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| d0ugal | o/ | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
| *** shardy has joined #openstack-meeting-alt | 14:00 | |
| tzumainn | hiya! | 14:00 |
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| shardy | o/ | 14:00 |
| dprince | #startmeeting tripleo | 14:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 20 14:00:34 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dprince. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tripleo' | 14:00 |
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| d0ugal | Hello! | 14:00 |
| dtantsur | o/ | 14:00 |
| derekh | yo | 14:00 |
| marios | \o | 14:00 |
| jdob | o/ | 14:01 |
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| slagle | sup | 14:01 |
| dprince | hi everyone | 14:01 |
| dprince | #topic agenda | 14:01 |
| dprince | * bugs | 14:01 |
| dprince | * Projects releases or stable backports | 14:01 |
| dprince | * CI | 14:01 |
| dprince | * Specs | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "agenda (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:01 | |
| dprince | * Meeting every week? | 14:01 |
| dprince | * Review Priorities: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-review-priorities | 14:01 |
| trown | o/ | 14:01 |
| dprince | * one off agenda items | 14:01 |
| dprince | * open discussion | 14:01 |
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| jrist | o/ | 14:02 |
| dprince | I slightly adjusted the agendy this week. Adding a "Stable backports" section to the project releases item | 14:02 |
| florianf | o/ | 14:02 |
| dprince | also, added a top level item to continue the review priorities discussion (etherpad) | 14:02 |
| dprince | any comments on this before we get started? | 14:02 |
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| jtomasek | o/ | 14:03 |
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| dprince | #topic bugs | 14:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:04 | |
| dprince | any new/critical bugs that need highlighted this week? | 14:05 |
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| dprince | Using Delorean trunk I hit this one yesterday: https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1507738 | 14:05 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1507738 in tripleo "ipxe fails on Centos 7 (inc: command not found)" [Critical,Triaged] | 14:05 |
| derekh | CI currently blocked by a puppet-heat regression https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1507934 | 14:06 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1507934 in puppet-heat "Could not find resource 'Anchor[heat::db::begin]'" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Clayton O'Neill (clayton-oneill) | 14:06 |
| derekh | I've submitted a revert and a pin, doesn't look like the revert will land | 14:06 |
| dprince | derekh: can we update our manifests to support this change? | 14:07 |
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| derekh | dprince: spredzy was looking into it | 14:07 |
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| derekh | dprince: they are trying to fix the puppet module I think | 14:08 |
| dprince | okay, but in the meantime the pin keeps us running | 14:08 |
| derekh | dprince: it should, we'll know when CI is done | 14:08 |
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| dprince | derekh: cool | 14:08 |
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| dprince | any other bugs to be aware of? | 14:08 |
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| dprince | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1507934 | 14:09 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1507934 in puppet-heat "Could not find resource 'Anchor[heat::db::begin]'" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Clayton O'Neill (clayton-oneill) | 14:09 |
| derekh | you'll notice the pin is a temp workaround that Is now in the tripleo.sh repository, I think we should in future put them there (not tripleo-ci) | 14:09 |
| dprince | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/tripleo/+bug/1507738 | 14:09 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1507738 in tripleo "ipxe fails on Centos 7 (inc: command not found)" [Critical,Triaged] | 14:09 |
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| dprince | derekh: yeah, I noticed you left a comment on my tripleo-ci review to that effect as well. | 14:10 |
| trown|mtg | +1 to putting pins in tripleo.sh | 14:10 |
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| dprince | derekh: I'd agree that tripleo.sh is a good place for these | 14:10 |
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| derekh | dprince: ya, I was going to resubmit you patch for tripleo-sh but this change should deem it redundant https://review.openstack.org/#/c/229906/ | 14:11 |
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| dprince | derekh: okay, so that change would make it build openstack-heat then? | 14:12 |
| dprince | derekh: I will follow up on that afterwards perhaps... | 14:12 |
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| derekh | dprince: ya, I'll explain in #tripleo afterwards | 14:12 |
| dprince | Sorry, for those not following there was a breakage in CI this weekend due to puppet-ceph moving its git to /openstack | 14:13 |
| dprince | anwyays, lets move along :) | 14:13 |
| dprince | #topic Projects releases or stable backports | 14:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Projects releases or stable backports (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:13 | |
| dprince | shardy: would you like to give an update here? | 14:14 |
| shardy | dprince: sure | 14:14 |
| shardy | So, the release branch spec landed \o/ | 14:14 |
| trown|mtg | woot | 14:14 |
| dprince | :) | 14:14 |
| dtantsur | \o/ | 14:14 |
| shardy | And I pushed a project-config patch which prepares for creating them: | 14:14 |
| shardy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237597/1 | 14:14 |
| shardy | when that lands, I'll create the branches and start work on making tripleo.sh support them, then wire that into CI | 14:15 |
| shardy | So no action required from folks yet, but I hope that pretty soon after summit we should have the stable branches up and running | 14:15 |
| dprince | all sounds good to me | 14:15 |
| derekh | cool beans | 14:16 |
| dtantsur | which point will this branches be created from, the current HEAD? | 14:16 |
| dprince | shardy: any thoughts on which CI jobs we'll be running on stable? | 14:16 |
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| shardy | dprince: If we get it stable enough I was thinking the HA job, but open to suggestions | 14:16 |
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| dprince | dtantsur: I would think Head for now, yes | 14:16 |
| shardy | I was thinking initially pick one, then go from there | 14:16 |
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| trown|mtg | shardy: dtantsur, I would suggest we make the stable branches start at the commits used for RDO liberty packaging, I can provide a list | 14:17 |
| trown|mtg | it is more or less HEAD | 14:17 |
| shardy | dtantsur: yeah, we'll pick a known-good point, e.g no pins in CI and branch from there | 14:17 |
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| derekh | shardy: ha probably makes most sense, I guess it would give us most coverage | 14:17 |
| shardy | trown|mtg: Ok, that works, please do | 14:17 |
| derekh | shardy: we could maybe add the other jobs also in the experimental queue | 14:17 |
| slagle | we'll need some tripleo.sh patches as well to support the right repos in --repo-setup | 14:17 |
| trown|mtg | are we going to do stable releases as well? | 14:17 |
| shardy | trown|mtg: For now, I was assuming we wouldn't tag stable releases, as AFAIK openstack generally is moving away from that | 14:18 |
| shardy | trown|mtg: if folks are happy with that, it seems simpler, e.g we just have a rolling release with CI coverage | 14:19 |
| shardy | does that work wrt RDO plans? | 14:19 |
| trown|mtg | hmm... that makes packaging a bit more of a pita, but if all of openstack is doing that | 14:19 |
| dprince | okay, anything else for stable branches, etc? | 14:19 |
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| shardy | trown|mtg: I'll look into it, last I heard that was the direction, but we'll align with what other projects do | 14:19 |
| shardy | so should be the same as other RDO packaging regardless | 14:19 |
| trown|mtg | cool +1 to following what other projects do | 14:20 |
| shardy | dprince: not from me, thanks! | 14:20 |
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| dprince | #topic CI | 14:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "CI (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:20 | |
| dtantsur | ironic team is still making releases, so not sure.. | 14:20 |
| gfidente | I'd like to see the BP which does automatic backports when commit has backport: $release implemented, but this is probably a little out of scope nw | 14:20 |
| dprince | derekh: anyting updates for CI? | 14:20 |
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| shardy | gfidente: that didn't actually get implemented | 14:20 |
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| derekh | dprince: not much happening, I've tested and submitted patches to update the jenkins nodes to F22, all seems ok there | 14:21 |
| shardy | so we'll probably have to work out how to implement it before we can auto-backport | 14:21 |
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| gfidente | shardy, yeah read your comment :( | 14:21 |
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| derekh | dprince: we had aoutage for 12 hours of our cloud last week | 14:21 |
| derekh | my fault. move along | 14:21 |
| dprince | derekh: yes, and thanks to you for resolving it quickly | 14:21 |
| rhallisey | hey | 14:21 |
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| derekh | nothing much else to report | 14:22 |
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| dprince | rhallisey: hi, we are talking about CI now. any updates from your team? | 14:22 |
| rhallisey | dprince, we're going to start trying to integrate there | 14:23 |
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| rhallisey | anyone I could work with to get this going? | 14:23 |
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| Slower | we have patches up for local registry and scripts to support containers | 14:23 |
| derekh | somebody merge this, its fixes a bug where you may see CI logs for a seed befor you even started one up https://review.openstack.org/#/c/230129/ | 14:23 |
| rhallisey | just need to be pointed in the right direction | 14:23 |
| derekh | very confusing if you run across it | 14:23 |
| dprince | rhallisey: okay, to be clear we are talking about integrate Docker CI jobs into CI right? | 14:23 |
| rhallisey | dprince, yes | 14:24 |
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| dprince | derekh: do we have sufficient capacity for at least 1 docker job? along with the new stable branch HA job as well? | 14:25 |
| derekh | rhallisey: give me a shout, and I'll see if I can help | 14:25 |
| bnemec | We're going to need an upgrade job of some sort too... | 14:25 |
| derekh | dprince: I'll take a look at numbers after this meeting and | 14:26 |
| dprince | derekh: we may want to put in caching somewhere for docker images too | 14:26 |
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| rhallisey | derekh, ok thanks. | 14:26 |
| derekh | dprince: Yum, I'm working on that for the other jobs but it requires we would have a periodic job buil;ding images | 14:26 |
| shardy | bnemec: good point, I was thinking we'd tackle that after we have working stable branches in place | 14:26 |
| derekh | dprince: patch for that is here https://review.openstack.org/#/c/235321/ | 14:26 |
| rhallisey | derekh, correct, we would need to build to keep up | 14:27 |
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| shardy | before we even do that we could do with really basic update tests, e.g prove that updating between t-h-t revisions on master doesn't destroy any resources unexpectedly | 14:27 |
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| rhallisey | shardy, what do you mean by update tests? | 14:28 |
| shardy | rhallisey: updating a deployed overcloud | 14:28 |
| shardy | currently we only test initial deployment in CI | 14:29 |
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| Slower | cool! | 14:29 |
| rhallisey | ok gotcha | 14:29 |
| dprince | okay, any other CI updates? | 14:29 |
| derekh | nope | 14:29 |
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| Slower | so with a periodic job to build containers, would we have a docker registry running to load them into? | 14:29 |
| dprince | oh, for those who missed it last week our CI status page is now here | 14:29 |
| dprince | #link http://tripleo.org/cistatus.html | 14:30 |
| dprince | #topic Specs | 14:30 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:30 | |
| rhallisey | derekh, if you're around after the meeting, I'll ping you and hopefully get started on this | 14:30 |
| derekh | rhallisey: ack, I'll be here | 14:30 |
| dprince | any spec items need attention this week? | 14:30 |
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| dprince | #topic Meeting every week? | 14:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Meeting every week? (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:32 | |
| rhallisey | bnemec, I updated the container spec. Thanks for the comments | 14:32 |
| marios | +1 weekly | 14:32 |
| derekh | +1 | 14:32 |
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| jistr | +1 | 14:32 |
| trown|mtg | +1 weekly | 14:32 |
| gfidente | +1 weekly | 14:32 |
| marios | dprince: i have the review ready for the irc-meetings change fyi - (was curious to see hwo that works) | 14:32 |
| marios | dprince: i didn't submit it | 14:32 |
| gfidente | on the spec, I'd like some eyes on the external lb spec at https://review.openstack.org/233634 | 14:32 |
| dprince | marios: could you submit it now and link it in? | 14:33 |
| marios | sure sec | 14:33 |
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| gfidente | the changes for the external lb spec are up for review already | 14:33 |
| dprince | marios: sounds like everyone pretty much agrees meeting once a week is good | 14:33 |
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| marios | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237609/ | 14:34 |
| marios | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237609/ | 14:34 |
| dprince | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237609/ | 14:34 |
| marios | sry :) | 14:34 |
| dprince | #agreed everyone wants a weekly TripleO meeting | 14:35 |
| dprince | marios: thanks! | 14:35 |
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| shardy | belated +1 on weekly! ;) | 14:35 |
| bnemec | gfidente: Can you link those into the spec? That might have answered some of my questions. | 14:35 |
| * shardy got distracted for a moment | 14:35 | |
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| tzumainn | spec wise, if anyone has time to look at the exciting proposal for tuskar.... v3, that'd be appreciated! https://review.openstack.org/#/c/230432/ | 14:35 |
| d0ugal | +1 | 14:35 |
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| dprince | #topic Review Priorities: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-review-priorities | 14:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Priorities: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-review-priorities (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:35 | |
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| dprince | slagle: thanks for organizing this etherpad | 14:36 |
| dprince | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-review-priorities | 14:36 |
| slagle | tzumainn: how does that spec relate to https://review.openstack.org/#/c/227329/ ? | 14:36 |
| dprince | has this been helpful for getting eyes on important patches? | 14:36 |
| gfidente | bnemec, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/tripleo/+spec/tripleo-mitaka-external-load-balancer | 14:36 |
| slagle | tzumainn: are they the same? or are these competing? | 14:36 |
| derekh | lets delete things instead of strickthrough, its should be as concise as possible | 14:36 |
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| tzumainn | slagle, it's the same, rbrady is abandoning that patch at some point but we plan on adapting his work towards a tuskar v3 update | 14:37 |
| slagle | k, thx | 14:38 |
| slagle | derekh: fine by me, i started the strikethrough thing. was thinking of deleting the topic once all was struck through. i'm good either way | 14:38 |
| * dprince waits for any other specs updates | 14:39 | |
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| derekh | slagle: ahh ok, so that kinda makes sense, I'm good either way now aswell. gonna delete the done topics so | 14:40 |
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| dprince | slagle, derekh: so we agree deleting done (merged) review items on this etherpad is the way to go? | 14:41 |
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| derekh | dprince: ya, no point in clutter hanging around | 14:42 |
| slagle | dprince: make it so! | 14:42 |
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| jistr | +1 for delete | 14:43 |
| dprince | cool. One top patchset I'd like to highlight is an idea for more "composable roles" within t-h-t. I've linked it into the etherpad too but here it is: | 14:43 |
| jrist | slagle picard | 14:43 |
| dprince | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/236243/ | 14:43 |
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| dprince | The motivation here was to make integration w/ new services like Trove, Manila, Sahara easier. But I think if we bought this approach we'd do all services the same way | 14:44 |
| dprince | I will reply to shardy's thread on the mailing list with regards to these idea's | 14:45 |
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| shardy | dprince: not properly reviewed yet, but +1 on more granular role definition | 14:45 |
| bnemec | ^Ditto | 14:45 |
| slagle | dprince: do you have anything in progress to show what the templates/manifests would look like for say standalone Glance API server? | 14:46 |
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| shardy | I think we need to eventually work towards a well defined "role plugin" type interface, where all services are deployed in the exact same way | 14:46 |
| slagle | since that what you started with :) | 14:46 |
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| dprince | shardy: yep, agree | 14:46 |
| gfidente | dprince, I think it's very clean and nice but wanted to point out | 14:46 |
| dprince | shardy: My initial example service was with glance | 14:46 |
| gfidente | we have some issues when a resource type for a pre-existing resource changes | 14:46 |
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| gfidente | when doing upgrades | 14:46 |
| gfidente | so I don't think we can avoid this if we want to make roles more granular, but it is worth looking how we can survive | 14:47 |
| gfidente | an upgrade | 14:47 |
| shardy | that is a good point, we'll have to think carefully about the upgrade impact of a major refactor, but that shouldn't prevent us attempting it | 14:47 |
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| gfidente | indeed, I don't think it is avoidable | 14:47 |
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| dprince | gfidente: yes, there may be some rubs there perhaps | 14:48 |
| gfidente | we'll change a resource type again in the future | 14:48 |
| slagle | dprince: it'd be helpful to review how this might work, if that were there as well. in fact i was thinking of trying it myself to understand this patch better | 14:48 |
| slagle | dprince: just didnt know if you had already tried it | 14:48 |
| dprince | gfidente: along with the role changes there is perhaps a more radical idea we could investigate where we split our stack into 2 (or more) | 14:48 |
| shardy | I think the answer may end up being to fix heat abandon/adopt features | 14:49 |
| dprince | gfidente: stack 1 would create OS resources (servers), and the 2nd stack would only configure them (as external resources) | 14:49 |
| shardy | so it's possible to completely rework the heat template architecture, without deleting any nodes | 14:49 |
| slagle | shardy: dprince : i take it this patch does not use the resource chaining spec proposed for Heat | 14:49 |
| slagle | any thoughts on how that might affect this? | 14:49 |
| shardy | there are quite a few unsolved issues before we can do that | 14:49 |
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| dprince | if we took this approach we wouldn't need to delete servers, but we could drastically refactor the "configuration" resources as we see fit | 14:50 |
| shardy | slagle: Yeah, I was thinkingt the same thing, I think it will be complimentary | 14:50 |
| shardy | e.g you specify a list of types as a resource chain, and each one would be a "role plugin" defining a service | 14:50 |
| gfidente | dprince, ack I'd be happy to help there if I can | 14:50 |
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| shardy | then you do the cluster wide config of the groups of resource chains | 14:50 |
| dprince | slagle: no resource chaining yet. I'm not super clear on how that helps | 14:50 |
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| shardy | dprince: It'd be a way to wire in a bunch of "plugin" type resources, e.g which all have common interfaces | 14:51 |
| dprince | shardy: spec? | 14:51 |
| slagle | i guess i was thinking you'd have a roles resources, mapped to glance-api, keystone-api, etc | 14:51 |
| slagle | or whatever roles you wanted | 14:51 |
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| dprince | slagle: this is a good example of the interface I've got | 14:51 |
| dprince | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237370/1/overcloud-without-mergepy.yaml,cm | 14:51 |
| dprince | basically you define an input which is an array of roles you want on that server type | 14:52 |
| shardy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/228615/ | 14:52 |
| shardy | dprince: ^^ | 14:52 |
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| slagle | dprince: ah cool, that's what i was looking for :) | 14:52 |
| dprince | slagle: yeah, and for pacemaker I've got pacemaker version of the roles which "extend" the defaults | 14:52 |
| dprince | so the duplicate puppet manifests would go away | 14:53 |
| shardy | dprince: perfect, so the list in ControllerServices could eventually just be an input to a ResourceChain resource | 14:53 |
| slagle | longer term, i'd like to make use of the composable roles to deploy the Undercloud as well, using the standalone Heat container idea | 14:53 |
| dprince | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/237370/1/puppet/roles/pacemaker/glance-api.yaml,cm | 14:53 |
| dprince | jistr: you might want to look closely at that and see if you buy it? | 14:53 |
| gfidente | I'm happy that it keeps the network resources out of the role as well | 14:54 |
| dprince | rhallisey: for docker I think we'd add some output metadata to describe the docker compose, and perhaps the actual containers we'd need (for the "plugin") too | 14:54 |
| dprince | gfidente: exactly, network resources are tied to the servers themselves | 14:54 |
| dprince | gfidente: a different "layer" | 14:55 |
| gfidente | yes I think it's great this way | 14:55 |
| dprince | gfidente: it won't hurt if say glance::api::bind_host is set... but there is no glance API or registry running | 14:55 |
| jistr | dprince: yeah will look at the composable roles | 14:55 |
| jistr | dprince: in general i like the idea a lot | 14:55 |
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| rhallisey | dprince, ya I think we should fit in pretty easily with composable roles. Metadata with list of containers works | 14:56 |
| jistr | dprince: same for the 2 separate stacks for HW prep and config phase. I'll think it through a bit more. | 14:56 |
| dprince | jistr: yes, I've been chatting w/ the Kolla community about using TripleO as a "paving machine" (they have nothing that does baremetal provisioning). 2 stacks would help there | 14:57 |
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| dprince | or perhaps a more configurable single stack | 14:57 |
| dprince | lots to think about | 14:57 |
| dprince | #open discussion | 14:58 |
| dprince | #topic open discussion | 14:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: tripleo)" | 14:58 | |
| gfidente | dprince, sec, the comment on bind_host | 14:58 |
| dprince | any other things to bring up quickly in the meeting this week? | 14:58 |
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| shardy | dprince: IMO we shouldn't necesarily say that we couldn't just support two different heat templates | 14:58 |
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| gfidente | we can always pass that as param no? | 14:58 |
| dprince | I probably won't be around next week to run the meeting next week. Anyone want to run it? | 14:59 |
| dprince | Or perhaps we just cancel? | 14:59 |
| shardy | it's kind of unusual the way TripleO uses one template for all deployment topologies, if we needed a "noconfig" overcloud template, IMHO that'd be perfectly fine | 14:59 |
| dprince | shardy: that is the idea | 14:59 |
| shardy | dprince: most folks will be at summit, so I'd say +1 on cancel | 14:59 |
| slagle | see some of you in tokyo! | 14:59 |
| d0ugal | Enjoy | 14:59 |
| d0ugal | I am jealous :) | 14:59 |
| dtantsur | ++ | 14:59 |
| dprince | gfidente: lets chat bind_host in #tripleo following this | 15:00 |
| * bnemec will not be attending next week regardless :-) | 15:00 | |
| dprince | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 20 15:00:12 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2015/tripleo.2015-10-20-14.00.html | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2015/tripleo.2015-10-20-14.00.txt | 15:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tripleo/2015/tripleo.2015-10-20-14.00.log.html | 15:00 |
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| janscheurich | Hi BGPVPN: anybody there? | 15:06 |
| Prem | Hi Jan | 15:06 |
| pcarver | I'm here, but in an unrelated face to face meeting | 15:07 |
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| janscheurich | Did Thomas cancel the meeting last week? | 15:07 |
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| Prem | janscheurich: I don't think so | 15:08 |
| vthapar | janscheurich: don't see anything on that in logs. | 15:08 |
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| adrian_otto | #startmeeting containers | 16:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 20 16:02:37 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is adrian_otto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:02 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'containers' | 16:02 |
| adrian_otto | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Containers#Agenda_for_2015-10-20_1600_UTC Our Agneda | 16:02 |
| eliqiao_home | o/ | 16:02 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Roll Call | 16:02 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:03 | |
| mfalatic | o/ | 16:03 |
| rlrossit | o/ | 16:03 |
| bradjones | o/ | 16:03 |
| muralia1 | o/ | 16:03 |
| Tango | Ton Ngo | 16:03 |
| rpothier | o/ | 16:03 |
| adrian_otto | Adrian Otto | 16:03 |
| suro-patz | o/ | 16:03 |
| eghobo_ | o/ | 16:03 |
| juggler | o/ Perry Rivera | 16:03 |
| hongbin | p/ | 16:03 |
| hongbin | o/ | 16:03 |
| madhuri_ | o/ | 16:03 |
| vilobhmm11 | o/ | 16:03 |
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| daneyon | o/ | 16:04 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Announcements | 16:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:05 | |
| adrian_otto | 1) stable/liberty branch is up | 16:05 |
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| adrian_otto | that's what we will be releasing against. | 16:06 |
| adrian_otto | so if you have code up for review that needs to be in the liberty release, it needs to be re-submitted for review against that branch | 16:06 |
| adrian_otto | backported | 16:06 |
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| adrian_otto | 2) No meeting next tuesday… Tokyo Summit | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | any other announcements from team members? | 16:07 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Container Networking Subteam Update (daneyon) | 16:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Container Networking Subteam Update (daneyon) (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:08 | |
| daneyon | thx adrian_otto | 16:08 |
| daneyon | we did not have a meeting last week due to a scheduling conflict. Everyone should have seen the notification on the ML | 16:09 |
| daneyon | we will not have a meeting this week due to the DS. | 16:09 |
| adrian_otto | ok | 16:09 |
| daneyon | We will reconvene on 11/5 | 16:09 |
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| daneyon | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/224367/ | 16:09 |
| daneyon | I would like to discuss ^ review | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | and we have DS sessions, including a fishbowl for networking | 16:10 |
| daneyon | I have spent a fair bit of time over the last week or so having to rebase and rebase | 16:10 |
| adrian_otto | daneyon: so I will make sure that you have the schedule and invite key contributors to attend | 16:10 |
| daneyon | I know it's a big one, but it's well tested | 16:10 |
| daneyon | I addressed everyone's comments. | 16:10 |
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| adrian_otto | final schedule should be done later today. | 16:10 |
| daneyon | If I need to break it apart, then I will... but hoping you can let it slide this time. | 16:11 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto great | 16:11 |
| adrian_otto | thanks, daneyon. Ready for the next topic? | 16:11 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto you or I need to also respond to gsagie's email about the magnum community joining the kuryr session. | 16:12 |
| daneyon | sure | 16:12 |
| adrian_otto | daneyon: I'm drowning a little. Please follow up with me today. | 16:12 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto will do | 16:12 |
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| adrian_otto | my inbox is a disaster area currently | 16:12 |
| adrian_otto | tx | 16:13 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Magnum UI Subteam Update (bradjones) | 16:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Magnum UI Subteam Update (bradjones) (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:13 | |
| bradjones | thanks | 16:13 |
| bradjones | so pretty great progress this week | 16:13 |
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| bradjones | a couple more people are now working on different bits of the UI | 16:13 |
| bradjones | Rob Cresswell has been helping out with the containers views and APIs | 16:14 |
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| bradjones | and helping get the testing up to scratch before the summit | 16:14 |
| bradjones | also Shu Muto has done a great job with the Bay UI | 16:14 |
| bradjones | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/235870/ | 16:14 |
| bradjones | there is some small feedback that needs to be addressed then I'm happy to merge that | 16:14 |
| bradjones | one thing that is blocking a couple of patches is I have included network_driver and labels which are going to be present in the new python client | 16:15 |
| bradjones | but currently waiting to merge until the new client is release | 16:15 |
| bradjones | do we have an eta on that? | 16:16 |
| hongbin | I think the network_driver and labels are already there. Is it? | 16:16 |
| bradjones | I couldn't find those labels in 0.2.1 | 16:16 |
| adrian_otto | I can release a client today | 16:17 |
| bradjones | adrian_otto: that will be great then I can hit go on the relevant patches | 16:17 |
| adrian_otto | tonight actually | 16:17 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, next topic? | 16:18 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Review Action Items | 16:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:18 | |
| bradjones | that's about all from me | 16:18 |
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| adrian_otto | I owe you one deliverable here, which is the ODS schedule. This is the top item on my todo list, and I expect to complete it today. | 16:19 |
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| adrian_otto | would you like me to send an update to the ML with a link to the schedule? | 16:19 |
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| daneyon | adrian_otto please do so. | 16:20 |
| bradjones | adrian_otto: that would be great | 16:20 |
| vilobhmm11 | adrian_otto : ODS ( Design Summit) that will be better IMHO | 16:20 |
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| adrian_otto | #action adrian_otto to send a message to our ML detailing our Design Summit sessions for requested attendance | 16:21 |
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| adrian_otto | #topic Blueprint/Bug Review | 16:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Blueprint/Bug Review (Meeting topic: containers)" | 16:21 | |
| adrian_otto | I am going to deviate from the agenda here | 16:21 |
| adrian_otto | do something less formal than usual | 16:22 |
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| adrian_otto | I want to give a final call for any reviews that need to be merged for stable/liberty | 16:22 |
| adrian_otto | also, any showstopper bugs that are must-fix for the release | 16:22 |
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| muralia1 | adrian_otto: there is one for TLS. https://review.openstack.org/#/c/232152/6 | 16:23 |
| muralia1 | I'm working on addressing one last comment about trusts | 16:23 |
| adrian_otto | muralia1: thanks for that. Please explain why it | 16:23 |
| adrian_otto | is a must | 16:23 |
| muralia1 | current we use user auth tokens. they expire after a while | 16:24 |
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| muralia1 | trust token stick around | 16:24 |
| adrian_otto | ok, understood | 16:24 |
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| adrian_otto | please submit another identical review against stable/liberty for that. | 16:24 |
| adrian_otto | ^^ muralia1 | 16:24 |
| muralia1 | ok | 16:24 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto: I think i hit a show stopper bug: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/236737/ | 16:25 |
| adrian_otto | any others? | 16:25 |
| daneyon | Using atomic-5/6 images over the weekend, I could not get docker to start on a k8s minion without this patch. | 16:25 |
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| hongbin | daneyon: I am not able to reproduce the error you saw on that one | 16:25 |
| daneyon | There may be other ways to solve the problem... we would need to dig deeper. | 16:25 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, there is a bunch of discussion on this patch | 16:26 |
| daneyon | hongbin: Let me try again today and I will update the review with my findings. | 16:26 |
| hongbin | daneyon: k | 16:26 |
| adrian_otto | is there a quick fix with a more elegant follow on that we can agree on? | 16:26 |
| eghobo_ | +1 hongbin | 16:26 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto there is. I need to test again and then I will provide updates. | 16:26 |
| vilobhmm11 | +1 hongbin | 16:26 |
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| Tango | daneyon: I can help debug if you need a hand | 16:27 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto: Not sure why others don;t see this bug. All, the atomic-5/6 image was updated on 10-12-2015. Make sure you are using this image. You may need to download and add to glance. | 16:27 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, so daneyon please duplicate the review for stable/liberty | 16:28 |
| daneyon | Tango: I fixed the problem, it just sounds like we need to see if that;'s the best fix to the issue | 16:28 |
| adrian_otto | and muralia1 + daneyon be sure the review comment stream has a link to the permalink between each duplicate review | 16:28 |
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| adrian_otto | so that reviewers can easily navigate between them | 16:28 |
| adrian_otto | rather than discover them separately | 16:28 |
| muralia1 | ok | 16:28 |
| daneyon | hongbin I assume you are using the 10-12-2015 atomic-5 or 6 image, correct? | 16:29 |
| adrian_otto | tx | 16:29 |
| hongbin | daneyon: yes, I am | 16:29 |
| daneyon | ok | 16:29 |
| vilobhmm11 | i used atomic-5 daneyon | 16:29 |
| adrian_otto | if there were a way to have a single patch against two branches at once, that would be a cool trick, but I doubt that's possible | 16:29 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, are those our only two must-haves? | 16:31 |
| muralia1 | when are we going to freeze the branch? | 16:32 |
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| adrian_otto | muralia1: as soon as those two patches land, and I have indication from >1 tested that the release has been functionally tested and is known to work | 16:32 |
| daneyon | i would love to have https://review.openstack.org/#/c/236737/ in the relase :-) | 16:32 |
| daneyon | release | 16:32 |
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| adrian_otto | I am seeking volunteers to take the patched stable/liberty code, and deploy it, and use it for everything you can think of looking for problems | 16:33 |
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| daneyon | going once... | 16:33 |
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| leecalcote | adrian_otto: is that a bug-finding challenge? ;) | 16:34 |
| daneyon | going twice... | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | I will personally hand you cash | 16:34 |
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| adrian_otto | ;-) | 16:34 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto count me in | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | leecalcote: yes sir | 16:34 |
| juggler | lol ao | 16:34 |
| daneyon | i don;t need the cash though | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | awesome, thanks daneyon | 16:34 |
| rlrossit | I'm attempting magnum deployments as well, I can switch that over to liberty | 16:34 |
| adrian_otto | drinks on me at the Cisco party. | 16:34 |
| eliqiao_home | adrian_otto: hand up. | 16:35 |
| daneyon | i will take a beer or two | 16:35 |
| rlrossit | I would require the cash though ;) | 16:35 |
| daneyon | lol | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | hahah | 16:35 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto can you ping me when the magnum and client code is cut? | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | in all seriousness, Rackspace and Intel are holding a reception for the OpenStack Innovation Center. I'd love to see you all there. | 16:35 |
| adrian_otto | daneyon: yes. | 16:36 |
| eliqiao_home | cool, glad to be there | 16:36 |
| eghobo_ | adrian_otto: I can play/test with stable/liberty when it's ready | 16:36 |
| juggler | i'm there in spirit! | 16:36 |
| adrian_otto | thanks eghobo_ | 16:36 |
| daneyon | is their a list of functionality I can test against? | 16:37 |
| eghobo_ | ' OpenStack Innovation Center' is it in SF? | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | so my plan is to bundle an initial release once we merge those two patches (hopefully today) | 16:37 |
| eghobo_ | daneyon: start with dev quick start | 16:37 |
| daneyon | ya | 16:37 |
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| adrian_otto | hold off on the announcement. Get input from each of you on confirmed readiness, | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | iterate if needed, then release based on your guidance | 16:37 |
| adrian_otto | and announce the release | 16:37 |
| SteveA | I'll try the dev quick start too | 16:38 |
| daneyon | adrian_otto I assume you want our whole test stack to use the L release, correct? | 16:38 |
| adrian_otto | thanks SteveA | 16:38 |
| adrian_otto | daneyon: yes, if possible | 16:38 |
| daneyon | got it | 16:38 |
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| adrian_otto | it's also imformative to know about others who made it work on previous releases and how, but confirmation on liberty is the first priority | 16:39 |
| daneyon | makes sense | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | ok, let's open it up | 16:39 |
| adrian_otto | #topic Open Dicsussion | 16:39 |
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| daneyon | Tango: Does the atomic-6 image posted on 10-12-2015 is built from the rpm's in this repo: https://copr.fedoraproject.org/coprs/tango/f21-kubernetes-v1/builds/ | 16:40 |
| daneyon | of if anyone else has the answer | 16:40 |
| Tango | daneyon: Yes it is | 16:40 |
| daneyon | great, thx | 16:41 |
| eliqiao_home | I would like to bring more attentions on functional testing stuff, started from this patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/232421/12 | 16:41 |
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| adrian_otto | dimtruck had ideas about how to transition to tempest and allow the func tests to run in parallel. | 16:42 |
| vilobhmm11 | eliqiao_home : sure | 16:42 |
| eghobo_ | eliqiao_home: I think we should discuss it at Tokyo | 16:42 |
| adrian_otto | this will be a subject of discussion in a workroom session next week, guaranteed | 16:42 |
| eliqiao_home | eghobo_: sure , good to know. | 16:43 |
| eghobo_ | it's big topic and we all should agree how we are going to do func test | 16:43 |
| eghobo_ | and all will folow | 16:43 |
| adrian_otto | absolutely | 16:43 |
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| hongbin | I have a comment on the magnum-ui depedency | 16:43 |
| hongbin | magnum-ui is using master version of magnum, but not master version of magnumclient. Is that correct? | 16:44 |
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| hongbin | bradjones: ^^ | 16:44 |
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| bradjones | it should be using the released versions of both | 16:45 |
| bradjones | I think currently we point at magnum from git is that correct? | 16:45 |
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| hongbin | I think so. But not for magnumclient | 16:45 |
| bradjones | I will put out a patch to change that now | 16:45 |
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| hongbin | k | 16:46 |
| bradjones | we should only be pointing at released packages from the ui | 16:46 |
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| hongbin | get it | 16:46 |
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| hongbin | A disadvantage is that pointing ui to release might not pick up the latest features from Magnum | 16:48 |
| hongbin | But it is good for stableness | 16:48 |
| adrian_otto | that's probably ok | 16:48 |
| hongbin | k | 16:48 |
| hongbin | thx bradjones | 16:48 |
| adrian_otto | if we have a compelling new feature, we can just cut a release for it | 16:49 |
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| bradjones | no problem | 16:49 |
| adrian_otto | and assuming the ui picks the current releases, then we surface that without much effort | 16:49 |
| hongbin | sure | 16:49 |
| bradjones | perhaps I will wait and change it once the new releases go out later today | 16:50 |
| bradjones | then we start completely up to date :) | 16:50 |
| adrian_otto | I just opened up a chunk of time this afternoon to get taht done | 16:51 |
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| adrian_otto | ok, should we wrap up a few minutes early for a change? | 16:52 |
| vilobhmm11 | adrian_otto : is there a common place/etherpad where the design summit discussion will be jotted down for people who won't be able to make it to the summit ? | 16:52 |
| juggler | +1 vilo | 16:53 |
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| vilobhmm11 | last time we had a ref here https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Design_Summit/Liberty/Etherpads#Magnum that was useful if we have something of that sort this time as well it be useful IMHO | 16:53 |
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| adrian_otto | vilobhmm11: Yes, I will place it on the Wiki (or find another way to link to it in the main schedule) and email that our on openstack-dev with the [Magnum] topic tag in the subject. | 16:54 |
| vilobhmm11 | adrian_otto : thanks! that would be nice | 16:54 |
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| juggler | ^^AI needed? | 16:54 |
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| adrian_otto | juggler: I already recorded that as an action | 16:55 |
| juggler | cool | 16:55 |
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| adrian_otto | thanks everyone for attending today. Our next meeting will be Tuesday 2015-11-03 at 1600 UTC. | 16:55 |
| adrian_otto | #endmeeting | 16:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 20 16:56:10 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2015/containers.2015-10-20-16.02.html | 16:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2015/containers.2015-10-20-16.02.txt | 16:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/containers/2015/containers.2015-10-20-16.02.log.html | 16:56 |
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| juggler | thx adrian | 16:57 |
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| sergmelikyan | #startmeeting | 17:00 |
| openstack | sergmelikyan: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee' | 17:00 |
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| sergmelikyan | #startmeeting murano | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 20 17:00:46 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sergmelikyan. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| Nikolay_St | hi | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: murano)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'murano' | 17:00 |
| sergmelikyan | hi folks o/ | 17:00 |
| kzaitsev_ip | O/ | 17:00 |
| freerunner | heey :) | 17:01 |
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| katyafervent | hi | 17:02 |
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| sergmelikyan | Today is a last meeting before the summit and I think we should have it short :) | 17:03 |
| StanLagun | o/ | 17:03 |
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| Nikolay_St | sergmelikyan: sure, let's run through it) | 17:04 |
| sergmelikyan | So I guess I have only one topic from my side: agenda for our contributors meetup | 17:04 |
| sergmelikyan | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/murano-mitaka-contributors-meetup | 17:04 |
| sergmelikyan | any suggestion? | 17:04 |
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| sergmelikyan | Please don't hesitate to add topics that you would like to discuss :) | 17:06 |
| Nikolay_St | sergmelikyan: what is 'Service API' topic? | 17:06 |
| sergmelikyan | #topic Open Discussion | 17:06 |
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| Nikolay_St | well | 17:06 |
| sergmelikyan | @Nikolay_St We didn't yet explain this topic in the etherpad, I will work on that by tomorrow | 17:06 |
| Nikolay_St | I have a really small suggestion for open discussion | 17:07 |
| sergmelikyan | it's a way to make our actions API more convenient, like change endpoint URL and etc... | 17:07 |
| Nikolay_St | I'd like to start a work on 'APIv2' and today discussed it with sergmelikyan | 17:07 |
| Nikolay_St | the good starting point could be creating a copy of existing API depends on Flask | 17:08 |
| Nikolay_St | what do you think about it, guys? | 17:08 |
| sergmelikyan | Nikolay_St: please add to the etherpad? | 17:09 |
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| Nikolay_St | sergmelikyan: ok | 17:09 |
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| StanLagun | Don't think it's a good idea. There is no point to switch framework for existing API if we are going to design new one and this switch gives us no clear benefits | 17:10 |
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| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: starting point | 17:10 |
| sergmelikyan | otherwise we will never get out hands to implement that | 17:10 |
| katyafervent | Flask? again? | 17:11 |
| StanLagun | Starting point for what? Starting point would be implementing small part of APIv2 not to rewrite thing that already works fine | 17:11 |
| sergmelikyan | and given that we thought about rewamping our vision of environment<>apps relations in object model - it may be good place to experiment | 17:11 |
| katyafervent | ( we used to have murano repository related things on flask) | 17:11 |
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| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: I didn't say reimplemennt that thing from scratch | 17:11 |
| kzaitsev_ws | why Flask? | 17:12 |
| katyafervent | if we want to rewrite something we should forget about existing things | 17:12 |
| sergmelikyan | copy :) | 17:12 |
| sergmelikyan | katyafervent: nope | 17:12 |
| katyafervent | and design from scratch | 17:12 |
| kzaitsev_ws | I mean. Flask is not an api-centrik kind of thing | 17:12 |
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| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, that what Nikolay_St said. ...creating a copy of existing API... | 17:12 |
| sergmelikyan | I propose to have this discussion on summit and think through until that. Glance team can have good hints how to do that properly | 17:13 |
| kzaitsev_ws | I thought there was a dedicated thing in the global requirements | 17:13 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: copy, but not creating from scratch | 17:13 |
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| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: about API framework? | 17:13 |
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| kzaitsev_ws | can't remember the exact name. but Fask is a web framework, like django | 17:14 |
| kzaitsev_ws | smaller in scale | 17:14 |
| kzaitsev_ws | but still it's a web framework | 17:14 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: well | 17:14 |
| StanLagun | I suggest to start with APIv2 design before implement anything | 17:14 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_ws: pecan and wsgi? | 17:14 |
| kzaitsev_ws | there | 17:14 |
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| kzaitsev_ws | pecan yep | 17:14 |
| Nikolay_St | Nikolay_St: may be I'm wrong with the name? | 17:14 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: pecan is not the standart | 17:14 |
| katyafervent | StanLagun, + 1 | 17:15 |
| katyafervent | and picking framework is a separate topic | 17:15 |
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| kzaitsev_ws | neither is Flask | 17:15 |
| Nikolay_St | and some teams said that it's not as good as it should be | 17:15 |
| kzaitsev_ws | 'some teams said' is a lousy argument, don't you think? | 17:15 |
| Nikolay_St | StanLagun: for how long we will wait before 'start design'? | 17:15 |
| kzaitsev_ws | pecan can't do X and sucks at Y is better | 17:15 |
| katyafervent | until we have a specification | 17:16 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: I have a link for the discussion about it. | 17:16 |
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| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: I think it contains some arguments | 17:16 |
| StanLagun | Nikolay_St, you don't have to wait for anything. Design is a regular task that you can peek if you'd like. But design need to come before implementation | 17:16 |
| kzaitsev_ws | please share, I'm all in if the arguments are solid | 17:16 |
| katyafervent | api design spec and select framework can be done in separate | 17:16 |
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| katyafervent | know we are discussing two different things | 17:17 |
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| katyafervent | * now | 17:17 |
| StanLagun | you are now more focused on the framework rather than with what you going to write on it. That scares me | 17:17 |
| sergmelikyan | folks, folks.... :) | 17:17 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | StanLagun: if we pick the framework now — we're stuck with it for the next few years. | 17:18 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: let's go through with point that Nikolay_St and me supporting: create a copy of the current api (probable based on the new framework), should be easy task, right? When you are just changing api wrapper and routing | 17:19 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | which new framework? | 17:19 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: who cares right now? | 17:19 |
| kzaitsev_mb | can we at least get a ML discussion on that? | 17:19 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: there are tons of them already from another teams :) | 17:19 |
| kzaitsev_mb | sergmelikyan I care | 17:19 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: let me finish please | 17:20 |
| kzaitsev_mb | sergmelikyan: that's why I care | 17:20 |
| kzaitsev_mb | as if I can interrupt you over the internet | 17:20 |
| StanLagun | kzaitsev_mb, I know, but we don't have to choose it right now. And we will also stick with new API for much longer I guess so I don't think framework name is what most important right now | 17:20 |
| sergmelikyan | let's go through with point that Nikolay_St and me supporting: create a copy of the current api (probable based on the new framework), should be easy task, right? When you are just changing api wrapper and routing, and leave implementation as it is (we can reference same implementation which is used in v1 right?), then start changing parts of the API, writing new implementation. | 17:20 |
| kzaitsev_mb | how can you implement something with the new framework without choosing it? | 17:21 |
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| sergmelikyan | and obviously do that having design first, StanLagun no worries about that | 17:22 |
| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, lets first decide what new API should look like. Otherwise it looks like a 50/50 waste of time porting things that you may no longer need (and this requires testing and so on) | 17:22 |
| sergmelikyan | I've just tired from the talks about new API v2 and nothing happening. | 17:22 |
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| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: we are not porting anything - we reference same implementation from v2, than let's say we are changing session mechanism and implement it in the new api. than do the same for the tasks and so on. | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | bit by bit | 17:23 |
| sergmelikyan | we will plan new api forever if we are going just do the talk | 17:23 |
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| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, how do you know that this is the optimal way if you don't have any design at all? | 17:24 |
| kzaitsev_mb | I see what you mean. Have no objections to the idea. | 17:24 |
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| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: because we will have design WHEN we are going to change something | 17:24 |
| kzaitsev_mb | Would like to have at least minimal discussion about the tech we choose for it | 17:24 |
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| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: sure thing, I propose you to check already existing discussions around pecan and flask + idea for abandoning eventlet | 17:25 |
| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, cannot agree with that. We will have design when we start designing, not when we switch web framework. That doesn't make us closer to solution | 17:25 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: discussion is good) | 17:25 |
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| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: what framework does have with API design? | 17:25 |
| Nikolay_St | and here is the mailing list discussion http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-August/073156.html | 17:25 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: ^^ | 17:26 |
| StanLagun | nothing. So why waste our time on this instead of doing design? | 17:26 |
| StanLagun | lets start with more important things | 17:26 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: design should come with use-cases, when you have use-cases you want to prototype, and that will give a way to do that. | 17:26 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | Seriously guys. This whole situation looks ugly. you've decided something, read some emails and started some work, which good. But you could at least write a simple small letter to the ML saying, "Hey, we've started doing this big important thing, rmember this X vs Y discussion — we've chose Y to implement the big thing, etc etc" | 17:27 |
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| StanLagun | agree with use cases and prototyping and do on. I just don't see how switch of framework help prototyping. Why not start with use cases first? | 17:27 |
| sergmelikyan | It will be done anyway once you will start implementing any new thing, but I don't believe that we can design whole new API and then implement | 17:27 |
| sergmelikyan | that does not work like that in open source | 17:27 |
| sergmelikyan | or anywhere else | 17:28 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_ws: we don't start anythinh | 17:28 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | Nikolay_St: don't or didnt'? | 17:28 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: didn't | 17:28 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: switching framework is possible, but is not necessity. I am talking about adding v2 endpoint which point to the same implementation as v1 | 17:28 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: except two etherpads 2 months ago, I guess | 17:28 |
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| katyafervent | ativelkov, can help us with design and his experience in big api changes | 17:29 |
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| sergmelikyan | oh god... I feel like troll of the year :) | 17:29 |
| Nikolay_St | katyafervent: if he has enough time for that | 17:29 |
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| katyafervent | Nikolay_St, I suggest to set up a couple of meetings where we will collect all use cases | 17:30 |
| kzaitsev_mb | well, yeah. | 17:30 |
| sergmelikyan | @katyafervent etherpad and e-mail regarding that didn't help at all | 17:30 |
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| sergmelikyan | you think on the meeting people will have better ideas from top of they heads? | 17:30 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: I have nothing against email, gosh | 17:31 |
| kzaitsev_mb | k. I see. | 17:31 |
| katyafervent | We have list of UI problems which based on lack of backend | 17:31 |
| katyafervent | that can be a starting point | 17:31 |
| kzaitsev_mb | I thought you've started the woek, while you were only considering doing the thing | 17:31 |
| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, again, how does it make us closer to v2? There are many things that can be done in theory. But it all cost time/resources/etc. Instead of doing something that could be done later (it we decide that it needed at all) why not start instead with something that is 100% needed that is design, use cases etc. It might be that it is faster to start from scratch. Or that we don't need v2 at all. We don't know for sure | 17:31 |
| StanLagun | now and doing something (even that simple task) without desigh doesn't look like a smart thing to do | 17:31 |
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| katyafervent | sergmelikyan, even 1 meeting can help to start the design and then we can discuss draft everywhere | 17:32 |
| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: I was talking with Nikolay_St today, and we both feel that nothing going to happen, unless people will have an easy way to implement something in v2 | 17:32 |
| kzaitsev_mb | sergmelikyan: it's all in the wording. tbh. | 17:32 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: what do you think we should design in order to add v2 endpoint that point to the same implementation? | 17:33 |
| StanLagun | nothing will happen until someones drives it. But this way it is more likely that nothing will change after the switch. You should be thinking how to drive this thing instead | 17:33 |
| Nikolay_St | guys | 17:33 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: that is exactly what I am doing :) | 17:33 |
| StanLagun | sergmelikyan, why do we need v2 endpoints at all? | 17:33 |
| Nikolay_St | StanLagun: we have some problems with existing API | 17:34 |
| Nikolay_St | I guess | 17:34 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: please, read arguments above, not going to repeat myself :) It's 9 in the evening, fingers are to tired | 17:34 |
| StanLagun | there is nothing to design to make utility that erases HDD. But it doesn't mean we need to write one | 17:34 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | I thought you've started the woek, while you were only considering doing the thing, and the wording made me think, that you've made some tech decisions based on some arbitrary ideas. | 17:34 |
| kzaitsev_mb | I'd like to appologise for being too swift to judge | 17:35 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: that's ok) | 17:35 |
| kzaitsev_mb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-August/073156.html | 17:35 |
| kzaitsev_mb | for the record | 17:35 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | Nikolay_St: btw, the spec in questions considers using pecan. or am I reading it wrong? | 17:36 |
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| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: you're talking about the link? | 17:37 |
| kzaitsev_mb | Nikolay_St: #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/218155/1/specs/mitaka/remove-wsme.rst | 17:37 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: or about current discussion here? | 17:37 |
| kzaitsev_mb | it says | 17:37 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | 'The most obvious choice is probably to use the Pecan' | 17:38 |
| kzaitsev_mb | So I still would like some minimal discussion about the tech. | 17:38 |
| kzaitsev_mb | like we have options A/B/C | 17:38 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | or we can have a spec like ceilometers, right? | 17:38 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | isn't that the most open way to do such things? =) | 17:39 |
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| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: I think I can start work on this kind of spec | 17:40 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: at least it's a small step forward, isn't it? | 17:40 |
| kzaitsev_mb | Nikolay_St: yep. the link we both mentioned have a couple of interesting alternatives. | 17:41 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: sure) | 17:41 |
| kzaitsev_mb | like Falcon, that's used in Zaqar and Flavio says, that they're happy with it. | 17:42 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | well, there are some options. maybe flask is the right tech. just would like to consider others. | 17:43 |
| kzaitsev_mb | sergmelikyan: StanLagun: Nikolay_St what would you say if we called the api version 1.5? | 17:43 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | huh? | 17:43 |
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| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: what for? | 17:44 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | Nikolay_St: cause it won't be api v2 before we actually design v2. | 17:44 |
| kzaitsev_mb | or 1.9 | 17:44 |
| Nikolay_St | kzaitsev_mb: sound good for me | 17:44 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | as far as I understand the point is to have a platform to experiment easily, do the boilerplate code now and to be able to expand it quickly after the design is there | 17:45 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | so we might create a 1.5, compatible with 1.0 on the new framework and then make breaking changes and call it 2.0 | 17:46 |
| kzaitsev_mb | might be a bad idea | 17:46 |
| kzaitsev_mb | don't know, just thinking out loud | 17:46 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | sergmelikyan: StanLagun: are you still there? =) | 17:48 |
| StanLagun | yep | 17:48 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | I think Serg decided to abandon us for being too edgy =))) | 17:50 |
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| sergmelikyan | kzaitsev_mb: I don't know what to say :) | 17:50 |
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| kzaitsev_mb | you've startled the hornets nest, I'm afraid =) | 17:51 |
| Nikolay_St | but it works) | 17:51 |
| Nikolay_St | finally | 17:51 |
| sergmelikyan | You are guys fighting about different stuff and completely ignoring what I was saying :) | 17:52 |
| sergmelikyan | I want to unblock contributors to be free working on the new ideas for our API. | 17:52 |
| sergmelikyan | I want people stop talking and start doing | 17:53 |
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| sergmelikyan | I want to stop constant references to "we need to design whole api first" | 17:53 |
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| sergmelikyan | I want to have v1 finally stable and not add crutches on top of it | 17:53 |
| StanLagun | there are several alternate ideas 1) make 1.5 2) make v2 and v3 in parallel 3) make experimental git branch 4) experiment on v1 | 17:54 |
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| StanLagun | I also afraid of database issues because it is hard to experiment when you tied by existing database schema | 17:54 |
| StanLagun | so there are too many questions for this short meeting | 17:54 |
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| Nikolay_St | StanLagun: I can send a letter to ML with some list of 'how to operate' | 17:55 |
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| sergmelikyan | Nikolay_St: I would wait until end of the summit :) | 17:56 |
| sergmelikyan | Anyway people are too busy by summit activities to reply | 17:56 |
| Nikolay_St | sergmelikyan: yeah, I forgot about summit | 17:56 |
| StanLagun | If we want v1 to be rock-stable we need to thing on CI so that it would be impossible for change in v2 or anything to break v1 | 17:56 |
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| StanLagun | can we pospone this for 1 month. There is ongoing design on next architecture that we are doing right now. It will materialize in next several weeks probably. This may be a better starting point for new API | 17:59 |
| sergmelikyan | StanLagun: this is not anyhow related | 18:00 |
| sergmelikyan | #endmeeting | 18:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 20 18:00:18 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2015/murano.2015-10-20-17.00.html | 18:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2015/murano.2015-10-20-17.00.txt | 18:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/murano/2015/murano.2015-10-20-17.00.log.html | 18:00 |
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| vipul | FYI.. No Cue team meting today | 18:08 |
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