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| zehicle | The OpenStack Core meetup will use IRC openstack-meeting | 01:00 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: hi, wheres Colin? didn see him for some time | 14:04 |
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| colinmcnamara | Sorry I'm late | 14:06 |
| dguitarbite | hi colinmcnamara | 14:06 |
| dguitarbite | meetings not yet started | 14:07 |
| colinmcnamara | Ok, is Sean on ? | 14:07 |
| dguitarbite | colinmcnamara: ping | 14:07 |
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| dguitarbite | yea | 14:07 |
| dguitarbite | he is online | 14:07 |
| dguitarbite | he is talking to anne gentle as of now | 14:07 |
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| colinmcnamara | K | 14:07 |
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| colinmcnamara | K, then we will wait for Sean | 14:08 |
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| dguitarbite | just ping him once | 14:10 |
| colinmcnamara | I'm checking. I think he might be getting up to 10,000 feet. Before he can log on | 14:11 |
| colinmcnamara | Nope, his flight is at 8:30 | 14:12 |
| colinmcnamara | Mine is in 30 min | 14:12 |
| colinmcnamara | Calling him now | 14:12 |
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| colinmcnamara | Sean will be on in 5 min or so, he is getting through the airport | 14:13 |
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| colinmcnamara | Different airport than me btw | 14:14 |
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| dguitarbite | alrite | 14:16 |
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| sarob | I'm back | 14:16 |
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| sarob | Security line took longer than expected | 14:17 |
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| dguitarbite | hi | 14:17 |
| sarob | Meeting start? | 14:18 |
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| sarob | Who's here? | 14:18 |
| dguitarbite | go | 14:18 |
| dguitarbite | im here | 14:18 |
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| sarob | #startmeeting training-manuals | 14:19 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 14:19:38 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sarob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:19 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: training-manuals)" | 14:19 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'training_manuals' | 14:19 |
| sarob | #topic rst xml devref conversion | 14:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "rst xml devref conversion (Meeting topic: training-manuals)" | 14:20 | |
| dguitarbite | topic? rst to xml? | 14:20 |
| dguitarbite | :D | 14:20 |
| sarob | So I missed most of the docs meet discussion | 14:21 |
| sarob | I'm confused why they want to go slow | 14:21 |
| dguitarbite | alrite, i guess ill give you the summary on training stuff | 14:21 |
| sarob | Help me understand | 14:21 |
| dguitarbite | till colin comes in | 14:21 |
| dguitarbite | alrite, so they wanteed to know whats unique with training manuals | 14:21 |
| sarob | Unique? | 14:22 |
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| dguitarbite | 1. They think that this is closer to user groups, they clearly have not understood hackathon's purpose | 14:22 |
| dguitarbite | unique in d sense | 14:22 |
| dguitarbite | whats is different from manuals | 14:22 |
| dguitarbite | theres a bit of confusion there | 14:23 |
| dguitarbite | 2. Anne has a point, she will hesitate to touch Havanna branch as she has to keep it stable ... | 14:23 |
| sarob | So I want to get all the devref rst available in xml so we can work | 14:23 |
| sarob | Where's the confusion? | 14:24 |
| dguitarbite | yes so that goes in Icehouse | 14:24 |
| sarob | It goes online | 14:24 |
| dguitarbite | the point put up by them is that, the tools for openstack docs nearly stable and so the the content | 14:24 |
| sarob | Rst devref goes into Havana | 14:24 |
| sarob | Tools? | 14:25 |
| dguitarbite | in the sense the Rst devref will convert | 14:25 |
| dguitarbite | loads of content | 14:25 |
| sarob | Now I'm really confused | 14:25 |
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| sarob | Well yeah there's lots of project rst | 14:26 |
| dguitarbite | alrite Rst Devref automates certain things, they dont want to get it in | 14:26 |
| dguitarbite | the branch which is about to be stable | 14:26 |
| sarob | We want to use it rather than it molding | 14:26 |
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| sarob | Great so we get to wait until when | 14:27 |
| sarob | Did anyone say? | 14:27 |
| dguitarbite | till the end of this week | 14:28 |
| sarob | And then the patch with the conversion | 14:28 |
| sarob | Can come in? | 14:28 |
| sarob | Or something else | 14:28 |
| dguitarbite | one second | 14:28 |
| sarob | Okay | 14:29 |
| dguitarbite | some guy is going to work on this for a week | 14:29 |
| dguitarbite | and then they will decide about it | 14:29 |
| dguitarbite | but I am not sure if we can rely on that ! | 14:29 |
| dguitarbite | yeah we can patch this convo | 14:29 |
| sarob | Hold on a sec | 14:31 |
| dguitarbite | sure | 14:31 |
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| sarob | Back | 14:33 |
| sarob | Nermina has offered to help | 14:33 |
| sarob | It sounds like they want to copy some of the devref rst | 14:34 |
| sarob | Which would cause major stale content | 14:34 |
| sarob | If the devref materials are stale then we either update them or move | 14:35 |
| sarob | Move will take time | 14:35 |
| sarob | So we update first | 14:35 |
| sarob | Then work with projects on the move | 14:35 |
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| sarob | Copy is a no go | 14:36 |
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| dguitarbite | sorry for that internet issue | 14:43 |
| sarob | Back | 14:43 |
| sarob | Nermina discussion | 14:45 |
| dguitarbite | sounds good | 14:45 |
| sarob | Colin or Pranav can you finish meet | 14:45 |
| dguitarbite | is colin on | 14:45 |
| dguitarbite | ? | 14:45 |
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| sarob | Sorry I have to go | 14:55 |
| sarob | Close meet for now? | 14:56 |
| sarob | Catch up later? | 14:56 |
| sarob | I'm too worked up to talk right now anyway | 14:56 |
| sarob | #endmeeting | 14:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings (alternate)" | 14:57 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 14:57:07 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-10-22-14.19.html | 14:57 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-10-22-14.19.txt | 14:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/training_manuals/2013/training_manuals.2013-10-22-14.19.log.html | 14:57 |
| sarob | Crappy meeting | 14:57 |
| sarob | Sorry | 14:57 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | hi | 15:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Neutron folks here? | 15:30 |
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| bmelande | Hi Sumit! Bob Melander here | 15:30 |
| yamahata | Hi Sumit | 15:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | hi Bob, good to see you | 15:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | hi yamahata | 15:31 |
| obondarev | Hi | 15:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | hi obondarev | 15:31 |
| shivharis | hi sumit, hi all | 15:31 |
| obondarev | Hi Sumit, folks | 15:31 |
| greg_r | hi, greg here | 15:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Bob hopefully better time for you? :-) | 15:31 |
| geoffarnold | hi there | 15:31 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | hi shivharis greg_r | 15:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | hi geoffarnold | 15:31 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | ok lets get rolling | 15:31 |
| bmelande | Sumit: Yes, this time my brain will hopefully work | 15:32 |
| bmelande | :-) | 15:32 |
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| enikanorov | hi there | 15:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: :-) | 15:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #startmeeting Networking Advanced Services | 15:32 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 15:32:13 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SumitNaiksatam. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:32 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 15:32 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_advanced_services' | 15:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Greetings! | 15:32 |
| SridarK | HI | 15:32 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | thanks all for joining, its a bit inconvenient for those in PDT, we can try and change that in the future | 15:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | one request - let's have one conversation thread so as to avoid confusion on what is being discussed | 15:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i have four broad topics on the agenda | 15:33 |
| SumitNaiksatam | but please feel free to suggest more as we go along | 15:33 |
| amotoki | hi | 15:33 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets first follow up from items we discussed last week | 15:34 |
| SumitNaiksatam | hi amotoki SridarK | 15:34 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic service insertion and chaining | 15:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "service insertion and chaining (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 15:34 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/neutron-services-insertion-chaining-steering | 15:34 |
| geoffarnold | can you list the 4 topics before we dive in | 15:34 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yeah sure - | 15:34 |
| SumitNaiksatam | the first one i just mentioned above | 15:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | the other three areL | 15:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Service VMs - mechanism | 15:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Service VMs - policy (this is your blueprint) | 15:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | Extensible APIs for advanced services (this is enikanorov's topic) | 15:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | anything more to add geoffarnold? | 15:36 |
| geoffarnold | just that the policy topic needs to embrace vms and physical resources | 15:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: sure | 15:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets discuss when we come to that | 15:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: point well taken, its not just service VMs | 15:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok going back to "service insertion and chaining" | 15:37 |
| obondarev | SumitNaiksatam: saw also 'Service agents' topic in your email | 15:37 |
| obondarev | there was 5 | 15:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | quite a few folks posted comments on the google doc, and I have responded | 15:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | obondarev: ah, sorry I missed that | 15:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | thanks | 15:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | I should have not relied on my memory :-) | 15:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yes, we will discuss that | 15:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok on "service insertion and chaining" | 15:38 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | this is still WIP, anyone has any thoughts/reservations? | 15:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | there were some face to face discussions as well | 15:38 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | and good feedback | 15:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | folks got a chance to read the google doc? | 15:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i know last time some folks had not yet read it | 15:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov: sent a couple of comments over email | 15:40 |
| bmelande | Sumit: Is the list of use cases indicating what will be targeted first? | 15:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: good question | 15:40 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | i don't think we can bite that much right away | 15:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | seems like Nachi is not here | 15:41 |
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| bmelande | Agree, seems ambitious to attempt to cover all in I | 15:41 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we were discussing earlier - for implementation we might just try to do a basic chain first - firewall and VPN | 15:41 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: hopefully the API and model can handle all other chains as well | 15:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: but we won't target that for reference implementation | 15:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: certainly vendors can support a lot more | 15:42 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | any thoughts on the single service insertion? | 15:43 |
| amotoki | SumitNaiksatam: I am reading it now. I will leave comment or mail to you. I haven't fully understand service_insertion_types BITW and tap are represented in neutron model. | 15:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so we all in agreement, so far on the proposal? ;-) | 15:44 |
| enikanorov_ | the question on workflow: is it going to change if we introduce insertion mode? | 15:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: thanks | 15:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: there is currently no example of BITW and Tap | 15:45 |
| enikanorov_ | workflow of service creation | 15:45 |
| enikanorov_ | i meant | 15:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: actually currently we have only L3 based | 15:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: so in that context, I think the key is to be able to capture the insertion_context correctly for these modes | 15:46 |
| SumitNaiksatam | what we have in the design spec is a suggestion, but i think we can evolve that | 15:46 |
| SumitNaiksatam | looking forward to your comments | 15:46 |
| geoffarnold | I would like to see more end-to-end workflow analysis | 15:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: the workflow might not change if we use default insertion mode, right? | 15:47 |
| enikanorov_ | yes, I guess the ability to use default should remain | 15:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: or you have identified some deviation? | 15:47 |
| geoffarnold | all the way from EC2 API calls to low level actions | 15:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: will try :-) | 15:48 |
| enikanorov_ | that's only question i have at the moment on insertion | 15:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ok let's work through the workflow for each of LBaaS, FWaaS and VPNaaS | 15:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | not here, offline that is :-) | 15:48 |
| enikanorov_ | sure | 15:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action SumitNaiksatam to work with enikanorov_ on workflow | 15:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action geoffarnold to review :-) | 15:49 |
| geoffarnold | yup ;-) | 15:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: more thoughts, or should we move to the next topic? | 15:49 |
| amotoki | SumitNaiksatam: go ahead now. | 15:50 |
| geoffarnold | next. tempos fugit | 15:50 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic common L3 agent framework | 15:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "common L3 agent framework (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 15:50 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | I believe Nachi is not here | 15:50 |
| SumitNaiksatam | obondarev: you had some thoughts? | 15:50 |
| enikanorov_ | i'm not fuly aware of activity on this front. Have we moved to l3 agent that loads service drivers? | 15:51 |
| SumitNaiksatam | last time we discussed: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1e85n2IE38XoYwlsqNvqhKFLox6O01SbguZXq7SnSSGo/edit#slide=id.p | 15:51 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: I don't think so | 15:52 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: at least not for fwaas | 15:52 |
| bmelande | Are there additional documents/bps to the one that Nachi has made on this topic? | 15:52 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: and vpnaas still inherits | 15:52 |
| enikanorov_ | i thought that was a consensus back in time when the code was pushed | 15:52 |
| enikanorov_ | SumitNaiksatam: I see | 15:52 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: not that i am aware off, sorry i should have researched | 15:53 |
| amotoki | my question is "do we need to implement all services on a single l3-agent?" An alternative is to chain l3-agent namespaces though i am not sure it can cover all possible cases. | 15:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: i was thinking nachi was going to be here | 15:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: good point on chaining namespaces | 15:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: that makes it easier to realize service chains as well | 15:53 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: is that something you want to propose? | 15:54 |
| amotoki | nothing from me | 15:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | or if you have already, pointer will help | 15:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: ok | 15:54 |
| amotoki | i have no material at now. just an idea. | 15:54 |
| yamahata | Is there any expecation of number of chains? | 15:54 |
| enikanorov_ | folks, could you explain what is namespaces chaining? | 15:54 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: go ahead | 15:55 |
| amotoki | what i am thing is to create several namespace and create veth paris between two namespace. | 15:55 |
| enikanorov_ | ok, i see | 15:55 |
| SumitNaiksatam | to add to that, each service specific construct will be in a different namespace | 15:56 |
| shivharis | with namespaces we may be limited to one host service chainging? | 15:56 |
| enikanorov_ | remember we have l3 agent scheduling, so in case of service chaining whole chaing should be scheduled to 1 agent | 15:56 |
| enikanorov_ | (just thinking aloud) | 15:56 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so for example, fwaas rules in a different namespace | 15:56 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: right? | 15:56 |
| amotoki | what do you mean by "fwaas rules in a different namespace"? | 15:57 |
| amotoki | what i think is VPNaaS in one ns and FWaaS in another. | 15:57 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: the fwaas functionality is realized as iptables configuration in the same namespace as the router | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: exactly | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: thats what i meant | 15:58 |
| shivharis | amotoki: with namespaces we may be limited to one host service chainging? | 15:58 |
| geoffarnold | Does this assume L3 agent is managed by a driver under an L3 plugin (to accommodate alternative L3 providers, HW and SW)? | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok folks, hang on | 15:58 |
| geoffarnold | Same pattern as LBaaS | 15:58 |
| bmelande | How about evolving the L3 agent so it can configure remote "entities"? | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we have some questions in the buffer | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | one sec | 15:58 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets answer yamahata's question first | 15:59 |
| amotoki | we need to investigate it more... | 15:59 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yamahata: can you clarify what you mean by the number of chains? | 15:59 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yamahata: the API and model should be agnostic of the number of chains | 16:00 |
| yamahata | I concerned too many netns and veth. performance degradation. | 16:00 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yamahata: ah, ok | 16:00 |
| amotoki | yamahata: i agree. | 16:00 |
| yamahata | Probably it can be addressed later for performance and scalability. | 16:00 |
| SumitNaiksatam | yamahata: that is implementation | 16:00 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | yamahata: right, but good point to keep in mind | 16:00 |
| amotoki | we need to check the performance when we talk about l3-agent implementation. | 16:00 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: agreed | 16:01 |
| yamahata | SumitNaiksatam, agreed. | 16:01 |
| bmelande | Won't that be part of scheduling | 16:01 |
| bmelande | i.e taking into account performance | 16:01 |
| SumitNaiksatam | next question was from shivharis | 16:01 |
| SumitNaiksatam | shivharis: we are talking about this in the context of reference of implementation | 16:01 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | shivharis: that already uses namespace implementation and is limited to the host on which the L3 agent runs | 16:02 |
| SumitNaiksatam | shivharis: chaining namespaces would not change any of that | 16:02 |
| shivharis | we should be able to chain not only with namespace, but across hosts as well | 16:02 |
| SumitNaiksatam | next question was from geoffarnold | 16:02 |
| amotoki | shivharis: in the current model it may be limited on one host, but we can enhance neutron model and implemetnation to connect two interfaces on differnt host with p-to-p link. | 16:03 |
| shivharis | ok, for now | 16:03 |
| shivharis | make it general purpose later | 16:03 |
| geoffarnold | "one host" is useless for real world | 16:03 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: we are talking in the context of reference implementation, which only deals with SW not HW | 16:03 |
| geoffarnold | so am i | 16:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: :-) | 16:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: thats reference implementation | 16:04 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: we can have a separate discussion on how to enhance it | 16:04 |
| geoffarnold | framework should accommodate both simple ref imll and real world | 16:05 |
| shivharis | for reference implementation it should be ok | 16:05 |
| geoffarnold | impl | 16:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: i think your question is along similar lines | 16:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: good point | 16:05 |
| bmelande | SumitNaiksatam: Yes it was :-) | 16:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action suggestion to enhance L3 agent framework, nacho to contact geoffarnold shivharis | 16:05 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action suggestion to enhance L3 agent framework, nachi to contact geoffarnold shivharis | 16:06 |
| geoffarnold | and bob | 16:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets take the next topic | 16:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action suggestion to enhance L3 agent framework, nachi to contact geoffarnold shivharis bmelande | 16:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | happy? :-) | 16:06 |
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| bmelande | geoffarnold: Yes, thanks, I want to be part of that discussion too | 16:06 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Service VMs - Mechanism | 16:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Service VMs - Mechanism (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 16:06 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/adv-services-in-vms | 16:07 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | greg_r: there? | 16:07 |
| greg_r | yes, thanks | 16:07 |
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| greg_r | good input from ftf last week | 16:07 |
| SumitNaiksatam | want to give a quick summary of the discussion over the last week? | 16:07 |
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| greg_r | gathering up feedback from comments and from the ftf | 16:08 |
| greg_r | major item is the data model | 16:08 |
| greg_r | and the use cases | 16:08 |
| greg_r | one point i would like to clarify is implementation | 16:08 |
| greg_r | of the 4 use cases identified, want to understand most common case | 16:09 |
| greg_r | the 4 use cases are: private, shared, multi-service, and scale-out | 16:09 |
| greg_r | my guess is that the first one, private, is the simplest and most common case | 16:10 |
| SumitNaiksatam | greg_r: i vote for starting with private | 16:10 |
| bmelande | greg_r: I have been time to spend on implementation and is offering to help with that. | 16:10 |
| greg_r | and so would be most likely to be the first to implement | 16:10 |
| bmelande | greg_r: have been -> have been given | 16:10 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: thats great | 16:10 |
| greg_r | it sounds like we are in agreement? | 16:11 |
| geoffarnold | clarification....? | 16:11 |
| greg_r | top priority to implement is private use case. | 16:11 |
| bmelande | greg_r: But nothing prevents going furhter than that right? | 16:11 |
| geoffarnold | Private - app configures - vs. infrastructure - Neutron configures | 16:11 |
| greg_r | right, only time and resources | 16:11 |
| geoffarnold | Let's put al of those use cases in an LBaaS context | 16:12 |
| greg_r | geoffarnold: yes | 16:12 |
| geoffarnold | rather than abstract | 16:12 |
| greg_r | geoffarnold: lbaas implemented as a VM, right? | 16:13 |
| amotoki | +1. It is simple. In addition LBaaS instance can work with one port :-) | 16:13 |
| geoffarnold | so the LBaaS driver cares about the distinction | 16:13 |
| geoffarnold | yes | 16:13 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we could do any of LBaaS, FWaaS, VPNaaS whichever is easier | 16:13 |
| greg_r | ok, you mean to add in the spec? | 16:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_ can correct me, but LBaaS is not a VM | 16:14 |
| obondarev | yes | 16:14 |
| enikanorov_ | right. reference impl is a process on host | 16:14 |
| enikanorov_ | not a vm | 16:14 |
| geoffarnold | "private" is confusing (conflated with "guest mode" where it's a really private part of an app topology) | 16:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_ obondarev thanks | 16:14 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: agree, private is confusing | 16:14 |
| geoffarnold | But LBaaS ref imll still has a driver, right? | 16:15 |
| enikanorov_ | geoffarnold: sure | 16:15 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: driver yes, but not VM | 16:15 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: all services have drivers today | 16:15 |
| enikanorov_ | :-) | 16:15 |
| geoffarnold | point is, above driver nobody knows what the use case - shared, scale out, etc. - is | 16:16 |
| bmelande | Anything based on namespaces ought to be pretty easy to put in a VM, or? | 16:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | at different levels of maturity (before enikanorov_ corrects me :-)) | 16:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bmelande: i agree | 16:16 |
| geoffarnold | I'm just looking at abstractions | 16:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: you have suggestion on better term to use instead of private? | 16:16 |
| SumitNaiksatam | or we can take this offline | 16:16 |
| geoffarnold | offline for taxonomy | 16:17 |
| amotoki | Who manages a service VM in the context "private"? neutorn or a tenant? | 16:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action greg_r geoffarnold to brainstorm on taxonomy | 16:17 |
| greg_r | ok | 16:17 |
| enikanorov_ | amotoki: i guess neutron. throught the service driver | 16:17 |
| geoffarnold | amotoki: better be neutron | 16:17 |
| bmelande | amotoki: Me too, neutron should. | 16:17 |
| greg_r | yes, neutron | 16:17 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: i agree | 16:17 |
| enikanorov_ | otherwise it's going to be quite complex for the user | 16:17 |
| amotoki | i agree. it is same as what i think. | 16:18 |
| geoffarnold | Uninterested in tenant-managed VMs in this context | 16:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok we are running low on time | 16:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | greg_r: anything more to add or can we go to the next topic | 16:18 |
| greg_r | go on | 16:18 |
| geoffarnold | But decision as to shared vs. multi-service is a driver issue | 16:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | folks, we will have this as on going meeting | 16:18 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so we will be back next week as well | 16:18 |
| geoffarnold | and then in the bar in Hong Kong | 16:19 |
| greg_r | :) | 16:19 |
| SridarK | decisions will be faster for sure | 16:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: Ha! (a la chris matthews!) | 16:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Service VMs - Policy | 16:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Service VMs - Policy (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 16:19 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/dynamic-network-resource-mgmt | 16:19 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: over to you | 16:20 |
| geoffarnold | this is all about allocating scarce/different resources | 16:20 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: do you want to bring the rest of us unto speed as to where we are going with this | 16:20 |
| geoffarnold | hw and sw | 16:20 |
| geoffarnold | sure | 16:20 |
| geoffarnold | the DNRM BP is really all about the end-to-end use cases | 16:20 |
| geoffarnold | that makes it too big for OpenStack, but I really don't want to lose the context | 16:21 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: you mentioned you were going to break it down? | 16:21 |
| geoffarnold | canonical use case: how do I (a cloud operator) set things up so production LB traffic goes to the physical F5 fleet and dev/test goes to virtual Netscalers? | 16:22 |
| geoffarnold | Obvious way to break it up is... | 16:22 |
| geoffarnold | Producer-pool-consumer | 16:23 |
| geoffarnold | Producer manages (discovers, provisions) resources | 16:23 |
| geoffarnold | Consumer selects a resource from what's available based on a policy | 16:23 |
| enikanorov_ | that looks like a higher level problem than what neutron is solving, no? | 16:23 |
| geoffarnold | Not really. Look at the inventory blueprint for LBaaS | 16:24 |
| geoffarnold | Multivendor support is essential | 16:24 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: i believe that's enikanorov_ blueprint? :-) | 16:24 |
| geoffarnold | Physical resources are (always) scarce | 16:24 |
| geoffarnold | Yup | 16:24 |
| geoffarnold | So we need a way of selecting a resource and from that locating the driver that handles it | 16:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: can we make the strategy pluggable? | 16:25 |
| geoffarnold | M0ost work so far assumes that Neutron API call provides selection criterion | 16:25 |
| SumitNaiksatam | strategy for selection | 16:26 |
| geoffarnold | But that's too limiting - needs to be pluggable | 16:26 |
| geoffarnold | Bingo | 16:26 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok good | 16:26 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so i think one blueprint can be around the framework to support the strategy | 16:26 |
| SumitNaiksatam | with a dumb default policy | 16:26 |
| geoffarnold | It affects all Neutron services where multiple resource from multiple vendors are in play | 16:27 |
| SumitNaiksatam | and then separate blueprints for different stategies | 16:27 |
| geoffarnold | "dumb policy" is right for ref arch | 16:27 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: exactly | 16:27 |
| geoffarnold | that's what out PoC will show in hong kong | 16:27 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: nice | 16:27 |
| geoffarnold | our | 16:27 |
| geoffarnold | But it does cut across a lot of stuff :-( | 16:27 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: its good to see end to end action | 16:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | we are running short on time | 16:28 |
| geoffarnold | Let me do the carve-up before next week | 16:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | geoffarnold: great | 16:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | lets move on the next topic? | 16:28 |
| geoffarnold | Anyone wants to discuss offline, contact me | 16:28 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic Extensible API: deal with growing services | 16:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Extensible API: deal with growing services (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 16:29 | |
| enikanorov_ | ok | 16:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | this is Eugene's proposed topic for the Summit | 16:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/22 | 16:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: over to you | 16:29 |
| enikanorov_ | so this one is about how to exopose vendor-specific features through the API | 16:29 |
| enikanorov_ | and this is not limited to adv services | 16:29 |
| enikanorov_ | i saw similar session proposal for ml2 drivers from amotoki | 16:29 |
| enikanorov_ | i guess the same could be applied there | 16:29 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: you mention moving advance services' api to core? | 16:29 |
| enikanorov_ | that one of the steps in that direction | 16:30 |
| enikanorov_ | but not essential, i guess | 16:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok, can you elaborate a little? | 16:30 |
| enikanorov_ | in fact we already have extensions for extensions, i think | 16:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | btw, folks we are at the hour mark | 16:30 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | but i don't think there is another meeting | 16:30 |
| enikanorov_ | ok, i'll try to make it short | 16:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so we can continue until we are kicked out | 16:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: sorry continue | 16:30 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: take your tie | 16:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | time | 16:31 |
| enikanorov_ | so what i'd like to see is ability for vendors to make their specific extensions that are not in 'common' location | 16:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: some plugins are already doing this, right? | 16:31 |
| enikanorov_ | that has some benefits, including more simple review/discussions penalty | 16:31 |
| SumitNaiksatam | nicira has some in their private directory structure | 16:32 |
| enikanorov_ | *penalty=process | 16:32 |
| SumitNaiksatam | so does big switch and i believe Cisco as well | 16:32 |
| enikanorov_ | right | 16:32 |
| enikanorov_ | such framework would require dispatching mechanism that will forward rest call to a proper driver | 16:32 |
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| enikanorov_ | and at this point i'm insterested in how this could be applied for, say, fwaas | 16:33 |
| enikanorov_ | for lbaas it looks relatively simple since we have 'plugin driver' notion | 16:33 |
| enikanorov_ | and fwaas seems to have device drivers only | 16:33 |
| enikanorov_ | and communication goes through the rpc/agent | 16:33 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: fwaas will comply with the service_type framework | 16:34 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ok | 16:34 |
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| enikanorov_ | currently it seems to me that it would require to create the same 'plugin_drivers' for fwaas | 16:34 |
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| enikanorov_ | although they can be trivial | 16:34 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: so the vendor extensions will be in the same neutron tree, right? | 16:34 |
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| enikanorov_ | extensions will be in neutron tree, but they will not be loaded like common extensions | 16:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ah ok | 16:35 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: i missed that part | 16:35 |
| enikanorov_ | instead, I'm planning that REST API layer wil ask plugin for resources/attr maps and embed them into the resulting API | 16:35 |
| enikanorov_ | instead of checking for 'supported ext alias' and using preloaded comon extension | 16:36 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: when we make an API call for /extensions it will return all the loaded extensions including the ones selectively loaded for the vendors? | 16:36 |
| enikanorov_ | this way we could control API set by simply defining providers for the service, and also avoid the need to place vendor's extensions into common space | 16:36 |
| enikanorov_ | SumitNaiksatam: that's a good question. I think it should return everything that is supported | 16:37 |
| enikanorov_ | everything that is loaded i mean | 16:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: you mean supported, or loaded? | 16:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ah ok | 16:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: i agree | 16:37 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: this seems like a good approach to me, but I have dived deeper | 16:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | other folks have thoughts? | 16:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i think this is pretty relevant with the proliferation of services and related extensions | 16:38 |
| enikanorov_ | so essential part of such framework would be dispatching mechanism that will forward rest cals to appropriate driver | 16:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | and extensions of extensions :-) | 16:38 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ok | 16:38 |
| SridarK | sorry have not read the BP but where does the dispatching mechanism exist - in the vendor plugin ? | 16:38 |
| enikanorov_ | SridarK: yes, i think it should go to the plugin (generic plugin) | 16:39 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: is there a blueprint? | 16:39 |
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| SridarK | enikanorov_: thx ok makes sense | 16:40 |
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| enikanorov_ | i guess there is no bp for this particular task (dispatching). Currently I'm planning to use api-core-for-services as a scope | 16:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: ok | 16:40 |
| enikanorov_ | probably it makes sense to break it down to parts | 16:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | anyone else has thoughts on this? | 16:40 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i guess we have slowly started to loose people | 16:41 |
| enikanorov_ | i hope i didn't overload folks :) | 16:41 |
| amotoki | enikanorov_: thanks. that totally make sense to me. i am thinking simlar but just start to study. I am half asleep.... | 16:41 |
| enikanorov_ | amotoki: thanks | 16:41 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: apologies for the timing, thanks a lot of attending | 16:41 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #topic open discussion | 16:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: Networking Advanced Services)" | 16:42 | |
| SumitNaiksatam | anything else to discuss, or to put on the agenda for next week? | 16:42 |
| enikanorov_ | one remaining thing is | 16:42 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: go ahead | 16:42 |
| enikanorov_ | vendor-specific configuration | 16:42 |
| enikanorov_ | currently radware is working on their lbaas driver trying to put their conf in neutron.conf | 16:43 |
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| enikanorov_ | and they have reasonable question | 16:43 |
| enikanorov_ | that it might be not the best place for their specific conf | 16:43 |
| enikanorov_ | so it may make sense introduce yet another conf file for services | 16:43 |
| enikanorov_ | what do you think? | 16:43 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: i had earlier suggested this for lbaas | 16:44 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: if you recall in the reviews | 16:44 |
| SridarK | We do this for fwaas | 16:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | that time you went with the approach of creating a new section in the neutron.con :-) | 16:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | since there seemed to be a proliferation of conf files | 16:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | i think separate might be better | 16:44 |
| SumitNaiksatam | any other items to discuss? | 16:45 |
| enikanorov_ | yeah, agree | 16:45 |
| amotoki | how about craeting conf file per service and having "config files" parameter in [default] seciotn in neutron.conf? | 16:45 |
| enikanorov_ | (now I agree :) | 16:45 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: that might work as well | 16:45 |
| enikanorov_ | amotoki: what about just specifying needed files in cmd line? | 16:46 |
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| amotoki | IMO many --config-file is not easy to manage | 16:46 |
| amotoki | s/--config-file/--config-file options/ | 16:46 |
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| enikanorov_ | so the difficulty is in cmd options or in the number of conf files? | 16:47 |
| shivharis | stuffing everything in neutron.conf should not be encouraged - since we can specify multiple conf files at startup | 16:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: will you be capturing this requirement somewhere? | 16:47 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | i mean splitting up the conf file? | 16:47 |
| enikanorov_ | SumitNaiksatam: under discussion right now. I hope it will be covered in HK | 16:47 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #action enikanorov_ to capture splitting up of conf files for advances services | 16:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | ok folks, I think its getting too late for amotoki, perhaps for enikanorov_ as well :-) | 16:48 |
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| SumitNaiksatam | unless there is something else to discuss, we can end this meeting | 16:48 |
| enikanorov_ | seems that we had productive discussion :) | 16:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #info etherpad for pre-summit discussions on this meeting/topic is here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/NeutronAdvancedServices | 16:48 |
| SumitNaiksatam | enikanorov_: thanks for participating | 16:49 |
| shivharis | Sumit: thanks for organizing | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | and to the others as well | 16:49 |
| enikanorov_ | +1 shivharis | 16:49 |
| enikanorov_ | ! | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | shivharis: thanks | 16:49 |
| amotoki | thanks everyone! good night. | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | amotoki: thanks | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | alright by everyone | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | #endmeeting | 16:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings (alternate)" | 16:49 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 16:49:43 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:49 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_advanced_services/2013/networking_advanced_services.2013-10-22-15.32.html | 16:49 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_advanced_services/2013/networking_advanced_services.2013-10-22-15.32.txt | 16:49 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_advanced_services/2013/networking_advanced_services.2013-10-22-15.32.log.html | 16:49 |
| SumitNaiksatam | bye | 16:50 |
| shivharis | bye | 16:50 |
| enikanorov_ | bye | 16:50 |
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| amotoki | bye | 16:50 |
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| SpamapS | lifeless: ahoy! | 19:00 |
| lifeless | ahoy | 19:00 |
| rpodolyaka1 | o/ | 19:01 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 19:01 |
| lsmola | hello | 19:01 |
| lifeless | #startmeeting tripleo | 19:01 |
| jistr | hi | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 19:01:05 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is lifeless. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| viktors_ | hi | 19:01 |
| marios_ | hi | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| ifarkas | hi | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tripleo' | 19:01 |
| noslzzp | hi | 19:01 |
| *** ccrouch has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 19:01 | |
| jcoufal | o/ | 19:01 |
| slagle | hi | 19:01 |
| tzumainn | hiya | 19:01 |
| *** gokrokve has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 19:01 | |
| shadower | hola | 19:01 |
| derekh | o/ | 19:01 |
| dkehn | hi | 19:01 |
| lifeless | #agenda | 19:02 |
| lifeless | bugs | 19:02 |
| lifeless | reviews | 19:02 |
| lifeless | Projects needing releases | 19:02 |
| lifeless | CD Cloud status | 19:02 |
| lifeless | CI virtualized testing progress | 19:02 |
| lifeless | Insert one-off agenda items here | 19:02 |
| lifeless | review kanban | 19:03 |
| lifeless | review the tweaked reviewer rules | 19:03 |
| *** Ng has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 19:03 | |
| lifeless | open discussion | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #topic bugs | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:03 | |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/ | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/ | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-refresh-config | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-collect-config | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar-ui | 19:03 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-tuskarclient | 19:03 |
| lifeless | also good morning everyone | 19:03 |
| jtomasek | hi | 19:03 |
| lifeless | we have bug 1241042 which is a firedrill | 19:04 |
| lifeless | devtest is broken | 19:04 |
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| derekh | So https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1241042 , after I reported it and tried a few things my time got sucked away on something else | 19:04 |
| lifeless | and we have multiple untriaged bugs | 19:04 |
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| dkehn | ithout a REALLY good reason | 19:04 |
| lifeless | e.g. https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config/+bug/1243263 | 19:05 |
| * SpamapS closes one old untriaged bug | 19:05 | |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: derekh's patch is very close to fix bug 1241042, I tested it today, there is one small issue with nova config template | 19:06 |
| SpamapS | Oh, I just realized I'm not subscribed to bugmail for oac | 19:06 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: sorry to pick on that bug | 19:06 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: but you filed it without triaging it | 19:06 |
| marios_ | lifeless: i think i hit https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1241042 be the reason heat stack create for overcloud falied (even though nova instances came up) on 2 separate boxes today | 19:06 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: importance 'undecided' | 19:06 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: for some reason being in tripleo team on launchpad I can't triage in os-apply-config :( | 19:06 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: ok, lets fix that! | 19:06 |
| lifeless | everyone: if you find you can't do something you should be able to do, raise it! | 19:07 |
| lifeless | oac had a per-project team for no good reason, switching it to tripleo | 19:07 |
| lifeless | done | 19:07 |
| SpamapS | tuskar should be changed to tripleo too | 19:08 |
| lifeless | https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1240753 also wasn't triaged though | 19:08 |
| * rpodolyaka1 triages | 19:08 | |
| lifeless | I would ask 'is everyone making a little time to do triage' | 19:08 |
| lifeless | but since we have bugs untriaged for > a week | 19:08 |
| lifeless | the answer is no :( | 19:08 |
| lifeless | including me, obviuosly | 19:08 |
| lifeless | My excuse this week is that we've had a super busy time @ HP with conference proposals for an internal thing | 19:09 |
| * lifeless is sorry | 19:09 | |
| lifeless | however, as a group - we need to do better. | 19:09 |
| lifeless | Any ideas on how ? | 19:09 |
| SpamapS | I am a big believer in a unified view that helps us drive to 0 | 19:10 |
| SpamapS | but, in the past that has required writing little one-off launchpad scripty things to generate a report. | 19:10 |
| lifeless | ok | 19:11 |
| lifeless | I agree, would be wonderful | 19:12 |
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| lifeless | but ponies. | 19:12 |
| lifeless | Unless we want to commit to triaging all of OpenStakc | 19:12 |
| lifeless | which I think would be a bit tough until everyone gets on board | 19:12 |
| SpamapS | We do deploy all of OpenStack.. so there would be value in doing so.. but I'm not sure we can absorb the cost of all the irrelevant things we'd have to filter out. | 19:13 |
| lifeless | however, can I get everyone to commit to - just one, one day, over the next week visiting the meetings page, ctrl-clicking on the bug section links, scrolling to the bottom and triaging all 'unknown' importance bugs ? | 19:13 |
| rpodolyaka1 | +1 | 19:13 |
| lifeless | if we make a joint commitment to do that *once* each once a week, I think we can keep on top of it very easily. | 19:13 |
| shadower | ya | 19:13 |
| * Ng nods | 19:13 | |
| jcoufal | +1 | 19:14 |
| tzumainn | sounds reasonable | 19:14 |
| lsmola | ok | 19:14 |
| jtomasek | ok | 19:14 |
| lifeless | #vote +1 if you will triage across all tripleo LP projects [see the meetings page] once a week | 19:14 |
| jistr | ok | 19:14 |
| ifarkas | +1 | 19:14 |
| shadower | +1 | 19:14 |
| tzumainn | +1 | 19:14 |
| lsmola | +1 | 19:14 |
| lifeless | erm, clearly I don't know how to drive mootbot votes. | 19:14 |
| marios_ | k | 19:14 |
| jtomasek | +1 | 19:14 |
| SpamapS | +1 | 19:14 |
| Ng | do we want to try and somehow avoid all accidentally doing it all on the same day? | 19:14 |
| viktors_ | +1 | 19:14 |
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| lifeless | Ng: birthday paradox | 19:14 |
| slagle | +1 | 19:14 |
| lifeless | +1 from me | 19:15 |
| ccrouch | Ng: thats like trying to avoid winning the lottery :-) | 19:15 |
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| lifeless | ok, so thats triage handled. | 19:15 |
| Ng | +1 | 19:15 |
| lifeless | Onto the critical: this is a firedrill. | 19:15 |
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| lifeless | It's a bit sad tht /noone/ managed to find time to drive it forwards | 19:15 |
| derekh | tried a updated patch about 2 hours ago that failed, havn't looked at why yet | 19:16 |
| lifeless | This is another case of joint responsibilities. And yes, company stuff will draw us away : let me apologise again for the HP folk who had papers to write with a deadline | 19:16 |
| SpamapS | I did not know it was in need of driving (or even in existence actually) | 19:16 |
| shadower | lifeless: I wasn't here, would you elaborate pls? | 19:16 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: ok, so last week we agreed to put firedrills: a) critical in the bug tracker, b) in the firedrill column in trello and c) in the #tripleo channel topic. | 19:16 |
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| SpamapS | Did not look at any of those since Friday. | 19:17 |
| lifeless | shadower: the change to remove file injection on the cd-undercloud broke devtest because devtest's undercloud isn't being deployed identically to the cd-undercloud | 19:17 |
| SpamapS | (so therein lies the problem.. "SpamapS is scatterbrained" bug has been open for decades) | 19:18 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: today is your tuesday afternoon ? | 19:18 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: anyhow it's not about you specifically | 19:18 |
| rpodolyaka1 | so we basically need to use neutron_dhcp_agent and force use_file_injection=False? that should be done by derekh's patch with minor tweaks to nova config template | 19:19 |
| lifeless | there are 15 odd folk driving tripleo as a whole, each with specialities sure | 19:19 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: aye Tue 12:19 to be exact | 19:19 |
| *** ozstacker has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 19:19 | |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: right, my concern here is that noone - myself included - said 'moving that bug forward is the most important thing for the team' | 19:19 |
| rpodolyaka1 | I managed to get working overcloud today but haven't tried to run a user VM yet | 19:19 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: oh, but it sounds like you have - fantastic! | 19:19 |
| lifeless | anyhow, lets not obsess | 19:20 |
| rpodolyaka1 | I was close to reproduce/check this yesterday but hit some strage bugs with ext4_resize_fs() :( | 19:20 |
| derekh | rpodolyaka1: I managed to get use_file_injection=False by forcing it to string in heat template (by wraping in quotes) | 19:20 |
| marios_ | i got the overcloud vms up but they didn't get the ssh keys (so couldn't init the keystone setup etc) | 19:21 |
| marios_ | though that happened very late in afternoon and i left work a few hours ago | 19:21 |
| derekh | rpodolyaka1: will update bug with details after this meeting | 19:21 |
| lifeless | derekh: oh, is this because oac has a bug too ? That bug probably needs to be critical as well, since it's blocking another critical bug. | 19:21 |
| rpodolyaka1 | lifeless: no, oac bug looks similar but is irrelevant | 19:21 |
| rpodolyaka1 | *it | 19:22 |
| lifeless | rpodolyaka1: oh, ok. | 19:22 |
| lifeless | ah, I see, it's the template. | 19:22 |
| lifeless | Lets get on that right after the meeting | 19:22 |
| lifeless | any other bug material? | 19:22 |
| Ng | 8 | 19:22 |
| Ng | derp | 19:23 |
| lifeless | orly ? ;) | 19:23 |
| lifeless | #topic reviews | 19:23 |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-openreviews.html | 19:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:23 | |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-30.txt | 19:23 |
| lifeless | http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-90.txt | 19:23 |
| lifeless | 19:23 | |
| lifeless | Stats since the last revision without -1 or -2 (ignoring jenkins): | 19:23 |
| lifeless | Average wait time: 1 days, 13 hours, 49 minutes | 19:23 |
| lifeless | 1rd quartile wait time: 0 days, 2 hours, 56 minutes | 19:23 |
| dkehn | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/50749/ | 19:23 |
| lifeless | Median wait time: 0 days, 4 hours, 3 minutes | 19:23 |
| lifeless | 3rd quartile wait time: 1 days, 4 hours, 29 minutes | 19:23 |
| lifeless | 19:23 | |
| lifeless | Longest waiting reviews (based on oldest rev without nack, ignoring jenkins): | 19:23 |
| lifeless | and | 19:23 |
| lifeless | 6 days, 8 hours, 37 minutes https://review.openstack.org/50341 (Add unique constraint to ResourceClass.) | 19:24 |
| lifeless | 5 days, 19 hours, 58 minutes https://review.openstack.org/52236 (add python-ironicclient to openstack-clients) | 19:24 |
| lifeless | 1 days, 4 hours, 29 minutes https://review.openstack.org/49729 (Add Glance image id to `resource_classes` table) | 19:24 |
| lifeless | 0 days, 4 hours, 20 minutes https://review.openstack.org/50477 (WIP : Add tempest elements) | 19:24 |
| lifeless | 0 days, 4 hours, 3 minutes https://review.openstack.org/53128 (Add James Slagle to tripleo-cd-admins.) | 19:24 |
| lifeless | so overall we're going ok, but there are reviews waiting nearly a week | 19:24 |
| viktors_ | Add unique constraint to ResourceClass - there is already two +2 | 19:24 |
| jistr | i'm gonna approve it | 19:24 |
| viktors_ | thanks | 19:25 |
| jistr | we didn't approve because we had failing jenkins at the time | 19:25 |
| lifeless | fair enough, do you know when jenkins got fixed ? | 19:25 |
| jistr | well it's in the bug that we filled for it | 19:25 |
| jistr | lemme dig it up | 19:25 |
| lifeless | also you can 'recheck bug XXXX' to probe and find out if jenkins is fixed without causing gate pipeline resets. | 19:25 |
| lifeless | jistr: cool thanks, I'm curious how long the review sat in inventory is all | 19:26 |
| jistr | lifeless: we did a common patch for it with pblaho https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar/+bug/1240934 | 19:26 |
| lifeless | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/52236/ looks like gerrit got confused | 19:26 |
| lifeless | I'll ask about that one in -infra | 19:26 |
| lifeless | slagle: btw its good seeing lots of reviews from you - thank you! | 19:28 |
| lifeless | most folk seem to have stepped up to the plate in fact | 19:28 |
| lifeless | which is awesome | 19:28 |
| slagle | lifeless: thanks. been trying to keep up :) | 19:28 |
| lsmola | lifeless, ?? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/52236 , it is waiting for dependency to get in, right? | 19:29 |
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| rpodolyaka1 | indeed | 19:29 |
| lifeless | lsmola: yeah | 19:29 |
| lifeless | lsmola: just had cluebat applied to me in -infra :) | 19:30 |
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| lsmola | lifeless, :-) | 19:30 |
| lifeless | so the review stats tool could benefit by taking that into account in some fashion | 19:30 |
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| lsmola | lifeless, +1 | 19:30 |
| lifeless | overall, I'm happy with where we are at with reviews: is anyone unhappy? Are you finding reviewing hard? Are you getting reviews in a timely manner? Are they supportive? Are you getting tossed all over by contradictory reviews? | 19:31 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: my only complaint is that non-tripleo programs do not review nearly as rapidly as tripleo programs. ;) | 19:31 |
| lsmola | hehe | 19:32 |
| SpamapS | I've gotten rather spoiled | 19:32 |
| *** malini is now known as malini_afk | 19:32 | |
| lifeless | SpamapS: from a centre of excelllence.... | 19:32 |
| dkehn | lifeless: 625 St. Ann Street | 19:32 |
| lifeless | ok, next topic | 19:32 |
| dkehn | lifeless: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/50749/ | 19:32 |
| lifeless | #topic projects needing releases | 19:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "projects needing releases (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:33 | |
| lifeless | dkehn: interesting, did you change the commit id on my draft? I'm going to guess it was 'abandoned' and thus you couldn't push to it | 19:33 |
| lifeless | Ng: how did you go getting a release of everything out ? | 19:33 |
| Ng | lifeless: tripleo-heat-templates and the three tuskars are still pending, I failed to drive those through in time for today | 19:34 |
| lifeless | Ng: ok, want to take the challenge up for another week ? | 19:34 |
| Ng | all the other bits (incubator excepted) got releases last week | 19:34 |
| Ng | lifeless: I absolutely do | 19:34 |
| lifeless | Ng: since many things have had commits | 19:34 |
| lifeless | Ng: we need more releases :) | 19:34 |
| lifeless | Ng: cool! | 19:35 |
| Ng | ok | 19:35 |
| lifeless | #action ng to push the release wheelbarrow | 19:35 |
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| lifeless | #action Ng to push the release wheelbarrow | 19:35 |
| lifeless | is it just me, or am I failing to drive mootbot? | 19:35 |
| lifeless | meetbot | 19:35 |
| lifeless | ok | 19:36 |
| lifeless | #topic CD cloud status | 19:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CD cloud status (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:36 | |
| lifeless | I'll take this one | 19:36 |
| lifeless | The CD cloud is deploying very reliably *except* | 19:36 |
| lifeless | every couple of days the mellanox ethernet adapter is losing the plot | 19:37 |
| lifeless | the symptoms are that it starts failing | 19:37 |
| lifeless | and the logs show DNS lookup errors | 19:37 |
| lifeless | doing a while true; do host cd-overcloud.tripleo.org; done loop | 19:37 |
| lifeless | results in one in 20 or so failing | 19:37 |
| lifeless | pings /mtr to the name servers don't show a fail | 19:37 |
| lifeless | I've fixed this by | 19:38 |
| lifeless | rmmod mlx4_en mlx4_core; modprobe mlx4_en; ip address del <undercloud 10.x>/26 dev eth2; ovs-vsctl del-port eth2; ovs-vsctl add-port br-ctlplane eth2 | 19:38 |
| lifeless | and it comes good for another couple of days | 19:38 |
| lifeless | I've added a card to the 'make things better' column for someone to dig into WTF is going on. | 19:39 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: saucy is out, maybe we should try with its shiny new kernel. :) | 19:39 |
| lifeless | Anyone tried actual workloads on the overcloud ? | 19:39 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: I think that should wait for us being able to actually redeploy the undercloud :> | 19:39 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: yeah we have 3 whole months before raring is dead. :) | 19:40 |
| * Ng has not tried workloads on the overcloud, I don't actually have any cloudy workloads I could retool for such a thing :/ | 19:40 | |
| lifeless | remember *everyone* can get overcloud accounts | 19:41 |
| lifeless | just propose yourself to the incubator | 19:41 |
| lifeless | free cloud accounts on top-grade hardware. Go for it! | 19:41 |
| lifeless | next topic in 1 mon | 19:41 |
| lifeless | *min* | 19:41 |
| Ng | and they're only going to erase your data every few hours! | 19:41 |
| marios_ | lol | 19:42 |
| lifeless | well, the passwords are stable | 19:42 |
| lifeless | so if the deployment is automated | 19:42 |
| lifeless | should be pretty straight forward | 19:42 |
| lifeless | and hey - next MVP is data persistence :P | 19:42 |
| SpamapS | we should try juju on it | 19:42 |
| lifeless | #topic CI virtualized testing progress | 19:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CI virtualized testing progress (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:42 | |
| lifeless | pleia2: how goes? | 19:43 |
| pleia2 | hey, so we now have an experimental check on the tripleo-incubator project | 19:43 |
| lifeless | \o/ | 19:44 |
| lifeless | all hail automated tests | 19:44 |
| pleia2 | can see it being run on this patch: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/52607/1 | 19:44 |
| lifeless | pleia2: whats next? | 19:44 |
| pleia2 | right now it's just an echo script, but we have images being successfully built and managed in the tripleo cloud from nodepool | 19:44 |
| pleia2 | next is Iteration 2 outlined here where we actually make it do something useful: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-test-cluster | 19:45 |
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| pleia2 | no updates on progress here really, have my test nodepool up to get some of the dependencies sorted first (it's currently erroring on some basic things that I need to work out) | 19:46 |
| lifeless | ok cool | 19:46 |
| lifeless | pleia2: btw you shouldn't need nodepool for iteration 2 at all | 19:46 |
| lifeless | pleia2: it's all now within other components | 19:47 |
| pleia2 | lifeless: hm, fair enough | 19:47 |
| lifeless | pleia2: so if I was hacking on it, I wouldn't be worrying about nodepool for now. | 19:47 |
| pleia2 | ok | 19:47 |
| lifeless | #topic review kanban | 19:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "review kanban (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:48 | |
| lifeless | so I added this one-off topic | 19:48 |
| lifeless | I'd like folks feedback on the use of kanban so far | 19:48 |
| lifeless | whats good about it? | 19:48 |
| lifeless | whats bad? | 19:48 |
| lifeless | What would you like changed? | 19:48 |
| Ng | I'm bad at keeping track day-to-day of where we are in it | 19:49 |
| SpamapS | I have found its mere presence helps me focus on the immediate. | 19:49 |
| lifeless | Ng: do you look at it day to day ? | 19:49 |
| * derekh same as Ng, just not checking it enough | 19:49 | |
| SpamapS | Just seeing trello in my open tabs reminds me "go work on MVP" | 19:49 |
| rpodolyaka1 | it's convenient for finding out what folks are currently working on, what current MVPs are | 19:49 |
| SpamapS | and it is quite a sense of pride when I get to move a card to done :) | 19:50 |
| Ng | lifeless: no :) | 19:50 |
| SpamapS | I do not look at it day to day, because I am following the "only have one thing assigned to yourself".. so unless I finish one thing a day.. it doesn't get a detailed look until I finish the thing I am doing now. | 19:51 |
| Ng | between bug triage and trello, I'm starting to think I need to have a stricter cadence to my days/week where I'm looking around at things more | 19:51 |
| lifeless | so the tension is between flow and unblocking other people | 19:51 |
| lifeless | if we just do our one thing | 19:51 |
| lifeless | it's easy | 19:51 |
| lifeless | but other folk can get stuck | 19:51 |
| lifeless | represented by bugs [untriaged], firedrills [bug/topic/kanban], reviews[no -1/-2] | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | Right, so to me it is "unblock others" followed by "do MVP work" | 19:52 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: yeah | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | Though I admit that unblock has been 99% reviews. | 19:52 |
| SpamapS | As evidenced by the lack of triage by all of us :) | 19:52 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: so it seems to me we need to poll the metadata for 'is someone out there blocked' at least once a day | 19:52 |
| lifeless | as a team | 19:53 |
| lifeless | but possibly as individuals too. | 19:53 |
| lifeless | Any other thoughts? | 19:53 |
| Ng | makes sense | 19:54 |
| SpamapS | seems like that would be worth a tool to do that | 19:54 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: add it to the roadmap ? | 19:54 |
| Ng | my ponies and rainbows tool would be an IRC bot that notices when I come on in the morning and tells me if there's a firedrill, how many untriaged bugs there are, and suchlike | 19:55 |
| SpamapS | one person could probably whip up an "obvious blockers" report just pulling all of the obvious data into one place that we all start at. Given the number of people involved, probably worth the time to do it. | 19:55 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: as a card we can pickup ? | 19:55 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: yes doing that | 19:55 |
| lifeless | cool | 19:55 |
| lifeless | ok, 2nd last topic | 19:55 |
| lifeless | oh and russel just fixed http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-openreviews.html for us | 19:55 |
| lifeless | approved patches will no longer show as stuck, because they aren't, its' their deps that are stuck and they will be getting evolved | 19:56 |
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| lifeless | #topic review the tweaked reviewer rules | 19:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "review the tweaked reviewer rules (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:56 | |
| lifeless | So, last week we decided: | 19:56 |
| lifeless | - cd reviews could use two +2's from anywhere | 19:56 |
| lifeless | - multiple author reviews can use a +2 from the submitters | 19:57 |
| lifeless | Feedback on those changes? | 19:57 |
| lifeless | Working? Keep it? Discard it? | 19:57 |
| SpamapS | keep it, it has already been used and helped keep the train moving | 19:57 |
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| jistr | multiple author rule worked well for us on the Jenkins critical bug | 19:57 |
| Ng | lifeless: keep it | 19:57 |
| rpodolyaka1 | +1 | 19:58 |
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| lifeless | #agreed keep the review tweaks we introduced last week | 19:58 |
| lifeless | #topic open discussion | 19:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:58 | |
| Ng | I did something on two reviews which I think was slightly outside those rules, but seemed pretty reasonable | 19:58 |
| lifeless | 2 minutes y'll | 19:58 |
| Ng | there was a +2 already, but a typo in the commit message, which I fixed and carried the existing +2 forwards, added my own and Approved | 19:58 |
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| lifeless | Ng: thats inside the rules | 19:59 |
| lifeless | Ng: you + original author - one +2. Other reviewer second +2. Done. | 20:00 |
| Ng | :) | 20:00 |
| lifeless | Ng: the 'approve' button is orthogonal. | 20:00 |
| lifeless | ok, tiems pu | 20:00 |
| lifeless | thanks everyone | 20:00 |
| lifeless | times up. | 20:01 |
| lifeless | #endmeeting | 20:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meetings (alternate)" | 20:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 20:01:03 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:01 |
| Ng | thanks lifeless :) | 20:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-10-22-19.01.html | 20:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-10-22-19.01.txt | 20:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2013/tripleo.2013-10-22-19.01.log.html | 20:01 |
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| lsmola | thanks everyone, good night | 20:01 |
| jistr | thanks all, good night | 20:01 |
| rpodolyaka1 | night! | 20:01 |
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| tzumainn | thanks all | 20:01 |
| marios_ | night | 20:01 |
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| viktors_ | night | 20:01 |
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| jcoufal | night | 20:03 |
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