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| gmann | Office hour time.. | 01:00 |
|---|---|---|
| cdent | uh oh | 01:07 |
| gmann | ttx: cdent how about adding those MailingListEtiquette on contributor portal from wiki ?- https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/MailingListEtiquette | 01:07 |
| cdent | It may be a good idea, but it also might put people off. A lot of those guidelines are very hard to do in some mailers... | 01:08 |
| gmann | yeah we can extract the recommended vs better to do etc | 01:08 |
| fungi | also if we're putting the openstack-discuss topic list in the project teams guide, maybe that's a better place to keep them together? | 01:21 |
| gmann | fungi: +1. work both way and we can give refer link in other place. i am thinking if new contributor find this ML style guidelines also it will be easy for them to communicate on ML. | 01:23 |
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| fungi | yes, well, i plan to put a link to the list topic tags and etiquette in the ml description and the welcome message. we could do with also posting a copy or link to the ml ~monthly if this is important to us | 01:31 |
| fungi | hoping to have most of this nailed down and underway by the end of this week, in preparation for closing down the old lists on monday | 01:32 |
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| gmann | adding in welcome message is nice idea. | 01:35 |
| fungi | did some cross-comparison on active posters to the old lists vs subscribers to the new list. so far half the people who posted more than 10 messages to the old lists in 2018 have subscribed to the new list so far | 01:49 |
| fungi | i expect a lot more to get around to it after i close the old lists on monday | 01:49 |
| fungi | keeping in mind some of those people may have posted under different addresses at some point in 2018, or left the community in recent months, or... so i wouldn't expect close to 100% anyway | 01:51 |
| gmann | true, i remember i used two addresses during 18. | 01:52 |
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| fungi | yeah, this is just a raw comparison of addresses seen posting on the old lists vs address seen subscribed to the new | 01:54 |
| fungi | but it's a helpful metric at any rate | 01:55 |
| fungi | and that's it for office hour today | 02:01 |
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| ttx | fungi: re: old ML subscribers, note that a significant portion of those subscribers actually have the nomail flag on... about 15% at a glance | 09:45 |
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| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Mark recent Charm deliverables externally-released https://review.openstack.org/620586 | 12:19 |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Mark blazar-specs release-management: none https://review.openstack.org/620587 | 12:21 |
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| cdent | ttx wanted to be sure you saw salmon coloured comments on https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/role-of-the-tc | 12:38 |
| ttx | cdent: thanks, I love salmon. | 12:43 |
| cdent | Yeah, saying that has reminded me of how hungry I am | 12:43 |
| ttx | agree that it's a more positive / extensive way to think about that point. Bleeds into the documentation bit too | 12:44 |
| ttx | cdent: one other issue is that the current draft is the tension between the part of the role that is about defining governance and the part of it that is around applying the currently-defined model | 12:47 |
| cdent | yeah | 12:48 |
| ttx | maybe we should split the part about "defining governance, creating social norms, documenting" and the part that is about applying / refining the current model | 12:48 |
| ttx | I'll dump that ^ in the comment section | 12:50 |
| * cdent nods | 12:50 | |
| cdent | I think it is probably good that it covers three things, so it is clear to readers: defining terms, describing the now, describing the gap (if any) between now and the desired state | 12:50 |
| ttx | conflict resolution is an artifact of the two-level model | 12:50 |
| * cdent nods | 12:51 | |
| ttx | so more of a second-level role | 12:51 |
| * cdent gets lunch and thinks on these and many other things | 13:03 | |
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| evrardjp | cdent: 's comment is definitely worth a thumbs up, star, like, or whatever social media things do these days. | 14:35 |
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| fungi | clinking beers emoji | 15:50 |
| smcginnis | 🍻 | 15:51 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/project-team-guide master: Add documentation for dependency management tools https://review.openstack.org/615388 | 15:57 |
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| dhellmann | tc-members: our next meeting is a week from tomorrow. Please add anything you would like to discuss to the agenda suggestion list at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Agenda_Suggestions | 16:17 |
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| openstackgerrit | Doug Hellmann proposed openstack/governance master: update chair guide reference to closed mailing list https://review.openstack.org/620656 | 16:49 |
| openstackgerrit | Doug Hellmann proposed openstack/governance master: clarify chair responsibility for managing chair selection process https://review.openstack.org/620657 | 16:49 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: start document with chair's responsibilities https://review.openstack.org/618810 | 17:07 |
| ttx | dhellmann: Note that I'll be traveling during that meeting next week. Hopefully can still make it | 17:20 |
| smcginnis | Same here | 17:22 |
| * zaneb will be asleep during that meeting next week | 17:24 | |
| dhellmann | ttx: thanks, and noted | 17:26 |
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| dhellmann | did I miss summary email threads for the forum sessions on the vision retrospective and the technical vision, or are those still being written? | 17:43 |
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| TheJulia | earliest I will be able to get to the vision retrospection is likely friday | 18:22 |
| TheJulia | (in part because I was out all last week) | 18:22 |
| dhellmann | TheJulia : ack, that's sort of what I figured was going on | 18:31 |
| zaneb | dhellmann: I still need to write one | 18:36 |
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| mnaser | aws outposts | 20:12 |
| mnaser | seems really interesting, just announced | 20:12 |
| mnaser | on-prem aws | 20:12 |
| zaneb | fungi: when you're sending announcements about closing the list, maybe don't reply to an existing thread? for those of us with threaded email clients the new message just gets buried below the 15 others | 20:16 |
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| clarkb | zaneb: shouldn't it re promote the thread as it has new messages? | 20:19 |
| clarkb | and if you are silencing a thread you should do that after you've subscribed to the new list :P | 20:19 |
| zaneb | yes, it does | 20:19 |
| zaneb | for the record, *I* already subscribed :) | 20:19 |
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| zaneb | clarkb: the bigger issue is that the title is "[openstack-dev] [all] Bringing the community together (combine the lists!)" | 20:20 |
| zaneb | there's no point sending an email with IMPORTANT in the subject if you're going to reply to a thread with an innocuous title | 20:21 |
| clarkb | ya I can see that. That is more an issue with the subject than with threading though | 20:25 |
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| fungi | the subject was changed as part of the change in the subthread itself. sounds like gmail is really not an appropriate client for participating in mailing lists | 20:54 |
| fungi | or maybe it's so effective that's why you didn't need the reminders ;) | 20:58 |
| fungi | but sure, i've already made other compromises to these announcements to accommodate broken mailreaders, including dropping subject tags entirely and explicitly not cross-posting them but sending them separately per-list | 21:00 |
| fungi | so next time i'll leave out the in-reply-to header as well | 21:01 |
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| zaneb | fungi: for the record, I'm using Thunderbird, and AFAIK every threaded email client displays the subject line from the *first* message in the thread when a thread is collapsed | 23:58 |
| clarkb | zaneb: mine (fastmail) shows them as two "conversations", it isn't properly threaded | 23:59 |
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