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| tonyb | So I know I said SIG a lot before but looking at https://governance.openstack.org/sigs/ and https://governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/working-groups.html I *think* I meant working group rather than SIG but if the sig structure is flexibile then I can propose a SIG | 02:09 |
|---|---|---|
| tonyb | anyone around to chat about the pros and cons of each? | 02:09 |
| clarkb | tonyb: aiui the idea with SIGs was to make it a lot less formal so that people could start them up relatively quickly and anyone could particpate easily? | 02:43 |
| tonyb | clarkb: I think I was stuck on the idea the SIGs communicate on the openstack-sigs list whereas I'd kinda like a lot of stable stuff to be on openstack-devel | 02:44 |
| tonyb | but I expect for the most part we could just cross-post liek API does and if that gets too gross think about it then | 02:45 |
| openstackgerrit | Tony Breeds proposed openstack/governance master: Remove Stable branch maintenance as a project team https://review.openstack.org/584206 | 02:46 |
| clarkb | tonyb: I think there is also some ideas to collapse the mailing lists into one or a few so maybe you can get ahead of that | 02:47 |
| tonyb | clarkb: Okay I'll propose the sig and see how it flys | 02:47 |
| smcginnis | I think Thierry was also trying to move more things to be SIGs. | 02:48 |
| tonyb | smcginnis: Well I've done it now ;P https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:extnded-maintenance-sig | 02:49 |
| tonyb | I can't type but at least I used the same command on each git review -t so I still have a single topic | 02:50 |
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| cmurphy | ttx: storlets and masakari also report not appearing on the project navigator, is that something you can help with? | 06:19 |
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| ttx | cmurphy: Masakari's first official "release" should be Rocky iirc, they were added after MembershipFreeze in the Queens cycle. Project navigator is updated around release time | 08:08 |
| ttx | Storlets is seen as a Swift extension, but that should not prevent their presence in the current version of the project navigator... I'll doublecheck | 08:09 |
| cmurphy | thanks ttx | 08:53 |
| cmurphy | smcginnis: I went ahead and chatted with e0ne and added notes in https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OpenStack_health_tracker#Horizon | 08:55 |
| e0ne | cmurphy: thanks for the good summary | 08:57 |
| cmurphy | :) | 08:58 |
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| ttx | cmurphy: Masakari should definitely be added, was part of Queens. Will get that fixed. Re: Storlets, the project navigator under its current form is only showing first-level deliverables (things that are shown on the OpenStack map), and it's a Swift extension, that's why it does not appear there. | 09:43 |
| cmurphy | ttx: okay thanks, will report back to them | 09:44 |
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| ttx | cmurphy: the project navigator is being rewritten right now (for better exposure of deployment tools) so there should be a lot of changes sooonish | 09:47 |
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| cmurphy | ttx: oh interesting | 09:48 |
| ttx | basically add a specific landing page for "deployment". We plan to have one around CLIs/user-facing tools too | 09:49 |
| ttx | since the default format is not great for those | 09:49 |
| * cmurphy books ptg hotel finally | 09:53 | |
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| dims | o/ | 12:14 |
| smcginnis | o/ | 12:14 |
| mnaser | very sleepy o/ | 12:18 |
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| TheJulia | Good morning | 12:30 |
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| dhellmann | tonyb: there's no reason the stable sig couldn't use the -dev list | 14:13 |
| dhellmann | clarkb : yes, I want us to collapse most of the separate lists down to a smaller number at some point. I thought maybe coordinating that change with a mailman upgrade would be good, but perhaps that's not necessary | 14:14 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: it would be nice to coordinate some of that project navigator work with the docs team. they have some similar separation, and we would benefit from being able to easily link from one place to the other. or maybe remove some of the duplication. | 14:15 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I'll loop them in as soon as I have something solid | 14:17 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ++ | 14:18 |
| dhellmann | one challenge with removing duplication is that it's easy to update the docs site, and not the navigator | 14:19 |
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| pabelanger | is anybody else having issues with https://www.openstack.org/ptg#tab_schedule from ttx email to ML? | 14:54 |
| cdent | pabelanger: yes | 14:55 |
| dhellmann | it was mentioned in #openstack-release & ttx is looking into it | 14:56 |
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| ttx | pabelanger, cdent: I posted a followup email to point to the data while the tab is being restored | 15:00 |
| pabelanger | great! | 15:03 |
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| clarkb | dhellmann: fungi has been working on getting a test mm3 deployment running. I'm not sure the list changes have to happen when that happens though | 15:50 |
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| dhellmann | clarkb : no, they don't have to, I just thought that might make the transition easer ("as part of upgrading, we have merged 50 lists into 5" or whatever) | 15:57 |
| dhellmann | otherwise we have to decide what to do with the old archives after the transition | 15:58 |
| dhellmann | when we do merge | 15:58 |
| persia | For the purpose of retaining the integrity of the internet, it is nice when old archives are still accessible using old URLs. Whether that is through redirects is a more complicated question. | 16:00 |
| clarkb | persia: ya I expect we would be able to keep the old list archives in place they just wouldn't be active lists and you would join the smaller number that are | 16:00 |
| persia | That is a common and sensible solution. | 16:01 |
| persia | Often paired with mail aliases, so those sending mail to old lists either a) receive a reminder of which new list to use or b) have their mail silently redirected to the new list | 16:02 |
| dhellmann | right. so if we just install mm3 and do not migrate (all of) the existing lists, then the old archives stay where they are and we get new archives for the new lists | 16:04 |
| dhellmann | the fact that we *can* migrate some lists doesn't necessarily mean we need to | 16:05 |
| smcginnis | "retaining the integrity of the internet" - got my good laugh in for the day :) | 16:05 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: do we have any stats for how many unique core reviewers we have on all of our teams? | 17:37 |
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| fungi | clarkb: dhellmann: notes so far are at https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mm3poc and it's mostly working. still need to figure out why hyperkitty doesn't see/index messages which are delivered through the mailing lists | 18:55 |
| fungi | and yes, the tactic i've seen used by other communities who have done mm2->mm3 migrations is to leave the old pipermail archives online indefinitely but also import the old archives into hyperkitty for continuity's sake | 18:56 |
| fungi | but nothing says we must follow that pattern | 18:56 |
| fungi | dhellmann: i can run stats on unique core reviewers for all deliverable repos of each team (based on who has the ability to approve changes for them per their gerrit acls) | 18:58 |
| fungi | the tools/who-approves.py script in openstack-infra/system-config needs https://review.openstack.org/566365 applied to work with our current gerrit release, but should be runnable by anyone with a gerrit account | 18:59 |
| dhellmann | fungi : cool, I'll take a look at the script | 19:00 |
| fungi | it basically just retrieves and analyzes the acls, then queries gerrit for recursive group membership on the groups granted approval rights | 19:02 |
| dhellmann | that sounds like exactly what I need | 19:04 |
| dhellmann | it's running now; I guess it dumps a YAML file and I'll need to do a bit of work to produce the stats I actually want, but that's perfect | 19:05 |
| fungi | right, i figured structured data at least gives you the option to merge it with dumps of things from other systems | 19:08 |
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| fungi | depending on what it is you want to know | 19:09 |
| dhellmann | ++ for reusable outputs | 19:14 |
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| fungi | this was the closest data representation i could find corresponding to our vague notion of "core reviewers" | 19:24 |
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| dhellmann | Total approvers: 1430 | 19:28 |
| dhellmann | All repos: 1994 with average review team 8 | 19:28 |
| dhellmann | Spec approvers: 434 | 19:28 |
| dhellmann | Spec repos: 57 with average review team 9 | 19:28 |
| smcginnis | That number is higher than I expected. | 19:29 |
| dhellmann | I was surprised, too | 19:29 |
| dhellmann | here's my script, maybe I got something wrong: http://paste.openstack.org/show/726369 | 19:29 |
| smcginnis | Probably right, just a little surprising. | 19:30 |
| dhellmann | we have a *lot* of repositories | 19:30 |
| dhellmann | the question came up in the course of responding to the python-committers thread about potential changes in the governance model for that community: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-committers/2018-July/005925.html | 19:35 |
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| dhellmann | if I don't count the repos with no review team in the averages I get | 19:55 |
| dhellmann | Total approvers: 1430 | 19:55 |
| dhellmann | All repos: 1994 with average review team 8 | 19:55 |
| dhellmann | Staffed approvers: 1430 | 19:55 |
| dhellmann | Staffed repos: 1447 with average review team 12 | 19:55 |
| dhellmann | Spec approvers: 434 | 19:56 |
| dhellmann | Spec repos: 57 with average review team 9 | 19:56 |
| dhellmann | oops, forgot to exclude unstaffed repos from the spec list | 19:56 |
| dhellmann | Spec approvers: 434 | 19:56 |
| dhellmann | Spec repos: 55 with average review team 10 | 19:56 |
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