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| ttx | johnthetubaguy: just replied to your thread on -dev | 13:09 |
|---|---|---|
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: I don't think we can support the middle-ground you describe | 13:09 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: we already have 2 release models, I'd rather not add a third one | 13:10 |
| ttx | it's either semver or preversion, shouldn't be "something that looks like semver but aligns on milestones" | 13:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: ah, OK | 14:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: yeah, I am keen to not over complicate it | 14:18 |
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| ttx | johnthetubaguy: just wrong timing | 15:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: yeah, thats a totally fair comment, it would be more useful discussing this four weeks ago on the ML | 15:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: I am only just waking up to some of the issues facing Nova, and trying to see how fact we can move on some stuff | 15:33 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: yeah, just trying to stay afloat of all the changes and various fires | 15:35 |
| ttx | let's see how the Ironic story pans out | 15:35 |
| ttx | we may just tag 2015.2.0b1 for liberty, basically, since it's ine 3 weeks | 15:35 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: *if* we make really fast progress, it might be called 12.0.0b1 | 15:36 |
| ttx | but anything beyond that won't happen before k2 | 15:36 |
| ttx | err l2 | 15:36 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ttx: that totally makes sense | 15:43 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: my motivation here is really about making it clear how people can use Nova milestones. Turns out we do a lot of work to support live upgrades between arbitrary commits, and that applies to the milestones as well | 15:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: its to answer questions for folks that want the bleeding edge, but for some reason they don't feel happy pulling form master, because it doesn't have a version number they can talk about | 15:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: I suspect there is more to it, and I am wondering how I find out what they really want | 15:45 |
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| ttx | johnthetubaguy: I think the question lies higher. You either want to do intermediary releases that people can use or you don't. | 16:04 |
| ttx | if you do, then you should opt for an intermediary release model | 16:04 |
| ttx | if you don't, then tagging time-based is ok | 16:05 |
| ttx | the versioning is more a consequence of that choice. | 16:05 |
| ttx | but you can't have it both ways... intermediary releases means spending a bit of QA time before tagging | 16:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: so I think we want folks to use our milestones, but we want to do them time-based, maybe thats really a non-option? | 16:06 |
| ttx | well, you can still do time-based, my point is more... it's not a single cycle split in three phases. It's thre releases | 16:06 |
| ttx | so you have to think in terms of features to deliver etc | 16:06 |
| ttx | My impression was that you couldn't even commit to features or doing QA around milestones, I don't see it happening in intermediary releases | 16:07 |
| ttx | basically, I don't think Nova is ready or agile enough for that "intermediary tags are releases" approach | 16:07 |
| ttx | yet | 16:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: right, frankly I don't really see us actually doing much QA on releases either, so I guess we figure calling milestones as releases doesn't make much of a difference | 16:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | ...but thats just confusing things, rather than making this better | 16:09 |
| ttx | in the end if it's the "b" that sounds too pejorative in 12.0.0b1, we could use another letter | 16:09 |
| ttx | 12.0.0m1 would look like a development milestone | 16:09 |
| ttx | rather than a broken beta | 16:09 |
| ttx | my point is, those intermediary things may be more than betas, they are still much less than releases | 16:10 |
| ttx | (in Nova) | 16:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm, you know that might be the sticking point, lets just call it a "milestone" | 16:10 |
| ttx | the reason we sued b1 is that PEP440 mandated some rather limited grammar back then | 16:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: yeah, I would argue in some ways they have less things (docs and translation) than most betas you get these days too | 16:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | ...ah | 16:11 |
| ttx | it's really a milestone rather than a beta | 16:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah | 16:11 |
| ttx | it's a point in time that should be usable but doesn't have any of the release polish | 16:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: right, I guess thats what we want to say | 16:11 |
| ttx | I think they expanded on the letters we may use | 16:12 |
| ttx | https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0440/#pre-releases | 16:12 |
| ttx | pretty limited still | 16:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: so personally I am actually OK with b1 b2 b3, as long as we document what that thing is, but calling it m1 does help stop the the beta/alpha "baggage" | 16:13 |
| ttx | X.Y.devN could be used I guess | 16:13 |
| ttx | but I think it's used for per-commit numbering | 16:13 |
| ttx | anyway, don't want to spend too much time on this right now | 16:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: agreed, lets not get distracted | 16:14 |
| ttx | but yes, we could get rid of the beta stigma | 16:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: so one extra point, do we actually have per commit versions already, I don't know the details there? | 16:15 |
| ttx | I think we do | 16:17 |
| * ttx pulls a random tarball | 16:17 | |
| ttx | right glance-master.tar.gz is 2015.2.0.dev38 | 16:18 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ttx: ah, cool, I had not realised that was done already | 17:11 |
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