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| SridharG | Hello everyone.. | 14:02 |
|---|---|---|
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| SridharG | do we have the Neutron IPV6 subteam meeting now? | 14:02 |
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| sc68cal | Yuyp | 14:02 |
| xuhanp | hello | 14:02 |
| sc68cal | #startmeeting neutron_ipv6 | 14:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 14:02:31 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sc68cal. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)" | 14:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_ipv6' | 14:02 |
| baoli | hi | 14:02 |
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| sc68cal | So - we have some good news | 14:03 |
| sc68cal | the subnet attributes patch was merged yesterday | 14:03 |
| shshang | What's it? | 14:03 |
| shshang | Oh, cool! | 14:03 |
| sc68cal | and part of dzyu's patch for EUI64 addresses | 14:03 |
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| shshang | That's excellent! Congrats, sc68cal! | 14:03 |
| sc68cal | we had to split it though | 14:03 |
| sc68cal | so we added the utility library | 14:03 |
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| sc68cal | but we did not patch db_base_plugin_v2 | 14:04 |
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| sc68cal | Here's the bad news | 14:04 |
| sc68cal | shshang's patch did not land | 14:04 |
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| sc68cal | there are concerns about networks with multiple v6 subnets | 14:04 |
| shshang | that's fine. :) | 14:04 |
| sc68cal | Basically if you have 2 v6 subnets with slaac | 14:05 |
| shshang | that's means, I can take my time and no need to rush now | 14:05 |
| sc68cal | no idea which prefix is going to be used | 14:05 |
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| sc68cal | Now the good news is that since the attributes patch landed - no more rebasing to chase the HEAD alembic script | 14:06 |
| shshang | Yup, that is true. :D | 14:06 |
| baoli | well, I patched in the change, and tried it myself. the VM will get both prefixes. | 14:06 |
| sc68cal | which was like 90% of the churn | 14:06 |
| SridharG | sc68cal: Did the client (python-neutronclient) side changes also got merged? | 14:06 |
| xuhanp | not yet | 14:06 |
| sc68cal | SridharG: good question | 14:06 |
| xuhanp | I got one -1 about unit test | 14:07 |
| xuhanp | I just restored it today | 14:07 |
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| sc68cal | The other possible piece is that for Icehouse | 14:07 |
| sc68cal | we may patch it so that the v6 attributes are not returned to API requests | 14:07 |
| sc68cal | since there is nothing behind the API - since the dnsmasq changes did not land | 14:08 |
| sc68cal | but once J opens - they'll undo the disable | 14:08 |
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| sc68cal | so we'd be able to continue our work | 14:08 |
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| sc68cal | Otherwise - I think we did a great job given the circumstances | 14:09 |
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| sc68cal | Everyone - pat yourselves on the back | 14:09 |
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| xuhanp | sc68cal, do we still have time for my security group patch to get merged? | 14:10 |
| sc68cal | xuhanp: since that is a bug - it is possible | 14:10 |
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| xuhanp | I have one small problem with the unit test due to recent code change. | 14:10 |
| xuhanp | sc68cal, good to know | 14:10 |
| sc68cal | #topic blueprints | 14:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)" | 14:12 | |
| sc68cal | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron?searchtext=ipv6 Ipv6 Blueprints | 14:12 |
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| sc68cal | Since we're moving towards RCs - make sure you've got your BPs all set | 14:13 |
| sc68cal | baoli: did we ever register a bp for prefix delegation? | 14:14 |
| baoli | sc68cal, I did | 14:14 |
| sc68cal | oh there it is | 14:14 |
| sc68cal | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/neutron/+spec/ipv6-prefix-delegation Prefix Delegation | 14:14 |
| sc68cal | perfect | 14:14 |
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| sc68cal | if there isn't anything else, we'll continue on | 14:15 |
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| sc68cal | #topic bugs | 14:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)" | 14:15 | |
| sc68cal | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bugs?field.tag=ipv6 IPv6 tagged bugs | 14:16 |
| shshang | so if I understand you correctly, we won't be able to make the change to the code until Juno, is that correct? | 14:16 |
| absubram | sc68cal: Sean - congrats on getting the neutron side of the new IPv6 attributes getting merged last night | 14:16 |
| sc68cal | shshang: Yes - so usually that's the week after the summit | 14:16 |
| absubram | unfortunately in the Horizon community, we decided to move the Horizon BP out to Juno | 14:16 |
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| shshang | OK, good to know. Thank you | 14:17 |
| absubram | it should go in very early in J hopefully | 14:17 |
| sc68cal | absubram: that's fine - since the attributes don't do anything currently | 14:17 |
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| sc68cal | Any other bugs to discuss? | 14:17 |
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| sc68cal | #topic reviews | 14:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "reviews (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)" | 14:18 | |
| sc68cal | So - I don't know if there is anything to report besides what we spoke about in the beginning | 14:19 |
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| sc68cal | otherwise I'll turn us over to open discussion | 14:19 |
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| xuhanp | sc68cal, I hope more people can help review my security group bug patch if that's possible :-) | 14:19 |
| xuhanp | I kind of changed the design from the beginning | 14:20 |
| sc68cal | careful what you wish for :) | 14:20 |
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| xuhanp | :-) | 14:20 |
| sc68cal | But yes - we should review it since there's a chance of it getting merged for icehouse | 14:21 |
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| sc68cal | anything else before we go to open discussion> | 14:21 |
| shshang | Other than that, we can celebrate, right? :) | 14:21 |
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| sc68cal | I got my celebrating in yesterday - st. patrick's day and getting ipv6 stuff merged | 14:22 |
| sc68cal | :) | 14:22 |
| shshang | Go GREEN! :D | 14:23 |
| sc68cal | But yes - everyone should be proud of the work we've done | 14:23 |
| sc68cal | We built a team and made Ipv6 a priority for Neutron | 14:23 |
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| sc68cal | we put it on the map, and it's only going to get better from here | 14:24 |
| shshang | Yup | 14:24 |
| xuhanp | sc68cal, good to have you as the lead! | 14:24 |
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| sc68cal | Haha - well I don't think of it quite that way - I just start the meetings and end them | 14:24 |
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| sc68cal | We had some great work that was floating around in private forks and we just pulled them out into the public | 14:25 |
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| sc68cal | #topic open discussion | 14:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)" | 14:25 | |
| SridharG | sc68cal: can you please share the link for the security group bug patch. | 14:25 |
| sc68cal | SridharG: sure. | 14:26 |
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| sc68cal | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/72252/ | 14:26 |
| SridharG | sc68cal: thanks | 14:26 |
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| sc68cal | xuhanp: One thing that comes to mind | 14:27 |
| sc68cal | your TODO about finding the GUA for a router - if it's put in the subnet's gateway field | 14:27 |
| sc68cal | baoli: is GUA for a gateway unusual? | 14:28 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, not sure. | 14:28 |
| xuhanp | sc68cal, you mean my TODO in my patch? | 14:28 |
| sc68cal | I know we've probably talked about this a couple times - where we were thinking if the admin sets it that way- we just trust that they know what they're doing | 14:28 |
| sc68cal | xuhanp: yes | 14:28 |
| baoli | sc68cal, I think that we are talking about LLA here. | 14:29 |
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| sc68cal | the TODO on line 274 of xuhanp 's patch | 14:30 |
| xuhanp | with my security group patch. Only LLA can be used when ra mode is off | 14:30 |
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| xuhanp | I think this is sc68cal is talking about? | 14:31 |
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| sc68cal | I think so | 14:31 |
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| sc68cal | but for Comcast - we'd be setting a gateway IP that is a LLA | 14:31 |
| sc68cal | since it'd be a physical device that we know up front | 14:32 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, that is https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76125/ | 14:32 |
| sc68cal | right - for routers that neutron creates | 14:33 |
| baoli | In that case, we should check if a qr-xxx port is created by neutron when the subnet is added into a router | 14:33 |
| baoli | It doesn't seem to make sense to create a neutron port in that case. | 14:34 |
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| xuhanp | baoli, you are saying we should not allow this subnet be attached to a router? | 14:35 |
| shshang | I am confused about which use case you guys refer to.... | 14:35 |
| shshang | baoli, would u plz elaborate? | 14:35 |
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| sc68cal | if i'm not mistaken | 14:35 |
| baoli | xuhanp, it's a provider net, right? | 14:35 |
| xuhanp | yes | 14:35 |
| sc68cal | 76125 allows you to create a subnet with a LLA address | 14:35 |
| sc68cal | then when you create a router for that subnet, it uses that LLA address | 14:36 |
| sc68cal | *attach a router that you've created | 14:36 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, I think my qeustion is if it's a provider net, and ra is done externally, why would you need a neutron router | 14:36 |
| sc68cal | baoli: I don't think 76125 was meant to address that | 14:36 |
| sc68cal | remember this patch was in response to the -1 that you did for another review | 14:37 |
| sc68cal | where you created a v6 subnet | 14:37 |
| sc68cal | then created a router | 14:37 |
| sc68cal | with a pre-defined gateway IP that was an LLA address | 14:37 |
| sc68cal | and when Neutron tried to set the router's IP to that LLA address that was stored in the subnet's gateway attribute - it blew up | 14:37 |
| sc68cal | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/72252/2/neutron/db/securitygroups_rpc_base.py | 14:38 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, I agree. So you are saying that this subnet with LLA gateway IP still needs to be added in a router? | 14:38 |
| sc68cal | line 264 | 14:38 |
| baoli | sc68cal, I'm not questioning about the change. | 14:39 |
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| sc68cal | I think all we're trying to fix was this error | 14:39 |
| sc68cal | 400-{u'NeutronError': {u'message': u'Invalid input for operation: IP address fe80::2001:1 is not a valid IP for the defined subnet.', u'type': u'InvalidInput', u'detail': u''}} | 14:39 |
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| sc68cal | which happened when you did openstack@devstack-16:~/devstack$ neutron router-interface-add 7cf084b4-fafd-4da2-9b15-0d25a3e27e67 myipv6sub | 14:40 |
| sc68cal | but I could be mistaken | 14:40 |
| xuhanp | sc68cal, I think baoli's question is do we ever need to do that. | 14:40 |
| baoli | xuhanp, yes, that's my question with provider net | 14:41 |
| xuhanp | to attach a provider network to the router | 14:41 |
| shshang | if it is provider network, then neutron doesn't need to deal with qr- interface any more, right? | 14:41 |
| xuhanp | baoli, I don't think neutron limit that provider network should not be attached to a router. | 14:41 |
| sc68cal | I don't think this error was related to a provider network and external gateway | 14:41 |
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| shshang | so what sc68cal described is not applicable for provider network | 14:41 |
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| sc68cal | this was an error encountered when you were making a neutron router with a predefined gateway | 14:42 |
| sc68cal | that was an LLA | 14:42 |
| shshang | Yup | 14:42 |
| sc68cal | Neutron would try and set the router's IP to an LLA address and the whole thing would blow up | 14:42 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, yes. Now that the error is fiexed: a user can create a predefined gateway that's not on the subnet, would it make sense to add that subnet into the router any more? | 14:43 |
| sc68cal | I don't think it is fixed | 14:43 |
| xuhanp | it was supported | 14:43 |
| xuhanp | before | 14:43 |
| xuhanp | someone wants to change it but Anthoy stopped that. | 14:44 |
| xuhanp | If I remember correctly | 14:44 |
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| baoli | yes, I knew that it was allowed, then the restriction (gateway on the same subnet) was added later | 14:46 |
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| xuhanp | baoli, yep. with a configuration flag | 14:48 |
| shshang | boali, yes, in ipv6 subnet case, it still makes sense to add that subnet to the router | 14:48 |
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| baoli | shshang, can you explain? | 14:49 |
| shshang | I think the use case you mentioned is valid, only for IPv6 | 14:49 |
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| shshang | "a user can create a predefined gateway that's not on the subnet, would it make sense to add that subnet into the router any more?" | 14:49 |
| sc68cal | I believe that's the only way that subnet would be able to get traffic out | 14:49 |
| sc68cal | if the gateway IP is an LLA address | 14:50 |
| shshang | yes | 14:50 |
| sc68cal | otherwise the router attach step fails and the subnet has no gateway | 14:50 |
| shshang | I remember in IPv6, you can add the GUA as default gateway, and you can also add LLA as default gateway | 14:50 |
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| shshang | The latter case is the scenario baoli wants to address, right? | 14:50 |
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| shshang | the former case will pass the check, but the latter case will blow up, because the checkpoint think it is not in the same subnet | 14:51 |
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| shshang | Is my understanding correct, baoli? | 14:51 |
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| baoli | shshang, if you create a subnet with a LLA gateway, and then add it to a router. | 14:51 |
| baoli | you would end up having two LLAs on the qr-xxx port | 14:52 |
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| sc68cal | are we sure of that | 14:52 |
| shshang | one is predefined, one is auto-calculated, right? | 14:52 |
| baoli | shshange, right | 14:52 |
| sc68cal | currently it just blows up - no router is created | 14:53 |
| sc68cal | so there are no qr-xxx ports | 14:53 |
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| baoli | Plus, it's against the routing principle to allow a gateway not on the same subnet to forward the subnet's traffic. | 14:53 |
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| baoli | That's why my question about adding such a subnet into a router. | 14:53 |
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| sc68cal | but LLAs are not on the same subnet | 14:54 |
| sc68cal | in the way Neutron thinks of things being on the same subnet | 14:54 |
| sc68cal | am I following this correctly? please let me know if I am mistaken | 14:55 |
| baoli | sc68cal, if a gateway with the LLA is external, then it shouldn't be added into a router with the same LLA. But as you said, it's up to the admin to do the right thing. In that case, it would be fine | 14:55 |
| shshang | baoli, now I see your point...I am not sure about whether it is legal to have more than 1 LLA. Let me double check | 14:55 |
| sc68cal | baoli: The gateway is not external | 14:55 |
| baoli | shshang, it's legal | 14:56 |
| sc68cal | This is for a subnet that you create - with a predefined LLA address, that you then create a router in neutron | 14:56 |
| sc68cal | that will use that LLA address that was set as the subnet's gateway | 14:56 |
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| sc68cal | which currently fails | 14:56 |
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| sc68cal | this has nothing to do with an external gateway that is a physical device | 14:56 |
| sc68cal | am I correct? | 14:56 |
| sc68cal | ok - we need to take this to the mailing list | 14:57 |
| sc68cal | we've probably discussed this a couple times and not gotten anywhere - so I will start a thread on the ML | 14:57 |
| shshang | baoli, according to Cisco doc, multiple IPv6 link-local addresses on an interface are not supported | 14:57 |
| baoli | sc68cal, if that's the case, the change (or fix), I think, will be different. | 14:57 |
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| baoli | shshang, cisco is not supporting it | 14:57 |
| shshang | yup | 14:58 |
| baoli | but others do | 14:58 |
| baoli | it doesn't seem to be useful with multiple LLAs | 14:58 |
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| sc68cal | baoli: I don't agree - I think xuhanp's change fixes | 14:58 |
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| sc68cal | ok - I'll post on the ML | 14:59 |
| sc68cal | thanks everyone | 14:59 |
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| baoli | sc68cal, we can discuss on the ML | 14:59 |
| baoli | thanks | 14:59 |
| sc68cal | #endmeeting | 14:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 14:59:37 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-03-18-14.02.html | 14:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-03-18-14.02.txt | 14:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-03-18-14.02.log.html | 14:59 |
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| bauzas | #startmeeting gantt | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 15:00:03 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is bauzas. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: gantt)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'gantt' | 15:00 |
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| bauzas | hi all, someone here to discuss about scheduler ? | 15:00 |
| mspreitz | o/ | 15:00 |
| PaulMurray | hi | 15:00 |
| bauzas | hi | 15:00 |
| bauzas | let's wait a few minutes | 15:01 |
| lcostantino | hi | 15:01 |
| bauzas | is boris-42 there ? | 15:01 |
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| bauzas | the first topic is about discussing no-db scheduler blueprint | 15:01 |
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| bauzas | but we can move forward and go to the 2nd topic | 15:02 |
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| bauzas | #topic scheduler forklift | 15:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "scheduler forklift (Meeting topic: gantt)" | 15:02 | |
| bauzas | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/icehouse-external-scheduler | 15:03 |
| * johnthetubaguy waves, but is a bit distracted | 15:03 | |
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| bauzas | so, there are 2 blueprints for the forklift | 15:03 |
| bauzas | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/remove-cast-to-schedule-run-instance | 15:04 |
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| bauzas | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/scheduler-lib | 15:04 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yeah, just looking at the draft change there | 15:04 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: thanks | 15:04 |
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| bauzas | maybe could you please put me owner of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/scheduler-lib ? | 15:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | doesn't seem quite right yet, but I see the idea | 15:04 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's the goal of FF | 15:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: what is your lp nic? | 15:05 |
| bauzas | :) | 15:05 |
| bauzas | sylvain-bauza | 15:05 |
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| johnthetubaguy | you are going to need a better spec for this I think, would be good to rough that out | 15:05 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: I'm taking FF as an opportunity for drafting the patch | 15:05 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: we can open a distinct etherpad or create a wiki page | 15:06 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: both are fine with me | 15:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | sure, wiki could work | 15:06 |
| bauzas | ok, taking action to create it | 15:07 |
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| johnthetubaguy | Need to be clearer about the split | 15:07 |
| bauzas | #action bauzas Create a wiki page for spec'ing bp scheduler-lib | 15:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | nova db stuff stays in nova db | 15:07 |
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| johnthetubaguy | think about the information flow | 15:07 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: ComputeNode shall be thought to be stored in Gantt | 15:08 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: especially if we consider moving to memcached | 15:08 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: for storing host states | 15:08 |
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| bauzas | anyone left wanting to see the draft ? | 15:09 |
| bauzas | #link https://review.openstack.org/80113 | 15:09 |
| mspreitz | yes, I would like to see it | 15:10 |
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| bauzas | ok, will add you as reviewer | 15:10 |
| mspreitz | thanks | 15:10 |
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| bauzas | mspreitz: doen | 15:10 |
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| bauzas | done | 15:10 |
| PaulMurray | bauzas I would like to look | 15:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: I think you are hooking up too high | 15:11 |
| PaulMurray | please | 15:11 |
| bauzas | PaulMurray: done | 15:11 |
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| PaulMurray | thx | 15:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | nova service status will stay in nova after the split I feel | 15:11 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: oh, seems there was a confusion | 15:11 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: service status should stay in Nova, right | 15:11 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: computenode status should move to Gantt | 15:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | yep, scheduler probably has to have its own copy of that state | 15:12 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: ok, seeing my mistake | 15:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | self.conductor_api.compute_node_update | 15:12 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that one should be replaced by a call to memcached (at the end of the story of course) | 15:12 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: see the discussion around no-db-scheduler | 15:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | I don't agree with that, but it doesn't really matter right now | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | its certainly a valid option | 15:13 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: yey, let's discuss this at the summit | 15:13 |
| bauzas | that's not that important for now | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | agreed | 15:13 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so if scheduler lib is just: | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | nductor_api.compute_node_update | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | conductor_api.compute_node_update | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | and the select_destination | 15:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | would that work? | 15:14 |
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| johnthetubaguy | so scheduler right now just sends it to the conductor today, later it sends it to the scheduler | 15:14 |
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| johnthetubaguy | then thats about it I think…? | 15:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | nice simple client | 15:14 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: I was thinking to replace _sync_compute_node() | 15:15 |
| bauzas | of the RT | 15:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, thats way too big I feel | 15:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | its really just compute node plus a dict sent to the scheduler right? | 15:15 |
| PaulMurray | bauzas conductor_api.compute_node_update is going away because of objects, but | 15:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | we need to agree the format mind | 15:15 |
| PaulMurray | there will be somethings imilar that can be done | 15:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | PaulMurray: agreed, its just that operation | 15:15 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: PaulMurray: ok, let's discuss this on the wikipagfez | 15:15 |
| bauzas | wikipage | 15:15 |
| PaulMurray | ok | 15:16 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: I see your idea | 15:16 |
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| johnthetubaguy | basically client should be a single line seam in nova | 15:16 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: should we consider that ComputeNode should stay in Nova ? | 15:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think you got select_destinations spot on | 15:16 |
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| bauzas | yey, that's the issue with RT | 15:17 |
| bauzas | because select_destinations() is already decoupled | 15:17 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yeah, ComputeNode will stay in nova, I think you need to call nova method, and scheduler call at the moment, but not totally sure about it, I think I see your idea more now | 15:17 |
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| bauzas | but RT is having tight dependency with the schedulret | 15:17 |
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| johnthetubaguy | well it could all go into oslo, but yes, need to deal with these things | 15:18 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: ok, let's all of us take a few amout of time discussing about the split itself | 15:18 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: and see what we must do step-by-step | 15:18 |
| bauzas | s/must/shall (better :) ) | 15:18 |
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| bauzas | PaulMurray: I still have to review https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/make-resource-tracker-use-objects | 15:19 |
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| bauzas | ok, I'm done with this topic | 15:20 |
| bauzas | anyone else has to add something ? | 15:20 |
| PaulMurray | justa thought | 15:20 |
| bauzas | sure | 15:20 |
| PaulMurray | there is some code that is on scheduler and compute node side | 15:20 |
| PaulMurray | to do with claims | 15:20 |
| PaulMurray | on compute node and | 15:21 |
| PaulMurray | consuming from host state on scheduler | 15:21 |
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| digambar | Hi | 15:21 |
| digambar | https://review.openstack.org/80113 | 15:21 |
| PaulMurray | would be good to think if that needs to be the way | 15:21 |
| digambar | this url is not opening up | 15:21 |
| bauzas | claims are only located on resourcetracker, right? | 15:21 |
| PaulMurray | right | 15:21 |
| PaulMurray | but the effect of a claim is | 15:21 |
| PaulMurray | repeated in host state | 15:21 |
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| PaulMurray | on sheduler | 15:21 |
| bauzas | digambar: please give me your Gerrit username so I could add you as reviewer | 15:22 |
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| PaulMurray | its just something to think about | 15:22 |
| bauzas | PaulMurray: see your point, and already thought about it | 15:22 |
| bauzas | PaulMurray: the idea is that RT objects should place a call to scheduler-lib for updating states | 15:22 |
| johnthetubaguy | PaulMurray: yeah, its getting the write slice, I am think duplicate state for the first cut, but not sure | 15:22 |
| digambar | ok | 15:22 |
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| bauzas | either in claims or thru the update_available_resources() method | 15:23 |
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| digambar | username-digambar | 15:23 |
| digambar | email-digambarpatil15@yahoo.co.in | 15:23 |
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| PaulMurray | bauzas one of the problems | 15:23 |
| PaulMurray | I had to deal with in extensible rRT | 15:23 |
| bauzas | digambar: I already added you, please check that you are logged in | 15:23 |
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| digambar | ok | 15:23 |
| PaulMurray | is that a new resource has to be implemented at compute node and scheduler | 15:23 |
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| bauzas | PaulMurray: I see your problem | 15:24 |
| PaulMurray | so to allow split I did a plugin for both, but could have been one plugin | 15:24 |
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| PaulMurray | shared | 15:24 |
| PaulMurray | It may be a limitation to live with, but there might be another way to factor the code long term | 15:24 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's one of the reason IMHO I think ComputeNode should get rid of Nova and be stored only in Gantt | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | PaulMurray: object shoud be a good plugin point… good point | 15:24 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: yeah, ComputeNode probably should go, but service stays, my bad | 15:25 |
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| bauzas | ok, let's write the rationale and see how it integrates with extensible RT | 15:25 |
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| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: a new resource tracker that is gnatt specific could be the other way, but that seems too broad | 15:25 |
| bauzas | +1 | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | PaulMurray: does the object work make this clearer? | 15:26 |
| bauzas | hence the hook on RT.update_available_resource() | 15:26 |
| PaulMurray | Not really | 15:26 |
| bauzas | RT should stay in Nova | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm, just thinking, could compute node be like instance and cells and report to scheduler vs nova | 15:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah RT will be in Nova | 15:27 |
| digambar | how to configure https://github.com/openstack/gantt repo to openstack | 15:27 |
| digambar | for replacing existing scheduler to use this new one ? | 15:27 |
| bauzas | digambar: gantt is currently not ready to be integrated | 15:27 |
| digambar | okay | 15:28 |
| digambar | then we have to test it off way | 15:28 |
| digambar | ? | 15:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: I think I like what you have done now, thinking about this more... | 15:28 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: provided I find some way to request nova service either way | 15:28 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: that's a big showstopper | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: don't understand you | 15:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: the blocker for me is removing the old code from resource tracker.py | 15:29 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: the service table will stay in Nova | 15:30 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: yeah, service table will be in Nova, gnatt will need its own copy of that | 15:30 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: so that the call to _get_service() requires an external call | 15:30 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: a copy or an API call ? | 15:30 |
| bauzas | :) | 15:30 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: I don't like much caching objects :) | 15:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: I think its getting the correct data split | 15:31 |
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| johnthetubaguy | gnatt should have its own view of what services it knows about | 15:31 |
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| johnthetubaguy | nova-computes and nova-volumes | 15:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | Nova needs to maintain its own list | 15:31 |
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| johnthetubaguy | and we need to plug in correctly | 15:31 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: well, that means that creating a Nova service must end up to create it as well on Gantt | 15:32 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: why can't we consider that Gantt is discovering services using a REST call ? | 15:32 |
| bauzas | thanks to python-novaclient | 15:32 |
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| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: not sure I understand what you are trying to say, but I think we are agreeing, just prehaps not on the implementation | 15:33 |
| bauzas | agreed | 15:33 |
| bauzas | taking the point | 15:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | there are two things | 15:33 |
| bauzas | yet | 15:33 |
| bauzas | yey | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | is the service alive, just like nova-network or whatever | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | what stats does the service have | 15:34 |
| bauzas | +1 | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | for the compute node | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | we need the first in nova | 15:34 |
| bauzas | exactly | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | the second goes in gnatt | 15:34 |
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| bauzas | +1 | 15:34 |
| PaulMurray | good | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK, so I think we agree | 15:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | my plan for this is thus…. | 15:35 |
| bauzas | but the question is : how gantt can discover nova data ? | 15:35 |
| bauzas | for services | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | make nova-scheduler not make any DB calls, except for the above compute node stats | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | make no other service access the compute node stats | 15:35 |
| bauzas | that's right | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | using coding similar to how nova-compute is unable to directly contact the db | 15:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | then we can start to prove the split inside the Nova tree | 15:36 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I think thats the goal here | 15:36 |
| bauzas | #agreed make nova-scheduler not make any DB calls, except for the above compute node stats | 15:36 |
| bauzas | #agreed make no other service access the compute node stats | 15:36 |
| PaulMurray | +1 | 15:36 |
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| bauzas | ok, let's move on and discuss about the implementation on the wiki page | 15:36 |
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| bauzas | any other things to mention on that topic ? | 15:36 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I think we can do this in the code review now, but lets see how it goes | 15:37 |
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| bauzas | ok | 15:37 |
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| bauzas | #topic no-db-scheduler | 15:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "no-db-scheduler (Meeting topic: gantt)" | 15:37 | |
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| bauzas | I have nothing to say here, but maybe there is a discussion on -dev about a scalable scheduler that could make use of it | 15:38 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, have you got a link? | 15:38 |
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| bauzas | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/030084.html | 15:39 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oh right | 15:39 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: the problem is about instance groups and race condition happening | 15:39 |
| johnthetubaguy | yep, I responded to that saying I agree with Russells fix, not read the response to that | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | (yet) | 15:40 |
| bauzas | so I would be interested in knowing what's the status of no-db-scheduler bp | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | it got deferred for being too risky in Juno | 15:40 |
| bauzas | yey, of course | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | if its not optional I will −2 it because it requires a dependency | 15:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | new depedency^ | 15:40 |
| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: we just need to make sure if it can handle this issue | 15:41 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I like the general ideas as an option | 15:41 |
| bauzas | agreed | 15:41 |
| bauzas | there is one stackforge project about distributed locking, called tooz | 15:41 |
| bauzas | it would be nice to see if there are mutual concerns for this | 15:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | hmm, I don't mind that being later | 15:42 |
| bauzas | and I personnally do think | 15:42 |
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| johnthetubaguy | don't want too many dependencies, but also what to share code eventually | 15:42 |
| mspreitz | bauzas: what do you mean by mutual concerns for tooz? | 15:43 |
| bauzas | mspreitz: I mean that distributed locking mechanism is one of the goals for memcached scheduler states | 15:43 |
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| mspreitz | bauzas: you mean no-db-scheduler should use tooz? | 15:44 |
| bauzas | that could be one option yes | 15:44 |
| bauzas | and tooz could also add a backend memcached plugin | 15:45 |
| bauzas | in order to minimize the dependencies | 15:45 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yeah, thats something for after the current code merges | 15:45 |
| bauzas | of course :-) | 15:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | good good | 15:45 |
| PaulMurray | bauzas I have a question | 15:46 |
| bauzas | ok, thats'it for me on that topic | 15:46 |
| bauzas | PaulMurray: sure | 15:46 |
| PaulMurray | don't want to open it up too much | 15:46 |
| PaulMurray | but it seems that this dicussion is gonig towards a general | 15:46 |
| PaulMurray | configuration service | 15:46 |
| PaulMurray | you know, like zoo keeper | 15:47 |
| PaulMurray | I can see why | 15:47 |
| PaulMurray | do you see the scheduler | 15:47 |
| bauzas | tooz is based on zk :-) | 15:47 |
| PaulMurray | taking that role or do you think something else should | 15:47 |
| bauzas | that's the current default driver | 15:47 |
| PaulMurray | and scheduler should use that service | 15:47 |
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| bauzas | PaulMurray: that's too early for answering it :) | 15:47 |
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| PaulMurray | but thanks anyway - didn't know about tooz | 15:48 |
| bauzas | for Juno, we should just make sure the paths won't diverge too much | 15:48 |
| bauzas | but that could be an opportunity for a later cycle | 15:48 |
| bauzas | IMHO | 15:48 |
| PaulMurray | BTW I hate zookeeper | 15:48 |
| bauzas | hence the plugin mechanism :d | 15:48 |
| bauzas | write your own ;) | 15:48 |
| PaulMurray | :) | 15:48 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, that an interesting one | 15:49 |
| bauzas | I agree that now we should focus on memcached scheduler | 15:49 |
| bauzas | but just make sure that the interfaces are flexible enough for accepting a new backend | 15:49 |
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| johnthetubaguy | erm, well I think we need to focus on the split, which gives the memcached scheduler a good plugging in point | 15:50 |
| bauzas | the few I read about the reviews make me think it's the case | 15:50 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: yey, both efforts are separated | 15:50 |
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| bauzas | johnthetubaguy: but both can profit | 15:50 |
| bauzas | anyway | 15:50 |
| bauzas | let's discuss this at the summit | 15:50 |
| bauzas | and that leads me to the next topic | 15:51 |
| johnthetubaguy | bauzas: not so sure anymore, I have a feeling the no-db-scheduler needs the split to plugin in an optional way | 15:51 |
| johnthetubaguy | sure, do continue... | 15:51 |
| bauzas | #topic open discussion | 15:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: gantt)" | 15:51 | |
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| bauzas | a quick FYI : http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/80 | 15:51 |
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| bauzas | at the moment, I don't have a need for another discussion | 15:52 |
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| johnthetubaguy | do you want to cover no-db-scheduler? | 15:52 |
| bauzas | I'm not the owner | 15:52 |
| bauzas | I will send an email to boris-42 | 15:53 |
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| johnthetubaguy | sounds good | 15:53 |
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| bauzas | and see if he plans to promote it | 15:53 |
| bauzas | that's it for me | 15:53 |
| bauzas | we're having 5 mins lefty | 15:53 |
| bauzas | left | 15:53 |
| bauzas | any other subject to discuss ? | 15:53 |
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| PaulMurray | what's the abbrieviation for I"I hear the tumble weeds blowing in the wind"? | 15:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | d.o.n.e ? | 15:55 |
| bauzas | no shout, no doubt :) | 15:55 |
| bauzas | #endmeeting | 15:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:55 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 15:55:42 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:55 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-03-18-15.00.html | 15:55 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-03-18-15.00.txt | 15:55 |
| bauzas | thanks all | 15:55 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-03-18-15.00.log.html | 15:55 |
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| jd__ | bauzas: we know have a minimal memcached backend ready to be merged in tooz FWIW | 15:56 |
| bauzas | jd__: that's great :) | 15:57 |
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| bauzas | jd__: that's something we should see if it's worth using it for memcached scheduler:) | 15:57 |
| jd__ | bauzas: yeah I don't know what you need right now, but if you want to discuss let me know | 15:58 |
| jd__ | we'd be happy to have a first consumer | 15:58 |
| bauzas | I think at summit time | 15:58 |
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| bauzas | ok, leaving the chan now | 15:58 |
| bauzas | bye | 15:58 |
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| Swami | ping vivek_ | 16:44 |
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| boris-42 | #startmeeting Rally | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 17:01:08 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is boris-42. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'rally' | 17:01 |
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| boris-42 | marcoemorais hughsaunders stannie meeting | 17:01 |
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| stannie | yes boris-42 | 17:03 |
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| stannie | hi | 17:03 |
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| boris-42 | stannie hey there=) | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | msdubov ping | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | penguinRaider ping | 17:04 |
| penguinRaider | boris-42, pong | 17:04 |
| boris-42 | marcoemorais ping | 17:04 |
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| msdubov | boris-42 hi | 17:05 |
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| boris-42 | so let start | 17:07 |
| boris-42 | our meeting stuff | 17:08 |
| boris-42 | #topic Benchmarking future steps | 17:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Benchmarking future steps (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:08 | |
| boris-42 | So stannie you are improving perfromance of generic cleanup? | 17:09 |
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| hughsaunders | pong | 17:09 |
| stannie | yes boris-42 I am going to work on CleanupContext | 17:09 |
| stannie | haven't started yet | 17:09 |
| stannie | the task is to add a special decorator for CleanupContext that will increase the performance by having a a generic cleanup | 17:10 |
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| stannie | e.g @cleanup(["service1", "service2"]) will only run cleanup for service1 and 2 | 17:11 |
| stannie | service1 can be nova | 17:11 |
| boris-42 | yep yep | 17:11 |
| stannie | service2 e.g cinder etc | 17:11 |
| boris-42 | stannie btw Kun will work on another improvment | 17:12 |
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| stannie | ok so he is depending on my patch ? | 17:12 |
| boris-42 | nope | 17:12 |
| stannie | ok | 17:12 |
| boris-42 | but he will improve as well generic clenaup | 17:12 |
| boris-42 | to cleanup only users that we actually used | 17:12 |
| boris-42 | e.g. if we have 10k users but run tests only 1k times (we don't need to cleanup all 10k users) | 17:13 |
| msdubov | boris-42 Have you started the work on the StressRunner? | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | msdubov nope I didn't.. | 17:13 |
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| msdubov | boris-42 Ok I'll take it then if you're not against | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | msdubov okay | 17:13 |
| boris-42 | stannie hmm so I think that everybody agrees with that stuff? | 17:14 |
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| boris-42 | stannie with having decorator that cleans only specified services?) | 17:14 |
| hughsaunders | less cleaning, less waiting | 17:14 |
| boris-42 | hughsaunders yep | 17:14 |
| boris-42 | msdubov btw yes I am against | 17:14 |
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| boris-42 | msdubov don't touch stress test | 17:15 |
| msdubov | boris-42 why& | 17:15 |
| boris-42 | msdubov until you finish your patch with refactoring of utils | 17:15 |
| msdubov | why? | 17:15 |
| msdubov | boris-42 sure | 17:15 |
| boris-42 | msdubov or let Kun make it.. | 17:15 |
| boris-42 | msdubov or finish it by self.. | 17:15 |
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| msdubov | boris-42 I suppose we'll continue the work with Kun on the processing utils after we merge https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79970/ | 17:16 |
| boris-42 | msdubov it is not related... | 17:16 |
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| boris-42 | msdubov to your work at all | 17:17 |
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| boris-42 | msdubov so pls concentrate on first patch with utils | 17:17 |
| boris-42 | msdubov cause it blocks everything | 17:17 |
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| boris-42 | msdubov "stress" runner doesn't block anything | 17:17 |
| msdubov | boris-42 ok | 17:18 |
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| boris-42 | hughsaunders are you working on passing context to scenario?) | 17:19 |
| hughsaunders | boris-42: yep, but slowly | 17:19 |
| hughsaunders | needs big rebase | 17:19 |
| boris-42 | hughsaunders hmm I didn't touch that part too much?) | 17:20 |
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| boris-42 | so okay let move | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | let's move | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | So I am going to finish work (by the end of this wekk) | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | week* | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | and build ContextManger that will handle what context to run and what context are required by benchmark | 17:22 |
| boris-42 | this will finish work on BenchmarkStuff | 17:23 |
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| boris-42 | So I will concentrate on other parts of projects | 17:23 |
| boris-42 | E.g. tempest & deploy stuff | 17:23 |
| boris-42 | And thoughts about benchmarking in VMs | 17:23 |
| boris-42 | hughsaunders msdubov stannie btw does anybody have any questions?) | 17:24 |
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| boris-42 | I mean seems like it's clear what and why we are doing=) | 17:24 |
| hughsaunders | seems clear to me | 17:24 |
| boris-42 | seems like Rally team works even without meetings =( | 17:24 |
| boris-42 | or probably I should be happy=) | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | # Tempest stuff | 17:25 |
| msdubov | Yep, there is actually the guiding doc | 17:25 |
| msdubov | so it's clear | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | #topic Tempest stuff | 17:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tempest stuff (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:25 | |
| boris-42 | 1. We should improve config generation (to make it works in any case0 | 17:25 |
| boris-42 | I think that somebody should start playing with it… and catching all mistakes in configs | 17:26 |
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| boris-42 | 2. We should create benchmark scenario that will run tempest scenario | 17:26 |
| boris-42 | Seems like this work is quite close to be finished | 17:27 |
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| boris-42 | we will use "verification" stuff to make proper configuration for tempest | 17:27 |
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| boris-42 | and we will have TempestContext | 17:27 |
| boris-42 | that will "activate" virtualenv with all stuff from tepest and run tempest unit test | 17:27 |
| boris-42 | and in cleanup it will "deactivate" | 17:28 |
| boris-42 | So seems like it's clear here as well hughsaunders penguinRaider stannie msdubov ? | 17:28 |
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| msdubov | point 1. : Is it clear who will handle this "catching mistakes" stuff? | 17:29 |
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| msdubov | really lots of work as we discussed it today | 17:29 |
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| boris-42 | msdubov probably you?) | 17:29 |
| msdubov | boris-42 Certainly not this week then... | 17:29 |
| boris-42 | msdubov it's okay | 17:30 |
| penguinRaider | msdubov, boris-42 I can do that maybe ? | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | penguinRaider yep sure | 17:30 |
| msdubov | boris-42 Actually my thought was that this should be done by 2-3 people | 17:30 |
| msdubov | so we could do it together | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | actually Olga is already working on this stuff | 17:30 |
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| boris-42 | but she need help | 17:30 |
| boris-42 | cause task takes a lot of time and it's quite big | 17:30 |
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| amaretskiy | just to note, i am ready for some kind of work | 17:31 |
| boris-42 | amaretskiy okay nice | 17:31 |
| boris-42 | amaretskiy penguinRaider let's speak today and coordinate this work with Olga | 17:31 |
| boris-42 | tomorrow* | 17:31 |
| amaretskiy | ok | 17:31 |
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| penguinRaider | sure | 17:32 |
| boris-42 | # Deploy stuff | 17:33 |
| boris-42 | #topic Deploy stuff | 17:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Deploy stuff (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:33 | |
| boris-42 | hughsaunders penguinRaider amaretskiy msdubov guys we should help rediskin | 17:33 |
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| boris-42 | to finish at least multi host engine | 17:33 |
| msdubov | boris-42 Do you mean code reviews? | 17:33 |
| msdubov | or other kind of help? | 17:33 |
| boris-42 | msdubov code reviews and testing patches | 17:34 |
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| msdubov | hard to do code review without testing patches in case of rediskin =) | 17:34 |
| hughsaunders | yep, I removed -1 today, but need to retest | 17:34 |
| boris-42 | msdubov lol | 17:34 |
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| boris-42 | #topic Free discussion | 17:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Free discussion (Meeting topic: Rally)" | 17:35 | |
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| boris-42 | msdubov hughsaunders penguinRaider amaretskiy does anybody have any questions about Rally/RoadMap/any stuff... | 17:36 |
| boris-42 | ? | 17:36 |
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| amaretskiy | i don't | 17:36 |
| penguinRaider | boris-42, hughsaunders msdubov I need help regarding my application for gsoc | 17:36 |
| hughsaunders | penguinRaider: what needs doing? | 17:36 |
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| penguinRaider | I need a unifying theme for the proposal | 17:36 |
| boris-42 | penguinRaider yep you should share with them | 17:36 |
| tzabal | do you have any proposed changes for the output of the tasks? | 17:36 |
| boris-42 | tzabal hi! | 17:37 |
| boris-42 | tzabal ?) | 17:37 |
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| penguinRaider | hi tzabal :-) | 17:37 |
| tzabal | hello :) | 17:37 |
| boris-42 | tzabal out of task you mean CLI or Graphics?) | 17:37 |
| hughsaunders | penguinRaider: is your proposal available somewhere to read? | 17:37 |
| penguinRaider | hughsaunders, yeah I made a rough first draft will share with you | 17:38 |
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| tzabal | i was thinking about putting the average, min, max results that we have in CLI, in the report of plot2htm | 17:38 |
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| mwagner_lap | is there a way to dump the actual openstack calls rally is making ? | 17:38 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap all calls? | 17:39 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap all API calls you mean?) | 17:39 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap actually if you run it with -d you will get all calls.. | 17:39 |
| mwagner_lap | ok cool | 17:39 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap it will be just debug mode (and all http request will be shown with all details) | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | tzabal so that is the work that started msdubov | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | tzabal but he didn't finished yet first patch | 17:40 |
| boris-42 | tzabal after he finish work you may share this task with Kun | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | msdubov ^ pls help with organizing work on this | 17:41 |
| tzabal | boris-42 ok | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap so actually I have one idea | 17:41 |
| msdubov | boris-42 ok | 17:41 |
| mwagner_lap | just one :) | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap to collect more data form our benchmarking stuff | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap =) | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap one for you=) | 17:41 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap at this second=) | 17:41 |
| tzabal | boris-42 do you have any proposed change for the plot2html stuff? | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | tzabal nope | 17:42 |
| * mwagner_lap waits anxiously | 17:42 | |
| boris-42 | tzabal btw I have idea what you may do | 17:42 |
| boris-42 | tzabal until you are waiting for msdubov | 17:42 |
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| boris-42 | tzabal draw histogram (with possibility on Y and duration on X) | 17:43 |
| boris-42 | tzabal interested ? | 17:43 |
| tzabal | boris-42 yeap | 17:43 |
| boris-42 | tzabal okay I will share with details after meeting | 17:43 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap so | 17:43 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap actually as you see we are doing active pooling of resource | 17:43 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap e.g. checking status of VM until it becomes "Acitve" | 17:43 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap yep? | 17:43 |
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| mwagner_lap | boris-42, actually trying to figure out how to do that now | 17:44 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap it's already done.. | 17:45 |
| mwagner_lap | tryting to figure out how you bypass the instance database | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap not sure that understand queiston=) | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap First step send request to create VM | 17:45 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap second step in while do get_vm_by_uuid | 17:45 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap if it is Active stop while, if it is in Error state raise Exception | 17:46 |
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| mwagner_lap | as I mentioned earlier this morning, if i run the "boot" task, vms get created and are left running but they dont show up via nova list and they are not in the instance database | 17:47 |
| mwagner_lap | which doesn't delete them from the db | 17:47 |
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| mwagner_lap | they show up in a ps -ef | grep qemu on the hypervisor but in virsh list --all | 17:47 |
| mwagner_lap | so procs are running but no record of them from the openstack or libvirt perspective | 17:48 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap so seems like you didn't get my response | 17:49 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap the reason why you didn't see them is that you try to list admin's VMs | 17:49 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap and Rally creates VMs from temporary users | 17:49 |
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| mwagner_lap | boris-42, i did get that but shouldn't all the vms show up in the "systems" instance table ? | 17:52 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap "systems"? | 17:53 |
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| mwagner_lap | from an openstack pov there should be an accounting of the resources used | 17:53 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap they should be showed in "instances" table | 17:53 |
| mwagner_lap | they are not showing up in mine, but they are running on the hypervisor | 17:54 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap hmm strange | 17:56 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap they should be all in DB | 17:56 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap and if you are looking in Horizon | 17:57 |
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| boris-42 | mwagner_lap they should be listed in "instances" | 17:57 |
| mwagner_lap | horizon does not show them and 'virsh list' doesn't list them either | 17:57 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap at admin page | 17:57 |
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| mwagner_lap | virsh list on the hypervisor | 17:57 |
| boris-42 | mwagner_lap okay lets disccuss this in rally chat | 17:57 |
| mwagner_lap | bogdando, right not even with the admin page | 17:57 |
| mwagner_lap | ok | 17:58 |
| boris-42 | #endmeeting | 17:58 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 17:58:08 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-03-18-17.01.html | 17:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-03-18-17.01.txt | 17:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-03-18-17.01.log.html | 17:58 |
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| stevemar | o/ | 17:59 |
| lbragstad | hey | 18:00 |
| fabiog | o/ | 18:00 |
| gyee | \o | 18:00 |
| henrynash | hi | 18:00 |
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| stevemar | o/ /o/ \o \o\ | 18:00 |
| marekd | o/ | 18:00 |
| bknudson | dolphm: hi | 18:00 |
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| dolphm | o/ | 18:00 |
| dolphm | ayoung, bknudson, dstanek, jamielennox, morganfainberg, stevemar, gyee, henrynash, topol, marekd, lbragstad, joesavak, shardy, fabiog, fmarco76: ping | 18:00 |
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| dolphm | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting | 18:00 |
| dolphm | #startmeeting keystone | 18:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 18:01:00 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dolphm. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 18:01 |
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| * ayoung here | 18:01 | |
| dolphm | #topic Reminder: Design summit session proposals open until April 20th | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Reminder: Design summit session proposals open until April 20th (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:01 | |
| dolphm | #link http://summit.openstack.org/ | 18:01 |
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| dolphm | this is for the *design* summit, not the conference | 18:01 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I assume we are already at the point where we can start merging the proposals | 18:01 |
| bknudson | lots of keystone topics already | 18:02 |
| ayoung | 18 | 18:02 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i'd like to wait until after the deadline to accept/reject/merge anything so it's clear what we're working with | 18:02 |
| stevemar | how many slots do we have? | 18:02 |
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| ayoung | assuming I can count, which is a big assumption | 18:02 |
| ayoung | stevemar, 3 | 18:02 |
| dolphm | ayoung: otherwise it seems unfair to start shuffling things too early | 18:02 |
| ayoung | :) | 18:02 |
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| ayoung | we had about 8 last time | 18:02 |
| dolphm | stevemar: fewer than last time, as we're donating some time to a new cross-project track | 18:02 |
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| dolphm | stevemar: i don't think i have a final number yet | 18:02 |
| ayoung | one days worth, spread over multiple days | 18:02 |
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| ayoung | our client stuff maybe can be merged with the Oslo common client | 18:03 |
| stevemar | boooo... | 18:03 |
| ayoung | and then we can make sure anything that is a server side topic at least addresses client side for that same topic | 18:03 |
| dolphm | and as a reminder for what the *design* summit is all about if you'd like to propose something: this is for moderated collaborative discussions, not for powerpointy lectures :) | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | down with ppts | 18:04 |
| gyee | and with prototype demos | 18:04 |
| dolphm | i believe the deadline for proposing powerpointy lectures for the conference has passed | 18:04 |
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| dolphm | gyee: i'd submit that demos are best saved for lightning talks | 18:04 |
| dolphm | which you don't need to register for in advance | 18:04 |
| gyee | sounds reasonable | 18:05 |
| ayoung | really, the week will be spent doing collaborative development in the dev lounge. the rest is just distractions | 18:05 |
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| dolphm | gyee: plus if your demo fails, you can sit down and just try again the next day :P | 18:05 |
| gyee | dolphm, we'll do live debugging | 18:05 |
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| ayoung | Feature freeze for Keystone will be Juno 2. If you want a big feature in to Juno, you need to have it started before the summit | 18:05 |
| ayoung | right morganfainberg ? | 18:05 |
| * ayoung thinking ephemeral tokens | 18:06 | |
| henrynash | ayoung: oh, yes please | 18:06 |
| dolphm | the bigger the feature, the earlier the better | 18:06 |
| gyee | that will be a *fun* discussion | 18:06 |
| marekd | ayoung: and J-2 is happening when? | 18:06 |
| dolphm | marekd: probably july, there's no schedule yet | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | well find out the schedule at the summit right? | 18:07 |
| lbragstad | or shortly after? | 18:07 |
| bknudson | we'll need people doing reviews early, too, then | 18:07 |
| dolphm | bknudson: we could do a very early feature proposal freeze, rather than feature freeze | 18:07 |
| dolphm | this might be a conversation best saved for the summit, but it's good to give everyone an early warning here | 18:08 |
| dolphm | #topic RC1-blocking issues | 18:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RC1-blocking issues (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:08 | |
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| dolphm | i wanted to run through what's on our plate for shipping an RC1 | 18:08 |
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| dolphm | my goal is to have fixes for all RC1 issues at least in review by friday | 18:09 |
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| dolphm | #link https://launchpad.net/keystone/+milestone/icehouse-rc1 | 18:09 |
| dolphm | so let's run through the list | 18:09 |
| morganfainberg | o/ here sorry | 18:09 |
| dolphm | Bug 1291157: idp deletion should trigger token revocation | 18:09 |
| dolphm | (no linky bot?) | 18:09 |
| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1291157 | 18:10 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, ++ at least work on it | 18:10 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, bot has been dead for week+ | 18:10 |
| dolphm | boo | 18:10 |
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| dolphm | marekd: ayoung: stevemar: i'm comfortable shipping icehouse with this as a known issue, but i'd be happy to see a fix if anyone wants to pursue | 18:10 |
| dolphm | i'm worried we're going to get into api conversations, and it's far too late for that | 18:11 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I don't want to do list_tokens_for_idp but doing it in the revocation events makes sense | 18:11 |
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| bknudson | is it going to require a schema change? | 18:11 |
| dstanek | stevemar: does a revocation need to happen on ipd update too? | 18:11 |
| dolphm | ayoung: i think it'd just be a matter of adding "OS-FEDERATION:identity_provider" | 18:12 |
| stevemar | dstanek, it probably should | 18:12 |
| ayoung | bknudson, for revocation events, it could probably be done with the domain ids, assuming they are valid. otherwise, yeah, I'd need to add an IOdP column | 18:12 |
| dolphm | ... as an attribute of a revocation event | 18:12 |
| dolphm | stevemar: dstanek: why? there's not too much to update, is there? | 18:12 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, what did we settle on as the relationship between IdPs and (identity) domains? | 18:13 |
| dstanek | dolphm: i have to reasoning...it was mentioned in the issue | 18:13 |
| dolphm | ayoung: no explicit relationship in icehouse | 18:13 |
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| stevemar | dolphm, if we use revoke instead of delete, wouldn't we then create a dependency on an optional extension? | 18:13 |
| marekd | dolphm: stevemar dstanek actually you can only disable idp when you PATCH it | 18:13 |
| stevemar | thanks marekd | 18:13 |
| marekd | https://github.com/openstack/identity-api/blob/master/openstack-identity-api/v3/src/markdown/identity-api-v3-os-federation-ext.md#update-identity-provider-patch-os-federationidentity_providersidp_id | 18:13 |
| ayoung | dolphm, do userids from Federation have a domain_id associated with them in icehouse? | 18:13 |
| ayoung | stevemar, nope | 18:13 |
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| ayoung | stevemar, the event API insulates one from the other | 18:14 |
| dolphm | stevemar: yes, but i'd say it's acceptable for extensions to depend on one another | 18:14 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, ++ | 18:14 |
| ayoung | ah, you mean an implicit dep | 18:14 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, yeah, but even if it was an explicit dep, it wouldn't be horrible (though i think the code doesn't support it) | 18:15 |
| ayoung | for now, I would say that an IdP needs to have some sort of domain id. Then we can treat it like a domain disable event | 18:15 |
| ayoung | plus won't everything break if there is no domain_id? | 18:15 |
| dolphm | ayoung: that's a viable solution, but not really for icehouse | 18:15 |
| dolphm | ayoung: there's no domain_id now | 18:15 |
| ayoung | dolphm, doesn't any user in Federation have to alreayd live in the Identity backend? | 18:16 |
| dolphm | ayoung: no | 18:16 |
| ayoung | just groups? | 18:16 |
| marekd | ayoung: nooo? | 18:16 |
| dolphm | ayoung: they "live" in the remote IdP are ephemeral in keystone | 18:16 |
| marekd | ayoung: just groups | 18:16 |
| dolphm | ayoung: authorization lives in keystone | 18:16 |
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| ayoung | make IdP ID == domain_id then | 18:16 |
| dolphm | ayoung: that's the conversation we can have at the summit | 18:16 |
| ayoung | put it in the tokens and get a disable domain event | 18:16 |
| ayoung | OK | 18:17 |
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| dolphm | is anyone completely opposed to waiting until juno to address this? | 18:17 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, i'm actually more for addressing this in juno | 18:18 |
| henrynash | ++ | 18:18 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: i am too | 18:18 |
| bknudson | it's scary leaving this bug... there's no workaround? | 18:18 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, vs squeezing it in under the wire (unless we have a very very good reason not to) | 18:18 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, so is it just that we delete an idp and tokens aren't revoked? | 18:18 |
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| dolphm | bknudson: not a simple one | 18:19 |
| bknudson | morganfainberg: yes, you delete or disable an idp and tokens aren't revoked | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | because, as aweful as it is we could do the same thing we do for oauth | 18:19 |
| marekd | morganfainberg: and what's happening there? | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | oh nvm we can't | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | we'd need a new index. | 18:19 |
| gyee | bknudson, disable a group would delete the tokens right? | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | we're not tracking by user. | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, which groups | 18:19 |
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| bknudson | gyee: right, disable a group or a user... or a domain | 18:19 |
| gyee | assuming you keep track of Ide=group mappings | 18:20 |
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| marekd | gyee: we dont | 18:20 |
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| gyee | IdP user to group mapping I mean | 18:20 |
| bknudson | I guess we'd know what groups are referenced by the mapping | 18:20 |
| dolphm | gyee: we don't really track that, per se | 18:20 |
| morganfainberg | hm. | 18:20 |
| dolphm | bknudson: the mapping is mutable | 18:21 |
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| morganfainberg | can we add the IDP id to the token? | 18:21 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: it's already there | 18:21 |
| bknudson | changing the mapping should probably invalidate tokens, too | 18:21 |
| morganfainberg | can we make auth_token ask keystone if an IDP is valid on validating the idp? | 18:21 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: and i suspect what the revocation event should be based on | 18:21 |
| marekd | morganfainberg: and later go through all the tokens and match them? | 18:21 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: token -> user -> OS-FEDERATION -> identity_provider -> id | 18:21 |
| morganfainberg | or provide a list of active IDP IDs to auth_token? | 18:21 |
| morganfainberg | internal to keystone this is easy | 18:21 |
| morganfainberg | is IDP valid, nope? reject | 18:22 |
| ayoung | loss of IdP is catastrophic, and revoke all tokens | 18:22 |
| dolphm | ayoung: lol that's not a bad approach | 18:22 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, dolphm, for I i think we could expose a list of valid IDP ids | 18:22 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: GET /v3/OS-FEDERATION/identity_providers | 18:22 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, yeah | 18:23 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, make auth_token middleware track that | 18:23 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, just check if token_id is in that list. | 18:23 |
| morganfainberg | it's a low risk / easy solution | 18:23 |
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| morganfainberg | and internal to keystone we can check IDP is valid for validation calls | 18:23 |
| morganfainberg | if we don't already | 18:23 |
| ayoung | dolphm, it is the sane approach for Icehouse | 18:23 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: ayoung: ++ | 18:24 |
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| dolphm | i'll add keystoneclient to that bug then | 18:24 |
| morganfainberg | k | 18:24 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, probably a separate middleware sitting behind auth_token | 18:24 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, i don't think we want to do that. | 18:24 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, I'm unwilling to do that | 18:24 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, getting everyone to load another middleware is bad | 18:24 |
| ayoung | I thik that a list of valid IdPs as part of the check is getting into the revoke events space | 18:24 |
| morganfainberg | this needs to be in auth_token | 18:24 |
| ayoung | I'd rather just add it to revoke events | 18:24 |
| dolphm | revised https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-keystoneclient/+bug/1291157 | 18:25 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, but we don't have full revocation events now. | 18:25 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, and we need a solution for I | 18:25 |
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| gyee | morganfainberg, middleware is alreay overloaded, but I like ayoung's idea of having it in revoke events | 18:25 |
| morganfainberg | long term i want it in revocation events | 18:25 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, we have revocation events, and I have a fledgling patch for the client side | 18:26 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, but we've stated revocation events are expirimental | 18:26 |
| gyee | auth_token middleware refactoring is overdue :) | 18:26 |
| dolphm | gyee: it's happening, slowly | 18:26 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, so is Federation in my book | 18:26 |
| dolphm | so we need to move on, we have more bugs to discuss :) | 18:27 |
| dolphm | Bug 1255321: v3 token requests result in 500 error when run in apache | 18:27 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, then we need to mark it in the docs | 18:27 |
| dolphm | Bug 1291423: revocation events sync slows responses to all authenticated calls | 18:27 |
| dolphm | Bug 1291047: Keystone returns traceback for db backend | 18:27 |
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| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1255321 | 18:27 |
| dstanek | gyee: yes, i was looking at it yesterday and was very tempted to start hacking it up | 18:27 |
| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1291423 | 18:27 |
| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1291047 | 18:27 |
| ayoung | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81166/2 | 18:27 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, will discuss more in -dev after meeting | 18:27 |
| dolphm | ayoung: all three of these are assigned to you -- care to share the burden with anyone else? | 18:27 |
| ayoung | dolphm, looking | 18:27 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I'd be happy to hand them off | 18:28 |
| ayoung | I'll keep https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1291423 | 18:28 |
| dolphm | anyone want to volunteer to pick any of these up? | 18:28 |
| ayoung | which is revocation events, and I think we already have a better approach | 18:28 |
| gyee | the 500 error one is interesting, compressed token should help | 18:28 |
| ayoung | gyee, yeah...but I don't think I can slip compressed tokens into the icehouse release | 18:29 |
| dolphm | "Keystone returns traceback for db backend" is a regression that should be an easy fix if we can figure out where things went wrong | 18:29 |
| jamielennox | dolphm: yea, that shouldn't happen with up to date requirements, it was initially filed on bugzilla and i put the same comment there but no response yet | 18:30 |
| dolphm | ayoung: so should https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1255321 be untargeted from rc1? | 18:30 |
| ayoung | dolphm, well...maybe | 18:30 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: have you tried to reproduce? | 18:30 |
| ayoung | dolphm, I have a python33 issue, but assuming I solve that | 18:30 |
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| ayoung | the path needs to be clear to enabling compressed tokens on the server | 18:30 |
| ayoung | I think that means a new config value | 18:30 |
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| gyee | ayoung, recommend endpoint filtering to reduce service catalog size, or nocatalog on token request | 18:31 |
| ayoung | or, maybe a new token provider | 18:31 |
| ayoung | gyee, suspect that none of that is going to make adifference | 18:31 |
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| jamielennox | dolphm: you'd have to get eventlet context switching at just the right time, i guess you could force that - but no | 18:31 |
| gyee | its the service catalog that super sized the PKI token | 18:31 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, so, assuming I get compressed tokens working, I would probably make the server side be an alternative token provider, that looks just like the PKi provider, but that generates compressed tokens instead | 18:32 |
| bknudson | users are going to need the service catalog | 18:32 |
| ayoung | and then you would configure that in the config file as the token provider | 18:32 |
| ayoung | if that is acceptable, (and I figure out the python33 issue) we can have an RC1 fix | 18:32 |
| dolphm | gyee: nocatalog isn't a viable option for everyone | 18:32 |
| gyee | bknudson, not the whole shebang, just the services user is interested in | 18:32 |
| jamielennox | ayoung: i'm still not sure why this would need to be a provider rather than just a wrap/unwrap middleware option | 18:32 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: ++ | 18:32 |
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| ayoung | jamielennox, OK...so we don't assume that the entire openstack deployment upgrades at once | 18:33 |
| gyee | is there really a use case where the whole thing is needed? | 18:33 |
| ayoung | if it doesn't we need to keep from breaking existing clients | 18:33 |
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| gyee | beside horizon, where they can get the catalog on a separate API | 18:33 |
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| ayoung | gyee, doesn't matter | 18:33 |
| morganfainberg | can we make it a ?compressed=true | 18:34 |
| morganfainberg | ? | 18:34 |
| ayoung | so much code is written around the service catalog, we can't break that | 18:34 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, no | 18:34 |
| jamielennox | ayoung: sure that just means you ahve to roll out the client updates before you can switch over the server - but that would be the same as a new provider | 18:34 |
| jamielennox | morganfainberg: no, i don't think it should be optional at request time | 18:34 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, or we make it part of the accepts header | 18:34 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, it needs to be a different token format, and then auth token neeeds to handle both | 18:34 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, hm. | 18:34 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: i don't think it should be optional either -- it should happen transparently for end users | 18:34 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, oh right derp. sorry was thinking | 18:35 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, auth_token making the request | 18:35 |
| ayoung | dolphm, defaults to uncompressed for Icehouse, compressed for juno | 18:35 |
| morganfainberg | nope. | 18:35 |
| ayoung | MII still needs to work | 18:35 |
| ayoung | rem,ember, there is Java code out there that talks to openstack....we can't brak this | 18:35 |
| ayoung | break | 18:35 |
| dolphm | alright, so untargeted Bug 1255321 "v3 token requests result in 500 error when run in apache" from RC1 | 18:36 |
| ayoung | but we can make the mechanism possible, and publish it | 18:36 |
| ayoung | dolphm, wrong call | 18:36 |
| ayoung | the right call is to make it optional | 18:36 |
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| ayoung | just don't try to drop all the baggage at the same time | 18:36 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: you're advocating for compressed tokens to be a service-side feature, in which case it's too late for icehouse | 18:37 |
| dolphm | ... correct me if i'm wrong | 18:37 |
| ayoung | Fair enough | 18:37 |
| jamielennox | ayoung: i don't disagree with the client needing updating and MII etc. My point is that as the logic behind PKI and compressed PKI tokens is exactly the same other than that last compress step it doesn't need to be a new 'provider' | 18:37 |
| ayoung | jamielennox, the problem is that the old clients can't deal with the new format | 18:38 |
| ayoung | its not just "the final step" | 18:38 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: that's my intuition as well, but i haven't tried to make it happen to judge the actual required complexity :) | 18:38 |
| jamielennox | ayoung: sure | 18:38 |
| bknudson | ayoung: auth_token middleware? why do clients care in general? | 18:38 |
| dolphm | bknudson: because auth_token has to unpack tokens to validate them offline | 18:38 |
| dolphm | bknudson: clients == auth_token here | 18:38 |
| ayoung | and compression is part of the unpacking | 18:39 |
| jamielennox | dolphm: me neither, but i consider the provider to be the controller and compressed or not should be a view of it | 18:39 |
| bknudson | right, just making sure it wasn't all clients that care. | 18:39 |
| ayoung | bknudson, it will be...in Juno | 18:39 |
| dolphm | bknudson: exactly, actual end users won't/shouldn't care | 18:39 |
| ayoung | dolphm, OK, so I'll continue on with the compressed token work, but if anyone wants to use it, they will need to run an unsupported, out of tree token provider | 18:40 |
| dolphm | alright then, so the other bug up for grabs was https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1291047 | 18:40 |
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| ayoung | we'll get the token provider into Juno 1, and backport if there is sufficient demand | 18:40 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: do you think this should be incomplete? | 18:40 |
| morganfainberg | this is a tough one to duplicate imo | 18:40 |
| jamielennox | dolphm: i'm wondering from before if I could reproduce with some well place sleeps and a decent load | 18:41 |
| morganfainberg | jamielennox, adding in sleep(0)'s? | 18:41 |
| dolphm | it's not using SecurityError somehow, is it? and then the behavior is dependent on debug=true? | 18:41 |
| jamielennox | morganfainberg: right - something that made eventlet switch to a new thread | 18:41 |
| morganfainberg | jamielennox, it does force context switches | 18:41 |
| jamielennox | morganfainberg: yea, i *think* you can do it with a call to eventlet as well but i dont know how | 18:42 |
| dstanek | how does the context switch cause this error? | 18:42 |
| jamielennox | i've tried to ignore eventlet as much as possible | 18:42 |
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| * dolphm is confused between this bug and another one with a really similar title... | 18:42 | |
| morganfainberg | dstanek, when eventlet switches it's execution point, thread swap, it looks like it's clearing the exc. stack? | 18:42 |
| jamielennox | dstanek: see linked eventlet bug: https://bitbucket.org/eventlet/eventlet/issue/118/exceptions-are-cleared-during | 18:42 |
| morganfainberg | it's a fairly standard coroutine-like-code hell problem | 18:43 |
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| morganfainberg | thankfully eventlet has been mostly decent (lately) about not introducing/causing these | 18:43 |
| jamielennox | but it shouldn't happen with new greenlet and global-requirements.txt has sufficient greenlet in it | 18:43 |
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| jamielennox | (from my understanding) | 18:44 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, how is this a security issue? | 18:44 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: leaking internal details unnecessarily | 18:44 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, ah ok phew, i thought i was missing something else | 18:44 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, i was concerned you were seeing a rollback issue causing a gap | 18:45 |
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| dolphm | (this is marked as a private security issue) but i marked it as a dupe of the public bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1293113 | 18:45 |
| dolphm | it does actually vary a bit from https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1291047 | 18:45 |
| bknudson | seems like keystone should trap all exceptions and return a generic 500 error | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, that was what i was thinking would solve this | 18:46 |
| bknudson | unless debug=True... but even then doesn't seem necessary if it's in the log | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | this just seems like we should tighten up what we pass back, make the returns much simpler | 18:47 |
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| dolphm | bknudson: so basically UnexpectedError should extend SecurityError ? | 18:47 |
| morganfainberg | erm errors to the client | 18:47 |
| bknudson | dolphm: that sounds safer to me. | 18:47 |
| ayoung | dolphm, ++ | 18:47 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, ++ | 18:48 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, I'll take this one if you need. | 18:48 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: sure | 18:48 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, and chase down any external deps | 18:48 |
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| morganfainberg | hopefully it'll be minimal | 18:48 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: it looks like the only gotcha is that UnexpectedError currently expects %(exception)s in the string formatter | 18:49 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, yeah | 18:49 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, shouldn't be too bad (might require test massaging) | 18:49 |
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| morganfainberg | i'll link it against both the security bug and the regression one | 18:50 |
| morganfainberg | oh wait no the security one is marked dup | 18:50 |
| morganfainberg | haha don't need to. | 18:50 |
| morganfainberg | cool | 18:50 |
| dolphm | henrynash: o/ | 18:50 |
| henrynash | hi | 18:51 |
| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1287219 | 18:51 |
| dolphm | Bug 1287219: scope of domain admin too broad in v3 policy sample | 18:51 |
| henrynash | so fix merged | 18:51 |
| ayoung | dolphm, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/81235/ should go in. YorikSar needsd to open a bug to describe the problem he is fixing, but I've been testing the code. It solves some issues that I was seeing, but had not yet been able to reproduce with a server side test | 18:51 |
| dolphm | henrynash: you marked this as fixed, but there's no link to a fix as far as i can see? | 18:51 |
| henrynash | hmm…ok let me fix thaat :-) | 18:51 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, the code merged, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79897/ https://review.openstack.org/#/c/80769/ | 18:52 |
| dolphm | ayoung: open a bug and track it against RC1 | 18:52 |
| ayoung | dolphm, ++ | 18:52 |
| dolphm | YorikSar: ^ | 18:52 |
| morganfainberg | sorry #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/80769/ | 18:52 |
| morganfainberg | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79897/ | 18:52 |
| YorikSar | dolphm, ayoung: ok | 18:52 |
| dolphm | henrynash: morganfainberg: thanks | 18:53 |
| dolphm | henrynash: must have been a fluke with the bot | 18:53 |
| bknudson | can't trust bots | 18:53 |
| dolphm | henrynash: i linked the to the review in the bug | 18:53 |
| henrynash | dolphm: thx | 18:53 |
| dolphm | and the last one... | 18:53 |
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| dolphm | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1273867 | 18:54 |
| henrynash | I do have one question on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/80769/, see last item of the agenda (cover it then) | 18:54 |
| dolphm | Keystone API v3 lists disabled endpoints and services in catalog | 18:54 |
| bknudson | dolphm: it's partially fixed... disabled endpoints | 18:54 |
| dolphm | henrynash: ack | 18:54 |
| bknudson | but not disabled services | 18:54 |
| dolphm | bknudson: and i think endpoints are the more important piece, but do you think you'll have time to do the same for services? | 18:54 |
| dolphm | (this week) | 18:54 |
| bknudson | I can't promise I'd get services done this week | 18:55 |
| bknudson | it's crazy around here. | 18:55 |
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| dolphm | bknudson: this is another one that i'm comfortable shipping with as a known issue, given that we have a solid workaround (disable all the endpoints for your "disabled" services prior to upgrading) | 18:55 |
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| bknudson | close the bug and open a new one? | 18:55 |
| ayoung | ++ | 18:55 |
| bknudson | a new one for services? | 18:55 |
| morganfainberg | ++ | 18:55 |
| morganfainberg | that sounds very reasonable | 18:56 |
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| gyee | and disable a region? | 18:56 |
| dolphm | gyee: /v3/regions has no impact on the catalog, yet | 18:56 |
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| dstanek | bknudson: so endpoints is complete and we just have to implement services for this one? | 18:57 |
| dolphm | gyee: i think that expectation will come, but not yet | 18:57 |
| dolphm | dstanek: yes | 18:57 |
| ayoung | gyee, separate bug for that too, i'd wager | 18:57 |
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| gyee | yeah | 18:57 |
| dolphm | bknudson: it's going to be a parallel fix -- probably sharing a lot of code | 18:57 |
| bknudson | dstanek: yes, disabled endpoints are not in the catalog anymore... but disabling a service has no effect | 18:57 |
| dolphm | dstanek: ^ | 18:57 |
| bknudson | for services, I don't think there's a tempest test that doesn't work like there was for endpoints | 18:57 |
| dstanek | if you create a new bug you can assign it to me and can work on it | 18:58 |
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| dolphm | bknudson: good to know | 18:58 |
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| dolphm | dstanek: will do, thanks! | 18:58 |
| dolphm | #topic Should domain_id be immutable by default? | 18:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Should domain_id be immutable by default? (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:58 | |
| dolphm | (quickly) | 18:58 |
| henrynash | so https://review.openstack.org/#/c/80769/ provides option to made domain_id immutable... | 18:58 |
| henrynash | question is, should we really make it immutable by default | 18:58 |
| henrynash | would change existing fucntionaliy | 18:58 |
| dolphm | henrynash: are you asking about icehouse or juno? | 18:58 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, icehouse | 18:58 |
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| henrynash | icehouse | 18:58 |
| dstanek | bknudson: is tempest ensuring that disabled endpoints don't appear? | 18:58 |
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| morganfainberg | i'm concerned about a security implication (talked w/ henrynash) due to the ability that you could move a user you control into a domain you don't control | 18:59 |
| bknudson | dstanek: no, it was trying to set endpoint disabled to an invalid boolean value (by our XML translator) | 18:59 |
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| morganfainberg | and i'm not 100% sure we are guarding against admin in domain A with user moved to domain B clearly | 18:59 |
| bknudson | dstanek: as far as I know there are no tempest tests for getting a catalog with disabled endpoints... otherwise we wouldn't have the bug | 18:59 |
| jamielennox | henrynash: what's the logic behind it being mutable in the first place? | 18:59 |
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| dolphm | morganfainberg: ack; i'm not opposed to making it immutable in icehouse for that reason (it's a security improvement), and i'm very much in favor of making it immutable *by* juno | 19:00 |
| morganfainberg | jamielennox, it shouldn't be. we just didn't make it immutible | 19:00 |
| jamielennox | it wouldn't seem to work with the way our SQL/LDAP providers work | 19:00 |
| henrynash | jamielennox: lsoat in the midst of time | 19:00 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: there's not any ( morganfainberg++ ) | 19:00 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, in juno for sure immutible | 19:00 |
| morganfainberg | i'd prefer to invert the option for I | 19:00 |
| dolphm | henrynash: put the patch up to change the default and we'll vote on it :) | 19:00 |
| morganfainberg | if someone _needs_ that, make a less secure deployment | 19:00 |
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| dolphm | we're over time | 19:01 |
| dolphm | #endmeeting | 19:01 |
| henrynash | in reality, moving entities between domains will break most production style non-trivial deployments | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 19:01:05 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-03-18-18.01.html | 19:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-03-18-18.01.txt | 19:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-03-18-18.01.log.html | 19:01 |
| henrynash | dolphm: ++ | 19:01 |
| jeblair | hello infra folks? | 19:01 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 19:01 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | o/ | 19:01 |
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| tristanC | o/ | 19:01 |
| zaro | o/ | 19:01 |
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| clarkb | o/ | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #startmeeting infra | 19:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 19:02:11 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is jeblair. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting | 19:02 |
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| jeblair | agenda ^ | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-03-11-19.01.html | 19:02 |
| jeblair | last meeting ^ | 19:02 |
| fungi | yo | 19:02 |
| anteaya | o/ | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:02 | |
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| jeblair | oh that was easy | 19:03 |
| nibalizer | o/ | 19:03 |
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| jeblair | #topic Upgrade gerrit (zaro) | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Upgrade gerrit (zaro) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| jeblair | zaro: do you have the etherpad handy for this? | 19:04 |
| zaro | changes waiting to be reviewed. | 19:04 |
| zaro | ohh. let me find it. | 19:04 |
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| jeblair | zaro: i'd like to check in on what changes we need to review now, and which ones we should be planning on merging when we actually do the upgrade | 19:04 |
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| zaro | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/gerrit-2.8-upgrade | 19:05 |
| jeblair | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/gerrit-2.8-upgrade | 19:05 |
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| zaro | here is the list | 19:05 |
| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79107 | 19:06 |
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| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/70818/ | 19:06 |
| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60893/ | 19:06 |
| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/60080/ | 19:06 |
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| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/69768/ | 19:06 |
| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/70014/ | 19:07 |
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| zaro | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/70864/ | 19:07 |
| jeblair | zaro: this week, can you update the etherpad and put those in 3 sections? | 19:07 |
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| jeblair | zaro: the changes we need to merge now, during the upgrade, and after the upgrade? | 19:07 |
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| zaro | sure. but that is all the remaining. | 19:08 |
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| jeblair | zaro: because it seems like some of those may not be safe to merge right now, right? | 19:08 |
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| zaro | maybe 2 are not, but rest can. | 19:08 |
| zaro | i'll put it on etherpad and send out to irc. | 19:09 |
| jeblair | zaro: coool thanks. | 19:09 |
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| zaro | ohh question. | 19:09 |
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| zaro | should we upgrade during openstack 'off' week? | 19:10 |
| clarkb | I won't be around that week | 19:10 |
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| jeblair | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Icehouse_Release_Schedule | 19:10 |
| zaro | ohh yeah. i think clarkb was actually suggesting week before if we can gett all changes approved. | 19:10 |
| clarkb | I was thinking week before might be slightly better as only fungi will be out that week iirc | 19:10 |
| anteaya | the off week is designed for infra to be able to take a week off | 19:11 |
| clarkb | anteaya: exactly :) | 19:11 |
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| anteaya | at least that was the intend I heard | 19:11 |
| jeblair | clarkb: the week of 24? | 19:11 |
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| clarkb | jeblair: ya | 19:11 |
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| * fungi will be missing in action for the two weeks prior to the off week, and then will be around for the off week, bizarrely | 19:11 | |
| clarkb | I get on a plane on the 26th (don't let me stop anyone from doing it during the off week fi you want to do it then) | 19:11 |
| jeblair | anteaya: i don't think that was the intent -- i think the intent was that everyone should take a week off. it's more about release schedule timing than giving infra a break. | 19:11 |
| jeblair | fungi: i will be around during the off week | 19:12 |
| clarkb | jeblair: anteaya right it was an everyone off week including infra | 19:12 |
| anteaya | oh I thought ttx thought infra needed to be able to take a break | 19:12 |
| anteaya | and that a week needed to be scheduled since infra, release management and qa seem to work when everyone else is off | 19:12 |
| fungi | i think ttx just needed to be able to go skiing ;) | 19:12 |
| jeblair | anteaya: no, it's because the time between summits was too short for another milestone and too long for one less | 19:13 |
| anteaya | oh okay | 19:13 |
| jeblair | anteaya: and the time between the release and the summit is unstructured | 19:13 |
| jeblair | anteaya: so having that time be too long means people are working on things that may not have been discussed or approved | 19:13 |
| * zaro is not off @ off week. | 19:13 | |
| jeblair | so we want to minimize it | 19:13 |
| jeblair | zaro: let's see if a few more people will be around; if so, i like the idea of doing it during the off week | 19:14 |
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| pleia2 | I'm around too | 19:14 |
| clarkb | huh I figured everyone would be taking advantage of the off week | 19:15 |
| fungi | i'm totally up for that | 19:15 |
| fungi | people come back from break to a new gerrit ;) | 19:15 |
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| pleia2 | clarkb: I still have some of my humanity, I don't plan my *whole* life around the openstack release cycle :) | 19:15 |
| mordred | oh. | 19:15 |
| mordred | o/ | 19:15 |
| mordred | I'm actually awake still | 19:15 |
| jeblair | mordred: have plans for the off week? https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Icehouse_Release_Schedule | 19:16 |
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| jeblair | mordred: we're thinking of doing the gerrit upgrade then | 19:16 |
| fungi | pleia2: we'll fix that soon, i promise | 19:16 |
| clarkb | pleia2: it actually worked out great for me so win for me I guess | 19:16 |
| pleia2 | fungi: haha | 19:16 |
| mordred | jeblair: works for me | 19:16 |
| pleia2 | I'm only gone for the weekend (conference) | 19:16 |
| jeblair | clarkb, fungi: i'm going to be tooling around NC the week between the off week and summit (and then road tripping to the summit) | 19:17 |
| jeblair | clarkb: so that's great that you'll be around to fix any problems that crop up then! ;) | 19:17 |
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| anteaya | I'm around that week | 19:17 |
| fungi | jeblair: i'm around that week too, so should be fine | 19:17 |
| clarkb | jeblair: ha | 19:17 |
| fungi | jeblair: we'll be running a whole new fork of gerrit when you get back ;) | 19:18 |
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| jeblair | fungi: and after my next vacation, vinz? :) | 19:18 |
| fungi | likely | 19:19 |
| pleia2 | :) | 19:19 |
| clarkb | no no first pygit needs to be fixed :) | 19:19 |
| jeblair | ok, so let's tentatively say we'll upgrade during the off week.... | 19:19 |
| clarkb | wfm | 19:19 |
| jeblair | zaro: do you want to send a note to the ml suggesting that and see if anyone screams? | 19:19 |
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| zaro | will do. | 19:20 |
| jeblair | if no one does, we can start doing more formal announcements closer to then | 19:20 |
| zaro | ohh is that openstack-infra ml or opestack ml? | 19:20 |
| clarkb | openstack-dev | 19:20 |
| zaro | ok | 19:20 |
| clarkb | is probably the best place to get a tempurature | 19:20 |
| jeblair | #topic determining atc for the purposes of ptl and tc elections (anteaya) | 19:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "determining atc for the purposes of ptl and tc elections (anteaya) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:21 | |
| fungi | ooh! | 19:21 |
| anteaya | o/ | 19:21 |
| mordred | look. it's an anteaya | 19:22 |
| jeblair | anteaya: welcome back! | 19:22 |
| fungi | anteaya: we run a script to generate that currently, from the programs list in the gobernance repo | 19:22 |
| jeblair | in the agenda, anteaya says " does using projects.yaml from the governance repo get us an accurate list? " | 19:22 |
| fungi | governance | 19:22 |
| anteaya | so the governance repo has a handy projects.yaml: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/governance/tree/reference/programs.yaml | 19:22 |
| jeblair | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/governance/tree/reference/programs.yaml | 19:22 |
| anteaya | jeblair: thanks | 19:22 |
| fungi | anteaya: that is the list we use. are you saying you believe it to be inaccurate? | 19:22 |
| anteaya | so what would happen if that was used as a reference for atc list generation for voters | 19:23 |
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| anteaya | fungi: no, just wanting to ensure I am using it the correct way | 19:23 |
| fungi | yep | 19:23 |
| anteaya | for instance Barbican is on that list | 19:23 |
| anteaya | but to my knowledge is not an integrated project | 19:23 |
| fungi | when did barbican join a tc-approved program? | 19:23 |
| fungi | right | 19:23 |
| anteaya | that was my question | 19:23 |
| clarkb | git log? | 19:23 |
| mordred | it's incubated | 19:23 |
| mordred | incubated counts for atc | 19:24 |
| anteaya | when did it get incubated? | 19:24 |
| fungi | that is the list official openstack programs use for determining electorate, and the foundation uses to determine who's an active technical contributor for an official project | 19:24 |
| anteaya | I must have missed that | 19:24 |
| fungi | and since it's in code review, anyone who spots an error can propose a fix and let the tc vote to approve the update | 19:24 |
| jeblair | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/77647/ | 19:24 |
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| anteaya | great, so I will use it for electorate generation and evaluation | 19:24 |
| anteaya | March 10 | 19:25 |
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| anteaya | jeblair: thanks | 19:25 |
| anteaya | okay, my question is answered, thank you | 19:25 |
| jeblair | so, looks like it's time to start moving barbican to openstack/ | 19:25 |
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| fungi | sounds like it. maybe climate can settle on a new name asap and we can rename them all at the same shot? | 19:26 |
| clarkb | wait more renaming? | 19:26 |
| jeblair | fungi: i'll add both to the agenda | 19:26 |
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| clarkb | should we add a review thing to new project addtions that includes 'googled project name and function didn't see any relevant hits" | 19:26 |
| zaro | do all incubated projects live in stackforge? | 19:27 |
| jeblair | zaro: no, they live in openstack/ | 19:27 |
| jeblair | zaro: much easier to move them when the move into incubation than when they graduate | 19:27 |
| jeblair | also, they become official projects at that point, so it makes sense | 19:28 |
| pleia2 | pre-incubation they typically are in stackforge | 19:28 |
| ttx | (late remark: the idea behind the off week is that 3 weeks is way too much time between release and summit, so we might as well try to encourage a vacation week in there) | 19:28 |
| jeblair | pleia2: ++ and actually the tc has made that a requirement now | 19:28 |
| pleia2 | jeblair: ah, nice | 19:28 |
| zaro | so what's the logical seperation between incubated and official? is does none exist? | 19:28 |
| jeblair | ttx: we interpreted "vacation" as "upgrade gerrit" :) | 19:28 |
| clarkb | except for me | 19:28 |
| fungi | right, at least when they're still only incubated, there aren't usually cross-dependencies requiring coordinated changes to how we're testing any official projects during the rename | 19:28 |
| anteaya | fungi: the script that runs on the governance/projects.yaml it uses the preferred email from gerrit, yes? | 19:28 |
| * clarkb is going to vacation in hawaii that week | 19:28 | |
| pleia2 | zaro: repo organization-wise, none really | 19:29 |
| anteaya | yay clarkb | 19:29 |
| ttx | jeblair: whatever you like to do as vacation ! | 19:29 |
| jeblair | zaro: incubated is a subset of official (integrated is also a subset of official) | 19:29 |
| fungi | anteaya: yes, we run a database query locally on the gerrit server's backend and then feed that list of addresses and activity into the script | 19:29 |
| * ttx will be in Barcelona | 19:29 | |
| jeblair | zaro: incubated and integrated are disjoint subsets of official | 19:29 |
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| anteaya | fungi: thought so, just wanted to confirm since I will be instructed electorate to confirm the gerrit prefered address in election prep | 19:30 |
| anteaya | s/instructed/instructing | 19:30 |
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| jeblair | #topic Open discussion | 19:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:31 | |
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| jeblair | mordred: have you collapsed yet, or do you want to mention your work on manage-projects? | 19:31 |
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| clarkb | wait I have a thing | 19:32 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fwiw, we hope to finish renaming of savanna to sahara this week, /me will have a bunch of clenups in random repos | 19:32 |
| clarkb | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/51425/ should make our use of pip in puppet much much better | 19:32 |
| clarkb | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/51425/ | 19:32 |
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| clarkb | but it keeps running into rebase hell | 19:32 |
| clarkb | I think the only way that gets merged is if we stop approving other puppet changes. Basically soft freeze before getting that in | 19:33 |
| clarkb | btu I also think getting puppetboard working first would help a lot | 19:33 |
| clarkb | so maybe we should bring this back up when we have puppetboard? | 19:33 |
| pleia2 | sounds good, I'm going through pip hell in fedora so maybe this will fix that | 19:33 |
| anteaya | clarkb: so you are asking for a soft freeze after puppetboard is up, to get the pip patch in? | 19:33 |
| pleia2 | good == getting it in now | 19:33 |
| fungi | clarkb: yes, after puppetboard is running | 19:33 |
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| clarkb | anteaya: yes | 19:33 |
| jeblair | clarkb: yeah, let's do puppetboard first | 19:33 |
| anteaya | soft freeze on puppet changes | 19:33 |
| pleia2 | aw :) | 19:33 |
| clarkb | ok sounds good | 19:34 |
| jeblair | so, puppetboard! is that ready to go? | 19:34 |
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| nibalizer | uh the review is stll alive | 19:34 |
| pleia2 | I saw a review the other day | 19:34 |
| jeblair | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/77928/ | 19:34 |
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| nibalizer | jeblair: last thing i saw was you mentioning that it doesn't pip -U | 19:34 |
| nibalizer | but then you +1'd so im not sure if thats a blocker or not | 19:34 |
| SergeyLukjanov | folks, I'm planning to update my outdated CR that extracts some jobs to pypi-release template (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76322/2/modules/openstack_project/files/zuul/layout.yaml) what do you think about it? | 19:35 |
| jeblair | nibalizer: it's not, because keeping a system up to date with pip is nearly impossible anyway... | 19:35 |
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| jeblair | nibalizer: pip -U would be nice, but we've decided that running from packages is the best way to go | 19:36 |
| fungi | SergeyLukjanov: i'm personally very much in favor of layout.yaml condensing with more templates | 19:36 |
| jeblair | nibalizer: so anyway, i think the change is ok as is; then we should probably look into seeing if we can get pip -U in there, and eventually move to packages (farther in the future) | 19:36 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, I hope that someday we could have template "integrated-project" | 19:37 |
| jeblair | SergeyLukjanov: ++ | 19:37 |
| nibalizer | jeblair: okay, so if someone with root wants to try some dry runs on puppetdb i think that intel will inform if that change can land right now | 19:37 |
| SergeyLukjanov | fungi, jeblair, ok, thx, will do it today/tomorrow | 19:37 |
| nibalizer | jeblair: i could add a weekly exec that activates the virtualenv and pip -U's | 19:37 |
| mordred | jeblair: mostly collapsed - biggest thing to mention is the change that tries puppet via ssh | 19:37 |
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| fungi | jeblair: to your question yesterday about whether i'd tested the puppetboard change, now i remember i commented on ps4 saying i would test it but then mordred piped up in channel and said he was testing puppet changes anyway and would try it out | 19:37 |
| clarkb | mordred: about that, why not salt? I think I missed that | 19:38 |
| nibalizer | i'm also interested in feedback on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/71739/ because moving that forward should help a number of things | 19:38 |
| jeblair | my changes to check and manage irc perms are about to merge, i think. once they do, we should make sure that any new channels defined in any config files also exist in the file that the access bot uses | 19:38 |
| jeblair | that's going to be a manual review criteria check for a while, until we can automate that | 19:38 |
| mordred | clarkb: because the ssh change is pretty easy to grok and is not very complex and gets us to sequencing quickly | 19:38 |
| clarkb | jeblair: noted | 19:38 |
| clarkb | mordred: so does salt if you just do salt cmd 'review*' do thing | 19:39 |
| clarkb | wasn't sure if ssh solved a particular problem that salt didn't | 19:39 |
| jeblair | either way, we're talking about opening root access to all hosts; we probably want to restrict the commands that can be run | 19:40 |
| mordred | clarkb: two things - one is expediency - which is that I could write that patch without going and reading a bunch of salt documentation | 19:40 |
| mordred | jeblair: I was thinking about restricting ip perhaps? root on the puppetmaster automatically gets you root on the other boxes anyway because of puppet, no? | 19:41 |
| nibalizer | mordred: thats correct | 19:41 |
| jeblair | mordred: er, you want to only be able to ssh to hosts from the puppetmaster? | 19:42 |
| mordred | as root | 19:42 |
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| jeblair | mordred: ssh-based ip restriction? | 19:42 |
| mordred | yah | 19:42 |
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| jeblair | mordred: i'm not sure that gets us much; i don't think it's stronger than an rsa key... | 19:44 |
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| mordred | probably not, now you mention | 19:44 |
| jeblair | mordred: i was getting at the fact that it would be nice if puppetmaster could do nothing other than run puppet on the other nodes | 19:44 |
| fungi | i'm looking to see whether authorized_keys can associate source ip address with a specific public key | 19:45 |
| fungi | vague recollection that was a feature | 19:45 |
| jeblair | mordred: sure, it can have puppet do anything | 19:45 |
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| lifeless | ttx: I may be awol today, C is home sick from kindy | 19:45 |
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| jeblair | mordred: but it's at least a bit more auditable, if we get to that point in the future | 19:46 |
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| mordred | jeblair: nod. I'll think on that and come back with ideas | 19:46 |
| ttx | lifeless: OK | 19:47 |
| fungi | from="pattern-list" Specifies that in addition to public key authentication, either the canonical name of the remote host or its IP address must be present in the comma-separated list of patterns. | 19:47 |
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| jeblair | mordred: should be able to add a restricted command to the authorized_keys file | 19:47 |
| fungi | so if we want to lock it down by a combination of ssh public key and source ip address that way, it's possible to do in the authorized_keys list | 19:47 |
| jeblair | fungi: and i guess if it's that easy, we could add that too | 19:47 |
| jeblair | probably wouldn't hurt | 19:47 |
| fungi | jeblair: and we can limit commands there too, yes | 19:47 |
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| fungi | man 8 sshd /AUTHORIZED_KEYS FILE FORMAT | 19:48 |
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| fungi | there's a lot of space juice in there | 19:48 |
| nibalizer | fungi: yes you can do that | 19:48 |
| nibalizer | of course with ip/dns poisioning, it might not mean much | 19:48 |
| jeblair | mordred: so this was pretty much to be our first step toward using salt to do complex orchestration across our hosts | 19:49 |
| jeblair | mordred: if you're ditching that, should we just remove salt everywhere? | 19:49 |
| fungi | nibalizer: right, more useful if we wanted to restrict a certain key to only be usable from a particular address, but i agree it doesn't buy much over just only installing the private key where you need it | 19:50 |
| anteaya | part of my trip to thailand was to reset to focus on salt for Juno, from focusing on neutron for icehouse | 19:50 |
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| anteaya | so I have work to do to get some code up, but that was the direction I wanted to take for juno | 19:50 |
| anteaya | unless I shouldn't | 19:50 |
| * anteaya considers heading back to thailand | 19:51 | |
| jeblair | anteaya: yeah, i'm a little sad because i think there's a lot we could do with salt. but mordred volunteered for this implementation; i'm not sure what else we would use it for if we don't even want to use it for this... | 19:51 |
| mordred | hrm. not sure. I think we could follow this with a patch that replaces the ssh commands with salt commands if we wanted | 19:51 |
| fungi | one of the alternative fixes for the manage-projects race was to parse the replication config and loop retrying to clone each empty project from all the replication targets until they all exist before firing the replication command | 19:52 |
| mordred | which might be easier to grok as a stepping stone - getting actually started with salt actually doing anything has seemed to be a bit of a roadblock | 19:52 |
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| anteaya | it is just that I need some prep work before I could offer anything, meaning we would have to limp along with manual manage-projects for a bit longer | 19:52 |
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| mordred | fungi: I'm not a fan of that personally - I do think we need ordered orchestration here and there are several ways to accomplish that | 19:53 |
| anteaya | yes, I have been part of that roadblock, I kept getting distracted | 19:53 |
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| jeblair | fungi: i'll not that doesn't require a substatial change to our security posture | 19:53 |
| jeblair | note | 19:53 |
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| jeblair | fungi: but it would have to check that before doing _anything_ with gerrit, not just the replication command | 19:54 |
| jeblair | fungi: (since manage-projects actions in gerrit themselves could trigger replication actions) | 19:54 |
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| fungi | mordred: i agree we need some ordered orchestration overall, but if we need a quick fix to manage-projects while we roll out more robust orchestration, that seems preferable to rolling out scripted orchestration | 19:54 |
| mordred | why? | 19:54 |
| mordred | the poll seems like a horrible hack | 19:54 |
| jesusaurus | can i get a link to the ssh patch? i'd be happy to help with salt stuff, but it's not clear to me what you guys want | 19:55 |
| mordred | even worse than the ssh thing | 19:55 |
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| jeblair | s/horrible//: the thing has a dependency, it just checks to see if that dependency is satisfied... | 19:55 |
| fungi | mordred: if you think the ssh thing will also be likely to only stick around until we can implement some more robust orchestration, then i'm fine with it | 19:55 |
| mordred | but it's trying to do it multi-node | 19:55 |
| mordred | sorry - my network is WAY too laggy to particpate well in an actual sensible discussion on this - I feel I'm doing a terrible job | 19:56 |
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| mordred | and coming across curt | 19:56 |
| zaro | here is the etherpad of remaining gerrit upgrade changes: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/remaining-gerrit-upgrade-changes | 19:56 |
| mordred | because of network | 19:56 |
| fungi | just that salt, ansible, et al started out as projects to run a bunch of commands over ssh. they likely contain a lot of learned lessons | 19:56 |
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| anteaya | jesusaurus: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/80976/ | 19:56 |
| mordred | well, ansible did. salt does zeromq | 19:57 |
| clarkb | zaro: you should use the #link directive with that so it shows up in meeting summaries | 19:57 |
| fungi | fair. s/ssh/the network/ | 19:57 |
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| jeblair | mordred: don't worry about it; i think you have some feedback, and we can regroup when you're in a better place... | 19:57 |
| mordred | and I agree- but there is also apparently enough of a learning curve that we'v been stymied by this seemingly simple task for over a yaer | 19:57 |
| jeblair | mordred: no one has worked on it until now | 19:58 |
| mordred | I know | 19:58 |
| clarkb | its only become necessary since the git farm went up | 19:58 |
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| fungi | mordred: i definitely agree that multi-dependency-oriented orchestration of tasks across separate systems in salt seems to be implemented in a way i've so far been unable to completely understand | 19:58 |
| jesusaurus | why does the git farm make this necessary? | 19:58 |
| mordred | every time I think about it I get stymied by learning curve | 19:58 |
| clarkb | jesusaurus: because now we have cross node dependencies | 19:58 |
| mordred | jesusaurus: because we ahve to add replicas before we add projects | 19:58 |
| clarkb | jesusaurus: other than firewall rules which are fairly static we haven't had that much | 19:58 |
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| jesusaurus | gotcha | 19:59 |
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| jeblair | clarkb: and firewall rules work themselves out eventually | 19:59 |
| mordred | jeblair: ++ | 19:59 |
| fungi | this particular issue would be moot if gerrit simply created the remote repositories via ssh if they didn't exist, before pushing commits into them | 19:59 |
| jeblair | anyway, time's up; thanks everyone! | 19:59 |
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| mordred | woot | 19:59 |
| jeblair | #endmeeting | 19:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 19:59:52 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-03-18-19.02.html | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-03-18-19.02.txt | 19:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-03-18-19.02.log.html | 19:59 |
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| ttx | Anyone here for the TC meeting ? | 20:00 |
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| mikal | Yep | 20:00 |
| sdague | o/ | 20:00 |
| markmcclain | o/ | 20:00 |
| SergeyLukjanov | o/ | 20:00 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 20:00 |
| ttx | russellb, markmc, annegentle, mordred, jgriffith, vishy, jeblair : around ? | 20:00 |
| markmc | hey | 20:00 |
| annegentle | ttx: ayup | 20:00 |
| ttx | lifless indicated he may miss it due to sick kid | 20:00 |
| russellb | o/ | 20:00 |
| vishy | o/ | 20:01 |
| jeblair | ttx: o/ | 20:01 |
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| ttx | ok, that's enough of us | 20:01 |
| ttx | #startmeeting tc | 20:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 20:01:18 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 20:01 |
| ttx | Thanks to markmc for chairing last week | 20:01 |
| ttx | Our agenda for today: | 20:01 |
| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Governance/TechnicalCommittee | 20:01 |
| markmc | ttx, np; nothing compares 2 u | 20:01 |
| ttx | We'll probably not complete all of this agenda and overflow to next week | 20:01 |
| ttx | markmc: now I have music on my mind | 20:02 |
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| ttx | nothiiing compares to you | 20:02 |
| * markmc tries to force some tears for the close-up shot | 20:02 | |
| ttx | devananda: around ? | 20:02 |
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| devananda | o/ | 20:02 |
| ttx | #topic Ironic graduation review | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ironic graduation review (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
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| ttx | This one should hopefully be quick, as we unofficially covered it in past discussions | 20:02 |
| ttx | We added a lot of new graduation requirements during this cycle, as well as stronger QA requirements, which is a very good thing | 20:03 |
| ttx | but it also means potentially longer incubation for projects that were incubated before we spelled those new requirements out | 20:03 |
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| ttx | For Ironic I think time ran short to complete new graduation requirements wrt. Nova integration in the Icehouse release | 20:03 |
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| ttx | Which IMHO means Ironic can't be integrated in Juno and will have to wait for K for common release | 20:04 |
| annegentle | ttx: sounds sound | 20:04 |
| ttx | anyone thinks different ? (besides Apple) | 20:04 |
| jgriffith | o/ | 20:04 |
| russellb | apple? | 20:04 |
| jeblair | is there an etherpad worksheet for ironic, like we've had for the reviews of nova, etc? | 20:04 |
| devananda | FWIW, we had planned on doing the QA work after graduation // in Juno, based on discussions at the last summit, so as those req's were written down during the cycle, we were not prepared. | 20:04 |
| ttx | russell_h: Think different. | 20:04 |
| russellb | ah. | 20:05 |
| ttx | russellb: "Think different" | 20:05 |
| dhellmann | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IronicGraduationDiscussion | 20:05 |
| russellb | i don't think the driver was ready for code review until towards the very end anyway | 20:05 |
| markmc | dhellmann, thanks | 20:05 |
| devananda | dhellmann: I havn't updated that ehterpad recently | 20:05 |
| russellb | even without the CI requirement, i think it was cutting it close | 20:05 |
| ttx | devananda: yeah. Frankly, this should not be seen as blame. We raised the bar while you started to jump. | 20:05 |
| mikal | The CI require was also advertised for a long time | 20:05 |
| dhellmann | devananda: noted | 20:05 |
| devananda | without the CI req and the deprecate-nova-bm req, I think we would be very close | 20:06 |
| ttx | and I think raising the bar was a good thing | 20:06 |
| devananda | would probably miss the deployer-documentation requirement too, though we have folks working on that now (and had intended to work on it during FF) | 20:06 |
| annegentle | devananda: good on ya | 20:06 |
| devananda | also fwiw, I agree with the CI req, though I'd like to talk about it at the summit | 20:07 |
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| devananda | asymmetric gating for a whole cycle is going to present a lot of pain for Ironic's development team | 20:07 |
| ttx | devananda: arguably Ironic was made fully functional only recently, and could use a bit more time anyway | 20:07 |
| markmc | ttx, devananda, we also talked last week about being more explicit that new projects should deprecate the old before graduating | 20:07 |
| devananda | ttx: *nod* | 20:07 |
| markmc | (where the new project is being split out from an existing project) | 20:07 |
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| ttx | OK, if everyone agrees, little point in spending more time on this, long agenda | 20:08 |
| devananda | markmc: that means an integrated project must depend on an incubated one, though | 20:08 |
| devananda | markmc: topic for another time :) | 20:08 |
| ttx | #agreed ironic should continue in incubation during the Juno cycle | 20:08 |
| markmc | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-11-20.03.log.html#l-354 | 20:08 |
| ttx | kgriffs: around ? | 20:09 |
| kgriffs | o/ | 20:09 |
| ttx | #topic Marconi graduation review | 20:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Marconi graduation review (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:09 | |
| ttx | kgriffs: Do you have an etherpad with your incubation/graduation requirements answers ? | 20:09 |
| kgriffs | I have a wiki page: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Marconi/Incubation/Graduation | 20:09 |
| ttx | or a wiki | 20:09 |
| markmc | devananda, no, ironic would be integrated in K, iff nova is willing to deprecate nova-bm in K | 20:09 |
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| kgriffs | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Marconi/Incubation/Graduation | 20:09 |
| lifeless | oh this is good timing for me managing to get a timeslice | 20:09 |
| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Marconi/Incubation/Graduation | 20:10 |
| russellb | dhellmann: have you had a chance to review the pecan ML post? | 20:10 |
| lifeless | at the tripleo sprint we were looking at marconi | 20:10 |
| dhellmann | russellb: only briefly | 20:10 |
| russellb | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/030326.html | 20:10 |
| russellb | our requirements state you should use oslo libs where appropriate | 20:10 |
| russellb | so we should clarify what we expect here ... | 20:10 |
| lifeless | and were very confused - rather than an API around existing production queues, it seems to implement its own message queue backed by mysql... | 20:10 |
| kgriffs | lifeless: that was clarified in the incubation meeting. I didn't realize there was still some confusion on that point. | 20:11 |
| lifeless | which raises a large set of scaling and performance questions when comparing it to e.g. kestrel | 20:11 |
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| dhellmann | russellb: based on an initial skim, and my observations over the course of this cycle, I'm completely unsurprised by the conclusions | 20:11 |
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| zehicle | o/ (sorry I was late) | 20:12 |
| ttx | russell_h: link to pecan analysis ? | 20:12 |
| ttx | zehicle: o/ | 20:12 |
| russellb | ttx: #linked above | 20:12 |
| ttx | damn | 20:12 |
| russellb | ttx: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/030326.html | 20:12 |
| ttx | taht other russellTAB is going to kill me | 20:12 |
| dhellmann | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Marconi/pecan-evaluation | 20:13 |
| russellb | dhellmann: thoughts on whether we should allow divergence like this? | 20:13 |
| markmcclain | the write up seemed very slanted and the graphs are meaningless with code | 20:13 |
| russellb | 708274 | 20:13 |
| markmcclain | s/with/without/ | 20:13 |
| dhellmann | russellb: no other team has objected so strenuously to using the same toolkit as the rest of us, so I do have concerns about why marconi is setting themselves up as different | 20:13 |
| adrian_otto | a divergence should be considered if there is a good technical reason for it. Expectation for control plane APIs shoudl be different for those of data plane APIs. | 20:13 |
| russellb | agree | 20:13 |
| kgriffs | markmcclain: FWIW, I have tried very hard to stay out of the evaluation since I know I am biased. We can provide code very easily | 20:13 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: I wasn't on the TC when that meeting happened | 20:14 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: so sure, a previous committee was happy | 20:14 |
| ryanpetrello | I believe the code in question is https://github.com/balajiiyer/marconi/commits/Pecan ? | 20:14 |
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| kgriffs | lifeless: ah, sure. I am happy to discuss your concerns. | 20:14 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: however I'm very worried | 20:14 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I guess the question is more, is there anything Falcon does that can't be obtained by improving Pecan ? Like awesome performance | 20:15 |
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| russellb | and we discussed this during incubation right? that it should at least be evaluated | 20:15 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: in particular the concerns about divergent stack being raised right now | 20:15 |
| russellb | though an evaluation was posted on graduation review day, heh | 20:15 |
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| russellb | hard to have time to really digest and respond to it | 20:15 |
| lifeless | are a side effect of marconio being a queueing implementation rather than an API for queueing implementations | 20:15 |
| dhellmann | ttx: some of the performance differences are explained by the fact that pecan relies on webob, which handles cases that falcon's request parser just doesn't handle | 20:15 |
| sdague | yeh, the fact that it was posted today is kind of a red flag. That really should have been at least a month before. | 20:15 |
| russellb | sdague: yes | 20:16 |
| kgriffs | russellb: apologies, balaji has been working on it for a while, actually, but he has been swamped. | 20:16 |
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| russellb | so i'm basically -1 because we don't have time to have a proper discussion about this | 20:16 |
| dhellmann | russellb: yeah, although I was more interested in community effects than arbitrary performance numbers | 20:16 |
| ttx | Is the Pecan vs. Falcon question the only gap, or are there other areas that are borderline ? | 20:16 |
| mordred | ttx: see lifeless question above | 20:16 |
| sdague | regardless of the falcom / pecan issues, my concern is this is the extend of gate testing - http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/tempest/tree/tempest/api/queuing/test_queues.py | 20:16 |
| sdague | which isn't yet voting | 20:16 |
| kgriffs | dhellmann: was the original Pecan eval you did documented somewhere? | 20:17 |
| russellb | sdague: no voting functional testing? | 20:17 |
| lifeless | because - as it stands, I would have voted -1 on marconi's incubation | 20:17 |
| kgriffs | sdague: that's a good point. We definitely need more tests there. | 20:17 |
| ttx | mordred: sheall we defer this to next week so that (1) lifless has time to raise his remarks on the ML and (2) we get time to discuss the Pecan vs. Falcon report ? | 20:17 |
| mordred | sdague: that is more vexing to me than anything else | 20:17 |
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| sdague | russellb: not last time I checked | 20:17 |
| dhellmann | kgriffs: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/havana-common-wsgi | 20:17 |
| mordred | ttx: what sdague just raised is WAY more worrying | 20:17 |
| sdague | it was in progress the last couple of weeks | 20:17 |
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| ttx | mordred: indeed | 20:18 |
| kgriffs | dhellmann: thanks! | 20:18 |
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| jeblair | i think the consistency around pecan is very important; as we've grown, we're hearing demands for consistency and standardization in our dependencies and architectures more | 20:18 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: the evaluation of the technical question has raised some questions for me about an "us vs. them" attitude I observed early in the release cycle, which makes me concerned that we will have constant fights with this team over using common tools | 20:18 |
| malini | sdague: the tests are an ongoing thing. I raised the coverage question in #openstack-qa & my understanding from the responses was this is adequeate. We have detailed coverage in the functional test suite & will add the same level of coverage in tempest as well | 20:18 |
| sdague | we're having lots of projects without solid testing in the gate causing all kinds of issues in making an openstack whole | 20:18 |
| sdague | malini: having it in a different test suite doesn't count | 20:18 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: +1 | 20:19 |
| kgriffs | dhellmann: "common tools" is a blanket statement. Are there other tools specifically that you have seen friction with? | 20:19 |
| sdague | malini: I'm sorry that you got the wrong impression there | 20:19 |
| lifeless | malini: do you have stress tests (e.g. thousands of tenants, millions of queues?) | 20:19 |
| ttx | sdague, dhellmann: so adding a week won't change your opinion on it ? | 20:19 |
| jeblair | i think the pecan/falcon report is a good place to start a discussion about whether openstack should move to falcon, but i think it would have to be _really_ compelling to be an argument that marconi should diverge | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | kgriffs: we do have some teams that have rejected python 3 patches, packaging changes, etc. | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | ttx: no | 20:19 |
| malini | lifeless: We have done stress tests using tsung | 20:19 |
| markmc | jeblair, dhellmann, on the web framework consistency, we have to admit the project as a whole has been slow to standardize here | 20:19 |
| ttx | jeblair: +1 | 20:19 |
| sdague | ttx: no | 20:19 |
| markmc | jeblair, dhellmann, not completely excusing it, but ... | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | markmc: the implementation was always meant to be slow, there is no point rebuilding without having a reason to bump the api version | 20:20 |
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| dhellmann | otoh, the investigation and learning has been picking up -- every integrated project has talked to us, iirc | 20:20 |
| markmc | dhellmann, yep, definitely picked up since you started pushing it | 20:20 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: what's your strategy for folk that want @scale marconi? Do they need to reimplement the API (which would be coutner to everything we're trying to achieve...) ? Is there an API vs implementation split in the code? | 20:21 |
| markmc | dhellmann, picked up from near zero, is my point | 20:21 |
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| dhellmann | and so far, every single other team has just said "ok, we'll do that" without argument | 20:21 |
| markmc | dhellmann, yeah, fair | 20:21 |
| kgriffs | lifeless: we can chat about scale, but Marconi actually scales and performs quite well already. | 20:21 |
| ttx | So how about... kgriffs posts a governance patch to switch Marconi to integrated. Lifeless starts a thread on the base concepts. We discuss Falcon vs. Pecan on the ML, and it all ties back into our votes on that proposed patch | 20:21 |
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| ttx | because it will require a vote, I think | 20:22 |
| jeblair | ttx: seems fair | 20:22 |
| mordred | ++ | 20:22 |
| * dhellmann nods | 20:22 | |
| kgriffs | lifeless: like I said, I would be happy to discuss in detail | 20:22 |
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| ttx | and to vote we need the governance patch | 20:22 |
| markmc | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Marconi/Incubation | 20:22 |
| ttx | then next week we can make the final call on it | 20:22 |
| markmc | (for reference) | 20:22 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: per ttx I will raise my concerns and hesitations on the mailing lit and we can deep dive there. | 20:22 |
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| kgriffs | kk | 20:23 |
| lifeless | kgriffs: but for instance, how does it compare to kestrel | 20:23 |
| ttx | kgriffs: ping me if you need help drafting the governance patch | 20:23 |
| kgriffs | ttx: will do | 20:23 |
| ttx | that's where final voting will happen | 20:23 |
| ttx | and while it runs, we can have the complementary discussions about Falcon or the whole concept of doing queue on top of mysql | 20:24 |
| ttx | #action kgriffs to post a governance patch to switch Marconi to integrated | 20:24 |
| ttx | #action lifeless to start a thread on the base concepts | 20:24 |
| ttx | #action TC to analyze and comment on Falcon vs. Pecan report | 20:24 |
| ttx | #agreed final decision at meeting next week | 20:25 |
| ttx | #topic Integrated projects and new requirements: Neutron | 20:25 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Integrated projects and new requirements: Neutron (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:25 | |
| ttx | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IcehouseProjectReviewNeutron | 20:25 |
| russellb | so, i was supposed to start a thread off of this, and i didn't. sorry. | 20:25 |
| ttx | I read the log from last week, and I think we need to clarify something | 20:25 |
| ttx | The review of currently-integrated projects vs. new requirements is *not* about discussing de-integrating some projects | 20:26 |
| ttx | It's about having a clear gap analysis and an agreed plan and deadlines to cover that gap | 20:26 |
| russellb | agree | 20:26 |
| ttx | Now, *if* that plan and deadlines are not met (or we can't agree on a plan), we'll discuss de-integration, but that's not an immediate topic | 20:26 |
| markmc | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-11-20.03.log.html#l-313 | 20:26 |
| ttx | So the question we are asking ourselves today is not "would we accept Neutron today" | 20:26 |
| annegentle | ttx: good to set | 20:26 |
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| ttx | It's "what is the gap between the current state and our current expectations, and what is the plan to address it ASAP" | 20:26 |
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| ttx | So we the TC should produce a clear gap analysis, markmcclain as PTL should answer with a plan to address it, and we the TC should bless that plan and the deadlines in it | 20:26 |
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| markmcclain | so here's the gap analysis that I've been tracking | 20:27 |
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| markmcclain | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/neutron-nova-parity | 20:27 |
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| ttx | I noted down 3 areas | 20:27 |
| ttx | 1. nova-net feature parity (including easier setup of basic networking) | 20:27 |
| ttx | 2. Migration plan from nova-net | 20:27 |
| ttx | 3. Functional tests coverage | 20:27 |
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| * ttx checks markmcclain etherpad | 20:27 | |
| sdague | markmcclain: good list | 20:28 |
| russellb | performance/reliability parity is another ... largely just part of #1 and #3 | 20:28 |
| russellb | but is a specific concern area that must be addressed before folks are comfortable with the deprecation | 20:28 |
| sdague | I think it should be explicit that #3 definitely depends on #1 and #2 completing | 20:28 |
| russellb | but yeah, it's a good list | 20:28 |
| ttx | russellb: yeah, nova-net feature/perf parity | 20:28 |
| markmc | markmcclain, awesome list of tempest additions | 20:28 |
| russellb | i agree that the list covers it from my perspective | 20:29 |
| markmcclain | markmc: mlavelle really help spearhead that work | 20:29 |
| ttx | markmcclain: is performance somewhere in your etherpad ? | 20:29 |
| markmcclain | I'll clarify it #8 | 20:29 |
| mordred | I'm number 5! | 20:29 |
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| jeblair | mordred: you're a network! | 20:30 |
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| mordred | markmcclain: if you call that api verb mordred, I'll vote for nova-network deprecation right now (also, great list) | 20:31 |
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| markmcclain | mordred: haha | 20:31 |
| lifeless | is 5 really a thing nova network has ? | 20:31 |
| ttx | markmcclain: so that's the gap analysis. Do you have a plan to tackle it yet ? Something that would show per-dev-milestone progress ? | 20:31 |
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| lifeless | I'd like to see a poionter to the nova network docs that match it, so we can see waht needs to be done to meet it | 20:31 |
| dhellmann | lifeless: good question | 20:31 |
| ttx | I think what we missed in the past is a plan more precise than "we'll fix it by next release" | 20:31 |
| lifeless | because really, its two API calls to geet neutron up and active with a new network - one for the network, one for the subnet, done. | 20:32 |
| russellb | and is Juno release a reasonable deadline? | 20:32 |
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| dhellmann | markmcclain: is this list in order by priority or dependencies or something else? | 20:32 |
| lifeless | and I've seen deployrs fight for weeks getting nova-network configured properly... :) | 20:32 |
| markmcclain | lifeless also the router and rtr interface plugging | 20:32 |
| ttx | lifeless: My original understanding of that requirement is to match the "simplicity" of Nova-net, but I agree it got a lot more specific now | 20:33 |
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| mordred | lifeless: for deployer or for tenant? | 20:33 |
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| markmcclain | ttx: yes so the last 4 items I want to have concrete blueprints for in Juno | 20:33 |
| mordred | lifeless: because having gotten a tenant with no working network, I can tell you it was not 2 api calls to get a working network | 20:33 |
| lifeless | mordred: deployers. nvoa-network doesn't have per-tenant self defined networks. | 20:33 |
| markmcclain | #3 we can define good bugs to track | 20:33 |
| mordred | lifeless: right - nova-network just had a network that worked because the option of a non-working one wasn't present | 20:34 |
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| ttx | markmcclain: Ideally you would discuss the whole plan with your core team. it needs to be a group commitment, not just you | 20:34 |
| mordred | so I think there is an end-user experience parity thing here | 20:34 |
| markmcclain | dhellmann: that is the general order of priority | 20:34 |
| lifeless | mordred: and neutron can do that too. You may have a deployer that made poor choices, which is a docs issue. | 20:34 |
| markmcclain | mordred: exactly | 20:34 |
| ttx | markmcclain: So we can let you refine the deadlines and milestone targets and conclude this next week | 20:34 |
| lifeless | mordred: e.g. 'clouds should provide a default all-tenants network' | 20:34 |
| annegentle | lifeless: interesting, who is accountable for the docs issue on a core project? (she asks hypothetically) | 20:35 |
| ttx | markmcclain: unless you already have theit commitment behind the plan you have in mind | 20:35 |
| markmcclain | ttx: that works | 20:35 |
| lifeless | annegentle: I dunno :) | 20:35 |
| mordred | annegentle: you!!! ;) | 20:35 |
| annegentle | or the core team | 20:35 |
| ttx | #info neutron integration gap analysis posted at https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/neutron-nova-parity | 20:35 |
| lifeless | annegentle: btw I don't mean that the docs team failed here, I mean that the issue may not be one of design or code | 20:35 |
| annegentle | lifeless: yep, agreed, just pointing out it's difficult to fix issues without known owners | 20:36 |
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| ttx | #action markmcclain to come up with precise and per-milestone plan to address gap analysis, get core support behind it and present at next meeting | 20:36 |
| lifeless | annegentle: agreed. I want the issue to be more precise first too | 20:36 |
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| lifeless | annegentle: right now I can't tell what problem mordred had, that he wants fixed, nor whether it is parity with nova-network, or polish on a new feature nova-network doesn't have | 20:37 |
| mordred | lifeless: I'd naively argue that we might e talking about defaults and not docs | 20:37 |
| ttx | markmcclain: you could even propose it as a resolution, so that we vote on it and have some official record of that commitment | 20:37 |
| markmcclain | ttx: sure I'll post one | 20:37 |
| lifeless | mordred: my suspicion is that a public cloud deployed a cloud with no default network, which IMO is really bad news. | 20:37 |
| lifeless | mordred: and that you got bitten bu this. | 20:37 |
| mordred | lifeless: this is correct | 20:37 |
| lifeless | s/bu/by/ | 20:37 |
| mordred | lifeless: my experience as an opensatck user was poor | 20:37 |
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| ttx | OK, let's move on to next topic | 20:38 |
| lifeless | mordred: I don't believe this is a nova-network parity issue, its a deployer that *didn't follow the guidelines* | 20:38 |
| mordred | lifeless: so I expressed that I'd like a way to say "hey man, give me a default working network" | 20:38 |
| ttx | lifeless: you can discuss mordred-network off-meeting :) | 20:38 |
| lifeless | ttx: well, its part of the parity list | 20:38 |
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| lifeless | ttx: so its on topic | 20:38 |
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| ttx | lifeless: fair enough | 20:38 |
| mordred | lifeless: guidelines are guidelines - they're not a thing that can be counted on | 20:38 |
| lifeless | ttx: can you add an action item that that point needs to be precise, and cover the actual gap, not issues with new features | 20:39 |
| mordred | and if we're wanting to say that we want experiences across openstack clouds to be consistent | 20:39 |
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| lifeless | ttx: its entirely possible - and easy - for deployres to deploy noeutron so that it behaves just like nova-network for users. | 20:39 |
| markmc | lifeless, you could add a comment to that effect in the etherpad | 20:39 |
| mordred | then there needes to be at least a consistent way for me to get into a working state | 20:39 |
| mordred | imho | 20:39 |
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| lifeless | mordred: I accept your point, but don't see it as a gap. new feature, new proboems. Don't use the new feature (per tenant networks)... | 20:40 |
| lifeless | markmc: ading. | 20:40 |
| mordred | which is either a default beahvior a depoloyer would ned to actively go out of their way to break - or an api call I can exercise | 20:40 |
| ttx | #action mordred to precise what is behind the mordred-network line in the gap analysis | 20:40 |
| mordred | lifeless: as a user, I cannot choose to not use per-tenant networks | 20:40 |
| ttx | yes, that can devolve into a ML thread to make progress before next week | 20:40 |
| mordred | kk | 20:40 |
| ttx | #topic Draft bylaws change from Defcore | 20:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Draft bylaws change from Defcore (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:40 | |
| ttx | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-tc/2014-March/000566.html | 20:40 |
| ttx | There were two things I wanted to discuss from that thread... | 20:41 |
| ttx | (1) The proposed bylaws change | 20:41 |
| markmc | I'm not sure the draft change itself is worth discussing that much | 20:41 |
| ttx | My understanding (confirmed with Mark's second email) is that their intent is to clarify how the TC can add new projects allowed to call themselves "OpenStack" something | 20:41 |
| ttx | Yes, my reading is that this bylaws change just creates a process for us to clarify things, and doesn't reduce or impede on our authority | 20:41 |
| markmc | the intent is to change the wording of "the TC proposes new projects to Core and the board approves" | 20:41 |
| ttx | Arguably it even increases it, since in the current authority split the BoD fully owns the trademark side | 20:41 |
| zehicle | I may be able to help clarify (but I was not in the meeting, so they may have altered course) | 20:41 |
| markmc | to something which doesn't mention "Core" | 20:41 |
| markmc | but not in any way affecting how we decide what goes in the integrated release | 20:42 |
| russellb | ok, that makes sense | 20:42 |
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| ttx | zehicle: I think if anyone has concerns they can voice it on that -tc thread | 20:42 |
| ttx | I think that point is pretty ok | 20:42 |
| ttx | (2) The snark and the angst at our response | 20:42 |
| markmc | yes | 20:42 |
| ttx | Leaving the snarkiness aside, I think I understand their frustration. From their point of view: | 20:42 |
| * jgriffith ties his hands behind his back | 20:42 | |
| ttx | The BoD needs a technical information ("designated sections") to go forward with designing trademark rules | 20:42 |
| ttx | The PTLs are definitely their main points of contact for that information | 20:42 |
| ttx | The TC is looped in as a convenient mechanism to gather that technical information | 20:43 |
| ttx | Then the TC answers that the whole idea doesn't seem to be the best way to achieve our common goals, and we should focus our efforts on something else | 20:43 |
| ttx | So obviously they don't like our answer. | 20:43 |
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| ttx | Now, IMHO we can't prevent them from going forward with the process they defined, since that's fully under the BoD responsibility | 20:43 |
| markmc | agree, but it also appears we went off the deep-end interpreting what was required for "designated sections" | 20:43 |
| markmc | due to lack of clarification, but also us being geeks I guess | 20:43 |
| ttx | I think our official answer (that we don't think it's the best way to achieve our goals) is good enough to make the point that we don't really like it | 20:43 |
| markmc | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-designated-sections | 20:43 |
| mordred | markmc: ++ | 20:43 |
| ttx | At this point I'm fine with them going to each PTL to get the technical answer they need to go forward | 20:44 |
| jgriffith | I'm still very unclear on what the goal is and nobody has answered that IMO | 20:44 |
| dhellmann | my main concern, which wasn't reflected fully in the response, was what form that "designation" has to take -- because IANAL, and I don't know what is "sufficient" for this purpose | 20:44 |
| markmc | that makes it very clear it's very, very high level info needed | 20:44 |
| mikal | Frankly, I can't see what Josh hopes to achieve by grandstanding the way he did | 20:44 |
| ttx | But maybe that's just me -- not caring enough about trademarks and happy to leave that completely to the BoD | 20:44 |
| mordred | mikal: let's ignore the snark for a second - fun as it is | 20:44 |
| zehicle | I'm working on a draft that may help - will vet it w/ mikal | 20:44 |
| annegentle | mordred: that's not even fun snark or clever, it's mean | 20:44 |
| markmc | dhellmann, this is the form they have in mind: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-designated-sections | 20:44 |
| ttx | mikal: we won't change josh | 20:44 |
| mikal | mordred: you didn't sit through 2.5 hours of it | 20:45 |
| markwash | jgriffith: I agree about being unclear, but I felt like once the "frustration" was being left aside there were actually some decent explanations given in the discussion in the defcore meeting | 20:45 |
| dhellmann | markmc: the lack of detail leaves a lot of room for interpretation | 20:45 |
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| jgriffith | markwash: yes and no.. but I can seek clarity later | 20:45 |
| ttx | zehicle: did I describe the frustration accurately ? | 20:45 |
| mordred | I agree with markwash - I think the follow up explanations ahve made it clear what was being asked for | 20:45 |
| sdague | dhellmann: I think that's intentional. Because this is going to be somewhat honor bound | 20:45 |
| markwash | I think what defcore needs to understand is that you guys aren't trying to do their job for them, we just need to better understand their job in order to translate it into actual designations | 20:45 |
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| russellb | it's hard to give a technical answer to a question when you're not sure if you fundamentally agree with what's being asked ... | 20:46 |
| markwash | because us being geeks, the specific intent seems to matter a lot | 20:46 |
| dhellmann | if they don't care about line numbers in files, then it seems perfectly reasonable to say "you may provide an entry point with this API" or "you may respond to RPC calls with this API" and be detailed about it | 20:46 |
| mordred | clearer | 20:46 |
| jgriffith | russellb: +1 | 20:46 |
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| markmc | dhellmann, the current requirement is open to even more interpretation | 20:46 |
| mikal | I think part of the problem is that defcore hasn't really made an effort to explain to the TC what they want / need | 20:46 |
| russellb | it's hard to even take this etherpad seriously with snark in it | 20:47 |
| markmc | dhellmann, we're not really being asked (as a body) for our input on the trademark policy | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | markmc: sure, but I thought we were trying to fix that | 20:47 |
| mikal | So we guessed, and they didn't like our guess | 20:47 |
| dhellmann | markmc: so we shouldn't have an opinion? | 20:47 |
| zehicle | mikal, we did offer to have an interactive meeting to discuss this | 20:47 |
| ttx | anyone thinks the TC (and not the PTLs) should be the point of contact to get that information ? | 20:47 |
| markmc | dhellmann, for something like this, I think we as individuals should have opinions | 20:47 |
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| jeblair | ttx: i think consistency is warranted here... | 20:47 |
| russellb | jeblair: +1 | 20:47 |
| markwash | As a PTL, i consider the TC to both represent and guide me | 20:47 |
| mikal | jeblair: certainly long term consistency, a PTL election shouldn't change radically what a vendor can do | 20:48 |
| ttx | jeblair: listening to Josh, he doesn't seem to be after consistency | 20:48 |
| markmc | dhellmann, e.g. Josh individually has opinions on how we run the project, but we wouldn't be so keen on the BoD having such opinions | 20:48 |
| jeblair | ttx: so while i agree that the ptls are an excellent resource for this info, i worry that if we abdicate, we'll get completely different responses | 20:48 |
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| dhellmann | markmc: as an engineer, I find it difficult to help guide "requirements gathering" when it seems like it is off course | 20:48 |
| zehicle | just like you Josh is just one person in the DefCore meeting - we have discussions. discussoin != result | 20:48 |
| markmc | dhellmann, yeah | 20:48 |
| annegentle | I think we're all a little cagey about the definitions -- originally I see this as a documentation/communication task, a list of each project and what each "cares" about (which may have to be PTL drafted?) | 20:48 |
| annegentle | see/saw | 20:48 |
| annegentle | heh | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | to *not* guide | 20:48 |
| mikal | jeblair: I don't think its abdication? I think Josh intends to just route around us. | 20:48 |
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| ttx | mikal: he may be disappointed. The PTLs and the TC are pretty close :) | 20:49 |
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| mikal | zehicle: it was an extremely negative first interaction where no one else in the room reigned it in though. | 20:49 |
| mikal | But I should stop talking about the snark | 20:49 |
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| mordred | honestly, I think that discussions of what someone who is not here may or may not be thinking are inappropriate | 20:49 |
| annegentle | mikal: it can certainly feel that way with Josh and as your first interaction you were rightfully shocked | 20:49 |
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| mikal | The reason I keep mentioning the snark is that I think what the TC needs to do is better understand what defcore wants / needs, and they chose to use the time to bitch instead | 20:50 |
| jgriffith | let's move along shall we? | 20:50 |
| jeblair | my primary concern is that we're develping open source software; that software has a name: openstack, and i think the trademark should reflect that. i'm not sure why there should be any sections designated as replacable | 20:50 |
| markwash | opinions aside, I just really think the lack of clarity about what defcores specific goals are blocks selecting designated sections | 20:50 |
| ttx | ack, let's move along | 20:50 |
| zehicle | mikal, thanks. | 20:50 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: +1 | 20:50 |
| russellb | jeblair: +100 | 20:50 |
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| dhellmann | jeblair: otoh, drivers | 20:50 |
| jgriffith | jeblair: I'd kinda agree with that, I added my thoughts to the etherpad | 20:50 |
| jgriffith | The only thing in Cinder that should be swappable are the drivers | 20:51 |
| ttx | jeblair: I think the fact that we define what the "openstack project" is made of (see proposed bylaws change) ensures that what we develop is still called openstack | 20:51 |
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| sdague | to play devil's advocate: do all the clouds we think of as openstack implement the nova scheduler as is? | 20:51 |
| jgriffith | The rest is not designed to be "interchangeable" so to speak | 20:51 |
| russellb | but even with drivers, once something is out of tree, consistency is (potentially) completely shot | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | markwash: right, I think that has been clarified sufficiently that we could give an answer now | 20:51 |
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| markwash | dhellmann: sorry, I must have missed the docs of that | 20:51 |
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| russellb | replaceable? sure. what we (openstack) built? no. | 20:51 |
| jgriffith | russellb: that's true but then it's a functionality issue IMO | 20:51 |
| sdague | zehicle: you had some early test results right? | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | markwash: oh, based on the etherpad linked above | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | markwash: with examples | 20:51 |
| russellb | jgriffith: which is of course why our response was to prioritize functionality to start with | 20:52 |
| russellb | instead of rat holing on this | 20:52 |
| ttx | jeblair: but I'm fine with PTLs answering that "all of it" is designated sections. I just don't want the TC to mandate that they do | 20:52 |
| dhellmann | markwash: I would still prefer more detail, but this is a reasonable starting place | 20:52 |
| sdague | that might be useful to understand the realities of how different different providers are | 20:52 |
| zehicle | sdague, we have some initial scoring of capabliities. | 20:52 |
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| sdague | zehicle: is that sharable data? | 20:52 |
| mikal | I think I have a problem with PTLs at the end of their elected cycle deciding this | 20:52 |
| jgriffith | mikal: ha! | 20:52 |
| mikal | I think the newly elected PTLs at the least should be consulted | 20:53 |
| zehicle | #link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Av62KoL8f9kAdFo4V1ZLUFM0OHlrRnFpQUkxSHJ5QWc&usp=drive_web#gid=6 | 20:53 |
| russellb | mikal: i don't think any ptl ever should decide it alone | 20:53 |
| jgriffith | mikal: you think those of us on the way out are suddenly going to sabotage something? | 20:53 |
| russellb | and should always consult broader group on controversial issues | 20:53 |
| dhellmann | mikal: I think that was why the TC was being asked | 20:53 |
| dhellmann | what russellb said | 20:53 |
| russellb | so i don't htink the cycle should really be a concern | 20:53 |
| markwash | sabotage +1 :-D | 20:53 |
| ttx | zehicle: what's the timing behind this ? Can it wait for newly-elected PTLs ? (April 10) | 20:53 |
| zehicle | my recommendation is that you agree on some general principles that can be used to drive selecton | 20:53 |
| mikal | What I worry about is long term trajectory | 20:53 |
| jeblair | ttx: so maybe we should ask the ptls, and make our response from that | 20:53 |
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| annegentle | We already got away from an all-PTL TC | 20:53 |
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| sdague | zhhuabj: ok, but that's not showing it against some clouds? that's just test suite analysis | 20:53 |
| jeblair | ttx: we can get the best information that way, and make sure it makes sense as a whole | 20:53 |
| mikal | I don't want a PTL to decide on a plan "everything shall be designated!" and then a new PTL to change it | 20:53 |
| jgriffith | jeblair: that seems reasonable | 20:54 |
| jgriffith | I think we may be making this harder than it need be again | 20:54 |
| zehicle | ttx, yes | 20:54 |
| markwash | dhellmann: ah, I was familiar with that etherpad, it is illustrative but too broad of a stroke in some cases to be useful | 20:54 |
| jgriffith | I'd say clarify the goal | 20:54 |
| ttx | jeblair: we should definitely be engaging with PTLs rather than discuss it just here | 20:54 |
| jgriffith | PTL's bring recommendations/thoughts to TC and we move forward | 20:54 |
| zehicle | ttx, I was hoping that you'd discuss the pricples for selection ( I added a strawman to that wiki page) | 20:54 |
| ttx | OK, to move forward i'll metion it in the PTLs / release / prject meetin gnext | 20:55 |
| jlibosva | markmcclain: hi, sorry about the delay, can we discuss https://review.openstack.org/#/c/75924/ now? | 20:55 |
| russellb | i think we're going to waste so much time debating this, sigh | 20:55 |
| ttx | zehicle: damn, missed the addition | 20:55 |
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| zehicle | question: do you want a response from DefCore? | 20:55 |
| lifeless | o my concern on PTLs | 20:55 |
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| lifeless | is that PTLs are arbitrators, not dictators | 20:56 |
| zehicle | or should have have an interactive meeting first? It looks like the TC is making progress | 20:56 |
| ttx | russellb: yes, I'd rather just ignore the whole thing | 20:56 |
| markmc | zehicle, a clarification, in prose, with examples and rationale of what DefCore is looking for would be great | 20:56 |
| dhellmann | lifeless: as a PTL, I would ask my team, and be the point of contact for this question | 20:56 |
| lifeless | which ties into mikals concern | 20:56 |
| jgriffith | markmc: yes please! | 20:56 |
| ttx | zehicle: we'll loop PTLs in that discussion | 20:56 |
| jeblair | markmc: ++ | 20:56 |
| russellb | ttx: well i feel like our response and offer to collaborate on a particular area first was very reasonable, a response to that would be great | 20:56 |
| zehicle | markmc, I'd like to do that in collaboration with some TC representatives. | 20:56 |
| russellb | zehicle: ^ | 20:56 |
| ttx | and continue this next week... | 20:56 |
| zehicle | That was the idea of an interactive meeting | 20:56 |
| markmc | zehicle, is this not "interactive" ? | 20:57 |
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| zehicle | sorry, yes | 20:57 |
| ttx | zehicle: so yes, an answer to our answer would be cool. At this point I heard "no thanks, please designate sections" | 20:57 |
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| zehicle | voice enabled with eitherpad | 20:57 |
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| ttx | zehicle: but maybe it could be more subtle | 20:57 |
| dhellmann | I read better than I listen, so either way I would VERY MUCH appreciate having more detailed examples of what a description of designated sections might look like, if this etherpad is not entirely sufficient as a response. | 20:58 |
| ttx | need to move on | 20:58 |
| ttx | 2 min left | 20:58 |
| russellb | how about an etherpad without ridiculous snark, too | 20:58 |
| zehicle | the DefCore committee came up with 3 alternatives - I was out last week so did not get a chance to review w/ the DefCore/TC appointees | 20:58 |
| russellb | completely not productive | 20:58 |
| zehicle | russellb, I'm trying... | 20:58 |
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| dhellmann | zehicle: could you post a link to those alternatives? I must have missed them #emailoverload | 20:59 |
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| mikal | zehicle: I would be happy to take a look at a draft defcore response and provide feedback, although asking a few other TC people for feedback would be a good idea as well | 20:59 |
| zehicle | I have not circulated yet - wanted to get byin from my cochair before blasting them | 20:59 |
| dhellmann | zehicle: ok | 20:59 |
| zehicle | mikal, adding you and annegentle to the doc | 20:59 |
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| ttx | zehicle: ok, post it when ready | 20:59 |
| annegentle | zehicle: sounds good | 20:59 |
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| * ttx moves on for last minute mentions | 20:59 | |
| ttx | #topic Other governance changes | 20:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Other governance changes (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:59 | |
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| ttx | * Graduate Sahara (ex. Savanna) project (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79766/) | 21:00 |
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| ttx | * Add Networking Program mission (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/79744/) | 21:00 |
| ttx | Shara will be formally approved when it reaches the threashold | 21:00 |
| ttx | damn | 21:00 |
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| ttx | typing too fast | 21:00 |
| jeblair | renamed again! | 21:00 |
| annegentle | jeblair: hee | 21:00 |
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| ttx | Networking program mission will be approved unless someone complains | 21:00 |
| ttx | that's all for this week | 21:01 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 21:01:04 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-18-20.01.html | 21:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-18-20.01.txt | 21:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2014/tc.2014-03-18-20.01.log.html | 21:01 |
| * dhellmann shall return for the project meeting shortly | 21:01 | |
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| SergeyLukjanov | jeblair, no, please, not one more renaming... | 21:01 |
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| ttx | dhellmann, dolphm, notmyname, jd__, markwash, jgriffith, russellb, stevebaker, david-lyle, markmcclain, hub_cap: around ? | 21:02 |
| markmcclain | o/ | 21:02 |
| notmyname | here | 21:02 |
| stevebaker | \o | 21:03 |
| markwash | hi | 21:03 |
| david-lyle | o/ | 21:03 |
| hub_cap | howdy | 21:03 |
| dolphm | o/ | 21:03 |
| jgriffith | hi | 21:03 |
| russellb | o/ | 21:03 |
| ttx | #startmeeting project | 21:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 21:03:28 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'project' | 21:03 |
| SergeyLukjanov | щ/ | 21:03 |
| SergeyLukjanov | :) it was o/ | 21:03 |
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| annegentle | SergeyLukjanov: cool trick :) | 21:04 |
| devananda | o/ | 21:04 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | annegentle, it's the russian letter on the same button with 'o' :) | 21:04 |
| ttx | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/ProjectMeeting | 21:05 |
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| ttx | #topic Current Feature freeze exceptions: status review | 21:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Current Feature freeze exceptions: status review (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:05 | |
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| ttx | We have just a few FFEs still running at this point: | 21:05 |
| ttx | * cinder/prophetstor-dpl-driver | 21:05 |
| ttx | This one is likely to be deferred at Cinder meeting tomorrow, unless it's ready to go in AND core people there want that new driver in Icehouse | 21:05 |
| ttx | * neutron/ml2-deprecated-plugin-migration | 21:05 |
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| ttx | This one is a migration script that improves the Neutron Icehouse story | 21:06 |
| ttx | Pending https://review.openstack.org/#/c/76533/, needs to be in before EOW | 21:06 |
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| ttx | * nova/smarter-network-cache-update | 21:06 |
| russellb | deferred | 21:06 |
| ttx | OK cool | 21:06 |
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| ttx | * nova/rpc-major-version-updates-icehouse | 21:06 |
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| russellb | *just* merged | 21:06 |
| markmcclain | ttx: two cores are currently reconciling a testing bug they found | 21:06 |
| russellb | and marked implemented | 21:06 |
| ttx | merged now ? | 21:06 |
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| ttx | OK, that's all I have. Anything I missed ? | 21:06 |
| jgriffith | seems about right from here | 21:07 |
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| ttx | alrighty then | 21:08 |
| ttx | #topic RC1 buglists | 21:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RC1 buglists (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:08 | |
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| ttx | #link http://old-wiki.openstack.org/rc/ | 21:08 |
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| ttx | (Still need to fix the redirect on status.o.o at some point) | 21:08 |
| russellb | some sharp drops today | 21:08 |
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| ttx | yes, that's the "ttx comes back from vacation and asks for cleanup" effect | 21:08 |
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| russellb | haha | 21:08 |
| ttx | We need to quickly get those lines set up at their relevant height and then start burning them down | 21:09 |
| ttx | The idea is to try to get to 0 release-critical bugs sometimes next week so that we can tag the first RC1s then. So... | 21:09 |
| ttx | (1) make sure that you only list release-critical bugs in there (you can use a tag to track the nice to haves) | 21:09 |
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| ttx | (2) go through the other reported bugs and make sure all known release-critical issues are tracked | 21:09 |
| * russellb uses icehouse-rc-potential as the nice to have tag | 21:09 | |
| russellb | if we want to be consistent ... | 21:09 |
| ttx | russellb: +1 | 21:09 |
| ttx | (3) burn them down | 21:09 |
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| ttx | Questions on that process ? | 21:09 |
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| markmcclain | russellb: +1 | 21:10 |
| devananda | ttx: just curious, what would be needed to get a similar graph going for incubated projects? | 21:10 |
| ttx | At this point I think neutron, and maybe Cinder, are still flying a bit high | 21:10 |
| tjones1 | ttx: can you paste the link again? i joined late | 21:10 |
| ttx | so they are either really broken or have not refined their lists enough :) | 21:10 |
| russellb | tjones1: http://old-wiki.openstack.org/rc/ | 21:10 |
| tjones1 | thx | 21:10 |
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| markmcclain | ttx: there's more refinement to be done | 21:11 |
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| jgriffith | ttx: same here as per this morning | 21:11 |
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| ttx | markmcclain, jgriffith: good news! | 21:11 |
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| ttx | Try to get the lists refined asap, like before EOD tomorrow | 21:12 |
| ttx | I'd like to start looking into the evolution of those curves as a useful metric rather than cleanup artifacts | 21:12 |
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| ttx | OK, moving on | 21:13 |
| ttx | #topic Dependency freeze | 21:13 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Dependency freeze (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:13 | |
| ttx | zigo raised an interesting discussion on the ML about dependency freeze, and I'd like us to discuss when and how we can achieve that | 21:13 |
| ttx | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/030277.html | 21:13 |
| ttx | Feature freeze is in effect but some dependency changes are not feature-related, and Swift is not feature-frozen yet | 21:13 |
| ttx | When do you think we can freeze addition of new dependencies ? | 21:13 |
| ttx | When do you think we can freeze dependency version bumps ? | 21:13 |
| notmyname | swift is ok from a dependency perspective | 21:14 |
| ttx | And final question... Do you think we can use openstack/requirements to enforce that, or its scope is too braod for us to leverage it ? | 21:14 |
| ttx | Last release I had a hard time watching openstack/requirements changes as a way to control the freeze | 21:14 |
| ttx | notmyname: no dep addition expected at this point ? | 21:14 |
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| ttx | notmyname: what about dep version bumps ? | 21:15 |
| notmyname | ttx: no. at least none that aren't already in openstack/requirements. the only one potential are swiftclient adding six and/or python-keystoneclient | 21:15 |
| sdague | ttx: well we did only just discover trove had requirements not in the global list, so I think that should try to get reconsiled | 21:15 |
| ttx | mordred: your input wanted on final question above | 21:15 |
| dolphm | someone on list mentioned pending client releases... would they not be an exception? | 21:15 |
| jeblair | ttx: i think os/requirements is exactly for handling this sort of thing | 21:15 |
| ttx | dolphm: up to a given date yes | 21:15 |
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| sdague | dolphm: why exactly are we always bumping client release minimums in global requirements? | 21:16 |
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| jeblair | ttx: reviewers should be apply extra caution to approving those changes, and respect whatever rules we apply to dep freeze | 21:16 |
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| notmyname | ttx: same with dependency bumps. we keep dependencies working with centos6/precise generic installs, so no worries from our perspective on version bumps | 21:16 |
| ttx | jeblair: so last cycle there were a lot of extra additions to cover for non-integrated projects | 21:16 |
| ttx | jeblair: like stuff just being added to incubation | 21:16 |
| jeblair | ttx: incubated projects? | 21:16 |
| ttx | jeblair: yes | 21:16 |
| SergeyLukjanov | savannaclient was added after rc1 I think | 21:17 |
| ttx | jeblair: that made it difficult to spot freeze players | 21:17 |
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| sdague | it's also super common for a new driver in a project to come in with requirements, some reasonable, some odd | 21:17 |
| ttx | notmyname: good to know, thanks | 21:17 |
| jeblair | ttx: we used to select the mirror based on namespace | 21:17 |
| jeblair | ttx: now we select the mirror based on presence in projects.txt in requirements | 21:17 |
| jeblair | ttx: so there's no reason to add a project to projects.txt if they can't follow the current rules for that repo | 21:17 |
| SergeyLukjanov | jeblair, ttx, probably, we should ensure that all openstack/ projects are in list? | 21:18 |
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| jeblair | ttx: in other words, if an incubated project can't handle the current requirements, then they should wait until after the dep freeze to add themselves to it | 21:18 |
| SergeyLukjanov | jeblair, ++ | 21:18 |
| ttx | jeblair: also as soon as we opened master for icehouse dev (after havana-rc1) the slew of new features added deps as well | 21:18 |
| ttx | basically we didn't cut a stable/havana branch for requirements at RC time | 21:18 |
| * dhellmann arrives late | 21:19 | |
| devananda | sdague: we're starting to push out requirements for optional drivers. AIUI, those dont need to be in global requirements | 21:19 |
| sdague | my opinion is we should resolve sqla and the 3 trove requirements, and call it frozen after that point | 21:19 |
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| jeblair | ttx: i _think_ a milestone-propose branch for requirements would probably work | 21:19 |
| ttx | anyway, we can work on the details of using openstack/requirements to control the dep freeze, if you all think we should be able to use that | 21:19 |
| devananda | sdague: let the driver load fail if its dependency isn't present, rather than enforce all those dependencies are installed even when a deployer doesn't want to use those drivers | 21:20 |
| jogo | sdague: ++ to resolving trove issues first | 21:20 |
| jeblair | ttx: and then branch stable/icehouse on requirements from that too | 21:20 |
| ttx | the main question is WHEn we can enforce that freeze | 21:20 |
| jeblair | ttx: that's untested afaik, so we'll need to pay close attention to that | 21:20 |
| ttx | now ? next week ? | 21:20 |
| sdague | however, I think you will find the the requirements reviewers are a pretty diverse set, which probably needs to be revisited, because there is definitely some uneveness in there | 21:20 |
| ttx | how about next week, so that we can prepare any branch magic in openstack/requirements that may be needed | 21:20 |
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| ttx | sdague: if we rely on a MP branch, or a stable branch, the set of reviewers change | 21:21 |
| sdague | I think that's fine, the 4 reviews in question are up | 21:21 |
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| sdague | ttx: true | 21:21 |
| ttx | sdague: so that could actually work | 21:21 |
| sdague | I guess that would be a thing for next time | 21:21 |
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| dhellmann | sdague: +1 to reviewing the list of reviewers | 21:22 |
| mordred | ttx: sup? | 21:22 |
| mordred | ttx: reading | 21:22 |
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| ttx | Should we first freeze additions and then bumps ? | 21:22 |
| ttx | or do a one-step dep freeze with exceptions ? | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | it seems like the process for the latter is simpler | 21:23 |
| jeblair | (anyone want to volunteer to be the requirements ptl?) | 21:23 |
| markmcclain | +1 for simple | 21:23 |
| ttx | dhellmann: yes, i'm leaning towards that too | 21:23 |
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| dhellmann | jeblair: I thought we already had one | 21:23 |
| * markwash touches his nose | 21:24 | |
| dhellmann | haha | 21:24 |
| mordred | ttx: I agree with jeblair on everything he said | 21:24 |
| ttx | so. Dep freeze Tuesday next week, working out the details around using openstack/requirements to enforce it by then ? | 21:24 |
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| ttx | works for everyone ? | 21:25 |
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| sdague | jeblair: so I kind of naturally assume that should be the release manager, so I nominate ttx | 21:25 |
| notmyname | ttx: works for swift | 21:25 |
| sdague | ttx: I think that will be fine | 21:25 |
| jeblair | sdague: seconded | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | sdague: +1 | 21:25 |
| markmcclain | sdague: +1 | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | ttx: that works for me | 21:26 |
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| * ttx is honored -- just note that for a requirements PTL I'm way behind in requirements regular reviews :) | 21:26 | |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, fwiw +1 | 21:26 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: we should announce the pending freeze on the ML, too | 21:26 |
| ttx | right, that's why I say one week -- sounds like the minimum notice | 21:26 |
| ttx | #agreed Dep freeze Tuesday next week | 21:27 |
| ttx | #action ttx to work out the details around using openstack/requirements to enforce depfreeze before next week | 21:27 |
| ttx | OK, thanks everyone | 21:27 |
| ttx | #topic UTF-8 charset migrations for oslo-db | 21:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "UTF-8 charset migrations for oslo-db (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:27 | |
| ttx | markwash: floor is yours | 21:28 |
| markwash | yay me | 21:28 |
| markwash | I put some relevant links in the agenda | 21:28 |
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| markwash | the basic problem is that db tables should have UTF-8 as the charset | 21:28 |
| markwash | but the migration in cases where they *arent* already utf8 are pretty scary | 21:28 |
| markwash | and we think the deployer ultimately has to be responsible for it | 21:28 |
| markwash | but there are a few options | 21:29 |
| dolphm | markwash: what makes them scary? | 21:29 |
| markwash | 1) we could just immediately require utf-8 with no migration | 21:29 |
| markwash | 2) we could provide a migration | 21:29 |
| dhellmann | dolphm: we have to re-encode the data in the tables | 21:29 |
| markwash | 3) or we could have a deprecation period where we say "you better fix this but we won't hose you yet!) | 21:29 |
| markwash | s/)/"/ | 21:29 |
| sdague | dhellmann: we did data migrations all the time in nova, why is that a problem? | 21:30 |
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| markwash | I'm also concerned about he migration being a whole lot of time and work for folks who maybe don't actually have any utf8 characters | 21:30 |
| markwash | but maybe that's just me being silly | 21:30 |
| bnemec | I think we're primarily basing this on http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2014-March/029708.html | 21:30 |
| dhellmann | sdague: we would have to write one for each table, no? maybe that would work. | 21:30 |
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| bnemec | Which suggested this isn't as simple as "make everything utf8". | 21:31 |
| sdague | markwash: ascii -> utf8 is a no op right, just a type flip | 21:31 |
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| dolphm | we did something like this for keystone, all affected tables in one migration: https://github.com/openstack/keystone/blob/master/keystone/common/sql/migrate_repo/versions/005_set_utf8_character_set.py | 21:31 |
| dolphm | i don't think i've ever seen a single bug report against that migration | 21:31 |
| markwash | sdague: well, its probably latin1, I don't think there is any thing that verifies that you don't have any high-bit-set characters to decide if you can do the easy or the hard form of the migration | 21:32 |
| dhellmann | maybe that ML post made it a bigger deal than it is? | 21:32 |
| markwash | dolphm: that's encouraging, but many public clouds don't run keystone yet :not a trollface: | 21:32 |
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| sdague | markwash: I honestly think #2 has been the default operating model for openstack | 21:32 |
| dolphm | markwash: ack :) | 21:32 |
| sdague | and the commits should come with giant UpgradeImpact on them | 21:32 |
| sdague | especially a warning that this might take a long time | 21:33 |
| dolphm | sdague: ++ | 21:33 |
| markwash | sdague: yeah, that would work to handle the lengthiness | 21:33 |
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| markwash | I'm still worried about possible corruption as was illuminated in the ML thread | 21:33 |
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| markwash | but I don't understand it perfectly so | 21:34 |
| markwash | . . . | 21:34 |
| sdague | and is this only a mysql issue? | 21:34 |
| dolphm | markwash: i'm not sure what to say about corruption without being able to reproduce and understand it :( | 21:34 |
| bnemec | sdague: Yes | 21:34 |
| sdague | yeh, it would be good to build a test case for what bad data here ends up looking like | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | sdague: IIUC, it has to do with mysql having many ways to set defaults, and then changing those defaults between versions | 21:34 |
| dhellmann | assuming we write the needed migration(s), does that mean we don't need an option to turn off the charset check in oslo? | 21:35 |
| markwash | dolphm: I think its basically utf8(latin1(binary(utf8(foo)))) != utf8(foo) | 21:35 |
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| markwash | something to that effect | 21:35 |
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| markwash | dhellmann: that's correct. if theres a migration we don't need a switch | 21:36 |
| dhellmann | markwash: ok | 21:36 |
| sdague | so you could probably be smarter and figure out if there is anything high bit before doing the migration | 21:36 |
| sdague | for fastpath | 21:36 |
| sdague | with a raw bulk query | 21:36 |
| markwash | dolphm: the supposition being that utf8 data was going into some latin1 tables via binary(utf8(foo)) | 21:36 |
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| dolphm | markwash: i'd have to try it, but i'd expect something to throw an exception before that succeeded :-/ | 21:37 |
| markwash | sdague: I'm not realy confident we can confidently catch those kinds of errors :-( that's why I want to pass the ball to deployers | 21:37 |
| markwash | apparently my standard is double confidence | 21:38 |
| sdague | markwash: that's a giant punt though | 21:38 |
| sdague | "hey guys, we screwed up, we don't know how to fix it. You tell you fixed it before we do anything" | 21:38 |
| markwash | well, except we only screwed up by allowing them to screw up with latin1 as a default | 21:39 |
| markwash | so there's a slight political out | 21:39 |
| sdague | markwash: sure, but that was still our fault | 21:39 |
| jgriffith | I'm just curious, haven't all the other projects already done this? | 21:39 |
| sdague | like when we forced everything to innodb | 21:39 |
| dolphm | markwash: if it's possible to detect corruption at migration time, and abort... that would be beneficial to the 99% of deployments that *don't* have corruption to worry about | 21:39 |
| jgriffith | I mean... cidner just looped through and did a convert to UTF8 in it's base migration | 21:39 |
| jgriffith | not sure about others | 21:39 |
| markwash | jgriffith: great question! if I'm just behind the times that's fine I can pipe down :-) | 21:40 |
| jgriffith | markwash: no no... I'm just wondering, maybe this is more flushed out than we think | 21:40 |
| jgriffith | markwash: ie lower risk | 21:40 |
| markwash | yes | 21:40 |
| ttx | Yep, it sounds safe to align with what other projects have done. At least you can deflect blame on them when all else fails | 21:40 |
| jgriffith | ttx: ha! | 21:40 |
| markwash | anyway it sounds like the general push here is to just go with a utf8 migration | 21:40 |
| markwash | less deflection, more contextualization ;-) | 21:41 |
| markwash | so I can take "allow utf8 migration" as the message | 21:41 |
| markwash | and we can move on | 21:41 |
| ttx | I hear Cinder and keystone have migrations doing it, I think Glance is in the same bag | 21:41 |
| ttx | usual-dataset-size-wise ? | 21:42 |
| markwash | seems likely, especially with cinder | 21:42 |
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| ttx | so yeah, i don't think it's special enough to justify diverging | 21:42 |
| markwash | everyone is special :-) | 21:43 |
| ttx | the other ones seem to have not caused that much havoc | 21:43 |
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| ttx | markwash: can we move on ? | 21:43 |
| markwash | indeed | 21:43 |
| ttx | #topic Red Flag District / Blocked blueprints | 21:43 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Red Flag District / Blocked blueprints (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:43 | |
| jgriffith | markwash: and nova | 21:43 |
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| ttx | Any inter-project blocked work that this meeting could help unblock ? | 21:43 |
| ttx | any RC bug fix needing some other project to do work for them ? | 21:43 |
| ttx | That will come in due time, I guess | 21:45 |
| ttx | #topic Incubated projects | 21:45 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Incubated projects (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:45 | |
| SergeyLukjanov | o/ | 21:45 |
| SergeyLukjanov | re sahara rc1 - https://launchpad.net/sahara/+milestone/icehouse-rc1 | 21:45 |
| ttx | SergeyLukjanov, kgriffs, devananda: you still belong here :) | 21:45 |
| devananda | o/ | 21:45 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, we're now in renaming hell, should complete 95% of it this week | 21:45 |
| ttx | SergeyLukjanov: OK, a lot left to cover I see | 21:46 |
| ttx | SergeyLukjanov: when you're done, maybe trim the RC1 buglist to only contain release-critical issues | 21:46 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, yup, so, we'd like to have +1w before the rc1 I think | 21:46 |
| ttx | so that we can reach RC1 in a reasonable time | 21:46 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, sure, that's I'm planning to do | 21:46 |
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| ttx | RC1 in two weeks is fine by me, for incubated projects | 21:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, it should work for us | 21:47 |
| ttx | leaves well enough time to catch a regression and respin | 21:47 |
| ttx | not as much integration concerns as for integrated release projects | 21:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | yeah | 21:48 |
| ttx | https://launchpad.net/ironic/+milestone/icehouse-rc1 | 21:48 |
| devananda | we're focusing on getting CI up and the various bugs we're finding along the way | 21:48 |
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| devananda | i'm doing triage a couple times a week to keep ^ accurate | 21:48 |
| ttx | devananda: is that buglist listing all release-critical fixes you'd like to get in before your icehouse release ? | 21:48 |
| devananda | yes | 21:48 |
| ttx | ok, sounds like you're in good shape | 21:49 |
| devananda | as far as docs go, a quick question | 21:49 |
| devananda | we're aiming at hosting deployer docs in the same repo as our developer docs for now | 21:49 |
| devananda | is that reasonable? | 21:49 |
| devananda | eg, docs.openstack.org/developer/ironic/ | 21:50 |
| annegentle | devananda: yep it's fine | 21:50 |
| ttx | devananda: ideally you would come up with someting usable enough so that people would actually play with that release as an alternative to nova-bm | 21:50 |
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| devananda | annegentle: thanks | 21:50 |
| ttx | that should get you new bugs for Juno :) | 21:50 |
| devananda | ttx: we have that :) | 21:50 |
| annegentle | devananda: think of eventually fitting into one of the install guides (we have four for four distros) | 21:50 |
| devananda | ttx: in devstack, you now can just set 2 ENV vars and it switches everything to ironic | 21:50 |
| ttx | devananda: now you just need to market it :) | 21:50 |
| devananda | ttx: yep, heh... deployer docs will help a lot there I think | 21:50 |
| ttx | devananda: the goal is to limit the effects of "not being integrated" to a bare minimum | 21:51 |
| ttx | so yes, easy devstack switching is a good idea | 21:51 |
| devananda | annegentle: i know that's the goal, just not sure how we ca do that prior to graduation / without help from you(r team). happy to talk out of meeting if you have suggestions | 21:51 |
| devananda | ttx: ack. will keep that in mind | 21:52 |
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| ttx | devananda: could also engage with distros in early Juno so that they fully support ironic in their next set | 21:52 |
| devananda | moving the nova "ironic" driver into our codebase has made that so much simpler. | 21:52 |
| devananda | ttx: afaik, RH and Deb/ubuntu are both packaging ironic in their next releases | 21:53 |
| ttx | devananda: great | 21:53 |
| devananda | ttx: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=ironic | 21:53 |
| lifeless | zigo has debian covered, RH are shipping tripleo so definitely have ironic covered | 21:53 |
| ttx | but packaged doesn't mean it works :) tested means it works :) | 21:53 |
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| devananda | yep | 21:54 |
| ttx | any other question from our still-incubated-in-icehouse crowd ? | 21:54 |
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| ttx | #topic Open discussion | 21:55 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:55 | |
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| ttx | summit.o.o is open for session suggestion since March 7 | 21:55 |
| ttx | 96 proposals at this point | 21:55 |
| ttx | keep them coming | 21:56 |
| ttx | Anything else, anyone ? | 21:56 |
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| hub_cap | thx ttx! | 21:56 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:57 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 21:57:14 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2014/project.2014-03-18-21.03.html | 21:57 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2014/project.2014-03-18-21.03.txt | 21:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2014/project.2014-03-18-21.03.log.html | 21:57 |
| ttx | Thanks everyone | 21:57 |
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| yamahata | hi | 23:00 |
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| s3wong | Hello | 23:00 |
| sweston | hello | 23:00 |
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| s3wong | serviceVM meeting, right? | 23:01 |
| yamahata | right. Glad to see other one unlike last week. | 23:01 |
| yamahata | let's start | 23:01 |
| yamahata | #startmeeting neutron/servicevm | 23:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Mar 18 23:01:38 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is yamahata. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 23:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 23:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron/servicevm)" | 23:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_servicevm' | 23:01 |
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| yamahata | #topic logistics | 23:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "logistics (Meeting topic: neutron/servicevm)" | 23:01 | |
| yamahata | This timeslot is temporal. and there are another proposal. | 23:02 |
| yamahata | So we'd like to agree on better timeslot. | 23:02 |
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| yamahata | So far related timezone is | 23:02 |
| s3wong | the current timeslot is OK for us PDT/PST people :-) | 23:03 |
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| yamahata | Some is uncomfortable with it. | 23:03 |
| sweston | I don't have any special needs. Yes, it is fine in the US, but is fairly undoable for a lot of time zones. | 23:03 |
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| s3wong | agreed | 23:04 |
| yamahata | JST(UTC+9), PST(UTC-8), PDT(UTC-7), EST(UTC-5) and IST(UTC+5.3) | 23:05 |
| s3wong | so what is the new proposal(s) | 23:05 |
| s3wong | for meeting time | 23:05 |
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| sweston | what are the requests for? earlier or later? | 23:06 |
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| yamahata | I'm thinking of some hours later. | 23:07 |
| s3wong | now is 23:00 UTC, one would imagine it should be earlier (in the day) | 23:08 |
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| yamahata | wondering it also works for EST and IST | 23:08 |
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| yamahata | yes, I mean 2:00UTC, 3:00UTC | 23:09 |
| s3wong | yamahata: probably not working for Europe time | 23:09 |
| yamahata | s3wong: right. Unfortunately there is no timezome that works for all asia, europe and us. | 23:10 |
| sweston | where is the majority of the interest right now? | 23:10 |
| s3wong | I am in US (Pacific timezone) | 23:11 |
| yamahata | PST/EST, JST, IST. I'm not aware of europe time. | 23:11 |
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| yamahata | Okay, I'll propose on ML and we'll see it. | 23:12 |
| sweston | so utc-5 looks like the best to me | 23:12 |
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| yamahata | 5:00 UTC works for me | 23:13 |
| sweston | ok, I'd say let's give it a week or two on ML for people to respond, then change it. | 23:14 |
| s3wong | OK | 23:14 |
| yamahata | #action propose new timeslot 5:00 UTC on the ml | 23:14 |
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| yamahata | #action yamahata propose new timeslot 5:00 utc on the ml | 23:15 |
| yamahata | next topic is f2f meeting. | 23:16 |
| sweston | meetbot must have left ... | 23:16 |
| s3wong | @23:00, meetbot is sleeping :-) | 23:16 |
| yamahata | It is possible for me to organize f2f meeting in Santa Clara on April 17 or 18. | 23:16 |
| sweston | hehe, meetbot needs rest too | 23:17 |
| s3wong | yamahata: f2f meeting in Santa Clara is fine with me | 23:17 |
| yamahata | Do we want to have it? given it's only 1 month before the summit. | 23:17 |
| sweston | the last one generated a good deal of interest ... I guess it depends on what would be discussed. | 23:18 |
| yamahata | Maybe it can be done at the summit. | 23:18 |
| s3wong | yamahata: this is not Icehouse feature, so having discussion at J-Summit would still be OK | 23:18 |
| yamahata | s3wong: I've proposed the topic for J summit. | 23:19 |
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| sweston | I agree. no reason to get everyone together if we're just all going to see each other in a month | 23:20 |
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| s3wong | +1 | 23:20 |
| yamahata | Then let's skip this time. | 23:20 |
| yamahata | next thing is frequency. | 23:21 |
| yamahata | I think the meeting will be held weekly at first. then we can switch to bi-weekly. | 23:22 |
| s3wong | yamahata: OK | 23:22 |
| yamahata | any other topic related to logistics? | 23:23 |
| sweston | I don't have anyting | 23:23 |
| sweston | anything | 23:23 |
| s3wong | all good | 23:23 |
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| yamahata | #topic current-status | 23:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "current-status (Meeting topic: neutron/servicevm)" | 23:23 | |
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| yamahata | As agreed at I-summit, I'm working on servicevm for lbaas. | 23:24 |
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| yamahata | I've implemented API/DB model part, lbaas-driver(plugin-part), neutron-command, devstack. | 23:25 |
| yamahata | and oslo.messaging | 23:25 |
| yamahata | I'm working on lbaas-agent and VM image. | 23:26 |
| yamahata | My estimation is 1 week or two to have working service VM that runs haproxy inside vm. | 23:27 |
| yamahata | The blueprint for horizon GUI is proposed. | 23:27 |
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| sweston | okay ... is there anything that you need that anyone can help with, at this point? | 23:28 |
| s3wong | yamahata: if I instantiate LBaaS, how can I specify if I am using the current container model vs VM based? | 23:28 |
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| yamahata | sweston: patch review and API review. | 23:29 |
| yamahata | s3wong: Right now it is chosen by config file. | 23:29 |
| yamahata | s3wong: In future, it could be chosen dynamically by service provider extension when lbaas supports it. | 23:30 |
| sweston | okay, I can help with that ... do you have a list of reviews I can start on? | 23:30 |
| yamahata | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/56892/ | 23:31 |
| yamahata | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/72068/ | 23:31 |
| yamahata | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/77862/ | 23:31 |
| yamahata | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/77863/ | 23:31 |
| yamahata | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/72070/ | 23:31 |
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| s3wong | yamahata: could be part of the flavor framework in the future | 23:32 |
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| sweston | okay, I have them on my reading list now | 23:32 |
| yamahata | s3wong: maybe yes when lbaas supports it. | 23:32 |
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| yamahata | the discussion for GUI has been started. There is mock image. would be interesting | 23:34 |
| yamahata | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/horizon/+spec/neutron-adv-svc-vm | 23:35 |
| yamahata | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Horizon-NFV-configuration#NFV_instances | 23:36 |
| s3wong | yamahata: yeah, there is a nova context in there too. Does the tenant get charged for one vm? | 23:36 |
| yamahata | s3wong: it's open question for now. The current implementation doesn't, though. | 23:37 |
| yamahata | It needs consideration. Do you have any idea? | 23:38 |
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| s3wong | yamahata: it is interesting, because now you are introducing "service VM" in nova also (thus it would know not to charge tenant) | 23:39 |
| sweston | well, it's an api right? so if there's expressed interest, we can add a multiplier .. but that might open up a can of worms | 23:39 |
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| yamahata | s3wong: VM is created with a dedicated user for now. not by the original user. | 23:40 |
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| yamahata | s3wong: there isurely s a requirement that tenants want to create its own servicevm and manage them themselves. | 23:41 |
| s3wong | yamahata: OK. Good start | 23:42 |
| yamahata | any other questions? | 23:43 |
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| sweston | not right now, not from me at least | 23:43 |
| s3wong | good, will take a look at your code | 23:43 |
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| sweston | s3wong: agree | 23:44 |
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| yamahata | high level review of API will also help | 23:45 |
| s3wong | yamahata: OK | 23:45 |
| yamahata | #link https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZWDDTjwhIUedyipkDztM0_nBYgfCEP9Q77hhn1ZduCA/edit# | 23:46 |
| sweston | yamahata okay | 23:46 |
| yamahata | # open topic | 23:46 |
| yamahata | #topic open | 23:46 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open (Meeting topic: neutron/servicevm)" | 23:46 | |
| yamahata | Any open topic to discuss? | 23:46 |
| sweston | I don't have anything ... s3wong? | 23:46 |
| s3wong | Not for now | 23:47 |
| yamahata | okay, thanks. | 23:47 |
| yamahata | bye | 23:47 |
| yamahata | #endmeeting | 23:47 |
| s3wong | bye | 23:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 23:47 | |
| sweston | awesome. thanks, everyone ... this was a good start :-) | 23:47 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Mar 18 23:47:44 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 23:47 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_servicevm/2014/neutron_servicevm.2014-03-18-23.01.html | 23:47 |
| s3wong | thanks! | 23:47 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_servicevm/2014/neutron_servicevm.2014-03-18-23.01.txt | 23:47 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_servicevm/2014/neutron_servicevm.2014-03-18-23.01.log.html | 23:47 |
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