Wednesday, 2016-05-25

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SridarK_Hi FWaaS folks04:00
njohnston#startmeeting fwaas04:00
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 04:00:05 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is njohnston. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.04:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'fwaas'04:00
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njohnston#chair SridarK_04:00
openstackCurrent chairs: SridarK_ njohnston04:00
njohnstonHi everyone04:00
chandancHello All04:00
SridarK_lets get started - i see most folks are on04:00
njohnston#topic Announcements04:01
SridarK_njohnston: thx for getting the agenda set04:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:01
njohnstonI just want to note that we are now 1 week from N-1.  Tempus fugit!04:01
njohnstonThis means that we are 1/3 done with the Newton cycle.  We should think about our velocity to make sure we are on track.04:02
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njohnstonwhich leads me to...04:02
yushiroHi, sorry for late.04:02
njohnston#topic Mid-Cycle04:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Mid-Cycle (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:02
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njohnstonIn Austin when we met, we had talked about doing a virtual mid-cycle04:03
njohnstonI am still in favor of that idea, but what does everyone think?04:03
njohnstonIf we decide we can add it to the wiki page
njohnstonWe should be aware of the timing of the Neutron mid-cycle:
mfranc213+1  also can you post the meeting agenda? ;)04:04
SridarK_yes i too think a virtual mid-cycle is more favorable with geography of contributors04:05
njohnstonDoes anyone have any thoughts about timing, or is it premature to think about that?04:05
SridarK_but perhaps lets first get some traction going - so we can be more productive during the mid-cycle04:05
SridarK_i think we have some things to decide before we get to this04:06
njohnstonok, so sounds like we still like the virtual idea, but it's too early to get something on the books.04:06
SridarK_i am hoping we can get some thing going in the next week04:06
SridarK_once we have some skeletal pieces beginning to talk to each other - then we can make some quick progress by blocking some time04:07
SridarK_just my thought04:07
njohnston#topic L2 and L304:07
*** openstack changes topic to "L2 and L3 (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:07
njohnstonSO we want to integrate with 2 agents, both L2 and L304:08
njohnstonDo we want to approach this in parallel, or work on one then the other?04:08
njohnstonI was having a converation with mfranc213 about this today and I realized we weren't on the same page, so I wanted to get the team's thought.04:08
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SridarK_i think we should approach them in parallel04:09
SridarK_if some folks can get the L2Agent integration started - out of this we can evolve some patterns that can be used in L304:09
SridarK_L3 is a bit simpler w.r.t iptables04:10
njohnstonL3 may need to be on the back burner for a bit while the L3 agent extension gets wrangled out, and then I agree we can re-use patterns from the L2 implementation.04:10
njohnstonmfranc213: what do you think?04:10
SridarK_Now with the change to get us going, in theory we can work thru the L3Agent to go end to end04:10
mfranc213i agree that L2 should, minimally, be started first.04:10
SridarK_as we are operational04:10
mfranc213i don't believe we have enough people to do these in parallel04:11
mfranc213but i like what srikark_ is saying04:11
mfranc213which i think is (tell me if i'm wrong):04:11
mfranc213start the L2 to get the general architecture understood/in place.  then go to the L3 which is simpler to implement.04:12
SridarK_mfranc213: yes along those lines04:12
mfranc213that may get us  with something to present soonest04:12
SridarK_mfranc213: yes04:12
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SridarK_if we have flushed out iptables on L2 then we can continue forth with the L2 implementation04:13
SridarK_in terms of actually getting some things comitted we will need a reference backend in place04:13
mfranc213njohnston: what do you think?04:13
SridarK_which is simpler in L304:13
mfranc213and which has been done, thought in a different way, in v1.  right?04:14
mickeysThe quickest way to get something running is to run with noopfirewall driver (for security groups). In order to run with iptablesfirewall driver (for security groups), the coexistence changes have to be made.04:14
njohnstonI agree with everything which has been said, and I look forward to tearing into the reference backend.  I think the risk is in leaving the L3 agent extension to be done by a third party, which surrenders the initiative so to speak.  That to me is a long pole that is difficult to control, and so is a risk item.04:15
SridarK_mickeys: yes we can do that for sure, but to get changes in - we cannot break SG04:15
SridarK_in essence the crux of the FW agent code should be very similar for L2 & L304:15
SridarK_possibly the same04:15
SridarK_how we bolt things in to the L2 & L3 framework could be a bit different04:16
SridarK_and some validations etc04:16
njohnstonOK, I think we talked that one out.04:17
njohnston#topic Explicating the dependency chain04:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Explicating the dependency chain (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:17
njohnstonIt'd be good to know for sure what depends on what so we can prioritize04:17
SridarK_but if we can flush out the L2 extension and how we interact with it we can get some things in place for L304:17
njohnstonThis came about when I was trying to test the existing code for the FWaaS DB change and found it depended on one or two other changes04:17
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njohnstonI made a stab at a graphical representation, please check it for accuracy:
SridarK_njohnston: on the DB piece, we should have a dependency on the v2 extensions04:18
SridarK_and this is mostly okay - i have tested that04:18
njohnstonYes, that was what I discovered :-)04:19
SridarK_there are probab some more few bits that need filling in04:19
njohnstonand I think the DB piece needs to be in place before versioned objects can really be gated on04:19
SridarK_shwetaap: i think u have started looking into this ?04:19
SridarK_njohnston: i have some basic stuff on rules added to the db patch04:19
SridarK_but we will need at least a skeletal piece of code on the Firewall group04:20
SridarK_before we can hit the versioned object - agent interaction if i am not mistaken04:20
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njohnstonwhich change is the firewall group?04:21
SridarK_if we can start getting these piece integrated that will could be our first steps04:21
SridarK_the db changes to support firewall group04:22
njohnstonah, I see04:22
njohnstonThe good news is that Armando's fix merged last week, so the gate should be working fine now.  Yay!04:23
SridarK_yes it is04:23
shwetaapSridarK_: sorry, yea I have taken a look at the extension patch, but I havent made any changes to it yet.04:23
SridarK_we have tempest passing too04:23
SridarK_shwetaap: ok no worries04:23
SridarK_so we are pretty much operational04:24
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njohnston#topic L3 Agent Extension04:24
*** openstack changes topic to "L3 Agent Extension (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:24
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njohnstonThe spec is still waiting for comments:
SridarK_njohnston: yes i am looking at it04:25
njohnstonIf folks could take a look and give feedback, or +1 if it looks good to you.04:25
yushironjohnston, Sure.04:25
njohnstonThanks SridarK_!04:25
njohnstonThanks yushiro!04:26
njohnston#topic Observer Hierarchy04:26
*** openstack changes topic to "Observer Hierarchy (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:26
njohnstonmfranc213 was wondering about the RPC callbacks/observer hierachy: can the same mechanism, whatever it may end up looking like, be the same for L2 and L3 callbacks/notifications?04:26
SridarK_I have pinged the submitter and he is retesting the patch04:27
mfranc213njohnston: i don't know, unfortunately04:27
SridarK_what does it look like for L204:27
SridarK_i suspect it should be similar04:27
mfranc213miguel may be able to speak to this.04:27
SridarK_we are essentially looking for changes in port state04:27
SridarK_or router state in L304:28
mfranc213but my belief is that these would be structurally the same if not simply one thing. ("these" = the two RPC callback implementations, for L2 or L3)04:29
mfranc213again, i think miguel can shed light on this04:29
SridarK_for L3 extensions - this piece is already present as the Observer Hierarchy04:29
SridarK_there are some router events that one can register callbacks to get notifications04:29
mfranc213sorry, change would for could ^^04:30
SridarK_i suspect for L2 we can register for port events ?04:30
njohnstonYes, I believe that is correct, looking at how QoS does it:
yushiromfranc213, SridarK_ regarding L2, I think it is very similar architecture QoS too.04:31
SridarK_yushiro: ok04:31
njohnstonactually that is the manager, here is where it registers for notifications:
yushiroHowever, we have to define new agent_driver, right?04:32
padkrishSridarK_# Isn't that what German's patch does?
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SridarK_padkrish: yes i think German starting pulling things together - but i think it is still WIP04:32
padkrishBasically get port notifications from L2 agent extensions and FW resource notifications similar to observer hierarchy04:33
padkrishSridarK_#Yes agreed04:33
yushiropadkrish, correct.04:33
mfranc213on the L2 level, is it just notifications of port updates that is needed by the agent?04:34
SridarK_i would think so04:35
mfranc213please fix the grammar of that question as you read it :)04:35
SridarK_mfranc213: :-)04:35
yushiromfranc213,  yes. I think so too.04:35
mfranc213i recall something about namespace information needed by the agent.  maybe i imagined that?04:36
SridarK_mfranc213: that is for L304:36
mfranc213thank you04:36
SridarK_ok i think we need to sort out some of these interactions for the agents04:36
SridarK_yushiro: , padkrish: are u guys looking into this ?04:37
yushiroSridarK_, currently, we're looking into QoS implementation for L2.04:37
SridarK_njohnston: , mfranc213: i think both of u have domain expertise here04:37
SridarK_yushiro: ok04:38
yushiropadkrish, SridarK_, And, I'll try to update xgerman's patch(
padkrishSridarK_# Yes.. thanks to mfranc213, njohnston for the QoS pointers04:38
njohnstonHappy to help, anytime :-)04:38
SridarK_padkrish: yushiro: other things u guys would like discuss on this topic ?04:38
SridarK_mfranc213: njohnston: thx for all the pointers04:39
padkrishif i understand right, the versioned objects in the patch is where more work is needed04:39
SridarK_padkrish: ok04:39
yushiroSridarK_, currently OK.04:40
padkrishthis is where i think, German was referring to following QoS patch more closely04:40
SridarK_yes agreed04:40
padkrishxgerman# there you are :)04:40
SridarK_now to make progress on the L3 Agent framework, we should look for defining a workflow that is quite similar04:41
xgermanYeah, I heard my name :-)04:41
mfranc213i love this meeting04:41
SarathMekalajust to be in loop :)04:41
njohnstonI think the last major thing I have been tracking is04:42
SridarK_hang on04:42
* njohnston hangs04:42
SridarK_So we can try to get some comments on to njohnston's spec04:42
SridarK_i would like to see if we can flush out a basic L3 workflow along the lines of L204:42
SridarK_i think having a similar model greatly increases how quickly we can get support on the L3 framework04:43
xgermanYeah, the more we can share the better04:43
SridarK_and if we have a model in place, given that we have a working L3 model - we can refactor the code (to commonize with L2) and fit the final L3 model04:44
SridarK_at least in a ideal world this might work04:44
SridarK_ok i am done on this topic04:45
njohnston#topic Neutron iptables changes04:45
*** openstack changes topic to "Neutron iptables changes (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:45
mickeysI still need to file the bugs and start on the code for security groups coexistence04:46
njohnstonmickeys: Is there anything we can do to facilitate?04:46
mfranc213mickeys: would you be able to email the group sample sample iptables doc that show before (with SG but not FW entries) and after (with both SG and FW entries04:46
mickeysYes I can email the sample. Actually I should just put that in the bug?04:47
mfranc213yes, perfect.04:47
mfranc213and this would show the wrapped and unwrapped stuff04:47
mickeyschandanc: Any chance you can take on the conntrack coexistence issue?04:48
chandancSure will take a look04:49
mickeysI can file the bug04:49
SridarK_chandanc: SarathMekala: Did u guys also have any other questions ?04:49
chandancnot at this time04:50
SarathMekalaI was going through Mickeys patch.... and felt if it would be helpful if there is a spec for reference04:50
SarathMekalaany pointers in this regards?04:51
mickeysI don't have anything written up. The main starting point is to understand the security groups iptables firewall driver.04:51
mickeysWe could have a call?04:51
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SarathMekalaYeah that would be helpful04:52
njohnstonWell, we have seven minutes left, so let's open the floor04:52
njohnston#topic Open Discussion04:53
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: fwaas)"04:53
mfranc213by the way, one thing i just realized (maybe i'm the last to realize): to add myself as a reviewer too all relevant fwaas-related patches in order to get notifications04:53
njohnstonI try and add folks when I see them missing, but I don't know everyone's launchpad ID.  In particular padkrish and shwetaap I had a hard time finding you to add as a reviewer for a change.04:54
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mfranc213also, nate's dependency chart and some things that i will finish when i get cycles should go on our wiki.  sorry for keep mentioning the wiki.04:54
SridarK_mfranc213: yes pls let me know what u would like to add04:55
SridarK_we can sync offline04:55
xgermanWiki is good. But we should also start a doc directory in tree04:55
SridarK_i think there are issues with access so i can proxy04:55
SridarK_xgerman: +104:55
njohnstonI like a doc directory in tree04:55
mfranc213xgerman +104:55
padkrish#njohnston# I will add myself as reviewer and will mail my launchpad ID04:56
mfranc213+3 really04:56
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njohnstonThanks padkrish!04:56
njohnstonSo, is this meeting time still working for everyone?04:56
mfranc213not me, really :( i'm sorry.  but i will keep doing it.04:56
yushiroHi, I'm summarizing FWaaSv2 L2 part at etherpad in order to share our(my) progress.  I'll send link ASAP.04:57
mfranc213for me, anyway: maybe ask this same question, about meeting time, next week?04:57
SridarK_yushiro: ok sounds good thx04:57
njohnstonmfranc213: sure thing04:57
njohnstonyushiro: Thanks, I look forward to reading it04:57
SridarK_njohnston: mfranc213: will sync offline to see how we can get some basic integration with plugin going04:58
yushiroxgerman, hi. I'd like to ask you some question about your patch.04:58
SridarK_i would like for us to start churning the patchsets04:58
njohnston+100 to churn04:58
xgermanyushiro: sure04:58
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SridarK_also folks can u pls pull a devstack env - albeit v104:59
yushiroHow about discussing #openstack-fwaas04:59
SridarK_then u can start playing with things04:59
yushiropadkrish, How about you ?04:59
SridarK_1 min04:59
padkrishsure yushiro04:59
yushiroxgerman, padkrish Thank you.  Let's move #openstack-fwaas after 1 minute.05:00
njohnstonall right, I have to call time05:00
yushiroOh, it's now :)05:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"05:00
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 05:00:08 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)05:00
njohnstonthanks all05:00
openstackMinutes (text):
SridarK_ok folks thx for joining05:00
hoangcxThanks :-)05:00
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yamamoto#startmeeting taas05:33
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 05:33:09 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is yamamoto. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.05:33
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: taas)"05:33
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'taas'05:33
yamamotowe have nothing on agenda05:33
yamamoto#topic Open Discussion05:33
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: taas)"05:33
soichiyamamoto: i think your idea is nice05:34
soichibut, i have a question05:34
reedipI have been offline for a while now, and have come back to normal timings... I will start work on the L2 plugin, it has been delayed for a long time05:34
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yamamotoreedip: l2 agent extension?05:35
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reedipsorry, yeah05:35
yamamotoL2 Extension flow management, including taas05:36
yamamotosoichi: what's the question?05:37
soichido you have any reason to use "" for the video in vancouver summit, on the other hand "" for the one on austin?05:38
reedipyamamoto: so we dont need to do anything ?05:38
yamamotoreedip: i guess the first step of l2 agent extension support doesn't need to care about flows from other extensions, though05:38
soichiif shorter url is prefered, what do you say to use "" for vancouver?05:38
yamamotoreedip: we need to turn our agent to l2 agent extension.  the review is about coordination among extensions.05:39
yamamotowell, i haven't read it yet, but it's my understanding.05:39
yamamotosoichi: i chose the url as it looks more official to me05:41
reedipyamamoto: let me read it and discuss it with ajo once :)05:42
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soichiokay, i see.  i guess it is better to use "" for austin.05:43
yamamotosoichi: is it available?  i couldn't find it when i searched.05:43
soichiyes, ""05:44
yamamotosoichi: thank you05:44
yamamoto#link common flow classsifer meeting schedule05:48
yamamoto17:00 UTC is somehow insane for JST folks though :-)05:49
soichiit is difficult to attend on line, but i'd like to check IRC logs.05:51
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yamamotoanyone have anything more to discuss today?05:51
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soichii have no additional topics for today.05:52
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kazme too.05:53
reedipThis is Today ????05:53
reedipthe CFC meeting05:53
reedipIts difficult for Indian Standard Time as well :P05:54
yamamotoreedip: it isn't officially scheduled yet (as the patch is not merged)05:54
reedipthe patch for the timing of the meeting?05:54
yamamotoreedip: yes, irc-meetings patch05:54
* yamamoto waiting for a while before closing the meeting05:56
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yamamotoi guess we've done05:58
yamamotothank you!05:58
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"05:58
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 05:58:15 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)05:58
openstackMinutes (text):
soichisee you, bye05:58
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robcresswell#startmeeting horizondrivers08:00
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 08:00:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is robcresswell. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.08:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"08:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'horizondrivers'08:00
tsufieva quiet morning meeting08:00
robcresswellUsually is :)08:00
r1chardj0n3sa quiet evening meeting ;-)08:00
r1chardj0n3s[I'm also cooking dinner]08:01
r1chardj0n3sI do have a BP I'd like to run past you though08:01
robcresswellSure. Just want to highlight the midcycle for anyone checking minutes08:01
robcresswell#info Remember to register for the Horizon midcycle! Everyone is welcome to attend08:02
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* tsufiev still getting travel approval08:02
robcresswell#topic Blueprint Review08:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Blueprint Review (Meeting topic: horizondrivers)"08:02
robcresswellFire away r1chardj0n3s08:02
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r1chardj0n3sso it turns out I don't have a BP for you because it's already been approved ;-)08:02
r1chardj0n3sI didn't do my pre-meeting homework, sorry08:02
robcresswellWhich one was it?08:02
r1chardj0n3sgot some folks working away on it08:03
robcresswellYep, I instantly approved those due to previous discussion08:03
robcresswelldidnt need to revisit it.08:03
r1chardj0n3sdavid's been working with them on it08:03
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robcresswellThats great. I'd like to continue refining the Django views while we move bits and pieces to angular.08:04
tsufievI have one item on my BP agenda08:04
robcresswellSure, go tsufiev08:04
tsufiev was approved some time ago, but now it seems that its scope has changed08:04
tsufievI have both Django and Angular implementation08:04
tsufievand I would like to get Django implementation merged as well, because it could be backported to mitaka release, contrary to Angular implementation08:05
r1chardj0n3sso a Django implementation ... the opening line "bypassing Django" isn't really accurate any more? :-)08:05
robcresswellCan't backport a feature. Unless you meant locally for MOS etc08:06
tsufievwell... it is bypassing part of Django08:06
tsufievrobcresswell, yeah, I meant downstream backports08:06
tsufievwell, downstream backporting is not something that upstream would be really interested in, anyways it _might_ be interested in having this feature for Django - as long as Django is still supported08:07
robcresswellI don't have a huge issue with using the same blueprint. Its not overloaded (5/6 patches?) and it provides a good "story" for how the code moved forward.08:07
robcresswellMight make sense to update the wording in it though.08:08
r1chardj0n3ssounds good to me too08:08
tsufievrobcresswell, okay, I'll update the description section there08:08
robcresswellWe're not strict on specs like the other projects. As long as the feature concept it sensible and the patches are tracked, we don't need to spend hours refining blueprints IMO.08:08
robcresswellconcept is*08:08
robcresswellThanks tsufiev08:08
tsufievbtw, r1chardj0n3s, I found out how to use the same approach for Swift upload08:09
tsufievI mean, CORS feature08:09
r1chardj0n3stsufiev: cool08:09
robcresswellI have one bp to mention, its more of a discussion point than a solid feature proposal.08:09
r1chardj0n3sso we can route around Django's FD issue ;-)08:09
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tsufievr1chardj0n3s, yep, will try to refresh my patch today08:10
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robcresswellIts a vague title, but a discussion worth having with the angular rewrites08:11
robcresswellURL patterns and code structure seem to be hopping around a bit08:11
r1chardj0n3syeah, interesting08:12
r1chardj0n3sdoesn't mention s/instance/server though, so REJECT08:12
r1chardj0n3s(I'm still not entirely sure how that conversation got derailed at the summit)08:12
tsufievI like the idea, Admin dashboard quite often looks redundant08:12
tsufievI mean certain panels within it08:12
r1chardj0n3sbut the admin panels are basically fronting over admin access to services, right?08:13
robcresswellAnyway if you have any thoughts on it, please note them down. Wanted to get some early discussion on the BP before mentioning at midcycle.08:13
r1chardj0n3sso there's different permissions going on there08:13
robcresswellr1chardj0n3s: Right, but a lot of it is very minor. The admin networking views for example, are nearly all direct inheritance08:13
robcresswellWhich adds a lot of boilerplate and duplication.08:14
tsufievand all the addition 'admin' stuff could be hidden with policy.check()08:14
robcresswellSo there are gains to be made in that regard08:14
robcresswellDavids point is good though, you wouldnt want someone accidentally deleting someone elses resources, for example.08:14
tsufiev+ we decided to stop using roles.admin permissions, in favor of checking policies08:14
r1chardj0n3salso it avoids the issue of us splitting out the angular implementation details of views because they're shared between the two sets of panels08:15
r1chardj0n3sthat's a level of obfuscation I'm not happy about08:15
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robcresswellYep. So we would just have <horizon_url>/images/<id> for example08:15
* tsufiev just read David's remark08:15
robcresswellIt ties in to the angular too, which atm is using <url>/details/<resource_name>/<id>08:16
r1chardj0n3syeah, David's point clarifies what I was thinking about there08:16
robcresswelloops, forgot a '/project/' in there08:16
tsufievthat would be a really good topic for UX research...08:16
robcresswellYeah, I'll see if Piet has any thoughts08:17
tsufievrobcresswell, do you know how the process of discussing the changes is organized now in UX community?08:18
tsufievI have fallen out from its workflow recently :/08:18
robcresswellI do not. They were organising research, but I don't recall the process08:18
robcresswell the next meeting is this friday08:18
tsufievokay, should come there and see what's going on...08:19
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robcresswellI've dropped that bp into the agenda so I can raise it there, see if there is any interest08:20
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robcresswellCool, thats all from me and the agenda is empty.08:22
r1chardj0n3squiet, quick meeting :-)08:22
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* tsufiev in the process of updating glance-image-upload bp, will finish 10 minutes later08:23
robcresswellSo if you have any thoughts on that bp, please leave comments; its just intended to generate early discussion so that its not a new idea at the midcycle (since time is limited)08:23
robcresswellThanks all08:23
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"08:23
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 08:23:46 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)08:23
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claudiub#startmeeting hyper-v13:02
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 13:02:15 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is claudiub. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.13:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: hyper-v)"13:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'hyper_v'13:02
domi007hi all13:02
claudiubhello. :)13:02
sonuHi everyone13:02
claudiubsorry I started a bit late, was pinged about nova-rescue. :)13:02
claudiubok, so some status updates13:03
claudiub#topic monasca Windows support13:03
*** openstack changes topic to "monasca Windows support (Meeting topic: hyper-v)"13:03
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claudiubstill in progress. I've fixed the disk checker, so now disk metrics are good.13:04
claudiubthere were a couple of fixes to do there. yeay.13:04
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sagar_nikamclaudiub: the monasca BP is approved ?13:04
claudiubcurrently looking at process checker, seems to be working. might be dependent on psutil version.13:04
lpetrutHi guys13:04
claudiubnot yet, for some reason.13:05
alexpilottihi folks13:05
sagar_nikamok, could you discuss this in the last monasca meeting ?13:05
claudiubsagar_nikam: I spoke with tpl, he seemed fine with most changes.13:05
sagar_nikamalexpilotti: Hi... welcome back ... to IRC meetings13:05
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claudiubyep, I've brought this up to the last monasca meeting13:06
sagar_nikamclaudiub: was it roland ?13:06
sagar_nikamlet me know if i need to follow up13:06
sagar_nikami can try it13:06
claudiubsure. I'll ping him today again.13:06
sonuare you collecting vnic metrics too on hyper0v?13:06
claudiubvNIC metrics are being collected by the hyperv checker, which is still in progress. still have to cleanup the refactor.13:07
claudiubas for host NIC metrics, they are collected by the network checker.13:07
sonuYeah it makes sense13:08
sagar_nikamclaudiub: i think we need the followin metrics to start off .. disk, network, cpu and memory13:08
sonufor vnic, do you put the port-id as one of the dim?13:08
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claudiubanyways, some reviews would be nice.13:08
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sonuand you would have to revisit this when we have OVS in place on Hyper-V13:10
claudiubsagar_nikam: you mean the VMs metrics?13:10
sagar_nikamfirst host metrics should be fine, we can then move to VMs metrics13:10
claudiubsagar_nikam: yeah also on the list will be disk.iops and disk.latency13:10
sagar_nikamcurrently vmware driver for monasca does that13:10
claudiubsonu: you mean the vNIC metrics, right?13:11
sonuthen OVS plugin will be useful -
sonuyes I meant vnic metrics13:11
sagar_nikamclaudiub: how about monasca metrics if the host is in MSCluster and we are using nova cluster driver13:12
sagar_nikamwe give CSV metrics ?13:12
sagar_nikaminstead of disk13:12
claudiubsonu: yeah, I should look at that13:13
claudiubsagar_nikam: hm, the disk checker takes all the available partitions, and collects metrics13:13
claudiubso, if the CSV is mounted on the host and has a drive letter, its metrics should be collected.13:14
sagar_nikamclaudiub: ok.. should be fine..13:14
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claudiubbut there's a chance the metrics can't collected. for example, for Floppy Disk Drive and CD / DVD Disk Drive, disk metrics can't be collected.13:15
claudiubeven with drive letter.13:15
claudiubanyways. in my list of to do, is to also look at the iis checker13:16
claudiubthere's some wmi stuff there. :)13:16
sagar_nikamclaudiub: IIS checker ? is it for web server or some thing else13:17
claudiub#topic nova patches13:17
*** openstack changes topic to "nova patches (Meeting topic: hyper-v)"13:17
sagar_nikami saw one nova patch merged ... nice13:18
claudiubso, last week something happened, apparently. :)13:18
claudiubnot just one. :)13:18
claudiubsince thursday untill now, we've had 6-7 patches merged.13:18
claudiuband we have 2 more patches with a +2.13:19
claudiubwhich is great, it came as a nice surprise. :)13:19
claudiubalso, apparently, we'll have to add support for PCI passthrough on Hyper-V.13:20
sagar_nikamcluster driver not in that etherpad ?13:20
claudiubit is13:20
sagar_nikamok found it ...13:20
claudiuband we'll have to investigate SRIOV as well.13:21
claudiubfun times. :)13:21
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sonuis PCI-SRIOV a requirement?13:21
claudiubsonu: what do you mean?13:21
sonuI mean which release is this targeted for?13:21
claudiubwe're targetting Newton.13:22
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claudiubat the very least, it will land on compute-hyperv, but hopefully it will also land on nova.13:22
sonuHave you started work on this already? or yet to start.13:22
sonuwe were interested in contributing this feature, if you are fine with it.13:22
claudiubsonu: I've started investigating for disk passthrough. I already have an env for that. For the rest, I'll need another env. :)13:23
claudiubsure, any help is welcome. :)13:24
sonuI was aiming for VM NICs as PCI and SRIOV passthrough.13:24
claudiubbut it will have to done until June 25, if it is to land on nova.13:24
domi007so exactly one month from now13:25
claudiubsonu: afaik, NIC passthrough is available only on Windows Hyper-V Server 2016.13:25
claudiubdomi007: yep.13:25
claudiubsonu: for the rest, there's only SRIOV13:25
sonuso you mean SRIOV has to be done till June 2513:26
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claudiubanyways, moving on.13:26
sonuI shall connect with you offline on this topic thanks.13:26
claudiub# os-brick status13:26
claudiubsonu: cool. :)13:26
claudiubso, there are 2 patches that needs to land in os-brick:13:27
claudiub# link
claudiubthis already has a +2, which is nice.13:27
claudiubthis one doesn't have any +2s :(13:28
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claudiubreally hope everything gets in asap.13:28
claudiubso we can move on with the nova fibre channel patches.13:29
sagar_nikamanybody hpe that i need to request for review on os-brick patches ?13:30
claudiubhemna. :)13:30
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claudiub# topic OVS13:31
claudiub#topic OVS13:31
*** openstack changes topic to "OVS (Meeting topic: hyper-v)"13:31
claudiubso, there's a new blog post that you might like:13:31
claudiubshould be interesting13:32
domi007:) I've seen this while in progress, good stuff, it works great in our env13:32
claudiubas for OVS vif plug driver on nova, we're waiting for os-vif to become a dependency in nova.13:32
claudiubdomi007: nice, good to know. :)13:33
domi007the only thing I wasn't able to figure out is how to run VLAN and VXLAN networks simultenously13:33
sonudo you use OVS firewall driver now with this?13:33
sagar_nikamclaudiub: some months in IRC meeting, we discussed about microsoft certification for OVS, anything happened on that ?13:34
claudiubatuvenie: ^13:34
claudiubhmm, alexpilotti? ^13:34
sonuor we should continue using WMI (or MI rather) driver13:34
domi007atuvenie told me she is working on trying to make the secgroups MI driver work on Liberty13:34
domi007on Mitaka I heard it works thanks to sonu13:34
claudiubyeah, I think its because of the enhanced rpc blueprint. :)13:35
claudiubsonu: thanks for the blueprint. :)13:35
domi007it doesn't work for us on Liberty, getting OVS running needed some cherry-picking as well - mainly because the windows OVS driver wasn't complete and working in Liberty13:35
alexpilottisorry folks, I'm jumping through meetings13:35
alexpilottisagar_nikam: we started that process a few days ago13:35
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sagar_nikamalexpilotti: thanks.. let us know how it goes13:36
alexpilottisagar_nikam: sure, it will take some time to process, I'll keep you guys updated of course!13:37
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claudiubdomi007: as for the vlan and vxlan networks, I haven't tried it yet.13:38
claudiubdomi007: simultanously.13:38
sagar_nikamclaudiub: any plans for DVR ?13:38
domi007claudiub: they supposed to work, I'll try to adapt settings from KVM hosts to see if it works13:38
sonuDVR is heavy lifting for Hyper-V13:38
claudiubdomi007: sure, let us know how it goes. :)13:39
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sonuDVR works on namespaces on Linux compute. We must evolve something equivalent on Windows.13:39
claudiubsonu: getting the neutron l3-agent to work properly on Windows is gonig to be tricky. :)13:40
sonuyes, But we should have this in roadmap, since sooner we will need it13:41
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claudiubindeed. we'll look at it once we finish all our work in progress blueprints.13:42
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sonuclaudiub: sure13:42
claudiubany other topic you guys want to discuss?13:42
sonuone question13:43
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sonuFrom the source, I see that we handle multiple physnet scenario in Hyper-V.13:43
claudiub#topic open discussion13:43
sonumeaning physnet:br1, physnet2:b213:43
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sonuso all VMs on physnet1 goes over uplink on br113:44
sonuand on physnet2 goes over uplink on br213:44
sonuthis is a classic use case in Linux KVM..13:44
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sonuand using our bridge mapping on hyperv neutron.conf, we can set the physnet and bridge mapping13:45
sonuand Ia m hoping that this is a supported scenario to test. correct?13:45
sonuwe were finding some issues. So wanted blessing to continue our debugging :)13:45
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claudiubwhat issues exactly?13:46
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claudiubI assume it's networking-hyperv, right?13:46
sonuVms on one physnet cannot reach out.13:46
sonuyes it is networking-hyperv.13:46
sonuWe will investigate and root cause the problem tomorrow.13:46
domi007I have two little questions as well: when adding a second SMB backend to cinder the following error message can be seen in the log: probably originating from this call
domi007the second is: have you heard anything from c64cosmin about freerdp?13:47
claudiubsonu: do those VMs get an IP?13:47
sonuno they don't13:47
claudiubc64cosmin: hi. :)13:47
c64cosminhi guys13:47
domi007hello :)13:48
c64cosminI'm just waiting to get my PR merged :)13:48
claudiubdomi007: that's a very weird error13:48
sagar_nikamc64cosmin: what is the fix for ?13:48
c64cosminseveral fixes13:49
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domi007claudiub: I agree, it should work just fine with any number of backends I guess13:49
sagar_nikamc64cosmin: once they are merged, can we have a MSI in stable branch, our QA can pick and test13:49
c64cosminsagar_nikam: totally13:50
claudiubdomi007: yeah, I would assume so. what backends did you configure?13:50
domi007claudiub: I have the config file here, got it from a colleague, could it be caused because of having the same mount point base?
sagar_nikamc64cosmin:let me know when the MSI is ready, we pick it up13:50
domi007sagar_nikam, c64cosmin +113:50
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sagar_nikamc64cosmin: if deb is available, we can pick and test that as well... i know that is in plans... we can try both MSI and deb13:51
c64cosminsagar_nikam: in your case, the deb might be useful13:52
sagar_nikamdomi007: how is your tests going with freerdp behind haproxy ?13:52
claudiubdomi007: it might be possible, actually.13:52
sagar_nikamc64cosmin: yes eagerly waiting for deb... can test as soon as it is available13:52
domi007sagar_nikam: I decided to wait for the new MSI, currently busy with networking and this SMB issue13:53
claudiubdomi007: do you have a full log by any chance?13:53
c64cosminsagar_nikam: as I said last week, you and domi007 will be anounced directly when available :)13:53
domi007claudiub: I'll try to create one and get it to you, thanks13:53
claudiubwondering if lpetrut knows more about this.13:53
sagar_nikamdomi007: i think you should try deb and haproxy instead of MSI and haproxy13:53
domi007c64cosmin: really appreciate it13:53
claudiubdomi007: sure, I'll let him know.13:53
sagar_nikamc64cosmin: thanks13:54
domi007sagar_nikam: it doesn't make a difference, I can try the deb as well, we have Ubuntu machines running as controller nodes13:54
c64cosminthank you13:54
claudiubsonu: still here?13:55
sagar_nikamalexpilloti: claudiub: how are the tests going with WIN 201613:55
sagar_nikami believe we cant run MSI on it13:55
claudiubsagar_nikam: really? why?13:55
sagar_nikami remember reading it somewhere on the net that it will not be supported13:56
claudiubsagar_nikam: we had a lot of tempest test runs on win 2016 until now.13:56
claudiubfor each cycle and release.13:56
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sagar_nikamcluadiub: installed on WIN2016 using MSI ?13:56
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claudiubwhat exactly is the issue?13:57
claudiubis there any error, or?13:57
claudiubcan you provide the installer logs?13:57
sagar_nikamclaudiub: not tried it.. just read it13:57
sagar_nikamclaudiub: can you provide me the location from where i can download the latest TP of WIN201613:58
claudiubnp. :)13:58
domi007claudiub: maybe this: "Nano Server does not include MSI as an installation technology due to dependencies"
sagar_nikami meant nano server13:59
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sagar_nikamof WIN 210613:59
sagar_nikamsorry i should have been more clear13:59
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sagar_nikamhave you tried tests on nano ?14:00
domi007np my Googleing was fruitful anyway :)14:00
sagar_nikamhow does it work ?14:00
claudiubdomi007: oh, i see what you mean. for nano, you cannot use a msi14:00
sagar_nikamclaudiub: yes, we cant use MSI14:00
claudiubanyways, we have to end the meeting. :)14:01
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sagar_nikamthank you all14:01
claudiubthanks for joining. :)14:02
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openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 14:02:06 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)14:02
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rhochmuth#startmeeting monasca15:00
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 15:00:52 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is rhochmuth. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'monasca'15:00
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igornhi \o15:01
rhochmuthagenda is at,
rhochmuth1. Discuss mid-cycle15:02
rhochmuth2. Discuss adding the ability to publish logs to Kafka topics based on a list of dimension filters and keystone roles. For example, if operational logs and audit logs need to be stored in separate Kafka topics (TSV - HPE)15:02
rhochmuth3. Reviews:15:02
rhochmuth (agent hang fix)15:02
rhochmuth (kv hint)15:02
rhochmuth4. Deterministic alarms 15:02
rhochmuth5. Periodic notifications15:02
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rhochmuthSo, it looks like i can travel to wherever we decide to host15:02
rhochmuththe mid-cycle15:02
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rhochmuthbut, from last week, it looks like we can't all travel to the same location at the same time15:03
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rhochmuthand for the most part it was split down the center15:03
bkleiwill probably need to allow virtual either way15:03
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rhochmuthi think my preference is to run it all remote this time around15:04
rhochmuthinclusivity is more important to me15:04
sloganworks for me15:04
bkleiok with me too15:04
rhochmuthand it is hard to justify travel for just half the team15:04
rhochmuthafter the barcelona summit the mid-cycles will be predefined15:05
rhochmuthby the openstack organization15:05
rhochmuthand i think at that point everyone should push hard to make the design summits15:05
sloganI was against travel, but now that the TSA has vastly been improved....15:05
rhochmuthi think the date is sometime in february15:05
rhochmuthand forgot where15:05
jayahnglad to hear TSA has been improved.15:06
rhochmuthso, unless anyone objects, let's do another remote mid-cycle in july15:06
rhochmuthwe just need to decide on the week15:06
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hosanailet's fight against time zone :-)15:06
rhochmuthwell, we can also mixup the mid-cycles to do half morning15:07
rhochmuthhalf night15:07
rhochmuthso folks in Asia time-zone are taken care of too15:07
rhochmuthare any of the weeks preferable?15:08
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bkleieither works for me -- 7/18 or 7/2515:08
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rhochmuthwell, let's wrap up on the date next week15:09
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rhochmuthnot everyone is here15:09
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rhochmuthand maybe we can modify the doodle15:09
bkleigood idea15:10
rhochmuthok, so i'll close on this for now, and move on to agenda15:10
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rhochmuthtsv: are u here?15:10
rhochmuth#topic logging api15:11
*** openstack changes topic to "logging api (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:11
rhochmuththe floor is yours15:11
tsv_i wanted to discuss adding support for publish logs to specific kafka topics based on filter criteria (using dimensions)15:12
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tsv_this is to differentiate audit logs from operational logs, for example, where the topic retention could be different for audit logs15:12
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tomasztrebskiso instead of single topic in api - rather multiple topics detected from logs or fallback to default ?15:13
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rhochmuthso, basically we could use a diemsion such as log_type = log or audit15:13
tsv_sdake, i see we already have support for multiple topics, but cannot filter15:13
rhochmuthand audit logs would end-up on a separate topic15:14
tomasztrebskiyes - there are multiple topics supported but all messages goes for all topics15:14
tomasztrebskias you mentioned - that's not selective15:14
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rhochmuthaudit topic would potentailly have a different retention period15:14
slogansounds like a nice idea15:14
rhochmuthso, i think the idea is pretty simple, and justification and pretty clear15:14
rhochmuththanks tomasztrebski15:15
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kamil_and who will consume this new topics?15:15
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tsv_kamil, in our implementation, logstash filter would read from this topic and forward to a different Elasticsearch index15:16
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kamil_could you not filter directly in kibana?15:17
kojiyou mean that the difference between the audit log and current log is only the retention, right?15:17
tomasztrebskiI think thay could but that does not resolve problem of retention15:17
tsv_koji, if Kafka security is enabled, the ACLs could be different too15:17
rhochmuthi think there are multiple differences, with retention being probably the main motification15:18
kamil_tomasztrebski, yeah that's true15:18
kojiat first, i thought that you propose the feature for the customer, like cloud trail of AWS15:18
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rhochmuthno, this is all internal15:19
kojiok, thank you15:19
tsv_tomasztrebski, why do you say that ? kafka supports per topic retention settings right ?15:19
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kamil_tsv: tomasztrebski was answering my question15:20
tomasztrebskiI am just thinking on using dimensions for that15:20
tsv_kamil, got it thanks15:20
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tomasztrebskiif that's the routing - perhaps more verbose approach and simple add routing property into the log15:21
tomasztrebskialso Kamil - there's a question of an idea of log-metrics where logs needs to go through particular topic in order to be transformed into metrics if certain severity happens15:22
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rhochmuthtomasztrebski: are you proposing that we add a spefic field, or just use dimensions15:23
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kamil_a think a field is easier to analyze in logstash15:24
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sloganalmost seems like it might be a better thing as a field15:24
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sloganbut only because when I think of dimensions, I think of metadata about my metric, not details about how it is handled15:25
rhochmuthslogan: agree15:25
jayahni agree on that, might be better as a field.15:25
rhochmuththe dimensions have been really about identity15:25
sloganif we find the need for more control data, perhaps there is some other thing that is a sibling to dimensions for that15:25
rhochmuthso, a "type" field might be preferred15:25
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tomasztrebskiin metrics there is value_meta, but I don't think that's suitable15:26
rhochmuthtomasztrebski: agree15:26
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sloganor "handling": { "type": xyz, "retention": abc, ...}15:26
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slogansomething like that15:27
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tsv_in addition to the field (or dimension), don't we also need a keystone role ? for example, if we want to restrict write access to the audit topic ?15:28
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rhochmuthnot sure we need a role, but that could be a separate discussion15:29
rhochmuthso, i would like to get to rest of agenda15:29
tsv_rhochmuth, ok15:29
rhochmuthtsv: can you submite  blueprint15:29
tsv_thanks, sure will do15:29
tomasztrebskialso I think that that might suit monasa-common quite nice, if you don't see any objections15:29
rhochmuththen we can discuss, comment further15:29
tomasztrebskioh...ok sorry, I didn't see that we are done with this for now...sry15:30
tsv_tomasztrebski: sure, thanks all for the support15:30
rhochmuthi'm rushing us through15:30
kamil_please distribute the blueprint to us. thx15:30
rhochmuthi think a field is the general concensus15:30
rhochmuththen slogan's idea is a good one too15:30
tsv_rhochmuth: ok15:31
rhochmuthpossibly making it a dictionary to allow for additional attributes15:31
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rhochmuthalthough, i would prefer calling the new field something like attributes, rather than handling15:31
sloganor just "meta"15:31
rhochmuthbut, in gneral, i think we hace some concensus/direction15:32
rhochmuthmeta, also might be nice15:32
rhochmuthok, need to move on15:32
rhochmuth#topic reviews15:32
*** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:32
rhochmuth (agent hang fix)15:32
bkleithat's me -- how do you guys think that's looking?15:33
rhochmuthso, i think this is ready for merging15:33
rhochmuththere are several +1's from the hpe tam15:33
rbrndttested it over the weekend, didn't see any errors or missing metrics15:33
rhochmuthtomasz: you had looked at earlier15:33
rhochmuthare you ok with a merge?15:33
bkleigood to hear, we are hitting that bug a bunch, but we deployed that fix on a staging node, no hangs yet15:33
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rhochmuththanks rbrndt15:33
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tomasztrebskiI've had it running for 3 days and never saw anything that would suggest that agent has stopped15:34
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rhochmuthtomasztrebski: thx for all the testing15:34
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rhochmuthtomasztrebski: if you +1, i'll merge it15:35
rhochmuthso, related to that review, we had talked about multi-processing/threading the plugins15:35
rhochmuthso all plugins would run as their own thread/process15:36
rhochmuthbklei: are you planning on continuing with that development15:36
rhochmuthor is this an area where the joe/michael would work on?15:36
bkleii'm not sure about that rhochmuth -- i thought that was joe15:36
tomasztrebskiI think that the idea is in overall very good - to sandbox each plugin15:37
rbakYeah, I think the plan was for Joe to take over from here15:37
bkleijoe ok with that?15:37
rhochmuthok, i don't think joe is here, but will follow-up with him and hoppal15:37
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rhochmuthi think he is ok, just the time thing15:37
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rhochmuthtomasztrebski: agree15:38
rhochmuthok, so will close on this topic, merge current code, and hoe/hoppal to follow-up15:38
bkleicool, thx15:38
rhochmuth (kv hint)15:39
bkleime again -- i think this one's been sitting a while15:39
rhochmuthso, i'll need to take another look, but it sounds like you think it is ready for a merge15:39
rhochmuthwill try and review again today15:39
bkleiyeah -- ryanb did some testing, didn't see any improvement, but didn't hurt either15:39
bkleisorta taking vertica support at their word15:40
rhochmuthbut it is hard to test know in this case15:40
rhochmuthso, agree, if vertica recommends, then we should enable15:40
rhochmuthhopefully you'll see an improvemnt if prod15:40
bkleithat's what i'm operating on15:40
rhochmuth#topic Deterministic alarms 15:40
*** openstack changes topic to "Deterministic alarms  (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:40
rhochmuthtomasztrebski: looks like  some code is ready for merging15:41
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tomasztrebskimonasca-common here is ready to merge IMHO and without it I cannot proceed with thresh and api15:41
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rbrndtI notice thresh failed with the current common changes15:42
rbrndtand I tried building locally with the same result15:42
tomasztrebskifor api - I've just fixed one last issue with tempests so that should be fine as well, thresh and ui are finished for me as well15:42
rbrndtdon't know if the error is in the thresh or common change though15:42
tomasztrebskihmm...I haven't looked at thresh that much assuming that lack of certain fields in model is causing that issue15:43
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tomasztrebskiand looking at log from gate right now it looks like that actually the problem15:43
tomasztrebskifor instance: cannot find symbol 2016-05-20 13:01:00.659 | [INFO]   symbol:   method isDeterministic()15:44
rhochmuthso, if common is merged, gate should pass15:45
rhochmuthas your review for common i'm assuming adds isDeterminstic15:45
rhochmuthis that correct"15:45
tomasztrebskithat and couple other things like grammar15:46
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rhochmuthrbrndt: is it possible your local build didn't get installed into maven repo?15:46
rbrndti can try building again, perhaps it was misaligned15:47
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rhochmuthi think you need to pull monasa-common, and then mvn install15:47
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rbrndtyeah, I did that15:47
rhochmuthso, i'll let you reverify and then see if we can resolve15:48
rhochmuthif resolved, then will merge15:48
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rhochmuthtomasztrebski: sound good?15:48
rhochmuthso, will wait for all clear from rbrndt15:48
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rhochmuthshould we move on15:50
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rhochmuthsorry, just checking if we can close for now, and move on next topic15:51
tomasztrebskii have nothing to add, will reverify that my self as well and post a comment with my results15:51
rhochmuthtomasztrebski: thx15:51
rhochmuth#topic Periodic notifications15:52
*** openstack changes topic to "Periodic notifications (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:52
rhochmuthso, mhoppal, what is status15:52
rhochmuthand is this ready for merging, presumably15:52
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mhoppalthe api review15:52
mhoppalis ready for reviews15:52
rhochmuthor more development required15:52
mhoppaland merging15:52
mhoppalthe client, ui and notification15:52
mhoppalhave some comments to address15:53
rhochmuthok, thanks15:53
mhoppalclient should be ready today15:53
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rhochmuthwill move on, just wanted to give folks a heads-up on that bit of work since it is a new feature too15:53
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rhochmuth#topic open15:54
*** openstack changes topic to "open (Meeting topic: monasca)"15:54
rhochmuthwe have about 5 minutes left15:54
FlintHPEmay I put in a quick shameless plug for the Monasca-Transform review (  ;-)15:54
rhochmuthFlintHPE: thansk for reminder15:54
rhochmuthturns out i didnt' have +2 privs15:54
rhochmuthwill get that today and merge15:54
rhochmuthsorry about delay15:55
FlintHPEno worries15:55
shinya_kwbtI wrote blue print about monasca-ui pagination style.
rhochmuththanks shinya_kwbt15:56
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shinya_kwbtTo adopt horizon pagination style needs to api sort option.15:56
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shinya_kwbtneeds to chanage sort option or add new option.15:57
rhochmuthso sorry, i didn't review, but i'll review, and we should discuss next week15:57
rhochmuthdoes that sound ok15:57
rhochmuthso, this can be first topic next week15:58
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rhochmuthrbrndt: you''ll want to review this one too15:58
rhochmuthso, time has almost up again15:59
rhochmuthany last gasp topoics15:59
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rhochmuthi keep thinking we need more time16:00
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rhochmuthi have a meeting after this, but i'll be in the monasca room16:00
rhochmuthgoing to close down the meeting16:00
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rhochmuththanks everyone16:00
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hosanaithanks & bye16:00
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rhochmuthbye hosanai, koji16:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:01
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 16:01:12 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:01
openstackMinutes (text):
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markvoelker#startmeeting defcore16:01
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 16:01:26 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is markvoelker. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'defcore'16:01
markvoelker#chair hogepodge16:01
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openstackCurrent chairs: hogepodge markvoelker16:01
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gemao/ (can only stay until half past)16:01
markvoelker#info agenda:
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shamailHi all.16:01
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markvoelker#link Today's agenda:
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markvoelkerOk folks, let's dive right in....16:02
markvoelker#topic I'm baaaaaaaack16:02
*** openstack changes topic to "I'm baaaaaaaack (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:02
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gemamarkvoelker: welcome back!16:02
markvoelkerThanks hogepodge for running the meeting while I was traveling the past couple of weeks!16:02
hogepodgehi markvoelker!16:02
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dwalleckwelcome back!16:03
Rockyggema, I haven't gotten to the review yet :-(16:03
markvoelkerJust FYI, I did a talk on interop for the China Open Source Cloud League while I was in China and they're quite interested in what we're doing. =)16:03
shamailWelcome back markvoelker and thanks hogepodge16:03
gemaRockyg: don't worry, now it is a slightly different doc, hopefully better :D16:03
markvoelker#topic Pending TC Resolutions16:03
*** openstack changes topic to "Pending TC Resolutions (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:03
gemaRockyg: I will be off next week, so next meeting for me is in 2 weeks16:03
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markvoelkerMostly just a heads-up if folks aren't aware, but there are a couple of DefCore-related TC resolutions winding their way though gerrit16:04
markvoelker#link Add resolution explaining which tests we think defcore should use
Rockygmark, next time you go to China, we can probably arrange a talk through Huawei, too.  Sponsor a meetup or some such.  Same offer to the rest of you16:04
markvoelker#link Add resolution asking defcore committee to avoid using proxy APIs in tests
markvoelkerRockyg: sure.  Probably won't be going back till next spring, but ya never know. =)16:05
Rockyggema, cool.  Gives me some time.  Life iss currently exciting here.16:05
markvoelker#topic Glance Import Refactor FYI16:06
*** openstack changes topic to "Glance Import Refactor FYI (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:06
hogepodgemarkvoelker: on the previous topic16:06
markvoelkerhogepodge: go ahead16:06
hogepodgemarkvoelker: would it make sense to flag the proxy tests when 2016.08 lands to encourage the direct APIs, as a response to the pending TC resolution?16:07
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hogepodgedeprecate, etc16:07
hogepodge(assuming the resolution passes)16:07
markvoelkerWell, I think it would make sense to let the TC debate the resolution and see if lands before we take action. =)16:07
hogepodgenaturally, but thinking ahead16:07
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markvoelkerBut assuming it does, we should probably look at rescoring those with future direction set to 016:07
hogepodgethe proxies have been sources of problems for us regardless16:08
RockygYeah.  The future direction is definitely away from those.16:08
VanL_Why not just deprecate the proxy API tests (assuming 1. This passes, 2. We agree)16:08
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hogepodgea year in, they haven't been fixed (esp the image calls)16:08
hogepodgeVanL_: deprecation works too16:09
hogepodgedo both, as a clear signal16:09
RockygWell, the image stuff has been slow to get changed/accepted....16:09
catherineDhogepodge: these tests are currently flagged .  Right?16:09
VanL_These are clearly not the right direction, and we don't want to bake in that *every cloud* has to have them if we are trying to get rid of them16:09
hogepodgecatherineD: not all of the proxy tests are flagged16:10
shamailVanL_: +116:10
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dwalleckI agree with markvoelker about making sure the TC resolution lands, but when it does the path  VanL_ and hogepodge said makes sense16:11
shamailhogepodge: do we need to take an action to flag them?16:11
catherineDhogepodge: do we have vendors failing the un-flagged tests ?16:11
VanL_Don't just flag them, remove them.16:11
hogepodgecatherineD: yes16:11
Rockygwe are seeing that the prod devs are making decisions based on current features and imposing them on current supported versions (sort of backporting directions)16:11
markvoelkerWell, flagging is thing we could do that has effect on Board-approved Guidelines.  Deprecation would get them out of future Guidelines.16:12
markvoelkerSo I think the answer isn't one or the other.16:12
catherineDhogepodge: so those vendors could not certified for powered logo ... I think we do have to at least flag them ...16:12
shamailI guess should they.16:12
Rockygfor us, we are still on juno, but will move to Mitaka, so already only v3 on Keystone.  Problem with the 2015.07 tests...16:12
catherineDmarkvoelker: do we need to flag before deprecate?16:13
shamailShould we flag for now (pending resolution) and then remove them eventually?16:13
markvoelkercatherineD: no.  The two are independent.  You can do one, the other, or both.16:13
shamailWhat catherineD said :)16:13
RockygWell flagging seems our version of deprecating...16:13
catherineDmarkvoelker: so we can go from required to deprecate ..16:14
hogepodgeRockyg: we do both. deprecation for one cycle is required to remove capabilities16:14
markvoelkercatherineD: yes16:14
Rockygcompanies who move forward won't be caught by old direction tests.16:14
dwalleckWell, flagging could be seen to imply that the test could be fixed16:14
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VanL_I'd vote for deprecation.16:14
shamailGood point dwalleck16:14
hogepodgedwalleck: flags are supposed to have reasons and resolutions, which range from fixing the test to removing the test16:14
markvoelkerdwalleck: We could just cite D400 when flagging it16:14
RockygOr removed if not fixed16:15
markvoelkerE.g. it does not meet Criteria16:15
shamailI agree with VanL_ if the options are independent.16:15
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VanL_We have an opportunity here before we put forward the next guideline16:16
hogepodgeshamail: flagging removes problematic tests from the enforced standards, deprecation is a signal that capabilities will be removed16:16
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hogepodgeshamail: so yes, I'm in favor of doing both16:16
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markvoelkerVanL_: Yeah, I imagine the TC will vote on the resolution well before we send the next Guideline to the Board in a few months16:17
shamailThanks for the explanation.16:17
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markvoelkerVanL_: so once they vote on it, I would have no problem with someone proposing deprecation16:17
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markvoelkerVanL_: and proposing flags against current Guidelines, for that matter16:17
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markvoelkerOk folks, sounds like we have general agreement that once the TC votes on that resolution we want to respond accordingly.  Ready to move to next topic?16:18
Rockyghow aoubt an agreement line for minutes?16:19
hogepodgethanks markvoelker16:19
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Rockygor info...16:19
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markvoelker#agreed Once the TC votes on the aforementioned resolutions, we should respond in current and forthcoming Guidelines16:19
catherineDmarkvoelker: I think  for approved guidelines the test should be flagged ... for future guidelines tests should be deprecate16:19
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markvoelkercatherineD: correct16:20
markvoelkerOk, moving on16:20
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markvoelker#topic Glance Import Refactor FYI16:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Glance Import Refactor FYI (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:20
markvoelkerRockyg sent a note about this to the list as well, but just thought we'd highlight it here as well since several of you have been involved in that conversation16:21
markvoelker#link image import refactor spec
markvoelkerA meeting has been proposed for May 26 at 15:00 UTC if you'd like to attend.  Don't think the venue was set last time I looked at the thread...16:21
* markvoelker checks16:21
catherineDseems like only 10 slots for the meeting16:22
Rockygcould happen in meeting-cp16:22
markvoelkerLooks like it'll be at
markvoelkerMore info here:
markvoelker#link  Image IMport Refactor Sync Meeting Info
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markvoelkerAnything else on this topic before we move on?16:23
hogepodgenikhil:do you have more info on how to join the meeting?16:24
markvoelkerhogepodge: see link above16:24
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markvoelkerOk, moving on...16:25
markvoelker#topic Open Reviews16:25
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Reviews (Meeting topic: defcore)"16:25
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markvoelkerWe have several reviews open for DefCore and a few DefCore-related reviews open elsewhere (including the TC resolutions above)16:26
markvoelkerLet's take a few minutes to run down the list and see if we need to talk through anything in the meeting.  If not, that's fine too.16:26
markvoelker#link Remove test lists and generators, update procedures
markvoelkerThis one looks ready to land and is pretty non-controversial.  Anything to discuss here?16:27
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hogepodgeI'm ready for it to be merged if there's agreement16:27
dwalleckLooks reasonable16:28
markvoelkerOk.  Let's move on then.16:28
catherineDI will need to send a patch to flag a few tests in the advisory section that still require 2 users16:28
catherineDafter that patch is merged16:28
hogepodgeI've made changes to refstack-client, and interop page to reflect the changes16:28
markvoelkercatherineD: ok16:29
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markvoelkerhogepodge: thanks16:29
markvoelker#link Added formal 1.5 json schema for gating against
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markvoelkerhogepodge: I started looking at this one this morning (still digging out from under my travel backlog) and will finish up this afternoon16:30
catherineDmarkvoelker: for this one please refstack will need to update the website before DefCore merge this one16:30
markvoelkercatherineD: we'll make sure not to merge until refstack is ready16:30
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catherineDmarkvoelker: thx16:30
* gema goes out of the room without making too much noise, see you guys in two weeks (please keep sending comments on the spec, there is a new version to review/comment on)16:31
hogepodgethere's an associated patch to make it gating16:31
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Rockygbye, gema!16:31
catherineDplease review this one on RefStack for 1.5 schema support
shamailSee you gema16:31
hogepodgethanks gema, have a nice vacation16:32
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shamailNewbie question: does DefCore actively review these changes during the meeting or just compile a list so we can review before end of the week?16:32
markvoelkercatherineD: hogepodge: thanks, added both to the etherpad16:32
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markvoelkershamail: most of the reviewing happens offline in gerrit, but sometimes it's useful to discuss individual items while we're together.16:33
Rockyghghlight the list needing review, shamail16:33
markvoelkerAnything else on this change?16:33
hogepodgemy main concern with the patch is if we need to do linting since the schema kind of already does that16:33
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shamailThanks, seemed like a lot to read/absorb in the meeting itself. :)16:33
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markvoelkerhogepodge: you mean the gate check?16:34
hogepodgeyeah. I do a schema check and a lint check16:34
hogepodgeI wasn't seeing other projects using the linting library16:35
hogepodgethat I pull in with that patch. Just something to think about16:35
markvoelkerhogepodge: Hmm.  Ok, I'll look that over this afternoon too then.16:35
markvoelkerNext up, another schema change...16:35
markvoelker#link Introduce target_programs definition
markvoelkerThis one seems to have gone a bit cold, so could use some reviews16:36
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hogepodgeI'll add a review that it needs a formal schema16:37
dwalleckI'll take a look at it this afternoon16:37
markvoelkerhogepodge: ++, I don't think we'd started that work when this was initially proposed16:37
markvoelkerBut would definitely be good to have going forward16:38
catherineDMore important is to discuss whether DefCore support non-defcore guidelines at RefStack for poublic view16:38
hogepodgeMy feeling is that refstack needs to finish up work to support DefCore, which is the project mandate. There's usefulness in allowing projects to define guidelines to help with future defcore direction. Heat immediately comes to mind16:39
markvoelkercatherineD: Agree that's an important conversation, but I think this change is a smaller scope.  Is there a refstack review on that somewhere we should be contributing to?16:40
catherineDhogepodge: agree.  I think the intention to prepare for introducing none defcore or openstack target programs16:41
Rockyghogepodge, the mandate is DefCore, but the founders and original core all had the greater interop test sets as the goal.16:42
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catherineDmarkvoelker: not yet for this schema version ... we only have a ptach for hogepodge: 's version 1.516:42
RockygBut, yes, inital focus was defcore16:42
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markvoelkercatherineD: ok thanks16:42
* markvoelker glances at clock16:43
Rockygis defcore, but we need to keep the greater mission in mind for the design16:43
shamailRockyg: +116:43
markvoelkerAnything else on this particular patch?16:44
hogepodgeIt's the project mission, and it's currently a work in progress fulfilling that mission.16:46
RockygYeah.  The yaml file does not capture the mission that was put together before the yaml files were uesed.16:46
hogepodgeRockyg: that was that statement that was conditional for the project to be accepted into the big tent. It is deliberate and meaningful16:47
markvoelkerI suggest that we take mission-statement-of-refstack discussions up with the refstack folks elsewhere in the interest of time. =)16:47
markvoelker#link compute-image flags were not carried to 2015.07
dwalleckmarkvoelker: +1, good discussion to have though16:47
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markvoelkerhogepodge: do we have bugs filed on the implicit deps here yet?16:48
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markvoelkerhogepodge: also, I guess since we're getting rid of the guideline directories and lists we can probably drop those from the patchset...16:48
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hogepodgemarkvoelker: no, I can do it this afternoon16:48
markvoelkerhogepodge: awesome, thanks16:49
markvoelkerAny other discussion on this one?16:49
hogepodgemarkvoelker: sure, it'll need a rebase16:49
markvoelker#link Add simple test for Neutron GET /
markvoelkerThis one's actually in Tempest, but it's a test being proposed because we wanted to include a Capability and found it didn't have a test16:50
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markvoelkerSeems like the general logic has been ok'd, so I can probably work up a similar thing for Glance this week16:50
markvoelkerOk, next couple have to do with admin creds in the networking tests...16:51
markvoelker#link Remove network port tests that requires admin credentials
hogepodgemarkvoelker: more of my backlog work items16:51
markvoelker#link Remove capabilities due to tests required admin credentials
hogepodgehopefully I can get to looking over the network tests tomorrow and Friday16:52
catherineDI think we should merge this one since those tests already been flagged in the next.json16:52
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dwalleckhogepodge: Do we have the go ahead from the Neutron team to rework these tests?16:52
markvoelkerhogepodge: Ok, awesome.  I was going to start poking at those probably next week-ish if nobody else had that on their plate as I think we definitely want to get those fixed up16:52
catherineDit would take time to fix .... meanwhile we should flag them so the users do not have to spend time debug16:53
hogepodgedwalleck: I don't have enough information to make an ask16:53
dwalleckhogepodge: Good point, neither do I :-) I've looked at them but I don't fully understand if those scenarios can be done without admin creds16:54
catherineDdwalleck: hogepodge: it would take time from investoigating for solution and actually fix them ..16:54
hogepodgecatherineD: I'll +1 with recommendations by the end of the day. Is that reasonable16:54
markvoelkercatherineD: these tests currently aren't required anyway, right?16:54
markvoelkerE.g. they were advisory in 2016.0116:55
catherineDmarkvoelker: right but some users looks forward for next required test also look at advisory tests16:55
catherineDthey are flagged in the required section of the next.json16:55
markvoelkercatherineD: I'm not sure removing them is a good idea if we think they can be fixed up to not require admin credentials.  By removing them completely we'd have to start the advisory cycle all over again.16:56
catherineDmarkvoelker: not removing --> flag them I mean this patch
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catherineDsorry my mistake16:57
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hogepodgecatherineD: sometimes admin tests are really easy to fix. I just need to check the endpoint to see if admin is required for the operation.16:57
catherineDI would rework the patch to flag them16:57
hogepodgeI should have done it last week16:57
markvoelkerDoesn't that patch remove them though?16:58
hogepodgeit's usually a matter of changing the client type, the test remain the same16:58
markvoelkerOh, you're saying remove the tests, not the capability16:58
catherineDmarkvoelker: yes it does ... my mistake16:58
catherineDlet me rework both patches to flag the tests16:58
markvoelkercatherineD: cool16:58
markvoelkerOk, last couple of minutes here folks16:59
markvoelker#link Fix Criteria defs in next.json
markvoelkerNothing much to say on that one, just a sync with the definitions we already agreed on16:59
markvoelkerWe're about out of time...thanks folks!  See you in #openstack-defcore17:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:00
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 17:00:30 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:00
openstackMinutes (text):
alaski#startmeeting nova_cells17:00
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 17:00:48 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is alaski. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"17:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'nova_cells'17:00
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alaskismall crowd, but let's get going17:01
alaski#topic Testing17:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Testing (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"17:01
alaskino cellsv1 breaks that I know of17:01
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alaskiauggy has kindly offered to work on cellsv2 testing17:02
alaskishe was researching what it would take to get a grenade job going on that17:02
doffmThanks auggy.17:02
* bauzas waves a bit late17:03
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alaskione point of interest that came up was whether we encourage deployers to migrate as part of an upgrade, or after17:03
alaskiand should grenade test M->N plus migrate, or N->N plus migrate17:03
alaskiI leaned towards thinking that deployers will want to do it in two steps17:04
alaskiso they would migrate to N, then at some later point migrate to cells17:04
melwittthat's my thought as well17:04
bauzasthat depends on if we want to support deployers not yet using cells v217:04
alaskibauzas: so far I've been working under that assumption17:04
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bauzasso, the question is : should we accept to have operators deploying Newton without using cells v2 ?17:05
alaskiand I don't think there's anything to prevent migrating to cells during an upgrade, but that won't be the tested/recommended path17:05
alaskibauzas: yes, I think so17:06
bauzasand then, the correlated question is: if we accept Newton deployments without cells v2, should we deprecate it for Ocata then ?17:06
doffmYes. We don't want that to go on too long.17:06
alaskiI would like to put a hard cut off for O17:06
bauzasokay, so the point is17:06
alaskii.e. must migrate to cellsv2 before upgrade to O17:06
bauzasokay, so we answered the question you had17:07
doffmAbsolutely. We (developers) are at some point going to make assumptions that cellsv2 is set up.17:07
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bauzasie. grenade for M-N and then N->N + cells V217:07
alaskibauzas: yep. we all seem to be on the same page17:07
bauzassaying that at the GA for Ocata, all the deployers will be using cellsv217:08
alaskidoffm: that will make some code much easier, right now I have conditionals everywhere17:08
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doffmThe migration code is basically all conditionals.17:08
bauzas(ie. at least running the main command)17:08
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bauzasI mean the one-for-all command17:08
bauzasokay, I'm fine17:09
alaskithe assumption I would like to make is that instance and host mappings are all set up17:09
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alaskicool, let's move on17:09
alaski#topic Open Reviews17:09
*** openstack changes topic to "Open Reviews (Meeting topic: nova_cells)"17:09
alaskibe better than me and try to keep that updated :)17:10
doffmI haven't put it on the etherpad. (I will) but bauzas had some questions about:
doffmBasically I think there is a race condition when migrating and updating at the same time.17:10
doffmI'll put additional comments up, but would like feedback on how best to proceed.17:10
bauzasyeah it was my question17:10
alaskiokay, I will need to read through it17:11
dansmithI haven't looked, but will17:11
dansmitheither way,17:11
dansmithadmin-only operations that could be racy without damage during an upgrade don't concern me as much17:11
doffmNo, I made that point, no damage caused.17:11
dansmithif it's something a user can do and have issues, that's a probem17:11
alaskigood point17:11
doffmAnd operator only.17:11
bauzasgood point yeah17:11
dansmithbut an admin can follow renos and not do things like that during an upgrade17:12
dansmithor at least, we can blame an admin who doesn't :P17:12
bauzasgiven the aggregate API is an admin one, then please nevermind my question17:12
bauzasbecause I agree with dansmith17:12
alaskiI still want to take a look, but I agree17:12
dansmithyep, and I will17:12
dansmithwe don't want to make too many of those kinds of excuses,17:12
bauzasmeaning that only operators modify the aggregates, so they should know when they migrate17:12
dansmithbut weigh the relative payoff vs. the complexity17:12
doffmI just have to make sure that all the update operations actually fail, rather than write to wrong db successfully.17:13
doffmI think that is the case.17:13
doffmJust have to make sure.17:13
alaskiif we could have an easy check of "migration has started but not completed so all actions fail momentarily" that seems good. but anything more complex may not be worth it17:13
dansmithlike flavors17:14
dansmithanything in api db means no updates17:14
dansmither, anything in either, means no updates17:14
doffmI can add the 'ensure_migrated' check to update ops.17:15
alaski#topic Open Discussion17:15
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bauzascool for me yeah, we could just say "sorry dude, you should know why you have this exception"17:15
auggyo/ hi!17:15
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auggyfor the grenade test, i have been updating the testing etherpad and am currently working on setting up a target devstack17:16
auggyso i will probably have questions ;)17:16
melwittI proposed the devstack transport_url patch before seeing that sileht had one up already
alaskiauggy: great. that should be a good opportunity for documenting things that will help someone getting up to speed on cells17:17
melwitthis doesn't handle the cells v1 case so I was hoping we could merge the two. mine passes the cells job in the experimental queue17:17
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alaskimelwitt: excellent17:18
alaskiI will take a look and comment17:18
melwittcool, thanks17:19
auggyyeah the docs question was going to be the next thing, since i'm basically fresh eyes on this whole process17:19
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alaskiI want to mention something that dansmith, bauzas, and I discussed yesterday but might benefit from further thinking17:20
* dansmith doesn't even know what this is17:20
doffmI have completely forgotten what docs we have. :)17:20
dansmithoh, delete17:20
alaskiauggy: there's a cells doc in the devref that could be updated17:20
alaskidansmith: yep17:20
alaskiit gets even better though17:20
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auggyalaski: ok cool i'll take a look and put together a patch based on my experiences with the grenade/devstack setup17:20
alaskiso instance delete currently blocks all progress on ongoing actions through the expected_task_state check on
alaskibut instance delete when all we have is a buildrequest does not block further actions17:21
alaskilike creating an instance in a cell after scheduling17:21
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alaskiright now my approach is going to be that instance delete removes the buildrequest and instance_mapping if there is no instance in a cell yet, and their existence should be checked when writing to a cell17:22
alaskiwhich mostly works, but might leave a small window for a race17:23
alaskiso if anyone has thoughts on improving that I'm open to suggestions17:23
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doffmThe race would be a very odd failure though. Would the instance possibly boot wile the instance_mapping was empty?17:23
dansmithI'm still missing where there is a race17:24
alaskionce the RPC call goes to a compute the instance_mapping won't matter17:24
dansmithif we create in the cell db before we send the build rpc call, then a delete can hit the instance and block progress the same way it does today17:25
dansmithif we create instance, delete buildreq in that order,17:25
alaskithe delete won't hit the instance until instance_mapping points to it17:25
dansmiththen I would think we can clean up the instance if buildreq is gone, before we do the cast, so we're good17:25
dansmithwe just have to make sure we create and delete things in the right order I think17:26
dansmithmapping, instance, delete buildreq17:26
dansmithshould let us detect the delete before the rpc call I think17:26
alaskiso if we write the instance, confirm buildreq/instancemapping exist,* ,  remap to instance, send RPC17:26
dansmithonce the instance and mapping are in place, then the normal delete procedures will work at any point17:26
alaskithe * is the race I think17:26
dansmithwrite instance, write mapping, delete the buildreq, send rpc17:27
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dansmithif we race at your *,17:28
dansmiththen delete will be re-issue-able, right?17:28
alaskiif we write mapping at the same time as the delete comes through it might remove the buildreq after we check17:28
alaskiyes, the delete is re-issue-able17:28
alaskiso not the worst thing, as long as our data stays consisten17:28
dansmithI don't get that last thing17:28
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dansmithcreate mapping and instance in one transaction,17:29
dansmithdelete the buildreq in another17:29
alaskimapping and instance are in two dbs17:29
dansmithif delete fails because it's missing, then we undo the instance17:29
dansmithokay, right, but it doesn't matter17:29
dansmithcreate the instance first17:29
dansmiththe instance isn't findable until the mapping is there17:30
* bauzas sorry, got distracted17:30
dansmithso mapping in one transaction, delete the buildreq in a separate transaction17:30
dansmithif buildreq is gone, delete the mapping and instance, never send the rpc17:30
dansmithI think we could whiteboard this in PDX and figure out a plan17:30
dansmithnot sure it's worth obsessing over right now17:30
alaskia whiteboard would help17:30
alaskiwe can move on and discuss this outside the meeting, but I wanted to bring it to everyones attention17:31
alaskithere's one further issue17:31
alaskiinstance tags, which can be created at any point in the instance lifecycle17:31
doffmalaski: Is there a patch where this race is introduced... for comments.17:31
alaskias in, when no instance exists17:31
bauzasI just think the instance mapping should be the very last thing to delete, given any problem we could have17:31
alaskidoffm: this is the closest
bauzasso we could just ask the user to delete again17:32
doffmalaski: Thanks.17:32
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alaskibauzas: we could17:32
dansmithalaski: you mean tag creation before the instance is scheduled?17:32
melwittasking the user to delete again, I hope we can avoid that because I think it'll happen a lot more than we are expecting here17:33
alaskidansmith: right. so it's looking like we need to have that code update the buildreq instance17:33
dansmithmelwitt: agree we should try to avoid it, but if the tiny race window still allows reissuing of the delete, then that's the least worst17:33
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bauzasmelwitt: sure, I'm just saying that if we still have the instance mapping, we can still delete again, which is not possible when the row is removed17:33
dansmithalaski: oye17:33
alaskimelwitt: dansmith +117:33
alaskidansmith: yeah, I'm hitting a few places where api code needs to be aware of if it got instance from a buildreq and do different things17:34
melwittyeah, I know it's least worst. just that it's not okay IMO. I think it'll happen a lot and will cause a lot of pain for users17:34
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dansmithalaski: seems like we might be able to argue for a "busy try again in a minute" status code for that17:35
dansmithmelwitt: you think the race will?17:35
alaskimelwitt: it would need to be a delete call almost immediately after issuing the boot request17:35
alaskimelwitt: I would really like to solve this. we need a lock or sync point, and I'm not sure if we have the right things in place to do that yet17:36
doffmSounds like something that could happen in testing repeatedly. Which isn't the worst thing, but could cause repeated alarms in automated tests.17:36
alaskiwe previously used task_state17:36
dansmithalaski: that's really not airtight though17:36
dansmithalaski: it eventually stops the thing, but not always on the first try, AFAIK17:37
alaskiyeah. I'm going to think on it more, and I just wanted to get you smart people thinking on it as well17:37
melwittdansmith: yes. I think I've seen a lot of bugs in launchpad over the years of people deleting before the instance schedules. perhaps I'm thinking of the old cells v1 bug with delete racing with boot that got fixed when I converted things to instance objects17:37
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alaskibut for now I'm going to try relying on checking buildreq delete17:38
dansmithI think it's fully resolvable and not that big of a deal17:38
melwittthat race happened often in the tempest job17:38
dansmithmelwitt: sure, I know that kind of thing happens, but I wouldn't say it "affects a lot of our users" I guess17:38
bauzasI tend to agree with dansmith here, because cells v1 delete is a very different problem17:38
bauzasgiven how we call top/down and bottom/up17:38
bauzas(for cells v1)17:38
dansmithor a lot of pain or whatever17:38
dansmithI think the average horizon user probably clicks delete three times per delete anyway17:39
dansmithlike an elevator button :D17:39
bauzasjust making some assumptions when issuing a delete doesn't sound hard to do17:39
alaskiI think we need to take this to the review, or a whiteboard in pdx17:40
melwittwell, I have seen enough things like that, people boot an instance and immediately delete it. and to have the situation of "oh yeah, sometimes it doesn't really delete it, just delete it again"17:40
alaskiI have something to try, but further suggestions definitely welcome17:40
melwittI'm just saying I think it's worse than the consensus here is saying. just my opinion17:41
alaskiI agree it's crappy, but potentially addressable with the current direction17:42
alaskiI need to see it visually to convince myself either way17:42
doffmWe have reached the cognitive limits of IRC.17:42
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alaskidansmith: so back to your "try again later" status code17:43
alaskidoffm: yep17:43
alaskithat touches on the crux of this, which is that there is now a big distinction between pre/post scheduled instances17:43
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alaskito avoid exposing that in the API we sort of need to hide that, but should we really do that17:44
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dansmithtoo many "thats" in there for me to grok17:44
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alaskishould users be aware that an instance isn't really an instance until after scheduling17:45
alaskiand some actions may not work until then17:45
dansmiththe problem is it's not an action right?17:45
alaskilike updating tags or metadata17:45
dansmithan action of shelve doesn't work on a pre-schedule instance,17:45
dansmithbut tags have their own CRUD operations, right?17:45
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alaskiright. it's not instance actions, it's more actions on data attached to an instance17:46
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dansmithalaski: so we *can* load modify and save the buildreq, right? the problem is,17:46
alaskiwe can yes17:46
dansmithhigh danger of losing writes when multiple things are happening together17:46
dansmithwe could use a generation field to at least signal that it happened instead of lying,17:47
alaskithat. and that some code now needs two paths17:47
dansmithbut that is the same as the "try back later" right?17:47
alaskiI'm not sure it's much, or any, worse than today with an instance17:48
alaskimy main concern is special casing the code around buildrequests17:48
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alaskibut I may be convincing myself that it's only a few things and not that bad17:49
dansmithright but blocking things is less duplication than allowing it to complete in two ways17:49
alaskiyes. but if we can avoid blocking I would like to17:50
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dansmithso wait17:50
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dansmithyou want to (a) avoid blocking (b) avoid doing it two ways (c) not move tags to the api db?17:50
dansmithplease god don't say it's (c)17:51
alaskibut also (c), why would we move tags17:51
dansmithso you want to load/store the buildreq, add a version field?17:51
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dansmithI guess I thought above you said you didn't want to do that17:52
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* dansmith notes seven minutes remain17:53
alaskiwhat I'm hoping to avoid is too much complex if buildreq then foo elif instance then bar17:53
alaskiif it can be abstracted nicely I'm not concerned17:53
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alaskiyeah, I don't think we'll solve this here17:54
dansmithI dunno, I think you're likely going to have it be pretty complex,17:54
dansmithbecause tags are not stored in the instance,17:54
dansmithso you're going to need to store them with the buildreq instance, and make sure instance create handles that right17:54
dansmithmaybe it will, I'd have to go look, I don't recall you being able to do that though17:54
alaskiit doesn't, I would have to add that17:55
dansmithI was thinking tags was a regular @property, but maybe it's a proper field17:55
alaskiit's a field17:55
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alaskibut it's not normally updated that way17:55
alaskimaybe not ever17:55
dansmithit is yeah17:55
dansmithand yeah, it's a weird one17:55
alaskiwell, I'll put something together and we can discuss on a review17:56
alaskithat's all I have today17:56
dansmithtags are not created in create()17:56
alaskianyone want to use up the last 3 minutes?17:56
alaskidansmith: yeah, they're a bit odd17:57
alaskiokay, thanks all!17:57
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:57
openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 17:57:32 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:57
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robcresswell#startmeeting horizon20:00
openstackMeeting started Wed May 25 20:00:21 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is robcresswell. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: horizon)"20:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'horizon'20:00
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robcresswellHi all20:01
robcresswell#topic Notices20:02
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robcresswellReminder about the midcycle. Drop your name in if you'll be there, feel free to ping if you have any questions20:03
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robcresswellAgenda for today is empty20:03
robcresswell#topic Open Discussion20:03
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robcresswellWe're an open room if anyone has any topics they'd like to discuss20:04
tsufievI like the topic 'rechecks are futile' (see ML list) :)20:04
robcresswellre: your earlier comment, yes we can use the room topic20:04
* tsufiev hoping that it won't be actual for more than few days20:05
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robcresswellYeah, I'll be looking into that tomorrow morning, need to get things moving quickly20:05
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robcresswellI do have one blueprint to mention while there's an audience20:06
robcresswellThis is intentionally vague, but wanted to get it in peoples heads and open up discussion before the midcycle to avoid wasting limited time.20:07
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robcresswellIts mostly just about how we want to lay out the project moving forward, from both a code and UX point of view. If you have any thoughts, please add them.20:07
robcresswellIts a topic that needs to be discussed before the N release, even if the decision is "keep it the same"20:08
david-lyleI curmudgeon-ed that one already20:08
david-lylethere are parts that are on target too20:09
r1chardj0n3sdavid-lyle: I had a similar concern20:09
robcresswellHaha, I saw. Good comments, just want to see what others views are20:09
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tyr_The project / admin distinction strikes me as reminding root he's root20:10
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tyr_on that line...perhaps Horizon is always 'project' scoped...but with an 'sudo' button :)20:11
robcresswellIt can get quite complex, and making it non-obvious resulting in data loss is not a good way of endearing us to deployers :)20:11
robcresswellThat said, it seems like there are some good ways we could reduce overhead visually and in terms of code maintenance.20:12
robcresswellIts just whether that can be done in a reasonable manner, I suppose.20:12
robcresswellQuiet today :) If there are no more items, everyone can have their time back.20:14
robcresswellMake sure to get some reviews in on the blueprints here:
robcresswellThanks all20:15
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openstackMeeting ended Wed May 25 20:15:29 2016 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)20:15
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