Tuesday, 2015-02-10

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sarobmorn17:00
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thinrichsHi all17:01
thinrichs#startmeeting CongressTeamMeeting17:01
openstackMeeting started Tue Feb 10 17:01:49 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is thinrichs. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.17:01
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)"17:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'congressteammeeting'17:01
thinrichsLet's start out with status updates.17:02
thinrichs#topic status17:02
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thinrichscloudtoa_: want to start?  How's the dse-control-bus work going?17:02
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arosenHi17:03
sarobmorn17:03
arosening]17:03
sarobwhatever ;)17:03
thinrichsarosen: we're starting with statuses and waiting a minute for cloudtoa_ to pipe up.17:04
thinrichsMaybe cloudtoa_ stepped away.17:04
arosensounds good :)17:04
thinrichssarob: want to give a status report?17:04
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sarobsure17:05
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sarobthe sprint seemed to a moderate success17:06
sarobnot having people in the same physical space17:06
sarobdoesnt a strong sprint make17:06
sarobi do see more new faces over the last week17:06
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sarobas a team we are looking good17:07
sarobeven though our reviews are bit heavy on a few people17:07
sarobwe have 7 companies contributing code17:08
sarobactually 8 including huawei17:08
sarobwe had some discussing around cuting 2014.2.2 congress17:09
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sarobdo you want to discuss that now?17:09
thinrichsIt's great to see so many different companies contributing!17:09
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thinrichssarob: sure.17:09
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arosenI think pushing a tag for 2014.2.2 would be a good idea as a milestone.17:10
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sarobplus launchpad kilo2 milestone wrap17:10
thinrichsSounds good to me as well.17:10
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thinrichssarob, arosen: anything the group needs to know or do to prepare?17:11
sarobi dont think so17:12
sarobother than 2014.2.2 shouldnt be too buggy17:12
arosenYea we'll just need to decide when we want to push that tag.17:12
* arosen i believe. 17:12
* sarob believes too17:13
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arosenI think we could push that today before all my changes merge and break everything ;)17:13
sarobwell there you go17:13
sarobperfect timing17:13
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thinrichsDo we have any volunteers to manually test the code at the tip of master and make sure nothing's obviously broken?17:13
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sarobill take a pass at it17:14
arosenwe have our CI doing some limited testing on the code so we are probably okay unless someone wants to test soming specific17:14
sarobshould be a few others toooo17:14
thinrichssarob: thanks!17:14
arosencool17:14
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thinrichsIt seems we have a light crew at the meeting today.17:15
thinrichsMaybe we should send a note out to the ML to see if anyone can help out testing.17:15
* sarob thinking strategy strategy strategy17:15
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thinrichsLet's pick a commit ID so everyone is testing the same thing.17:15
sarobthinrichs that would be a good idea17:16
* sarob has a fire burning17:16
thinrichsarosen: want to pick out the commit ID you think looks best?  You've been pushing a bunch lately.17:16
arosenlets  say current top of master:  47991c608d01721827ecaf92cf8ce05efc569f2717:17
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thinrichsLooks good to me.17:19
thinrichssarob: Mind driving this and letting the rest of us know what to do and when to do it?17:19
sarobshirely17:19
thinrichsThanks!17:20
thinrichssarob: anything else to report?17:20
sarobnoope17:20
thinrichsarosen: want to tell us what you've been up to?17:20
sarobwell other than17:20
sarobsummit talks17:20
thinrichsarosen: hold up a sec17:20
sarobwe can discuss that next week17:20
sarobas talks get cleaned up17:20
thinrichsThe voting begins next week?17:20
sarobhmm, prob17:21
sarobarosen you member the voting delay17:21
sarobi think its a week17:21
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arosenyea i think a week17:22
thinrichsSounds good—let's discuss summit talks next week.17:22
thinrichsarosen: want to do a status update?17:22
arosenI've been working on a new api to allow us to see what datasource drivers congress has installed and then allow users to dynamically create and delete datasources17:22
arosenHere's a quick preview of the cli showing the new api calls:   paste.openstack.org/show/170257/17:23
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arosenThe patches are all up on review that implement this. I'm hoping that we'll be able to merge these soon since some of them are pretty large.17:23
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arosenonce these patches merge the next thing i think i'm going to bite off is to enable our API to be muli tenant17:24
arosenthese initially patches lay a lot of ground work for that thoguh.17:24
arosenthat's it unless someone wants to discuss.17:24
thinrichsSpinning up/down new datasource drivers at runtime is great!17:24
thinrichsI'm a bit scared about multi-tenancy, mainly because of scale.17:25
thinrichsBut overall it's good to have it there.17:26
arosenI think it's something we'll have to bite off eventually and I'd rather get that built into the api sooner than later :)17:26
thinrichsIt brings up a fundamental question though.17:26
thinrichsIf Alice says X is a violation, and Bob says X is not a violation, is X a violation or not?17:26
arosenI would say it's a violation to Alice but not to Bob.17:27
alexsyipCan it be a violation to one user and not another ?17:27
thinrichsBut at the end of the day, either Charlie can spin up a VM or he can't.17:28
thinrichsPeople don't get to control their own policy.17:28
aroseneach user would have their own rules configured though. I think in the general case they wouldn't be connecting to the same thing on the backend.17:28
arosenand if they do they would be connecting with different accounts.17:28
thinrichsThat is, one person's policy will influence another person's ability to do things.17:28
jwyhow is it resolved today if the admin user creates two conflicting policies?17:28
thinrichsOtherwise there's no point to having policy.17:28
alexsyipWhy would Alice be worried about Charlie’s configuration ?17:29
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thinrichsjwy: you're right that we run into the same kind of thing with multiple policies.17:29
arosenSay i want to say this.  All instances must have a security group that does not allow port 22.17:29
alexsyipAnd why would Charlie care if Alice doesn’t like his VM ?17:29
arosenCongress would scope that to just things it sees in the datasources I have configured.17:29
thinrichsBut we've always been able to say that only the admin writes policies and so it's up to them to do the proper integration.17:30
thinrichsalexsyip: because Charlie could be Alice's manager.17:30
thinrichsalexsyip: or vice-versa17:30
arosenthinrichs:  i think it's the same case. The tenant is able to only write policies over datasources that he has configured.17:30
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thinrichsStandard policy: prod and test apps need to be isolated (network, compute, storage).17:31
arosenif the cloud provider admin in congress has a special policy that will trump yours automatically and yuo won't know.17:31
thinrichsThat policy impacts *everyone*'s ability to deploy apps.17:31
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thinrichsWhat if each user provides policies for how they want their VMs to be deployed?17:32
thinrichsShouldn't the datacenter attempt to accommodate all of them?17:32
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arosenthinrichs:  that's fine as long as they don't conflict with a datacenter wide policy.17:32
thinrichsCharlie might say he doesn't want his VMs deployed on the same host as anyone from test.17:33
thinrichsarosen: but then what happens if Charlie's and Alice's policies conflict (and neither is an admin)?17:33
alexsyipSo one user can write policy that congress will enforce on another user.17:33
alexsyipWe make that relationship explicit.17:33
arosenI don't think we would allow a tenant to write a policy that could affect scheduling like that.17:33
thinrichsGood—we're getting to the point that we see multiple users have different policies that interact in some way.17:34
arosenthe reason why is because17:34
arosenonly an admin account that connects to the datasource can do that.17:34
arosenbut you are right this is an interesting example17:34
arosenin some systems this could be the case.17:34
arosentricky yea..17:34
aroseninteresting.17:34
thinrichsAfter all, everyone is running VMs/apps in the same datacenter.  They absolutely interact with each other, and policy will interact as well.17:34
arosenwell I think it depends on the scope of the policy. I think in general this isn't something that could occur in openstack deployments.17:35
thinrichsMy assumption has always been that we want people to tell us the policy they *actually* care about.17:36
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thinrichsWe build technology that helps implement/deal with those policies.17:36
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thinrichsAt any rate, I think at this point it's clear there's something more to think about here.17:37
arosenyea i understand, i think we should follow up this converstation after the meeting.17:37
arosenwe can talk about it in person since i don't think anyone else is here right now.17:37
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thinrichsShall we continue with status updates?17:37
arosensure17:37
thinrichsjwy: how's the Horizon UI going?17:37
jwyslow progress… i'll need to change the milestone to kilo-317:38
thinrichsOK.  Anything we can do to help?17:39
jwynot at the moment. wasn't happy with what i had initially, so trying out different things17:39
jwyonce i have something i feel better about, i'll ask for some folks to try it out17:39
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thinrichsSounds good.  I'd say we definitely want to hit kilo3, even if we're not 100% happy with it.17:40
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thinrichsJust let us know when you want us to try it out.17:40
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thinrichsalexsyip: what have you been up to?17:41
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alexsyipI’ve been working on a blog post about the performance improvements we’ve done.17:42
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alexsyipAnd also I’m investigating how to allow datasources to send data updates directly to congress through a congress api.17:42
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thinrichsBoth of those are really important for some of the deployment environments we're targeting.17:43
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thinrichsAnyone else with a status update?17:44
thinrichsOkay, let's open it up for discussion.17:44
thinrichs#topic open discussion17:44
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: CongressTeamMeeting)"17:44
arosenalexsyip:  interesting, yea i think that's going to be a good one to figure out.17:44
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aroseni remember theree was a blueprint i think tim wrote up about that.17:45
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arosenThough there was some questions about the design17:45
arosenalso another blueprint tim wrote up about using  oslo.db17:45
arosendo you have a plan on how you want to do this?17:45
alexsyiparosen: Let’s sync up about that today.  I spoke with pete a little yesterday about the overall api design which was helpful.17:45
arosensounds good17:45
rajdeepdhi thinrichs17:46
rajdeepdi had a small update17:47
thinrichsrajdeepd: hi!  Go for it.17:47
rajdeepdsubmitted the CL for data source status table in horizon UI17:47
rajdeepdgone through a couple of reviews with jwy and arosen17:48
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thinrichsjwy, arosen: want to take another look at rajdeepd's change?17:49
arosensure17:49
jwy1yep, was going to do it today17:49
thinrichsrajdeepd: anything else?17:49
rajdeepdif jwy1 needs help on UI i can help once this review is done17:49
rajdeepdthats all from my side17:50
jwy1rajdeepd: thanks for the offer, i'll let you know17:50
rajdeepdok jwy117:50
thinrichsAnything else?17:51
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thinrichsOK.  Let's end the meeting a bit early.17:52
thinrichsThanks all!17:52
thinrichs#endmeeting17:52
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"17:52
openstackMeeting ended Tue Feb 10 17:52:24 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)17:52
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2015/congressteammeeting.2015-02-10-17.01.html17:52
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2015/congressteammeeting.2015-02-10-17.01.txt17:52
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/congressteammeeting/2015/congressteammeeting.2015-02-10-17.01.log.html17:52
arosenlater!17:52
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briancurtin#startmeeting python-openstacksdk19:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Feb 10 19:00:19 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is briancurtin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.19:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: python-openstacksdk)"19:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'python_openstacksdk'19:00
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briancurtin#topic Roll Call - say hi if you're here for the SDK meeting19:01
briancurtinBrian Curtin19:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call - say hi if you're here for the SDK meeting (Meeting topic: python-openstacksdk)"19:01
terrylhoweTerry Howe, HP19:01
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briancurtini wrote up a small agenda at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/PythonOpenStackSDK#Agenda_for_2015-02-10_1900_UTC19:02
briancurtini know everett won't be here, ian might, not sure about anyone else, so i guess let's go and maybe more will come in19:03
briancurtin#topic auth plugins work!19:03
*** openstack changes topic to "auth plugins work! (Meeting topic: python-openstacksdk)"19:03
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redroboto/19:03
briancurtinI already had this working in tree, and it was as simple as just taking it out, but as you probably guessed, auth plugins simply work19:03
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briancurtinhey redrobot - i don't recognize your handle19:04
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redrobothi briancurtin, I'm Douglas Mendizábal, Racker and PTL for Barbican19:04
briancurtinah cool, welcome (i think i even saw you earlier today)19:04
* sigmavirus24 is late19:05
* sigmavirus24 apologizes19:05
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briancurtinapology denied19:05
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briancurtinanyway, https://github.com/briancurtin/rackspace-sdk-plugin works - it's not on PyPI and that's just a temporary repo, but installing the SDK and then installing that will work perfectly fine. i'm going to write up a simple rackspace-only service and see how that works, and then write up a user guide on how to implement custom plugins. probably won't get to19:06
briancurtinthat immediately, but soon19:06
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terrylhoweI’m surprise you have an auth_url19:06
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briancurtinterrylhowe: that's something i just noticed as i was about to copy/paste an example...i need to get handle more directly. right now i do "connection.Connection(preference=pref, auth_plugin="rackspace", auth_url="https://identity.api.rackspacecloud.com/v2.0/", user_name="curtin", api_key="key")" and i can work with the existing object_store stuff19:07
terrylhowecool19:08
briancurtini'll just move that auth_url inside and then it's good, i think. assuming that's all we need, in the process of writing up the user guide i will put a cookie-cutter plugin somewhere so anyone can get started for their provider19:09
briancurtinnot a whole lot else going on directly with this right now - it's more a part of a greater thing with supporting the CDN service and an internal task i have, but it was cool that it just worked so easil19:10
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briancurtin#topic split up of cinder review19:11
*** openstack changes topic to "split up of cinder review (Meeting topic: python-openstacksdk)"19:11
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briancurtinso at least terry saw this, but i put a pretty large review of cinder out there to follow up on what i started going into that mid-cycle meetup. i'm going to split it up probably as follows, which is a guideline we should probably follow going forward: one change for all Resources, then one change for each resource's addition to the connection level, then19:12
briancurtindocs19:12
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briancurtini prefer docs alongside changes so it becomes a fluid part of the process, but for this cinder one i actually need help with that along with it depending on some compute work to be truly useful in the docs19:13
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briancurtinwithin that change there were a few comments from terry that i'll address with changes in those subsequent review19:14
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briancurtinthe topic of naming came up in https://review.openstack.org/#/c/150979/5/openstack/volume/v2/_proxy.py and i would just like to make a general comment (which is in there, but i'll summarize here): i think right now this is the time to experiment with APIs and try different names and things and see how this all works. nothing is locked down yet, and we19:16
briancurtinhaven't really built enough on top of this to know how we or other users are going to want to use it19:16
redrobotbriancurtin interesting... that's kinda why I joined the meeting today...19:17
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redrobotbriancurtin not cinder, but renaming things in general19:18
terrylhowethe keystore stuff has a very generic proxy redrobot19:20
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terrylhoweor were you thinking about another part of the sdk19:20
briancurtinredrobot: i'd love to get other perspectives involved in building out a nice high-level interface to work with this stuff. right now there are basically two approaches or conventions. eventually we'll converge on one after things have seen more use19:20
briancurtinthat does mean we're going to break anyone who may be an early adopter, but i think that's expected, or it will be made to be an expectation. we do have some releases on PyPI but they're not very advertised. as we get more completed and can build nice demos, i think we'll be more public about the releases to show them off19:23
redrobotcool... I'm still spinning up on the client work19:23
redrobotI've been spending a lot of time on our client, and was curious about what (if any) work had been done here for barbican19:23
terrylhoweI was in Paris at the barbican presentation and added it to the sdk19:24
redrobotterrylhowe nice!19:24
briancurtinredrobot: i dont know how discoverable this at the moment, but our current docs are at http://python-openstacksdk.readthedocs.org/en/latest/19:24
terrylhowehttps://github.com/stackforge/python-openstacksdk/tree/master/openstack/keystore19:25
redrobotSo one thing we did a while back was rebrand to "key-manager" instead of "keystore"19:26
redrobotI was wondering if it would be feasible to rename the module in the client?19:26
briancurtinright now none of the keystore things show up in docs though, but i'll add some docstrings and add them to the resource docs. would be nice to work together on a high-level (proxy) interface for that, would be helpful in coming up with some docs19:26
briancurtinredrobot: we'd have to name it key_manager, but yeah it can change19:27
redrobotI would love to help out with that... we have our hackathon mid-cycle coming up next week, and we'll be talking about clients a lot...19:27
briancurtinredrobot: where at?19:27
redrobotbriancurtin It'll be in Austin at the Capital Factory19:28
briancurtinredrobot: mind if i crash the party? i did the same for the cinder meetup at IBM in austin19:28
redrobotbriancurtin the more the merrier! :) You can get all the details here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Sprints/BarbicanKiloSprint19:30
briancurtincool, i'll be there. at the cinder one they just gave me the floor for a bit to introduce the project and then it was around an hour discussion on what we do, how we do it, how it'll fit into cinder, who wanted to work on it, stuff like that. their mid-cycle was more planning than hacking, but one guy wrote up some cinder resources like an hour later19:31
briancurtinanyway, back to the topic since we're halfway through19:32
sigmavirus24Yeah, the glance midcycle sounded a lot like planning/demos instead of hacking19:32
briancurtini'll follow up with probably 4-5 smaller reviews on cinder and go from there19:32
briancurtin#topic Resource.list consistency update19:32
*** openstack changes topic to "Resource.list consistency update (Meeting topic: python-openstacksdk)"19:32
terrylhoweI marked one of my patches related to this WIP19:33
terrylhowenot sure when I’ll get back to it19:33
briancurtinback when britt pointed out that something wasn't responding to pagination because it was disabled (neutron?), i went off and hacked up Resource.list to be a catch-all list call. it ended up doing way too much and is not really a usable solution in real life. it's fine against devstack with tiny responses, but doing a double  request for 10,000 containers is19:34
briancurtinnot acceptable19:34
briancurtinterrylhowe's Resource.page actually solves this, or starts to19:34
briancurtinindividual resources that return lists, but not paginated ones, should probably override list and use page directly19:34
briancurtinthey would essentially look like the get_types method at the top of this module: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/150979/5/openstack/volume/v2/_proxy.py19:35
terrylhoweoh we sent that on through, I just have a task card to review resources that override list19:35
briancurtinterrylhowe: at first i didn't really get Resource.page except for being an organizational thing, but when it clicked that it will solve that non-paginated but still a list calls...i fell in love19:36
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terrylhoweyeh, I think that would be a good model what you have there19:38
briancurtinso that's all on that, just wanted to note that i think we can avoid that crazy catch-all Resource.list19:39
briancurtinother than that stuff, i'm probably going to kick off some smaller resource changes to build out some sample apps for an internal talk i have in a few weeks19:40
briancurtinand then terry and i submitted a proposal for teh summit to talk about building applications on the SDK19:40
briancurtinanything else going on?19:41
terrylhowesort of back to the naming thing, I’m not necessarily opposed to volume.types over volume.list_types, the only concern I can think of is if there is some name conflict19:42
terrylhowewe get some very generic resource names like object and type sometimes19:42
terrylhoweis there anything to be concerned about there?19:42
stevellethat is a hurdle throughout openstack19:43
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terrylhoweI see brian has a long comment there I hadn’t seen before in the volume patch.  I’ll have to look at that19:44
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briancurtinyeah, object and type are kind of hard to work with, but the majority of names are far away from those and i'd rather code to the majority19:44
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briancurtinterrylhowe: yeah that comment is pretty long...i have sort of strong opinions on naming. some way will win in the end, but i'd like to stick with the names in there at least for now19:45
briancurtinterrylhowe: and im going to be doing some work on compute soon, where i'll probably just leave those names as-is and see how they feel19:46
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terrylhoweredrobot: https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-openstacksdk/+bug/142046119:48
openstackLaunchpad bug 1420461 in OpenStack SDK "keystore renamed key-manager" [Undecided,New]19:48
terrylhoweshould we have a ticket to rename all list_ proxy methods?19:49
briancurtinterrylhowe: i dont think we should rename them yet. i would just leave everything as-is, work with it, build stuff, and find out what really is best. i could very well be wrong that the methods should just be a plural version of the resource type, e.g., volumes, containers, etc19:50
terrylhowek19:50
briancurtinanything else to add?19:53
redrobotterrylhowe thanks!  I'll try to get a patch up in the next few days19:53
terrylhowecool, thanks19:54
terrylhowenothing else here19:54
briancurtini guess that's it. thanks everyone!19:54
briancurtin#endmeeting19:56
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"19:56
openstackMeeting ended Tue Feb 10 19:56:00 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)19:56
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/python_openstacksdk/2015/python_openstacksdk.2015-02-10-19.00.html19:56
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/python_openstacksdk/2015/python_openstacksdk.2015-02-10-19.00.txt19:56
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