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| gmann | seems like nova-next is failing on multiple network issue on new stable rescue tests. pushed the fix on tempest side - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721767/ | 02:43 |
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| openstackgerrit | sean mooney proposed openstack/nova master: Delete ARQs by UUID if Cyborg ARQ bind fails. https://review.opendev.org/716186 | 03:49 |
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| openstackgerrit | sean mooney proposed openstack/nova master: cyborg evacuate support https://review.opendev.org/715326 | 04:53 |
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| openstackgerrit | sean mooney proposed openstack/nova master: Delete ARQs by UUID if Cyborg ARQ bind fails. https://review.opendev.org/716186 | 05:00 |
| openstackgerrit | sean mooney proposed openstack/nova master: cyborg evacuate support https://review.opendev.org/715326 | 05:00 |
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| bauzas | good morning Nova | 07:26 |
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| aarents | 'morning | 07:33 |
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| openstackgerrit | Sylvain Bauza proposed openstack/nova master: Ussuri 21.0.0 prelude section https://review.opendev.org/721548 | 08:22 |
| bauzas | last iteration of prelude ^ | 08:22 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/os-resource-classes master: Cleanup py27 support https://review.opendev.org/719351 | 09:57 |
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| gibi | lyarwood: hi! do you still plan to have a stable release this week? | 10:42 |
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| kashyap | lyarwood: I have this open, will check this today: https://zuul.opendev.org/t/openstack/build/8011a4c1b08e4b9d921660d0c5c2505d | 10:43 |
| kashyap | The virt-preview + Q35 job failure | 10:43 |
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| zigo | elod: Should you recheck https://review.opendev.org/711233 ? | 10:47 |
| zigo | The errors look like unrelated. | 10:47 |
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| elod | zigo: thanks, yes they seem unrelated, I've initiated the recheck | 10:56 |
| elod | zigo: could you test perhaps the patch somewhere? | 10:57 |
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| lyarwood | gibi: yup sorry just on a call, back in 10 | 11:00 |
| gibi | lyarwood: no prob | 11:01 |
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| zigo | elod: I can yes. | 11:09 |
| zigo | elod: Also, I have tons of warning like this one: "Instance d459e746-ac99-448b-9e44-890fbfdcb6f0 has been moved to another host hostB(hostB). There are allocations remaining against the source host that might need to be removed: {u'resources': {u'VCPU': 1, u'MEMORY_MB': 512, u'DISK_GB': 1}}." | 11:09 |
| zigo | elod: Can this also be due to the same problem ? | 11:09 |
| zigo | elod: Also, I'm unsure how to reproduce the failed migration though ... | 11:10 |
| zigo | That's kind of needed if I want to test your patch, no? | 11:10 |
| lyarwood | gibi: back, so yeah I did want to propose something for each supported branch. I'll get something posted later today for Train and work back from there. | 11:14 |
| lyarwood | elod: ^ FYI | 11:14 |
| lyarwood | kashyap: ack thanks, I've not had a chance to look through it all yet, I assume there's f31 failures in there tbh. | 11:14 |
| elod | lyarwood: thanks for doing that! is there anything waiting for review and then merged before the relese? | 11:25 |
| lyarwood | elod: not for stable/train | 11:27 |
| elod | lyarwood: and of course I can also try to prepare the release patches if needed (do we need other than that for the release?) | 11:27 |
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| lyarwood | looks like we have a few things in stable/stein | 11:27 |
| lyarwood | elod: if you have bandwidth then please feel free to do so for train | 11:27 |
| * lyarwood is slightly underwater downstream | 11:27 | |
| kashyap | lyarwood: Nod | 11:27 |
| elod | lyarwood: sure, I'll do that now | 11:28 |
| lyarwood | awesome thanks elod | 11:28 |
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| elod | zigo: hmmm, interesting. I have to check that. About reproduction: there are steps in the bug report but I think that not everything are needed, but haven't looked at it yet. | 11:32 |
| sean-k-mooney | alex_xu: by the way i dont know why https://review.opendev.org/#/c/662264/ that show up as last updted 2 days ago i have not touch it since i abandonded it last august and there has been no update to it in the last 2 days | 11:33 |
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| sean-k-mooney | alex_xu: my best guess is someone removed there name form the review list or something like that. | 11:37 |
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| openstackgerrit | Qiu Fossen proposed openstack/nova master: The instance is volume backed and power state is PAUSED，shelve the instance failed https://review.opendev.org/711609 | 11:45 |
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| gibi | lyarwood, elod: thanks a lot! | 11:55 |
| openstackgerrit | Kashyap Chamarthy proposed openstack/nova-specs master: Make Q35 machine type the default for x86 https://review.opendev.org/631154 | 12:05 |
| kashyap | lyarwood: --^ For your "copious free time" :) | 12:05 |
| kashyap | lyarwood: I also threw you under the "liaoson bus" without asking checking in first with you ... | 12:05 |
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| sean-k-mooney | kashyap: im not actully sure we shoudl be doing that vs the hw:profile concept | 12:17 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Well, is there something up for the hw:profile thing? | 12:17 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: And why not? 'pc' will be dead _anyway_ | 12:18 |
| sean-k-mooney | no not yet | 12:18 |
| kashyap | And we'll be doing the operators a disservice | 12:18 |
| kashyap | I know; not at least for 5 years | 12:18 |
| sean-k-mooney | kashyap: because we can potentailly break people on upgrade | 12:18 |
| sean-k-mooney | its the same reason libvirt did not change the default | 12:18 |
| kashyap | Well, the discussion there is _far_ more nuanced; libvirt is different - it gives the nuts and bolts | 12:18 |
| kashyap | I actually had a few paragraphs of text in the spec (but deleted), they were about: | 12:19 |
| sean-k-mooney | kashyap: there are other factors but that does not demish the fact that we have many fo the same constratints | 12:19 |
| kashyap | ... whether Nova shold make the 'policy' decision. I wrote an example, etc. But cut it out after I saw the recommendations from the QEMU/KVM/libvirt folks over the year | 12:19 |
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| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Yeah, I'm aware of why libvirt did it; I've even linked to it in a previous edition of the commit message | 12:20 |
| kashyap | (The exact change of libvirt and its reasoning) | 12:20 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: I'm typing fast, as I need to have lunch and head out for some air, been cooped up long | 12:20 |
| kashyap | But will catch here later | 12:20 |
| sean-k-mooney | ok but as it stand while i think we shoudl make q35 our default in osp in not sure if we shoudl chagne the code to do that | 12:21 |
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| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Before I head out: | 12:23 |
| kashyap | I'm also open for this: | 12:23 |
| kashyap | - A Nova CI job with 'q35' passes | 12:23 |
| kashyap | - TripleO flips the default from 'pc' --> 'q35' | 12:24 |
| openstackgerrit | Takashi Natsume proposed openstack/nova master: Fix list rendering in the accelerator support doc https://review.opendev.org/721846 | 12:24 |
| sean-k-mooney | kashyap: lyarwood is working to make nova-next do that | 12:24 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Yes, I investigated the failures yesterday and posted a Tempest one-liner for the failing test | 12:24 |
| kashyap | All linked in the spec | 12:24 |
| sean-k-mooney | the ci job and then ya the plan as far as i understood for osp was to change the default in ooo | 12:24 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Yes, TripleO upstream has this posted: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/716526/ | 12:25 |
| kashyap | It is waiting on the Nova CI | 12:25 |
| sean-k-mooney | ah cool | 12:25 |
| sean-k-mooney | im reading your spec now. go have lunch :) | 12:25 |
| kashyap | sean-k-mooney: Thanks. :) Likewise | 12:26 |
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| bauzas | gibi: can I hold the bugs lock again ? | 12:33 |
| bauzas | aarents: thanks for reporting https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1874032 | 12:33 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1874032 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "nova-compute become stuck when doing IO on busy file system" [Undecided,New] | 12:33 |
| gibi | bauzas: sue | 12:34 |
| gibi | sure | 12:34 |
| gibi | I'm swamped with a downstream stuff with a close deadline | 12:35 |
| aarents | bauzas: this one is painfull.. | 12:35 |
| openstackgerrit | Sylvain Bauza proposed openstack/nova master: Ussuri 21.0.0 prelude section https://review.opendev.org/721548 | 12:35 |
| bauzas | gibi: <3 with love for your pain | 12:35 |
| * bauzas hugs gibi | 12:35 | |
| bauzas | aarents: sure, but I think it should be a Wishlist bug | 12:36 |
| gibi | bauzas: thanks | 12:36 |
| gibi | funny that RC1 is due tomorrow and my downstream high prio stuff due today (but was not on the radar until Monday) | 12:36 |
| bauzas | gibi: in my company, we also have sometimes some downstream priorities that are in the same times than upstream yes... | 12:39 |
| bauzas | I totally understand you :p | 12:39 |
| bauzas | aarents: so, about your bug | 12:39 |
| bauzas | aarents: you asked why we don't have compute workers, right? | 12:41 |
| aarents | yep | 12:41 |
| bauzas | b/c there is only one service per host | 12:41 |
| bauzas | and in general, when you want to call some I/O issue, you don't do this by the nova-compute service | 12:42 |
| bauzas | that's rather the nova-compute service which calls privsep | 12:42 |
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| bauzas | aarents: eg. https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/privsep/qemu.py#L37 | 12:45 |
| bauzas | and then as you can see we call processutils.execute() https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/privsep/qemu.py#L81 | 12:45 |
| aarents | bauzas: ok.. so to workaround this we have to put glance upload outside of nova-compute, in fact that what I've done to fix that on our release I made an execute(*curl).. | 12:47 |
| bauzas | aarents: do you have I/O issues when snapshoting or uploading ? | 12:48 |
| bauzas | from what I see, you generate some I/O calls | 12:48 |
| bauzas | so I thought the problem would be around snapshoting, not uploading to glance | 12:48 |
| aarents | yes during glance upload because IO is made inside nova-compute | 12:48 |
| bauzas | we don't write on disk when we do glance upload, do we ? | 12:49 |
| aarents | the glance upload done during instance snapshot | 12:49 |
| aarents | we read an extracted file (done by qemu-ing convert)) | 12:50 |
| aarents | localy | 12:50 |
| bauzas | oh man this is pizza code from what I can read | 12:52 |
| aarents | :) | 12:52 |
| bauzas | https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/virt/libvirt/driver.py#L2252 | 12:53 |
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| aarents | bauzas here https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/virt/libvirt/driver.py#L2421 | 12:55 |
| aarents | it then use glance api to do the PUT in glance so slow IO are running in nova-compute | 12:56 |
| aarents | not in a processutils.execute() | 12:56 |
| aarents | so maybe workaround processutils.execute(*curl) can be the solution to check | 12:58 |
| aarents | my | 12:58 |
| bauzas | aarents: that's not the glance upload issue | 12:58 |
| bauzas | aarents: IMHO the problem is with the semaphore we wanna take | 12:58 |
| bauzas | hence the D | 12:58 |
| bauzas | the problem with reviewing this code is that nobody documented which cases raise those exceptions we catch https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/virt/libvirt/driver.py#L2358-L2359 | 12:59 |
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| bauzas | aarents: because we only fall back into this semaphore lock if you are not able to do the other way | 13:00 |
| * bauzas goes doing some investigation | 13:00 | |
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| aarents | I think, I'm not sure, in my case, we are in NotImplementedError because because direct_snapshot is a feature used typically with ceph, not implemented in raw/qcow2 | 13:04 |
| bauzas | that's correct | 13:04 |
| bauzas | I found the change in question | 13:04 |
| bauzas | aarents: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/205282/ | 13:04 |
| bauzas | aarents: here in your case, we're not talking of RBD snapshots, right? | 13:04 |
| aarents | right, local backed instance raw or qcow2 | 13:05 |
| elod | lyarwood: I've prepared the Train release patch: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721883/ if you have time please double-check the version bump and the reasons | 13:05 |
| bauzas | aarents: kk, okay so the exception catch-up clause is the default when non-RBD | 13:06 |
| bauzas | (just speaking out loud) | 13:06 |
| aarents | exactly | 13:06 |
| * bauzas going down the road to the semaphore | 13:07 | |
| bauzas | aarents: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/609180/ | 13:13 |
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| bauzas | aarents: fwiw, I'm about to triage it as Invalid | 13:13 |
| bauzas | but you could open a blueprint for optimizing how we manage I/O concurrency | 13:14 |
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| sean-k-mooney | stephenfin: i have added the topic of libvirt hardware profiles to the ptg topic list https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/nova-victoria-ptg on line 60 by the way | 13:18 |
| stephenfin | sweet | 13:19 |
| sean-k-mooney | i will start fleshing it out more here https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/libvirt-hardware-profiles | 13:19 |
| sean-k-mooney | but im not sure if i will get to it this week | 13:19 |
| sean-k-mooney | the spec template is more or less the same form last cycle right? | 13:19 |
| sean-k-mooney | oh there already is one https://github.com/openstack/nova-specs/blob/master/specs/victoria-template.rst | 13:21 |
| bauzas | sean-k-mooney: stephenfin: if you don't mind MHO, I'd not want to have the hardware profiles be operator-defined | 13:22 |
| bauzas | this defeats interop | 13:22 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: yep its out of scope in the first version | 13:22 |
| bauzas | in *any* version tbc :) | 13:22 |
| sean-k-mooney | i said we could add that after if we wanted but only if they cannot modify intree ones and if we have an api to list and show the hardware profiles | 13:22 |
| bauzas | if we go this way, we absolutely have to be pedantic and provide some abstraction that'd be versioned and defined by us | 13:23 |
| sean-k-mooney | ill state teh same in the spec but i dont want to enable that in victoria | 13:23 |
| bauzas | I think this absolutely needs to be discussed in the V spec | 13:23 |
| bauzas | b/c this could be a terrible knob | 13:23 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: yes we would im planning for them to be version even if they are in tree only | 13:24 |
| bauzas | or we would allow *custom* profiles | 13:24 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: well it wont provide anything that can be done with flavor extrra specs or image properties today | 13:24 |
| bauzas | which would be yet another Far-West in Novaz | 13:24 |
| bauzas | correct | 13:24 |
| sean-k-mooney | *cannot | 13:24 |
| bauzas | for this exact reason, I think we need to state in the spec that we WON'T support operator-defined profiles ever | 13:25 |
| sean-k-mooney | e.g. its just a static set of profiles that change the default of existing tunables. | 13:25 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: if you want me to make that the starting point im ok with that | 13:25 |
| sean-k-mooney | if someone else want to chagne that after Victoria we can have that discussion then but im totaly fine with only nova as a project being able to define these profiles | 13:26 |
| bauzas | shoot, but again, I just want to be clear on the fact that I'm absolutely opposed to any attempt of delivering custom profiles unless they're explicitely stated "custom" | 13:26 |
| bauzas | sean-k-mooney: this sounds reasonable | 13:27 |
| sean-k-mooney | ok im fine with that too. i understnad the interop concern and i share that | 13:27 |
| bauzas | leave others the pain to propose some customizable profiles in another spec | 13:27 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: yep, i intened to have no api or db changes and to store the profiles as yaml files that are packaged as data files as part of nova | 13:29 |
| bauzas | sean-k-mooney: that's design discussion for sure | 13:29 |
| bauzas | (but fwiw, I'll -1 this :D) | 13:29 |
| bauzas | don't provide guns to kids | 13:30 |
| sean-k-mooney | well i just dont want ot have a bunch of dicts in a module but my other appoch was to mirror the flavor validation work | 13:30 |
| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam Mann proposed openstack/nova master: Add docs and releasenotes for BP policy-defaults-refresh https://review.opendev.org/720129 | 13:30 |
| bauzas | sean-k-mooney: the latter sounds good | 13:30 |
| bauzas | but let's see what other ppl think | 13:30 |
| sean-k-mooney | bauzas: it makes verioning harder which is the only reason i dont want to defautl to that but we can discuss in the spec later | 13:31 |
| bauzas | sean-k-mooney: we have a couple of versioned objects you know | 13:31 |
| bauzas | and we have versioned libs | 13:31 |
| sean-k-mooney | yes but i want you to be able to say give me hw:profile=realtime-vicoria in W or Z | 13:31 |
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| bauzas | but this sounds a rathole to discuss this now :D | 13:32 |
| bauzas | let's draft the UX in the spec ;) | 13:32 |
| sean-k-mooney | where hw:profile woudl be an alias to the latest version of a profile | 13:32 |
| sean-k-mooney | yep | 13:32 |
| sean-k-mooney | anyway this was just an fyi that im starting to draft this | 13:32 |
| bauzas | I'm not an API specialist, but I don't like explicit versioning on the flavor extraspec itself | 13:33 |
| bauzas | but yeah, shoot | 13:33 |
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| gmann | gibi: stephenfin updated the policy doc, please re-look - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/720129/12 | 13:37 |
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| aarents | bauzas: ok thks | 13:40 |
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| bauzas | aarents: are you able to attend the virtual PTG ? | 13:41 |
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| aarents | bauzas: probably yes | 13:49 |
| aarents | bauzas: I will dig soon the patch you share on bug report, if it can solve the issue | 13:49 |
| bauzas | which one ? | 13:50 |
| aarents | https://review.opendev.org/#/c/609180/ | 13:50 |
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| bauzas | aarents: ah you mean you'll try to conf setting ? sure, lemme know if this alleviates your issue | 13:56 |
| lyarwood | elod: looking | 13:56 |
| bauzas | you'll try the* | 13:56 |
| lyarwood | elod: btw feel free to add me directly in these reviews in the future or anything really on stable :) | 13:56 |
| aarents | bauzas: yep | 13:57 |
| elod | lyarwood: oh, I forgot to add you to this :S and thanks, will do in the future :) | 13:58 |
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| bauzas | lyarwood: this sounds a configuration problem, nope ? 2019-09-05 16:08:30.057 8 ERROR nova.volume.cinder [req-522cbf47-a65a-4d46-8852-01adcfcbda2f - - - - -] The [cinder] section of your nova configuration file must be configured for authentication with the block-storage service endpoint. | 13:59 |
| bauzas | lyarwood: context is https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1843643 | 14:00 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1843643 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "VM on encrypted boot volume fails to start after compute host reboot" [Undecided,New] | 14:00 |
| bauzas | lyarwood: I'm litterally 2 mins away from closing this bug | 14:00 |
| bauzas | (comment #4 in the stacktrace) | 14:00 |
| * lyarwood looks | 14:00 | |
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| lyarwood | bauzas: if having that section configured allows n-cpu during init_host to have a valid admin context for grabbing secrets from barbican then yes | 14:02 |
| lyarwood | bauzas: I think it might, I'd have to dig into the context code again as it has been a while | 14:03 |
| bauzas | lyarwood: refresh the bug and see my comment | 14:03 |
| bauzas | but I'm not a ksa specialist | 14:04 |
| lyarwood | bauzas: yeah so I assume that would allow n-cpu itself to auth correctly, do we set that typically in devstack? | 14:04 |
| * lyarwood looks | 14:05 | |
| lyarwood | yeah we do | 14:05 |
| * lyarwood tries to reproduce quickly | 14:05 | |
| bauzas | lyarwood: well, if you don't, I don't see how you can get service tokens... | 14:05 |
| lyarwood | bauzas: right | 14:06 |
| bauzas | okay, closing the bug, asking the reporter to reopen the bug if fixing this doesn't help | 14:07 |
| bauzas | done. | 14:07 |
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| bauzas | gibi: one day, we'll have to discuss what to do with bugs open since 2 years | 14:13 |
| gibi | bauzas: ack, please add a line to the ptg etherpad and then we can start an ML discusison | 14:14 |
| gibi | before the pt | 14:14 |
| gibi | g | 14:14 |
| bauzas | not sure I wanna be the messenger :D | 14:14 |
| gibi | OK, I will do it :D | 14:14 |
| bauzas | gibi: there is no rush | 14:15 |
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| gibi | I mean I will now add a line to the etherpad and later will think about an ML message | 14:15 |
| bauzas | fwiw, we made it once, for example https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1018253/comments/5 | 14:15 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1018253 in OpenStack Dashboard (Horizon) "No error message prompt during attaching when mountpoint is occupied" [Wishlist,New] | 14:15 |
| gibi | bauzas: yepp | 14:17 |
| gibi | anyhow added a line to the ptg etherpad | 14:17 |
| bauzas | and I just provided this example | 14:17 |
| bauzas | gibi: go back to your downstream work, man ! | 14:18 |
| bauzas | :D | 14:18 |
| gibi | :) | 14:18 |
| lyarwood | sigh we need to kill mountpoint in the API | 14:19 |
| lyarwood | now that we have attachments | 14:19 |
| bauzas | lyarwood: feel free to triage this bug, not on my radar yet :) | 14:23 |
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| sean-k-mooney | gibi: im hoping that we wont use the mailing list to hevialy for converstaion that are not backed by a spec | 14:32 |
| sean-k-mooney | gibi: we can do that but i think its not a great medium to have those kind of disucssions without a lot of pre work | 14:33 |
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| sean-k-mooney | that said we used to have a bot that jsut closed them so we could always just do that again :P | 14:33 |
| * sean-k-mooney stick head in sand and pretends there are no bugs | 14:34 | |
| gibi | sean-k-mooney: what do you suggest, how to prepare for the limited real time ptg discussion? | 14:34 |
| sean-k-mooney | well im hoping our actul contact hours that are don vitually will not be less then we normally have in person but will just be spread over more days | 14:35 |
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| sean-k-mooney | i just think if its a spec we should keep most of the discussion in gerrit. if its a process thing i would prefer to have an etherpad for it with a summary after the ptg slot on the mailing list | 14:37 |
| sean-k-mooney | we can certenly do some disucssion on the mailing list but i fount the plamcnet pre ptg and the nova pre ptg we did last cycle very hard to follow | 14:37 |
| gibi | sean-k-mooney: we won | 14:38 |
| gibi | sean-k-mooney: we won't have that much contact hours | 14:38 |
| gibi | and it will be a lot slower discussion | 14:38 |
| gibi | compared to a face to face discussion | 14:39 |
| sean-k-mooney | then we may need to consider doing a midcyle or other 1:1 session around milesotone 1 | 14:39 |
| sean-k-mooney | i guess we can cross that bridge after the ptg to see if there are still things that need more dicussion that would be hard to do via gerrit or ml | 14:40 |
| gibi | agree ^^ | 14:40 |
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| sean-k-mooney | the reason i prefer etherpads for this type of disucsion by the way is just down to how mailing list thread thend to diverge and its hard to reponed quickly to indivigual quetions without having to respond ot everything | 14:41 |
| sean-k-mooney | with etherpad we can just talk on indiviual lines and keep all the context | 14:41 |
| gibi | sean-k-mooney: OK, so before the virtual ptg I will try to kick peole to start looking at the etherpad | 14:42 |
| gibi | I'm fine if we do the pre-discussion in the etherpad | 14:42 |
| gibi | what I need is to have pre-discussion somehow | 14:43 |
| dansmith | etherpad is really terrible for discussions because it's very easy to end up with stuff that you can't attribute to the author | 14:43 |
| sean-k-mooney | we may want to create topic etherpads linked off the main one to keep it clean | 14:43 |
| dansmith | especially with lots of people | 14:43 |
| dansmith | so I'm very much opposed to *directing* people to etherpad for discussions | 14:43 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: for things with a spec i think gerrit si the place to have the disccssion | 14:43 |
| dansmith | I have a huge difficulty distinguishing the colors, even to assign unattributed text to someone that said something elsewhere | 14:44 |
| sean-k-mooney | but do you think we should be using the mailing list for eveything else | 14:44 |
| gmann | i think ML is better than etherpad discussion for pre-ptg. | 14:44 |
| dansmith | agree that gerrit is the place for anything that is a spec. for non-spec, mailing list for sure | 14:44 |
| gibi | that was my default plan ^^ | 14:44 |
| gmann | and where discussion going heavy then mark that for PTG discussion instead of overloading ML | 14:44 |
| dansmith | etherpad also doesn't tell you what things you've read and what things are new | 14:44 |
| sean-k-mooney | gmann: i really hated the pre-ptg ml threads we have done in the past | 14:44 |
| dansmith | gibi: ++ | 14:45 |
| sean-k-mooney | but if that is what we are going to do i guess ill have to live with it | 14:45 |
| gibi | sean-k-mooney: I hated that too but maybe it was not because of the ML itself but because of the amount of information I needed to process | 14:45 |
| sean-k-mooney | can i just ask that we do not complete any topic only in the mailing list | 14:45 |
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| gmann | sean-k-mooney: i think we tried to conclude the things on ML which got too much. I think we can burn lot of light weight topic discussion there | 14:46 |
| dansmith | how many people that hate divergent ML threads are using a mailer that doesn't actually show threads hierarchically like gmail? | 14:46 |
| sean-k-mooney | gibi: for me its the format not the amount of info | 14:46 |
| gmann | and if any topic is going back and forth then say 'let's discuss in ptg' | 14:46 |
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| gibi | gmann: ^^ +1 | 14:46 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: i use revesr chronolgical order | 14:46 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: not threads | 14:46 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: but that is not my issue | 14:46 |
| dansmith | mmhmm :) | 14:46 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: my issue is that i often feel like people dont see or respond to comment i make on some thread and there is no way to bring that point back into one fo the other divergent threads | 14:47 |
| dansmith | probably because they're using gmail | 14:47 |
| sean-k-mooney | that mainly hapens when people cut out part of the email | 14:47 |
| dansmith | because gmail is the worst thing ever | 14:48 |
| dansmith | non-trimming emails considered harmful | 14:48 |
| sean-k-mooney | well i use evolution locally so i can enable thread view i jsut dont but ya that could be part of it | 14:48 |
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| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: i think there are pros can cons to trimming | 14:48 |
| sean-k-mooney | trimming creats divergent tread if there are multipe open topics that dont reconverge | 14:49 |
| sean-k-mooney | but it allows you to focus on that topic | 14:49 |
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| dansmith | non-trimming means people take a sub-thread and redirect it to something that was actually a different sub-thread by grabbing something someone said days ago | 14:49 |
| sean-k-mooney | a sorry | 14:50 |
| sean-k-mooney | i tought you ment replying with just a snippit fo the full email | 14:50 |
| sean-k-mooney | dansmith: gibi if you have recommenation of Netiquette for how to conduct a discussion on the mailing list or tools that help that would be good to share | 14:52 |
| dansmith | agree that gibi should try to set some ground rules and police with a big stick | 14:52 |
| sean-k-mooney | im aware of the normal process for the mailing list but if feel that is not quite adequet for design dicussions | 14:53 |
| gibi | I have no stick but I will try | 14:53 |
| * dansmith hands gibi a stick | 14:53 | |
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| gibi | :) | 14:55 |
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| elod | lyarwood: thx for the review! | 14:59 |
| elod | gibi: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721883 | 14:59 |
| gibi | elod: ack | 14:59 |
| gibi | elod, lyarwood: thanks! I'm +1 | 15:02 |
| elod | \o/ | 15:03 |
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| gmann | nova-next failure for multi network fix is merged now, feel free to recheck if failing on your patch - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721767/2 | 15:59 |
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| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/nova master: DNM: Testing tempest https://review.opendev.org/722060 | 16:14 |
| kashyap | lyarwood: Thanks for taking time to give feedback! I answered your questions on the change. (The interesting LM bits are at the end. Hope that makes sense) | 16:15 |
| openstackgerrit | Andreas Jaeger proposed openstack/nova stable/rocky: DNM: Testing tempest https://review.opendev.org/722063 | 16:16 |
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| bauzas | cores, the prelude section is up for reviews https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721548/ | 16:41 |
| bauzas | reminder, we have to merge it before we cut RC1 | 16:41 |
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| openstackgerrit | melanie witt proposed openstack/nova stable/stein: Add config option for neutron client retries https://review.opendev.org/722077 | 16:47 |
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| openstackgerrit | Lee Yarwood proposed openstack/nova master: WIP block_device: Rework refresh_connection_info https://review.opendev.org/720769 | 17:03 |
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| gmann | gibi: stephenfin its ready with gate result too - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/720129/12 | 17:27 |
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| melwitt | gmann: I think you have a small bug here? | 17:44 |
| melwitt | https://review.opendev.org/#/c/720129/12/doc/source/configuration/policy-concepts.rst@204 | 17:44 |
| gmann | melwitt: ah, thanks. fixing | 17:45 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam Mann proposed openstack/nova master: Add docs and releasenotes for BP policy-defaults-refresh https://review.opendev.org/720129 | 17:57 |
| gmann | melwitt: updated ^^ | 17:57 |
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| melwitt | gmann: was there discussion around why this is in the "features" section rather than the "upgrade" section? https://review.opendev.org/#/c/720129/13/releasenotes/notes/bp-policy-defaults-refresh-b8e6e2d6b1a7bc21.yaml@2 | 18:00 |
| gmann | melwitt: not yet. I put it in feature as this is disabled via flags to actually not breaking upgrade. if we enable scope or remove deprecated old rules then we can add that in upgrade section. is that correct way to think of upgrade section ? | 18:02 |
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| melwitt | gmann: yeah ... this case is not so straightforward I guess. dansmith thoughts? ^ | 18:02 |
| dansmith | I don't really think that it's appropriate to call it a feature. With the exception of someone sitting around hoping we'll make our policy more granular, most people will see it as an upgrade-related piece of homework | 18:04 |
| dansmith | upgrade items aren't necessarily things that break or need to happen during the upgrade, they're often "this thing that used to be like A is now like B" | 18:04 |
| melwitt | yeah, my concern is that if we don't put it in the upgrade section, people won't see as clearly that they have homework to do before W | 18:05 |
| dansmith | agree | 18:05 |
| gmann | i see. that is good point | 18:05 |
| dansmith | I would put something general in the prelude as a "hey ya'll, we're refactorin' this shiznat over the next few cycles, just FYI" | 18:05 |
| gmann | should I move the complete section in upgrade or keeping scope things in feature as well ? | 18:05 |
| dansmith | and keep the homework bits in upgrade | 18:05 |
| gmann | dansmith: this is prelude, is it fine/enough - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/721548/6/releasenotes/notes/ussuri-prelude-4b96f1244cefcdf4.yaml@36 | 18:06 |
| gmann | I need to add the doc link there once that is ready. | 18:07 |
| dansmith | yeah, seems probably like enough, but definitely "see $link for more details on what is changing" | 18:08 |
| melwitt | yeah, that's a todo after we merge this doc on policy changes | 18:08 |
| gmann | ok. let me update the releasenotes | 18:09 |
| melwitt | as for the section for the policy reno, I guess I was thinking to just s/features/upgrade/ for the reno. scope types are kind of a feature (leveraging a keystone feature) but we're going to make them the default, which means operators have homework to do to (1) educating their users to use scoped tokens and (2) get their policies enabled with enforcing scope, | 18:09 |
| melwitt | and then we're going to remove the old policy way in W, so it's not really optional in the end | 18:10 |
| dansmith | A short note in -features might be appropriate too, but if it's in the prelude, I think that's enough | 18:11 |
| melwitt | ok, then either way | 18:11 |
| sean-k-mooney | by the way i assume the we wont be doing something similar for unified limits since we wont have part of it merged in ussuri and its just going to be called out in victoria instead | 18:12 |
| sean-k-mooney | that is a similar hay we are refactroing this change | 18:12 |
| sean-k-mooney | but it wont really affect people for ussuri and they wont have homework yet so i guess its not a concern right now | 18:13 |
| melwitt | yeah nothing yet until V | 18:13 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam Mann proposed openstack/nova master: Add docs and releasenotes for BP policy-defaults-refresh https://review.opendev.org/720129 | 18:25 |
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| openstackgerrit | François Palin proposed openstack/nova stable/train: Add retry to cinder API calls related to volume detach https://review.opendev.org/722142 | 20:56 |
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| gmann | melwitt: thanks for review. can i fix these 'scoped' word quickly ? if you are around for re+2 - https://review.opendev.org/#/c/720129/14 | 21:20 |
| melwitt | gmann: yeah that'd be great | 21:21 |
| gmann | ok | 21:22 |
| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam Mann proposed openstack/nova master: Add docs and releasenotes for BP policy-defaults-refresh https://review.opendev.org/720129 | 21:22 |
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| gmann | melwitt: ^^ done | 21:23 |
| melwitt | +2 | 21:23 |
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