Tuesday, 2017-01-17

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hongbin#startmeeting zun03:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 03:00:02 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.03:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.03:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zun)"03:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'zun'03:00
hongbin#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2017-01-17_0300_UTC Today's agenda03:00
hongbin#topic Roll Call03:00
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mkraiMadhuri Kumari03:00
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hongbinthanks for joining the meeting pksingh diga mkrai Namrata lakerzhou sudipto_ kevinz03:01
hongbin#topic Announcements03:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: zun)"03:01
hongbini have no announcement03:01
hongbinanyone else has?03:01
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hongbin#topic Review Action Items03:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: zun)"03:01
hongbin#topic Cinder integration (diga)03:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Cinder integration (diga) (Meeting topic: zun)"03:01
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/cinder-zun-integration The BP03:01
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/417747/ The design spec03:01
hongbindiga: ^^03:02
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digahongbin: Yes03:02
digahongbin: I saw your comments03:02
digaI think the current approach looks okay to me03:02
digaI agreed on we should create seperate volume table for this implementation03:03
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hongbindiga: ack03:03
digahongbin: but I have studied on this, then I came up with this approach03:04
hongbindiga: sure03:04
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hongbindiga: most of my comments are asking for clarification03:04
digahongbin: if you do this way, then later on, we can extend this to multiple drivers03:04
digahongbin: yes03:04
hongbindiga: ok03:04
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hongbindiga: then, i would look forward to your revision to address them03:05
digahongbin: I will revisit the spec, will reply to your comments03:05
digahongbin: yes03:05
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digahongbin: I will update it in next one hr03:05
hongbindiga: thanks03:05
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digahongbin: welcome!03:06
hongbinfor others, any comment about the cinder integration spec?03:06
pksinghi agree that there should be no hard dependency on any projects03:06
pksinghwe should design in that way03:07
mkraiThe driver based implementation is preferable03:07
digayes, that's the approach I am taking in this spec03:07
hongbinpksingh: mkrai +103:07
hongbinok, next topic03:08
hongbin#topic Support interactive mode (kevinz)03:08
*** openstack changes topic to "Support interactive mode (kevinz) (Meeting topic: zun)"03:08
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-interactive-mode The BP03:08
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/396841/ The design spec03:09
hongbinkevinz: ^^03:09
kevinzI prepare to use CLIS->API->COMPUTE->Docker Daemon to finish the container tty resize function03:10
kevinzIn server side03:10
kevinzAlso websocket link need docker version03:11
hongbini see03:11
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kevinzin compute node. Do we already have ? If not I can add one func to get03:11
mkraiYes it is already there03:12
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mkraiwe do have a conf for it03:12
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hongbini think the problem is how to expose the version via REST API?03:12
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kevinzAPI just get the doceker version in compute node and then generate the websocket link to CLIS03:13
hongbini see03:14
kevinzhongbin: Yeah03:14
hongbinkevinz: if i understand correctly, zun needs to have an admin api to return the link for cli to do interactive operations?03:15
hongbinkevinz: however, the websocket link is generic? or it is runtime-specific?03:16
kevinzYes, exactly03:16
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kevinzYes the websocket APi need the docekr version, docker daemon IP and port03:17
hongbinkevinz: ok03:17
hongbinkevinz: feel free to go ahead and submit a patch for review03:18
kevinzOK, I see03:18
kevinzThanks hongbin03:18
hongbinany other question for kevinz ?03:18
kevinzNo more :-)03:18
hongbinthanks kevinz03:19
hongbinnext one03:19
hongbin#topic Make Zunclient an OpenStackClient plugin (Namrata)03:19
*** openstack changes topic to "Make Zunclient an OpenStackClient plugin (Namrata) (Meeting topic: zun)"03:19
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/zun-osc-plugin The BP03:19
hongbinNamrata: ^^03:19
Namratathe blueprint is completed03:20
hongbinNamrata: awesome03:20
Namrataas for noe as discussed earlier03:20
Namratathanks hongbin03:20
hongbinNamrata: thanks for the great work03:20
pksinghNamrata: great work :)03:21
Namratathanks pksingh03:21
hongbinNamrata: mind marking this bp as implemented? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/zun-osc-plugin03:21
Namratayeah sure03:21
hongbinNamrata: thanks03:21
hongbinany other comment for the osc bp?03:22
hongbinok, next one03:22
hongbin#topic How to expose CPU configurations for containers03:22
*** openstack changes topic to "How to expose CPU configurations for containers (Meeting topic: zun)"03:22
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/418675/ A proposal to add cpushare to container03:22
hongbin#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/418175/ A proposal to change description of cpu parameter03:22
hongbini will try to summarize the discussion, sudipto_ feel free to chime in if you have any comment03:23
hongbinwe have been discussing how to expose the cpu contraints of the container via zun api03:23
sudipto_I have been struggling with time management this past week, but hopefully this week would be better.03:24
hongbincurrently, we are exposing cpu constraints as the number of core03:24
hongbinthat is vcpu (same as nova)03:24
hongbinhowever, there are several alternatives proposed03:24
hongbinfor example, exposing the cpushare parameter instead03:25
sudipto_hongbin, i have my doubts over what we are calling a vcpu right now.03:25
hongbinsudipto_: i guess it is the number of virtual cores03:25
pksinghhongbin: number of core or relative number of cpu cycles, i am not sure whether they are same or different03:26
hongbinpksingh: i see, i am not sure either03:26
sudipto_hongbin, number of virtual cores have no significance unless you can map them to cores on the system...which we aren't doing.03:26
hongbinsudipto_: i see03:26
hongbinthen, let's discuss. what is the best way to do this03:27
sudipto_hongbin, the last time we discussed, the proposal was to bring out cpu policies03:27
pksinghwe are using cpu-quota and docker says it as 'cpuquota - Microseconds of CPU time that the container can get in a CPU period'03:27
sudipto_pksingh, yup, that's my point.03:28
sudipto_so if you define a CPU period of 10 ms. Then a cpu-quota will define, how many ms - your container can execute in that period.03:28
pksinghsudipto_: +103:28
sudipto_so it kinda boils down to a shares concept03:29
hongbini have looked at k8s for cpu in before03:29
hongbinif i remembered correct, they used cpu quota for max cpu allocation, cpu share for required cpu allocation03:30
hongbinhowever, k8s is using other cpu unit (not vcpu)03:31
hongbinsudipto_: pksingh what are your opinions of the ideal solution?03:32
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sudipto_hongbin, so let's talk in terms of physical cores on the system, if there are 5 cores in the system...what's a cpu period/quota for this system?03:32
sudipto_hongbin, i plan to get some clarity on this today03:32
pksinghi was thinking exposing these things can make scheduling job complex03:32
sudipto_hongbin, we don't expose these, we expose policies.03:33
sudipto_pksingh, ^03:33
sudipto_policies being - shared/dedicated/strict03:33
pksinghmeans it would be configurable?03:33
sudipto_where shared means the default case, where we are operating right now.03:33
sudipto_yeah configurable as a part of zun run command03:34
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hongbinsudipto_: i am fine with the policy things03:34
sudipto_dedicated means, the zun backend code will give you dedicated cpu cores to run on. While strict means, there's a one on one mapping of cores to containers.03:34
hongbinsudipto_: however, that is about cpu pining, but less about cpu allocation?03:34
sudipto_hongbin, agreed.03:35
sudipto_hongbin, do you know k8s do cpu allocation? (shares is one way)03:35
hongbinsudipto_: ok, it seems you proposed to expose "number of physical cores" + policy?03:35
sudipto_hongbin, after the discussion with you and pksingh i feel it's a good idea to not expose the cores, but just the policy to the end user.03:36
pksinghi was thinking abou a public cloud, will it be better to expose this,03:36
sudipto_pksingh, public cloud with openstack? very few :) but that's beyond the point.03:37
sudipto_i agree with you that we should not be exposing cores to the end users, hence the policies.03:37
hongbini think zun would be mainly targeted for private cloud (since container on public cloud has isolation problem)03:37
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sudipto_Now why policies? Because there's a need for running NFV based workloads to have dedicated resources.03:38
pksinghhongbin: +103:38
hongbinsudipto_: if we expose policies, we need to expose the number of cores as well?03:38
pksinghsudipto_: ccan we run them on diferent set of compute nodes?03:38
sudipto_hongbin, not to the user necessarily right?03:39
hongbinsudipto_: for example, if we have a policy "dedicated", then how many cores are dedicated?03:39
sudipto_hongbin, o yeah, for that yes.03:39
sudipto_i thought you mean the actual numbers on the system03:39
sudipto_pksingh, meaning?03:39
lakerzhoupolicy is related to cpu pining support only03:39
sudipto_lakerzhou, yeah03:39
pksinghsudipto_: we have some nodes in the system which are dedicated for this dedicated policy03:40
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pksinghsudipto_: we will always alot that container to that set of nodes03:40
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lakerzhouNFV applications usually require a certain # of cores (dedicated)03:41
sudipto_pksingh, that does sound like the availability zones concept, but yes you need to do that.03:41
sudipto_pksingh, someone in nova had proposed a way to overcome this by creating host capabilities. I will share that spec with you once i find it.03:41
sudipto_lakerzhou, +103:42
pksinghsudipto_: ok03:42
hongbinok, if we want to expose # of cores, how to do that?03:42
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hongbinbkero: yes, it seems that is the command to get the number of processor03:43
lakerzhouAlso in nova, the # of cores are vcores, not physical cores03:43
sudipto_hongbin, that boils down - to if we can expose something in the form of a vcpu for a container03:43
hongbinsudipto_: what do you think about that?03:44
sudipto_lakerzhou, the virtual cores, give you the idea of how many physical cores you would need for a dedicated use case.03:44
sudipto_hongbin, i will get back on this by today, if that's ok.03:44
hongbinsudipto_: ok, sure03:44
hongbinperhaps, we could table this discussion to next week03:45
hongbinthen, all of us can study more about this area03:45
hongbinany last minute comment before advancing topic?03:45
hongbin#topic Discuss BPs that are pending approval03:46
*** openstack changes topic to "Discuss BPs that are pending approval (Meeting topic: zun)"03:46
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-port-bindings Support container port mapping03:46
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hongbinkevinz: i saw you proposed this bp, want to drive this one?03:46
kevinzhongbin: YEAH03:46
kevinzI think we can add a port binding to container when create03:47
sudipto_hongbin, do we also keep track of allocated ports? I am guessing we should?03:47
hongbinsudipto_: i am not sure03:47
sudipto_hongbin, otherwise, two containers can potentially overlap on the same port?03:48
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sudipto_same host port for example.03:48
hongbinsudipto_: yes, that is a problem03:48
hongbinsudipto_: however, you could use the -P opiton and let docker pick a port for you03:48
sudipto_hongbin, kevin has put a -p with the zun command line...which i think is legit because docker might not just be the driver of the future...03:49
hongbinsudipto_: +103:49
sudipto_hongbin, this too points to some kind of a host inventory, we need to build in zun03:51
hongbinsudipto_: yes, that is true03:51
sudipto_the cpu one would need that too, and so will many other host capabilities.03:51
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hongbinsudipto_: if we follow the openstack deployment, host will be under a management network, which is different from the tenant network03:51
hongbinport mapping in this case means to expose a container to a management network....03:52
sudipto_hongbin, good point...03:52
hongbini am not sure if this makes sense, however, if containers are running on vm, this makes perfect sense03:52
sudipto_hongbin, yup, thats a very valid point.03:52
sudipto_another thing to brainstorm about :)03:53
pksinghhongbin: +103:53
hongbinthen, how to deal with this bp, table it? drop it? keep it?03:53
sudipto_hongbin, come back do some research next week?03:54
hongbinkevinz: what do you think?03:54
hongbinsudipto_: ok, sure03:54
pksinghyes that would be better03:54
hongbintable this one03:54
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-zun-copy Support zun copy03:55
kevinzhongbin: +1for sudipto_03:55
hongbinhow about this one? a good/bad idea?03:55
pksinghi think this is good03:55
hongbinpksingh: ack03:56
sudipto_is this docker cp?03:56
pksinghi thunk k8s also supports this03:56
hongbinsudipto_: i guess it is03:56
pksinghyes sudipto_03:56
sudipto_yeah, doesn't seem to harm. at all.03:56
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hongbinok, i will approve it if there is no further objection03:56
hongbinnext one03:57
hongbin#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/kuryr-integration Kuryr integration03:57
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hongbini am proposing to use kuryr for our native docker driver03:57
sudipto_hongbin, +103:57
hongbinperhaps just an invetigation for now, to see if this is possible03:58
pksinghyes that would be good03:58
lakerzhouhongbin, +103:58
hongbincurrently, our nova driver has neutron integration (via nova capability), the native docker driver doesn't have any neutron integration yet03:58
pksinghbut it does not support multitenancy right?03:58
hongbinpksingh: i hope it does03:59
hongbinpksingh: will figure it out03:59
pksinghhongbin: ok sure03:59
hongbinsorry, run out of time03:59
hongbin#topic Open Discussion03:59
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: zun)"03:59
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hongbinit looks most of us agreed on the kuryr integration bp, then i will approve it04:00
hongbinall, thanks for joining the meeting04:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"04:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 04:00:12 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)04:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-01-17-03.00.html04:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-01-17-03.00.txt04:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2017/zun.2017-01-17-03.00.log.html04:00
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hongbinsure, i didn't allocate enough time for open discussion04:00
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Dinesh_BhorsamP_: Hi04:01
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takashisamP_: Hi. Can we start?04:01
samP_#startmeeting masakari04:02
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 04:02:11 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is samP_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.04:02
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.04:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: masakari)"04:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'masakari'04:02
samP_ok, hi everyone04:02
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samP_since we don"t have critical bugs.. lets jump in to discussion points04:03
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samP_last week it was action item for me to writedown about ironc HA04:03
samP_so, I put wrote some words about it.04:04
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samP_#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/baremetal-ha04:04
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samP_To implement this we need ironic instance boot from cinder vols.04:05
samP_#link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/ironic-boot-from-volume04:06
samP_ah.. forgot to change the topic04:06
tpatilI will start understanding about Ironic so that we can implement this use case04:07
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takashisamP_: do you know any shcedule about implementing the feature, ironic-boot-from-volume in nova project?04:08
Dinesh_BhorThe implementation is in blocked state: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/ironic-boot-from-volume04:08
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takashiIt seems that blueprint for nova is currently blocked, and we still need some changes, right?04:09
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samP_takashi: they are holding it till spec from ironic side to merge. and it will done after refactoring in ironic04:09
takashisamP_: ok04:09
takashiI just found nova spec propsed for Pike: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/311696/04:10
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samP_takashi: there was some discussion in ironic team to remove this block and start code implementation.04:11
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takashisamP_: it is great if we can get some chance to discuss with ironic team in PTG, covering their plan about bfv04:11
samP_however, there will be anther discussion in PTG04:11
takashisamP_: ok04:12
samP_takashi: sure, I will try to get it04:12
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samP_I will add more details for ironic HA and container HA on that etherpad. please put you comment, questions and ideas on it too..04:14
samP_takashi: yes04:15
tpatilsamP_: can we not add this ha support for ironic instance in masakari if it's booted from image?04:16
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samP_tpatil: we can, but if it boot from a local disk ,then you can not have the same instance after it failover to a new one04:17
samP_tpatil: "can we ""not"" add "04:17
tpatilsamP_: But if you are using shared storage to store local disks, it's possible, correct?04:18
samP_tpatil: it would be possible, but I am not sure you can do it with current ironic/nova APIs04:19
tpatilsamP_:  Ok, I will check current Ironic/Nova APIs to figure that out04:20
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takashitpatil: IMO it can be possible that ironic does not support shared storage for 'image store'04:21
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samP_tpatil: there will be ways around. its all about cutoff the old instance and attaching the same disk to new instance04:21
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takashisamP_: right04:22
samP_takashi: correct04:22
tpatilsamP_: Will check this point04:23
samP_then shall we move to next topic, if no more questions or comments about this04:23
takashisamP_: yes04:24
samP_what would be the next topic?04:25
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rkmrHonjoCan I talk about AOB?04:25
samP_rkmrHonjo: sure04:25
samP_#topic AOB04:26
*** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: masakari)"04:26
rkmrHonjotpatil: You and abhishek said that you were working about https://review.openstack.org/#/c/397064/ last week.04:26
rkmrHonjoAny update on this?04:26
tpatilAbhishek is working on this issue04:26
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tpatilrkmrHonjo: He is working on your patch to see how to handle all pending requests before gracefully exiting the child process04:28
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rkmrHonjotpati: OK, thanks.04:29
tpatilrkmrHonjo: It's requires lot of refactoring, so it's taking some time04:29
samP_tpatil: In gerrit you mentioned "service should use ServiceLauncher instead of ProcessLaunche", is this because of the normal openstack way or any other reason?04:29
takashitpatil: One question. Is current monitor supports gracefull shutdown?04:29
takashis/Is/Does/ s/supports/support/04:30
takashimany mistakes, sorry...04:30
tpatiltakashi: No04:30
tpatilsamP_: Considering future plan, it's ok to use ProcessLauncher04:30
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takashitpatil: ok. Does it make sense to split the patch to two, like adding signal handlers and graceful shutdown support?04:31
samP_tpatil: ok, thanks04:31
tpatiltakashi: I don't think there is a need to handle signal handler in child process04:31
rkmrHonjosamP: In my understanding, it's the normal openstack way. But takahara wrote the reason of using ProcessLauncher on gerrit.04:31
takashitpatil: If it requires big effort for gracefull shutdown, it can be good if we can land signal handler support first, IMO.04:32
samP_rkmrHonjo: thanks. I read it04:32
takashiI don't mean that we should land current patch, if we have better solution for signal handling,04:33
takashibut I'm afraid to leave current signal handling problem for long time, on the other hand.04:33
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tpatiltakashi: Let's take that decision in the next week depending on the progress of refactoring the existing patch04:34
takashitpatil: makes sense04:34
rkmrHonjotakashi: I agree with your opinion. graceful shutdown is other problem.04:34
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samP_tpatil: make sense, lets discuss next action on next meeting04:35
tpatilsamP_: Ok04:35
samP_Ok then, please share the refac status on the existing patch and we can discuss on next meeting on how to proceed with this04:37
tpatilsamP_: Sure04:38
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samP_OK then, any other topics?04:39
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tpatilNothing from my side04:41
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takashiMe neither04:42
samP_Ok then, thank you all..04:43
samP_let end this... thank you again04:43
Dinesh_Bhorthanks to all04:43
takashihave a nice day!04:43
samP_takashi: you too04:44
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"04:44
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 04:44:08 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)04:44
Dinesh_Bhortakashi: you too, thanks04:44
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-01-17-04.02.html04:44
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-01-17-04.02.txt04:44
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/masakari/2017/masakari.2017-01-17-04.02.log.html04:44
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eranrom#startmeeting storlets08:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 08:00:23 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is eranrom. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.08:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.08:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: storlets)"08:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'storlets'08:00
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eranromkota_: takashi Hi08:01
eranromI have not got much on the agenda. Here it is https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets#Agenda08:01
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eranromakihito: Hi just sent a link to the agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets#Agenda:08:02
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kota_hi akihito, eranrom, takashi08:02
akihitoHi! Thank you. I look it.08:02
eranromHi kota_08:02
takashi#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets#Agenda08:02
eranromok, so lets start.08:02
eranrom#topic Multi-input desired behavior08:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Multi-input desired behavior (Meeting topic: storlets)"08:03
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eranromThe subject came up while corresponding with akihito on the multi-input functional test08:04
akihitoThe subject came up while corresponding with akihito on the multi-input functional test..08:04
kota_cool, that progressed08:04
akihitooh miss.08:04
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kota_looking at the agenda, it works well but probably it's tbd08:05
kota_what if we should do08:05
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akihitoI think that the fix is 'https://github.com/openstack/storlets/blob/master/storlets/swift_middleware/handlers/base.py#L310-L321'.08:06
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kota_i think ignoring the extra header is safe for users but someone wants to make it as sort of 400 BadRequest, maybe?08:06
eranromI think there are 3 options here08:07
eranrom1. leave this as is08:07
akihitoI think so too.08:07
eranrom2. enforce running multi-input on the proxy (as suggested bu Akihito's link)08:07
eranrom3. return 400 bad request if there are extra resources by no run-on-proxy header08:08
kota_either is fine to me.08:08
kota_for now.08:08
takashiIMO, solution 2 is the best for me because08:08
takashifor 1, considering API design, I think we should not ignore any parameters given by client silently08:09
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takashiit can confuse people08:10
takashifor 3, if we only support that feature for proxy execution, we don't need to ask people to always give run-on-proxy header, as we do for slo/range execution08:11
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eranromtakashi: +108:11
eranromIf we end up supporting this also from the object server, we can remove this enforcement08:12
takashikota_, akihito: does it make sense to you?08:12
takashieranrom: right!08:13
akihitohmm. I think that there is no merit of running on the object-server side..08:13
akihitoTherefore, I think 2 is good.08:13
kota_sounds ok. If I want to do it in object-server. will propose something with new architecture so08:13
takashiakihito: I don't think so, because we want to use small extra source, like a reference file,08:13
kota_no opinion exist to block the option 208:14
takashiwe can reduce the amount for network transition in object-server execution, in some cases08:14
takashis/we want to/when we want to/08:14
takashikota_: thx08:14
eranromWhen I was in IBM we had a PoC with a media firm that wanted this. They had one huge object and many small metadata objects thay wnted all to be streamed onto the storlet08:14
eranromso they were happy with multi-input on object nodes...08:15
eranromanyway, seems like we agree on option 208:15
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akihitoI see.08:16
eranrom#topic reviews prioritization08:17
*** openstack changes topic to "reviews prioritization (Meeting topic: storlets)"08:17
eranromany opinions?08:17
kota_eranrom: probably you are looking stale one08:17
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kota_i updated the agend before 5 minuts from metting08:17
eranromoh, sec08:17
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eranrom#topic Name decision, SBusDaemon? SBusServer? or StorletServer?08:18
*** openstack changes topic to "Name decision, SBusDaemon? SBusServer? or StorletServer? (Meeting topic: storlets)"08:18
kota_yes, that one08:18
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kota_so it's from takashi's patch to abstract the daemon class08:18
kota_#link  https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40608:18
kota_#unlink  https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40608:19
kota_#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40662008:19
kota_to be honest, idk if we could use unlink for the command :P08:19
kota_back to the topic08:20
takashikota_: :-)08:20
kota_i think the patch is for addressing the abstraction of the daemon we has been calling as...08:21
kota_takashi: SBusDaemon???08:21
takashikota_: yes08:21
kota_ah, just Daemon, IIRC08:21
takashilet me explain some background information08:21
kota_takashi: sure, please08:21
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takashiIn that patch, as you may know, I tried to create base class for storlet daemon and daemon factory08:22
takashiboth processes are a kind of daemon which depends on sbus protocol and execute callback functions correspoding to the command requested by client08:23
takashiso we can create a baseclass which implements a basic interface for them08:24
takashiIt works on sbus protocol, not limited for storlets, so that is why I include 'SBus' in that class name08:26
takashiand 'Daemon' came from StorletDaemon as they are a kind of daemon processes, which keep running in container side.08:26
takashiCurrently, after reading some comments from kota_, I think 'Server' is better than Daemon, which shows that it execute a kind of callback based on the request08:28
kota_takashi: thanks for explaining08:29
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takashiSo I'm thinking to name the base class as SBusServer08:29
kota_takashi: i also think it's better to call it Server08:29
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takashiMaybe main discussion point is  1. SBus or Storlet  2. Daemon or Server08:29
kota_but ... perhaps, StorletServer could be better?08:29
kota_that is because it sounds like SBusServer provide sbus, maybe?08:30
takashiSBusServer works for request in sbus protocol, like HttpServer works for request in http protocol08:30
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kota_and IMO, i has been thinking of the abstruction, BaseStorletSrever could include all things we need to run as Server process, e.g. listening, dispathing08:31
takashiand I'm thinking to have SBusClient which sends request in sbus protocol https://review.openstack.org/#/c/405937/, like we use HttpClient for http request08:31
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kota_and then, all the extension like FactoryManager and StorletManager could implment just commands which are supported in the server?08:32
kota_takashi: ah, yeah, we call HTTPServer which provide http interface to connect.08:32
kota_takashi: make sense.08:33
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kota_sorry, i said a few kind of things08:33
kota_1. the name, it could be SBusServer for base class?08:34
takashiI'm currently thinking to name the base class as BaseSBusServer like BaseHttpServer08:34
kota_2. which feature should be in the SBusServer08:34
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takashi^^^ for 108:34
kota_takashi: sounds good for 108:34
takashiand for 2, I think it is better to have all funcutions in base to start up server functions08:35
kota_for 2, IMO, all things to provide SBusServer08:35
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takashikota_: yes08:35
takashiI mean, main_loop, dispatch_command, and all command handler functions, based on currently implementation08:35
kota_i think, all things means it can run independently but no command cannot be runable with extension.08:35
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takashikota_: or we can implement some basic handler like ping in base class, as we expect same implementations for all servers08:36
kota_and if we could think of making it most likely HTTPServer, we should use populer name for each method, like "listen"?08:37
takashikota_: maybe I need to check interface design in HTTPServer08:37
kota_takashi: me too08:37
kota_eranrom, akihito: summirize current discussion08:38
kota_eranrom, akihito: the patch is going to move...08:38
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kota_1. rename the base class as BaseSBusServer08:38
kota_2. more refactor to be likely common HTTPServer (but it listens by SBus protocol)08:39
kota_takashi: correct?08:39
takashikota_: yes08:39
takashifor 1, I think I can update my patch in not so long time.08:40
takashifor 2, I still need some more time because I need to solve interface difference between StorletDaemon and DaemonFactory08:40
eranromkota_: takashi: This was a great discussion. I watched and learned. Thanks!08:41
kota_they will be something like, StorletServer and StorletServerFactory08:41
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kota_eranrom: k, sorry we consume much time, please go ahead to the next08:42
eranromkota_: np. It was a very good usage of the time!08:42
eranromif there is more please continue!08:42
eranromyou were suggesting names for the servers inheriting form BaseSBusServer08:43
takashiIn my current idea, I'm just thinking to use the name corresponding to the process name (I mean StorletDaemon and StorletDaemonFactory or DaemonFactory) for each implementation class08:45
takashiIf we change that name, we should change the name of the script file (files under bin), correspondingly08:45
kota_takashi: good point08:46
takashiI think we can discuss about that on gerrit. If we need some more discussions, I'll bring that topic in irc meeting again.08:46
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eranrom#topic review prioritization08:47
*** openstack changes topic to "review prioritization (Meeting topic: storlets)"08:47
eranromany opinions?08:48
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takashiCurrently I'm working about agent refactoring, and akihito is working about functional test coverages08:50
akihitoyeh! My functiona tests without 'WIP' is reviewable.08:50
takashiin that point, it would be great if I can ask your reviews about them08:50
eranromakihito: :-) great! will review some more08:50
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kota_akihito: which one is the first patch for your chain?08:51
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takashiAFAIK, they are basically independent08:52
takashitalking about my patches, because I used some patches for testing config file addition for agent process https://review.openstack.org/#/c/419044/, most of them depends on another one.08:53
akihitoI divide this commit.08:53
kota_takashi: yeah, i mean just which one is the most priority....08:53
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takashikota_: Oh. got it.08:54
kota_akihito: it looks like in gate failure.08:54
kota_takashi: actually, idk if they are independent or not.08:54
takashikota_: Can I ask you to create a list of your patches for review?08:54
eranromtakashi: any special patch to start with? Other then the ones I have reviewed08:55
takashisorry, not for kota_08:55
takashi^^^ akihito08:55
takashieranrom: about my patch, base class implementation for all agent codes are the base one08:55
takashibut that dependency is unnecessory, so will think if I can solve that long dependency in some days08:55
akihitook! I will create patches list08:56
takashiand I'll also create patch list...08:56
takashiabout mine08:56
eranromplease post them on our channel once you got them.08:56
kota_eranrom: +108:56
takashieranrom: +1, and ok08:57
eranromThanks! We are running out of time, so I will just mention the PDT etherpad. pls have a look and add as you see fit08:57
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eranromkota_: right!08:57
takashieranrom: will check it. thanks!08:57
kota_thanks eranrom for organizing08:58
eranromThanks you all for joining. and for the great discussion.08:58
eranromIf there is anything else, we can continue on #openstack-storlets08:58
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"08:59
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 08:59:06 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)08:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2017/storlets.2017-01-17-08.00.html08:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2017/storlets.2017-01-17-08.00.txt08:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2017/storlets.2017-01-17-08.00.log.html08:59
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saggi#startmeeting karbor09:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 09:00:31 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is saggi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.09:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.09:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: karbor)"09:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'karbor'09:00
saggiHi everyone09:00
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zengchenhi everyone.09:01
saggi#topic The status of plan09:02
*** openstack changes topic to "The status of plan (Meeting topic: karbor)"09:02
saggiWho suggested this?09:02
chenying_A new guy wujiajun join our team. :D09:02
chenying_topic The status of plan  It is mine.09:02
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saggiwelcome, wujiajun!09:03
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saggichenying_, the thing I don't understand about this topic is that it talks about protecting as being part of the plan status. A plan shouldn't be in a protecting state.09:03
chenying_◦Now a plan with several volumes is being protected. The user still could create a checkpoint with this plan to protect the resources. Then the protection about volumes may fail. Because the status of volume is "backup" already.09:03
chenying_◦Can we consider that setting the status of plan "protecting", so the plan can not be protected again when it is being protected. After the protection of the plan have been done, the status of plan is set to "available".09:03
wujiajunthanks , all09:03
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saggiThis kind of issues is solved by having the checkpoint track that state.09:04
yuvalchenying_: 1) the same resource can be part of the more than two plans, so this will not solve the case of two plans protecting the same resource in the same time09:04
yuvalchenying_: 2) the cinder backup protection plugin should handle that09:04
yuval*of more than two09:04
chenying_saggi : the cinder backup protection plugin should handle that ---Do we need check the status of resource whether it is "available" in the workflow.09:05
saggiThe plugin should handle this.09:06
chenying_saggi: Or as you said, the status of resource need be handed by plugins.09:06
saggieither wait or reuse the result09:06
saggidepending on the protection plugin's semantics09:06
chenying_saggi: dinfene new interface of plugins to check the resource's status?09:07
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saggichenying_, I don't think so.09:08
saggiIt should be done through the backend's API09:08
saggibecause it might not even be Karbor that is using the resource09:08
saggiWe need to check at the source09:08
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chenying_saggi My question is that the handleing of checkint status of resoures only be considered by plugins. Or karbor call the check method of plugins to do in the services?09:11
saggiI think it should be done under the hood. The plugin would just wait until the device is free or fail the operation (whatever is appropriate).09:11
saggiThere is no advantage to have a check phase since making it atomic is impossible.09:12
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chenying_saggi  Ok I see. The plugin should handle the status.09:13
saggichenying_, unless you can think of a use case where those outcomes (waiting or failing) or not optimal.09:13
chenying_saggi Now the resources can be add to more than one plan, the plan is also can be protected repeatedly at the same time. So some protection flow may fail.09:15
yuvalchenying_: fail, or wait until the resource is available09:16
saggihaving 2 protections run at the same time is something that should either be queued of fail anyway09:17
chenying_saggi  fail, or wait until the resource is available----You mean that it depend on the implementment of plguins.09:17
saggiyes, on what makes sense.09:19
saggiThings should only be locked for a short time anyway09:19
chenying_IMO, It may be unfriendly for the enduser. He don't know that the resource in another plan is being protected.09:21
saggiIt could be relfected in the status of the resource in the checkpoint. Something like 'waiting for resource'.09:21
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chenying_saggi What is the reason that resources can be add to more than one plan? Do we have this use case?09:22
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saggiImages mostly09:23
saggiI don't see why VMs and volumes should be used in multiple plans09:23
yuvalwe do not prevent that, however09:24
saggiWe can't possibly check for that09:25
saggianything else?09:28
chenying_The use case of Images, if we only consider the snapshot image of server itself, do no't care about the original id. It may do not need add it to multiple plans.09:28
chenying_do not care about the original image.09:29
saggichenying_, Sometimes images are reused between applications.09:29
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saggiIn any case, since images are read only. There is no reason for them to be locked.09:29
chenying_saggi you mean the snapshot image of server also can be reused?09:31
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chenying_Ok I don't have any question. But we real consider the use case that VMs and volumes should be usedi n multiple plans.09:33
chenying_ But we real need consider the use case.09:34
saggi#topic bug status09:35
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saggiWhere are we on this front. AFAIK we should be in good shape.09:35
yuvalwe have very few left09:36
yuvalwe have MS3 next monday09:36
saggiAnything unassigned?09:37
yuvalone or two09:37
chenying_yuval and I will finish the refactor plugins work ASAP.09:37
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chenying_yuval: The glance plugins has been updated. I will update the nova plugins patch later.09:38
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saggi#topic PTG09:40
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saggiIt coming closer and closer.09:40
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saggiAgain, If you have anything you think that should be discussed by us or with other teams please write it in etherpad form.09:41
chenying_I think we could add some detail info or description about the topics.09:41
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chenying_saggi I have a question, Do we have a plan to integrate with cinder volume snapshot?09:43
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saggiAlso, we all need to look at other team's etherpads and check if they are talking about something that might interest us.09:43
saggichenying_, integrate in what way?09:43
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chenying_saggi develop a volume snapshot plugin.09:44
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saggiit seems odd to backup a snapshot. It's not part of the application it's a result of it.09:44
yuvalchenying_: do you mean: volume -> snapshot -> backup -> delete snapshot?09:45
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chenying_I mean that create a snapshot is a protection action. a restre action is roll-back the snapshot.09:46
chenying_not the use case backuping the snapshot of volume.09:47
saggirestore would be based on the snapshot. The actual use-case for in-place rollback is still not there.09:48
chenying_In some public cloud like AWS and aliyun, the snapshot feature is the only pretction way.09:49
chenying_restore would be based on the snapshot----Yes09:49
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saggiWe should support this. It's part of the cinder implementation and dependent on configuration and backend.09:52
saggicinder protection plugin implementation09:52
saggiThe only issue is that it might make the snapshot less portable (depending on the backing storage) but we already plan on having providers for single site use cases.09:52
chenying_ but we already plan on having providers for single site use cases. ---- the database bank plguins is alos for the single site use cases.09:54
saggichenying_, yes. As I said, this should be no problem.09:55
chenying_saggi Ok I don't have any question.09:56
saggiWe are almost out of time09:56
saggiThanks everybody!09:56
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"09:56
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 09:56:53 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)09:56
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2017/karbor.2017-01-17-09.00.html09:56
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2017/karbor.2017-01-17-09.00.txt09:56
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ayoungI'm alive11:12
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yanyanhu#startmeeting senlin13:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 13:00:16 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is yanyanhu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.13:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.13:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: senlin)"13:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'senlin'13:00
yanyanhuhello, everyone13:00
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yanyanhuhi, ruijie_13:01
ruijie_hi, yanyanhu13:01
yanyanhulets wait for a while for other attenders13:02
yanyanhuxuefeng is still on the way back home I think13:02
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yanyanhuhi, lxinhui13:03
yanyanhuQiming, around?13:04
yanyanhulets keep waiting for minutes13:04
yanyanhuhi, elynn13:04
yanyanhuok, lets get started, I think qiming and xuefeng will catch up soon13:05
yanyanhuhere is the agenda, https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/SenlinAgenda#Agenda_.282017-01-17_1300_UTC.2913:05
yanyanhuplease feel free to add items13:05
yanyanhu#topic Senlin Ocata meetup summary13:06
*** openstack changes topic to "Senlin Ocata meetup summary (Meeting topic: senlin)"13:06
yanyanhufirst, thanks all you guys joining the meetup last weekend :)13:06
yanyanhuwe made a great discssion and the meeting is very productive I believe :)13:06
yanyanhuwe have summaried a long TODO list13:07
yanyanhuand I guess some of you have put your +1 on some items13:07
yanyanhuit wil help us to decide the priority of different jobs13:07
yanyanhubased on current voting, there are 3 items get the highest priority13:08
yanyanhu1.  Add command "node adopt --profile-type <type> --properties network.id=<ID> --resource <nova_id> <node_name>" +1+1+1+113:08
yanyanhuthis is for nova server adoption13:08
yanyanhuwhich can help user to adopt some existing VMs which were not created by senlin before13:09
yanyanhuthen senlin can help to manage those VMs' lifecycle13:09
yanyanhu2.  Enrich "nova server" profile to add more properties13:09
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yanyanhuthis is for enhancing our existing nova server profile to make it support creation of new volume, network port, sec-group etc. per users' requirement13:10
yanyanhuthis is important for some use case like NFV13:10
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yanyanhu3.  Tutorial documentation13:10
yanyanhu Tutorial documentation for HA13:11
* ruijie_ agreed13:11
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yanyanhusorry those three are current winner :)13:11
yanyanhuand I have marked them using BLACK in the etherpad13:11
yanyanhuI think we can consider to start those works asap13:12
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yanyanhuespecially the first one, which is not only related to our summit proposal but also for real use case in NFV scenario13:12
yanyanhuhi, XueFengLiu13:13
XueFengLiuhi, all13:13
yanyanhuwe are going through those todos we summaried in meetup13:13
yanyanhuso there are three high priority works: 1) nova serve adoption 2)enriching nova server profile 2)HA tutorial13:14
yanyanhuXueFengLiu, I recalled you have started a spec about nova serve adoption?13:14
XueFengLiuYes, will submit draft latter13:15
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yanyanhuthis one13:15
yanyanhugreat, thanks13:15
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yanyanhubut I think we may not be able to finish this work in Ocata cycle since there are only 1 month left before the final release13:16
yanyanhuand the o3 release will be in 2 weeks13:16
yanyanhuso we can settle down the design in current stage13:16
XueFengLiuThis cycle is to short13:16
yanyanhuyes, only 4 months...13:17
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yanyanhuabout the enriching nova server profile(or a new profile), I think we should start to work on it soon13:17
yanyanhuelynn, Qiming and me have had some discussion about it today13:17
yanyanhuabout some implementation detail actually :)13:18
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yanyanhubut I believe the entire work should be supported by most people :)13:18
elynnI put them on etherpad https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/senlin-vdu-profile13:18
yanyanhuelynn, great13:19
elynnAnd I'm working on a PoC code13:19
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lxinhuiWhen elynn got the poc done13:19
yanyanhuguys, please help to review and leave your comments13:19
lxinhuiI can help to use it with VNF13:19
ruijie_Great job13:19
lxinhuithen we will know the result and where to improve13:19
yanyanhulxinhui, yes13:19
yanyanhuand actually XueFengLiu have given me a quick call few minutes ago about the Senlin NFV proposal to Boston summit13:20
elynnyes lxinhui13:20
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yanyanhuI believe this is very important for us13:20
yanyanhuto show the ability of senlin of managing the resource pool in real case13:20
yanyanhua real and important case13:20
yanyanhusince the deadline of proposal is Feb.6th, and I guess most of the team will start their vacation for Spring festival since the end of the month13:21
ruijie_I just talked to my boss about the use case13:21
yanyanhubefore the end of the month :)13:21
ruijie_Since we are having an annual meeting13:21
yanyanhuso I think we'd better complete the proposal before we starting our vacation13:21
yanyanhuruijie_, yes13:22
ruijie_We will find an project with 1000s of vm13:22
ruijie_To implement sending13:22
yanyanhuruijie_, great!13:22
XueFengLiuWe have a use cause use tacker now. I talk with them13:22
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yanyanhuruijie_, if so, we can try to build another propsal based on it13:23
yanyanhuto share your experience13:23
elynnI think the enrich profile can be a contrib and don't need to carry by a senlin release, so that we can continually improving it.13:23
ruijie_Yes yanyanhu, will try to detail it later13:23
yanyanhuelynn, sure, it can stay in contrib dir for a while13:23
yanyanhuruijie_, thanks :)13:23
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yanyanhuhi, XueFengLiu, so I think maybe you can start a thread about NFV propsal and include elynn lxinhui and haiwei13:24
yanyanhuand lets see how to build that topic13:24
yanyanhusince it could include both Senlin and Taker and your real use case13:24
yanyanhusorry, Tacker13:24
XueFengLiuYes, will send a mail tomorrow to discuss details13:25
yanyanhuXueFengLiu, thanks13:25
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lxinhuido you mean the node adoption13:25
yanyanhulxinhui, no, NFV proposal is about enriching nova server profile to support NFV requirement13:26
lxinhuiThe real use case is in your envrionemtn13:26
yanyanhu    - Design a "feature rich" nova server, including, e.g. volume, network, security group, etc. +1+1+1+113:26
XueFengLiuAbout NFV use cause,lxinhui13:26
yanyanhuthis one13:26
yanyanhuhi, xuhaiwei13:26
xuhaiweihi yanyanhu, everyone13:26
lxinhuihi, xuhaiwei13:27
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lxinhuiYes, definitly, we can discuss13:27
yanyanhuxuhaiwei, actually we are talking about Senlin NFV proposal to summit. XueFengLiu will start a thread tomorrow and include you guys to decide how to make it13:27
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yanyanhuI believe your work for integrating Senlin and Tacker will be important part of that topic13:28
xuhaiweiyanyanhu, ok, that's fine13:28
yanyanhuso lets build that topic together :)13:28
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XueFengLiuOK.Thanks all:)13:28
xuhaiweiMy boss also wants me to propose some session in the coming summit, we can work together I think13:29
yanyanhusure, we have the same goal :P13:29
yanyanhuso that's a simple summary about the summit13:29
XueFengLiuWe can together to do this13:29
lxinhuiPhone call maybe much more efficient13:29
yanyanhulxinhui, sure, but we can start from the mail to let everyone know the item13:30
XueFengLiuWe have a network element, use tacker and heat now.13:30
lxinhuicould you schedue some meeting13:30
yanyanhuand let them get the chance to involve :)13:30
XueFengLiuI talked with them, we can do a demo us senlin to do this13:30
ruijie_Are you using Dingding or something13:31
ruijie_It support video meeting etc13:31
lxinhuiGood suggestion ruijie_13:31
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lxinhuiI have VNF can share for demo purpose13:32
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yanyansorry, just dropped...13:32
yanyanso any further discussion on meetup summary?13:32
XueFengLiuruijie_, good idea13:33
elynnCould you schedule the meeting at afternoon since I'm busy tomorrow morning.13:33
yanyanif not, I think we can keep discussing the nfv proposal offline :)13:33
yanyanand decide more detail13:33
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xuhaiweithere is tacker meeting from 13:30 beijing time tomorrow13:33
XueFengLiuI can send a mail first13:34
yanyanplease just want to remind that the tacker meeting will be in 13:30 beijing time tomorrow13:34
xuhaiweiyanyan: about the nfv topic , I am interested in it13:34
XueFengLiuThen we can decide time13:34
yanyanand hope you guys can join it13:34
ruijie_Will join it13:35
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yanyanxuhaiwei, sure, lets work on it together13:35
yanyanmaybe after 4:00 pm tomorrow?13:35
elynnWill join and watch it to see if there's any requirements.13:35
yanyanlooks like all of us are free at that time?13:35
lxinhuiworks for me13:36
elynnSounds good to me.13:36
XueFengLiuI'am ok13:36
xuhaiweiI am ok I think13:36
yanyanxuhaiwei, and you?13:36
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yanyanok, lets reconfirm it tomorrow13:36
yanyanI will call you in the irc channel before it starts13:36
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yanyanok, lets move on, still have several topics need to get through :)13:37
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yanyan#topic Ocata Work Items13:37
xuhaiweithere should be discussion about node adoption in senlin in tacker meeting I thinnk13:37
yanyanxuhaiwei, yes, that item is also in our list with high priority :)13:37
yanyanjust as qiming said today13:37
yanyanthat job will be started soon13:37
xuhaiweijust remind other members13:38
yanyanhope that will be helpful to erase the concern from tacker team13:38
yanyanok, we really need to move on :P13:38
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yanyan#topic Ocata Work Items13:38
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yanyanok, I think most of the items in the list have been discussed in last weekend13:39
yanyanand I have added the one about enriching nova serve profile13:39
yanyanabout the test, ruijie_ have started working on it13:40
yanyanand about HA, we will try to add mistral workflow support and prepare a proposal based on it13:40
ruijie_Yea. I am working on it13:40
ruijie_Will finish it this week13:40
yanyanand lxinhui has reached to Mistral team to see their feedback13:40
yanyanruijie_, great. No need to hurry, just take you time :)13:41
ruijie_Sure yanyan13:41
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yanyanlxinhui, I think we can focus on the workflow based HA part and then show it to Mistral team and ask their opinion13:41
lxinhuiyanyan, I touched the team is for middle-cycle13:41
lxinhuiabout proposal,I will think more about that13:42
yanyanoh, you mean ptg13:42
yanyanlxinhui, sure13:42
lxinhuilet us focus on the NFV case proposal now13:42
yanyanwe can listen to those guys idea13:42
yanyanbefore we make the decision13:42
yanyanso looking forward to more feedback from the them in the PTG :)13:43
lxinhuiWho else will be on PTG?13:43
yanyanok, next topic13:43
yanyan#topic Ocata-3 releas13:43
lxinhuiyou will be there?13:43
XueFengLiuYes, will go13:44
yanyanlucky people :)13:44
xuhaiweilxinhui, about NFV proposal which project will be involved ?13:44
yanyanxuhaiwei, both senlin and tacker I think13:44
lxinhuiand acrually13:44
yanyanjust we need to figure out how to organize the topic13:44
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lxinhuiwe can give common NFV support13:45
yanyanand how to build the case13:45
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yanyanwe can have more discussion on it based the thread XueFengLiu will start13:45
XueFengLiuYes, to highlight senlin with this proposal13:46
yanyanok, about Ocata-3 release, it will come in a week13:46
yanyanplease pay attention to those critical bugs that are still not addressed13:46
xuhaiweiaccording to my thought previously, I was planning to make it a small session about 15mins, but if we think about it more, we can make it a big one maybe13:46
XueFengLiuSome bugs have fixed13:46
XueFengLiuAbout project_safe13:46
yanyanxuhaiwei, that's for sure13:46
yanyanXueFengLiu, yes, saw your patch13:47
yanyanenabling project_safe for admin user does bring us some problems :)13:47
xuhaiweiXueFengLiu has a use case for NFV?13:47
yanyanneed to address all potential issues before release13:48
yanyanthat one has been fixed13:48
yanyanI guess there are still some corners need to seek13:49
yanyanhope we won't miss something :)13:49
XueFengLiuneed check13:49
ruijie_Found 2 bugs before about senlin client13:49
ruijie_Will look forward to it tomorrow13:50
XueFengLiuAlso about do_check13:50
yanyanruijie_, great, thanks a lot13:50
yanyanah, right13:50
XueFengLiusome issues13:50
yanyanXueFengLiu, so please help to confirm they all work correctly, thanks13:51
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yanyanI plan to cut the release on Tuesday or Wednesday next week13:52
XueFengLiuIf no much time, will fix high priority first13:52
yanyansince Friday will be Chinese Spring festival13:52
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yanyanXueFengLiu, sure :)13:52
yanyanwill also help to check it13:52
yanyanok, any more question about this topic?13:53
yanyanok, lets move on13:53
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yanyanProposals for Boston Summit. We have discussed it.13:53
yanyanand remind again, hope you guys can join the Tacker meeting tomorrow13:54
yanyanBeijing time 13:30, UTC 053013:54
lxinhuiwhen is it?13:54
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lxinhuiyou are so nice :)13:54
yanyanok, open discussion now, we still have 5 minutes :)13:54
yanyanhi, xuhaiwei, how urgent the server adoption feature is required based on the feedback you got?13:55
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yanyanif it is for NFV use case13:56
xuhaiweiTacker team hopes to finish senlin integration jobs in ocata release13:56
xuhaiweibut it is very difficult IMO13:56
yanyanxuhaiwei, but the spec is still pending...13:56
xuhaiweiyes, the PTL seems to support this feature, but some cores are asking strange questions13:57
yanyanI see. Anyway, we try our best to drive it13:57
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yanyanbut we can't decide the result by ourselves :)13:58
xuhaiweiI think the spec will be merged soon13:58
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yanyanxuhaiwei, yes, I think so too13:59
yanyanso lets discuss it more in tomorrow's meeting13:59
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yanyanTacker meeting13:59
yanyanok, time is almost over13:59
yanyanthanks all you guys for joining13:59
xuhaiweisee u13:59
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yanyanhave a good night :)13:59
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yanyanand talk to you tomorrow13:59
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ruijie_Good night14:00
XueFengLiugood night14:00
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"14:00
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openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 14:00:31 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)14:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2017/senlin.2017-01-17-13.00.html14:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2017/senlin.2017-01-17-13.00.txt14:00
jlibosva#startmeeting networking14:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2017/senlin.2017-01-17-13.00.log.html14:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 14:00:37 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is jlibosva. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.14:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'networking'14:00
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jlibosvaHello friends!14:00
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jlibosva#topic Announcements14:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: networking)"14:01
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jlibosvaThe Project Team Gathering (PTG) is approaching fast. Please read the following email14:01
jlibosva#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2017-January/110040.html14:01
jlibosvaIf you have a topic or idea that you think should be discussed there, feel free to write it down on this etherpad14:02
jlibosva#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/neutron-ptg-pike14:02
ajohi o/14:02
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jlibosvaNote that there is also PTG Travel Support Program that can help with funding, if you are for some reason unable to join the gathering14:02
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jlibosvaDeadline for applications to this program has been extended and ends by the end of the day TODAY14:03
jlibosva#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2017-January/110031.html14:03
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* jlibosva slows down a bit with links but more are to come :)14:03
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jlibosvaYesterday a new neutron-lib 1.1.0 was relased. yay14:04
jlibosvaCongratulations to all who made it happen! Good stuff.14:04
jlibosvaYou can read the enthusiastic announcement and a lot more here14:04
jlibosvalink http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/release-announce/2017-January/000372.html14:04
jlibosva#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/release-announce/2017-January/000372.html14:05
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ihrachyshave we bumped minimal already?14:05
dasmihrachys: i didn't see this yet.14:05
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jlibosvathis is all I wanted to announce14:06
jlibosvaAnybody has anything else to announce?14:06
dasmyes. friendly reminder: next week is FF14:06
dasmso, just one week's left to squeeze all changes14:07
amotokiwe already have neutron-lib>=1.1.0 now in master14:07
amotokidasm: I think it is better to release neutronclient this week14:07
dasmamotoki: hmm... this one shows 1.0.0 :/14:07
jlibosvadasm: maybe it's not synced with global reqs yet?14:08
dasmamotoki: ack. we still have one week, but we can work on this14:08
amotokito avoid a situation where our client does not breaks others14:08
amotokidasm: I will ping you after checking the situation14:08
dasmamotoki: ack, thanks14:08
amotokiwe tend to release our client lately in a release and broke something several times.... let's avoid this14:09
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jlibosvadasm: thanks for FF reminder14:09
jlibosvaanything else?14:09
amotokidasm: fyi http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/requirements/tree/global-requirements.txt#n11014:09
dasmjlibosva: amotoki: you're both right. global-requirements has already neutron-lib 1.1.014:09
dasmamotoki: thanks, just noticed the same14:10
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jlibosvamoving on14:11
jlibosva#topic Blueprints14:11
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jlibosva#link https://launchpad.net/neutron/+milestone/ocata-314:11
jlibosvaWe're getting to the end of milestone 3 very soon14:11
hichiharaamotoki dasm: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/419345/14:11
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jlibosvaah, there it goes :)14:12
jlibosvahichihara: thanks14:12
dasmhichihara: thanks. now just wait for effect on all gates :D14:12
jlibosvaand let's pray for no failures ;)14:12
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jlibosvaSo back to milestone3, per planned schedule should be Jan 23 - Jan 2714:12
jlibosvawhich is the same week as mentioned FF14:13
jlibosvaDoes anybody want to raise here any bug/patch/blueprint that lacks proper attention and must get to ocata-3?14:13
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ataraday_I've got 3 patches that are ready and waiting for some reviews: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/419815/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/415226/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/404182/14:13
jlibosvaataraday_: good, thanks for bringing this up14:14
korzenI have one ready for review: https://review.openstack.org/27354614:14
korzenIt is working doe long time, now fixed functional tests14:15
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ihrachyswould also be good to give this OVO patch some love: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/306685/14:15
jlibosvakorzen: cool, thanks. I'm sure jschwarz will love it ;)14:15
ihrachysand to make review progress on port bindings rework that will be used for multiple port bindings: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/407868/ and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/404293/14:16
jlibosvaihrachys: do you want a dedicated topic for that? I saw no patches on wiki14:16
ihrachysjlibosva: nah14:16
ihrachysI think I mentioned already what's really important14:16
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jlibosvaihrachys: ok, thanks14:16
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jlibosvaany other patches ready to land that are worth attention?14:18
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ajoI have this one, refactoring the QoS drivers to something more decoupled14:19
jlibosvaajo: thanks, this one is huuuge :)14:19
ajoI'm sorry, yes ':D14:19
ajoand I broke it on last changes, but I should push a new one now :)14:19
jlibosvaajo: do think the related bug is doable in ocata-3 timeframe?14:20
ajojlibosva seems huge, but it's more moving stuff around, than creating new logic14:20
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ajoI'm unsure, but it would be beneficial to let driver implementers switch to the new driver model as soon as they can14:21
ihrachysajo: is it ready for another review run?14:21
ajoihrachys it is if you want, I have a -1 on jenkins I'm fixing now, but it must be a small change14:21
ihrachysI see qos tests failing14:21
ihrachysok, ping me when everything is in shape Jenkins wise14:22
ajoapparently passing unit test locally is not a warranty, :)14:22
ajoack, it should be good in a couple of hours14:22
ajoI'll ping you, thanks ihrachys14:22
jlibosvaajo: I asked because the bug is not set for milestone 3 and that could hide it from reviewers that prioritize o3 bugfixes14:22
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ajooh, thanks jlibosva, may be we should set it for milestone-3, or add it on a separate bug on milestone-314:23
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dasmjlibosva: john-davidge reminded me about this handy link to all o-3 related changes14:23
jlibosvaajo: yeah, I was also thinking about separate bug14:23
ajoto be honest, the whole thing is probably not m-3 doable14:23
ajothis refactor: yes14:23
dasm:( sorry14:23
ihrachysdasm: !!!14:23
jlibosvadasm: is it a link or a spam?14:23
dasm#link http://status.openstack.org/reviews/14:23
* ihrachys passes a prize to dasm14:24
john-davidgedasm: Haha! That's why I didn't try to link you directly to it :P14:24
dasmjohn-davidge: ;)14:24
ajook, I'm adding a separate bug for it, thank jlibosva14:24
jlibosvaajo: thanks14:24
ajoin fact, I thought I had it hmm14:24
jlibosvaI also have one o3 patch that lacks eyes and love - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/402174/14:24
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jlibosvaand thanks dasm for the link :)14:25
ajojlibosva oh right, I think that one is good to go probably14:25
ajoit's simple14:25
mlavallejlibosva: I'll take a look later today14:25
ajoI commited a new patch fixing a tiny typo in comments14:25
mlavallejlibosva: the patchset I meant14:25
jlibosvamlavalle: thanks you! :)14:25
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jlibosvaso if there are no other patches/bp to highlight we can move on to the next topix14:26
jlibosvaand the next topix is14:27
annpSorry. I have one https://review.openstack.org/#/c/203509 need more attention.14:27
jlibosva#topic Bugs and gate failures14:27
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and gate failures (Meeting topic: networking)"14:27
openstackRemoving item from minutes: #topic Bugs and gate failures14:27
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ajoannp but that looks like a spec, makes sense for pike,14:27
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mlavalleyeah, that is a spec14:28
ajoI thought jlibosva was asking about code patches that need attention due to FF14:28
amotokiannp: I think it gathers enough attentions these weeks. active discussion happens recently14:28
jlibosvaannp: thanks for bringing this up14:28
jlibosvayeah, even though it already links some patches, it'll likely be discussed further in the next cycle14:29
jlibosvaanything else?14:29
jlibosva#topic Bugs and gate failures14:30
annpOk, I understand please go ahead14:30
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and gate failures (Meeting topic: networking)"14:30
jlibosvaannp: thanks :)14:30
jlibosvaWe started experiencing a lack of memory on gate jobs14:30
jlibosva#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/165638614:30
openstackLaunchpad bug 1656386 in neutron "Memory leaks on Neutron jobs" [Critical,New]14:30
jlibosvaAt first it appeared it's only linuxbridge jobs but then I saw also other multinode job to fail because of insufficient memory14:30
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jlibosvaI wanted to bring this to attention in case there is someone who loves memory leaks and stuff :)14:31
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electrocucarachajlibosva: do we have an entry in logstash for that one?14:31
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electrocucarachajlibosva: just for monitoring the number of hits14:32
ajojlibosva it would be great to have some sort of memory usage output at the end of test runs14:32
jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: good point, I think we don't have that14:32
jlibosvaajo: the oom-killer dumps the processes before picking a victim14:32
ajoah, nice14:32
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jlibosvaajo: and also I think worlddump collects that as well14:33
electrocucarachajlibosva: ok, I'll doublecheck and maybe add something there14:33
jlibosvaelectrocucaracha: thanks!14:33
ihrachysjlibosva: worlddump is called in grenade only14:33
dasmajo: i tried to investigate it a little. it seems like during end of tempest run, swap is going through the roof and oom-killer tries to "solve" this by killing something14:33
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reedip_jlibosva : have we run a fulll tempest job on a local ( like devstack ) node to check  ?14:33
jlibosvaihrachys: oh, I thought it's called on every failure. ok, nevermind, thanks for correcting me14:34
ajooh and we have ps output: http://logs.openstack.org/73/373973/13/check/gate-tempest-dsvm-neutron-linuxbridge-ubuntu-xenial/295d92f/logs/ps.txt.gz14:34
dasmreedip_: i didn't see any local problems with this issue. probably good idea would be to try and reproduce on env similar to gate (like 8gb ram + 2gb swap)14:35
amotokiin neutron-full failures in the bug comment, we got "Out of memory: Kill process 20219 (mysqld) score 34 or sacrifice child".14:35
reedip_dasm : Hmm, that can be done , and probably we can use ps --forest to see a better detail of the tree14:35
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jlibosvareedip_: I looked at project config and all full runs are multinode it seems14:36
ajodasm, jlibosva  on those ps listings I don't see anything neutron outstanding in numbers14:36
reedip_jlibosva : oh then reproducing it as dsvm wouldnt be helpful unless its also failing14:36
ajoI see cinder using a lot of memory though14:36
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ajowell, where a lot of memory is 0.8GB , not huge14:37
jlibosvaajo: IIRC I saw nova-api and mysqld being big. But we can dig into it later to not waste time on a single bug here on a meeting14:37
ajohow much memory do test VMs have?14:37
jlibosvaajo: 8G I think14:37
ajomakes sense14:37
amotokiyes, 8GB14:37
jlibosvabug deputy was boden for last week but I don't see him around14:37
jlibosvaand we don't have a bug deputy for this week!14:38
jlibosvaso unless there is some other critical bug that you are aware of, I'd like to find a volunteer :)14:38
jlibosvafor this week, starting probably yesterday14:38
janzianI haven't done it before, but I can give it a shot14:38
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jlibosvajanzian: you're very welcome to do it :)14:39
jlibosvajanzian: thank you14:39
dasmjanzian: thanks14:39
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jlibosvawe should also pick a deputy for the next week14:39
jlibosvais there any other hero that will server next week?14:39
jlibosvasorry, serve* :)14:40
jlibosvait's a very prestigious role14:41
jlibosvaok, so I take next week14:41
haleybselling used cars is not for you :)14:41
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ajojlibosva let me take it14:42
ajoIt's been a long time for me14:42
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jlibosvahaleyb: maybe I should wave my hands more :)14:42
mlavallethanks Tocayo!14:42
jlibosvaajo: alright, sold to ajo :)14:42
jlibosva#topic Docs14:43
*** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: networking)"14:43
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jlibosvajohn-davidge: hello :)14:43
john-davidgejlibosva: Hello :)14:43
jlibosvajohn-davidge: do you want to update?14:43
john-davidgeOne interesting bug to raise #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/165637814:44
openstackLaunchpad bug 1656378 in openstack-manuals "Networking Guide uses RFC1918 IPv4 ranges instead of RFC5737" [High,Confirmed]14:44
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john-davidgeThere will be an effort across the networking guide to address that, possibly devref too if its needed14:44
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john-davidgeIf anybody is interested in seeking out and destroying instances of non-compliance it would be much appreciated14:45
haleybjohn-davidge: it already uses 2001:db8 for IPv6 right?14:45
john-davidgeotherwise our top priority remians the migration to OSC14:45
john-davidgehaleyb: Yes14:45
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amotokiRFC5737 defines IP ranges for documentation. It is worth checked.14:46
john-davidgehaleyb: Obviously the IPv6 team is always on the ball :)14:46
haleybjohn-davidge: obviously :)14:46
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john-davidgeThat's all from me14:48
jlibosvajohn-davidge: cool, thanks for the link :)14:48
jlibosva#topic Transition to OSC14:48
*** openstack changes topic to "Transition to OSC (Meeting topic: networking)"14:48
jlibosvaamotoki: do you want to update about OSC?14:48
amotokiA patch in discussion is FIP associate/disassociate https://review.openstack.org/#/c/383025/14:49
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amotokiIt seems we need a discussion with Dean.14:49
jlibosva#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/383025/14:49
amotokiIf you are interested please show your opinion.14:49
reedip_I had an opinion to change the options14:50
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amotokiI haven't checked the overall status. sorry for late, but it will be reported at latest this week.14:50
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amotoki* the end of this week14:50
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jlibosvaamotoki: ok, thank you for update. I hope the discussion will continue on that patch14:50
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amotokiwhat I am not sure is which patches of OSC plugins want to be merged in Ocata neutronclient release.14:51
jlibosvanext topic should be neutron-lib but since I don't see boden here, we can move to on demand agenda as there is a topic there. So unless anybody wants to discuss neutron-lib, I'd pass on that14:51
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jlibosvaamotoki: maybe dasm can help as release liaison?14:53
dasmjlibosva: nothing about neutron-lib. but afaik majority of things were merged14:53
amotokijlibosva: yes as we discussed at the beginning14:53
jlibosvaok, thanks, moving on14:54
jlibosva#topic Disable security group filter refresh on DHCP port changes14:54
*** openstack changes topic to "Disable security group filter refresh on DHCP port changes (Meeting topic: networking)"14:54
jlibosvamdorman: do you want the stage? :)14:54
mdormansure.  really i’m just looking for advice on how to go forward with https://review.openstack.org/#/c/416380/14:54
mdormanfor us, personally, we will probably just turn off DHCP to work around the problem (we don’t really use it anyway),but this seems like a scalabiliy thing that could affect others.14:55
amotokibut currently we allow users to change IP addresses of dhcp ports after DHCP ports are created.14:56
amotokiit would be nice if we have an alternative.14:56
mdormanthe idea of that patch was to stop refreshing all security group filters on all ports any time a dhcp port changes.   but turns out that is actually a breaking fix because there are inbound rules on the port specific to the dhcp agents on that network.  so i think the proposal in the comments is to do away with those specific inbound rules and replace them with a blanket rule that would allow all dhcp traffic in.14:56
jlibosvaseems like there is some kind of discussion going on on that patch14:56
mdormanamotoki: correct.  that’s the current issue14:56
mdormanyes.  i just wanted to raise the issue and try to get some more eyeballs14:57
ajowouldn't it be reasonable to allow any dhcp in from the specific DHCP servers?14:57
mdormanajo that’s the current behavior i believe.14:57
ajoand wouldn't that only be an issue if you move the dhcp server IPs around?14:57
mdormanthe problem is when a dhcp agent is added/removed/changed, then the rules on all ports in the network have to be updated14:57
jlibosvamdorman: yep, more eyes are definitely useful :) thanks for bringing this up14:57
* ajo opens the review14:57
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mdormanajo: correct14:58
amotokilet's continue the discussion and question on #-neutron or the review!!14:58
ajomdorman aha, makes sense14:58
ajoso it becomes an scalability issue in such case14:58
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ajofor ovsfw we could use conjunctive rules...14:58
ajoI wonder if for iptables we could use a generic chain used from all ports for that14:58
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ajowell... from all ports on specific networks14:58
mdormanajo: yup, exactly.  we run only providers networks, i nsome cases with 1000s of ports.  so any time a dhcp agent changes, thre is an avalanche of rpcs to neutron-server to refresh all the rules14:58
jlibosvaamotoki: +114:58
ajoone chain per network or so14:59
amotokiwe are out of time....14:59
jlibosvawe're running out of time anyway14:59
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mdormanfair enough.  happy to move to neutron channel14:59
jlibosvathanks everyone for showing up :) and have a good day14:59
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amotokimdorman: thanks for raising it anyway14:59
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"14:59
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 14:59:54 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)14:59
dasmthanks folks! o/14:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-01-17-14.00.html14:59
mlavallejlibosva: thanks!14:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-01-17-14.00.txt14:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2017/networking.2017-01-17-14.00.log.html15:00
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igordcard#startmeeting network_common_flow_classifier17:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 17:00:31 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is igordcard. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.17:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'network_common_flow_classifier'17:00
igordcardhi davidsha17:00
igordcardhi all17:00
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igordcardlet's wait 3 minutes to improve the chances of everyone being around17:00
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igordcard                                self.assertDictContainsSubset(# nsh match fields)17:03
igordcardnot that for sure :p17:03
davidshaThat's an unusual one...17:03
igordcard#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Neutron/CommonFlowClassifier#Discussion_Topic_17_January_201717:03
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igordcard#topic Approach A - PoC status17:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Approach A - PoC status (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:04
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igordcarddavidsha has been working on the first steps of Approach A's PoC17:04
igordcarddavidsha: how is it looking so far?17:04
davidshaigordcard: good, I've just been working on the Service Plugin and the CLI extensions to interact with it. I'm looking into the DB back end too and seeing how that should work.17:05
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igordcarddavidsha: great17:06
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davidshaigordcard: I'm working from the CLI perpective as this was the distinction between approach A and B17:08
igordcardwhen we have the full API and db backend we should be able to make another PoC demoing how that could be integrated to a neutron service17:08
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davidshaigordcard: Right, I'm thinking of integrating it with the QoS DSCP rule as a PoC17:09
igordcarddavidsha: cool17:09
igordcarddavidsha: you're extending the existing openstack/neutron-classifier right?17:09
davidshaigordcard: yes, though it could still be radically different by the time I'm done, not sure how much can be recycled after it's been converted from a library to a service plugin.17:10
igordcarddavidsha: which is good, we will then know for sure whether it makes sense to submit patches to neutron-classifier or simply create a new repo17:11
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davidshaigordcard: If Sean is ok with us changing neutron-classifier this much then I'd say stick with it.17:12
igordcarddavidsha: sure17:12
davidshaigordcard: Once the patch for the service plugin is finished we can show him it and see what he thinks.17:13
igordcarddavidsha: agree17:13
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igordcardalright, I think that's everything about the PoC17:13
igordcardmoving on...17:13
igordcard#topic Open discussion17:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: network_common_flow_classifier)"17:14
igordcardmyself and davidsha are going to the PTG, and we are available to meet and discuss anything about the common classification framework17:14
igordcardanything else we're missing davidsha ?17:15
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davidshaDon't think so.17:15
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igordcardthis is all then, great meeting17:16
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"17:16
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 17:16:58 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)17:17
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2017/network_common_flow_classifier.2017-01-17-17.00.html17:17
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2017/network_common_flow_classifier.2017-01-17-17.00.txt17:17
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openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/network_common_flow_classifier/2017/network_common_flow_classifier.2017-01-17-17.00.log.html17:17
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lbragstad#startmeeting keystone18:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 18:00:01 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is lbragstad. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.18:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.18:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'keystone'18:00
lbragstadping agrebennikov, amakarov, annakoppad, ayoung, bknudson, breton, browne, chrisplo, crinkle, davechen, dolphm, dstanek, edmondsw, edtubill, gagehugo, gyee, henrynash, hrybacki, jamielennox, jaugustine, jgrassler, knikolla, lamt, lbragstad, kbaikov, ktychkova, morgan, nisha, nkinder, notmorgan, raildo, ravelar, rderose, rodrigods, roxanaghe, samueldmq, shaleh, spilla, srwilkers, StefanPaetowJisc, stevemar, topol, portdirect, SamYaple18:00
samueldmqHey o/18:00
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lbragstadlet's give it a minute for folks to trickle in18:01
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lbragstadok - cool18:03
lbragstad#topic announcements18:03
*** openstack changes topic to "announcements (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:03
lbragstadwe are in R-5 and this is the final week for non-client library releases18:03
lbragstadonly 5 weeks left until we release18:03
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lbragstadalso this week is non-client library freeze18:03
lbragstadwe will be releasing new versions of KSA and KSC this week18:03
lbragstadI know rodrigods has a last minute patch up to KSA to add some tests18:03
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stevemarand jdennis had a nice fix for ksa18:03
rodrigodslbragstad, ++18:04
morganmordred: ^ we wont get the KSA context manager in if we don't have an example, it will take me longer to generate it than you18:04
lbragstadbut that's the only thing i think we are waiting on for KSA18:04
morganif you have an example today, i'll get us to land the new context manager18:04
morganbefore the release18:04
lbragstadmorgan ++18:04
lbragstadstevemar I assume we have until friday?18:04
morganwe should, but lets not delay unless there is a damn good reason to18:05
stevemarlbragstad: wednesday/thursday18:05
stevemarthe release team doesn't like releasing on friday18:05
morgancommit it and quit :P18:05
lbragstadmorgan cool - so we have a day or two to land the context manager18:05
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stevemartheres one more for KSA: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/421319/18:05
samueldmqNice! Let's get it done18:05
morganyeah i can make that happen18:05
morganbut i need an example to work from18:06
morganwhich i expect will take a day or so to shore up18:06
* stevemar puts his +2 on 42131918:06
lbragstadmorgan I can follow up with you later too on that - i just want to have tabs on it18:06
morganlbragstad: it's more just needing a concrete example and confirming the design is sane18:06
lbragstadmorgan ++18:06
lbragstadmakes sense18:06
morgani don't want to land that in KSA (since ksa is very strict in contract) w/o the concrete test(s)18:06
stevemarmorgan: and docs ;)18:06
morgan(not unit/functional)18:07
morganstevemar: the example will be for doc generation too18:07
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morganworst case, it lands in Pike18:07
lbragstadmorgan how much does it need to be in this next release?18:07
lbragstadmorgan ok - that answers my question18:07
mordredmorgan: yes. sorry. I will do this18:07
morganlbragstad: ideally this release18:07
morganwe want to lean on it18:07
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morganit cleans up  our code in shade/zuul/nodeppool18:08
lbragstadif there is anything else that we need in those libraries, please speak up so that we can prioritize accordingly18:08
morganand sooner is very much better18:08
stevemar#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting18:08
stevemaragenda ^18:08
lbragstadthanks stevemar18:08
morganbut worst case we can lag on it, i just don't wnat to drag too much if we can avoid it18:08
lbragstadmorgan makes sense - let me know when you need some reviews18:08
lbragstadPike PTG in ATL is just around the corner, be sure to check out the etherpad18:09
lbragstad#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-pike-ptg18:09
morganif mordred doesn't get it today i'll take on the example work, but it will def be in Pike timeframe instead18:09
lbragstadit makes it a lot easier as we go through and start planning things18:09
* morgan needs to book a flight18:09
lbragstadmorgan makes sense18:09
* stevemar wonders if anyone added anything to the ptg etherpad18:09
samueldmqSamuel has got Green status to go to Atlanta18:09
lbragstadfinal few things to review18:09
morganfwiw, i'll be missing day 1 of the PTG, family things to do that weekend in Los Angeles18:09
stevemari bought my ticket18:09
lbragstadreview #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40389818:10
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morganbut i'll be there for the rest of the time18:10
lbragstadreview #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40987418:10
lbragstadreview #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/41589518:10
stevemarlbragstad: use #topic!18:10
knikollais the first one not WIP anymore?18:10
morganstevemar: ++18:10
lbragstadstevemar i'm still in the announcements sections :)18:10
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stevemarknikolla: doesn't look like it :O18:11
lbragstad#topic final things to review for ocata18:11
*** openstack changes topic to "final things to review for ocata (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:11
stevemarmind if i chime in here lbragstad ?18:11
lbragstadstevemar sure18:11
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stevemarwe've got maybe 1-2 weeks left for features18:12
stevemarI've identified the following as critical patches18:12
stevemarthe next few are nice to have:18:12
stevemarso please... everyone knows what i'm gonna ask :)18:12
lbragstadI have a new patch up for #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/415895/18:13
lbragstadI'm going to spend today working on docs18:13
stevemarlamt: rderose samueldmq rodrigods spilla gagehugo all of you :P18:13
lbragstadso I'll have something up before 518:13
rderosewill do18:13
gagehugoI shall pickup the pace18:13
stevemarpull down the patch, play with the new functionality18:14
spillaay ay captain18:14
stevemarif you have questions let me know on irc18:14
* samueldmq noda18:14
lamtwill do18:14
samueldmqNods, not noda18:14
lbragstad#topic announcement: prepare for bug mode!18:14
*** openstack changes topic to "announcement: prepare for bug mode! (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:14
stevemarsecondly we need a few folks to look at the undecided and high bugs18:14
lbragstadlast announcement18:14
stevemarlbragstad: take it away18:14
lbragstadwe will need to start going to bugs and getting into bug mode in order to have a productive RC period18:14
morganstevemar: i'll triage bugs today18:14
lbragstadthere are bunch of things that aren't triaged yet18:14
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lbragstadis anyone able to pick up a couple? this is also something we can try and get through during office hours, too18:15
lbragstadthanks morgan18:15
stevemarmorgan: awesome, breton / lbragstad / myself have been doing a pretty good job of it this release18:15
lbragstadI don't want to ask someone to do *all* the work, but if someone even has time to do one, that's a big help18:15
morganwont commit to code, but i'll do a sweep for the high prio ones and make sure nothing is lingering/close out dead bugs if I see them18:15
stevemarmorgan: ++18:15
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stevemarthats all i was asking for18:15
morganbut i'll be sure to hit the highs that looks relevant for ocata18:15
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knikollalbragstad: i can work on that18:16
lbragstadknikolla awesome18:16
lbragstadif in the process of triaging, you find one that makes a good candidate for office hours - write it down18:17
lbragstador vocalize it18:17
lbragstadit's always nice to have easy ones stashed away for folks to work on18:17
lbragstad(I wonder if we should make an office-hours bug tag)18:17
knikollai'll put them on the office hours etherpad18:17
lbragstadknikolla cool - thanks!18:18
lbragstadmoving on18:18
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lbragstad#topic Owning the Docker image18:18
*** openstack changes topic to "Owning the Docker image (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:18
lbragstadSamYaple o/18:19
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lbragstaddo we have a SamYaple ?18:20
lbragstadwe  can circle back after gagehugo's topic18:20
lbragstad#topic Finishing up doc build stacktraces bug18:20
stevemarlbragstad: he chimed in earlier18:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Finishing up doc build stacktraces bug (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:20
lbragstadgagehugo o/18:20
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stevemargagehugo: hmm, i remember bknudson tackled this early on, looks like we created more errors since then :)18:21
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gagehugoso this bug is almost done18:21
stevemarbut he's a good resource for this stuff18:21
openstackLaunchpad bug 1602422 in OpenStack Identity (keystone) "Many tracebacks building keystone docs" [Low,In progress] - Assigned to Gage Hugo (gagehugo)18:21
stevemar#lnk https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1602422/18:21
morgani don't wnat to convert away from @hybrid_property unless really needed18:21
morganit seems super useful to keep that18:21
gagehugothe other option is to just ignore the sql_model file18:22
bknudsonwe used to have an option to fail docs if there were warnings but that hasn't worked for a while now18:22
rderosemorgan: ++18:22
gagehugowhen autodoc'ing18:22
morganwe can skip the file in autodoc for now and work to make that functional down the road18:22
rderosewe have other hybrid properties (domain_id), are any of those failing?18:22
gagehugoI think it's something to do with value that aren't in the same table18:22
morganshort term, skip with a todo18:22
gagehugobecause User has name/enabled/domain_id and they are fine18:22
gagehugoin sql_model18:22
gagehugoit's just the password stuff18:23
rderoseyeah, I am okay with skipping18:23
morganif you can't fix it w/o moving away from hybrid_property, just skip that autodoc bit and we can circle back on it18:23
gagehugook, that works18:23
stevemargagehugo: looks like zzzeek is aware of it http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6859182/sphinx-autodoc-integrate-decorated-properties :)18:23
gagehugooh cool18:23
morgansounds like future sql-a will fix18:24
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lbragstadthat'd be nice18:24
gagehugo5 years ago :/18:24
morganwell lets bug zzzeek again18:24
morganit should be fixable18:24
morganand zzzeek works on openstakc now, he didn't 5yrs ago18:24
morganso he is more reachable for us18:24
gagehugoalso: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/420171/ for the same bug18:24
gagehugooh nice18:25
gagehugoI'm good then if we wanna move on18:25
stevemargagehugo: maybe check if zzzeek is available in -keystone and bug him?18:25
gagehugostevemar: sure18:26
stevemarhes great for anything sql related18:26
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lbragstad#topic open discussion18:26
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:26
SamYaplelbragstad: apologies, kids were screaming18:26
bknudsonthere should be some way for us to catch errors in the doc builds18:26
lbragstadSamYaple cool!18:26
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lbragstad#topic Owning the Docker image18:26
*** openstack changes topic to "Owning the Docker image (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:26
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lbragstadSamYaple o/18:26
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ayoungThis is based on the pattern of functional tests and devstack moving to the projects18:27
stevemarbknudson: fail on warnings :D18:27
* topol On irc, no one can hear your kids scream. Thank goodness. That saved me many a time18:27
ayoungmoving from a central project to the to corresponding remote projects18:27
SamYaplehello all. short summary, id like to see keystone repo have a Dockerfile and maintain that for keystone18:27
SamYapleTo that effect, we have this18:27
SamYaple#link https://github.com/yaodu/docker-keystone/tree/master/dockerfiles18:28
ayoungit allows the Keystone team to control the defaults for containerization.18:28
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SamYapleup until recently we havent been able to effectively build openstack images ina a manner that CI/CD likes18:28
SamYaplethis was a major pain point in the Kolla project18:28
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ayoungI was thinking this could go under a separate git repo under the Identity program18:29
SamYaplewhere kolla solved this with many layers (a base layer, and openstack-base layer, a keystone-base layer, etc)18:29
SamYaplethis is solved with a single Dockerfile18:29
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SamYaplemaking it much more reasonable to get into a keystone-owned repo18:29
SamYaplesince there are no linkages to external tooling and complicated layering system18:29
dstanekSamYaple: and the identity team should manage it?18:29
morganayoung: i would agree a separate repo would be good.18:29
SamYapledstanek: i would like to see that yes18:29
dstanekmorgan: ++ on separate repo - that way i don't need to see it :-)18:30
SamYaplefor a quick look at how easy it would be to build images _with_ patches, https://github.com/yaodu/docker-keystone/blob/master/README.md18:30
* morgan wants to avoid encoding special things for packaging (outside of like bindep) in the main repo18:30
SamYaplesingle command can build an image with a ref patch18:30
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morganSamYaple: as a point, is it possible to CI this with zuul?18:31
SamYaplemorgan: yes! thats the goal!18:31
breton && pip install --no-cache-dir --no-index --no-compile --find-links /tmp/packages --constraint /tmp/packages/upper-constraints.txt \18:31
lbragstadSamYaple have other projects already started maintaining their own docker files?18:31
morganbecause i don't want to be responsible for something that isn't tested18:31
stevemarnothing wrong with keeping it in the repo18:31
bretonwhy does it install upper-constraints.txt?18:31
SamYaplelbragstad: no. starting with keystone18:31
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morganif it isn't tested it is broken (in proper openstack fashion)18:31
stevemarwe keep uwsgi and mod_wsgi stuff in the repo18:32
morganstevemar: that is not really deployment stuff like docker is18:32
SamYaplebreton: its not installing upper-constraints, its constraining to upper-constraints18:32
morganstevemar: docker is more like deb or rpm spec imo18:32
SamYaplemorgan: ++18:32
SamYaplemorgan: and thats the goal here18:32
stevemaras long as it's tested it is OK with me18:32
morganand i would -2 deb control files AND rpm specs18:32
bretonSamYaple: oh ok, sorry18:32
morganso, i am inclined to say no to a dockerfile in keystone as well18:32
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SamYapleto produce a binary-like thing that can be plugged into a deployment tool/script/devstack18:32
morganthis feels like part of the deployment tools that covers .deb and rpm building18:33
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lbragstadSamYaple have you talked to other projects about whether or not they want a docker file in project source?18:33
SamYaplelbragstad: not in an official capcity, no18:33
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stevemarits to help kolla right?18:33
* morgan doesn't wnat to block this though18:33
SamYaplethere are people around that are interested in it, but this is the first official project meeting18:34
morganbut just voicing the opinion of where i see this fitting18:34
dstanekit's no help to them if we don't use it and it just rots18:34
stevemardstanek: testing would be a requirement18:34
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stevemardstanek: we've had other stuff bitrot before for less18:34
SamYaplestevemar: this is unrelated to Kolla. Kolla needs external tooling to build and isn't CI/CD friendly18:34
lbragstadSamYaple I'd be curious to see what a note the mailing list brings up18:34
SamYaplelbragstad: can do.18:35
lbragstadSamYaple I only worry about having a split conventions between the different projects18:35
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SamYaplelbragstad: to be clear, i am hoping for a cross-openstack effort here, not something keystone specific18:35
lbragstad(some projects keeping in tree, some keeping it in a separate repo under the project, some projects keeping is somewhere else)18:35
lbragstadSamYaple ++18:35
SamYapleso what you suggest is reasonable. this is jsut the first conversation on the road18:35
stevemarSamYaple: apply for a new community goal?18:35
* SamYaple adds to list18:36
stevemarSamYaple: like this? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/419706/18:36
ayoungWhat I want to avboid is having people that know nothing about Keystone make decisions that are then inherited .  Containers are the main way people are going to be deployiong software here on in.  Seems we should take it that far18:36
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SamYaplefor those that are interested, it takes ~1 minute to build this keystone image with a ref patch18:36
lbragstadI just wouldn't want to have a conversation with another project as to why we keep it in tree when they have a strong reason not to, and now we have different projects doing different things18:36
stevemarlets see what reasoning SamYaple brings up in the mailing list :D18:37
SamYaplejust as a quick poll, is there interest in this from the keystone team?18:37
ayoungAnd, unlike most of OpenStack, Keystone can be deployed without any other OpenStack services running.  This is a reasonable tool for development, as well as comunicating live setup standards18:37
ayoungSamYaple, probably too soon.  people need time to consider it, I think18:38
dstaneki don't use docker so i likely wouldn't look at it18:38
ayoungdstanek, *yet*18:38
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dstanekayoung: hopefully ever18:38
morganayoung: again, i am going to refer to current state. -2 for control files and rpmspecs, i view dockerfile the same18:38
SamYapleok fair enough. I will hit up the mailing list with all of this18:38
ayoungdstanek, docker is like venvs for everything else18:38
lbragstadSamYaple awesome - thanks!18:39
stevemarSamYaple: sounds like a good initiative, needs x-project talk thogh18:39
morgani'd like us to have a clear this is how it works in openstack model18:39
morganif that is in tree, i'll conceed, but right now i'd say no based on prior art18:39
SamYapleright morgan. and i don't have a good answer for that at the moment18:39
morganfor in-tree, and ask for it to be like other packaging18:39
lbragstadyeah - that would probably help in figuring out if people want to use it18:39
morganSamYaple: yep!18:39
stevemarSamYaple: I'm OK as long as it's tested18:39
SamYaplemorgan: i will say it is a _bit_ different than an RPM18:39
morganoh for sure18:39
SamYaplebut im with you in your concerns18:39
dstanekayoung: i tried docker, but went back to lxc18:39
SamYapledstanek: you can use these images with LXC!18:40
morganit's why i wouldn't hard -2 it on principle18:40
morganjust want to make sure we're not doing wacky things18:40
ayoungdstanek, ah...so jsut the docker piece...18:40
SamYaplecool. well this when as well as I could have expected. thats all from me18:40
dstanekayoung: all my dev is currently in containers18:40
lbragstadSamYaple thanks for the info - i'll keep tabs on the mailing list18:40
SamYapleif you want more info on any of this, hit me up. and we have a working channel for this stuff in #yaodu18:40
lbragstad#topic open discussion (round 2!)18:41
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (round 2!) (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:41
lbragstadreminder that we have the policy meeting tomorrow for those who are interested (#link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/#Keystone_Policy_Meeting)18:41
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spillaI have something (hopefully) quick if there's nothing else18:42
morganlbragstad: you missed my topic18:42
spillado that ^18:42
lbragstadmorgan ah - im sorry18:43
lbragstad#topic *** VERY IMPORTANT *** VMT coverage / Threat Analysis Requirements18:43
*** openstack changes topic to "*** VERY IMPORTANT *** VMT coverage / Threat Analysis Requirements (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:43
lbragstadmorgan fungi o/18:43
* morgan securely puts on the VMT hat18:43
morganok, so keystone should be leading here. We are heavily invested in security for obvious reasons18:43
morganthe issue is we are not fully covered by the VMT18:44
morgankeystone server and client are grandfathered in18:44
morgankeystone auth and middleware are not (arguably should be, but different story)18:44
morganwe really need to move on getting these covered by the VMT18:44
morganespecially middleware and auth18:44
morganthis requires a security analysis that can be publically published to be completed18:45
stevemaris there a guide that we can follow?18:45
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stevemarshould i be bugging ibm's security teams?18:45
lbragstadmorgan is the security analysis manual?18:45
morganin the middleterm we need to do the same for keystone and keystoneclient (as the VMT will require grandfathered in projects to do the same thing to maintain the tag)18:45
morganthere is a template18:45
morganone sec, getting the link18:45
lbragstadstevemar yes - you should ;)18:45
fungi#link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/security-analysis/18:45
morganthanks fungi !18:46
* fungi broke radio silence18:46
browneso i did work on this much, but i know the OSSG has been work on threat analysis of various projects18:46
morganbut in short, it needs to be a reputable external party (meaning, not the VMT members)18:46
* fungi is glad not to be reputable18:46
morganOSSG can commit to doing this, but we are not requiring them to do so18:46
lbragstadthis almost sounds liaison related18:47
brownemorgan:  yeah, best if the project cores did it18:47
morganit might be faster to not try and ask the OSSG if we can source from one of the contributors (red hat, rackspace, etc)18:47
fungii believe the one or two the ossg were getting hands-on with were to dry run the analysis process and templates18:47
morganand the project cores collaborate with them on it18:47
fungibut the idea is that they wouldn't be directly involved beyond reviewing future analyses18:47
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brownebut if you want templates or help in how to do it OSSG can be useful reference18:47
morganfungi: ++18:48
morgani really want to get us moving on this. it is *** important ***18:48
morgankeystone should not lag behind on this. if we do, we risk a lot.18:48
fungithat said, i don't speak for the security team. the vmt asked if they wanted to help us come up with a process for this piece and they volunteered, but their involvement is their own18:49
morganand we have a ton of new things that need to be looked at with a critical eye18:49
brownei thought maybe bknudson had already done some work in this area18:49
stevemarbrowne: he's been busy with a bunch of things18:49
morganbrowne: i believe so, but iirc most of the work done was not directly publishable18:49
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morganbrowne: as most of the threat-analysis done to this point has not been18:49
morganthe key is this version must be something we can publish publically18:49
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morganso. i am revisiting this and trying to get this done for the ocata code.18:50
morganespecially for ksa and ksm18:50
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lbragstadmorgan what's the deadline?18:50
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fungiyea, i _believe_ the compromise there is that the analysis itself doesn't need to be performed in public (and in fact may turn up risks which the team doing the analysis want to bring to the project in private), but that the eventual _final_ document produced as an outcome of the analysis should be something the project can publish documenting its securit model and design18:50
morganno real hard deadline yet18:50
morganas long as the doc (final) can be published18:51
lbragstadah - so it's technically doable so long as we support ocata code18:51
morgani'm happy to work with whatever team is doing the analysis (as a member of keystone-core-sec)18:51
morganlbragstad: i am targeting ocata because we are almost done with it18:51
lbragstadmorgan that makes sense18:52
morganlbragstad: barbican did their s-a for vmt tag on newton18:52
stevemarmorgan: maybe bug the security related folks at rh, rax and ibm ?18:52
fungilbragstad: right, the vmt provides coverage of stable branches starting with the release following acquisition of the vulnerability:managed tag18:52
morganbut since we haven't started, no reason to target ocata18:52
lbragstadmorgan i have some time available tomorrow and Thursday18:52
morganerm s/to/not to/18:52
lbragstadmorgan if you want to work on it together?18:52
fungiso if you can get it done before ocata is released, we can cover stable/ocata onward. or if it's done before the pike release then would be stable/pike onward18:52
morganlbragstad: if you wouldn't mind collaborating and working with me to liason18:52
morgani just want to make sure i'm not the bottleneck as i have a ton on my plate18:53
lbragstadfungi got it - that makes sense18:53
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morganand... i want someone not on the VMT to be ultimately a interested party within the project18:53
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morganthe only requirement i ask for whom is involved is a member of of keystone-core (and if you're not on coresec you might get added to it for this)18:54
lbragstadmorgan cool - I'd like to help, ping me when you have time and I'll get up to speed18:54
morganlbragstad: lets talk tomorrow18:54
lbragstadmorgan cool - tomorrow is pretty open for me18:54
morgan#action lbragstad to help wrangle security analysis (with help from morgan) for keystone projects18:54
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morgani have a table being delivered but that is about it ;)18:54
lbragstadmorgan cool - ping me when you're sitting at your new table18:55
morganok thats it for me.18:55
morganfungi: thanks for the input as well18:55
lbragstadalright - we have 5 minutes left18:55
lbragstadanything else we want to cover?18:55
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lbragstad#topic open discussion (round 3!)18:56
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (round 3!) (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:56
fungimorgan: always glad to help18:56
knikollaspilla wanted to discuss something i think18:56
spillaSo sorta a heat/keystone issue, if its a thing at all anymore18:56
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spillaso when using the ResourceType keystone_role_assigments.py18:57
spillaif there is a user associated with a non-existing role, Heat will error out and lock the Stack in a fail state18:57
spillaWould anyone know about this/if its fixed?18:58
spillaI was planning on ping the heat irc too, wasn't sure how involved anyone in keystone was with this18:58
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stevemarspilla: catch the roleNotFound error and make heat smarter?18:59
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lbragstadspilla stevemar want to head over to -keystone?19:00
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lbragstadwe're about out of time19:00
stevemaroh yeah19:00
lbragstadthanks for coming, everyone!19:00
spillathat'll work19:00
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lbragstad#endmeeting keystone19:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"19:00
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 19:00:46 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)19:00
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-01-17-18.00.html19:00
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-01-17-18.00.txt19:00
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2017/keystone.2017-01-17-18.00.log.html19:00
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fungiinfra team, accumulate!19:01
fungithis week's topics brought to us by clarkb, AJaeger and fungi19:01
* morgan lurks19:02
jeblairfungi: can we squeeze in a quick nodepool v3 discussion?19:02
fungijeblair: no problem19:02
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fungi#startmeeting infra19:04
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 19:04:06 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.19:04
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:04
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)"19:04
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'infra'19:04
fungi#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting19:04
fungi#topic Announcements19:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: infra)"19:04
fungii don't have any for this week19:04
fungias always, feel free to hit me up with announcements you want included in future meetings19:04
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fungi#topic Actions from last meeting19:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)"19:04
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fungi#link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-01-10-19.04.html19:04
fungioof, we have a bunch. some have my name next to them and i know i didn't get them done, so i'll just readd them now19:04
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fungi#action fungi Obtain docs.openstack.org X.509 certificate.19:04
fungi#action fungi Obtain developer.openstack.org X.509 certificate.19:04
fungi#action fungi announce the infra ptg pike etherpad to relevant mailing lists.19:04
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fungithe others have a better change of being done maybe?19:04
fungijeblair mark http://specs.openstack.org/openstack-infra/infra-specs/specs/nodepool-zookeeper-workers.html implemented19:05
jeblair#action jeblair mark http://specs.openstack.org/openstack-infra/infra-specs/specs/nodepool-zookeeper-workers.html implemented19:05
fungiyeah, i only just looked myself19:05
fungipabelanger Switch DNS for docs.openstack.org from CloudSites to files01.openstack.org.19:05
fungithis i know got done19:05
fungithanks pabelanger for making the switch!19:06
jeblairthat's the trick... 'pabelanger' has to come after "#action' for this to work19:06
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fungisome additional holes in documentation got filled which the community at large spotted after the cut-over, but last word seemed to be that everything was in ship shape now19:07
fungiAJaeger follow up to http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2016-August/004690.html letting them know we're ready for site deletion.19:07
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fungithat too19:07
fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2017-January/005023.html19:07
fungii guess we haven't completely told them they can delete it yet19:07
fungiwe still need to stop publishing to it, but we can discuss that later in the meeting19:08
jeblairyeah, i think the actual 'go' has not yet happened19:08
AJaegerjeblair: correct, not happened - just the heads-up19:08
fungiokay, that concludes the previous action items portion of our show19:08
fungi#topic Specs approval: PROPOSED Ethercalc (clarkb)19:09
*** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED Ethercalc (clarkb) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:09
fungi#link https://review.openstack.org/420136 Ethercalc specs proposal19:09
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clarkbohai, this is pretty straightforward. Basically PTG organizers (ttx) have requested that we run an ethercalc to do virtual unconference post it note scheduling19:09
fungiit's gotten a few reviews, looks straightforward, and we're on a tight timeline to hopefully have it working in time for the ptg19:10
clarkbits really similar to etherpad with the biggest difference being redis is required (no mysql option)19:10
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fungialso i doubt i'm the only one who's been after an excuse to have an ethercalc.openstack.org. it's a nifty service19:10
fungii think jeblair was the one who first brought it to my attention, like a year ago maybe?19:11
jeblairyeah, i enjoyed using the project-hosted ethercalc, but it deletes things after not-too-long, so it will be nice to have our own.19:11
fungianyway, seems like a worthwhile experiment19:11
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fungianyone object to going ahead with infra council roll call on it over the next couple days?19:12
clarkbif this gets the go ahead I will push up the chagne to add the puppet-ethercalc repo and then go from there19:12
fungi#info Infra Council voting is open for the "Ethercalc" spec until 19:00 UTC on Thursday, January 19.19:13
jeblairsounds good to me, and i think the abbreviated timeline is reasonable considering the similarity to an existing service.19:13
fungidoes appear we can reuse a lot of our prior art19:13
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fungiokay, priority efforts...19:14
fungi#topic Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (jeblair)19:14
*** openstack changes topic to "Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (jeblair) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:14
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fungii guess we can cover "nodepool v3" here19:14
jeblairmordred sent an email about a branch of nodepool for the v3 shim19:15
fungior is this more about the Zuul v3 spec?19:15
fungiahh, that yes19:15
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openstackRemoving item from minutes: #topic Nodepool: Use Zookeeper for Workers (jeblair)19:15
fungi#topic Priority Efforts: Zuul v3 (jeblair)19:15
*** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts: Zuul v3 (jeblair) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:15
jeblairmy read is that while most of us would prefer the situation be different, no one strongly objects to the 'branch nodepool to create a temporary shim program' approach19:16
fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2017-January/005048.html "Nodepool v3 shim for talking to v2 zuul"19:16
* mordred waves19:16
jeblairand i do think it will be the easiest way to get where we're going (and an appropriate amount of effort for a temporary component)19:16
jeblairdoes that sound right?  should we go ahead and proceed with that?19:17
fungiprobably far less effort than the temporary bits of zuul v2.519:17
fungithe plan seemed sound to me19:17
jeblairfungi: yep19:17
mordredif there are no objections, I'll make the branch for it today19:17
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clarkbya I didn't have objections once I groked the plan19:18
clarkbmaybe I should've been more explicit in my email19:18
fungi#agreed The Nodepool v3 shim plan seems sound.19:18
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clarkbbasically "these two options seem viable but haven't spent enough time to say one way or another which would be better so I defer to you"19:18
fungi#action mordred make the temporary branch for the Nodepool v3 shim.19:19
fungiSpamapS: if you're around, did jeblair's reply address your concerns about that plan?19:20
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* mordred is about to send a quick response to that thread with slightly more info19:21
fungiso be it19:21
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fungithanks mordred!19:22
fungiand jeblair!19:22
fungi#topic Priority Efforts: Docs Publishing via AFS (AJaeger)19:22
*** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts: Docs Publishing via AFS (AJaeger) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:22
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AJaegerdocs.o.o works fine, thanks everybody.19:22
AJaegerWe can now stop publishing to it https://review.openstack.org/#/c/420135/ and then declare the spec implemented https://review.openstack.org/#/c/420138/19:22
fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-docs/2017-January/009479.html docs.o.o looks great - doesn't it?19:23
fungiand i guess also follow up with the cloudsites admins to let them know they're free to delete19:23
* AJaeger saw two or three bugreports against outdated pages and we missed initially some infra content - all fixed or commented on19:23
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AJaegerYes, will do that once 420135 is merged and we do not publish there anymore19:23
mordredI love that this works:  ls /afs/openstack.org/docs19:23
jeblairmordred: ++19:24
fungior lynx /afs/openstack.org/docs/index.html ;)19:24
jeblairi think that could be a really good debugging tool for the docs team19:24
AJaegerSo, nothing more to add from my side - just waiting for those to merge...19:24
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AJaegergrepping over the tree ;)19:25
jeblairi don't know how many folks have installed afs clients, but we do have some install instructions19:25
clarkbI just did zypper search afs and found no afs19:25
SpamapSfungi: Yes I think so19:25
fungii approved 420135 just now19:25
fungithanks SpamapS!19:25
jeblairif folks wanted to add instructions for other os's, that'd be fine i think19:25
jeblair#link afs client install http://docs.openstack.org/infra/system-config/afs.html#client-configuration19:26
AJaegerclarkb: yeah ;( There're some packages in the build service but haven't tested those19:26
mordredclarkb, AJaeger: there is an old thread here: https://forums.opensuse.org/showthread.php/442068-how-to-install-openafs-on-11-3 that does not shed much light19:26
SpamapSfungi: np. I also realized just how much I've avoided learning about nodepool by reading jeblair's reply. :)19:26
jeblairSpamapS: as you can see, we have good reasons for changing all the things we are in v3 ;)19:27
funginodepool as a passive gearman sniffer19:27
SpamapS(BTW, as the current steward of gearmand, that use of the admin protocol horrifies me. ;) Anyway, carry on.19:27
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mordredSpamapS: it horrifies us too19:27
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SpamapSFor some reason I thought it was just a small part of it. Glad we're on the same page now. :)19:28
SpamapSNow.. how do I get you to also decide to use rustygear..... ;-)19:28
fungiAJaeger: okay, so once 420135 merges (~3 minutes more, zuul willing) i'll approve the change to mark the spec implemented and you or i can follow up one more time to the cloudsites admins thread19:29
AJaegerfungi: I'll followup privately and CC you - ok?19:29
fungiAJaeger: that's fine, though there's also that thread on the infra ml we could use19:30
funginot sure what does or doesn't need to be private19:30
AJaegerlet's do it public...19:30
fungiit's my default preference ;)19:30
fungithanks everyone for working on the afs docs implementation! it's one of the awesomest things we have19:31
jeblairalso, like our oldest spec?19:31
fungiquite likely, especially if you count back to the prior swift-based plan19:31
fungia milestone!19:31
jeblairit starts out with a link to "Juno summit session"19:31
* fungi shudders19:32
mordredI kindof want t-shirts that say "OpenStack Infra: Horrifying the world by solving problems using proven old technology instead of chasying shiny"19:32
fungiwhat's old is new again19:32
fungi#topic Pike Cycle signing key ready for attestation (fungi)19:33
*** openstack changes topic to "Pike Cycle signing key ready for attestation (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)"19:33
fungi#link https://sks-keyservers.net/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0xc96bfb160752606daa0de2fa05eb5792c876df9a&fingerprint=on Pike Cycle signing key19:33
fungi#link http://docs.openstack.org/infra/system-config/signing.html#attestation attestation process19:33
mordredfungi: I feel like I just did this19:33
fungii went ahead and did this early19:34
fungiespecially since we have a shorter cycle19:34
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fungithe idea is to normally give everyone plenty of time to do this rather than scrambling after the release19:34
fungii also talked to dhellmann and got a reminder for it on the release process/timeline to coincide with when the release managers propose the custom gerrit acls for the upcoming stable branch19:35
fungione tricky bit is that this is happening before there is actually a release date set for pike. as such i set the key expiration for 12 months just to make sure it's viable past whatever release date is chosen (we'll likely stop using it at least a couple months before it expires, but doesn't hurt for it to be a little longer)19:36
clarkbfungi: so we don't need tkeys to be valid during the entire stable support period?19:37
mordredfungi: done. thank you for documenting an easy to follow process19:37
fungiclarkb: sort of. the key remains "valid" just no longer in use (and so expired)19:37
fungiexpiration can always be extended if deemed necessary19:38
fungirevocation, on the other hand, is forever ;)19:38
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fungiwe would only revoke keys if we thought they were compromised (as someone could reuse them for nefarious purposes in that case)19:38
fungibut an expired key that was not expired at the time it signed something doesn't make whatever it signed untrusted just because you're in the future now19:39
fungiwe're more relying on the creation/expiration dates to provide a rough window for when the keys were used to create signatures (and then we also provide much more precise date ranges at https://releases.openstack.org/#cryptographic-signatures for those who need them)19:40
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fungianybody have any questions about this before we move on to open discussion?19:41
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fungi#topic Open discussion19:43
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)"19:44
fungiAJaeger: i've approved 420138 now and will take the Docs Publishing via AFS topic out of priority efforts in our agenda after the meeting. thanks!19:44
AJaegerthanks, fungi!19:45
AJaegerfungi, mail sent and tony answered already...19:45
fungilooks like i've also forgotten to remove "Common OpenStack CI Solution" from the agenda after it was implemented so will clean that up as well19:45
fungiapproving his held post through moderation now19:46
fungi#link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2017-January/005073.html docs.openstack.com excessive INODE consumption19:47
fungiawesome wrap-up!19:48
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fungisince nobody seems to have anything for open discussion, i grant you all 10 minutes of recess!19:49
fungithanks everyone19:49
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"19:49
AJaegerthanks, fungi! ;)19:49
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 19:49:56 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)19:49
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-01-17-19.04.html19:50
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-01-17-19.04.txt19:50
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2017/infra.2017-01-17-19.04.log.html19:50
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fungiafter the coffee break, enjoy our top-notch performers from the openstack technical committee as they sing all your favorites19:50
ttxincluding "goals goals goals"19:50
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fungi"translators are contributors too"19:52
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fungi"it's not easy being go"19:52
fungi"a tempest in many teapots"19:53
* dhellmann looks around for the bucket he carries his tunes in19:53
dimswhat? infra closed early? :)19:54
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fungidims: i was as surprised as anyone19:55
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AJaegerdims: mark it in your calendar, won't happen often ;)19:56
fungiwe're running out of controversial topics in there i guess ;)19:56
fungisomeone should propose a zuul rewrite in go and nodejs19:56
dimsy that would definitely be container-friendly!19:57
zara_the_lemur__don't forget angular19:57
clarkbprolog would be a good choice for some of zuul's decision making19:57
clarkbmerge yes19:57
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* fungi _is_ still here for the tc meeting, in case our illustrious chair has any doubts19:59
ttxAlright... let's see... I saw fungi dims and dhellmann already19:59
ttxwho else is around for the TC meeting ?19:59
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ttxmtreinish said he is at LCA20:00
* jroll is but doesn't count20:00
ttxdtroyer, EmilienM, johnthetubaguy, mordred, sdague, stevemar: around ?20:00
ttxjroll: you do count20:00
dtroyero/  and suddering at the thought of go + nodejs20:00
thingeejroll yes you count20:00
jrollnot for quorum :)20:00
ttxok, we have quorum20:00
fungijroll makes his own quorum20:00
ttx#startmeeting tc20:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Jan 17 20:00:49 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.20:00
* smcginnis is hanging out with jroll in the corner20:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)"20:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'tc'20:00
* AJaeger joins jroll and smcginnis20:00
ttxHi everyone!20:01
ttxOur agenda for today is at:20:01
ttx#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee20:01
ttxI added a few items for the open discussion at the end, so let's keep some time to cover them20:01
ttxA few easy ones first20:01
ttx#topic Refresh I18n ATC list20:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Refresh I18n ATC list (Meeting topic: tc)"20:01
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/41756920:01
ttxNice refresh, no-brainer for me20:01
flaper87ship it20:01
ttxshipping in 10 seconds20:02
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stevemardo it up20:02
ttx#topic Amend new-language reference document20:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Amend new-language reference document (Meeting topic: tc)"20:02
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/41848720:02
ttxAlso a pretty simple change20:02
thingeeship ship20:02
ttxshipping in 10 seconds unless someone screams really hard20:02
stevemardo it!20:03
* flaper87 removes caps lock from his keyboard20:03
ttxOK, let's pick some Pike goals now20:03
ttx#topic Pike goal: support python 3.520:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Pike goal: support python 3.5 (Meeting topic: tc)"20:03
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/34906920:03
ttxEmilienM: feels like this one has broad support ?20:03
flaper87ship... it20:03
EmilienMditto again? python 3.5 didn't have any pushback20:03
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* flaper87 likes this meeting already20:03
EmilienMttx: yes ship it20:03
ttxany reason to hold on this one ?20:03
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stevemardo it up20:03
stevemarso many projects are nearly there20:04
thingeeit has been sitting around for feedback and has good support20:04
ttxalright, let's do this. Shipping in 10sec20:04
fungiif there are any missing bits of ci standing in the way of projects implementing/testing py3k support, give us a heads up20:04
fungiwe currently consider that already done20:04
dimsfungi : yep. will do20:04
fungi(we being infra)20:04
ttx#topic Pike goal: split out tempest plugins20:04
sigmavirusfungi: y'all have been fantastic20:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Pike goal: split out tempest plugins (Meeting topic: tc)"20:04
sigmavirusdims too ;)20:04
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/36974920:04
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ttxEmilienM: this one sounds slightly more controversial ?20:05
EmilienMit seems like this one is still under review20:05
thingeeand without mtreinish I'm not sure how far we're going to get20:05
ttxWe are running out of time though... should we have a plan B in case this one doesn't make it ?20:05
EmilienMI have a plan B20:05
fungii've abstained so far given the number of ptl -1s on 36974920:06
jrolluntil today the -1s were for "please add a guide", but now I see a couple people disagreeing with the premise20:06
thingeefungi +120:06
ttxyes, it's a bit less obviously beneficial than other things20:06
EmilienMfungi: same here20:06
flaper87yeah, it looks like this one needs some extra talking20:06
sdaguefungi: honestly, I think that there is confusion about the architecture there20:06
ttxOK, shall we table it until someone (mtreinish?) addresses the concerns ?20:07
fungisdague: probably so, and i guess the goal can attempt to address that confusion20:07
sdaguetempest plugins were never designed to be in branches20:07
flaper87TBH, If we manage to do the python3.5 goal for pike, I'll consider it a success already20:07
flaper87but let's not let that stop us20:07
ttxEmilienM: shall we table it until someone (mtreinish?) addresses the concerns ?20:08
dimsflaper87 : nova/py35/tempest shows "Pass 1295 Failure 42 Skip 85" :)20:08
EmilienMttx: yes, most probably20:08
stevemarttx: yeah, wait til mtreinish is around i suppose20:08
dhellmannttx: it seems like we should wait on this one20:08
sdagueyeh dims has been making good progress20:08
ttxok, let's see the backup plan then20:08
ttx#topic deploy-api-in-wsgi20:08
*** openstack changes topic to "deploy-api-in-wsgi (Meeting topic: tc)"20:08
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/41970620:08
jrollsdague: fwiw in-repo tempest plugins work fine with a small hack in project-config, this is just about ops/users AIUI20:08
EmilienMok let me introduce quickly20:08
ttxThat one was "moved" to Queens20:08
EmilienMI was looking for a goal that might have a direct impact on operators20:08
flaper87dims: w00h00020:08
EmilienMand this one is quite interesting20:08
EmilienMI moved it to Queens because I thought we already had 2 goals and stevemar made me realize 3 goals might be too much20:09
* jroll loves this goal20:09
EmilienMI don't think the amount of work is huge for this one20:09
EmilienMbut I'm probably missing something, specially for some projects (maybe neutron)20:09
ttxEmilienM: do you think it could be a Pike goal if the tempest plugin stuff is deferred / abandoned ?20:09
flaper87EmilienM: fwiw, I like this goal and I'd go as far as saying that it'd be great to do it in Pike and hold tempest for Queens20:09
EmilienMttx: yes, it would be doable I think20:09
stevemaras many of you know keystone was one of the first to move to mod_wsgi + apache and ditch eventlet, its one of the best things we've done as far as operators are concerned20:09
thingeewe could leave this one pending if the back up plan for tempest related goal doesn't pass.20:09
dtroyerflaper87: ++20:10
EmilienMstevemar: yes exactly that20:10
ttxWe need more feedback on it though20:10
dimsstevemar : ++20:10
thingeettx +120:10
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sdagueso, I actually think because of some of the apache port binding weirdness, we actually need to get off appache for this to really work20:10
sdagueand explore other wsgi runtimes20:10
EmilienMso, for next week folks can give feedback on wsgi goal, so we have a backup ready in case the other one doesn't make it20:10
sigmavirusEmilienM: I'm surprised that Glance can't be deployed like you want but at the same time, I am not an expert ;)20:11
ttxEmilienM: could you try to gather more PTl feedback on it, just in case we end up needing it ? Ideally we would choose the goals before end of month20:11
jrollsdague: what weirdness, specifically?20:11
fungimaking it webserver agnostic seems generally fine to me20:11
EmilienMsigmavirus: I'll need to investigate more20:11
dtroyerdoes this goal need to be specifically about apache?  or just "some" wsgi server?20:11
EmilienMttx: yes, it's on my list.20:11
sdaguejroll: in order to separate out service logs you need a stanza where you can do it20:11
ttxOK good20:11
EmilienMfungi: yes that's the Goal20:11
sdaguewhich turns out to be a vhost20:11
stevemari think the wording said any possible web server20:11
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EmilienMfungi: only thing is devstack use apache, so for testing, we'll keep using apache20:11
stevemarwell sorry, that may be too broad :)20:11
sdaguewhich means we still have to bind all the weird ports20:11
clarkbsdague: you can still have the python do the logging aiui (rather than rely on apache)20:12
ttxEmilienM: in all cases it doesn't hurt to have a backlog -- it gives a chance to teams that are a lot behind to get an early start20:12
EmilienMI think it's clear in the goal that you can use any webserver20:12
EmilienMttx: indeed20:12
jrolldtroyer: it's already about just exposing a wsgi app that any wsgi-supporting thing can use20:12
jrollsdague: ah right20:12
* jroll plugs nginx/uwsgi20:12
sdagueclarkb: possibly20:12
dhellmanndtroyer : the original idea was to do whatever devstack is doing, but once you have a WSGI app it should work with any server20:12
ttxI feel like Python 3.5 is easier to pass now because we mentioned it last cycle20:12
sdagueanyway, the point is that the apache model turns out to be kind of clumsy20:12
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EmilienMwe also need to consider this goal might affect small projects with lower bandwidth20:13
sdagueand would rather not have everyone put in the effort on the odd work arounds there throughout the community20:13
ttx#info trying to address concerns in split-tempest-plugins, and gathering feedback on deploy-api-in-wsgi in case we need it as a backup plan20:13
clarkbalso for completeness you can also switch vhosts on name rather than poirt20:13
dhellmannin order for this to be a well-defined goal, we need to pick *one* target, even if we do end up supporting others20:13
jrollsdague: ++20:13
dhellmannotherwise we'll have a lot of reinvention20:13
clarkbnova.openstack.test:443 vs neutron.openstack.test:44320:13
flaper87dhellmann: ++20:13
sdagueclarkb: you can, but then you have to distribute dns in your dev env20:13
clarkbsdague: which we already do20:13
clarkbto make multinode testing work20:14
dhellmannso if there's an issue with apache, let's use another service, but let's definitely specify one20:14
sdagueclarkb: not for users20:14
sdagueclarkb: this is more than CI20:14
sdaguethis has to work for developers as well20:14
dhellmannyeah, I don't do dns20:14
clarkbok, just want to point out options here for completeness20:14
* fungi notes we have an entire openstack service devoted to dns ;)20:14
clarkbapache doesn't actually prevent you from doing this they way you want20:14
sdagueI am all in favor of us getting here, I just wanted to raise specific concerns20:14
jrollI think it's solvable but doesn't want to dig into details here20:15
sdagueclarkb: it sort of does given the constraints of working deve environments20:15
flaper87let's elaborate more on this things on the review20:15
dhellmannwe could also decide that it's useful to have those logs combined *shrug*20:15
jrollpls no20:15
EmilienMsdague: please add it into the review20:15
stevemarsince this goal is more "operator focused" can we add some to the review? like mfisch?20:15
jrolllog overload already, with them separate20:15
fungiit seems like a viable second pike goal, assuming enough projects are already close to doing it20:15
EmilienMstevemar: I sent an email to openstack-dev and openstack-operators already20:15
ttxyes, please all feed back to the review so that we have all the cards on the table for next week20:15
ttxAnything more on that topic ? Any other goal that could serve as a Pike contender ?20:16
dhellmannEmilienM : you may want to highlight the fact that we're now considering this for pike, not queens20:16
ttxdhellmann: +120:16
EmilienMdhellmann: yes, I'll update it20:17
EmilienMttx: i'm done with this topic.20:17
ttxOK, good!20:17
ttx#topic Introduce assert:supports-api-compatibility20:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Introduce assert:supports-api-compatibility (Meeting topic: tc)"20:17
ttx#link https://review.openstack.org/41801020:17
dhellmannwhile we're on goals, there has been a lot of interest in the quota goals, so it would be good for someone to line up to manage that for queens or r*20:17
ttxmtreinish is at LCA so isn't around to present this20:18
ttxI see it as a continuation of mordred's rant a few cycles ago20:18
ttxthat we could just say that we won't ever break an API20:18
ttxmaking it an assert tag is a good way to achieve it20:18
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jrolltiming makes this feel like it's an answer to the glance/community images debate, heh20:19
ttxThe review is pretty dry for the moment, what are your thoughts on that ?20:19
ttx(only a few TC members commented so far)20:19
bswartzhow would the TC police that tag?20:19
dimsdoes the "API change guidelines" change?20:19
dhellmannthere was some pushback to the idea of having microversions as a goal because some folks think it's not a great approach. do we want to encode that answer in this tag?20:20
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ttxbswartz: we don't need to. projects decide whether they want the follow the rule or not20:20
dhellmannbswartz : there's a requirement for a test job20:20
fungibswartz: same as for most of our tags, expect the community to self-regulate and propose addition/removal of it with justification20:20
thingeebswartz from the requirements it was my understand that there be a test job20:20
ttxah, misunderstood the question20:20
jrollhow I read bswartz question: how does the tc validate that the api tests cover enough to be meaningful20:20
cdentIs it useful to know that that the api-wg does not like the api change guidelines?20:20
bswartzso if a project says they're following the tag, but then they don't, there's a way to catch the mistake before something bad happens20:21
dhellmanncdent : yes20:21
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sdaguecdent: it would be more useful if the api-wg changed the guideline then20:21
cdentThey are too easy to use as a false metric where following the letter of the law becomes more important than the spirit of helping users have a good (long term) experience20:21
thingeesdague ++20:21
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cdentsdague: the api-wg has only just recently realized how little they liked the guidelines20:21
cdentalso, usual excuses about timelines etc20:21
cdentand also it is rather clear, based on the experience of the past couple of weeks, that the members of the api-wg are not necessarily representative of the some of the common feelings on this topic20:22
thingeewe have an api change guideline to go off of. anyone is welcome to improve it.20:22
cdentso it is a bit challenging20:22
dhellmannwe probably want to wait until that's worked out to approve this tag definition, then, because otherwise the requirements for the tag will change out from under teams20:22
thingeedhellmann seems reasonable20:22
* edleafe missed his calendar alarm and shuffles to the back of the room20:22
jrolldhellmann: +120:22
dhellmannmaybe someone can start a ML thread about it?20:22
* mordred hands edleafe a pie20:22
dims++ dhellmann20:22
lbragstaddhellmann ++20:23
edleafemordred: mmmmmm... pie!20:23
thingeepie ++20:23
ttxanyone wanting to sub for mtreinish and start a thread ?20:23
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ttxideally someone who wants that tag to exist :)20:23
dhellmanncdent : please do leave a comment on the review, if you haven't already20:23
cdentare we talking about a thread about the tag or a thread about the need to change the guidelines20:23
cdentdhellmann: yeah will do20:23
dhellmanncdent : a bit of both20:23
cdentif the latter, I can certainly do the latter20:24
sdaguettx: so I think the ML thread really is about the api-wg not liking the guideline20:24
dhellmanncdent : that's a good start, thanks20:24
ttxsdague: Ah, misunderstood, ok20:24
cdentk, I'll do that tomorrow20:24
sdaguebecause, I also do wonder about the api-wg opinion being representative of the projects, and a ML thread would help there20:24
ttxsdague: ok so a more fundamental "is it a good idea at all"20:24
dimsthanks cdent20:25
sdaguewell, honestly, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/418010/2/reference/tags/assert_supports-api-compatibility.rst seems like exactly what many of our users have been asking for20:25
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sdagueand I agree that it lines up really strongly with mordred's rants on this subject20:26
cdentI think compatibility is a good idea, I have no problem with that. The issue is with some of the metrics in the guideline20:26
* thingee agrees strongly that mordred rants20:26
ttxyes, can't wait for mordred to reapply that rant to the thread20:26
* mordred rants20:26
* ttx has been missing mordred's rants lately20:26
ttxOK, anything more on that topic ?20:27
sdaguecdent: so is it more accurate that the overall guideline spirit is fine, but there are details the api-wg would like to refine?20:27
* mordred has to withold rants occasionally so that people enjoy their return20:27
sdagueI'm trying to figure out if we're going from round earth to flat earth, or round earth to elipsoid earth20:27
cdentsdague: I need to review them in detail, but I like they were being applied in the absolute rather than in sprit and that (sorry to be so squishy) felt unfortunate20:27
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* fungi observes that the earth is not a perfect ellipsoid, but in fact slightly eggish20:28
cdents/I like/I feel like/20:28
mordredfungi: eggs are tasty20:28
cdentIt's akin to the way if you don't match metrics as a hospital in the NHS, they take away your funding.20:29
sdaguecdent: which is more about interpretation than content20:29
* cdent will to make this morass much more clear in the email tomorrow20:29
sdagueok, anyway, ML list might clarify20:29
mordredcdent: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodhart%27s_law20:29
cdentsure, the content needs to be better about setting an interpretational context20:29
cdentmordred: yes, that, thanks20:30
ttxok, let's move on, funny topics in open discussion20:30
sdaguemordred: sure, but the corolary is that there have been constant calls that things weren't clear enough so they should be written down20:30
sdagueand if now writing them down is wrong... *shrug*20:30
ttxsdague: yes, that's slightly disappointing20:30
mordredsdague: oh - no, I totally think we should write them down20:31
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sdagueat the end of the day... "be a reasonable human being" still has to be assumed here. Nothing, written or unwritten, works if that's not there.20:31
dhellmannaren't we just talking about being clear when we do write them down?20:31
mordredsdague: just agreeing that we need to make sure to contextualize such that it's clear that there is a spirit that can be more important than the letter20:31
dhellmannand writing down what we agree on, not just what the author agrees on?20:31
mordreddhellmann: yah20:32
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* cdent has not intended to set off such a stir20:32
mordredif we currently have places where people are chasing the wrong thing, we just need to adjust to make it clear what they should be chasing20:32
sdaguemordred: sure20:32
cdentIt was just this: the guidelines need review and revalidation before we depend on them.20:32
dimscdent : totally20:32
ttxcdent: said this way, kinda makes sense20:32
sdaguecdent: ok. I think it's always fair to revisit things20:32
dhellmannright, let's just get everything lined up before we start sending folks off in the wrong direction20:33
cdent(I've said as much in my comment on the tag review and will say as much in the email)20:33
sdaguebut I think it's also important to realize people are already depending on them20:33
sdaguethey've been around a while20:33
ttxok, so let's do that in the thread, and investigate how we'll actually test/verify that20:33
ttxthat tag isn't exactly time-sensitive so we can take the time to do it right20:33
ttx#topic Open discussion20:34
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: tc)"20:34
ttx* Date/location for Board+TC workshop on OpenStack Futures20:34
ttxAs you know we decided not to overload the PTG with a Board+TC meeting20:34
ttxwhich I think was a sane decision given how busy that week is gearing up to be20:34
ttxTo make progress on that strategy topic, the Board is now proposing a separate 1- or 2-day workshop, sometimes in March20:34
ttxOne date/location they are floating is Boston the week of March 6th20:34
ttxAn alternate date/location would be to place it the day before the Ops Meetup in Milan (Italy), week of March 1320:34
ttxI tend to prefer the latter because I can combine events to justify the trip, and it's further away from the Atlanta travel20:34
ttxalso we can visit flaper8720:35
dimsBoston location works for me!20:35
flaper87As crazy as it sounds, I won't be around on the OPs mid-cycle20:35
ttxflaper87: dude!20:35
EmilienMflaper87: what?20:35
flaper87so, I prefer the 6th20:35
sdagueboston would be better for me20:35
ttxok, let me doodle it to check20:35
flaper87yeah, another trip got in the middle20:35
EmilienMsame ^20:35
EmilienMttx: can we vote maybeN20:35
ttxjust a sec20:35
EmilienMsounds like we have time20:35
ttxyes, setting up a doodle for a slightly more complex answer scheme20:36
flaper87Actually, I'm out from the 8th20:36
stevemarwouldn't the 7th make sense for boston too?20:36
fungii should be able to manage a couple days in boston. not as convenient as some places i can get direct flights, but it's still reasonably nearby that i can't complain20:36
AlanClarkjust to interject - the 6th was a target to shoot at20:36
ttxwow that thing sucks20:36
ttxLet me try a startvote instead20:37
dhellmannwhat's happening in boston that makes that a good location/date?20:37
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stevemaroh wait, march, not may...20:37
AlanClarkBoston was simply East Coast - figured it easy for TC members to get to ; my understand is most TC is on East Coast20:37
stevemardhellmann: yeah, same question20:37
dhellmannAlanClark : ok, I was just curious20:38
dhellmannesp. given the attachment to the ops meetup for the other date20:38
flaper87what about late March ? After the 18th ? or early april ?20:38
ttxOne thing to consider though is that a lot is happening in the US this year, especially with two PTGs there20:38
EmilienMttx: did you send a doodle already on ML?  I probably missed it20:38
flaper87EmilienM: think he's creating it20:39
ttxno the doodle is not playing location/date game well20:39
EmilienMmaybe we can first pick a place and then a date or vice-versa?20:39
ttxOh, there is alaso Berlon the week of March 27, colocate with CloudNative Con20:40
flaper87yeah, that'd be perfect for me since I'll be there :P20:41
persiaWill observers be permitted?20:41
dhellmanneither location is fine with me, but the later into march we go the more likely it will overlap with my as-yet-not-locked-down holiday plans.20:41
mordredyah - so far I'm fine with any of these dates20:41
dhellmannnot that it should be planned around me, of course20:41
mordredand happy to do boston, berlin, or whatev20:42
ttxOne issue for me is that I'm /also/ scheduled for another round of training in Ann Arbor20:42
flaper87ttx: will it be a 1 day thing?20:42
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ttxI would make it a 2-day thing to justify travel20:43
AlanClarkI would like to do 2 if possible20:43
flaper87mmh, ok. 2 might not work for me if we do it on March 6th so I'll put maybe20:43
ttxOK, people can continue to vote and I'll collect the results and post on the ML, circle back to Alan20:45
ttxnext topic was:20:45
ttx* Base services20:45
ttxThe ML discussion on depending on Barbican has some interesting insights20:45
cdentyes pleaes20:45
ttxI think we (arch-WG and TC) need to move on with defining "base services" and start thinking adding more20:45
ttxI'll push a thread on this this week20:45
ttxbecause frankly, reinventing the wheel locally a dozen times to not have a dependency sounds a bit silly20:46
dtroyerespecially with something as easy to get wrong as crypto20:46
EmilienMmost of TC is US/Canada based, it would be odd to go in Europe. Maybe Board is mostly Europe based?20:46
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dhellmannEmilienM : I think the idea is that they may be going to that ops meetup as well20:47
thingeedhellmann ++20:47
sdaguesure, though I think Duncan's point is pretty valid too, getting crypto wrong is not just about the crypto code itself, but how it's used. And there are some big usage questions right now.20:47
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jbryceEmilienM: board is pretty split between asia, europa and usa now20:47
EmilienMjbryce, dhellmann: fair enough20:47
ttxsdague: if Barbican is not the right solution, then we need to express that20:47
ttxand why20:48
AlanClarkttx could you add Berlin to the poll.  Board: 5 Asia, 4 EU, rest North Amer20:48
thingeebase service: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/arch-wg/tree/proposals/base-services.rst20:48
mordredttx: the why part I think is important20:49
mordredttx: especially if it's actionable20:49
ttxAlanClark: Added20:49
ttxAlanClark: you could reuse it for the Board too :)20:49
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AlanClarkttx: great idea20:50
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jbryceit also sounded like expressing that (and why) may not fix barbican without finding more contributors20:50
sdaguethingee: so... to be clear, oslo.db doesn't mean you support other dbs, db migrations definitely can (and do) have dbisms in them.20:51
sdaguejbryce: yeh, that's how I read the thread20:51
mordredjbryce: agree20:51
sdaguethere are gaps, they are known, now by more people20:51
sdaguebut closing them isn't really on anyone's radar20:51
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fungion the other hand, projects reimplementing crypto primitives and tooling multiple times when those same people could contribute that same work to barbican could also be hypocritical20:52
dhellmannttx: milan is on that poll twice now?20:52
mordredI think either barbican is good and everyone should use it for that purpose, or it isn't suitable for $reasons and we shoudl all know the reasons so we can have a discussion about what projects needing that functionality should do20:52
jbrycei like the idea of thinking out what other services would be really useful to have as “base services” and thinking about it even broader than just services that there are openstack options for. as someone in the thread pointed out, starting with some basic assumptions early on (rdbms, mq) did help…those were not things that were all built in openstackland20:52
mordredeach project implemeting crypto individually and not coordinated is certainly the worst outcome20:53
thingeesdague ok SpamapS ^20:53
mordredjbryce: ++20:53
fungidhellmann: i only see one milan, but the field orders got moved around20:53
edleafemordred: +1 on multiple crypto == bad20:53
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mordredjbryce: in ad-hoc discussions I've had people ask me about things like statsd/graphite/elk and similar things, for which we do not have a coordinated answer20:54
dhellmannfungi : and now reloading does show that20:54
sdaguefungi: maybe, except the primary concern is actually the barbican interface relying on a keystone token20:54
mordred(and for the record, I've heard both "why don't you have an opinion" AND "please stay out of having an opinion"20:54
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ttxfungi: I had to add a column to modify the "Milan" choice to include ops meetup colocation20:54
ttxfungi: should be all set now20:54
sdaguebecause the keystone token actually isn't secure enough for the kinds of operations you want to do with the secrets20:54
fungisdague: sure, maybe the solution is for the people who have a different need to collaborate on something not-barbican which has the alternate design they need20:55
edleafemordred: that means "why don't you have MY opinion" :)20:55
mordrededleafe: yup20:55
ttxLast thing I wanted to cover in open discussion was...20:55
ttx* Next steps for Golang20:55
lbragstadmost use cases I've heard from barbican devs is that they want to be able to get a token for a specific secret (instead of all of them within a project)20:55
ttxFrom flaper87's document it feels like someone needs to formally push step 120:55
ttx"Use case analysis"20:55
ttxflaper87: Or should we consider that done ?20:55
dtroyerI think one specific use case is done, not sure if that covers the general case though20:56
fungido we need more than one use case to get the ball rolling on the rest of the process?20:56
flaper87yes, we need that first phase to be officialized for golang20:56
ttxflaper87: are you working on it ?20:56
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ttxor waiting for someone else to pick it up ?20:57
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flaper87I'm not because I think other folks have a better understanding of the use case for golang than myself20:57
flaper87so, hoping someone from the swift team can help with this20:57
fungi(my question about needing more than one use case was in response to dtroyer)20:57
flaper87or anyone interested, really20:57
EmilienMflaper87: it sounds fair.20:57
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ttxshould we... trigger that in other folks ?20:58
dtroyerfungi: sure.  I don't think we need more to start, or I should say I didn't wait for that to start…20:58
flaper87ttx: I tried but I'll be more agressive this time20:58
ttxor maybe dims can take it20:58
dtroyerbut I also have a want for it in a place that doesn't fall under this specific guideline (a non-service project)20:58
* flaper87 will write to the mailing list to announce this has merged and to request for volunteers20:58
ttxflaper87: +120:58
flaper87has been merged*20:58
* thingee whispers to ttx that he has an item that wasn't posted20:59
dimsack i can help with that20:59
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ttxdims, sdague added one option to the poll (Berlin) in case you want to file how much you love/hate it20:59
flaper87dims: i'll send the email anyway, feel free to "o/" there too :)20:59
ttxOK, last minute... Anything else, anyone ?20:59
dimsflaper87 : will do20:59
ttxthingee: go for it21:00
EmilienM#openstack-dev otherwise? (out of time now)21:00
thingeewe all agreed in previous discussions that improving vendor discoverability can be done regardless of things like official vendor project teams. I have communicated out my first intentions in improving things in the market place http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2017-January/110151.html21:00
dimsttx marked ifneed be for berlin21:00
thingeefeedback would be much appreciated since I haven't received much yet21:00
thingeeotherwise I'd like to give nova and cinder a first pass in demonstrating something that works with multiple projects with different matrices21:01
ttxack, please feed back to thingee's thread21:01
ttxand we are out of time21:01
ttxThanks everyone!21:01
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"21:01
EmilienMttx: thanks for chairing21:01
openstackMeeting ended Tue Jan 17 21:01:26 2017 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)21:01
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-01-17-20.00.html21:01
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-01-17-20.00.txt21:01
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2017/tc.2017-01-17-20.00.log.html21:01
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ttxAlanClark: another option would be around the leadership training in Ann Arbor, but that's early April.21:02
ttxlots of TC members there, and a few Board members expected to join.21:02
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mordredttx: I could also do that21:06
mordredttx: somehow my travel schedule doesn't conflict with any of these options. I'm so confused21:06
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ttxI'll check with Alan and add it if it makes sense to him21:07
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sdaguettx: what are the ann arbor dates?21:07
ttxCurrent plan is week of April 10, according to gothicmindfood21:08
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