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| irenab | hi, anyone for PCI meeting? | 13:02 |
|---|---|---|
| rpothier | o/ | 13:02 |
| irenab | rpothier: hi | 13:03 |
| baoli | #startmeeting PCI passthrough | 13:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Aug 26 13:03:12 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is baoli. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: PCI passthrough)" | 13:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'pci_passthrough' | 13:03 |
| baoli | Hi, everyone | 13:03 |
| irenab | hi | 13:03 |
| irenab | baoli: How is going? | 13:03 |
| baoli | irenab, let me report my status. | 13:04 |
| irenab | baoli: I meant generally, not patches :-) | 13:04 |
| baoli | irenab, I don't understand | 13:04 |
| baoli | irenab, sorry, my bad | 13:05 |
| irenab | baoli: never mind | 13:06 |
| baoli | yea, the summer is about to be over, and the school starts tomorrow. | 13:07 |
| irenab | baoli: cool, we have few more days till back to school | 13:07 |
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| baoli | irenab, that's better. My son is not excited about going back to school | 13:09 |
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| irenab | baoli: :-) | 13:09 |
| irenab | smart guy | 13:09 |
| heyongli | hi | 13:09 |
| baoli | heyongli, hi | 13:09 |
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| baoli | ok, I think we can get started | 13:09 |
| irenab | +1 | 13:10 |
| baoli | status wise, you probably have seen the activities from the review. | 13:10 |
| baoli | it's getting closer, but a couple of sticking issues | 13:11 |
| baoli | The first one is about the use of the system metadata for pci requests which is a 255 bytes json doc. And the concern is the out of bound issue | 13:11 |
| irenab | baoli: I have some concern regarding the patch: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/107466/43/nova/virt/libvirt/vif.py | 13:12 |
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| baoli | The second one is about the data structure of the requested network, adding the request_id into the existing tuple | 13:12 |
| baoli | irenab, what about it? | 13:13 |
| irenab | baoli: can you please take a look at Itzik comment on patch#42 | 13:13 |
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| heyongli | baoli, i will recheck the 2 concerns to find out what we can do | 13:13 |
| irenab | after rebase you missed the cleanup for plug_hw_veb and unplug_hw_veb | 13:14 |
| irenab | as code is now, it fails for hw_veb vif_type | 13:14 |
| baoli | irenab, hmm, I changed it, I need to find out why the change was not uploaded. | 13:15 |
| irenab | baoli: thanks! | 13:15 |
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| baoli | heyongli, I'm hoping that Dan can agree with addressing them separately. | 13:18 |
| heyongli | oh, stick one, we can negotiate and same time try find a solution or better implementation, anyway , we try | 13:18 |
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| irenab | AFAIK September 4 is last day for code to merge | 13:20 |
| heyongli | very tight schedule for us | 13:21 |
| irenab | But bug fixes can land later | 13:21 |
| baoli | we have only a few days left. | 13:22 |
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| irenab | I think probably better to fill bugs for the issues to resolve them later, if it is not blocking the solution of course | 13:22 |
| heyongli | worth to try | 13:22 |
| baoli | irenab, I'm hoping that the cores think the same way | 13:22 |
| baoli | I will have several bugs/enhancements to file, for sure | 13:23 |
| baoli | any thing else that you guys want to talk about? | 13:24 |
| irenab | there were few action items we took last week | 13:24 |
| baoli | ireanb, can you recap? I didn't look at last week's log yet. | 13:24 |
| irenab | I need to start the list of next work items in the SR-IOV networking area | 13:25 |
| baoli | irenab, on the neutron side? | 13:25 |
| irenab | rpothier: to investigate on HEAT to configure VM with port vnic_type = direct | 13:26 |
| irenab | baoli: no, as a further functionality as well | 13:26 |
| irenab | once basic support including nova patches you push will be merged, what is next | 13:26 |
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| baoli | irenab, we have a list on the meeting wiki, but may not be complete. We also talked about rewriting the ml2 driver | 13:27 |
| irenab | I hope to cover it during this week, and send an email for you guys to add | 13:27 |
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| irenab | baoli: refactoring of ML2 plugins defenitely in the list | 13:27 |
| baoli | irenab, cool | 13:28 |
| irenab | baoli: I'll start from the wiki | 13:28 |
| baoli | irenab, send the list to the ML, and we can start from there | 13:28 |
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| irenab | baoli: sure | 13:28 |
| rpothier | irenab: I looked into Heat, vnic_type can be configured currently, however a OS::Neutron::pci-port type would be better | 13:29 |
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| irenab | rpothier: can you please explain or maybe share some HEAT template to define VM with SR-IOV port? | 13:30 |
| irenab | rpothier: Does it require to add support to HEAT? | 13:30 |
| rpothier | I have a basic template at http://paste.openstack.org/show/100473/ | 13:31 |
| irenab | rpothier: nice! | 13:33 |
| heyongli | thanks | 13:33 |
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| irenab | rpothier: Do you suggest to add OS::Neutron::pci-port ? | 13:33 |
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| rpothier | irenab: yes | 13:34 |
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| rpothier | it's much clearer than adding parameters to value_spec | 13:34 |
| irenab | rpothier: so the Template can be simplified, right? | 13:35 |
| rpothier | irenab: yes | 13:35 |
| heyongli | sriov is tech detail , pci thing might close to user, seems good | 13:35 |
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| irenab | rpothier: Is it something you want me to put on the list of next tasks, or plan to work on it during Juno? | 13:36 |
| irenab | as long as there is a way to define it, I do not think its urgent to add | 13:37 |
| rpothier | irenab: yes, you can put it on the list, not sure on timing | 13:37 |
| irenab | rpothier: sure. Thanks a lot for checking | 13:38 |
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| irenab | do you know of some task that is critical to complete for our current support? | 13:38 |
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| irenab | Let's hope that nova patches will be merged soon and we can start focusing on next items | 13:41 |
| baoli | let's keep our finger acrossed | 13:42 |
| baoli | s/acrossed/crossed | 13:42 |
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| baoli | and that's the highest priority | 13:43 |
| baoli | anything else? | 13:43 |
| irenab | not for me | 13:43 |
| heyongli | no for me | 13:43 |
| baoli | good day and good night. See you guys next time | 13:43 |
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| irenab | see you | 13:43 |
| baoli | #endmeeting | 13:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 13:43 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Aug 26 13:43:54 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 13:43 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-08-26-13.03.html | 13:43 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-08-26-13.03.txt | 13:43 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/pci_passthrough/2014/pci_passthrough.2014-08-26-13.03.log.html | 13:43 |
| heyongli | ok baoli, i try to pull more people foucus on nova side | 13:44 |
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| baoli | heyongli, thanks | 13:48 |
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| adrian_otto | #startmeeting Solum Team Meeting | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Aug 26 16:00:13 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is adrian_otto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'solum_team_meeting' | 16:00 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Solum#Agenda_for_2014-08-26_2200_UTC Our Agenda | 16:00 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Roll Call | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:00 | |
| adrian_otto | Adrian Otto | 16:00 |
| datsun180b | Ed Cranford | 16:00 |
| ravips | Ravi Sankar Penta | 16:00 |
| devkulkarni | Devdatta Kulkarni | 16:00 |
| gpilz | Gilbert Pilz | 16:00 |
| muralia | Murali Allada | 16:00 |
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| stannie1 | Pierre Padrixe | 16:01 |
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| roshanagr | Roshan Agrawal | 16:01 |
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| james_li | james li | 16:01 |
| adrian_otto | welcome everyone. Let's begin | 16:02 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Announcements | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:02 | |
| ravips | I will be on ETO from Aug 29th to Sep 12th, so will miss the next 2 meetings | 16:02 |
| diga_ | Hi | 16:02 |
| adrian_otto | ravips: enjoy your time off!! | 16:03 |
| datsun180b | have fun! | 16:03 |
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| adrian_otto | I'll count that as Announcement #1 | 16:03 |
| devkulkarni | have fun ravips | 16:03 |
| ravips | thanks :) | 16:03 |
| adrian_otto | Announcement #2 is: | 16:03 |
| adrian_otto | Our team has expressed an intent to pursue incubation for Solum. | 16:03 |
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| adrian_otto | One of the criteria for exiting incubation is showing production usage of the software from a project team. | 16:03 |
| adrian_otto | Rackspace is now using Solum in a production capacity in the delivery of one of it's managed services. | 16:04 |
| diga_ | ok | 16:04 |
| adrian_otto | I look forward to announcing other production uses of Solum as I learn about them. | 16:04 |
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| adrian_otto | thanks to all our contributors for helping to make this possible | 16:04 |
| adrian_otto | Announcement #3 is: | 16:05 |
| adrian_otto | Release 2014.2.1 (+python.solumclient 1.2.1) cut. | 16:05 |
| adrian_otto | #link http://tarballs.openstack.org/solum/solum-2014.2.1.tar.gz Solum 2014.2.1 Release Tarball | 16:05 |
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| adrian_otto | #link http://tarballs.openstack.org/solum/solum-2014.2.1.tar.gz Solum 2014.2.1 Release Tarball | 16:05 |
| muralia | woot! | 16:05 |
| adrian_otto | I still have some administrative shoveling to do in Launchpad | 16:05 |
| datsun180b | that's a good verb for that | 16:05 |
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| adrian_otto | but *applause* for another release for both solum and python-solumclient that include a lot of our blood sweat and tears | 16:06 |
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| adrian_otto | the bug fixlists are impressive | 16:06 |
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| adrian_otto | Announcement #4 is: | 16:06 |
| adrian_otto | #link http://openstacksv.com/ Openstack Silicon Valley 2014-09-16 | 16:06 |
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| adrian_otto | this is an OpenStack event happening in Northern California next month | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | I will be attending. It happens to fall on a Tuesday, so it will conflict with our team meeting | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | I'd like to plan to take one of two actions: 1) Cancel out 9/16 team meeting -or- 2) Select a pro-tem chair to run it while I am out | 16:08 |
| adrian_otto | what are your preferences? | 16:08 |
| devkulkarni | keep the meeting so that there is continuity | 16:08 |
| datsun180b | i say keep the pattern, #2 | 16:08 |
| ravips | option-2 preferred | 16:08 |
| james_li | +1 | 16:08 |
| muralia | +1 | 16:08 |
| adrian_otto | ok, in that case, I will take volunteers to chair | 16:08 |
| stannie | #2 | 16:08 |
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| devkulkarni | I can do it | 16:09 |
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| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: thanks. | 16:09 |
| datsun180b | i've got prior experience! i'll even file the minutes in the right directory this time | 16:09 |
| adrian_otto | any objections? | 16:09 |
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| devkulkarni | datsun180b: cool. I will pick your brain then :) | 16:09 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so devkulkarni can be the chair, and if he does not appear on time, then datsun180b will assume the role for him. | 16:10 |
| datsun180b | dev's got this | 16:10 |
| devkulkarni | sounds good | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | #agreed devkulkarni will chair our team meeting on 2014-09-16 | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | Announcement #5 is: | 16:10 |
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| adrian_otto | All Bug/Task tickets have been triaged. Please check to see if you have any marked INCOMPLETE. | 16:10 |
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| adrian_otto | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/solum/+bugs Our Bug List for Solum | 16:11 |
| adrian_otto | so now is the time to scan the backlog of bugs and tasks, and to get me your input for what should be included in juno-3. I have some guidance from you already. | 16:11 |
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| adrian_otto | it's not too late to make a case for including anything you are willing to allocate engineering resources towards. | 16:12 |
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| devkulkarni | is there a link for juno-3 that you can share with all? | 16:12 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: not yet. That is one of the shoveling items I need to do | 16:12 |
| devkulkarni | okay. | 16:13 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, so that concludes our announcements. (that was a bunch!) | 16:13 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Review Action Items | 16:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:13 | |
| devkulkarni | while we are discussing juno, could we curate juno-2 | 16:13 |
| adrian_otto | (none) | 16:13 |
| stannie | so what has been written by roshan in the wiki/ml is not the final roadmap for juno-3 right ? | 16:13 |
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| adrian_otto | stannie: not final, but that is my guideline, yes | 16:14 |
| stannie | ok | 16:14 |
| roshanagr | stannnie: that is meant to be a basis for discussionm not final | 16:14 |
| adrian_otto | if you have strong feelings about adjusting anything, let's talk | 16:14 |
| adrian_otto | we have room for that in Open Discussion today | 16:14 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Blueprint/Task Review | 16:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Blueprint/Task Review (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:14 | |
| adrian_otto | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/solum/+bug/1358462 Java+Tomcat Language Pack | 16:15 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1358462 in solum "Create Java+Tomcat language pack to run Java web applications" [Undecided,Incomplete] | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | Should we develop a Java language pack? Are existing Build Packs sufficient? | 16:15 |
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| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: so we need some investigation about whether CF Javabuildpack would work as is in Solum or not | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | the reason I am raising this for discussion is because similar work appears to be happening in other open source projects that we may be able to leverage. | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | here is a link for that: | 16:15 |
| adrian_otto | #link http://blog.cloudfoundry.org/2013/09/06/introducing-the-cloud-foundry-java-buildpack/ CF Java BuildPack | 16:16 |
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| roshanagr | Java is a popular language so should support that our of box in Solum. | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | my understanding is that at least one also exists for Heroku | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | roshanagr: agreed. | 16:16 |
| devkulkarni | so we already support Java runtime via cedarish stack | 16:16 |
| roshanagr | We do need to work out if we want to build our own docker image for it, or leverage CF build pack | 16:16 |
| ravips | yeah, I agree if there is an existing buildpack we can leverage thta | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | my question is whether we accomplish that by leveraging prior art, or making our own equivalent(s) | 16:16 |
| gpilz | it would be uber-cool if I could run the VitaMinder example on both nCAMP and Solum | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | I also recognize that OpenShift has good support for JBOSS | 16:17 |
| devkulkarni | gpilz: what all things do you need for that app to run? jdk version/maven/tomcat ? | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | so it might make sense to explore that too | 16:17 |
| roshanagr | leveraging prior art (say CF build pack) is worth exploring | 16:17 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: sure | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | recognizing that a JBOSS runtime and a Tomcat runtime are rather different. | 16:18 |
| roshanagr | how do we think of TomCat | 16:18 |
| ravips | openshift cartridges is curently on v2 (yaml format) and v3 format will support dockerfile | 16:18 |
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| roshanagr | I think Java Tomcat 7 would be nice | 16:18 |
| devkulkarni | roshanagr: sure.. I guess one problem with picking a specific tool and specific version | 16:19 |
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| devkulkarni | is there is a high probability that we will become outdated soon.. | 16:19 |
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| gpilz | +1 Tomcat 7 - known quantity | 16:19 |
| devkulkarni | what we should aim at is doing something that we are currently doing for Python/Ruby.. have a 'requirements.txt' kind of thing in the repo and then use it to build the runtime with the required tools | 16:20 |
| adrian_otto | the root of my question really comes down to whether we want the support/maintenance commitment that comes with developing an LP for a given language | 16:20 |
| devkulkarni | the only thing that would not really change is jdk version (which will be somewhat stable) | 16:20 |
| adrian_otto | should that be carried by the open source project, or the cloud operators? | 16:20 |
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| devkulkarni | open source project like ours will be always short handed trying to support | 16:21 |
| gpilz | seems like a core set of LPs should be carried by the project | 16:21 |
| devkulkarni | all the lps that people may want | 16:21 |
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| devkulkarni | we should provide reference LPs | 16:21 |
| adrian_otto | projects in the CI/CD space leave hands off of this, and projects in the PaaS space seem to take this on. | 16:21 |
| devkulkarni | with ability to create custom LPs | 16:21 |
| stannie | by the opensource project is fine but we have to make sure it's up to date with the latest security fixes (always some troubles with java :/) | 16:21 |
| roshanagr | adrian_otto: to your point, are you suggesting we add support for "custom language packs" and democratise what does into the language pack | 16:21 |
| devkulkarni | roshanagr: we already have support for custom language pack | 16:22 |
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| adrian_otto | I want us to make a concious decision to enter the world of language specific LP's | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | (the API part still needs some work) | 16:22 |
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| adrian_otto | or a deliberate decision not to | 16:22 |
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| roshanagr | devkulkarni: good to know ! | 16:22 |
| devkulkarni | I suggest we provide some reference packs (Java 8 with Tomcat 7, for ex) | 16:23 |
| devkulkarni | and then provide the custom language pack API | 16:23 |
| devkulkarni | which would enable consumers of a particular instance of Solum to create their own LPs | 16:23 |
| devkulkarni | and register them in their own Glance | 16:23 |
| devkulkarni | to be used in their plan files | 16:23 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: one possible drawback to that approach is that we may be incorrectly perceived as an XYZ language only solution | 16:23 |
| stannie | in CF what is cool is that you can fork the LP source and then extend the LP with your specific changes | 16:24 |
| adrian_otto | just like Heroku was before they produced reference Build Packs for a variety of languages | 16:24 |
| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: valid point | 16:24 |
| adrian_otto | in fact that was DotCloud's point of differentiation | 16:24 |
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| devkulkarni | so one way to get around that will be to not tie the LPs that we provide with the Solum codebase itself | 16:25 |
| adrian_otto | yes | 16:25 |
| adrian_otto | the language specific LP's could be isolated from Solum in that way | 16:25 |
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| adrian_otto | to exhibit an arms-length relationship | 16:25 |
| devkulkarni | right | 16:25 |
| roshanagr | adrian+otto: I like your suggested approach | 16:26 |
| devkulkarni | also to emphasize that the provided LPs are just for example | 16:26 |
| gpilz | adrian: does anyone really think anyone does language-specific PaaS anymore? | 16:26 |
| adrian_otto | and it would lend itself to delegating control to other groups for maintenance of them | 16:26 |
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| adrian_otto | so the Ruby experts can own one, and the Java experts can own another, etc. | 16:26 |
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| ravips | are we saying separate repo that will have reference implementations? | 16:26 |
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| adrian_otto | gpilz: you would be surprised how misguided most of the public is when given limited information | 16:27 |
| devkulkarni | gpilz: actually yes.. I have heard folks going to particular PaaS because that PaaS has the best support for Python | 16:27 |
| adrian_otto | ravips: yes, that's an option for us | 16:27 |
| devkulkarni | ravips: yes | 16:27 |
| adrian_otto | another approach might be to place them in contrib for now | 16:27 |
| adrian_otto | and label them very clearly as references | 16:28 |
| devkulkarni | yep. that's where we currently have the Dockerfiles for Chef and Go | 16:28 |
| ravips | okay | 16:28 |
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| devkulkarni | ravips: mind adding some links to that bug about OpenShift cartridges? | 16:29 |
| devkulkarni | whenever you get a chance | 16:29 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so maybe what we can do is start with a contrib approach | 16:29 |
| adrian_otto | and revisit this again once we have had some more time to consider the ramifications of including or moving that code to other projects | 16:30 |
| ravips | #link http://openshift.github.io/documentation/openshift-pep-010-docker-cartridges.html | 16:30 |
| devkulkarni | thanks ravips | 16:30 |
| adrian_otto | anyone object to starting with this compromise? | 16:30 |
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| devkulkarni | adrian_otto: sounds good to me | 16:30 |
| ravips | I like that | 16:31 |
| stannie | +1 | 16:31 |
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| muralia | +1 | 16:31 |
| adrian_otto | roshanagr: ? | 16:31 |
| gpilz | +1 | 16:31 |
| roshanagr | +1 | 16:31 |
| roshanagr | like it | 16:31 |
| james_li | +1 | 16:31 |
| adrian_otto | ok, good, one moment for the #agreed | 16:31 |
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| adrian_otto | #agreed Language specific language packs may be added to our contrib directory, labeled clearly as reference implementations, and shall be evaluated for movement to dedicated projects if/when they are used for production purposes and require ongoing maintenance. | 16:32 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, that satisfied my interest in this. I hope you all like that too. | 16:33 |
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| devkulkarni | +1 | 16:33 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, so we are still in bug/BP/task review | 16:33 |
| adrian_otto | I want to draw core reviewer attention to one review in particular… | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | https://review.openstack.org/111846 | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://review.openstack.org/111846 Add barbican/mistral devstack integration for functionaltests | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | I suggest we get any final feedback in for this work, and proceed to merging once it's acceptable | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | ahead of other priorities | 16:35 |
| datsun180b | looks like it's already got 2 approves, it's zuul is just hammered right now | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | there is other work that is depending on it | 16:35 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, good, that happened this morning then | 16:35 |
| datsun180b | that Toggle CI button is nice | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | thanks ravips for getting that in | 16:35 |
| devkulkarni | +1 thanks ravips | 16:35 |
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| ravips | thanks you all for your reviews | 16:36 |
| datsun180b | that review is also carrying a bugfix from image handler | 16:36 |
| adrian_otto | ok, are there other work items that need team discussion or attention? | 16:36 |
| devkulkarni | ravips's other patch (private git repo) | 16:36 |
| datsun180b | yeah that's a big one | 16:36 |
| devkulkarni | we all should try to get it in before ravips leaves for vacation (he has already gone through many rebases) | 16:37 |
| datsun180b | agreed | 16:37 |
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| adrian_otto | #link https://review.openstack.org/109468 Plan create/show will display artifact public ssh keys if present | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | is that the one you meant? | 16:37 |
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| devkulkarni | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/105605/ | 16:38 |
| devkulkarni | that one | 16:38 |
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| devkulkarni | ravips: Jenkins is complaining on it | 16:38 |
| muralia | this should get fixed when the first one gets merged | 16:38 |
| datsun180b | likely it's that image states ordering bug | 16:38 |
| ravips | yes, this one is dependent on previous pull request | 16:38 |
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| devkulkarni | the previous one being the one with barbican client? | 16:39 |
| ravips | yes | 16:39 |
| devkulkarni | ok | 16:39 |
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| datsun180b | http://logs.openstack.org/05/105605/12/check/gate-solum-devstack-dsvm/a39ff5b/console.html.gz devstack setup failed, looks like upstream deps | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | I don't see anything in the dependencies section for 105605 | 16:39 |
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| ravips | adrian_otto: how to add dependecies to PR? | 16:40 |
| datsun180b | cross-project, i don't think you can | 16:41 |
| * ravips still learning gerrit tool | 16:41 | |
| adrian_otto | ravips: I have not done it after the fact… the way I have done it is by checking out the parent branch, and then modifying it. and submitting it as a separate review | 16:41 |
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| adrian_otto | then it happens automatically | 16:42 |
| stannie | ravips: do you mean dependencies to a patch ? you have to submit a review with multiple commits | 16:42 |
| datsun180b | within the same project, dependency ordering is git patch ordering | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | but it's not important since the other chance is in the merge queue already | 16:42 |
| ravips | ah, ok I will try that next time | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | I'll order a recheck on 105605 once that merges | 16:42 |
| devkulkarni | right.. we don't need it now | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | so don't worry about it | 16:42 |
| ravips | okay | 16:42 |
| datsun180b | er commit ordering anyway | 16:42 |
| stannie | you just have to make sure you've different change-ids in your patch | 16:43 |
| ravips | ok, understood..thx | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | ok, any other things we should bird dog? | 16:43 |
| datsun180b | you can watch your meters fill up at http://status.openstack.org/zuul/ just filter on "solum" and expand the job boxes | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | ok, let's proceed to Open Discussion then | 16:44 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Open Discussion | 16:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Solum Team Meeting)" | 16:44 | |
| devkulkarni | Paris — do we have a slot for Solum? | 16:44 |
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| adrian_otto | not yet. | 16:45 |
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| adrian_otto | My submissions for Summit sessions (main conference) for Solum were all rejected (4 of them) | 16:45 |
| datsun180b | boo | 16:45 |
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| muralia | :( | 16:45 |
| adrian_otto | the only one accepted was my multi-cloud containers talk | 16:45 |
| devkulkarni | do they give feedback reviews? | 16:45 |
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| adrian_otto | once the call for submisions for OpenSource at OpenStack opens, we can apply for that. | 16:46 |
| adrian_otto | I am confident that we will get that again like we did in Atlanta | 16:46 |
| devkulkarni | and these are not part of the main conference? | 16:46 |
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| adrian_otto | that is part of the main conference, but it is not considered a Session | 16:46 |
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| adrian_otto | it's not part of the Design Summit though | 16:46 |
| adrian_otto | and we can still apply to have Design Summit sessions to discuss our various project integration concerns | 16:47 |
| devkulkarni | I see.. we should soon start articulating what next things we would want to discuss while at Paris | 16:47 |
| adrian_otto | that usually opens for submissions and voting about a month before the event | 16:47 |
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| devkulkarni | ok | 16:48 |
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| adrian_otto | on another tiopic, Solum team members should be aware of this | 16:49 |
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| adrian_otto | #link #link https://review.openstack.org/114044 OpenStack Containers Service Spec Proposal | 16:49 |
| adrian_otto | this is an effort within the OpenStack Compute project to add a new API service for containers to work in harmony with Nova | 16:50 |
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| devkulkarni | cool. thanks for sharing | 16:50 |
| adrian_otto | since we all use containers a lot, it would be nice to have your input on that proposal | 16:50 |
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| devkulkarni | would this API be part of nova or separate from it? | 16:51 |
| adrian_otto | devkulkarni: it would be a separate API that treats Nova as an upstream | 16:51 |
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| ravips | is this proposal in review or it got accepted by nova team? | 16:51 |
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| adrian_otto | it has been agreed to in concept by the Nova team, and we are iterating on it now | 16:52 |
| ravips | okay | 16:52 |
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| adrian_otto | that review is not intended to merge into nova-specs, because it will have it's own repo soon. | 16:53 |
| adrian_otto | it's there temporarily for collaboration purposes | 16:53 |
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| adrian_otto | whoops its != it's (sloppy grammar, Adrian) | 16:54 |
| * adrian_otto five minute bell | 16:55 | |
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| adrian_otto | ok, anything else for today? | 16:57 |
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| adrian_otto | thanks everyone for attending. I'll see you here again next week. Our next meeting is on 2014-09-02 at 2200 UTC. | 16:57 |
| adrian_otto | #endmeeting | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Aug 26 16:58:03 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-08-26-16.00.html | 16:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-08-26-16.00.txt | 16:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/solum_team_meeting/2014/solum_team_meeting.2014-08-26-16.00.log.html | 16:58 |
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| ruhe | #startmeeting murano | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Aug 26 17:01:13 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ruhe. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'murano' | 17:01 |
| ruhe | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/MuranoAgenda#Agenda | 17:01 |
| ruhe | murano team, are you here? | 17:01 |
| dteselkin | Hi | 17:02 |
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| ruhe | sergmelikyan, katyafervent, slagun, sjmc7: ping | 17:02 |
| sergmelikyan | Hi o/ | 17:02 |
| sjmc7 | hi | 17:02 |
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| ruhe | would someone like to add a topic for discussion before we begin? | 17:03 |
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| slagun | \o/ | 17:03 |
| ruhe | ok. we can add more topics while we go | 17:03 |
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| ruhe | #topic action items review | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "action items review (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:03 | |
| ruhe | there was only one | 17:04 |
| ruhe | gokrokve_ to create an etherpad for team to fill pros and cons of becoming a part of two programs vs having our own program | 17:04 |
| ruhe | gokrokve_: took it a bit differently and send an email with this idea to public mail | 17:04 |
| ruhe | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-August/043602.html | 17:04 |
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| sjmc7 | it sounded like the glance team were enthsuastic, heat much less so | 17:04 |
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| ruhe | that's correct | 17:05 |
| ruhe | this idea came up as a result of feedback from TC. but since heat team is not so enthsuastic about this. but all of that is still a useful feedback | 17:06 |
| ruhe | * but since heat team is not so enthsuastic about this we can build our next steps on that | 17:07 |
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| ruhe | sorry, i had too many meetings today. my brains works slow | 17:07 |
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| ruhe | we can continue on this topic in open discussion | 17:08 |
| ruhe | #topic juno-3 release | 17:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "juno-3 release (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:08 | |
| ruhe | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Juno_Release_Schedule | 17:08 |
| ruhe | that's just a heads up | 17:08 |
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| ruhe | we're following general openstack release schedule, so we're going to release munora juno-3 on september 4 | 17:09 |
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| ruhe | actual juno release is targeted for october 16. so we can spend that time on bug fixing and documentation improvements | 17:09 |
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| sjmc7 | our team should have some more time for upstream stuff midway through september i think | 17:10 |
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| sjmc7 | our first release is keeping us busy | 17:10 |
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| ruhe | sjmc7: i hope that lessons learned during your release will help to improve murano, i know they will | 17:11 |
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| ruhe | anything else for this topic? | 17:12 |
| ruhe | #topic documentation improvements in juno | 17:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "documentation improvements in juno (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:12 | |
| ruhe | so, katyafervent put up a document with items we can improve in our docs | 17:13 |
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| ruhe | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/murano-docs | 17:13 |
| ruhe | folks, please review this document | 17:13 |
| ruhe | feel free to add more items and/or comment on importance of each item | 17:13 |
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| ruhe | i'll create an action item for katyafervent to send out notice about this work to ML list | 17:14 |
| katyafervent2 | Ok | 17:14 |
| ruhe | #action katyafervent send out a notice about documentation improvements in murano | 17:14 |
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| ruhe | sjmc7: you said that your team is going to work on documentation. is it in juno time frame? | 17:15 |
| sjmc7 | during september | 17:15 |
| ruhe | great | 17:16 |
| sjmc7 | so i think we could get it merged back within juno timeframe | 17:16 |
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| ruhe | sjmc7: will you have time to review this document? maybe, mark the items your team needs to have. just to avoid work duplication | 17:17 |
| sjmc7 | i'll make sure our docs team know about it | 17:17 |
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| sjmc7 | it's not our developers writing it | 17:17 |
| ruhe | ah. thanks | 17:17 |
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| ruhe | anything else for this topic? | 17:18 |
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| katyafervent2 | no | 17:18 |
| ruhe | 40 minutes left and we're ready to switch to #open discussion | 17:19 |
| ruhe | #topic open discussion | 17:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:19 | |
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| katyafervent2 | Will we support getting-started guide? | 17:19 |
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| ruhe | katyafervent2: if we have documentation we either support it or get rid of it (in case if it's obsolete) | 17:20 |
| sergmelikyan | Having only developers oriented documentation is wrong, we have few group of users and we should have clean targeted documentation | 17:20 |
| katyafervent2 | Ok, so it should be totally reworked | 17:20 |
| sjmc7 | ours will be user-oriented | 17:21 |
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| ruhe | slagun: are you here? | 17:22 |
| slagun | o/ | 17:22 |
| ruhe | do you have any updates on "trusts"? | 17:23 |
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| slagun | I tried several alternate approaches and it seems that trust is the only option for nod though I not like it much. Currently I updating engine's code to support new approach | 17:24 |
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| slagun | I thing I'll finish by Thursday (tomorrow gonna be yaql day) | 17:24 |
| slagun | *think | 17:25 |
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| ruhe | ok. so, theere is a good chance we get trusts in juno | 17:25 |
| ruhe | anything else for today? | 17:26 |
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| katyafervent2 | do we have super critacal bugs? | 17:27 |
| sergmelikyan | we have several bugs with high priority | 17:28 |
| katyafervent2 | will we do a blueprint review someday? | 17:28 |
| katyafervent2 | what time do we have until the code freeze? | 17:28 |
| ruhe | katyafervent2: i'll review blueprints and contact people in person | 17:28 |
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| ruhe | katyafervent2: as i said juno-3 is targeted for september 4 | 17:28 |
| katyafervent2 | and after juno-3 is code freeze? | 17:29 |
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| ruhe | no, there will be release candidates | 17:29 |
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| ruhe | we will accept only bug fixes during that phase | 17:29 |
| sergmelikyan | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Juno_Release_Schedule | 17:29 |
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| katyafervent2 | ok | 17:29 |
| katyafervent2 | thanks for the link | 17:29 |
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| ruhe | i guess we can wrap up early today | 17:31 |
| ruhe | and get back to our routine | 17:32 |
| katyafervent2 | Goodbuy everyone! | 17:32 |
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| katyafervent2 | *Goodbye | 17:32 |
| ruhe | thanks eveyrone and goodbye | 17:32 |
| sergmelikyan | thx | 17:32 |
| ruhe | #endmeeting | 17:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:32 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Aug 26 17:32:48 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:32 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-08-26-17.01.html | 17:32 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-08-26-17.01.txt | 17:32 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2014/murano.2014-08-26-17.01.log.html | 17:32 |
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| jdob | o/ | 19:00 |
| marios_ | \o | 19:01 |
| tchaypo | o/ | 19:02 |
| alexislee | o/ | 19:02 |
| tchaypo | hrm, no lifeless yet. | 19:02 |
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| tchaypo | I need a few minutes to wake up but then i can run the meeting if needed | 19:02 |
| GheRivero | o/ | 19:02 |
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| jprovazn | hi | 19:03 |
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| tchaypo | nope, we have a lifeless | 19:03 |
| slagle | hi | 19:04 |
| lifeless | hi | 19:04 |
| lifeless | sorryforbeinglate | 19:05 |
| lifeless | #startmeeting tripleo | 19:05 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Aug 26 19:05:11 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is lifeless. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:05 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:05 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tripleo' | 19:05 |
| bnemec | \o | 19:05 |
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| lifeless | #topic agenda | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * bugs | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * reviews | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * Projects needing releases | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * CD Cloud status | 19:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:07 | |
| lifeless | * CI | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * Tuskar | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * Specs | 19:07 |
| lifeless | * open discussion | 19:07 |
| lifeless | Remember that anyone can use the link and info commands, not just the moderator - if you have something worth noting in the meeting minutes feel free to tag it | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #topic bugs | 19:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:07 | |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/ | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/diskimage-builder/ | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-refresh-config | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-apply-config | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-collect-config | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/os-cloud-config | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tuskar | 19:07 |
| lifeless | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-tuskarclient | 19:07 |
| slagle | i don't think we have any untriaged bugs | 19:08 |
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| lifeless | we have a bunch of criticals still though | 19:08 |
| lifeless | bug 1263294 | 19:08 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1263294 in tripleo "ephemeral0 of /dev/sda1 triggers 'did not find entry for sda1 in /sys/block'" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1263294 | 19:08 |
| lifeless | bug 1316985 | 19:08 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1316985 in tripleo "set -eu may spuriously break dkms module" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1316985 | 19:08 |
| lifeless | bug 1317056 | 19:08 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1317056 in tripleo "Guest VM FS corruption after compute host reboot" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1317056 | 19:08 |
| lifeless | bug 1361235 | 19:08 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1361235 in tripleo "visit horizon failure because of import module failure" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1361235 | 19:08 |
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| tchaypo | GheRivero: Do you have an update on https://launchpad.net/bugs/1316985 ? | 19:09 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1316985 in tripleo "set -eu may spuriously break dkms module" [Critical,In progress] | 19:09 |
| GheRivero | I just need some love" https://review.openstack.org/#/c/104115/ | 19:09 |
| slagle | i've put a patch for a workaround for 1361235 | 19:10 |
| slagle | needs some reviews, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/116721/ | 19:10 |
| slagle | we could drop the bug to High...i was on the fence | 19:10 |
| lifeless | broken builds are crit IMO here - if we were tempesting this it would have failed | 19:11 |
| lifeless | boris-42: have you seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1361235 ? | 19:11 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1361235 in tripleo "visit horizon failure because of import module failure" [Critical,In progress] | 19:11 |
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| lifeless | #info please review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/116721/ (critical bugfix) | 19:12 |
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| lifeless | no sign of rpodolyka - hope he's ok | 19:12 |
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| tchaypo | #info GheRivero needs some reviews on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/104115/ (critical bugfix) | 19:13 |
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| lifeless | tchaypo: could you perhaps volunteer to ping michael and roman for the other two bugs ? | 19:13 |
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| tchaypo | lifeless: consider me volunteered | 19:14 |
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| lifeless | #info tchaypo will follow up on bug 1263294 and bug 1317056 with assignees | 19:15 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1263294 in tripleo "ephemeral0 of /dev/sda1 triggers 'did not find entry for sda1 in /sys/block'" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1263294 | 19:15 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1317056 in tripleo "Guest VM FS corruption after compute host reboot" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1317056 | 19:15 |
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| lifeless | any other bug stuff to discuss? | 19:15 |
| lifeless | #topic reviews | 19:16 |
| lifeless | #info There's a new dashboard linked from https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/TripleO#Review_team - look for "TripleO Inbox Dashboard" | 19:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:16 | |
| lifeless | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-openreviews.html | 19:16 |
| lifeless | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-30.txt | 19:16 |
| lifeless | #link http://russellbryant.net/openstack-stats/tripleo-reviewers-90.txt | 19:16 |
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| lifeless | 19:16 | |
| lifeless | Stats since the last revision without -1 or -2 : | 19:16 |
| lifeless | Average wait time: 12 days, 9 hours, 42 minutes | 19:16 |
| lifeless | 1st quartile wait time: 4 days, 23 hours, 21 minutes | 19:16 |
| lifeless | Median wait time: 11 days, 4 hours, 30 minutes | 19:16 |
| lifeless | 3rd quartile wait time: 18 days, 11 hours, 26 minutes | 19:16 |
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| tchaypo | Same trend as recently, and I don't think there's been much discussion on the list about what we're measuring being wrong | 19:17 |
| tchaypo | s/wrong/not the thing we want to measure/ | 19:17 |
| lifeless | You started a thread - thanks. I have it tagged to reply to | 19:17 |
| lifeless | any pet reviews folk want to ask for help on? | 19:17 |
| lifeless | I have three I'm going to beg for reviews on | 19:19 |
| lifeless | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/102081/ - backwards compat spec | 19:19 |
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| lifeless | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/103454/ vlan support for the public virtual control IP | 19:20 |
| tchaypo | linkify them? | 19:20 |
| lifeless | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/103757/ - incubator support for 103454 | 19:20 |
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| lifeless | tchaypo: sure | 19:20 |
| lifeless | #info reviews sought on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/102081/ - backwards compat spec | 19:21 |
| slagle | i'll re-reivew the backwards compat spec. been meaning to circle back to it | 19:21 |
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| lifeless | #info reviews sought on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/103454/ vlan support for the public virtual control IP | 19:21 |
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| alexislee | Not super important but it'd be nice to have: | 19:21 |
| alexislee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/82038/ | 19:21 |
| lifeless | #info reviews sought on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/103757/ - incubator support for 103454 | 19:21 |
| alexislee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/110366/ | 19:21 |
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| lifeless | #info reviews sought on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/82038/ - o-a-c meta support | 19:22 |
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| lifeless | #info reviews sought on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/110366/ - declarative static files | 19:22 |
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| lifeless | ok, next topic | 19:23 |
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| lifeless | #topic Projects needing releases | 19:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Projects needing releases (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:23 | |
| lifeless | #info marios_ to release the world | 19:24 |
| lifeless | (He volunteered in #tripleo :)) | 19:24 |
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| lifeless | #topic CD Cloud status | 19:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CD Cloud status (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:24 | |
| lifeless | #info HP1 is still in burnin, no specific new to report | 19:24 |
| lifeless | I believe RH1 is still happy | 19:25 |
| lifeless | dprince: ^ ? | 19:25 |
| lifeless | tchaypo: status of HP2 ? | 19:25 |
| dprince | lifeless: :) | 19:25 |
| tchaypo | HP2 now has the full 100 machines available to us. 4 are reserved for special use; 4 need some love and attention; the 14 have been register-noded and the other 82 will get that treatment today | 19:25 |
| lifeless | #info RH1 is copacetic | 19:25 |
| lifeless | #info RH2 is still in bring-up, capacity of 100 machines at this stage. | 19:26 |
| lifeless | bah | 19:26 |
| lifeless | #undo | 19:26 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Info object at 0x2927650> | 19:26 |
| lifeless | #info HP2 is still in bring-up, capacity of 100 machines at this stage. | 19:26 |
| tchaypo | There are some reviews up for the tripleocd element that I'll be testing out - in theory they should make the scripts able to handle any region with a few config files | 19:26 |
| lifeless | #topic CI | 19:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CI (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:26 | |
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| tchaypo | https://review.openstack.org/116534 is the top of the tree. Probably should have mentioned during reviews. | 19:26 |
| lifeless | http://goodsquishy.com/downloads/tripleo-jobs.html looks ok | 19:27 |
| lifeless | any other CI news? | 19:27 |
| lifeless | #topic tuskar | 19:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "tuskar (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:28 | |
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| lifeless | Any Tuskar items ? | 19:28 |
| jdob | nothing from me | 19:28 |
| lifeless | #topic specs | 19:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "specs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:29 | |
| lifeless | ok | 19:30 |
| dprince | lifeless: review my spec! | 19:31 |
| lifeless | gfidente is not here | 19:31 |
| slagle | please respond to lifeless's email about specs if you have an opinion on that | 19:31 |
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| lifeless | #info please respond to lifeless's email about specs if you have an opinion on that | 19:31 |
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| lifeless | #topic open discussion | 19:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 19:31 | |
| lifeless | gfidente had a thing about deedicated jobs for block storage and object storage | 19:31 |
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| slagle | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-August/043455.html | 19:32 |
| slagle | the spec email ^ | 19:32 |
| lifeless | dprince: I'd like to turn on the vlan job as well before we merge the os-net-config stuff | 19:32 |
| boris-42 | lifeless yes working on it | 19:32 |
| tchaypo | that was discussed last week, consensus at the time was to go ahead with them | 19:32 |
| lifeless | dprince: we are -very- close to that | 19:32 |
| boris-42 | lifeless sorry for long reply | 19:32 |
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| lifeless | dprince: last week you were concerned about adding more jobs | 19:33 |
| dprince | lifeless: until we have more capicity I'd like to hold still | 19:34 |
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| lifeless | dprince: I think we have enough - we're not seeing any significant queuing ATM AFAICT | 19:34 |
| lifeless | dprince: I'm not talking about adding the full spread | 19:35 |
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| lifeless | dprince: what about we add it (when the deps have landed) and review after one week, pull it out if we've cross the safe threshold | 19:36 |
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| dprince | lifeless: just the vlan job is probably okay but I'd like to consider combining it with one of the existing jobs | 19:36 |
| lifeless | dprince: if we move the ironic HA job to voting | 19:37 |
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| lifeless | dprince: we would then have two overcloud jobs, and we could make one vlan | 19:37 |
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| lifeless | dprince: but! I think we need to run the vlan stuff non-voting as a separate job initially, because we don't want to wedge ourselves | 19:38 |
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| dprince | lifeless: seperate initially is fine, then combine them :) | 19:38 |
| lifeless | yah | 19:38 |
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| lifeless | anyone have thoughts on making the ha job voting? | 19:38 |
| * bnemec checks goodsquishy | 19:39 | |
| slagle | i still see failures on changes that are unrelated to ha | 19:39 |
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| lifeless | ok, so some reliability improvements still needed | 19:39 |
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| greghaynes | ohai | 19:40 |
| lifeless | TheJulia: / greghaynes: are you tracking the ha job reliability? It needs more to be turned on as voting | 19:40 |
| lifeless | jprovazn: ^ | 19:41 |
| greghaynes | yes, I have been trying to debug CI fails | 19:41 |
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| lifeless | ok, do you need help ? | 19:41 |
| greghaynes | Actually, yes! There was one scary one where br-ex interface was never created, and this seemed beyond my network script knowledge | 19:42 |
| greghaynes | currently am debugging one where a node also ended up as error, deleting state in nova.... which I dont get how that is even possible | 19:42 |
| lifeless | greghaynes: we've seen that quite a lot in the HP1 burnin | 19:42 |
| greghaynes | anywho, Ill just keep rambling about them in #tripleo, please to help if possible :) | 19:42 |
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| lifeless | greghaynes: might want to turn on debug for the ha jobs to help track this down (sadface, logging again, sadface) | 19:43 |
| greghaynes | aha. I think ill do the secondary logging sink to store debug in a separate file | 19:43 |
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| greghaynes | good idea | 19:44 |
| lifeless | greghaynes: doing normal debug via the heat parameter would get it into logstash | 19:44 |
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| lifeless | greghaynes: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/112778/ | 19:44 |
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| lifeless | any other stuff to chat about ? | 19:45 |
| greghaynes | hrm ok | 19:45 |
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| dprince | lifeless: also, would be nice to have more fedora jobs in CI | 19:45 |
| dprince | lifeless: just saying :) | 19:45 |
| lifeless | dprince: hah sure | 19:46 |
| greghaynes | Was the mariadb element being unusable brought up? | 19:46 |
| lifeless | dprince: I have no objection - we do want a spread. but should we change jobs or put the effort into the new jobs | 19:46 |
| lifeless | greghaynes: nope | 19:46 |
| bnemec | greghaynes: Not yet, but I was considering it. :-) | 19:47 |
| greghaynes | bnemec: mentioned that the mariadb element doesnt actually work ATM | 19:47 |
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| bnemec | It looks that way to me at least. | 19:47 |
| dprince | lifeless: either, I'd like to see more of a spread too | 19:47 |
| slagle | didn't we talk about deprecating then deleting that? | 19:47 |
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| slagle | mariadb-rpm is the one that should be used | 19:47 |
| slagle | iirc, no one spoke up about wanting to use mariadb on ubuntu | 19:47 |
| bnemec | Yeah, I'm not sure we even need to deprecate it. I'm pretty sure it never worked, so it's literally impossible that anyone is using it. | 19:48 |
| greghaynes | ah, either way, I would *really* like to see the maridb(-rpm) be used in our CI | 19:48 |
| slagle | and on !ubuntu, they'd use mariadb-rpm | 19:48 |
| greghaynes | since mysql is kind of a moving target for us | 19:48 |
| slagle | mariadb-rpm is being used by the fedora job | 19:48 |
| slagle | afaik | 19:48 |
| bnemec | ^ | 19:48 |
| bnemec | It's the incubator default for fedora. | 19:48 |
| slagle | right, so CI will pick that up | 19:48 |
| greghaynes | oh. so it is CI'd? | 19:48 |
| greghaynes | well, all is well | 19:48 |
| dprince | slagle: I'm seeing DB connection issues today w/ mariadb | 19:49 |
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| slagle | dprince: ok... | 19:50 |
| slagle | we've got some passing CI jobs, so i don't think it's across the board | 19:50 |
| bnemec | I haven't had any db issues in devtest today. | 19:51 |
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| dprince | slagle: :) haven't chased it further myself. Just thought I'd mention it | 19:51 |
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| slagle | lifeless: i've pushed up all the backports needed to fix the stable branches | 19:51 |
| slagle | and did a fedora and ubuntu successful run locally | 19:52 |
| slagle | just fyi on that front | 19:52 |
| ccrouch1 | greghaynes: any quick comments on the operators meetup while everyone is here? I know you've been doing some play-by-play commentary on #tripleo | 19:52 |
| greghaynes | hah, yes, really people want some kind of reasonable arch. docs! | 19:52 |
| greghaynes | there is a lot of "I get what youre trying to do, but I know your complicated...." | 19:53 |
| lifeless | slagle: awesome | 19:53 |
| lifeless | slagle: sounds like multiple things | 19:53 |
| lifeless | slagle: how will we land it ? | 19:53 |
| slagle | lifeless: this needs to land first: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/115755/ | 19:54 |
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| slagle | then let's see how the jobs on the backports fair | 19:54 |
| slagle | i think i pushed them up in the right order | 19:54 |
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| bnemec | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/115755/ passed CI, BTW | 19:54 |
| lifeless | slagle: I think your +A on it is all thats needed :P | 19:54 |
| slagle | ah, so it is :) | 19:55 |
| greghaynes | +A'd | 19:55 |
| lifeless | well +2 + +A | 19:55 |
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| bnemec | ninj+A'd | 19:55 |
| rbrady | greghaynes: I have an arch doc I worked on a while back: https://github.com/rbrady/tripleo/blob/master/docs/architecture_overview.rst | 19:55 |
| greghaynes | So, one thing that would be *amazing* is at least a graphic of our seed, uc, oc deal | 19:56 |
| greghaynes | rbrady: nice! | 19:56 |
| lifeless | 3m warning | 19:57 |
| ccrouch1 | i've read through rbrady's doc and i think it helps with the big picture. Its not specific to devtest. Its more focussed on Undercloud and Overcloud being the big things | 19:58 |
| ccrouch1 | might be useful on its own or as a starting point for something else | 19:58 |
| greghaynes | Getting that or something similar onto our docs page would be awesome :) | 19:58 |
| greghaynes | yes | 19:58 |
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| ccrouch1 | i'm sure rbrady would be open to pull requests :-) and moving it somewhere else, if people wanted that | 19:59 |
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| rbrady | ccrouch1: +1 | 19:59 |
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| lifeless | ok folk thats all that we can write | 20:00 |
| lifeless | Thanks! | 20:00 |
| lifeless | #endmeeting | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Aug 26 20:00:09 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-08-26-19.05.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-08-26-19.05.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2014/tripleo.2014-08-26-19.05.log.html | 20:00 |
| lsmola2 | th | 20:00 |
| lsmola2 | thanks | 20:00 |
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| adrian_otto | #startmeeting containers | 22:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Aug 26 22:00:06 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is adrian_otto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:00 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: containers)" | 22:00 | |
| *** harlowja_away is now known as harlowja | 22:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'containers' | 22:00 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Containers#Agenda_for_2014-08-26_2200_UTC Our Agenda | 22:00 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Roll Call | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: containers)" | 22:00 | |
| adrian_otto | Adrian Otto | 22:00 |
| thomasem | Thomas Maddox | 22:00 |
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| mtesauro | Matt Tesauro | 22:00 |
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| adrian_otto | we lost apmelton | 22:01 |
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| apmelton | o/ | 22:01 |
| thomasem | not fer long | 22:01 |
| apmelton | andrew melton | 22:01 |
| adrian_otto | oh, there you are | 22:01 |
| dguryanov | hello | 22:01 |
| apmelton | y'all looking for me? | 22:01 |
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| adrian_otto | I found it amusing that I called rollc all and your client left the room | 22:01 |
| iqbalmohomed | Iqbal Mohomed, IBM Research | 22:02 |
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| apmelton | in transition to a new bouncer and haven't quite got it set up | 22:02 |
| apmelton | so back to the old one for now | 22:02 |
| adrian_otto | makes sense | 22:02 |
| adrian_otto | so before I advance to announcements, I will share trivial stuff | 22:02 |
| adrian_otto | I hurt my shoulder last week | 22:02 |
| thomasem | Oh that's no fun | 22:03 |
| mtesauro | doing... | 22:03 |
| adrian_otto | in California we have bad drought (lowest water levels in 100 years) | 22:03 |
| adrian_otto | so I have been trying to save water | 22:03 |
| rcleere | digging a well? | 22:03 |
| adrian_otto | collecting the shower water in a pail while waiting for it to warm up | 22:03 |
| adrian_otto | rcleere: :-) | 22:03 |
| adrian_otto | then I take that shower water and use it in my washing machine | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | it's a 5 gallon pail | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | so when full it weights 40 pounds | 22:04 |
| apmelton | wow california doesn't sound nearly as fun as everyone says it is :P | 22:04 |
| thomasem | you don't say | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | anyway, while I was hurling it into the clothes wacher… ouch. | 22:04 |
| thomasem | youch | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | that was last thursday | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | and I have been in serious pain, until today | 22:04 |
| adrian_otto | today I am almost all better | 22:05 |
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| adrian_otto | so I'm in a terrific mood, just thought I would share that | 22:05 |
| thomasem | that's good news | 22:05 |
| thomasem | lol, that's awesome | 22:05 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so on with the agenda | 22:05 |
| * jogo walks in late | 22:05 | |
| adrian_otto | #topic Announcements | 22:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: containers)" | 22:05 | |
| adrian_otto | fist of all | 22:05 |
| adrian_otto | OpenStack Silicon Valley event. | 22:06 |
| adrian_otto | 2014-09-16 | 22:06 |
| adrian_otto | it's a Tuesday, and I'm attending | 22:06 |
| adrian_otto | will I see any of you there? | 22:06 |
| thomasem | I honestly didn't find out about that until today. | 22:06 |
| adrian_otto | while I'm doing that, I will be missing our team meeting, so we should decide to 1) Cancel or meeting for that day -or- 2) Select a pro-tem chair to run it | 22:07 |
| adrian_otto | #link http://openstacksv.com/ Openstack Silicon Valley 2014-09-16 | 22:07 |
| adrian_otto | what do you all think is best? | 22:07 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: I have a general question when there is an opening in the meeting schedule | 22:07 |
| adrian_otto | jogo, proceed | 22:08 |
| thomasem | adrian_otto: Well, we may know more closer to that time. | 22:08 |
| thomasem | e.g. who would be availabel to lead the meeting | 22:08 |
| jogo | so I asked this at the nova midcycle but I am less sure then before | 22:08 |
| adrian_otto | we can punt this for a week or so | 22:08 |
| jogo | so some background | 22:08 |
| jogo | I think OpenStack needs a good container story, as they have a lot of value for !VM use cases | 22:09 |
| jogo | but why does openstack need a openstack native solution instead of adopting another project and making them work better together | 22:09 |
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| jogo | there is no shortage of things that try to manage containers at scale | 22:09 |
| adrian_otto | great question | 22:10 |
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| adrian_otto | first of all, my goal is to make containers a first class resource in OpenStack | 22:10 |
| jogo | and I didn't see the spec mention that | 22:10 |
| jogo | so IMHO first class doesn't mean we need a native built from scratch solution | 22:11 |
| jogo | the compute program can just say, use x for the container service | 22:11 |
| adrian_otto | the current proposal suggests specific tools that we can leverage | 22:11 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: hmm I must have missed that line | 22:11 |
| apmelton | jogo: I think the important distinction between the openstack containers service compared to others (kubernetes, fleet, etc) is that our service not only builds and magages the containers, but also the infrastructure they are built on | 22:11 |
| adrian_otto | the intent is not to recreate what exists, but represent them within the fabric of openstack | 22:11 |
| adrian_otto | without a clumbsy third party heat resource | 22:12 |
| adrian_otto | something that taps into the same scheduling capability that OpenStack uses | 22:12 |
| jogo | apmelton: so layer something underneath to do taht | 22:12 |
| jogo | that | 22:12 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so let's table this for like 2 minutes | 22:12 |
| jogo | hmm why does it need to use the same scheduling? | 22:12 |
| adrian_otto | and continue it once we close out announcements | 22:13 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: kk, thats why I asked for when you had a moment, sorry for derailing | 22:13 |
| adrian_otto | any other announcements from team members? | 22:13 |
| adrian_otto | jogo, Oh, I thought you were referring to 9/16, sorry. | 22:13 |
| adrian_otto | I want to have this debate, for sure. | 22:13 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so no other announcements, so advancing to next agenda item | 22:14 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Discuss Specs for OpenStack Containers Service | 22:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Discuss Specs for OpenStack Containers Service (Meeting topic: containers)" | 22:14 | |
| adrian_otto | first the links, and a quick update on each | 22:14 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://review.openstack.org/114044 Spec Proposal | 22:15 |
| adrian_otto | there is a revision as of today for your review | 22:15 |
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| adrian_otto | #link https://review.openstack.org/115328 Repo Review | 22:15 |
| adrian_otto | on this topic, something perplexing happened | 22:15 |
| adrian_otto | we were asked to work within the OpenStack compute program using Stackforge | 22:15 |
| adrian_otto | which apparently the current rules do not allow. | 22:15 |
| adrian_otto | If we are going to use the OpenStack trademark, then we need to be in the openstack/ namespace, so I resubmitted this accordingly. | 22:16 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: you were asked to work on stackforge before goign to the compute program | 22:16 |
| adrian_otto | the real intent was to allow for rapid iteration on a project, which is possible regardless of Stackforge or compute program work | 22:16 |
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| adrian_otto | as they can have separate review teams, and just not tag releases | 22:17 |
| dguryanov | What about https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/containers-service-api? | 22:17 |
| adrian_otto | and so long as we trust the compute program PTL not to cut a release of containers until it is ready, then the lcoation should not matter | 22:17 |
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| adrian_otto | thanks, I will get to that in a moment, dguryanov | 22:18 |
| adrian_otto | so although we ahve contributors working on implementing an API spec, there is not currently anywhere to land that | 22:18 |
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| adrian_otto | until I get through the red tape of 115328 | 22:18 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, any questions on the current state of the code repo? | 22:19 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, so next part is: | 22:20 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/containers-service-api Previous Containers Service API Draft | 22:20 |
| adrian_otto | this dates back to the 2013 timeframe when a containers API was first discussed | 22:21 |
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| adrian_otto | dguryanov: ^^ what are your thoughts on this? | 22:21 |
| apmelton | adrian_otto: you asked me to come up with reasons I didn't want to use the docker api as our implementation: https://gist.github.com/ramielrowe/4d162d780977542997a8 | 22:21 |
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| dguryanov | I thinks this API is a better starting point, then docker's API, but it have some lacks | 22:22 |
| apmelton | I didn't get much time to work on it, but those are the basic reasons for my position | 22:22 |
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| adrian_otto | apmelton: excellent! Thank you! | 22:22 |
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| adrian_otto | apmelton: notice that I adjusted our proposal to suggest an alternate approach in accordance with our discussion last week | 22:22 |
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| adrian_otto | Docker API users can use libswarm and an openstack containers backend to talk to the openstack containers service API | 22:23 |
| apmelton | adrian_otto: yup, I think that we can offer equivalent functionality to the docker api | 22:23 |
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| adrian_otto | and we can still provide access to other sorts of containers, so if someone prefers openvz they could use that | 22:24 |
| adrian_otto | as a backend module to the containers service | 22:24 |
| adrian_otto | and possibly even use docker CLI to control that, as perveted as that may sound. | 22:24 |
| adrian_otto | ok, so any more thoughts on this before resuming the discussion stemming from jogo's questions? | 22:25 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, jogo, you have the floor | 22:26 |
| dguryanov | I still suggest to create a new etherpad page for API | 22:26 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: thanks | 22:26 |
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| dguryanov | And write all thoughts there | 22:26 |
| adrian_otto | dguryanov: Good, I'll take that as an AI | 22:26 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: so my understanding of this effort its twofold | 22:26 |
| jogo | 1) have a defacto container answer for OpenStack | 22:27 |
| adrian_otto | #action adrian_otto to create and share a new etherpad for recording current consensus about a containers service api | 22:27 |
| jogo | 2) be able to provision compute instances from inside the container service so user doesn't need to worry about it | 22:27 |
| adrian_otto | jogo, yes. I want owners of OpenStack clouds to have a built-in containers solution that just works, regardless of what instance type they have chosen to use for their nova service | 22:28 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: sure but why not use an existing solution | 22:28 |
| adrian_otto | and without scurrying arounda nd bolting on third party software to make OpenStack containers ready. | 22:28 |
| jogo | and just have the compute program 'bless' it | 22:29 |
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| adrian_otto | jogo: that approach has been tried and failed. | 22:29 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: so this comes from my view that openstack should be not be big tent but a small tent with a big ecosystem | 22:29 |
| apmelton | jogo, because that conflicts with #1 | 22:29 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: do you have examples? | 22:29 |
| apmelton | or at least my view of #1 | 22:29 |
| adrian_otto | scalr, nova-docker | 22:29 |
| jogo | not if openstack, or the compute program in particular, says use outside things for this | 22:30 |
| jogo | so nova-docker why is that a failure? | 22:30 |
| jogo | and I have never heard of scalr | 22:30 |
| apmelton | to be the defacto container solution for openstack, that container solution should present it self with very similar features as nova | 22:30 |
| jogo | so cannot comment | 22:30 |
| jogo | apmelton: why? | 22:30 |
| adrian_otto | because you can't do half the things that containers are meant to allow | 22:30 |
| adrian_otto | nova features and containers features are a venn diagram with a limited overlap | 22:30 |
| adrian_otto | that limited overlap is what nova-docker delivers now | 22:31 |
| adrian_otto | and that's not enough to meet customer expectations | 22:31 |
| apmelton | jogo, because otherwise would be a bad user experience | 22:31 |
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| apmelton | I should be able to switch from using nova to using containers, and bring my cinder volumes and neutron networks with me | 22:32 |
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| adrian_otto | apmelton: +1 | 22:32 |
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| apmelton | and I should be able to do that without having to learn an entirely new architecture | 22:33 |
| jogo | apmelton: interesting idea | 22:33 |
| adrian_otto | jogo: I must admit that back in November 2013 I thought *exactly* what you are expressing right now | 22:33 |
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| jogo | apmelton: but how do you migrate a full VM to a container? | 22:33 |
| adrian_otto | and my position has evolved considerably as I started using containers every day. | 22:33 |
| jogo | image wise | 22:33 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: so there is clearly something I am missing in this discussion | 22:34 |
| thomasem | Well, that's another step, and not impossible. OpenVZ has a prototype for that, I think. | 22:34 |
| adrian_otto | what you begin to realize is that if you think of a container as just a cheaper VM, you are missing out on all the truly compelling things about containers | 22:34 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: as you have more experience with containers then me and you changed your mind | 22:34 |
| jogo | but I just don't see what I am missing right now | 22:34 |
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| apmelton | jogo, that's definitely tricky | 22:34 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, take for example the ability to set a shell environment variable key/value pair to be set at the time a container starts | 22:35 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: sure, I see the value of OpenStack working well with containers | 22:35 |
| mtesauro | +1 adrian_otto | 22:35 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: let me ask a different question | 22:35 |
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| thomasem | capturing stdout and return codes too | 22:36 |
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| thomasem | shared namespaces, though a bit more niche in my opinion. | 22:36 |
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| apmelton | jogo, what I'm suggesting is, images aside, our users should be able to provision containers and almost the same openstack experience as if they used nova | 22:36 |
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| thomasem | It ought to feel like OpenStack | 22:36 |
| jogo | why don't any public clouds today have native container solutions? and defer to seperate tools | 22:36 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: I am not questioning the value of containers | 22:36 |
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| adrian_otto1 | jogo, both GCE and RAX clouds have it | 22:37 |
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| adrian_otto1 | through docker + libswarm, our workd with OnMetal as well. | 22:37 |
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| apmelton | jogo because those tools are not multi tenant at the moment | 22:37 |
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| jogo | thomasem: I don't knwo what 'feal like OpenStack' means | 22:37 |
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| thomasem | jogo: using similar verbiage, data structures | 22:38 |
| thomasem | jogo: async | 22:38 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: GCE supports a way to say just give me a container | 22:38 |
| jogo | without doing anything else? | 22:38 |
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| adrian_otto1 | with multi-tenancy and async, those are the two major differences. | 22:38 |
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| apmelton | jogo, they have a docker image that essentially is configured through metadata the user provides | 22:39 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: async? | 22:39 |
| jogo | apmelton: sure that is just an image | 22:39 |
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| jogo | that is different then a full service though | 22:39 |
| adrian_otto1 | and still allowing for the actual container code to be pluggable, to alow for implementations for LXC/libct, openvz, docker/libcontainer whatever. | 22:39 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: sorry I am still missing something, in part because of all the different voices in here saying different things | 22:39 |
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| jogo | The point that I am still stuck on is why should OpenStack have an OpenStack native solution to do this? I don't want another case of NIH | 22:40 |
| adrian_otto1 | jogo: have you seen the use cases section of the spec proposal yet? | 22:40 |
| adrian_otto1 | those are intended to give a perspective for who values this and why | 22:40 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto1: looking now | 22:41 |
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| adrian_otto1 | jogo, if a suitable solution already existed, we would be using that now. What we have now is nova-docker and a clumbsy heat resource with no scheduler. That's not working well enough. | 22:41 |
| adrian_otto1 | we also have libvirt/lxc | 22:41 |
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| adrian_otto1 | which solves only a part of the use cases | 22:41 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: I am really conrused about the nova-docker thing | 22:41 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: I thought that isn't related at all | 22:41 |
| apmelton | jogo, do you have an example of another service provider, providing containers as a service? | 22:42 |
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| apmelton | with a non-native service providing that 'containers as a service' | 22:43 |
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| adrian_otto1 | apmelton: there was only one, Tutum, and now they are part of Docker, Inc. | 22:43 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Review Action Items | 22:43 |
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| adrian_otto | (none) | 22:44 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Open Discussion | 22:44 |
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| adrian_otto | jogo: you are welcome to continue through open discussion | 22:44 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: as that is a nova driver | 22:44 |
| jogo | confused* | 22:44 |
| jogo | so going through the use cases | 22:44 |
| jogo | 1,2,3,4,5 don't have anything in them that is OpenStack specific | 22:44 |
| jogo | is that accurate? | 22:44 |
| jogo | adrian_otto1: sorry if I am coming accross as contrary | 22:44 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: so use cases ^ | 22:44 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: is it safe to say 1,2,3,4,5 have nothing in them that makes them OpenStack specific | 22:45 |
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| adrian_otto | jogo, the frame of reference is that the cloud operator is using OpenStack | 22:46 |
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| adrian_otto | and they have these sue cases to address | 22:46 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: right, but is my take on 1-5 accurate | 22:46 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: I want to make sure I am not missing something before going on to the next two | 22:47 |
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| adrian_otto | 1-5 could be solved using a variety of approaches, some not including openstack at all. However, I'm after something that addresses each with a consistent user experience that does not require the cloud operator do to r&D to figure out how to address these use cases. | 22:48 |
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| adrian_otto | it should just work. | 22:48 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: so yes. | 22:48 |
| adrian_otto | as A cloud operator, I should not need to do circus tricks to solve those cases. | 22:49 |
| jogo | so the does not require R&D to figure it out | 22:49 |
| jogo | well I will get back to that | 22:49 |
| jogo | ok the last two use cases | 22:49 |
| adrian_otto | I want at least one configuration to work with OpenStack out of the box | 22:49 |
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| jogo | I like the use case in #6 | 22:50 |
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| jogo | nice way of hiding extra complexity from the user | 22:50 |
| jogo | but to solve 1-6 can't you add a small tool under an existing system? | 22:50 |
| jogo | and I am not sure what you mean in #7 | 22:51 |
| adrian_otto | sort of, but not really | 22:51 |
| adrian_otto | the key is multi-tenancty | 22:51 |
| adrian_otto | if I am a single tenant cloud, then yes, there are options for that | 22:51 |
| adrian_otto | but as a multi-tenant cloud, that's where it all falls apart and becomes rather yucky from an ops perspective. | 22:51 |
| jogo | so as far as I can tell the model existing public clouds use for this is: | 22:52 |
| jogo | charge and manage the instances and let user deal with all things containers | 22:52 |
| jogo | in that model you don't need to deal with multi tenancy as each user would spin up there own copy of the service | 22:52 |
| jogo | using a preseeded image or something | 22:52 |
| adrian_otto | jogo: that user experience is sub-optimal | 22:53 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: why? | 22:53 |
| jogo | requiring a user to spin up a single instance? | 22:53 |
| apmelton | jogo, because that means ever user would need to manage that single instance | 22:54 |
| jogo | isn't that how everyone does it today? | 22:54 |
| thomasem | And that doesn't seem to accumulate to unnecessary overhead once you have a significant customer base? A bunch of wasted resources that could have been solved by some orchestration above it? | 22:54 |
| adrian_otto | because the complexity of dealing with wiring up a container infrastructure and cloud resources is carried by the customer, not by the hosted service | 22:54 |
| jogo | apmelton: but isn't that how everyone does it today? | 22:54 |
| adrian_otto | I'm proposing a place where that complexity can be abstracted from the user | 22:54 |
| jogo | thomasem: who said that instance won't run containers as well | 22:54 |
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| jogo | adrian_otto: right, so in the current form I don't really see that fleshed out in the spec | 22:54 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: less I just missed it | 22:54 |
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| apmelton | jogo, that's how everyone does it today because it's a quick win | 22:55 |
| apmelton | jogo, "win" | 22:55 |
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| jogo | apmelton: with minimal overhead to a user | 22:55 |
| apmelton | it's a bad experience because as a user all I want to worry about are my containers | 22:55 |
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| thomasem | jogo: Nobody. I'm not talking about whether or not instances can run containers. I'm talking about providing a cleaner user experience by not making every customer use additional resources just to handle their containers when we could do it better as a cloud (we know the infrastructure). | 22:55 |
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| jogo | apmelton: well users are still charged per instance not per container right? | 22:56 |
| adrian_otto | jogo, I'm trying not to slant the proposal too much toward what matters to public cloud operators. | 22:56 |
| apmelton | I don't want to have to worry about upgrading Container Management Service X | 22:56 |
| thomasem | jogo, correct, only per instance is the idea. | 22:56 |
| adrian_otto | I want a sensible balance for both public and private cloud use cases, even small ones. | 22:56 |
| adrian_otto | and the review is bordering on 400 lines now | 22:57 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: that isn't very big ;) | 22:57 |
| adrian_otto | I don't want it to be impossible to review either | 22:57 |
| jogo | so specs are not code | 22:57 |
| adrian_otto | that's with no API details in it | 22:57 |
| jogo | so they rule of thumb about length is a little different IMHO | 22:57 |
| jogo | anyway, I am concerened that we do something | 22:57 |
| jogo | but the !OpenStack things in this space do it way better | 22:58 |
| apmelton | jogo, yes, they are still charged for the instance even if they aren't using it | 22:58 |
| jogo | and everyone just adpos that | 22:58 |
| jogo | adopts that, and we waste our time | 22:58 |
| adrian_otto | jogo, so you are suggesting that if we add additional rationale from the perspective of a public cloud operator, that it could help explain the desire to address the use cases? | 22:58 |
| adrian_otto | we need to wrap up open discussion in a min | 22:58 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: no I am not saying that | 22:58 |
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| adrian_otto | jogo, I encourage you to continue with us in #openstack-containers | 22:59 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: I am saying I don't get why we cannot use the half dozen projects trying to solve this | 22:59 |
| adrian_otto | we'd like to learn from your perspective on this | 22:59 |
| jogo | adrian_otto: just joined the room | 22:59 |
| jogo | thanks | 22:59 |
| adrian_otto | thanks everyone for your attendance today. | 22:59 |
| apmelton | wanna wrap up here and move to openstack-containers? | 22:59 |
| adrian_otto | our next meeting is 2014-09-02 at UTC 1600 | 23:00 |
| adrian_otto | #endmeeting | 23:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 23:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Aug 26 23:00:05 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 23:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2014/containers.2014-08-26-22.00.html | 23:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2014/containers.2014-08-26-22.00.txt | 23:00 |
| thomasem | Thanks, everyone! | 23:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2014/containers.2014-08-26-22.00.log.html | 23:00 |
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