Wednesday, 2013-10-02

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ekarlsohey danwent :)06:52
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mestery#startmeeting networking_ml214:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Oct  2 14:00:21 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is mestery. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'networking_ml2'14:00
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mestery#link Agenda14:00
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mesterySo, I'd like to spend 15-20 minutes on bugs and docs, and the remainder of the meeting on Icehouse planning.14:01
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mestery#topic Bugs and Docs14:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and Docs (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)"14:01
mesteryrkukura: Can you update us on docs?14:01
rkukuraemagana is doing a 1st pass at updating the cloud admin guide14:02
rkukurareview is at
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rkukuraDoes anyone have progress to report on the other guides?14:02
SukhdevI have not been able to start yet14:03
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rkukuraI don't see reviews attached to any of the other doc bugs14:04
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mesteryOK. We'll have to keep an eye on those reviews this week to ensure some progress is made on at least some of them.14:04
rkukuraI guess that's it for now, but we need to make progress14:04
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mesteryrkukura: Thanks and I agree.14:04
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mesteryOn the bug front, are there any ML2 bugs we should discuss in the meeting today?14:05
SukhdevI will start on mine either later this week or early next week14:05
mesterySukhdev: Thanks!14:05
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mesterySo I guess on the bug front, ML2 is looking good then!14:06
SukhdevI have a patch out for Arista cleanup bug -will be pushing updated patch later today14:06
rkukuraI just filed and will propose a fix similar to that for
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1234195 in neutron "ML2 mechanism drivers not called for ports auto-deleted when subnet deleted" [Undecided,New]14:06
mesterySukhdev: Thanks!14:06
matrohonI also updated my patch about live-migration14:06
mesteryrkukura: Awesome, thanks for cleaning both of those up!14:06
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mesterymatrohon: I saw that, thanks for adding similar support to OVS and LB plugins.14:06
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matrohonas I understood, mark want it for RC1?14:07
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rkukuraI haven't reviewed it yet, but am slightly concerned its scope may too big for RC1 or RC214:07
mesterymatrohon: I think RC1 was cut already or will be soon.14:08
mesteryBut there will be an RC2 likely.14:08
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rkukuraBut I think we should try to get it in14:08
mesterymarkmcclain says that bug is the last blocker for RC.14:08
mesteryrkukura: Lets review that one ASAP once the meeting is done.14:08
markmcclainyes it is the last one I've been waiting on for RC114:09
mesterymarkmcclain: We're discussing
mesteryOK, lets review this one diligently after the ML2 meeting.14:09
rkukuramarkmcclain: Is this the one rc1 is waiting for?14:09
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mestery#action rkukura and mestery to review as it's the last RC1 blocker14:09
markmcclainyeah mainly because there's a change to the RPC interface14:10
rkukuraI'll review it ASAP14:10
markmcclainideally I we don't want to change those between RC releases14:10
rkukuramakes sense14:10
mesteryOK, thanks for clarifying markmcclain.14:10
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mesteryAny other bugs to discuss?14:10
Sukhdevwhat is the timeline for RC2?14:10
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markmcclainSukhdev: there is not a definitive date for RC214:11
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markmcclainit depends on any issues we find the first RC14:11
SukhdevI will be putting out an updated patch today - wanted to check when will it make it in14:12
mesteryOK, just a note for everyone in case you missed it: ML2 is now the default plugin for devstack when running with Neutron.14:13
Sukhdevsaw that - thanks14:13
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mesteryThanks to rkukura for working with me last week for 2.5 days to track down the tempest failures!14:13
pcm_Are there published notes for users wanting to migrate from OVS-> ML2?14:14
mesterypcm_: Not yet, we're working on that.14:14
mesteryAnd in fact, that leads us to the next topic ...14:14
mestery#topic ML2 Icehouse Planning14:14
*** openstack changes topic to "ML2 Icehouse Planning (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)"14:14
mesteryIf you look at the agenda, we have a list of ML2 Icehouse items listed there, collected from anyone who wanted to put an idea down.14:15
rkukurado we want to consider a conversion tool that populates ML2's tables based on existing OVS tables?14:15
mesteryrkukura: That would be interesting actually.14:15
roaethello. I am back.14:15
mesteryroaet: Hi, we're discussing Icehouse planning now.14:16
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mesterySo, the thinking is that we'd like to see if we could group all the ML2 items into maybe two Icehouse sessions.14:16
roaetThank you, I apologize for lateness. Flu season hitting my family hard. Have we done doc-project status?14:16
rkukurawould such a conversion tool be required at the point when icehouse drops the deprecated plugins?14:16
mesteryrkukura: That's when it would make most sense, yes.14:17
mesteryrkukura: I was hoping to walk down the list and discuss the items now, make sense?14:18
rkukuraI'm not sure the conversion tool would need a session, but maybe be part of one14:18
mesterySo, the first item which is on the list is RPC handling in ML2.14:18
mesteryasomya has looked at this a bit, and we even talked about this a bit in May/June of this year.14:19
mesteryBut deferred doing anything until Icehouse.14:19
mesteryasomya: Here? Want to elaborate on this one?14:19
asomya@mestery sure14:20
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asomyaIn a nutshell, we want RPC messages to be sent all the way to they type and mechanism managers instead of the ml2 plugin answering them.14:20
rkukuraasomya: what about when several mechanism (all the l2 agent drivers) receive the same RPC?14:21
asomyaThis does crop up some issues with multiple drivers loaded, so I was thinking we could either implement multiple topics and send all messages to all drivers to be consumed as seen fit or implement an RPC manager that collects replies from all dirvers and sends it down to the sender14:21
rkukuraasomya: What is motivating this?14:22
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Sukhdevasomya: what is the goal for doing this>?14:22
asomya@rkukura A couple of ML2 drivers that we were tying to implement, including Opendaylight.. where we need custom RPC calls to the mechanism manager that talks to the controller14:23
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rkukuraFor "common" RPC methods like get_device_details(), could common plugin code handle the RPC, find the bound mech driver, and call it?14:23
mesteryrkukura: For common RPC methods, that makes sense to me.14:23
asomyaWe could take the common code and make a class out of it so that if any mech manager just wants the generic replies.. it can simply inherit that otherwise override calls as needed14:24
asomya*mech driver.. not mech manager14:24
rkukuradoes anything prevent mech drivers currently from registering additional RPC methods they handle, or do we need to provide an interface for this?14:24
matrohonthis is done with type_tunnel, which handle tunnel_sync14:25
asomyaThere's shouldn't be anything blocking additional registering, this is for the case where we want to override the common methods as well14:25
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rkukurasounds like something we could work out at the summit as part of a session on ML2 driver APIs or something14:26
asomya@rkukura yup, i was thinking the same14:26
mesteryMakes sense to me14:26
mesteryLEts move on, considering the time and the rest of hte list.14:27
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mestery#action RPC handling in ML2 to be added to an ML2 sessions for Icehouse Summit14:27
mesteryNext item on the list: More extensible TypeDrivers.14:27
mesteryThis came out of controller-based MEchanismDrivers, specifically OpenDaylight.14:27
mesteryasomya and I hit this, and I know rkukura has talked to cdub about this as well.14:27
rkukurais the crux of this that some controller want network_type to be opaque?14:28
mesterySpecifically, if a controller wants to control segment allocation, it's possible a TypeDriver may need to make a REST call to a controller.14:28
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mesteryrkukura: Yes.14:28
rkukuraReally opaque, or just selected by the controller?14:28
mesteryBoth, to some extent.14:29
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asomyaCurrently the segementation management is distributed across the plugin and the type drivers are just selectors. We should move everything segmentation related to the type drivers and the Ml2 plugin could just call the type drivers tfor segmentation ids14:29
rkukuraA completely opaque network_type should just be a new driver in the existing framework, but the later might take some work14:29
SukhdevWill this mean the segmentation ID allocation be pushed to controller as well?14:30
mesterySukhdev: That was part of the motiviation in the case of ODL, yes.14:30
rkukuraasomya: Isn't that how it works now?14:30
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asomya@rkukura from what i saw, the plugin expects an integer segmentation id and stores it in the DB itself.. the network_id is not sent to type drivers.. at least in the case of the vlan type driver that i saw.. it was jsut selecting a vlan id available and sending it back to the ml2 plugin14:31
rkukuraclearly this is something to discuss at the summit - should it be part of the same "ML2 driver API" session as above?14:31
rkukuraasomya: I thinkk already addresses at least part of this14:32
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mesteryrkukura: I think that makes sense.14:32
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mesteryrkukura: I forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me!14:32
mesteryOK, lets add this one to the Summit list as well.14:32
mestery#action TypeDriver extension in the context of controller MechanismDrivers to be part of Icehouse Summit sessions.14:32
rkukuraI'm thinking that BP and the two items we've discussed all relate to each other14:33
mesteryNext on the list: Monolithic plugins vs. ML2 MechanismDrivers: current and future plans14:33
mesteryrkukura: Agreed.14:33
mesteryrkukura: You put this on on the agenda, right?14:33
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rkukuraThe idea was to get the maintainers of existing monolithic controller-based plugins, and those considering writing new ones, into a room to discuss tradeoffs/obstacles/etc regarding ML2 driver vs. monolithic14:34
mesterySo, more of a discussion to see if ML2 is missing something to support their needs?14:35
amotokihi, i am interested in this topic too. If ML2 allows additional extension support by mechanism drivers, migration to ML2 becomes easier.14:35
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rkukuraso the issues we discussed already are deep technical details, but I'm looking more at the ecosystem and community aspects of it14:35
mesteryamotoki: What do you mean by additional extension support? Extension APIs?14:35
mesteryrkukura: I think this aspect is perfect to start off the ML2 sessions with at the Summit.14:35
rkukuraand also whether, for example, the L3 and other service plugability need to evolve for this14:36
amotokiSome monilithic plugin supports extra extensions and it can be a blocker to migratoin to ML2.14:36
amotokiservice plugin mechanism may help it of course.14:36
rkukuraamotoki: that's a great item for that session14:36
amotokithat sounds nice thought i haven't break down the problem yet.14:37
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mestery#action Add Ecosystem and community aspects of ML2 to the Icehouse list14:37
mesteryI think that one is a no-brainer to add the Summit list rkukura.14:37
rkukuraMy suggestion is this one is not a BP, but more of a debate14:37
mesteryrkukura: Agreed.14:37
rkukuraOK, I'll submit it14:37
mesteryOK, next item on the list: Future directions for ML2 (orchestration, deployment, management, ...)14:38
mesteryrkukura: Looks like this one is more of a discussion as well, correct?14:38
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rkukurayes, various ideas were in my ML2 proposals at the last two summits, and others may have ideas too14:39
rkukuramodular agent is another14:39
mesteryYes, I agree.14:39
mesteryAlso, Modular Layer 3 as well, though that may be outside the scope of ML2 perhaps.14:40
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rkukuraso not sure if a free-form session on futures makes sense, or a set of  BPs to discuss14:40
roaetmestery: I've been interested in working with pluggable/configurable IPAM. Would that be Modular Layer 3?14:41
SukhdevDo we have plans to cover ML3 in IceHouse or only limit it to ML2?14:41
rkukurais these where discussion of fits?14:41
mesteryroaet: I think it's separate, modular layer 3 would be allowing multiple disparite L3 agents to work together, similar to how ML2 does it for MechanismDrivers.14:41
roaetAh got it.14:41
mesteryrkukura: I think so, yes.14:41
mesterySukhdev: I'm throwing ML3 out there, since in Havana L3 was made pluggable, it only makes sense to make it more extensible in the same way as ML2 IMHO.14:42
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rkukuraI was touching on this under the monolithic-vs-driver session as well, but a specific BP to discuss for ML3 would be great14:43
mestery#action File blueprint for Modular Layer 3 (ML3), good Icehouse Summit session.14:43
mesteryOK, moving on to the next item.14:43
SukhdevSo, shall we add a session to discuss ML3 extensibility as well?14:43
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mesterySukhdev: Yes, just noted that. :)14:43
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mesteryNExt item: Migration from deprecated plugins.14:44
mesteryWe touched on this a bit already.14:44
mesteryI think it's worth talking about this at the Summit as well, perhaps in a combined session.14:44
rkukuraSeems we might have some ideas how to combine topics into a set of sessions, but cannot finalize that until we have them all14:44
mesteryrkukura: Yes.14:44
mesterySo, regarding migration, rkukura, something to add to the Summit list?14:45
rkukuranot sure how much there is to discuss about it14:45
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mesteryrkukura: Fair point.14:46
rkukuraWe could file a BP for a tool and discuss it14:46
rkukurabut something like 10 minutes might be enough14:46
mestery#action File BP for migration from deprecated plugins to ML2.14:46
rkukuraunless there is controversy14:46
mesteryHeh :)14:46
mesteryOK, next item, and something matrohon may be interested in:14:47
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mesteryAdding VXLAN multicast into the OVS agent.14:47
mesteryThis is somewhat related to ML2, and was brought up on #openstack-neutron this week, so I thought I'd put it in here.14:47
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mesteryAnyways, this is something which is possible with newer versions of OVS, Linux kernel, and iproute2 packages.14:48
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mesteryAnd would make LB and OVS with VXLAN very close to the same, as both would use VXLAN ports from the Linux kernel.14:48
rkukuraIs using it just a matter of turning off the endpoint management, or is there more to it?14:49
mestery#action File BP for VXLAN multicast support in OVS plugin using upstream Linux kernel VXLAN ports.14:49
mesteryrkukura: That may be it, but there may be a bit of underlying configuration required, I need to look into it a bit to verify.14:49
rkukuratrying to get a sense of which are 10 minute topics vs. needing 40 minutes (or more)14:50
matrohonmestery: sounds great, we need to have the same beahvior between ovs and lb with vxlan14:50
SukhdevI thought OVS plugin was being deprecated, am I missing something?14:50
mesterySukhdev: I mean OVS agent.14:50
mesteryWith the OVS MD14:50
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Sukhdevah thanks14:50
mesterymatrohon: Yes, I think that's a good goal to have, and it's achievable.14:50
mesteryrkukura: I think this is a 10 minute topic, or maybe not even worth discussing at the summit.14:51
mesteryBP may be all that is needed.14:51
matrohonagreed, this is just an aligment betwen the two agent14:51
mesteryOK, the last topic: Multisegment provider network implementations in MechanismDrivers and OVS.14:51
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mesteryThis came up from a discussion amongst apech rcurran myself and a few others yesterday.14:52
rkukuramestery: Can you explain?14:52
apechi can try too :)14:52
mesteryThe thinking was that we could modify the OVS agent to support "bridging" provider networks, if needed.14:52
mesteryapech: Please, jump in here. :)14:53
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mesteryBut there was slightly more to it as well, I'm missing some nuance perhaps.14:53
apechso i'm not sure if this needs to be discussed at the summit, but one area of interest is how neutron can define VXLAN gateways (basically a translation of VXLAN to VLAN). This seems to be something a bunch of different plugins solve14:53
rkukurathis kind of fits in with the futures and orchestration14:53
rkukurabridging service?14:54
mesteryrkukura apech: Yes to both.14:54
apechlooking at what's out there, there seem to be a couple possible ways of doing this - provider networks (and multi provider networks), and the Nicira plugin defines a NetworkGateway class14:54
mesterySo, I think this may be something to discuss at the summit.14:54
matrohonyou can use l2-pop two14:54
apechso I'm not sure what the right way to push this is, but wondering if others have thoughts, or if it is worthwhile discussing14:54
apechand what that means for the mech drivers14:54
mesterymatrohon: How so?14:54
matrohonwith l2-pop you can tell what next-hop you will use for your vxlan traffic14:55
matrohonwhat tunnel, and so what gateway to use14:56
apechsure, but you need some way to define that the gateway exists, and what attributes it has (ie VTEP IP) - does l2-pop provide this?14:56
mesterymatrohon: Interesting. I think this will be worth discussing in Hong Kong.14:56
rkukuraseems like a good topic to discuss at the summit - maybe a focus on multi-segment networks14:56
apechthen you can bind an existing network to that gateway14:56
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mesteryrkukura: Agreed.14:56
mesteryLets add this one to the agenda.14:56
apechokay sounds good14:56
matrohonmestery: agreed14:56
mestery#action Add multi-segment networks in ML2 to the Icehouse Summit list.14:57
mesteryOK, that was the last one I had.14:57
rkukurawe should see if others in the meeting have additional topics to suggest14:57
amotokiapech: i think  a gateway is to communicate outside  to neutron network.14:57
mesteryIF people have more, please add them to the meeting page for now.14:57
amotokiDo we have a plan to support multiple provider networks on a compute node? if i remember correctly rkukura presented the similar topic in last summit.14:57
mesteryamotoki: That is what we'll discuss in Hong Kong.14:57
mesteryWe could do it using L2 Population it seems.14:57
amotokimestery: nice14:58
mesteryOK, so please list more ML2 ideas on the meeting page.14:58
matrohonamotoki : we also need gateway to communicate between segment14:58
mesteryNext week, rkukura and I will see which ones we can combine and which ones need more time.14:58
amotokiit seems better to create a wiki page such as Nuetron/ML2/Havana.14:58
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rkukuraamotoki: Not sure I understand the question - even grizzly supports multiple provider networks14:58
amotokican we use multiple provider networks on a single node?14:58
mesteryamotoki: This is very temporary for now I think. :)14:58
mesteryamotoki: Yes.14:59
amotokibut we need a single br-int.14:59
matrohonone more subject : do we need a new agent with drivers for ovs and lb?15:00
mesteryWe may need to modify the agent to do this or use L2 Pop, we'll discuss more in Hong Kong it seems.15:00
rkukurathat br-int is managed by a single L2 agent, and can support multiple provider and tenant nets15:00
mesterymatrohon: Good one! rkukura and I were thinking a combined agent perhaps?15:00
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rkukuraamotoki: Are you looking for multiple mechanisms (agents, etc) on same compute node?15:00
mestery#action Discuss a combined Linuxbridge and OVS agent for ML2 as the two converge more nad more.15:00
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matrohonmestery :sounds great!15:00
mesteryOK, thanks again everyone!15:00
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"15:00
openstackMeeting ended Wed Oct  2 15:00:52 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:00
openstackMinutes (text):
rkukurathanks everyone!15:01
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amotokirkukura: What  I think is a case where one bridge is OpenFlow controlled and the other is just a linux bridge. This is one example.15:01
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amotokithank everyone.15:02
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rkukuraamotoki: That probably is not possible yet, so could be a good topic15:06
rkukuraamotoki: Maybe the binding attributes neutron sets on a bound port could be used by nova to get the bridge name15:07
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rkukuraamotoki: There were other changes to the port binding extension that didn't make havana, and maybe this could be part of a discussion of those.15:08
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johnthetubaguymay not have xenapi meeting today15:11
johnthetubaguylets see how people feel15:11
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med_jgriffith, mtg?16:02
jgriffith#startmeeting cinder16:02
openstackMeeting started Wed Oct  2 16:02:05 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is jgriffith. Information about MeetBot at
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openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:02
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:02
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'cinder'16:02
jgriffithHey ho everyone16:02
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bill_az_Hi all16:02
avishayhello all16:02
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jungleboyjWhat a crowd.16:03
jgriffithDuncanT: you've got a number of things on the agenda, you want to start?16:03
jgriffithDuncanT: you about?16:04
DuncanTjgriffith: Once I'd gone through them all, most of them ended up being fix committed. I can only find 2 taskflow bugs though16:04
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DuncanTAnd last week suggested 316:04
jgriffithdid you log a bug/bugs?16:04
DuncanTjgriffith: These are all from last week's summary16:04
jgriffithDuncanT: which *These*16:05
jgriffithYou mean the white-list topic?16:05
jgriffith#topic TaskFlow16:05
*** openstack changes topic to "TaskFlow (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:05
jgriffithso we had two bugs that are in flight16:05
jgriffithI've asked everybody to please review16:05
jgriffiththe white list issue a number of people objected to reversing that16:05
hemna_which reviews ?16:06
eharneyi just put a -0 on 49103, but i think it's ok16:06
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jgriffithhemna_: go to
jgriffithhemna_: anything that's "In Progress" needs a review if it's not in flight16:06
DuncanTAll four seem to eb in flight now16:07
jgriffithhemna_: There's actually on like 3 patches that I'm waiting on, one of them is yours :)16:07
jgriffithDuncanT: Oh yeah!!16:07
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hemna_I need your iscsi patch to land16:07
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jgriffithMy cry for help worked16:07
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hemna_then I'll refactor mine (iser) to remove the volumes_dir conf entry16:08
hemna_as it's a dupe16:08
hemna_in both our patches16:08
jgriffithhemna_: k.. if you need to you can cherry pick and make a dep16:08
jgriffithhemna_: but hopefully gates are moving along still this morning16:08
avishaydon't jinx it...16:08
jgriffitheeesssh... yeah, sorry :(16:09
* jungleboyj is knocking on wood.16:09
jgriffithDuncanT: what else on TaskFlow did you have (think we got side-tracked)16:09
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DuncanTjgriffith: My only question is that last week's summary said 3 bugs, and I could only find 216:09
DuncanTIf there are no more real bugs, I'll stop worrying16:10
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jgriffithDuncanT: well, for H I *hope* we're good16:10
jgriffithDuncanT: For Icehouse I think we have some work to do16:10
jgriffithie white-list versus black-list debate :)16:11
DuncanTSure. Hopefully somebody can take that debate to the summit?16:11
avishayjgriffith: i don't know if you want to discuss this now, but i was wondering what the policy would be for new features in Icehouse - taskflow only?16:11
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jgriffith#topic Icehouse16:11
*** openstack changes topic to "Icehouse (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:11
jgriffithavishay: not sure what you mean?16:12
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jgriffithI hope that taskflow isn't the only thing we work on in I :)16:12
hemna_the policy for new features?  we add them no?16:12
avishayjgriffith: if i'm submitting retype for example, should it use taskflow?16:12
jgriffithalthough that seems to be everybody's interest lately16:12
thingeejgriffith: not me16:12
jgriffithavishay: OHHHH... excellent question!16:12
thingeeapi all the way16:12
jgriffiththingee: :)16:12
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caitlin_56I think that favoring new features via taskflow would be a great idea.16:12
jgriffithavishay: TBH I'm not sure how I feel about that yet16:13
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hemna_avishay, so that kinda begs the question about taskflow, are we propagating it to all of the driver apis ?16:13
jungleboyjjgriffith: The goal is to eventually get everything there, right?16:13
jgriffithcaitlin_56: perhaps, but perhaps not16:13
avishayI hope I'll have time to convert migration and retype to use taskflow for Icehouse, but can't promise16:13
caitlin_56WE shouldn't force things to be taskflows that are not naturally.16:13
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jgriffithTBH I wanted to have some discussions about taskflow at the summit16:13
hemna_jgriffith, ok cool, same here.16:14
jgriffithI'd like to get a better picture of benefits etc and where it's going and when16:14
avishayhemna: i think for something simple like extend volume we don't need it, but for more complex things it could be a good idea16:14
caitlin_56summit discussions are good16:14
hemna_avishay, well I think there could be a case made for even the simple ones.16:14
jgriffithavishay: I think you're right, the trick is that "some here, some there" is a bit awkward16:14
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avishayanyway, something to think about until hong kong16:14
DuncanTI'd certainly like chance to discuss some of the weaknesses of the currently taskflow implementation16:14
jgriffithavishay: yeah, so long as you don't mind the wait16:14
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hemna_I was kind of hoping that tasklowing most things would lead to safe restart of cinder and all of it's services.16:15
jgriffithOk, I think we all seem to agree here16:15
hemna_a la safe shutdown/resume16:15
jgriffithhemna_: I think it will, that's the point16:15
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jgriffithwe need to get more educated and help harlow :)16:15
jgriffithI'd also like to find out more about community uptake16:15
kmartinalready a sesion for what's next in taskflow:
hemna_I already have a long list of my wants for I :P16:15
caitlin_56I've been working with harlow already.16:16
jgriffithI tihnk we're still going that direction, we just need to organize.  We don't want another Brick debacle :)16:16
avishaykmartin: nice!16:16
hemna_hey now16:16
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jgriffithhemna_: that was directed at ME16:16
jgriffith#topic quota-syncing16:16
*** openstack changes topic to "quota-syncing (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:16
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jgriffithDuncanT: you're correct ,that's still hanging out there16:17
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jgriffithDuncanT: I looked at it a bit but quite frankly I ran away screaming16:17
DuncanTjgriffith: It made my head hurt too16:17
jgriffithI'd like to just drop quotas altogether :)16:17
guitarzanquota syncing?16:18
jgriffithguitarzan: yes16:18
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1202896 in nova "quota_usage data constantly out of sync" [High,Confirmed]16:18
jgriffithevery time I mess with quotas I want to die, but...16:19
jgriffithI also think that there are just fundamental issues with the design16:19
caitlin_56No quotas are better than quotas enforced at the wrong locations.16:19
jgriffithMight be something worth looking at for I???16:19
jgriffithDon't all volunteer at once now!16:19
eharneyi would seriously consider the suggestion in that bug to replace the usage table w/ a view if possible16:20
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guitarzanthat's an interesting idea, but it doesn't really tell you if the resource is being used or not16:20
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guitarzanespecially in the error cases16:20
DuncanTI'm not sure that scales with large numbers of volumes and users, unfortunately16:20
jgriffithDuncanT: +116:20
jgriffithI think scale is the big concern with that16:20
caitlin_56guitarzan: I agree. We need definitions that deal with real resource usage. Otherwise we're enforcing phony quotas.16:21
jgriffithHowever I think we could do something creative there16:21
jgriffithDB caching etc16:21
jgriffithanyway... I don't think we're going to solve it here in the next 40 minutes :)16:21
DuncanTI attempted to write a tool that checked the current quota looked valid, and ran it periodically while doing many ops in a tight loop, but couldn't provoke the out-of-sync issue16:21
guitarzanDuncanT: I think you just have to get something in an error state so you can delete it multiple times16:22
jgriffithguitarzan: maybe we should focus on fixing that instead?16:22
DuncanTguitarzan: Ah, ok, that I can provoke16:22
jgriffithgo abou tit the other way16:22
guitarzanjgriffith: I think that's totally fixable16:22
jgriffithdid somebody say State Machine (again)16:22
DuncanTguitarzan: Is there a specific bug for that scenario? Sounds like low hanging fruit....16:22
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guitarzanI wasn't going tos ay taht :)16:23
guitarzanDuncanT: I don't know, I'm just reading the bug16:23
guitarzanI have been able to mess up quotas before, negative16:23
jgriffithDuncanT: there is not, and it's not as low hanging as one would hope IMO16:23
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jgriffithThere's a number of little *holes* that we can run into16:23
jgriffithanyway... quotas aside those are things that I'd really like to see us work on for I16:24
jgriffithexceptions and exception handling falls in that category16:24
DuncanTHmmm, I'm wondering if a runtime fault injection framework might make reproducing these issues easier?16:24
jungleboyjjgriffith: +116:24
avishayagain, state machine16:24
jgriffithhaving a better picture of what happened back up at the manager16:24
jgriffithavishay: :)16:24
jungleboyjI have seen several issues with deleting.16:24
jungleboyjAlso think the issue of exceptions goes along with the taskflow issue.  :-)16:25
jgriffithDuncanT: perhaps, but you can also just pick random points in a driver and raise some exception16:25
jgriffiththat works really well :)16:25
thingeejgriffith: ended up just writing something to correct the quota that we use internally16:25
med_ DuncanT infectedmonkeypatch?16:25
jgriffiththingee: Oh?16:25
thingeejgriffith: that's just a bandaid fix though16:25
DuncanTmed: Sounds promising. I'll have a google16:25
jgriffiththingee: might be something to pursue if DH is interested in sharing16:25
* med_ made that up so google will likely fail miserably16:26
jgriffiththingee: if nothing else experience16:26
DuncanTjgriffith: I was pretty much thinking of formalising that approach so we can test it reproducably16:26
jgriffiththe *experience* you guys have would be helpful16:26
jgriffithDuncanT: Got ya.. if we just implement a State Machine it's covered :)16:26
thingeejgriffith: I think it just wasn't put upstream because it was a bad hack. but yeah we can take ideas from that.16:26
jgriffithJust sayin16:26
* jgriffith promises to not say *State Machine* again16:27
jgriffiththingee: coolness16:27
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jgriffithokie dokie16:27
jgriffithDuncanT: what else you got for us?16:28
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DuncanTI'm all out I think16:28
* jgriffith keeps putting DuncanT on the spot16:28
DuncanTMost of my stuff is summit stuff now16:28
jgriffithOk, I just wanted to catch folks up on the gating disaster over the past few days16:28
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jgriffith#topic gating issues16:28
*** openstack changes topic to "gating issues (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:28
jgriffithso I'm sure you all noticed jobs failing16:28
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hemna_jgriffith, jenkins puked on
jgriffithbut not sure how many people kept updated on what was going on16:29
jungleboyjWhen were jobs failing?16:29
jgriffithThere were a number of intermittent faiures that were in various projects16:29
dosaboywas mainly broken neutron gate test no?16:29
jgriffithI also think that some bugs in projects exposed bugs in other projects etc etc16:29
DuncanThemna: That looks like a straight merge failure, manual rebase should sort it16:30
jgriffithdosaboy: no16:30
jgriffithdosaboy: it was realy a mixed bag16:30
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jgriffithCinder, neutron, nova, keystone...16:30
jungleboyjApparently the one in Neutron was one that had been there for some time but it was a timing thing that was suddenly uncovered.16:30
jgriffithjungleboyj: +116:30
jgriffithSo anyway....16:30
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jgriffiththings are stabilizing a bit, but here's the critical take away for right now16:31
jgriffiththe recheck bug xxx is CRITICAL to track this stuff16:31
jgriffithand even though the elastic search recommendation that pops up is sometimes pretty good, other times it's wayyy off16:31
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jgriffithwe really need to make sure we take a good look at the recheck bugs and see if something fits, and if not log a new bug16:32
jgriffithif you don't know where to log it against, log it against tempest for now16:32
jgriffithbest way to create these is to use the failing tests *name* as the bug title16:32
jgriffiththis makes it easier for people that encounter it later ot identify16:32
jungleboyjjgriffith: +116:32
jgriffithso like "TestBlahBlah.test_some_stupid_thing Fails"16:33
avishayalso, if something is already approved, make sure to do 'reverify bug xxx' and not recheck16:33
jgriffithinclude a link to the gate/log pages16:33
jgriffithavishay: +116:33
jungleboyjYeah, sorry for the ones I rechecked before I learned that tidbit.16:33
avishaysucks when jenkins finally passes and need to send it through again :)16:34
jgriffithalso take a look at this:
jgriffithparticularly the last one16:34
jgriffithFailed 385 times!!!16:34
jgriffiththat's crazy stuff16:34
jgriffithI wasn't even aware of it until it was at 30016:34
jgriffithBTW that wasn't the worst one :)16:35
jgriffithI did some queires last night on those and updated when last seen etc16:35
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jgriffiththat big one 1226337 pretty much died out a few days ago after the fix I put in (break out of the retry loop)16:36
jgriffithbut still hit occasionally16:36
jgriffithIt's an issue with tgtd IMO16:36
jgriffithIt's not as robust as one might like16:36
jgriffithso the follow up is a recovery attempt to create th backing lun explicitly16:37
jgriffiththe other item:  122346916:37
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jgriffithI wanted to point that out because I made a change that does a reovery but still logs the error message in the logs16:37
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jgriffiththis seemed like a good idea at the time, but the querie writers grabbed on to that and still querie on it16:38
jgriffitheven though it recovers and doesn't fail it still gets dinged in the queries16:38
jgriffithso I think I should change it to warning and chane the wording to throw them off he scent :)16:38
jgriffithbut I wanted to go through these to try and keep everybody informed of what was going on16:39
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jgriffithI spent most of the last 3 VERY long days monitoring gates and pouring over logs16:39
avishaycool, thanks for the update and the work!16:39
jgriffithHoping that if/when we hit this sort of thing again we'll have a whole team working on it :)16:40
jungleboyjavishay: +216:40
jgriffithOk, that's all I have...16:40
jgriffithanybody else?16:40
jgriffith#topic open-discussion16:40
*** openstack changes topic to "open-discussion (Meeting topic: cinder)"16:40
dosaboydrinks are on the house!16:41
jgriffithgoing twice....16:41
jgriffithdosaboy: Your house?  Ok, I'm in :)16:41
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jgriffithgoing three times...16:41
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"16:41
openstackMeeting ended Wed Oct  2 16:41:31 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)16:41
openstackMinutes (text):
avishaybye all!16:41
jgriffith20 minutes to spare!!!16:41
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jgriffithavishay: laters16:41
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jungleboyjhey!  We did keep it short!  :-)16:42
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med_thanks jgriffith16:42
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tjones#startmeeting VMwareAPI17:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Oct  2 17:00:15 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is tjones. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)"17:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'vmwareapi'17:00
tjoneshi folks - who's here?17:00
dimshowdy tjones17:00
tjoneshi dims17:00
garykhi, i am here17:00
tjoneshi gary17:00
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garyktjones: hi17:01
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tjonesok - i think everyone knows that hartsocks is on paternity leave for a few weeks.  so i'll run the meetings for a bit17:01
garykmazal tov! (aka good luck)17:02
tjoneslets get started - i ran the bug report this morning -
tjonesoops -17:02
tjones#topic bugs17:02
*** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)"17:02
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tjonesin terms of high/critical bugs we have17:02
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1227825 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "datastore selection bug - fills first disk only" [Critical,In progress]17:03
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tjoneswhich hartsocks was working on.17:03
garyktjones: that has been deferred to I as it is a feature17:03
smurugesanHey All, Sabari here17:03
tjonesthis is the issue where we will only use 1 datastore and then throw exceptions when full.  russellb has put it back into rc potenial.  can someone take this over?17:03
garykrussellb said that there may be a slight chance of getting review for it but it is doubtful17:03
smurugesanI can take it over17:04
tjonesi think it's very close.  thanks smurugesan17:04
smurugesanbecause i have a disk usage bug that can only be fixed after Shawn's patch.17:04
smurugesanlet me pull that for record17:04
tjones#action smurugesan take over
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1227825 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "datastore selection bug - fills first disk only" [Critical,In progress]17:04
tjonesthen we have 2 high/medium that need revision17:04
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1184807 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "Snapshot failure with VMwareVCDriver" [High,Fix committed]17:05
smurugesan will piggy back on 1227825's fix17:05
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1220459 in nova "VMware Driver reports incorrect disk usage" [High,Confirmed]17:05
tjonesoops - looks like the script has a bug.  that one is already committed17:05
garyktjones: that has been approved (it may be in the script as it is a grizzly backport)17:05
tjonesah ok.  lets look at the other one #link
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1213269 in openstack-vmwareapi-team "_check_if_folder_file_exists only checks for metadata file" [High,In progress]17:06
tjoneshee hee - that one is mine.  i'll get on it today17:06
tjonesthe other 2 need review - in fact there are quite a few needing +117:07
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smurugesanI will be doing some reviews today, I will take a look at them.17:07
tjonesby "quite a few" i actually mean 2 high prio and 6 low.  lets focus on the critical/high17:07
tjonesany other bugs needing discussion?17:07
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1225002 in nova "VMware: no VM connectivity when opaque network does not match bridge id" [Medium,In progress]17:08
garykIt also needs to be backported to grizzly. it has been around for quite a while now and we need to escalate to core reviewers17:09
smurugesanOther bugs, I am working on - should push a patch today. It's a regression over Grizzly.17:09
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1193980 in nova "Cinder Volumes "unable to find iscsi target" for VMware instances" [High,Confirmed]17:10
tjonesis it in review?17:10
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tjonesi don't see the link in the bug17:10
garykit has been in review since august - give me a sec17:10
tjoneswow - yes it's very ready for core17:11
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tjonesfunny no link in the bug.  ok that one is marked need core review in the report.17:12
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1197041 in nova "nova compute crashes if you do not have any hosts in your cluster" [Medium,In progress]17:12
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smurugesanfor some reviews, the bug is not getting updated. It happened with me as well.17:12
tjonesgark: yes that one is a pain to debug.  i have hit it and other users have reported it with VOVA.17:13
tjonessmurugesan: that iscsi - i'll add to the list17:13
tjonesany other bugs?17:13
garyki do not know why russellb removed this form the rc candidate. i'll try and check with him later17:13
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1228847 in nova "VMware: VimException: Exception in __deepcopy__ Method not found" [Medium,In progress]17:14
tjonessmurugesan: russellb has added havana-rc-potential to that one17:14
garykthis is really problematic17:14
tjonesyes it is hitting our CI guys17:14
tjonesdo you have root cause on it?17:14
garykif there is a an exception in the driver - for example nova fixed ips are all used up, then the actual exception is corrupted17:15
garykthis one needs to be moved to high17:15
tjonesi don't believe i have the ability to do so.  But we can ping russellb17:15
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garyki think that anyone who is part of the nova bugs team can (you just need to join the group)17:16
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tjonesoh ok - i'll do that :-D17:16
garykrussellb moved it from high to medium (just saw this now). i do not agree with his assesment. it makes troubleshooting practically impossible17:16
tjones#action set to high prio17:16
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1228847 in nova "VMware: VimException: Exception in __deepcopy__ Method not found" [Medium,In progress]17:16
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tjones#action target  for rc17:17
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1193980 in nova "Cinder Volumes "unable to find iscsi target" for VMware instances" [High,Confirmed]17:17
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tjonesany other bug issues besides triage?17:17
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tjones#topic bug triage17:18
*** openstack changes topic to "bug triage (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)"17:18
tjonesok here' s the list :
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1232348 in nova "VMware: vmdk converted via qemu-img may not boot as SCSI disk" [High,New]17:19
vuili filed this. Can someone confirm this well known issue.17:19
smurugesanvuil is working on couple of these bugs.17:19
smurugesanoh there he is17:19
vuilsorry out for a couple minutes17:20
vuilI am testing a fix. Hopefully out today.17:20
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tjonesok next is #link
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1194076 in nova "current_workload in  nova hypervisor-show not recover after nova suspend/resume" [Medium,Incomplete]17:20
tjonesgark it looks like you were discussing that with the reporter.  do you think user error?17:21
garyki was unable to reproduce this17:21
tjonesok lets leave that one17:21
tjonesnext is #link
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1226543 in nova "VMware: attaching a volume to the VM failed" [Medium,Incomplete]17:22
tjonesno action on this after garyk17:22
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tjoneslast we have the results of our test team doing stress tests #link
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1230047 in nova "VMware: spawning large amounts of VMs sometimes causes errors" [Undecided,New]17:23
tjonesrhsu was looking into the nfs server to see if that was the issue.  did anyone else look at this?17:24
garyktjones: this is a tough one. initially we thought it was
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1228847 in nova "VMware: VimException: Exception in __deepcopy__ Method not found" [Medium,In progress]17:24
garykafter we added the patch that i have fixed for that problem we saw the real exception and it was that the VC was return an exception that a vmdk was not found17:25
garykwhen ryan tried on another setup he was unable to reproduce17:25
garyki was also unable to reproduce17:25
garykwe need to try and reproduce this17:25
tjoneshum - the other setup was one in the BLR lab - so that is why he was thinking it was the NFS server somehow17:25
tjonesok let me talk with rhsu and see what the next steps are on this.17:26
tjones#action talk to the test team about repo on
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1230047 in nova "VMware: spawning large amounts of VMs sometimes causes errors" [Undecided,New]17:26
tjonesany other issues before we go to open discussion?17:26
garyktjones: i think that we need to talk about stable grizzly17:27
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tjones#topic open discussion17:27
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: VMwareAPI)"17:27
garyktjones: we should also go over documentation17:27
tjonesok lets talk about that17:27
tjoneswe have until 10/10 to get backports in correct?17:27
garykok. regarding the stable grizzly, the feature freeze is the 10th of the month17:27
garyki think that the relase will be a few days later (due to gating problems over the last few days and stable gate is broken)17:28
garykwe need to make sure that we have all of our critical and high bugs backported and tested hopefully by them17:28
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garykit would be nice if we can make this a formal part of these meetings as the stable branch is very importnat for all17:28
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tjones#action add grizzly backports to the meeting agenda17:29
garyktjones: thanks17:29
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tjonesok we have 5 patches that gary has called out as needing backport17:29
garykregarding documentation i saw (and had a comment). can someone else please take a look17:29
vuiltjones: where is the list of bugs you showed yesterday that had grizzly status17:29
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tjonesgaryk: i have that on my list to review today17:31
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garyktjones: thanks!17:31
vuilwill take a look as well17:32
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tjones#action bug owners review and backport their bugs if they have grizzly-backport-potential tags17:32
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tjonesoff the top of my head  - vui - you have 2, sabari you have 2, i have 117:33
vuilwas going to ask what the procedure is.17:33
tjonesliterally off the top of my head :-) so please check.17:33
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garyki think that i have done one of vui's (and was planning on doing a few others)17:34
vuilI saw that. Thanks.17:34
tjonesvuil - i'll paste the email from garyk on pastebin17:34
garyktjones: thanks17:34
tjoneshere you go -
russellbguys, please don't target new stuff to rc117:35
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russellbit's being released today, just waiting on the last change to go through the gate17:35
tjoneshey russellb17:35
vuilProbably can't assume folks not at this meeting get to the minutes in time to deal with their backports, so best we all take all pass through that list.17:35
garykrussellb: so will these bugs be targeted for rc2?17:36
russellbonly if we determine that they qualify as release blockers17:36
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russellbnone of these really seem to be, but happy to evaluate if you think something qualifies17:37
garykok, understood, the reason we added them to the rc1 list is that we feel they are release blockers17:37
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garykfor example if there is an exception in the driver we may be unable to trouble shoot as an invalid stack is logged17:37
russellbthey're not things that block everyone, are they?17:37
tjonesfor example - one is a grizzly regression17:37
garykthey block everyone using the vmware drivers17:37
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russellbyou have an interesting definition of block, then17:38
garykcan you please clarify17:38
garykmy take is that if the service crashes for some reason or another then that is a blocking issue17:38
russellbat this point, block needs to be something that can't be worked around, and affects major functionality17:38
russellbwould you like to go 1 by 1?17:38
garyki think that there are 2 serious bugs:17:39
russellbok on that one, is this a configuration error basically?17:39
russellbhow do you hit the problem?17:39
garykthis may result in a case where there is no network connectvity with the vm17:39
garykthe problem happens when the esx host does not have a matching opaque network.17:40
russellbso, a setup error?17:40
garykit can happen after a reboot of the host17:40
garykif a new host is added to a cluster then vm's deployed on that host may not have network connectivty17:41
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russellbwhat causes it to happen?17:41
garykif the host goes into maintenace mode and then say is rebooted (power outage for example)17:42
garykit is kind of like the ovs having no rules that match traffic17:42
garykmy bad is that i did not convey this information on the bug (was away on vacation…)17:43
garykbut that is not an axscuse17:44
russellbto be honest, i still don't understand what you're saying17:44
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russellbcan you write up on the bug in more detail what the problem is, how it occurs, and make a point to demonstrate that it's a bug with no workaround?17:44
garyksure, i'll do that17:45
tjones#action gark: update with more detail17:45
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garykit is like someone reboots a host with libvirt and after the reboot that are unable to run traffic to any vms on that host17:45
tjonesirc:// garyk: update with more detail17:45
russellbgaryk: i get the end result, but not the steps that lead up to putting the host in that situation17:46
garykthe second issue is
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1228847 in nova "VMware: VimException: Exception in __deepcopy__ Method not found" [Medium,In progress]17:46
russellbi saw you saying that one helps debugging17:46
russellbbut it's not preventing functionality from working for users17:46
russellbso i don't consider that a blocker17:46
russellbkeep in mind that this far into the RC period, the bar has to be *really* high, or we'll never release17:47
garykthe previous bug is really high and this one can be defered17:47
garykdeferred (i think my spelling is a mess)17:47
russellbk, ping me when you have a more detailed writeup on the bug ready, and hopefully i'll see what you see then17:48
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garykok, thanks17:48
tjonesok one more - this is a reggression from grizzly17:49
tjones 17:49
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1193980 in nova "Cinder Volumes "unable to find iscsi target" for VMware instances" [High,Confirmed]17:49
russellbno patch?17:50
russellband it's tagged grizzly-backport-potential?17:50
russellbso does that mean it exists in grizzly as well?17:50
tjoneswe've been having some issues with bugs not showing they are in review.  sabari - can you comment on this one?17:50
russellbeven if it doesn't happen automatically, you should update it manually :-)17:51
tjonesum - if it's marked for grizzly i may have mixed it up with another :-D  i'll check on it17:51
tjonesanything else for russellb folks?  we are getting close to tiem17:52
russellblooks like the grizzly tag was added when the bug was filed17:52
garyka hug when i start to cry :)17:52
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russellbso, clarify if it's a regression from grizzly to havana17:52
tjonesok will do17:52
russellband update the bug with the review, and set to In Progress, if there's a patch up17:52
russellband ping me after those updates17:53
tjones#action follow up on
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1193980 in nova "Cinder Volumes "unable to find iscsi target" for VMware instances" [High,Confirmed]17:53
garykrussellb: thanks for the time. much appreciated17:53
russellbyep, sorry to be tough, just have to protect the release timeline17:53
tjonesrussellb: thanks! no worries - this is the *fun* part17:53
tjonesanything else folks?17:54
tjonesgoing once….17:54
tjonesthanks for attending!  see you next week17:55
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:55
openstackMeeting ended Wed Oct  2 17:55:11 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:55
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notmynameanyone here for the swift meeting?19:10
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notmynameyay lag19:11
notmynamesorry for the delay. I'm on a horrible verizon wifi connection right now19:11
openstacknotmyname: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee'19:11
notmyname#startmeeting swift19:11
openstackMeeting started Wed Oct  2 19:11:56 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:11
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'swift'19:12
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grapsushere for the meeting19:12
notmynameagain, sorry for the delay. seems that I'm having wifi problems19:12
portanteshall we postpone?19:12
pelusehere for the free beer19:12
notmynametopics we need to address this week include the status of the havana release (first)19:13
notmynameportante: I'd like to at least get a status update on the patches19:13
notmynamedid I see the memcache patch merge earlier today?19:13
portanteI think it is in the queue, pool one, right?19:13
notmynameya, the pool one19:14
portantein the zuul queue, behind like 20 other patches19:14
notmynamethe other one I'm curious about is the dropped connection one by torgomatic19:14
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notmynameportante: kk, so by tormorrow :-)19:15
claygtorgomatic: the fix he came up with didn't really cut the mustard - he's posted a comment on it so I think he's gunna try again19:15
notmynameportante: zaitcev: any progress on reviews for your respective refactorings?19:16
portantea few folks have reviewed them, but not much movement19:16
zaitcevnotmyname: Thanks for reviewing the trickies one for me, but I failed to drum up support.19:16
notmynamebah. sorry zaitcev19:17
notmynameany other outstanding patches that need to be addressed?19:17
grapsusI'm new to this project19:17
notmynamegrapsus: welcome!19:18
notmynamegrapsus: right now we're wrapping up the release for Swift's contribution to havana19:18
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grapsushave you finished designing the API between EC codecs and swift-ec ?19:18
portantenotmyname: I believe we need to at least address the ondisk changes19:18
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portanteclayg: have you considered that further?19:18
pelusegrapsus:  still WIP, do you have info on the Trello board where we discuss?19:19
notmynameportante: what do you mean by "Address"19:19
grapsuspeluse: yep I read it19:19
pelusegrapsus:  that's the latest status, still open fpor mods.  We plan to discuss at hackathon as well19:19
grapsusseems like this PyEClib isn't public19:19
notmynamesweepthelegjohnn: ^19:19
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: i'll give you access19:20
claygI've mostly been looking at
claygportante: can you confirm that's top the tree for now?19:20
claygoh sorry, I think there's two conversations going on19:20
grapsuspeluse: I work on EC with Adri2000 I believe he already spoke to you19:20
peluseclayg:  my bad, sorry19:20
Adri2000I spoke with notmyname actually. maybe finish the patches discussion and move on to EC afterwards?19:20
portanteclayg: I think I need to rebase, but not much difference from top-of-tree19:20
pelusegrapsus:  lets let the topic of existing patches finish first19:21
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grapsuspeluse: I have a very simple implementation of RS in pure python (~ 200 lines + tests), I wrote to be sure about the API19:21
grapsuspeluse: ok, sorry19:21
claygportante: ok, i'll keep on that one then19:22
* clayg is done19:22
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notmynameclayg: portante: thanks19:22
notmynamewhat else on the topic of patches for havana?19:23
portanteclayg: regarding ondisk changes that is based on19:23
creihtyeah it is still a bit back in the queue19:23
creihtsorry I'm late :)19:23
portantedon't we want to fix the ondisk changes so that hash_path is put back to utils?19:24
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notmynameportante: sounds reasonable, but I want to look at it again. clayg, you had thoughts on this, right?19:24
portanteclayg, notmyname: my concern is that we release havana with a code move we don't really want19:25
notmynameportante: right19:26
claygI think i had a different perspective on why you want an ondisk module, my initial thoughts made it pretty clean that things like hash_path and normalize_timestamp that are consumed by things that are NOT ondisk should not be in the ondisk module19:26
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portantemea culpa, after reviewing that change more thoroughly, I made a mistake moving hash_path, though I still believe normalieze_timestamp should be in ondisk19:26
clayganother way to look at is to mark everything that is currently imported/used by the current in tree implementation as "ondisk"19:26
claygbut I don't know when that stops... cause like readconf, half of utils...19:27
zaitcevI tried to talk Peter to give ondisk a rest for a moment and just focus on getting the API in. This of course means 1) replicators use old API (but GlusterFS not using replicators), 2) no .setup method. On the upside, we actually deliver what we promised. And it's not some crap code cooked-up in a hurry to meat a deadline, just the most useful part of it in.19:27
portantethat is why I believe hash_path should go back to utils where it is shared and has a unit tests to verify it does not change19:27
zaitcevIt's nicer with ondisk, no doubt.19:28
clayganyway I think it's ugly but I don't have the chutzpah to carry a big "change the import path of a function just 'cause" patch through - so I shouldn't be whining about it19:28
notmynameclayg: "it" == the normalize_timestamp location?19:29
portanteclayg: it seems we both arrived at a good case for hash_path NOT being in ondisk, so it seems worth it to put it back19:29
claygportante: maybe, it's not worth it to me, normailize_timestamp is the one where I acctually have code that sits outside of swift that got broke by the change19:29
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clayglike you can't talk directly to backend servers without importing from... ondisk!?19:30
claygi mean you could re-implement it19:30
portanteclayg: today that is true, because the backend servers rely on that for its ondisk format19:30
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zaitcevclayg: We didn't realize there was such code. I grepped through my out-of-tree stuffs, ghole grepped through his, surprisingly normalize_timestamp wasn't used anywhere.19:31
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gholtHeheh ghole19:31
portantewe'd have to change the backend code to use a different method and not share it19:31
gholtI've been called worse; wait, maybe I haven't.19:31
zaitcevouch, sorry19:31
dfgnot twice. by the same person that is19:31
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claygit's fine, I'm cool with it...19:31
claygI *really* not going to be able to carry a patch to relocate it thought - so I'm not going to whine about it19:32
gholtThe one use I found for normalize_timestamp turned out to be an unused import. So I was whining needlessly19:32
notmynameportante: clayg: it seems that it's being used for 2 different things. so maybe it shoudl be 2 different functions (and that might be a bad idea too)19:32
portanteI don't mind carrying that patch if folks want it19:32
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portantethis is the kind of small thing that we might regret not being satisfied with before the release19:33
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zaitcevYay I'm not alone with nick typos19:34
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notmynameI'd like to get to an EC status update. are we good with what needs to be done for havana patches?19:34
portantei'll propose the hash_path restoration and you guys can vote on it that way, is that fair?19:35
notmynamesounds good19:35
portanteone last thing19:35
portanteregarding the DiskFile API changes as a whole, would it make it easier to review if I also posted a unified combined patch set?19:36
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portanteRight now it is broken out into four19:36
* notmyname finds it useful to see the end result19:36
notmynamebut I can go either way19:36
peluseI would appreciate that - have not been active in that effort and the size/complexity for a newb is one of the resaons why19:36
zaitcevmaybe like only what you say, and then we can clone one, clone two, diff -urpN -X dontdiff one two19:37
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zaitcevor I am the last guy remaining in git age who does things like that19:37
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notmynameportante: I think you have the unified set (or can make it easitly). go ahead and put it up, perhaps marked as WIP19:38
portantek done19:38
notmynameportante: thanks19:39
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portante#action portante unified patch set?19:39
notmyname#action portante unified patch set19:39
notmynameok, EC status update19:39
notmynamepeluse: sweepthelegjohnn: grapsus19:39
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pelusepolicies:  freshly rebased and proxyu/container code is ready for review19:39
sweepthelegjohnnPyECLib is functional and has a bunch of tests19:39
peluseEC Lb API:  still being defined/discussed on Trello, plan to talk at hackathon more19:40
sweepthelegjohnnshrink-wrapping for v0.1 release19:40
notmynamesweepthelegjohnn: when are you opening it? (I thought you already had)19:40
pelusegrapsus:  if you have a lib it would be great if you can get in on the Trello discussion and make sure the current state meets your requirements and if not make some suggestions19:40
notmynamepeluse: grapsus +119:40
sweepthelegjohnni can, i not am giving out access until a few i's are dotted19:41
grapsuspeluse: yep I don't have access to my work computer, I can post my API and code tomorrow19:41
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: what do you have?19:41
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: reed-solomon or something else?19:41
grapsusRS EC lib in pure python, it's very compact (< 200 lines of python), slow, but it works19:41
grapsusI wrote to be sure about the API19:42
pelusecool, so I suspect between what sweepthelegjohnn has and what Intel is doing we should have a pretty well ironed out API by end of this month, Kevin?  (I can't keep typing that nick :))19:42
sweepthelegjohnnpeluse: yes.19:42
sweepthelegjohnnin fact, i think the api is good to go19:42
notmynamesounds great :-)19:42
sweepthelegjohnna few more things, if you guys don't mind19:42
Adri2000where can we find the state of the current proposed API? in PyECLib?19:42
peluseI think so too, but wnated to reserve that strong of a statement until after hackathon19:42
notmynamesweepthelegjohnn: go for it19:43
grapsusit's 100% test covered and the API is documented, I can post it, but we'd like to see your API too to see if we haven't forget anything19:43
sweepthelegjohnnso, i talked with jim plank this week and will apparently be adding our GF-Complete (really fast galois field stuff) to Jerasure 2.019:43
sweepthelegjohnni will inciorporate that into v1.0 of PyECLib19:43
sweepthelegjohnnwe think that integrating our GF work into Jerasure should be pretty easy19:44
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pelusewrt grapsus's question:  Kevin is the latest on Trello up to date with your last ocnversations with Tushar?  If not maybe you can post a "latest" just to level set19:44
gholtI'd really love for the multi-ring stuff to land on master. Is there a chance that could move there instead of the ec branch?19:44
sweepthelegjohnnpeluse: yeah, i made the updates to PyECLib19:45
pelusegholt:  man I would love that too!19:45
sweepthelegjohnnpeluse: the only comment was specifying word size in the init function19:45
torgomaticgholt: the plan is for multi-ring to get finished, then merge ec -> master, then do erasure-code stuff, then merge again19:45
gholtAh okay19:45
notmynamegholt: peluse: ya, let's figure out how that can happen (not right now while I have 7 second ping times)19:45
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peluseBTW:  the policy stuff (multi-ring) is in multiple patch sets, some of which aren't done yet19:46
torgomaticthere's still a few more commits, like what to do if two diff. replicas of a container have different policies *and* objects in them19:46
sweepthelegjohnnpeluse: so the init only takes (k, m, type)…  E.g., (12, 2, "rs_vand")19:46
notmynameI had hoped that the ec branch would help isolate some changes, but I think the jury is out on the effectiveness of it19:46
pelusethe one up there now (the big one) covers the basic plumbing in proxy and container.  there's still some obj module work and replicator work as well, not rnearly as big though19:46
torgomaticnotmyname: let's judge effectiveness when we merge back into master the first time19:46
notmynametorgomatic: sounds good19:46
gholtYessir, maybe a hackathon thing19:46
notmynamethat would be a perfect time :-)19:47
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: what is your bitbucket account name?19:47
peluseagree w/that!  (judge effectiveness later)19:47
grapsussweepthelegjohnn: grapsus19:47
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peluseNote however that I have been rebasing the policy patch each week after notmyname merges from master so its up to date19:47
grapsusI have another question about EC, it is about server-side chunking19:47
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: invite sent19:48
grapsuswhat's your plan for that ? let's say I send a 2 Go file, will you buffer it entirely before calling EC ?19:48
notmynamegrapsus: no. EC each chunk as its read off the wire19:49
Adri2000so chunking is done server side? this is not implemented yet, is it?19:49
dfgnotmyname: is there some list somewhere about subjects we want talked about a the hackathon? or do we figure it out when we get there?19:49
grapsussweepthelegjohnn: excellent, thank you ! I'm looking at the API, I will send mine tomorrow, but looks very similar19:49
zaitcevBTW, I they fixed fedora's openoffice so I was able toread the EC PPT preso, it explained a lot19:49
notmynamedfg: somewhat in person, but I'm also working on a list that I'll publish19:50
zaitcevI just wish you guys weren't such... well... Just export it ot PDF next time or something.19:50
dfgnotmyname: ok- cause I have one.19:50
sweepthelegjohnngrapsus: please run the tests in the README and let me know if everything works and the performance19:50
dfgzaitcev: what EC PPT preso?19:50
grapsusnotmyname: Adri2000: so where will be this server chunk size determined and how ?19:50
notmynamedfg: cool, make a wiki page on the openstack wiki. I'll use tat19:50
zaitcevwaaait a moment19:51
grapsussweepthelegjohnn: ok, I'll do, but if you're using 128 bit registers, perfs should be stellar compared to my POC with python ints19:51
notmynameok, moving on from low-level EC implementation details... :-)19:52
sweepthelegjohnneven without that, i can get ~1 GB/s in some cases19:52
notmynamewhat else do we need to discuss in here in the next 3 minutes?19:52
pelusethat went by fast19:52
portanteis the priority list of reviews still up to date?19:52
portanteis that working?19:52
notmynameportante: I believe it's up to date and works for me. I'd like other feedback too19:53
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notmynameI have another meeting in a few minutes and have to run. any last minute things?19:54
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peluseportante:  where is the priority list of reviews available at?19:55
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zaitcevI'm going to look at the timestamp comparison, since I screwed up the mempool so well19:55
notmynamepeluse: topic in the -swift channel19:55
pelusethanks guys!19:55
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portantewas the irc topic at one point19:55
torgomaticstill is19:55
portanteof #openstack-swift, that is19:56
notmynamethanks everyone for attending and participating today. we're out of time.19:56
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"19:56
openstackMeeting ended Wed Oct  2 19:56:31 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)19:56
openstackMinutes (text):
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Adri2000thanks. very interesting discussion about EC19:56
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glangehow far along is EC development?19:57
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dfgglange: everybody's gone19:58
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shardy#startmeeting heat20:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Oct  2 20:00:42 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is shardy. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.20:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)"20:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'heat'20:00
shardy#topic rollcall20:00
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shardyHi all, who's around?20:01
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shardyzaneb, jpeeler, therve, SpamapS?20:01
jpeelerhey i'm here20:01
MikeSpreitzerI'm here too20:02
shardyOk, let's get started, not much on the agenda today, maybe we can have a short meeting ;)20:02
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SpamapSshardy: sick today, barely here20:02
shardy#topic Review last week's actions20:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Review last week's actions (Meeting topic: heat)"20:02
shardyActually I don't think there were any:20:02
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shardy#topic RC1 status20:03
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shardySo, branching for RC1 is imminent:20:04
sdake_did asalkeld have a chance this morning to look at that last lingering issue?20:04
asalkeldI woke up 7 minutes ago20:04
sdake_morning :)20:04
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stevebakershardy: should we be reviewing that change?20:05
sdake_asalkeld there is sa template attached to that bug now20:05
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shardystevebaker: No, I just acked it since we're ready to branch, and it's a one line change bumping the version20:05
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shardySo master will be open for Icehouse after than lands20:06
shardyhowever it would be really great if we can focus some effort on testing the Havana branch (ie RC1) over the next few days20:06
shardyas we have ~2weeks to catch any remaining issues which may require an RC220:07
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asalkeldsdake_ what is the bug with the attachment?20:07
sdake_i dont have the bug # handy20:07
asalkeldok, no worries20:07
zanebI'm awake20:07
stevebakerso fixes land in master and get backported to the release branch?20:07
zanebsorry, y'all20:07
shardysdake_: So asalkeld fixed bug #1233882, but the Ref issues may or may not be an issue, we haven't yet confirmed20:08
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1233882 in heat "neutron resources don't have the "show" attribute as used in the example templates" [High,Fix committed]
shardyIf we need to, we'll fix them and do an RC220:08
sdake_sounds good20:08
shardyAny other comments or questions re the Havana release?20:09
shardyreally, please everyone do test it, as we're still finding pretty significant issues..20:09
asalkeldshardy, the f17 LB?20:09
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asalkeldI have a local f19 one20:10
asalkeldbut you wanted to go to f18?20:10
shardyasalkeld: Yeah, we should bump that to F18/1920:10
asalkeldI'll make a bug for that20:10
shardyasalkeld: I don't mind, anything that works and isn't EOL is OK with me20:10
shardylet's fix it in master after the branch and we can consider backporting20:10
shardyasalkeld: Can we reimplement the LB as a provider template now, ie during Icehouse?20:11
stevebakerhas anyone tried the neutron loadbalancer?20:11
shardyseems like we probably can20:11
asalkeldyea, I can give that a go20:11
shardyasalkeld: cool, would be great to get rid of all the hard-coded nested templates :)20:12
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uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1234375 in heat "the aws loadbalancer use Fedora 17 and needs to be upgraded to f18 or f19" [Undecided,New]20:13
shardyOk, well great work everyone on Havana, we delivered 42 blueprints and 251 bug fixes!20:14
sdake_lots of bug fixes20:14
asalkeldyeah, that's good20:14
shardythanks to all, looking forward to the next push for Icehouse20:14
zanebhow many bug creations? ;)20:14
shardyzaneb: ha, true..20:15
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asalkeldfeature dev == bug creation20:15
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shardyYeah, hence my plea for testing :)20:15
shardy#topic open discussion20:15
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asalkeldso when is the summit sessions closed?20:15
shardySo I think they need to be wrapped up in the next couple of weeks, by mid Octover20:16
shardyOctober even20:16
MikeSpreitzerthe ides of October20:16
radixok, sorry I got distracted for the body of the meeting20:16
shardyI've not approved any, as I expected we'd want some discussion (at next week's meeting), and the new PTL can approve them20:16
shardyI've actually got a couple to propose too, so if anyone else has, please add them before next week:20:17
sdake_the ui lets you join stuff together or break them apart as well20:17
shardysdake_: Cool, that will be useful20:18
sdake_new ptl can expect to spend 4-5 hours preparing those talks20:18
stevebakerI'll be a bit quiet this week (ear infection)20:18
radix13 proposed sessions so far20:18
shardy#info summit session agenda to be discussed at next week's meeting20:18
gokrokveDo you plan to have Software orchestration design meeting?20:18
shardy#action all to add remaining summit proposals20:18
stevebakergokrokve: yes20:18
shardygokrokve: yes, the software config BP related discussion definitely warrants a session20:19
gokrokveCan we start some discussions before summit?20:19
zanebstevebaker: will you be quiet, or will it just seem quiet to you?20:19
sdake_mailing list20:19
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shardygokrokve: Yes, of course, but I wanted to ensure we have the full list of proposals before we start prioritizing too much20:19
radixI want to call attention to the thread that therve started on the mailing list about autoscaling and load balancing. there's a workable solution being proposed but it needs some discussion20:19
asalkeldyou need to start a etherpad gokrokve20:19
stevebakergokrokve: yes, I'm hoping to write some design docs to kick off some pre summit discussion20:20
gokrokvestevebaker: That will be great.20:20
shardyasalkeld: +1, etherpads will help with the discussion re priorities too20:20
stevebakergokrokve: are you on Murano?20:20
shardyie details as some of the proposals are pretty sparse20:20
gokrokvestevebaker: Yes.20:21
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sdake_one thing that i would have found handy in previous summit years was a master list of etherpads in one etherpad eg summit2013novheat20:21
sdake_or something similar20:21
sdake_with links to each specific etherpad20:21
gokrokveWe see that we have some code which actually better fits to Heat orchestration agenda then to Murano.20:21
stevebakergokrokve: OK, at some point I'd like to understand why Windows software config needs a whole new API - or maybe I don't ;)20:22
zanebgokrokve: yes, that sounds really interesting and we definitely want to discuss that20:22
shardyzaneb: +120:22
gokrokvestevebaker: That is the whole point. It does not require specific API.20:22
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shardysdake_: Sounds like a good idea20:22
shardythat's the heat proposal list20:23
gokrokvestevebaker: So we want to pass this stuff to Heat instead of doing this by ourselves.20:23
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sdake_shardy non-ptls get "forbidden" on that link20:23
MikeSpreitzerthat URL gets me "Forbidden"20:23
sdake_website presents different urls for ptl vs nonptl20:23
stevebakergokrokve: I'm hoping that the software config proposal I'm putting together will fit well with Murano, even if you're writing your own non cloud-init agent20:23
radixyeah that's a real bummer20:23
shardyHmm, ok sorry, I'm not sure how to get a topic filtered link then20:23
asalkeldctrl-f "Heat"20:24
sdake_you have to link them one at a time from your ui20:24
sdake_pretty weak :)20:24
zanebseriously, only the PTLs can see a list20:24
zanebwhy are the openstack web devs so user-hostile?20:24
shardyI thought you'd all see the list, only without the review option20:24
zanebwhat did we do to them?20:24
gokrokvestevebaker: our agent is very simple it actually listens on rabbitMQ queue and receive scripts and commands to execute. It can be anything except cloud-init.20:24
randallburtzaneb:  you know what you did… ;)20:25
tspatzieryou can sort the list by project20:25
sdake_one suggestion is to make a master list with links to etherpads20:25
shardygokrokve: so are you using cloudbase-init, or did you replace it with your agent?20:25
asalkeldtspatzier, that's as good as it gets20:26
zanebrandallburt: I may have questioned their parentage once or twice, but only after they started pulling this stuff ;)20:26
gokrokveshardy: we use cloud-init to do initial first boot configuration. After that cloud-init does not work on Windows as it is executed only once ant first boot.20:26
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sdake_gokrokve you can use cfn-hup for that20:26
gokrokveshardy: So we have to use our own agent to execute commands after VM restart.20:26
stevebakergokrokve: if you really wanted to align with Heat you could poll for metadata changes instead of listening to rabbitmq20:26
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gokrokvesdake_: I think yes. We can use anything that can execute scripts.20:27
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shardyYeah, there seem to be significant areas of overlap - and an FAQ from users I've spoken to is Heat windows instance support20:27
shardy(which we currently don't have)20:27
sdake_well lets not invent yet another whole set of agents for a new project20:27
sdake_lets try to have one set of agents :)20:27
gokrokvesdake_: Totally agree.20:28
zanebI take it all back, go to and click on 'Topic' and it sorts the list20:28
sdake_agent overhead is hard on everyone - image builders etc20:28
gokrokvesdake_: We created windows agent as there were no one.20:28
stevebakergokrokve: so you should look at os-collect-config for fetching the metadata, then use that to trigger your own tool to do the configuration20:29
asalkeld end of meeting?20:29
gokrokveI have another BP to discuss.20:29
spenceratxany idea why heat doesn't show up in the Openstack-dev subscribe list?
gokrokveThis is for Climate.20:30
gokrokveWe have a team who now actively works on CLimate development. They want to integrate soem CLimate capabilities to Heat.20:31
gokrokveCan someone review this BP and related proposal on Wiki?20:31
zanebspenceratx: because nobody added it20:31
MikeSpreitzerSo Climate would be a separate service, making a reservation does not directly interact with any scheduler?20:31
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zanebspenceratx: but I don't have an answer to your follow-up question ;)20:31
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asalkeldgokrokve, sounds interesting20:32
spenceratxzaneb: touche20:32
radixhere's that thread I mentioned earlier. could use some input at some point :)
radixthanks :)20:33
gokrokveOur enginners who are working on CLimate are in UTC+3 timezone. It would be nice if we can chat in IRC or talk around 8-9am PDT20:33
shardygokrokve: We can review the BP, we're still getting Havana finished, so there are lots of Icehouse (or potential Icehouse) BP's which are unreviewed at this point20:33
MikeSpreitzerwhat would be the atomic operation?20:33
stevebakergokrokve: that blueprint is currently too high-level to act on, it really needs some climate people to break it down into some more specific feature blueprints20:34
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shardyYeah, looking at the wiki page I'm not even sure what it has to do with Heat at all20:34
shardyneeds much more detail20:34
MikeSpreitzerIf the atomic operation is reserving all the resources of a stack at once, I see a connection to Heat20:35
asalkeldshardy, well they could have a reservation resource20:35
sdakeshardy I think they want heat to tell climate about the reservations20:35
asalkeldand the other resources in the template ref' the reservation20:35
gokrokveMikeSpreitzer: atomic means that you will reserve the whole bunch of resources (IP, VM, floating IP, volume) as a one object. At least this is my understanding.20:35
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randallburtI read it as Climate (Reserve this stack) -> Heat -> Climate (Reserve these individual resources)20:36
shardyOk, well lets say that in the BP rather then "Heat stacks Reservation support for the OpenStack Reservation service"20:36
tspatzierSo something like 'heat stack-reserve' that guarantees that a later 'heat stack-create' will succeed since you got sufficient resources?20:36
sdakei dont think you need a new api call20:37
gokrokveHere is more details:
sdakeyou can just stack-create and it will reserve and create atomically vs what is done now20:37
shardygokrokve: Yeah, I'm saying that page needs more specifics, what does Heat need, new Resource implementation, API integration with existing services, new API actions, or ..?20:38
radixsdake: yeah, agreed20:38
zanebsdake: reservations can be created well in advance of creating the stack20:38
tspatziersdake, yeah, that's another way to look at it.20:38
gokrokveshardy: Ok. Makes sense.20:38
MikeSpreitzerIf a reservation is created well in advance, what happens to the physical capacity in the meantime?20:38
sdakethese sound like questions for gokrokve to answer zaneb, radix, tspatzier :)20:38
gokrokveWhat will be the best to discuss the details? openstack-dev ?20:39
zanebgokrokve: +120:39
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stevebakergokrokve: Are climate peeps coming to Hong Kong?20:39
gokrokvestevebaker: Yes.20:39
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shardyOk, shall we wrap up the meeting and continue this on the ML?20:40
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gokrokveshardy: Yes. We will proceed with the discussion in ML for both Murano and Climate.20:41
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shardyOk then, lets do that, thanks all!20:41
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openstackMeeting ended Wed Oct  2 20:41:23 2013 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)20:41
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