things are moving quick12:14
prometheanfirewe have a few DNM patches and of course oslo.context12:15
tonyband a few otehr things in merge conflict12:15
dirk#topic Additional Gating - Updates - prometheanfire coolsvap12:15
*** openstack changes topic to "Additional Gating - Updates - prometheanfire coolsvap (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:15
tonybbut the master queue is ~12 which is pretty good12:15
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prometheanfireIn talking to tony about cross project testing his way is better12:16
tonybI discussed that with infra12:16
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prometheanfirewhile mine can select 1 test at a time from a project it's still slightly hackish in doing so12:16
tonybthe plan is the add/modify tools in project-config to enable this12:16
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tonybwe get a lot for free by doign that12:16
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tonybthe main cost is a change is that to change it we need to go via project-config but I see that as an advantage12:17
coolsvaptonyb: that is good news12:17
coolsvapI liked the change prometheanfire made12:18
tonybI have jenkins generating the new jobs but I have a syntax error somewhere12:18
prometheanfireoh, nice12:18
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coolsvaptonyb: cool12:19
dirktonyb: any reviews/pointers you can share?12:19
tonybcoolsvap: it's nice, it just goes in a direction the community rejected befoer Austin12:19
prometheanfireneeds a new template is the big thing iirc12:20
tonybdirk: not yet still testing locally, but it's similar to
tonybjust more typing12:20
tonybI'll probably re-use that review as the intent is the same and Clark is helping with "the plan"12:21
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dirkanyone who can help with that or are you covered?12:22
tonybdirk: If I can;t get it done today I'll hand it off12:23
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dirkok, great. thanks :)12:23
dirk#topic u-c for setuptools and sometimes wheel12:23
*** openstack changes topic to "u-c for setuptools and sometimes wheel (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:23
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dirkodyssey4me: ..12:23
coolsvaptonyb: we can work on this as a team12:23
prometheanfiredirk: he might be a bit, I think he is having another meeting now12:24
coolsvapdirk: not sure if odyssey4me is around, we can wait till he has the PoC ready12:24
dirkok, postpone this to later12:24
tonybBefoer he gets here12:24
tonybwhat are we trying to do *exactly*12:24
prometheanfirehe's in london, so is about12:24
prometheanfiretonyb: OSA wants to lock down EVERYTHING12:25
prometheanfiremore or less, that's the use case12:25
prometheanfiremainly to keep broken pips away, etc12:25
prometheanfiresetuptools have had problems too12:26
* odyssey4me is lurking, but in another meeting12:26
tonybWe can't add pip because itll break/be pointless setuptools is in there12:26
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prometheanfiretonyb: yep, it's a harder problem12:26
coolsvaptonyb: so we needed more input in the last meeting from people who already tried it12:26
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coolsvapdo you know some background around this?12:27
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odyssey4meI'm happy to go with the guidance of what everyone thinks is best - we have our own tooling to lock pip, setuptools and wheel down already... I just thought it may be of value to the broader community.12:27
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tonybcoolsvap: less than some but I have a little12:27
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odyssey4mehappy to chat about this a bit later, after this meeting12:27
tonybwheel is strange I need to look into that12:27
coolsvapodyssey4me: sure12:28
prometheanfireodyssey4me: using virtualenvs to help allows you to do it, not sure it's as easy system wide12:28
dirkgood for next topic?12:28
coolsvapodyssey4me: welcome to add a WIP change for review so that we can talk/experiment12:28
coolsvapdirk: yes12:28
dirk#topic Tasks from Etherpad - PTL12:28
*** openstack changes topic to "Tasks from Etherpad - PTL (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:28
dirkalready a topic?12:29
prometheanfirewe should open nominations for a week and then have a week of voting imo12:29
prometheanfirebut that's all I have about that12:29
dirkptl self-nomination is Sep 12th onwards as far as I can see12:30
tonybDo we *need* an election12:30
dirkdo we want to setup a PTL for newton?12:30
tonybdo we have multiple people that are commited to running?12:30
prometheanfiredirk: that might be better12:30
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prometheanfiretonyb: I'd volunteer, I think you'd be good too :P12:30
tonybWe need one in the interim becuase of the way the elections are run12:31
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tonybprometheanfire: so if we open the nominations you *will* run or you *might* run?12:31
dirkok, so we should start a week of self nominations?12:32
dirklike, e.g. next week? :)12:32
tonybokay so that's me and you so we will need to do the nominatons unless we agree as a core group on a candidate12:32
prometheanfireit's not really an issue, but a lot of people can vote, given how requirements are done12:32
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prometheanfiretonyb: ya, that'd work12:33
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dirktonyb: do we need to vote for the interim PTL?12:33
dirkI remember that you can just propose one or a small group for bootstrap purposes12:33
tonybdirk: I'm pretty suer that the first PTL can be appointed12:33
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tonyband then we'd run an offical process with the other PTLs12:34
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dirkyep, so if we can agree on one or two PTL interims until we have the Ocata cycle I think we can just ask the TC to appoint those one/two people12:34
coolsvapI think we can appoint interim PTL12:34
tonybdirk: one PTL12:34
tonyba project can only have one name in the yaml ;/12:34
coolsvapthan having two elections in one cycle12:34
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dirktonyb: I created a big tent projects iwth two PTLs. while it wasn't liked it was accepted for (half a ) cycle12:35
dirkanyway, if we can agree on one person then thats fine12:35
* dirk is not going to run and certainly fine with the options so far :)12:35
dirkok, now how do we move forward?12:36
tonybdo it here12:36
dirkcandidates should just add themselves to section 3.2.1 ?12:36
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tonybit's more transparent12:36
dirkor expect an email on -dev mailing list?12:36
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tonybI think we pick one here, that person uploads a review to governance and email os-dev12:37
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prometheanfireshould we discuss pros/cons for each nominee then vote?12:37
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tonybprometheanfire: sure, we can make statements that'll give dirk a change to read the meetbot docs on running a vote12:38
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dirklets revisit this next week12:38
dirkpeople who want to candidate update the etherpad12:38
prometheanfiredirk: then I'd have to run the vote :P (and figure out how) lol12:39
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dirkdoes anyone volunteer to drop a mail about this to -dev ?12:39
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prometheanfireI can do that12:39
dirk#action prometheanfire announce etherpad for interim PTL nominations12:40
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dirk#topic Tasks from Etherpad12:41
*** openstack changes topic to "Tasks from Etherpad (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:41
dirkanything else we need to discuss?12:41
dirk1.3 looks done, do we want to cross it off the list?12:41
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dirk3.13 is now also done, right?12:42
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prometheanfireI'm not sure 1.3 can be considered done12:43
prometheanfireit's non-voting12:43
prometheanfireand not passing atm12:43
dirkah, thanks for the explanation12:43
dirklets add that as TODO then :)12:43
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dirkwe should be moving 3.1, 3.3, 3.4 to DONE12:44
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prometheanfireya, so 3.13 is waiting on 1.312:44
dirkIMHO 3.6 as well12:44
tonyb2.x looks like it can go12:45
tonyb3.3 can go12:45
dirkarghhh. deleting stuff changed all numbering12:45
dirkuh oh.12:45
prometheanfire+1 to 3.1 3.3 3.612:46
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coolsvapcan we just strike through the DONE items?12:46
dirkyeah, striking is better. sorry. I'll fix this up again after the meeting12:47
prometheanfire3.3.1 isn't done12:47
prometheanfire(was 3.4.1)12:47
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dirkprometheanfire: its in the context of "goals for the requirements group", and that group was established so its done imho12:48
coolsvap3.5 is also done by number8012:48
tonybCan I suggest we move things around so the TODO items are in an independant section and start at 1.0 rather than the nested structure we have now12:48
prometheanfireya, just crossed it out12:49
prometheanfiretonyb: works for me12:49
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tonybokay lest do that after the meeting12:49
prometheanfiresection 3.3 should be moved under 3.112:49
dirktonyb: yep, just moving stuff during the meeting jus tdestroys the workflow for the disucssion12:49
tonybstrikethrough is good for now12:49
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prometheanfireya, we can contune the etherpad cleanup to out of meeting12:49
prometheanfirenext topic?12:50
dirkanything else we can strike through now or can we go on?12:50
dirk#topic optional-requirement12:50
*** openstack changes topic to "optional-requirement (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:50
dirknumber80: ^^12:50
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coolsvapi think the draft looks good, we need review related to it12:51
prometheanfirenext? we still have to discuss mascots12:51
dirknumber80: wanna give a status update or a comment?12:51
coolsvapand a mailing list thread12:52
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coolsvapthat was the action item from last meeting12:52
dirkok, thanks12:52
dirk#topic Volunteer for next 2 meetings12:52
*** openstack changes topic to "Volunteer for next 2 meetings (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:52
prometheanfireI have next one12:52
dirkanyone for August 1th?12:52
dirkAugust 10th?12:52
dirkif not I can do it again12:53
tonybnumber80: we shoudl talk about the optional stuff as I'm very confused12:53
coolsvapI can do 10th I might be PTO on 17th12:53
dirk#agreed coolsvap  will run August 10th12:53
dirk#topic Open Discussion - Project Mascot?12:53
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion - Project Mascot? (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:53
number80tonyb: yes12:54
dirkwe need to be quick as deadline is today12:54
number80(sorry got disconnected from ssh)12:54
tonybI think we order the list of optionsa and make it the foundations problem12:54
coolsvapI think beaver is good12:54
number80well, we have a clear winner according votes12:54
tonybit gives them the ability to self manage12:55
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prometheanfirewe need to give them a few12:55
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prometheanfiretonyb: +112:55
tonybthat way if 2 teams pick beaver then they can just fix it12:55
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tonybOur preferene is beaver and here are 3 others12:56
* dirk fails to understand why beavers manage requirements12:56
prometheanfireso, anyone else have ideas to add?12:56
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prometheanfirespiderweb was another option12:56
prometheanfireas it demonstrates the linking going on12:57
tonybYeah a web is good12:57
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prometheanfireadded it12:58
prometheanfirevote kthnx12:58
dirkok, so next step is? who is mailing Joy?12:58
tonybprometheanfire: ;P12:58
dirk#action prometheanfire  send voting results today to Marketing team12:58
prometheanfirethat's fine, since it's in just a few minutes12:59
dirk#topic Open Discussion12:59
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: requirements)"12:59
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coolsvapto the channel I think12:59
prometheanfiretonyb: take your bus :P12:59
coolsvapless than 60 seconds12:59
dirkyep, lets end this here12:59
dirkhanks, and sorry for running this a bit slow12:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"12:59
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 12:59:56 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)12:59
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coolsvapthank you dirk13:00
openstackMinutes (text):
tonybThanks all13:00
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Yipeihi, all13:01
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joehuang#startmeeting tricircle13:02
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 13:02:04 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is joehuang. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.13:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tricircle)"13:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tricircle'13:02
joehuang#topic rollcall13:02
*** openstack changes topic to "rollcall (Meeting topic: tricircle)"13:02
joehuang#info joehuang13:02
huangdongfeng#info dongfeng13:02
zhiyuan#info zhiyuan13:02
Yipei#info Yipei13:02
yinxiulin_#info yinxiulin13:02
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joehuanghello, the first topic is about microversion13:03
joehuang#topic microversion13:03
*** openstack changes topic to "microversion (Meeting topic: tricircle)"13:03
yinxiulin_I just finished microversion coding today13:03
joehuanghi, Xiulin, how about the micro-version support in Tricircle?13:03
yinxiulin_I just finished microversion coding today13:04
joehuanggood, is there tempest test cases for microversion?13:04
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yinxiulin_no yet13:05
joehuanghi, ronghui13:05
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joehuangno special tempest test cases for microsversion?13:05
joehuangbut I am sure unit test should be there in Nova \13:05
yinxiulin_i have not debug the code13:05
joehuangNova is the first service to support microversion13:06
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joehuangso you can borrow Nova microverion test cases13:06
ronghuiwhat is microversion13:06
yinxiulin_ok , i wanna finisend the debug first13:06
yinxiulin_then i will coding the tempset13:06
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joehuangso go on the implementation, than you, xiulin13:08
joehuangthan -> thank13:08
joehuang#topic big tent application13:09
*** openstack changes topic to "big tent application (Meeting topic: tricircle)"13:09
joehuanghello, I shared the big tent application in the irc channel about the second round discussion13:10
joehuangwould like to know your ideas on the comment13:11
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zhiyuanhmm, the most important point tc members complain is that we are using api gateway.13:15
joehuangwe need to ensure api consistency through tempest test cases13:16
joehuangTCs are afraid the in-consistency in the API13:16
zhiyuandifferent from other openstack services, which provides its own designed api, tricircle is serving request for vm, volume and networking13:16
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joehuang#topic open discussion13:18
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: tricircle)"13:18
joehuanghow about the features API implementation progress13:19
zhiyuando you think it will be more acceptable if we provide a set of new api to manage vm, volume and networking?do you think it will be more acceptable if we provide a set of new api to manage vm, volume and networking?13:20
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zhiyuanfor networking part, i am working on l3 networking on shard vlan network13:21
joehuangfor new API, it's even more difficult to get other software work with13:21
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joehuangthank you zhiyuan13:21
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zhiyuani have reconstruct the code to put networking operation in a helper module, and move the router setup to xjob13:22
zhiyuanthis is some preparation13:22
joehuanggood progress13:23
ronghuifor cinder part we are working to perfect the basic function13:23
ronghuii mean complete13:23
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joehuangdo you know how to open tempest test cases for new feature?13:24
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ronghuiIf there is some relevant documents can provide help13:26
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zhiyuanthen what about runing tempest test on your own environment?13:26
joehuangok, there is one example in this patch to show how to open tempest test cases for volume feature13:26
zhiyuansince you need to run tempest test locally before you submit your code13:27
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Yipeistill working on dynamic pod binding. recently, i am trying to catch a deadline of a conference. After the deadline (1st, Aug), i will denote myself to coding, and will finish it as planned13:27
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joehuangin this file:
joehuangjust need to add one regex line to include the tempest test cases for your feature13:29
joehuangfor example TESTCASES="$TESTCASES|tempest.api.volume.test_volumes_get"13:29
ronghuii will try it in our environment13:30
joehuangwill include all test cases matched with test_volumes_get13:30
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joehuangif you submit a patch, it'll be executed by the gate-tricircle-dsvm-functional13:31
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joehuangif the job failed, you can click the job, and find a lot of files to provide debug information why the test cases failed13:32
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joehuangas zhiyuan proposed, you can test locally using tempest first, it'll be easier to find out the failure13:32
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ronghuithanks so much13:33
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joehuangto Yipei, thanks for you information13:33
joehuangto Ronghui, welcome13:33
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joehuangother topics?13:34
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zhiyuanno for me13:34
ronghuino for me13:35
huangdongfengno for me13:35
Yipeino for me13:35
yinxiulin_no for me13:35
joehuangok. let's end this meeting now13:35
ronghuii just want to ask the problem that in local.conf13:35
ronghuiand just see the code is update13:35
joehuangso the issue is fixed13:36
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joehuangthank you for attending the meeting, let's keep online in #openstack-tricircle for daily communication13:37
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"13:37
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 13:37:51 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)13:37
openstackMinutes (text):
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krotscheckDum dee dum...13:59
* krotscheck waits for the seconds to tick down...13:59
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krotscheck#startmeeting javascript14:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 14:00:01 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is krotscheck. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'javascript'14:00
krotscheck#chair vkramskikh14:00
openstackCurrent chairs: krotscheck vkramskikh14:00
msmolhello all14:00
cardeoishello !14:00
betherlyhi hi!14:00
krotscheckGoood morning everyone!14:00
krotscheckLet's talk javascript!14:00
krotscheck#topic Action followup: Docs14:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Action followup: Docs (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:01
krotscheckAll the doc jobs, plus a bonus Hey Let's use NodeJS6, are available here:
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* Zara takes a look (hi!)14:02
cardeoiscool ! so if we use nodejs6 that means we could run test with and without babel right?14:02
krotscheckI'm creating two jobs. One is the docs-draft job, which will upload that job's doc deliverables to so we can test it.14:02
yujunzHow do you manage so many search queries?14:02
vkramskikhI think babel is still needed at least for es6 modules14:02
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krotscheckyujunz: ... the little search bar in the top right?14:02
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krotscheckThe second job will publish the docs to underneath the /sdk path.14:03
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cardeoisawesome !14:03
yujunzI mean you seem to have many filters for different scopes14:03
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krotscheckSince js-generator-openstack and js-openstack-lib work together to support each other, I'll be publishing both of those projects as part of the sdk.14:04
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yujunzlooks good. I'll have a look at the patchsets14:04
krotscheckyujunz: I'm not certain I udnerstand your question?14:05
betherlysounds awesome thanks for sorting krotscheck14:05
krotscheckAlso, I've created a reusable job template which can be used by other projects to publish their docs. Storyboard, for instance, can publish them, simply by providing a different path paraemter.14:05
krotscheckJust in case you want to do that :)14:05
yujunzNot related to this topic. Just ignore my comments on the search query14:05
Zaraah, we were wondering about what to do for webclient docs the other day14:06
krotscheckyujunz: Gotcha14:06
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Zaraso sounds intriguing14:06
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krotscheckRelated to this, I had to update ALL the javascript jobs so they now explicitly include the nodejs version.14:06
krotscheckThis'll help us upgrade in the future.14:06
krotscheckSpecial callout to `madong for helping me update the installation job.14:07
cardeoiscool, it's not possible to set a default version?14:07
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krotscheckcardeois: Infra specifically asked not to do that.14:07
krotscheckcardeois: vis-a-vis python27-jobs, python35-jobs, etc14:07
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cardeoisOh I see, so it's explicit which version you use14:07
krotscheckI'll report again on this once it lands next week. Any questions?14:07
msmolthat makes sense14:07
msmolgood job krotscheck14:08
krotscheckcardeois: Right. And for the time we'll actually be using both 4 and 614:08
yujunzGood for me14:08
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krotscheckApologies to betherly because I totally just took this and ran with it and forgot to loop her in :(14:08
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krotscheck#topic Action followup: Simple Keystone Client14:09
*** openstack changes topic to "Action followup: Simple Keystone Client (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:09
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msmolso, good news and bad news:14:09
msmolgood news: I've got a simple client working, authenticating with keystone!14:10
krotscheckwendar \O/14:10
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krotscheckWrong channel14:10
msmolbad news: having some trouble with fetch-mock for one of my tests14:10
msmolso, I think I should have a review open later today once I sort the issue with fetch-mock14:10
vkramskikhI think you can upload the review request with workflow -1, we can help to fix it14:11
krotscheckDid you use that vagrantfile of mine at all?14:11
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msmolvkramskikh: okay, I might end up doing that14:11
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cardeoisNo we have our own openstack at work, we used this one14:12
krotscheckcardeois? Nice14:12
msmolkrotscheck: no didn't end up using vagrantfile, like cardeois said, used own openstack from work14:12
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krotscheckDoes anyone have any questions for cardeois?14:12
cardeoiskrotscheck: You mean msmol?14:13
krotscheckYes, msmol14:13
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krotscheckAlright, let's see what he uploads and go from there :)14:13
cardeoisNope I guess open the review and we'll comment14:13
msmolI guess that's a no ;-)14:14
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krotscheck#topic Action followup ES2015 rules in eslint-config-openstack14:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Action followup ES2015 rules in eslint-config-openstack (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:14
yujunzNo. But I'm interested in the vagrantfile. Is it for creating an openstack for testing?14:14
vkramskikhhi, here is the review request:
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krotscheckyujunz: Yeah - already landed. it "should" work by just going 'vagrant up' in your root directory.14:14
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vkramskikhit changes the project structure, I don't know much about it14:15
vkramskikhso reviewers are welcome14:15
vkramskikhthe new es2015 config will be accessible via "extends: openstack/es2015"14:16
vkramskikhusing the same npm package - eslint-config-openstack14:16
krotscheckvkramskikh: I assume it's backwards compatible?14:16
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vkramskikhkrotscheck: no it doesn't and it will break es5 projects14:16
krotscheckvkramskikh: oooooh.14:16
vkramskikhbut it just extends base config adding es2015-specific rules14:17
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krotscheckvkramskikh: Sorry, maybe I misstated my question. If an ES5 project continues to use extends: openstack, and we update the version of eslint-config-openstack, will it break?14:17
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krotscheckI think the answer is 'no, it's backwards compatible'.14:17
* krotscheck is not expecting the rules to be backwards compatible.14:17
vkramskikhno it won't, the original config hasn't been changes14:17
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krotscheckAlright, so I would argue that this warrants a minor version release rather than a major version release.14:18
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krotscheckWe're adding a new feature, but not breaking the API in any way14:18
krotscheckAnyone disagree?14:18
vkramskikhwe might want to bump a version14:18
vkramskikhmajor version14:18
vkramskikhsince there is eslint 3.x is out14:18
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krotscheckThey move fast.14:19
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krotscheckAlright, so, let's move on the the other action items and talk about releasign eslint later.14:19
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krotscheck#topic Action followup: Devstack-gate and CORS14:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Action followup: Devstack-gate and CORS (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:20
krotscheckcardeois? The floor is yours.14:20
cardeoisYeah so I have a review opened
cardeoisMissing the project_config part, I didn't have much time to work on it but I almost have a functionnal flow14:21
cardeoisHowever we've been discussing with krotscheck about how we implement it properly14:21
cardeoisWe might have some shell scripts to publish in js-openstack-lib so we don't depend too much on project-config14:21
cardeoisI'll try to open the project-config part by next week if that's fine for you guys?14:22
krotscheckYeah, apparently the devstack-gate project (maintained by infra to install and run devstack in the gate) does weird copying and chown things to the project under test.14:22
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krotscheckyujunz: As soon as this settles out, I'd like to add a devstack-gate option to the generator.14:22
cardeoisYeah also, I might rebase my review once this is merged so feel free to take a look14:23
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krotscheckcardeois I'll help you work on this this week so we can have it ready by next week.14:24
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krotscheckAny questions for cardeois?14:24
cardeoisok sure, but I can't work on that today, I to work for my company a little :-)14:24
krotscheckcardeois: That's fine, that means I have a clean runway :)14:24
krotscheckOk, moving on.14:25
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krotscheck#topic Create api document with jsdoc14:25
*** openstack changes topic to "Create api document with jsdoc (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:25
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yujunzThe existing comments in js-generator-openstack have been converted into jsdoc14:26
krotscheckI am not familiar with doclets. Looks like a parallel service to travis, coveralls, etc?14:26
yujunzIt's a jsdoc publishing site14:26
krotscheckThank you for doing that, yujunz :)14:26
yujunzPreview the output help me finding some bugs14:27
yujunzSince we are publishing it to soon14:27
yujunzI think we don't need to go further on doclets now14:27
krotscheckWell, just because we're publishing our docs doesn't necessarily mean that they're actually being built properly.14:28
krotschecki.e. do we know how jsdoc is getting incorporated into the sphinx docs?14:28
krotscheck(I don't know, I just don't recall anyone working on that)14:28
yujunzI can have a look at it14:28
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yujunz#action yujunz to look into how to incorporate jsdoc into the sphinx docs14:29
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krotscheckHOnestly, I feel like we're glossing over a really important discussion re: how do we write docs, what format do we use, etc. here.14:31
krotscheckHowever, I'm content to put yujunz in charge of that :)14:31
krotscheckAnd just accept his expertise.14:31
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ZaraI'm interested in that, fwiw. we've had some different opinions about best practices for ui docs already.14:32
krotscheckZara, can you give us an overview?14:32
yujunzI'm interested too, Zara14:33
krotscheckI know there's a big camp that says "If your UI needs to be explained, it's not that good"14:33
krotscheckBut, well, we're building reusable things that will be consumed by those that read documentation.14:33
Zarayeah, I'm often in that camp. but also, when is it appropriate to say 'this element is in x position' when the position may change? because that adds a maintenance burden14:34
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Zaraand I think that kind of description is harder to automate than api docs, since the relation between elements is visual14:35
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Zaraespecially when things are differently positioned for different screen sizes14:35
Zaraso I guess I'm wondering at what point it's better to have no docs than something out of date, how to keep things up to date, that kind of thing, since I assume it's always going to be a human responsible for it14:36
krotscheckPiet may have good input on that.14:36
krotscheckI came across this article a few years ago, it still holds true.14:38
krotscheckEither way, this feels like an extended, offline discussion, let's move on.14:38
krotscheck#topic Releasing eslint-config-openstack14:38
*** openstack changes topic to "Releasing eslint-config-openstack (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:38
krotscheckSo, after the es2015 rules land we definitely have a reason to cut a new version, the quesitno is whether we want to update to eslint3 before or not.14:39
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krotscheckI had a general vague handwavey idea that the eslint rule major version would track eslint's major version.14:39
krotscheckSo if we bump to 3, I'd like to get eslint 3 in as well.14:39
krotscheckbetherly, you're core on that project, what do you think?14:39
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vkramskikhit think that makes sense, and the bump would be easy - the list of breaking changes isn't big14:40
betherlyI think that is sensible to move to eslint 314:41
vkramskikhAFAIR the most important change there is that node <4 is not supported anymore14:41
krotscheckThankfully that doesn't impact us anymore ;)14:41
betherlyas vkramskikh says there aren't that many things that will need changing as a result14:41
betherlyi think if we wait longer we will end up with bigger issues later down the line14:41
krotscheckAlright then. betherly, think you can take that on? Updating eslint, pushing a release, etc?14:41
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betherlyi can handle that. i might be coming to you for advice with some of it though krotscheck :)14:42
krotscheck(And, urm, documenting how you do it so the process isn't just in my brain anymore? :)14:42
betherlyof course :)14:42
krotscheck#action betherly Shepherd ES2015 and ESLint 3 through to a release of eslint-config-openstack.14:43
krotscheck#topic Library configuration14:43
*** openstack changes topic to "Library configuration (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:43
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krotscheckSo, I added this on a whim just now, but realized I'm not really ready to talk about it without seeing what msmol's put together.14:43
krotscheckReally, I want to talk about how we initialize an instance of our API library pointed at a specific cloud.14:44
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krotscheckIn a perfect world, I'd like every service to be an initializable class like "new Keystone(config)"14:44
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krotscheckThe question is whether we want a big overarching "new OpenStack(config)" as well.14:45
msmolfor right now what I've got is this: `const os = new Openstack(config, cloudName); os.authenticate()`14:45
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krotscheckThat seems sane. I'm ok punting the discussion to msmol's patch and/or next week.14:46
cardeoisYeah I guess if we want to look like shade, but in a JS way (with promises and stuff) `new OpenStack(config)` makes more sense14:46
cardeoisI think later we could add autodiscover support for config14:46
msmolsounds reasonable14:47
* krotscheck likes putting off the Autodiscover feature toa time when we actually have people who use our library that we can talk to.14:47
vkramskikhthough we may still want to include clients separately. for example, fuel may take advantage of this lib, but it needs only Keystone client. so it would be great just to "import Keystone from 'js-openstack-lib/keystone'"14:47
vkramskikhso that only Keystone client would be in the resulting bundle14:47
vkramskikhafter project build14:48
cardeoisMhh good idea yeah14:48
krotscheckThat'd help with finely focused apps, like tiny dashboards that only talk to one or two services.14:48
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krotscheckSo, let's say we have an app that wants to use nova, and nova is authenticated with Keystone. How do we get those two instances to talk to each other?14:49
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krotscheckI mean...14:49
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krotscheck"const keystone = new Keystone(config); const nova = new Nova(config);"....14:49
krotschecknow I want to do nova.createInstance(arguments);, how do I tell it to use my keystone tokens?14:50
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msmol`nova = new Nova(keystone);`?14:50
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krotscheckmsmol:... that... is definitely the sensible obvious answer.14:50
krotschecki.e. (Hey don't bother configuring yourself, ask keystone for your config).14:51
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vkramskikhwe may want to take a look into how it's done in python clients - don't think js approach will differ a lot14:51
krotscheckAny disagreements for trying that as an initial approach?14:51
msmolok, so I've got some refactoring to do, but sounds good to me14:52
msmolshould still have the review out today at some point I think14:52
cardeoisyep me too14:52
krotscheckOk, does anyone want to start working on one of the non-keystone API libraries once msmol has something up and running?14:52
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krotscheckSounds like most of us are already busy.14:53
krotscheck8 minute waring14:53
cardeoisWell honnestly me and msmol have only 1 day a week we can work for openstack, so not sure we can add more work14:53
larainemakrotscheck, I would like to try14:53
krotschecklarainema wins!14:53
krotschecklarainema: Which service would you like to work on?14:54
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msmoljust to clarify cardeois's comment: the two of us have an internal budget of 1 day per week to work on open source projects of our choosing on company time :-)14:54
krotscheckmsmol, cardeois: Indeed. And we appreciate you donating your time to our cause :)14:55
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larainemaI am more familiar with glance, might be try first14:55
* krotscheck makes a note to pay their bar tab the next time he sees them.14:55
krotschecklarainema: Perfect choice. Easily separated from other projects, not huge and unwieldy like nova ;)14:55
krotscheck#action larainema Start implementing a glance API on top of msmol's keystone work.14:56
krotscheckmsmol, cardeois: You two are in... montreal? Toronto?14:56
krotscheckLet's switch to open discussion14:57
krotscheck#topic Open Discussion14:57
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: javascript)"14:57
cardeoisYeah are you guys going to the summit in barcelona?14:57
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krotscheckDon't know yet. Depends on The Powers That Hold The Purse Strings.14:57
yujunzNot planned yet.14:57
cardeoisIt would be cool to setup a work session maybe, if there's enough people?14:57
krotscheckIf people vote for my "Beyond Horizon: Building Custom User Interfaces with the JavaScript SDK" talk, it'll be easier for me to justify.14:57
cardeoisYeah me too, might go, but not confirmed14:57
msmolhehe indeed. I was there in Austin so I may have to let cardeois or another coworker hit up Barcelona14:58
* krotscheck plugs himself shamelessly14:58
cardeoisYeah voted already14:58
krotscheckI'm actually working on getting SDK working sessions via the APP WG. Shade, JS-Lib, libcloud, etc.14:58
* msmol promises to vote14:58
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krotscheckSo that's on me.14:58
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krotscheck#action krotscheck Work on getting an SDK working session at the summit.14:58
krotscheckOk, we're out of time.14:59
krotscheckThanks everyone14:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"14:59
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 14:59:25 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)14:59
cardeoisOk bye !14:59
openstackMinutes (text):
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msmolbye everyone, 'til next week14:59
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Zarabye! next up, anyone around for the exciting storyboard meeting?14:59
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Zara#startmeeting storyboard15:01
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 15:01:17 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is Zara. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: storyboard)"15:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'storyboard'15:01
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Zara#topic Announcements15:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: storyboard)"15:01
Zaranone from me15:01
Zaranone on agenda15:01
Zaramoving on!15:01
Zara#topic Urgent Items15:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Urgent Items (Meeting topic: storyboard)"15:01
Zaranothing disastrous has happened this week, so this is also empty, yay!15:02
Zara#topic In-Progress Work15:02
*** openstack changes topic to "In-Progress Work (Meeting topic: storyboard)"15:02
ZaraI have a few things listed; will start with mine to give others some time to get here...15:02
ZaraI've been updating the python client!15:02
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Zarathis should make it easier to interact with storyboard with scripts15:03
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ZaraI'm also planning to put a command-line interface on it, for those who prefer to interact with things that way15:03
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Zarafirst I need to learn how to actually do that.15:03
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Zaraanyway, yeah, some misc patches in review here:15:04
Zaraand a visual representation of what's covered here:15:04
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Zaraas you can see, I've left all the trickier bits 'til the end. but it's getting there. :)15:05
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Zaraand the things people do more frequently are already covered (thanks again, nikitakonovalov :))15:05
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Zaranext thing is 'page to view all boards'-- I'm stuck as the search typeahead would *not* behave for me; SotK has offered to help when he gets a minute15:06
SotKoops hi15:06
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ZaraHI THERE15:06
ZaraSotK: any in-progress things you'd like to mention?15:07
SotKI'm still working on the events timeline for boards/worklists15:07
SotKI have lots of lovely events in my database now15:07
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SotKI said I'd rework the complex priorities before now15:08
SotKI guess I'll do that after the meeting15:09
Zaraokay, I'll get ready to review15:09
Zaraother things...15:09
Zaragerrit integration patches are still in review15:10
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ZaraI was about to link but my internet is slow15:10
Zarahere we go15:10
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Zarasteadily, we're getting there!15:10
* SotK is looking forward to that stuff being merged15:11
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Zaraif you're interested in storyboard updating tasks automatically from gerrit, that is the place to go15:11
Zarayes, me too15:11
ZaraI may have mentioned it just a few thousand times15:11
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Zaraand we still have some API docs waiting from anteaya15:12
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* SotK will try to get around to reviewing them soon15:13
ZaraI've held off commenting on the worklists and boards things recently, since I'm looking at those in the client and I'll probably be able to post something more helpful after that15:13
Zarahi betherly!15:13
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SotKhey betherly15:13
Zarasince atm we can merge with 'TODO's, or I can learn more about POSTs and PUTs and put some more useful commands in those spaces.15:14
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Zaraand since that's what I'm doing right now anyway, it's on my list for after15:14
Zaraare the relevant patches. also spent this morning checking branches and milestones things, so hopefully have some comments up on those soon15:15
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Zaraany other in-progress things?15:16
* SotK doesn't have any15:16
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Zarano discussion topics, so...15:17
Zara#topic Open Discussion15:17
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ZaraI had a question that I can't remember15:19
Zarathis happens literally every week15:19
ZaraI guess I'll mention that I'm onto the bit I'm less familiar with with python client things, so I may be asking a bunch of questions about syntax for things15:20
Zarahopefully once I've got the answers once, I won't have to keep asking15:20
Zarabut there's a warning!15:20
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Zarawe also just discussed docs for js things a bit in the js meeting, so I'm going to try to keep up with those discussions so we can have some sort of sensible webclient docs situation15:21
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SotKseems like a good idea15:22
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ZaraI think it'd be good to coordinate; I think some of the discussions we've had are going to crop up anywhere a tool has a more... visual? interface15:23
Zaraso yay for consistency15:23
Zarawell, that's all I can remember, anyone with anything else?15:23
Zaraotherwise I'll end the meeting in a few15:23
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ZaraIT'S ALL OVER15:25
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"15:25
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 15:25:30 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:25
openstackMinutes (text):
Zarathanks, everyone!15:25
SotKthanks Zara, sorry I was late :)15:25
ZaraI'll forgive you one day15:26
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smcginnis#startmeeting Cinder16:00
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openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 16:00:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is smcginnis. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'cinder'16:00
smcginnisCourtesy ping: dulek duncant eharney geguileo winston-d e0ne jungleboyj jgriffith thingee smcginnis hemna xyang tbarron scottda erlon rhedlind jbernard _alastor_ bluex vincent_hou kmartin patrickeast sheel dongwenjuan JaniceLee cFouts Thelo vivekd adrianofr mtanino yuriy_n17 karlamrhein diablo_rojo jay.xu jgregor baumann rajinir wilson-l reduxio wanghao thrawn01 chris_morrell watanabe.isao16:00
diablo_rojoHello :)16:00
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* TheDude abides16:00
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smcginnis#topic Announcements16:00
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*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:00
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smcginnisNo big announcements this week.16:01
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smcginnisI think we had a good productive midcycle last week. Thanks to all who participated.16:01
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smcginnis#link Review focus16:01
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smcginnisWe've started to make some progress on the priorities we identified at the summit.16:02
smcginnisHA in particular.16:02
dulekThanks to hemna for providing us the hangout and recording!16:02
smcginnisSo what we discussed was getting these in as long as they don't break the non-AA case.16:02
e0nedulek, hemna: +216:02
smcginnisThen once it's in there working through better testing and identifying any issues.16:02
smcginnisSo basically just some "beta" support for this release.16:03
smcginnisYes, thanks hemna for once again being our awesome AV team! ;)16:03
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duleksmcginnis: I don't think the stuff we've got in is actually functional from HA perspective. It's more like "prerequisites".16:03
smcginnisdulek: OK, "alpha" support then. ;)16:04
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smcginnisReally just somethign to be able to start working on better testing.16:04
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smcginnisPre-alpha even...16:04
geguileodulek is right, these are prerequisites16:04
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* dulek is pointing that out to make sure this won't make it to project update presentation. ;)16:04
smcginnis#link Release schedule16:05
smcginnisdulek: Good call. ;)16:05
e0nesmcginnis, geguileo: IMO, we have to write some basic testcases fo HA to start working on tests16:05
e0nesmcginnis: any news about os-brick? we're blocked 2 months16:05
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smcginnisSo we're a little over a month away from newton-3.16:05
geguileoe0ne: As agreed in the midcycle I plan on creating a document with things I've manually tested16:05
smcginnisFinal library freeze is before that though.16:06
diablo_rojoe0ne: I think we are still waiting on privsep stuff16:06
e0negeguileo: please, ping me tomorrow. I'll take a look on our internal test cases for HA16:06
DuncanTif this privsep thing isn't sorted soon, we should pull it out and go back to rootwrap16:06
smcginnise0ne: The patch to add hard-coded support of privsep to rootwrap is going through the gate queue as we speak!16:06
geguileoe0ne: Thanks!16:06
e0negeguileo: I've missed today's QA meeting :(16:06
diablo_rojosmcginnis: Yay!16:06
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hemnayah we need to make the rootwrap privsep patch a blocker16:07
hemnathat needs to land16:07
smcginnisSo once that's through and a new oslo.rootwrap release is out we can finally release os-brick!16:07
e0nesmcginnis, diablo_rojo: I +2'ed all patches related to privsep and rootwrap16:07
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e0nesmcginnis: great!16:07
TheDudeI thought QA meeting was Thursday16:07
diablo_rojoe0ne: Cool :) Hopefully that should get this moving16:07
smcginnisI'll watch for that release and get a new os-brick one out once that lands.16:07
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hemnathat needs love16:07
e0necan we get merged before new release?16:08
hemnaI'll look at it16:08
smcginnisWe do have some time before all the oslo stuff makes it through to be useable for us.16:08
e0nehemna: I'm sorry, I didn't had a time to review and test patch with connectors refactoring today16:08
hemnawe could use a CI for it16:09
smcginnisSo yes, please take a look at os-brick patches and get some of those through that should get in there.16:09
hemnae0ne, I have to rebase that refactor patch again today...another merge conflict.16:09
hemnaI'd like that to land16:09
smcginnisWe can do another brick release before final library freeze, but the more runtime we have on some of these changes the better.16:09
hemna(after I fix the merge conflict again today)16:09
smcginnishemna: That would be good. But also scares me with the size of it. ;)16:10
e0nehemna: +1. I'm going to review and test it asap16:10
hemnaI'll fix that right now.16:10
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e0nesmcginnis: TBH, it's not a big patch to review. a lot of LoC are changed, but almost all code are the same16:10
smcginnisBiggest problem is all the failing third party CIs, IMO. Would feel more comfortable with more green there, but I'm not going to hold my breath.16:10
smcginnise0ne: Yeah, it looks a lot worse than it is.16:10
e0nesmcginnis: the main changes are in connector.py16:11
hemnaI think the 3PAR brick CI is supposed to be working right now..16:11
* hemna crosses fingers.16:11
smcginnis#topic Volume Group Hiding\Protecting16:11
*** openstack changes topic to "Volume Group Hiding\Protecting (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:11
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smcginnisSo apparently no one wants to put there names on things anymore.16:11
smcginnisWho's topic is this?16:11
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xyang2saggi: your topic is up16:12
saggiyes, that's me16:12
smcginnissaggi: Take it away. :)16:12
saggiSo I put a draft for the BP.16:12
saggiBut I'll give the elevator pitch now16:12
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e0nesaggi: did you post a spec patch?16:13
DuncanTThis one makes me nervous with the level of detail that's there. No details about the interaction with normal cinder API. What happens if the tenant deletes a volume ina  hidden CG? Snaps it? Puts it in another CG? etc16:13
smcginnis#link Hidden group spec work in progress16:13
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xyang2DuncanT: volume in a CG cannot be deleted individually, but it is possible to remove or add, so good to add that16:14
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smcginnisSo wouldn't that be extremely confusing to an end user if a volume is in a hidden CG and they try to delete it?16:14
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DuncanTxyang2: So now the tenant suddenly gets volumes that they can't delete, without a good explaination of why. Not good.16:15
smcginnissaggi: So how does Smaug handle the case now where a volume is being protected but gets deleted?16:15
e0neDuncanT: +1. it will be very confusing for users16:15
xyang2DuncanT: I see what you meant.  almost like all volumes need to be hidden as well16:15
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saggismcginnis: We still don't set up consistency groups.16:15
smcginnisHiding the actual volumes seems even more confusing.16:15
smcginnissaggi: I mean without CGs16:15
saggiYes, we detect that16:15
smcginnissaggi: So why are CGs different?16:16
saggiSince they implement a continues feature.16:16
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dulekLocking the volumes instead?16:16
xyang2saggi: I believe you have problem with individual resource as well?16:17
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smcginnissaggi: Not sure I follow.16:17
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saggiSo if we just do a point in time backup. We do a full scan at that point in time and figure what's available16:17
xyang2saggi: so if smaug backs up a volume and that volume can be deleted in cinder, wouldn't that be a problem too16:17
saggiNo, since it didn't exist at that point in time16:18
saggibut if we create a consistency group to facilitate replication and the user modified it. We think that things are being replicated. But they aren't.16:18
saggiAlso we don't create volumes. (unless you are restoring). But if we create a consistency group the user might wonder where they came from.16:19
smcginnisNot sure I like this, but I think it should still be dynamic like that. Maybe scan volumes, add to CG to get consistent snap, then remove after snap is complete?16:19
xyang2saggi: so this is only a problem for replication?16:19
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xyang2saggi: because it is continuous, not point in time?16:19
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saggiAnd also that we create an auxiliary entity visible to the user16:19
saggiThat they might not understand16:20
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smcginnisI think obvious naming could help. "smaug-cg-xxxx-xxx-xxx-xx-xxx"16:20
DuncanTIf we make replication groups have a description field, we can put an explaination in there16:20
saggiIt similar to why tmp\helper files in desktop applications are hidden. The user might want to modify\delete them. But you don't want them always visible in you $HOME16:21
cFoutswhat about making replication status available via the API?16:21
saggiI suggested that as the Alternative16:21
saggiJust putting it in the description16:21
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saggiBut if we end up making a lot of CS for some reason. They might clutter thing for the user.16:21
flip214still the users need to look that up to understand why the volume can't be deleted16:21
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saggiA description is a must. The hidden feature is just to prevent confusion and clutter.16:23
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saggiWe don't anticipate making a lot of groups. So clutter might not be an issue.16:23
DuncanTI was honestly hoping replication groups will be a different entity to CGs16:24
saggiBut it does impact the UX if you keep seeing smag-cs-<SOME_GUID> in your list16:24
smcginnisDuncanT: Good point - they are, aren't they?16:24
xyang2DuncanT: it is different16:24
smcginnisThis all depends on xyang2's work.16:24
smcginnisSo the naming on this isn't accurate calling it consistency groups.16:25
DuncanTSo they'll only appear on the replication group list, which is exactly where you want them.16:25
smcginnisIf this is talking about tiramisu replication.16:25
saggiDuncanT: That's above my pay grade.16:25
smcginnissaggi: ;)16:25
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DuncanTsaggi: :-)16:25
smcginnisDuncanT: I think you are right.16:25
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smcginnisSo we're a little ahead of things IMO.16:26
smcginnisWe don't even have replication groups yet.16:26
smcginnisSo something to keep in mind, but we're not there until we actually add that feature.16:26
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saggiConsistency group for backup we don't fear malice since we fix them before each backup but they still might clutter things.16:27
xyang2saggi: we don't have CG for backup yet16:27
saggiWe *can* fix them. We don't use them yet.16:27
DuncanTsmcginnis: Makes sense. Nice to have a clear explanation of the problem now16:27
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xyang2saggi: we have CG for snapshot if that is what you are referring to16:27
saggixyang2: We plan to snapshot and copy from it.16:28
xyang2saggi: ok16:28
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smcginnisSo... doesn't seem like we are making any progress here.16:29
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smcginnissaggi: Could you actually submit that as a spec and we can discuss it there?16:29
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saggismcginnis: Sure16:29
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smcginnissaggi: Thanks. I think we all need some time to digest this and figure out what the need is and how this will look to the end user.16:30
saggiI'll also write about our user cases for backup and replication so it's clearer.16:30
smcginnisWe should probably readdress soon.16:30
smcginnissaggi: Perfect - thanks!16:30
saggismcginnis: np16:30
smcginnis#topic Tooz locks for volume drivers16:31
*** openstack changes topic to "Tooz locks for volume drivers (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:31
smcginnisAnother anonymous topic. :)16:31
bluexsoory, this one is mine16:31
DuncanTWe need a wiki blame command :-)16:31
smcginnisbluex: All your then...16:31
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bluexok then, we have tooz locking in base cinder code16:31
bluexnow we need them too in volume drivers16:31
smcginnis#link RemoteFS driver inheritance16:32
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bluexfor now
openstackLaunchpad bug 1606698 in Cinder "Volume drivers should use distributed lock manager" [Undecided,New]16:32
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bluexbut I'll be splitting it to separate bug reports for each driver16:32
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smcginnisbluex: Have you grepped for how many dirvers are not using the distributes lock decorator?16:33
duleksmcginnis: Definitely these ones:
smcginnisI agree it would be good to have bug reports for specific drivers.16:33
e0nebluex: who will be responsible for bug fixes? drivers maintainers or cinder community?16:33
duleksmcginnis: But that may not be a complete list.16:33
hemnasmcginnis, +116:33
bluexyup, all of them are mentioned in bug report16:33
geguileoe0ne: It should be driver maintainers16:34
smcginnisbluex: Ah, I see.16:34
duleke0ne: I would be more comfortable if driver maintainers would switch that.16:34
bluexthere are quite a lot of drivers using synchronized(..., external=True) decorators16:34
smcginnisgeguileo: +116:34
xyang2smcginnis: what is the decision on this now?  Should all drivers be changed to use tooz?16:34
geguileoe0ne: Because they are the ones who actually know if locks need to be distributed or if it's enough to be external16:34
e0neagree, just want to be sure that we're on the same page16:34
smcginnisAt least I would want the driver maintainers to +1 any change made by someone else.16:34
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geguileoxyang2: Only drivers that require the DLM to work in Active-Active need to move to Tooz16:35
smcginnisxyang2: In preparation for HA AA, yeah, I think so.16:35
e0nesmcginnis: driver maintainer + CI report should be required16:35
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smcginnise0ne: +116:35
xyang2geguileo: smcginnis, ok, thanks16:35
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smcginnisbluex: So you will create specific driver bugs. Anything else on this?16:36
DuncanTsmcginnis: Who's taking on the job of poking the maintainers who don't respond? There are always a bunch16:36
DuncanTsmcginnis: I've not got time this time16:36
smcginnisDuncanT: Yeah, true.16:36
bluexI think that's all, only wanted to raise awareness of this :)16:36
smcginnisDuncanT: I think if a bug is filed against their driver and they don't address it, then it sits there and users of that backend now there may be issues doing AA.16:37
smcginnisNot the best story, but it is what it is.16:37
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smcginnisPart of the bigger issue of vendors not paying attention to bugs filed against their drivers.16:37
smcginnisbluex: Cool, thanks for bringing this up.16:38
smcginnisAnd on the topic of uninvolved vendors...16:38
DuncanTsmcginnis: I'm not sure we need a vendor to approve every change... that's one of the reasons I try to -2 changes that make the drivers too difficult to understand16:38
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smcginnis#topic Non-CI compliant driver removal16:38
*** openstack changes topic to "Non-CI compliant driver removal (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:38
DuncanT(like being entirely hidden in third party libraries)16:38
smcginnisDuncanT: Yeah, we can make a judgement call for sure.16:39
smcginnisSo for CI - at the midcycle we discussed CI enforcement.16:39
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smcginnisTrying to come up with a concrete policy about enforcement.16:39
smcginnisWe decided to start with looking at how many haven't reported in more than 22 weeks.16:39
smcginnisWhoa - 2 weeks, not 22. :)16:40
smcginnisAlthough that's pretty bad too.16:40
smcginnis#link CI's not reporting > 2 weeks16:40
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smcginnisNot sure if this is 100% accurate.16:40
smcginnisBut it's a start for looking at it.16:40
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smcginnisThere are a few on here that I know haven't been reporting for some time.16:41
smcginnisSo I think I will put up some driver removal patches for a few that I know for sure haven't been around.16:41
DuncanTStart putting the removal patches up and post the list of them on the mailing list. No point being overly soft about this, and we don't have to rush to merge the patches16:41
smcginnisWe can wait a week like we discussed and if they are not addressed, then we can +A the patches.16:41
hemnathat's a lot of CI's16:42
smcginnisBut it should be a clear warning shot.16:42
hemnaDuncanT, +116:42
hemnado it16:42
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cFoutss/warning shot/incentive16:42
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diablo_rojoDuncanT: +116:42
diablo_rojosmcginnis: +116:42
smcginnisAnd if we post a patch and post to the ML and get no response from a vendor, that's a clear indication they are not paying attention and not involved in the community as they should be.16:42
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erlonsmcginnis: +116:43
diablo_rojosmcginnis: +116:43
_alastor_smcginnis: +116:43
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DuncanTWe've got time for them to come back into the fold before release if they want to16:43
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hemnaFWIW, the HPE_STORAGE_CI has been reporting16:43
smcginnisSo a lot of agreement. I want to make sure we think about all sides, so if anyone disagrees it's completely OK to speaj up.16:43
hemnafor example,
diablo_rojoDuncanT: I think we decided so long as its before M3?16:43
smcginnishemna: Yeah, I know there's some other ones there. I won't be posting a patch for that.16:43
hemnait just makes me wonder how valid that list is then16:44
hemnasomething isn't right16:44
smcginnisdiablo_rojo: Yep, I believe that's waht we agreed on.16:44
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hemnacan we verify the veracity of that tool that generated that list ?16:44
smcginnishemna: It's based on info on the third party CI wiki, so it's only as accurate as that information.16:44
_alastor_hemna: It's meant to be a heuristic.  Definitely file bugs if you find them :)16:44
hemnaas it's not working16:44
smcginnisTo be clear - I'm only going to post patches for the ones on there that I know for a fact are not reporting.16:44
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smcginnisI will do a little double checking before I do anything.16:44
DuncanTdiablo_rojo: Honestly I missed the fine detail, sound quality was sketchy. The sooner we get the removal patches posted the better though16:45
diablo_rojoDuncanT: That's what my wonderful notes in the etherpad were for :)16:45
smcginnisBut things like X-IO, Tintri (ironically), Tegile, etc. are all missing for a while now.16:45
hemnawait, the tool uses the wiki to determine which CI's are reporting ?!16:45
hemnaI'm confused16:45
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_alastor_hemna: I'll look into why it's reporting HPE as not reporting16:45
diablo_rojo_alastor_ can you explain how it works?16:46
erlonhemna: agreed there's something missing/passing in the list, Iv been watching the CIs in this patch and counted a lot more than what is in the list missing:
hemnawe can take this offline16:46
smcginnis_alastor_: I'm guessing name change or something not reflected. /HP/HPE/16:46
hemnait just doesn't look like the data is accurate at all.16:46
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_alastor_It's using the wiki, so it's only as accurate as the information there.  We don't have any single place that has all the necessary information, so it's a best-guess system16:47
hemnathe tool isn't working16:47
hemnait's completely broken IMHO16:47
smcginnisIt gives some useful hints.16:47
hemna_alastor_, the wiki says HPE is online and reporting16:47
hemnaagain, the tool is broken.16:48
_alastor_hemna: agreed, something is up.  I'll take a look and see if I can fix it.16:48
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hemnathe wiki doesn't seem like the right place to scrape IMHO16:48
xyang2_alastor_: can you post the command so everyone can give a try?16:48
e0neIMO, we should to have policy of drivers removinf if CI is not reported for N weeks16:48
smcginnisI will also compare against here
smcginnisAnd manual checking, last comment, etc.16:48
hemnathe wiki may say the CI is reporting....16:49
smcginnise0ne: That's what we're discussing. :)16:49
hemnawhen it's not.16:49
hemnacan we rethink this in cinder channel please16:49
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hemna(the tool)16:49
smcginnisThe policy agreed on was 2 weeks no reporting a patch goes up for removal. 1 week to give a chance to respond and address and it goes through.16:49
_alastor_hemna: The tool uses Gerrit queries to determine the last time a CI reported on a patch16:49
e0nesmcginnis: yes, I've missed a part of this. my point is: we have to implement policies and follow them16:49
smcginnise0ne: Totally.16:49
hemna_alastor_, *sigh*.  which is it?  the wiki or gerrit ?16:49
hemnayou are saying 2 different things every time I Ask.16:50
smcginnisThat's the hope that we can set a clear policy that we consistently enforce.16:50
diablo_rojoe0ne: It was a discussion we had on day2 I think16:50
hemnathe policy is great16:50
erlon_alastor_: cant the toll use the driver_list tool on Cinder to get the driver list and check it they are reporting?16:50
hemnawe just need a tool that isn't useless.16:50
smcginnishemna: Who's saying 2 different things?16:50
_alastor_hemna: Wiki to get the initial information (like gerrit account info) then gerrit quries using that information16:50
hemnasmcginnis, first he said the tool uses the wiki, then he just said it uses gerrit.16:50
* hemna is very confused16:50
hemnaeither way, it's broken.16:51
smcginnisLet's not get too hung up on the tool at this point. It's sure to have some issues, but it can be improved over time.16:51
smcginnisOr replaced by something else if we find a better solution.16:51
cFoutssmcginnis +116:51
smcginnisSo far we've had Tintri's dashboard, patrickeast's dashboard, some last-comment scripts.16:51
hemnaI just don't want folks getting driver removal patches put up based upon bogus data from a broken tool.16:51
_alastor_erlon: What is that?16:51
smcginnisNo one has been able to come up with one tool that works the best.16:51
hemnaI'm all for a tool that helps automate it, but it needs to work.16:51
e0nehemna: +116:52
_alastor_hemna: agreed16:52
smcginnisSo I'm just using this as one input to help identify where to look.16:52
diablo_rojosmcginnis: Point being, time to get reverting :)16:52
hemnathat's why I'm hung up on the tool.16:52
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smcginnisWe are a long way from where we can blindly automate anything based on its results.16:52
erlonhemna: I woudn't say its useless, just needs some tunning. It helped with the list. We just need to work on the false negatives16:52
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hemnalets get it to work, and I'm all for it.16:52
erlon_alastor_: there's a script that list all drivers in Cinder16:52
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erlon_alastor_: tools/generate_driver_list.py16:53
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smcginnisMy ideal would be something that uses that list of drivers, matches it up with specific tests run by CIs, and gets the data on a per-driver basis.16:53
smcginnisIt's that mapping that's the killer.16:53
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smcginnisDuncanT: Didn't you have a proposal at one point to keep somethign in tree?16:54
hemnacan we add a CI_NAME attribute to each driver ?16:54
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e0ne hemna: great idea!16:54
smcginnishemna: CI_NAME and CI_TESTNAME. That could work. At least most of the time.16:54
DuncanTI did, yes. I originally wanted to add an attribute to the drivers, several people prefered a yaml file16:54
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_alastor_smcginnis: That would definitely make the job easier16:54
hemnahp_3par_fc.HPE3PARFCDriver.CI_NAME="HPE_Storage CI"16:54
erlonhemna: I think would be better to add the driver name to the CI NAME16:55
smcginnisAnd now that we have the interface compliance checks, we can enforce that all drivers implement somethign like a get_ci_name() call.16:55
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DuncanTThe one thing that a yaml (or similar) file can add is a list of the files that make up a driver16:55
hemnasmcginnis, +116:55
diablo_rojosmcginnis: +116:55
_alastor_smcginnis: +116:55
hemnathe yaml file can get out of sync with the driver16:55
DuncanTsmcginnis: You need to be able to instantiate the driver to call that though, unless it's a classmethod16:55
hemnathe driver should be the source of truth IMHO.16:55
e0nesmcginnis: could you send mail to openstack-dev about CI_TESTNAME attribute, please?16:55
DuncanThemna: I can agree with that16:55
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smcginnise0ne: Let's think about that one a bit first.16:56
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smcginnisI like the idea, but want to stew on it a bit.16:56
hemnawant me to throw together a WIP ?16:56
smcginnishemna: Sure, that would be great!16:56
hemnaok cool.16:56
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smcginnis3 minute warning.16:56
hemnaI'll just do a few drivers at first and see what it looks like.16:56
smcginnisAnything else?16:56
DuncanThemna: If you can get the file list in there somehow, that would be awesome :-)16:57
_alastor_If we could get the CI account name and actual CI job name that would be great16:57
smcginnisOK, I'll call it. Thanks everyone!16:57
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:57
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 16:57:47 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:57
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e0nesee you next weel!16:58
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krtaylor#startmeeting ironic_qa17:07
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 17:07:13 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is krtaylor. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:07
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: ironic_qa)"17:07
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'ironic_qa'17:07
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krtaylorhello all, I am assuming that jlvillal is out today17:07
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krtayloras always agenda17:08
krtaylor#topic Announcements17:08
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: ironic_qa)"17:08
jrollsam's big jjb refactor landed \o/17:09
jrollalso, infra pointed out to us that we have far more jobs than other projects, and we should be working to reduce that17:10
sambetts\o/ and it didn't break everything17:10
jrollpart of that is our ipmitool transition, which was held back because of reliability concerns17:10
jrollI'd like a volunteer to work on the reliability there17:10
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jrollso we can finish switching over17:10
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clarkbjjb said 83 integration tests17:10
sambettsclarkb: generated or actually being used though?17:11
clarkbwhich is also a problem17:11
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jrollright, so we need to work on reducing that17:13
devanandaI don't have time to dive into the ipmitool proxy work, but I agree it's important to pivot to that soon17:13
jrollgetting rid of the ssh jobs is one part17:13
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krtaylor link to share work, spec, blueprint, defect?17:13
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jrollkrtaylor: not sure I have one right now17:13
sambettsthis ^ is were all the different permutations are defined now17:13
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krtaylorthanks sambetts17:14
devanandajroll: how about combining the driver tests into a single (slightly longer) run ?17:14
sambettsas you can see we have 4 differnt drivers being tested, 2 different types of disk image, then you have src or not-src for the ramdisks17:14
sambettsthe permutations grow quite fast17:14
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jrolldevananda: yeah, I've thought about doing e.g. whole disk vs partition in one run17:15
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jrollif we boot two instances on two nodes, and they're configured to use different images17:15
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jrollseems reasonable for one run17:15
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jrollso no takers to hack on ipmitool job reliability?17:17
sambettswhen we remove *_ssh job that'll reduce the generated jobs massivly17:17
krtaylorcould we get down to testing one (or two) default driver(s)?17:17
jrollkrtaylor: yes, the goal is to remove the ssh drivers17:18
* sambetts is willing to help with virtualbmc etc17:18
sambettsno idea what there is to do though17:18
jrollthanks sambetts17:18
jrollbasically, it's too unreliable to make voting17:18
jrollI'm not sure why :)17:18
sambettsI've seen weird failures with it even this morning with ironic failing to power on a node, lucas was looking into it17:20
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mjturek1is there a common failure on the ipmitool job? ie - the one seen here
mjturek1just asking because we see this one on the powerkvm ci every now and then and aren't sure why yet ^17:22
jrollmjturek1: well, that's a generic "the deploy timed out" sort of thing, the root cause is typically "ramdisk booted too slow or not at all"17:23
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mjturek1ahhh okay17:23
rajinirmjturek1>: Any errors in the conductor logs?17:23
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mjturek1yeah it's the node not powering on17:24
jrollmaybe come back to this in open discussion :)17:24
mjturek1which jroll mentioned17:24
mjturek1yeah :)17:24
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krtaylorok, let's move on then17:25
krtaylor#topic Multi-node Grenade17:25
*** openstack changes topic to "Multi-node Grenade (Meeting topic: ironic_qa)"17:25
sambettsI believe there are a few patches to get this working17:26
krtaylorstatus has not been updated in a while on the etherpad17:26
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krtaylorhm, 332490 isn't there - adding it now17:28
jrolloh, cool stuff17:28
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krtayloranything else to mention here?17:30
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sambettsNo Vasyl has mainly been working on it17:31
sambettsand I can't see him online17:31
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krtaylorok, lets move on, we can bring it up again in open discussion if needed17:31
krtaylor#topic 3rd party CI17:32
*** openstack changes topic to "3rd party CI (Meeting topic: ironic_qa)"17:32
krtaylorI had an action to create a patch for adding all drivers from a previous meeting, it is here17:32
thiagop#info OneView CI is being rebuild due to hosting cloud problems17:32
krtaylorthiagop, good to know, thanks17:33
thiagopit should be ready already, but I'm having some nasty problems with new versions of jjb, zuul, nodepool...17:33
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krtaylorthiagop, ping any of the folks in #openstack-third-party-ci for help17:34
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thiagopkrtaylor: thanks, didn't know of this channel..17:34
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krtaylorjroll, sambetts thanks for the reviews on the drivers patch, I just need the info to fill in the question marks17:35
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krtaylorwrt the driver vs platform thing, it is really up to the project17:36
sambettsNot sure what the best way to handle the drivers on different architechtures is17:36
jrollwell, imo this should be a list of drivers17:36
krtaylornova lists architectures as different drivers17:36
jrollif those drivers are tested on other architectures... we should note that17:36
jrollI only see that for kvm_ppc6417:37
jrolloh, in their feature matrix, sure17:37
jrollbut on the driver marketplace, I tend to think that should be a list of possible drivers to be used17:37
sambetts^ this17:38
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krtaylorand that a driver is supported on a different archtecture?17:38
krtaylorthats the question :)17:38
jrollput it in the description?17:38
jroll"tested on x86_64 and ppc64"17:38
* jroll wrote this in his latest comment17:38
sambettsIts a shame we can't list multiple CIs per driver17:38
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sambettsas far as I can tell anyway17:39
krtaylorfor community supported drivers tested on other architectures, hm, that works for me17:39
krtaylorsambetts, not that I know of17:39
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sambettsfeature request for stacklytics?17:39
krtaylorjroll, I think thats a good solution for stackalytics anyway17:40
krtaylorwe need the contact info for openstack wiki, etc17:40
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krtaylorI'll push a new rev with that and see what you think17:41
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jrollawesome, thanks17:42
krtayloranything else for 3rd party CI?17:42
krtaylor#topic Open Discussion17:42
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: ironic_qa)"17:42
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krtaylorwell, looks like we're done then, thanks everyone!17:44
sambettsThanks for hosting krtaylor17:44
jrollcool, thanks for hosting krtaylor17:44
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:44
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 17:44:42 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:44
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bh526r#startmeeting gluon17:59
openstackMeeting started Wed Jul 27 17:59:35 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is bh526r. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:59
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: gluon)"17:59
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'gluon'17:59
bh526rHi Paul17:59
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bh526rhello guys18:00
Jeffreyc42Hi Bin18:00
bh526rHi Jeff18:00
bh526rHi Mamil18:00
tomhambHi All18:00
bh526rsorry Kamil18:00
bh526rHi Tom, welcome back18:00
bh526rLet's get started18:01
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bh526r#topic Roll Call and Introduction18:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call and Introduction (Meeting topic: gluon)"18:01
bh526r#info Bin Hu18:01
krenczewski#info Kamil Renczewski18:01
Jeffreyc42#info Jeff Collins18:01
tomhamb#info Tom Hambleton18:02
bh526r#topic Admin Update18:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Admin Update (Meeting topic: gluon)"18:02
bh526r#info Let me summarize what we discussed and agreed last meeting, because Tom was on vacation18:03
pcarver#info Paul Carver18:03
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bh526r#info First, Regarding Tom's pacth of repo naming, all agreed with Kamal's proposal to change the name from "gluon-core" to "gluon-lib"18:04
bh526r#info Are you ok with it, Tom?18:04
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bh526r#info great. So you have an action to update your patch and upload patchset #2 for this name change.18:05
tomhambwill do18:05
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bh526r#info thank you18:05
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bh526r#info Secondly, we discussed Architecture document, but what types of architecture document we need to have18:06
bh526r#info because it was quite challenging in IRC, we moved to GoToMeeting so that we discussed it on live voice :)18:06
bh526r#info which turned out quite effective and constructive18:07
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bh526r#info Basically, we agreed to have 2 types of document18:07
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bh526r#info one document focuses on targeted architectural description, features and functions, technical requirement, to motivate and guide detailed design, implementation and coding18:09
bh526r#info this document intends to be stable once it is done, and shouldn't change along with implementation and coding18:09
bh526r#info it provides the target where we need to go, and what we intend to do and anticipate18:10
bh526r#info the other document focuses on more details of then-current implement, its design, how it is implemented, and what are the issues we need to solve at next step in implementation18:11
bh526r#info so this second document intends to evolve with then-current implementation and coding, i.e. a living document and changes when code changes18:12
bh526r#info the naming of those 2 documents TBD, subject to further discussion18:12
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bh526r#info here is where we were at the end of last meeting18:13
tomhamb#info sounds good18:13
bh526r#info end of admin update18:13
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tomhamb#info do we want to put the documents in a gluon-specs repository? Right now I put the Repo Structure doc in the gluon repo.18:14
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bh526r#info let me check repo structure now18:15
tomhamb#info I missed the openstack process last week.  Was there a recommendation either way?18:15
krenczewskiOk, I have a question: Where are the repositories? The active ones?18:15
bh526r#info our current repo is
bh526r#info there is a directory "doc"18:16
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krenczewskiI am not much involved into developement, but I need to be up to date with developement18:16
bh526r#info so we will put all docs within doc directory in our repo18:17
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bh526r#info there is "source" under "doc" see
Jeffreyc42#info I put the current arch des in the doc/source/ directory.18:18
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Jeffreyc42#info this is where it should go.  Correct?18:18
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bh526r#info we discussed "devref" 2 weeks ago.
pcarverJeffreyc42: You may want to go one level further to devref18:19
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bh526r#info we agreed to "documentation should be part of doc/source/devref" per minutes18:19
pcarverNeutron has doc/source subdirectories for devref, policies, stadium and dashboards18:19
bh526r#info Both Paul and Jeff are right.18:20
pcarverWe may not need all that, but it allows for additional documentation that isn't devref to be separated18:20
bh526r#info so for devref related, put to "doc/source/devref"18:21
bh526r#info for other subjects, follow Paul's proposal such as policies, etc.18:21
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krenczewskiMay I have a suggestion, to use #info to mark only what needs to be in a meeting minutes? Full text log from #startmeeting and #endmeeting is avaliable anyway18:22
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bh526rGood suggestion, thank you Kamil18:22
pcarverkrenczewski: +118:22
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bh526rAre we good now?18:23
krenczewskigreat :-)18:23
pcarverOne semi-documentation related topic is where to put api docs18:23
pcarverIt looks like there's currently some ambiguity in OpenStack due to the move from WADL to Swagger.18:23
bh526rusually how did Neutron or Nova do?18:23
pcarverIs anyone starting on API docs or should we postpone that topic?18:24
bh526rI don't think we are starting API docs. We may postpone it for now.18:24
bh526rPaul - can you take an action to look into how other projects handle APIs doc?18:24
pcarverok, I'm keeping an eye on API documentation developments so I'll hold that topic18:24
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bh526rGreat. When we start to work on it, we will know how to do it.18:25
bh526rThank you Paul18:25
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bh526rLet's switch gear18:25
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bh526r#topic Discuss Infrastructure Need of Development and PoC18:26
*** openstack changes topic to "Discuss Infrastructure Need of Development and PoC (Meeting topic: gluon)"18:26
bh526rThis item was requested by Daniel Smith, who has been our admin of development infrastructure18:26
bh526rDaniel - ping18:26
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krenczewskiDoes the PoC is for some planned event?18:27
bh526rI saw "dansmith"18:27
bh526rNo, it was for OPNFV Summit18:27
Jeffreyc42we need to plan for the next OpenStack Summit demo's though18:28
bh526rBut now we want some kind of long term planning of infrastructure resources, for our own development and future PoC18:28
bh526rThat's right.18:28
krenczewskiHow contrail backend is considered for any future developement (I forgot to talk about this with Nachi)?18:28
Jeffreyc42yea, I've been working with Dan on adding a few more servers for us in the OPNFV lab where we currently have the setup running.18:29
bh526rGreat, Jeff.18:29
Jeffreyc42its still in the works though18:29
Jeffreyc42maybe another month before we get the new servers added18:29
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bh526rThat's great news.18:29
bh526r#info There is a need of more blades, and more permanent infrastructure resources for our development, and PoC and demo in OpenStack Summit in the future18:30
bh526r#info Daniel and Jeff are working on adding a few more servers in Pharos Lab as our permanent home of infrastructure18:31
bh526r#info this is work in progress, and estimate another month before we get the new servers added18:32
pcarverWe also need to think about CI. Is the OpenStack CI going to need to invoke things in OPNFV lab in order to have multiple controller backend support for tests?18:33
bh526rSorry Kamil - of course, Contrail is part of future development and PoC18:33
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bh526rKamil - you may want to discuss with Nachi about resource allocation, etc. how to do it, and fully integrated with Gluon18:34
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krenczewskiOk, will do18:34
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bh526rPaul - regarding CI, we don't need any code from OPNFV for now.18:35
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bh526rSo as long as we are hooked with OpenStack CI, we are good18:35
bh526rThere is a big topic in OPNFV, regarding how to connect OpenStack CI with OPNFV CI18:36
pcarverI don't mean code. I mean when commiting new Gluon code, we'll want the OpenStack to test it. Will it be able to test it without instantiating multiple controllers?18:36
bh526rBut this is out of scope of our project here :)18:36
pcarverI meant to say "I don't mean OPNFV code"18:36
bh526rFor testing Gluon code, we can do 2 steps18:37
pcarverHow do we detect when a change to Gluon breaks functionality with one specific SDN controller?18:37
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bh526rGluon part - which basically Gluon core, particle generator, and validating Proton with the original YAML18:37
bh526rWorking with SDN Controller is specific for Proton, which is diagonal with Gluon core part18:38
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bh526rSo this is Proton specific, and we may need to test it in OPNFV18:39
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pcarverSo can we test, e.g., a "gluon port-create" without instantiating an SDN controller?18:39
bh526rFor example, next step of NetReady in OPNFV may be to integrate Gluon back to OPNFV platform18:40
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bh526rRight. That's API testing and validation of logical port18:40
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bh526rAnd we can test that the actual instantiation effort is done through API, i.e. command or REST call is issued to backend.18:42
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bh526rThen the 2nd part is the actual integration with platform and backends.18:43
bh526rwhichever backends are ready to be integrated.18:43
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bh526rThe (tested) Gluon core can hook up with backend SDN Controllers and see if SDN Controllers will indeed execute the command/or REST call18:44
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krenczewski+1 bh526r18:45
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bh526rThis way, OpenStack focuses on Gluon, and OPNFV focuses on backend integration18:46
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bh526rAnd we don't rely on the CI integration between OpenStack and OPNFV - no one knows when this can be done18:47
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bh526rBut for us, the actual work will be the same in Pharos lab18:48
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bh526rAre we good on this topic?18:49
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bh526rLet's move on18:50
pcarversounds fine to me18:50
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bh526r#topic Review of Patch
*** openstack changes topic to "Review of Patch (Meeting topic: gluon)"18:50
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kamal__info kamal__18:51
bh526rThank you Paul for your comments there18:51
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Jeffreyc42yes, thank you - I'll push the next patch with your comments updated today18:52
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bh526rGreat, and thank you Jeff.18:53
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bh526rDepending on which way this document will go (either a "what-to-do" more permanent document, or a summary of then-current "how-to-do" living document), more comments may come.18:54
Jeffreyc42Can't we approve it and just add updates to it later?18:55
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Jeffreyc42I don't think we need to continue to review for to much longer before "this version" is approved18:55
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Jeffreyc42I agree it will change but I think its close to being done for now18:56
bh526rI am fine with it being a summary of what has been done for now.18:56
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pcarverJeffreyc42: I agree about merging sooner rather than later. Additional changes can always be made in a subsequent review18:57
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tomhambMe too, but at some point we should add some diagrams.18:57
bh526rI suggest that we rename it as "Summary of Gluon Design and Implementation" for now18:58
pcarvercould probably just shorten that to "Gluon Design"18:59
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Jeffreyc42So generally I would say its too high level for a design doc18:59
krenczewskiLow level design ?18:59
Jeffreyc42design doc's discuss the code level within given functions19:00
pcarver"Gluon High Level Design"19:00
pcarverAnd then the next doc that needs to be written is "Gluon Low Level Design"19:00
bh526rGood to me19:00
Jeffreyc42archecture discusses the functions of what modules do but now how they are written19:00
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Jeffreyc42good with me19:00
Jeffreyc42Gluon High Level Design19:00
bh526rGood for me.19:00
Jeffreyc42ok, so I'll make paul's updates, move it to the correct directory and rename it.  Then we can merge it?19:01
pcarverbtw, we're running over time. I don't know if there's another meeting scheduled19:01
Jeffreyc42o woops19:01
bh526r#info agreed to Paul's comments, and the other content of the summary of current Gluon high level design19:01
krenczewskiLast week there was one19:01
bh526rNot this week :)19:02
Jeffreyc42ok, anything else since we are out of time?19:02
bh526r#info Jeff will take Paul's comment, upload patchset #2, rename it to "Gluon High Level Design", and move it to the correct directory "doc/source/devref"19:03
bh526rI think that's all. I need to finish documenting it in minutes19:03
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tomhambI will upload the changes to the Repo Structure document19:04
bh526rThat's all for today. thank you everyone19:04
bh526rThank you Jeff and Tom for taking the action19:04
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bh526r#info meeting adjourned19:04
tomhambOk, bye all19:04
bh526rbye all19:05
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"19:05
openstackMeeting ended Wed Jul 27 19:05:09 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)19:05
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