Tuesday, 2014-04-29

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sc68calGood morning everyone13:58
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SridharGaddamGood morning sc68cal13:58
sc68calSo it's an off week for openstack - i'm online today and plan on still running the meeting13:59
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sc68calbut I'll probably run right through the agenda real quick to get to open discussion13:59
sc68cal#startmeeting neutron_ipv614:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Apr 29 14:00:16 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is sc68cal. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.14:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'neutron_ipv6'14:00
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sc68cal#topic blueprints14:00
*** openstack changes topic to "blueprints (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)"14:00
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sc68calbaoli: hey14:01
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sc68calDo we have any new blueprints in review?14:02
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sc68cal#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/88043/ ipv6-provider-slaac14:03
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baolisc68cal, I'm planning to start neutron specs for the radvd bp and the prefix delegation bp for the next couple of weeks.14:04
aveigado we have functioning units for dhcpv6 yet?14:04
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aveigaI haven't seen anything that actually turns on stateful and sets up a scope in dnsmasq14:05
aveigathat might be a pre-req for PD to work14:05
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sc68calI believe we need to get the neutron-specs in, then we can break up the code that shixiong wrote into smaller, manageable chunks14:06
sc68cal#topic code reviews14:07
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*** openstack changes topic to "code reviews (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)"14:07
sc68calHonestly I've dropped the ball on updating any of my ipv6 patch submissions14:07
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sc68calbut I think we have a lot of stuff to hammer out at the summit14:08
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sc68calAnyone have any code reviews to discuss, or we can move to bugs then open discussion14:09
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sc68cal#topic bugs14:11
*** openstack changes topic to "bugs (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)"14:11
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sc68cal#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bugs?field.tag=ipv6 bugs tagged ipv614:12
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aveigashouldn't bumping the min version be a quick fix?14:13
sc68calaveiga: yes - but I don't know how that interacts with the distros14:13
sc68calbut I think we do need to bump it - I think we had a couple lines in meetings previously discussing it14:14
sc68calI'll have to do some grepping14:14
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sc68cal#topic open discussion14:16
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: neutron_ipv6)"14:16
SridharGaddamI have a question. In an IPV6 environment when OpenStack dnsmasq is acting as a stateful DHCPV6 server, how does it identify the client uniquely?14:16
SridharGaddamAs DHCPV6 Clients identify themselves using the DUID instead of MAC address and since clients can use UUID generated in three different ways (Link Layer Address with time, Vendor Assigned Unique ID and Link Layer Address), hence the question.14:16
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sc68calI suppose that depends on the guest?14:17
SridharGaddamthats true, it depends on the DHCP V6 client running inside the VM.14:17
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SridharGaddamBut since the dnsmasq is going to serve the IP address in a static manner. The mapping should be pre-determined using the DUID field.14:18
SridharGaddamSo I was wondering how we will be supporting the DHCPV6 Statefull mode.14:18
SridharGaddamDo you think we can enforce the requirement that DHCPV6 clients in the VMs should always use the Link Local Address as the DUID field?14:19
sc68calI'll freely admit that you're probably a bit further ahead than I am about this problem - so I'd be happy to delegate to you to figure out how to solve it14:20
sc68caland start discussing it on the ML to see if anyone else has some good ideas14:20
SridharGaddamno problem sc68cal. I'll have a look at it closely.14:20
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SridharGaddamSure, I'll send out an email on the mailing list.14:20
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sc68calThe more I think about it, the more I realize that addressing in Neutron had a lot of ipv4 isms in it where addressing can be centrally defined14:21
sc68calas opposed to ipv6 where the client has more influence in the transaction14:22
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sc68calWe are kind of lucky since we also determine the MAC for the guest14:22
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SridharGaddamyeah that is true.14:23
SridharGaddamBut supporting privacy extensions could be very tricky..14:23
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sc68calWe will not be supporting the display of PE addrs14:24
sc68calguests are free to use them, but they won't show up in API calls14:24
sc68calsince they're ... private ;)14:24
SridharGaddamwould they be forwarded and supported by the Neutron router?14:24
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aveigathere are a few hacks in flight for dnsmasq here14:25
sc68calnot sure what you mean14:25
aveigalike being able to determine from a dual-stacked host that the DUID and MAC match14:25
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aveigaor being able to strip the timestamp from an LLA+TS DUID14:26
aveigabut in general it's going to come down to the same setup we have with SLAAC14:26
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sc68calSridharGaddam: when you say supported by a neutron router, can you explain?14:26
aveigawe're telling people that privacy extensions are invalid in our environment, so why not also restrict to LLA DUID?14:26
SridharGaddamI meant to say that will the VMs with privacy extensions enabled be able to communicate to external world? Sorry if it was not clear.14:27
SridharGaddamaveiga: that is one possible solution.14:27
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baoliSridharGaddam: with PE, the prefix won't be chnaged but the ID part of the address, right?14:28
SridharGaddamyes, AFAIK the id part would no longer be constructed using EUI64 method.14:28
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aveigaand since that's a client-generated method with no way for us to calculate it, it's invalid for Neutron14:29
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aveigasince Neutron needs a predictable address to provide to advances services14:29
aveigathings like FWaaS, VPNaaS and LBaaS will fail with PE14:29
SridharGaddamyes aveiga, I agree.14:30
sc68calWhen a guest uses PE, it still keeps the assigned address - like if it's a slaac network14:30
sc68calso I assume that in this env they'd be using that address for accessing it, then perhaps just PE for sending traffic?14:30
aveigathe PE addr becomes the default14:31
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aveigawhich means FWaaS rules may fail, return NAT will fail from an LBaaS, etc14:31
SridharGaddamhmm... since each ipaddress has a valid lifetime and preferred lifetime. The SLAAC generated address could eventually timeout and the one generated using PE could be used for all the communication.14:31
aveigaif the SLAAC addr times out, routing will fail14:32
aveigabecause that means the RA has timed out14:32
aveigaand your default route is no longer valid14:32
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SridharGaddamyes aveiga. Supporting privacy extensions could be very tricky for the above reasons.14:35
baolias long as the prefix won't change, the routing wouldn't change. The concern with PE is the anti-ip spoofing filter. It's installed with ipv4 by default.14:36
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aveigathe concern with PE is the instability and unpredictability of the address14:36
aveigatyou can't provide PE to other systems, so it should be officially unsupported14:36
sc68calI suppose our easiest solution is to wait until someone files a bug about it, the only thing that could make things difficult is if a distro enables PE by default14:37
sc68cal(which may already be the case - not sure to be honest)14:38
aveigaUbuntu does by default14:38
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baolithat's true14:38
aveigathere are bugs filed there, as well14:39
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aveiga#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/procps/+bug/1068756 Ubuntu IPv6 PE bug14:39
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1068756 in procps "IPv6 Privacy Extensions enabled on Ubuntu Server by default" [Undecided,Confirmed]14:39
aveigabasically ignored for 2 years14:40
sc68calnice find14:40
SridharGaddamsome thread on PE. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=62284514:40
uvirtbotDebian bug 622845 in linux-2.6 "please enable IPv6 privacy extension in default configuration" [Wishlist,Open]14:41
aveigait's actually a valid concern for clients14:41
aveigabut bad for servers14:41
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baoliif the address is generated by dhcpv6, would the guest still use PEs? In other words, would PE only works with SLAAC address?14:42
sc68calagree. They should be disabling it for server images14:42
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baoliRFC 4941: Privacy Extensions for Stateless Address Autoconfiguration in IPv614:42
aveigabaoli: nope, it's SLAC only14:42
baoliso for servers, they dont' have to use slaac14:42
aveigadhcpv6-assigned prefixes will not have this, unless the A bit is set14:42
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aveigait's possible if you had A, M and O all set to true you'd have both PE and dhcpv6 addrs14:43
aveigabut we don't allow that on Neutron-issued RAs14:43
aveigathere's no API option for SLAAC+Stateful14:43
baoliBut the dhcpv6 addr will not expire14:43
aveigasure it will, it should have a valid lifetime14:44
aveigathe client will need to renew14:44
baolibut the client will renew it, right14:44
aveigajust like today with v414:44
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aveigaI think we can safely say that just as we don't support PE, we should only support LLA DUID14:45
aveigafor now, at least14:45
aveigaif any of you wants to write some really ugly hacks to dnsmasq to do otherwise, you're welcome to submit them upstream14:45
aveigaanyone disagree?14:46
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aveigaI'm not a dictator here :)14:46
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sc68calI think we should keep an eye on those bugs that people highlighted14:47
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sc68calwe've got some work to do in the layer of neutron that runs dnsmasq - so we'll get to the PE thing when we get to it :)14:48
sc68callet it not be known that the ipv6 team lacks things to be worked on :)14:49
aveigaah, decouple the issue14:49
aveigathe dnsmasq bit is for DUID14:49
aveigaPE is SLAAC/Neutron management, not dnsmasq14:49
sc68caltrue- but we need to get some code into neutron to drive subnets that have stateless set as the attrs14:49
sc68calerr stateful14:50
sc68caletc. etc.14:50
aveigaalso true14:50
aveigaso we can focus for now on getting LLA DUIDs supported14:50
aveigaso we at least have a basic functional target14:50
baoliTo be honest, I'm lost here. How dhcpv6 duid is related to PE?14:51
sc68calok - should we start something on the ML about it or is there enough info to put something into neutron-specs and LP?14:51
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aveigabaoli: they aren't14:51
aveigathat's waht I was getting at14:51
SridharGaddamthere is one BP and I asked this question in the BP earlier.14:51
aveigasc68cal: blueprint it as the basic miulestone14:51
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sc68calok - I see your comment.14:52
sc68calWe need to move that into neutron-specs and hash that out14:52
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sc68caldoing it on LP's whiteboard is a pain - I know I'm sort of waving my hand and hiding behind process14:53
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sc68calHonestly stuff in LP just gets neglected, most neutron devs are in gerrit14:53
sc68caleither that or the ML14:54
sc68calso feel free to start up convos on the ML14:54
sc68calor if you're a bit farther long in an idea, do a spec in neutron-specs14:55
baoli  Each DHCP client and server has a DUID.  DHCP servers use DUIDs to14:55
baoli   identify clients for the selection of configuration parameters and in14:55
baoli   the association of IAs with clients.  DHCP clients use DUIDs to14:55
baoli   identify a server in messages where a server needs to be identified.14:55
baoli   See sections 22.2 and 22.3 for the representation of a DUID in a DHCP14:55
baoli   message.14:55
baoli   Clients and servers MUST treat DUIDs as opaque values and MUST only14:55
baoli   compare DUIDs for equality.  Clients and servers MUST NOT in any14:55
baoli   other way interpret DUIDs.  Clients and servers MUST NOT restrict14:55
baoli   DUIDs to the types defined in this document, as additional DUID types14:55
baoli   may be defined in the future.14:55
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aveigabaoli: This fails for static allocations when the DUID is not pre-defined14:55
aveigathe only DUID that can be pre-determined by Neutron is LLA14:55
aveigaor by mangling an LLA+Time14:56
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baoliaveiga, I think that I have some homework to do14:57
aveigahit me up if you need help, I worked with the team that wrote this RFC14:57
aveigaand was sort of mentored by the WG chair14:57
SridharGaddamaveiga: I did not explore much, but some of the DHCPV6 clients which I used seem to use LLA+time as DUID(i.e, default conf).14:57
baoliaveiga, sure. thanks14:57
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aveigathere's a chance that some distros ship with LLA+time as the default14:58
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aveigaI know OpenWRT did for a while14:58
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sc68calAlright everyone14:59
sc68caltill next week - thanks everyone for attending14:59
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"14:59
openstackMeeting ended Tue Apr 29 14:59:51 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)14:59
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-04-29-14.00.html14:59
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-04-29-14.00.txt14:59
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_ipv6/2014/neutron_ipv6.2014-04-29-14.00.log.html14:59
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n0ano#startmeeting gantt15:00
openstackMeeting started Tue Apr 29 15:00:19 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is n0ano. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.15:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: gantt)"15:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'gantt'15:00
n0anoanyone here to talk about the scheduler?15:00
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n0anobauzas, again, tnx for covering for me the last couple of week, it's been crazy :-)15:01
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bauzasn0ano: no pb15:01
n0ano#topic review action items15:01
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n0anoI believe there were just a couple from last week.15:01
n0anomerge sessions 262 & 140 - I believe you did that, right bauzas ?15:02
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bauzasn0ano: yup15:02
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n0anowe'll call it done then15:02
bauzasn0ano: now the etherpad is up-to-date15:02
bauzas#link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/Gantt-summit-sessions15:02
n0anoexcellent, I looked it over, it's a good overview of the scheduler sessions15:03
bauzasI still have to provide the times15:03
bauzasbut I was waiting to see the agenda finalized, as it's subject to changes15:03
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n0anoindeed, but I don't expect it to change to dramatically15:03
bauzasthink so too15:03
llu-laptopwhat time will gantt sessions be scheduled?15:04
llu-laptopon which day?15:04
bauzasllu-laptop: see the etherpad15:04
bauzason Friday15:04
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n0anollu-laptop, mostly on Fri morning, up until about 2PM15:04
bauzasthere is one interesting session on Tuesday15:04
bauzasabout Climate15:04
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n0anoimportant point is to not schedule a flight home until late Fri15:04
* johnthetubaguy raises quite late hand15:05
bauzasIMHO, the Climate session is worth it for discussing with Gantt15:05
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n0anosounds like we can encourage all the scheduler centric people to try and make that session then15:05
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gliksonthis session on Wed is also related to scheduling: http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/a0d38e1278182eb09f06e22457d94c0c15:06
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n0anoglikson, not obvious from the session title but maybe we should include that on our etherpad15:07
jay-lau-513glikson: Yes, not sure if we can discuss how to migrate VM between clusters with only one nova compute15:07
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bauzassorry, got disconnected :(15:08
n0anoI think the scheduler session etherpad should be rather organic so anyone can update it with stuff they think is interesting15:08
bauzasmissed some parts, maybe15:08
n0anoglikson, pointed out the http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/a0d38e1278182eb09f06e22457d94c0c session might be scheduler interesting15:08
johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: hopefully that stuff becomes more obvious after we agree how to do the clustered stuff works15:09
bauzasn0ano: oh, right15:09
johnthetubaguyn0ano: node vs host thing in the scheduler is certainly related15:09
bauzasn0ano: then feel free to amend this ethepad :)15:09
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy yes, hope so, at least it is an imporatant feature for VMware now15:09
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n0anoas I said, I encourage everyone to update the etherpad as they think fit15:10
bauzasI was just speaking about Hi peers,15:10
bauzasToday is my last day at Bull. I truly appreciated working with you, in  particular when looking at all the achievements we had with the XLCloud  project. Seeing all people going into the same direction warmed me, and  I'm truly convinced that HPC and Remote Rendering coupled with OpenStack  will be someday the next key winning areas.15:10
bauzasI really enjoyed working on Climate with the help of INRIA, Bull and  latter Mirantis, and seeing people like Intel or IBM interested in the  project led me thinking that mixing upstream contributions to  open-source projects and business deals are complementary.15:10
bauzasI'll follow my path in another big OpenStack specialist, but I'm sure  we'll meet again at some events as the OpenStack ecosystem is quite  small and friendly.15:10
bauzasYou can reach me out by e-mail at sylvain.bauza@gmail.com or by IRC  (Freenode) PM bauzas, I'm still keen to discuss with all of you ! ;-)15:10
bauzasSee you,15:10
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bauzassorry all !15:10
bauzasI was speaking about http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/a848270c309b10517d4d186fecaf768f#.U1_A1ea9h-M15:10
n0anobauzas, :-)15:10
bauzasnevermind this above message, wrong c/p15:11
n0anolet's see, the other action was to publish nova-spec for no-db scheduling BP, anyone know if this was done?15:11
bauzasYorikSar ?15:11
YorikSarI didn't finish the spec yet.15:11
bauzasok, sure15:12
n0anoYorikSar, NP, I'll just bug you again next week :-)15:12
YorikSarIt seems that the blueprint is too old...15:12
bauzasn0ano: maybe we should put it again as action15:12
YorikSarI gues I'll have to reword it completely.15:12
n0ano#action YorikSar to publish nova-spec for no-db scheduling BP15:12
YorikSar(but first I have to understand which part of the scope is still actual)15:12
n0anoYorikSar, sounds like this might take you a little while, do you need more time?15:13
bauzasdo you feel you would need to wait for the Summit feedback ?15:13
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bauzasYorikSar: who will held the session btw. ?15:13
bauzasis it boris-42 ?15:13
johnthetubaguyI would do the spec to lead to a good session15:13
n0anojohnthetubaguy, +115:14
YorikSarI think I'll be able to produce at least a draft for it in spite of long holidays in Russia.15:14
n0anonothing like something on paper to focus attention15:14
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YorikSarbauzas: Yes, boris-42 is going to hold it. I'm going to work with him on my draft.15:14
johnthetubaguyI think making the no-db scheduler pluggable is the key15:14
johnthetubaguyI mean, optional15:14
n0anoYorikSar, OK, I don't want to pressure you too much but, if you're comfortable getting a draft out relatively soon, that's great15:15
n0anojohnthetubaguy, so you thing nodb pluggability is only an option?15:15
YorikSarjohnthetubaguy: Well... If we won't cut out old state synchronisation, adding another one would only increase the load on the system.15:15
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: right, the idea I have, is being able to choose between the new and the old option15:16
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: +115:16
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: many of us deploy off trunk, so we need to keep trunk working as we try new options, thats my main worry15:16
YorikSarjohnthetubaguy: From the user perspective there is no difference between them.15:16
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: I like the no-db stuff, I just need to make sure its optional in the first release, so we can sort out smooth upgrades between the old and new world15:17
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: its massive from the deployer perspective though15:17
YorikSarjohnthetubaguy: Once you restart your cloud new scheduler will sync state of all working compute node just like the old one would but w/o global SELECTs15:17
bauzasYorikSar: does that require memcache backend at least ?15:17
YorikSarbauzas: Nope15:17
bauzasYorikSar: is there any external dep ?15:18
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: agreed, but its quite an architectural change to force people to adopt15:18
PaulMurrayYorikSar, the issue is we want to chose when the new scheduler goes into use15:18
YorikSarIt can with SQL15:18
johnthetubaguyPaulMurray: +115:18
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YorikSarjohnthetubaguy, PaulMurray: I'm not sure I understand the reason for that...15:18
bauzasYorikSar: then it's worth having this as optional for Juno15:18
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YorikSarNew scheduler is basically an implementation improvement.15:19
PaulMurrayYorikSar, because we run large public services that we are very worried about15:19
PaulMurrayYorikSar, are you from mirantis?15:19
bauzasYorikSar: that's an disruptive change15:19
YorikSarPaulMurray: Yes, I'm from Mirantis.15:19
bauzasYorikSar: we need to be careful about the level of impact15:19
johnthetubaguyYorikSar: the other way of looking at this, if someone comes up with some other idea for doing this, that could also be another option, I want to encourage innovation here, but also not de-stabalise things15:19
PaulMurrayYorikSar, then I am sure you would not like me to add a change that made you run your service differently15:19
n0anoYorikSar, I think it's more a perception issue, it's a major change, even if hidden, so that can make deployers uncomforatble15:19
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PaulMurrayYorikSar, I want you to understand that I am all for this change, but I do need to control when it happens in my infrastructure - its a risk issue for the business15:20
YorikSarn0ano: Oh... It's not a major change, actually. It's just an optimization of state synchronization within the service. If you don't want to add new deps, you can just run migrations and you won't notice it.15:21
bauzasanyway, the idea is to write the spec and discuss it at summit time15:21
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n0anobauzas, +1 - that's what the summit is for15:21
YorikSarYeah. I hope Boris won't scare people any further...15:22
bauzasif there is no consensus before the summit, then let's the summit decide15:22
bauzasYorikSar: :)15:22
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n0anoYorikSar, :-)15:22
n0anolet's move on15:22
johnthetubaguyyep, I am −2 on this till its optional, its just way too risky as a "big bang" change, but your spec may convince me otherwise, just it seems very risky15:22
bauzasYorikSar: well, at least we know we have different view15:22
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n0anomoving on15:23
YorikSarbauzas: Yeah...15:23
johnthetubaguy+1 looking forward to the summit and reviewing the spec, but yeah, lets move on...15:23
n0ano#topic forklift status15:23
*** openstack changes topic to "forklift status (Meeting topic: gantt)"15:23
n0anobauzas, I believe your client library BP is approved, anything else to add?15:24
johnthetubaguywhat about the follow up blueprint? any news on that?15:24
johnthetubaguythe Juno-2 stuff15:24
bauzas#link https://review.openstack.org/8989315:24
bauzasthe proposal is there15:25
johnthetubaguycools, its in my queue now15:25
bauzasI also reopened the draft implementation of Juno-115:25
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bauzasI will have limited time this week to work on15:26
bauzasmostly holidays15:26
bauzasbut I'll resume my work by next week15:26
johnthetubaguyall sounds good, thanks for your work on that other spec, glad to get that all approved15:27
n0anobauzas, is there anything you want help on, I think we can find some people15:27
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: thanks15:27
bauzasn0ano: well, the amount of work for Juno-1 is not that huge15:27
johnthetubaguy+1 I would like to help out with this effort, where possible, I guess its probably just reviewing at this point15:27
johnthetubaguybauzas: we can always start the Juno-2 work during Juno-1 if we get there early15:27
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bauzasn0ano: I'm just in the middle of changing my affiliation (see my bad c/p above...)15:28
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: agreed15:28
n0anobauzas, just let us know, I don't believe in assigning 9 women to create a baby in 1 month :-)15:28
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: but the Juno-2 stuff is maybe more discussional yet :)15:28
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bauzasn0ano: ;)15:28
bauzasn0ano: you can maybe look at the very old implem15:29
bauzasn0ano: and review it to see some big misses15:29
n0anobauzas, sure, I can do that15:29
n0ano#action n0ano to review the old client library implementation15:30
bauzasn0ano: but I think we need to review the sched code to make sure we don't miss a crucial thing for the isolate-sched-db bp15:30
bauzasn0ano: that bp is important15:30
bauzasn0ano: and I don't want to miss an important thing15:30
n0anoI am worried that there are some hidden dependencies in the code that will surprise us when we do the implementation but we'll deal with that as it happens15:30
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bauzasn0ano: in particular, I'm really interested in discussing how we store aggs info if we consider not to rely on extensible RT at the moment15:31
bauzasn0ano: I went through all module imports15:31
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bauzasn0ano: to see what filters and managers were importing15:31
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bauzasn0ano: but maybe I missed some other things15:32
johnthetubaguyn0ano: its sure to happen, I don't think we should worry too much, its just an extra blueprint15:32
johnthetubaguythey way I see it...15:32
johnthetubaguyfix how scheduler gets given info, and gets it15:32
johnthetubaguysome stuff comes from compute15:32
johnthetubaguysome from api request15:32
johnthetubaguydo that first, then see where we end up15:32
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: well, specing bps are good for catching unnoticed things :)15:33
n0anoI just always worry that the devil is in the details, but yes, we'll just solve the problems that arise15:33
bauzasn0ano: +115:33
johnthetubaguyagreed, we identified issues, fix them in the bp, then repeat15:33
johnthetubaguyI think we have identified two clear classes of problem15:33
johnthetubaguyand two easy fixes for that issue15:33
bauzas(I hope so)15:34
johnthetubaguywell we have those two15:34
yjiang51johnthetubaguy: if the BP is approved quickly15:34
johnthetubaguylets run with them15:34
johnthetubaguyand then see what we missed15:34
johnthetubaguyyjiang51: yup, this breaks down if that dragges on too long,15:34
bauzassure thing :)15:34
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PaulMurrayn0ano, o/15:35
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n0anoOK, sounds like the forklift is making progress, anything else on this subject?15:35
johnthetubaguyI am sure there are loose ends, but they are going to be much easier to spot after the currently planned clean up15:35
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johnthetubaguyPaulMurray: you had a question?15:35
bauzasn0ano: nope15:35
n0anoPaulMurray, go ahead15:35
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PaulMurrayjohnthetubaguy, i have a call sorry15:36
n0anoPaulMurray, if you have something I should warn you I think we'll be ending soon15:37
n0anomoving on15:37
n0ano#topic summit sessions15:37
*** openstack changes topic to "summit sessions (Meeting topic: gantt)"15:37
n0anoI think we've already discussed the pretty well, anyone want to add anything?15:38
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n0anos/the pretty/this pretty15:38
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johnthetubaguywhat was that etherpad again?15:38
n0anobauzas, beat me :-(15:39
bauzasideally, we should provide the sched.org links15:39
johnthetubaguy+1 for sched.org links, when they go up15:39
n0anoit's an etherpad, feel free to update it15:39
n0anomoving on15:40
* bauzas doing it15:40
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n0ano#topic opens15:40
*** openstack changes topic to "opens (Meeting topic: gantt)"15:40
johnthetubaguydo we want to pre-discuss anything from that summit session list?15:40
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johnthetubaguyjust wondering if there is any design prep to make the sessions as productive as possible15:40
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy seems most of the topics have submitted its own nova-specs15:41
johnthetubaguyscheduler hints, I think it should become the next generation server groups15:41
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johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: cools, do you have a spec up for scheduler hints now?15:42
yjiang51johnthetubaguy: do you have any BP for your two-phase-commit idea for the claims?15:42
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: well, at least we should provide soon some detailed etherpads for each session15:42
n0anothe gantt API & no-db sessions are well researched, not sure about the others15:42
johnthetubaguyyjiang51: nope its more an implementation option15:42
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy i want to know more about your thinking about scheduler hint and server group15:42
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bauzasonce that done, we should amend https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Summit/Juno/Etherpads#Nova15:42
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n0anobauzas, +115:43
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy  https://review.openstack.org/#/c/88983/15:43
johnthetubaguybauzas: good point, do we have etherpads with a session plan yet?15:43
yjiang51johnthetubaguy: you mean no BP needed for it?15:43
n0anoI would suggest the the sussion proposer should set up an etherpad15:43
bauzasjohnthetubaguy: none I heard of15:43
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johnthetubaguyyjiang51: more the other way around, its an implemetation for some blueprint in the future, not really needed by its-self15:43
yjiang51johnthetubaguy: ok, got it.15:44
bauzasn0ano: +115:44
johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: thanks for the link, we can cover that here if we are done on other things15:44
johnthetubaguyn0ano: +1 thats the usual way15:44
bauzasn0ano: press the red 'action' button  then ;)15:44
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* n0ano was searching for the right button :-)15:44
johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: basic plan, server groups (affitiy/anti-affitiy) is basically a scheduler hint on steroids, I feel scheduler hints should look very similar15:45
bauzas#action ;)15:45
n0ano#action session proposers to create etherpad for their session15:45
johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: at least I would love them to look the same15:45
bauzasIIRC, we have YorikSar, jay-lau-513, mspreitz, devananda and me15:46
bauzasas session proposers15:46
n0anojohnthetubaguy, then would you propose we get rid of scheduler hints in favor of groups15:46
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy currently, the server group using hint to specify server group uuid as scheduler hint when create vm instance15:46
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johnthetubaguyn0ano: maybe, but I kinda like jaypipe's suggestion of making server groups a scheduler hint, I am cool with either way around really15:47
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy do you want enhance server group to use affinty/anti-affinity as scheduler hints?15:47
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johnthetubaguyso, basically I feel they should be the same, and easy to use15:47
johnthetubaguyand they should be persisted15:47
n0anoI just worry that if a is a superset of b when keep b around15:47
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n0anos/when/then why15:48
gliksonjohnthetubaguy: they are similar in a sense that in both cases a placement policy can be derived.. but the semantics is a bit different, overall.15:48
johnthetubaguyn0ano: sure, we might need to deprecate one of the APIs, or at least make them equivalent in the backend15:48
jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy I think that we can discuss JayPipes proposal for server group in the scheduler hint session15:48
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johnthetubaguyglikson: yes, but there is an overall more general thing that covers both I feel15:48
bauzasjay-lau-513: +115:49
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jay-lau-513johnthetubaguy with JayPipe's proposal, we do not need create server groups, but use scheudler hinits to achieve affinity/anti-affinity with scheduler hints, it is good to persist them15:49
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jay-lau-513bauzas I will update etherpad later to reflect the change15:50
johnthetubaguyjay-lau-513: yep, I think thats the best idea at this point, but need to think about the use cases a bit more15:50
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johnthetubaguynot all hints should be "sticky", like build on host X probably should be overridden by a live-migrate to Y15:50
johnthetubaguywhat should happen with resize is an interesting one, but needs some thought15:50
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jay-lau-513yes, sticky should be ignored15:51
llu-laptopI was once told by some nova core that the scheduler hint was in its way to be deprecated. is it changed?15:51
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johnthetubaguyllu-laptop: maybe, not heard of the deprecated plan myself, we need something better though15:52
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llu-laptopit was said that it might not be very good to have those kind of thing affecting scheduling specified in the api call from end user15:53
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johnthetubaguyllu-laptop: thats basically why its needed, but maybe they were talking about a specific scheduler hint15:53
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n0anollu-laptop, not sure I understand the, the end user always specifies things it needs (# cpus, mem, disk, ...)15:54
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bauzasjohnthetubaguy: agree, I don't see why hints would be removedf15:54
llu-laptopn0ano: nope, the admin specify those in flavor and let the user to choose15:54
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johnthetubaguyllu-laptop: yeah, for some stuff, maybe, doesn't work for server group like hints15:55
jay-lau-513llu-laptop  johnthetubaguy n0ano imho scheduler hint is an important feature for resource selection requirement, putting thoes in flavors is not convinent for operators as they may need to create many flavors for different requirement15:55
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n0anollu-laptop, implicitly the user is requesting that, the admin always controls what the nodes in a cloud support15:56
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PaulMurrayn0ano,  - sorry all - I'm back, it was a call from my daughter's doctor - I had to take it15:57
n0anoPaulMurray, hope she's OK, is your question quick?15:57
PaulMurrayn0ano, its ok, we past that I can deal with it later15:57
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n0anoOK then, it's almost at the top of the hour so we'll have to close15:58
n0anotnx everyone, we'll talk again next week (last talk before the summit)15:58
jay-lau-513thanks all, bye15:58
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"15:58
bauzassure thanks !15:58
openstackMeeting ended Tue Apr 29 15:58:36 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)15:58
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-04-29-15.00.html15:58
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-04-29-15.00.txt15:58
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/gantt/2014/gantt.2014-04-29-15.00.log.html15:58
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msdubovyingjun meteorfox hughsaunders marcoemorais aswadrangnekar kun_huang, andreykurilin penguinRaider ping17:00
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aswadrangnekarboris-42: hi all17:01
aswadrangnekarhi all17:01
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marcoemoraismsdubov: ping17:04
msdubovmarcoemorais, hi17:04
msdubov#startmeeting rally17:05
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openstackMeeting started Tue Apr 29 17:05:00 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is msdubov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.17:05
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:05
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: rally)"17:05
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'rally'17:05
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msdubovSo let's start out meeting17:05
msdubov#topic Resources descriptions in scenario configs17:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Resources descriptions in scenario configs (Meeting topic: rally)"17:05
msdubovmarcoemorais, Could you please tell a bit about your recent results you published in https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86116/17:06
marcoemoraismsdubov: patch set is no longer wip17:06
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marcoemoraismsdubov: biggest issue is the redundant processing in validation17:07
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msdubovmarcoemorais, the thing noticed by hughsaunders and me?17:07
marcoemoraismsdubov: I earlier raised this to boris-42 so he needs to re-confirm that is what he wants17:07
marcoemoraismsdubov: yes17:07
marcoemoraismsdubov: if necessary we can re-order things, but he didn't want that17:07
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msdubovmarcoemorais, hughsaunders also pointed out that even with this redundant processing the benchmarcks with 'image_exists' don't work17:08
msdubovmarcoemorais, yep, I see17:08
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msdubovmarcoemorais, Just saw your recent patch update17:09
marcoemoraismsdubov hughsaunders let me take a look at that particular issue — I test with a handful of nova scenarios17:09
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msdubovmarcoemorais, Does it fix that issue?17:09
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marcoemoraismsdubov: I will take a closer look at image_exists17:09
msdubovmarcoemorais, Ok17:10
msdubovmarcoemorais, So basically it seems to me that here17:10
marcoemoraismsdubov: anyway, once this patch is merged I can add the nova scenarios to the rally conf used for gating ci https://review.openstack.org/#/c/90897/17:10
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msdubovmarcoemorais, it's possible to add one line to perform args processing before validation17:10
msdubovmarcoemorais, this wouldn't make the code too dirty17:10
marcoemoraismsdubov: yes I proposed that to boris-42 but he didn't want it that way17:10
msdubovmarcoemorais, but anyway that should be discussed with participation of boris-4217:10
msdubovmarcoemorais, What was his argument?17:11
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marcoemoraismsdubov: he said that validation was going to be refactored17:11
msdubovmarcoemorais, Would it be then possible to put args processing somewhere in benchmark_engine.validate() (L103) instead of benchmark_engine.run() (L104)?17:12
msdubovmarcoemorais, just as a suggestion17:12
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marcoemoraismsdubov: well I have to rewrite the args passed to scenario, so it naturally fits in current location in code17:12
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msdubovmarcoemorais, also true17:13
msdubovhughsaunders, any opinions? ^^17:13
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msdubovSo ok let's discuss that tomorrow, since we have several other topics to cover now17:17
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msdubov#topic Ceilometer benchmark scenarios17:18
*** openstack changes topic to "Ceilometer benchmark scenarios (Meeting topic: rally)"17:18
msdubovaswadrangnekar, Could you please tell others a bit about your work?17:18
aswadrangnekarmsdubov: sure17:19
aswadrangnekarwe are targeting to cover all scenarios for ceilometer v2 api17:19
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msdubovaswadrangnekar, are you going to cover all scenarios in one patch or in several patches?17:20
aswadrangnekarpending scenarios are for queries and statistics17:20
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aswadrangnekarmsdubov: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:stackforge/rally+branch:master+topic:bp/benchmark-scenarios-for-celiometer,n,z17:20
aswadrangnekarseveral patches17:21
msdubovaswadrangnekar, Yep, I see, thanks17:21
msdubovaswadrangnekar, Great that several people are working on it17:21
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msdubovaswadrangnekar, So your patch is ready for review?17:21
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aswadrangnekarresources and meters should be up for review soon there are one scenario in each  of them17:22
msdubovaswadrangnekar, Ok, thanks17:22
msdubovI will take a look at it17:22
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aswadrangnekarwe need to focus on queries should be ready soon17:22
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msdubovaswadrangnekar, Will require lots of review, so Rally cores should also look at these patches. Seems though like I'm now the only core developer at this meeting =)17:23
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msdubov#topic Tempest tests17:24
*** openstack changes topic to "Tempest tests (Meeting topic: rally)"17:24
msdubovandreykurilin, andreykurilin_ Could you please share your progress with Tempest? Also probably that by Olga if you know about it17:25
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andreykurilin_Kun left a comment about new scenarios for Tempest Benchmark(https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86836/). When I tried to fix them, I discovered bigger problem.17:25
hughsaundershey all, sorry was an hour off on meetime time17:25
andreykurilin_Previous my patch(https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86337/) replaced `testr` launcher with `subunit` in verification. This helps to split test discovery and execution, but broke rally verification for "compute" and "full" sets.17:26
msdubovhughsaunders, no problem17:26
andreykurilin_I can't launch several tests from `compute` set via subunit without discovery.17:27
msdubovandreykurilin_, Have you understood why that happens?17:27
andreykurilin_a bit:)17:27
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andreykurilin_Today I chat with sdague and andreaf at #openstack-qa17:27
hughsaundersmsdubov: marcoemorais, I would prefer to remove the redundant processing from the btypes patch, but I can see that probably won't be straightforward17:27
hughsaundersadding more redundant processing to the validators is probably quickest way to get it merged. And I do really like the feature, thanks for working on it17:28
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msdubovhughsaunders, What do you think about rewriting the scenario arguments at validation step? Do you also think that this will be too complicated?17:30
hughsaundersmsdubov: I would prefer to do the rewrite before validation, so they can stay seperate17:30
msdubovandreykurilin_, Thanks! Do you know anything about Olga's progress with her patches? She's unfortunately absent at the moment17:30
hughsaundersbut I realise the meeting has moved on, sorry for dragging topic back17:30
msdubovhughsaunders, Well this is a really important topic.17:31
msdubovhughsaunders, Besides it wouldn't be great to merge a "quick" solution and the rewrite lots of code17:31
msdubovhughsaunders, So yet another method here https://github.com/stackforge/rally/blob/master/rally/orchestrator/api.py#L102-L10417:32
msdubovhughsaunders, before validation()?17:32
hughsaundersI do think validation should come after translation, so that the values that will be used are checked17:32
marcoemoraishughsaunders: so I had originally raised this point to boris-42, if I could upload a patch which does validation after processing, would that satisfy?17:32
andreykurilin_msdubov: I ask sdague and about correct way to split test discover and execution, but sdague said that it's a bad idea:)17:32
andreykurilin_msdibov: I do not know about Olga's progress17:33
hughsaundersyeah, another func in benchmark engine and orchestrator api makes sense to me17:33
msdubovandreykurilin_, Ok, thanks. Did sdague suggest something instead?17:33
andreykurilin_msdubov, yes17:33
msdubovhughsaunders, marcoemorais Also think that would be a good solution. So let's discuss that with boris-42 tomorrow once again17:33
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andreykurilin_msdubov, he proposed to not split discovery and test execution.17:34
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msdubovandeykurilin_ obviously :)17:35
andreykurilin_nsdubov,he said, that correct way to get time of test execution is to parse results of subunit stream17:35
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msdubovandreykurilin_, So great, you now have an understanding with direction to go futher. Did you realize already whether it's a hard task to parse this stream?17:36
hughsaundersthe current code uses a filter to convert it to xml (iirc) so should be able to parse that?17:37
andreykurilin_yes, i already use it here - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86836/17:38
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msdubovhughsaunders, andreykurilin_ Yep, I'm just not familiar with the format17:38
msdubovandreykurilin_, In which file?17:38
andreykurilin_`tempest_log_wrapper` from https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86836/10/rally/benchmark/scenarios/tempest/tempest.py saves results as add_atomic_actions17:39
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msdubovandreykurilin_, Yep I see17:40
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msdubovandreykurilin_, So then may we hope to see an update for "Tempest benchmarks - Part 2" soon? :)17:40
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andreykurilin_in near future I'll discuss solution of current problem with boris-42 and update my patch17:41
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andreykurilin_Also, sdague ended the conversation with phrase: "if that was addressed, and rally was reading the subunit, we could, for instance, apply the rally analysis at the end of every gate run"17:41
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hughsaundersawesome :D17:42
msdubovandreykurilin_, Really great17:43
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msdubov#topic CLI output17:43
*** openstack changes topic to "CLI output (Meeting topic: rally)"17:43
msdubovSo I've prepared a patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/89941/17:43
msdubovThat's what we discussed at one of the previous meetings17:44
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msdubovIt merges the two tables (atomic actions & overall results) in the task results output into one17:44
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msdubovAnd also rewrites the code so that it uses the openstack.common code to draw tables (instead of PrettyTable directly)17:44
msdubovhughsaunders, Could you review it please?17:45
hughsaundersmsdubov: will do17:45
msdubovhughsaunders, thanks17:45
hughsaundersmsdubov: just read the commit message and the after paste looks much cleaner17:45
msdubovhughsaunders, Unfortunately I wasn't able to split the atomic actions results and the overall results with a line17:46
msdubovhughsaunders, Seems like PrettyTable doesn't support this kind of stuff17:46
msdubovAlso my patch actually leaves some places written with a direct usage of PrettyTable, but this will be hopefully addressed by other patches from other developers17:47
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msdubovThe next step after code refactoring will be to add the --percentile parameter to "task detailed", to make the percentiles customizable17:47
msdubov#topic Free discussion17:48
*** openstack changes topic to "Free discussion (Meeting topic: rally)"17:48
msdubovhughsaunders, andreykurilin_, marcoemorais Does anybody have anything to add?17:48
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andreykurilin_msdubov, nope :)17:49
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hughsaundersnot from me17:49
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marcoemoraisnothing from me17:50
msdubovhughsaunders, andreykurilin_, marcoemorais, aswadrangnekar Ok, then many thanks for participation!17:51
msdubov#endmeeting rally17:51
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"17:51
hughsaundersmsdubov: thanks for chairing17:51
openstackMeeting ended Tue Apr 29 17:51:05 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)17:51
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-04-29-17.05.html17:51
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-04-29-17.05.txt17:51
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/rally/2014/rally.2014-04-29-17.05.log.html17:51
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dolphmayoung, bknudson, dstanek, jamielennox, morganfainberg, stevemar, gyee, henrynash, topol, marekd, lbragstad, joesavak, shardy, fabiog, fmarco76, nkinder, ericn: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting17:58
morganfainbergo/ it's that time!17:58
bknudsondolphm: hi17:58
lbragstaddolphm: hey17:58
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dolphm#startmeeting keystone17:59
openstackMeeting started Tue Apr 29 17:59:35 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is dolphm. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.17:59
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:59
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)"17:59
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'keystone'17:59
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dolphmi expect this meeting to be mostly open discussion, following an improv session by our special guest stevemar18:00
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dolphm#topic Design summit schedule18:00
*** openstack changes topic to "Design summit schedule (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:00
dolphm#link http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/18:00
ayoungCompress3ed tokens....review it18:00
morganfainbergdolphm, do we get interpretive dance too?18:00
dolphmmorganfainberg: oh i hope so!18:00
ayoungYou know you want it18:00
dolphmso most projects are starting to post their design summit schedules to http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/18:01
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dolphmit'd be awesome if everyone took this time to look for obvious conflicts between sessions that keystoners should be attending18:01
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ayoungdolphm, ++18:02
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dolphmdon't forget to look through the new "cross-project workshops" track as well18:02
morganfainbergthere are a lot of cross project items that are going to be cool18:02
lbragstad#link http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/overview/type/cross-project+workshops#.U1_pS1feRww18:03
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gyeeis there a barbican track or it is rolled into keystone?18:03
ayoungNot rolled in18:03
morganfainbergthis one is an important one for anyone interested in SQLAlchemy, Dogpile, Alembic, etc http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/0a0e3cb824a090773c42b67d6ed85d2918:03
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ayoungThe'yll just all be sitting together in the devlounge18:04
dolphmgyee: looks like they'll have their own track, but it's not published yet. keep an eye out for it18:04
dolphmgyee: their sessions aren't even reviewed yet18:04
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gyeeayoung, dolphm, seem like there are some integration points we need to discuss18:04
gyeekeystone and barbican I mean18:04
ayounggyee, ++18:04
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morganfainberggyee, this is something we'll likely just need to catch up in the dev-lounge/podarea/whatever it is18:05
morganfainberggyee, for in-person18:05
joesavakdolphm - the "Federation" 2:40p Weds design session is before the 9:50 a summit session "Federated Identity & Federated Service Provider support". I think the summit session would drive attendance to the design session.18:05
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gyeeyes absolutely18:05
joesavaksummit-session being thurs18:05
nkindergyee: I'm curious about what integration points you have in mind18:06
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gyeenkinder, like credential management18:06
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nkindergyee: using it as the password store?18:06
stevemaro/ late18:07
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gyeenkinder, no, not password store18:07
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gyeeI mean access keys, certs, etc18:07
morganfainbergnkinder, credentials, certs, etc18:07
morganfainberggyee, ++18:07
dolphmjoesavak: looking...18:07
stevemarjoesavak, i agree, i was hoping we could switch things around18:07
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dolphmjoesavak: where's the conference schedule?18:08
joesavakdolpm - links: design: http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/ab0966f5ec41f78e929effd499e0286f#.U1_p4_ldUog    summit session: http://openstacksummitmay2014atlanta.sched.org/event/e04ac68f0c98be95f9fcbf2812e44d5d#.U1_qf_ldUog18:08
joesavaklink: http://openstacksummitmay2014atlanta.sched.org/18:08
dolphmjoesavak: thanks18:08
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ayounggyee, you saw this:  http://junodesignsummit.sched.org/event/9a6b59be11cdeaacfea70fef3432893118:10
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dolphmwould swapping the Federation session with python-keystoneclient session resolve the conference conflict?18:10
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ayoungWe'll need to figure out an identity scheme for the various Queue Sinks and sources18:10
gyeeayoung, w00t!18:10
stevemardolphm, i think it would18:10
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ayoungwhat is the conflict?18:11
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gyeeayoung, lets get certmonger in there, we need a realistic provisioning18:11
gyeeprovisioning process18:11
ayounggyee, ++18:11
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morganfainberggyee, ++18:11
dolphmso python-keystoneclient Wednesday @ 2:40p and Federation Thursday @ 11:50a (with the Federated Identity conference session Thursday @ 9:50a)18:12
joesavakdolphm +118:12
ayounggyee, but certmonger only handles "Here are my certs"  we need to figure out the mapping from X509 Cert name constraints to the endpoints and hypervisors etc...18:12
gyeewe are having the same issue with tripleO with cert provisioning18:12
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dolphmthursday will be 100% identity then18:12
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gyeewe been told no self-signed certs, but we need a realistic solution, so I am pushing certmonger18:13
morganfainbergdolphm, thats a good thing imo18:13
morganfainbergdolphm, keeps general focus18:13
jamielennoxdolphm: do you know if it's possible to reword the session description now it's in?18:13
dolphmmorganfainberg: ++ and friday is sort of post-auth stuff18:13
dolphmauthorization & service catalog18:13
dolphmerr thursday18:14
ayounggyee, do you guys have an API for submitting and retrieving a Cert to a  CA separate from the Dogtog one?18:14
dolphmno i was right, the 16th is friday :P18:14
ayoungIf not...we can drive that in Barbican.  I think they have a BP for it already18:14
gyeeayoung, no, we don't have an agreed approach right now, that's the problem18:14
gyeeagreed upon18:14
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gyeeayoung, I am fine with Barbican, so as long as it is consistent18:15
ayounggyee, I'll be prepped to demo certmonger stuff, and we can discuss the wider CA story there.  Barbican as a CA front works for me.18:16
morganfainbergayoung, ++18:16
gyeeayoung, ++18:16
ayoungAnd certmonger<->Baribican makes sense18:16
nkinderayoung: agreed18:17
dolphm(assuming no one sees any further scheduling conflicts -- if any arise, ping me ASAP so we can try to resolve them)18:17
joesavakthanks dolphm!18:17
dolphm#topic Open discussion following improv and interpretive dance by stevemar18:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion following improv and interpretive dance by stevemar (Meeting topic: keystone)"18:17
dolphmstevemar: o/18:17
ayounggyee, also, I think we'll need to driver the cryptography.py work for CMS, which means accepting a 509, and verifying a signature.  That will help both Keystone Client verification as well as the Messaging verification18:17
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dstanekgo stevemar go18:17
stevemari've prepared a table flip18:18
stevemar (╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻)18:18
stevemarthats all i got18:18
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morganfainberg┬─┬ ノ( ^_^ノ)18:18
stevemarserves me right for questioning the agenda18:18
dolphmstevemar: damn straight18:19
dolphm#link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/71181/18:19
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ayoungReview compressed tokens.  Please!18:19
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gyeeon it18:20
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ayoungCompressed tokens will lead to being able to extract the singer info from the token prior to verification, and thus fetching the certs, allowing for multiple providers.18:20
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ayoungOh...also, anyone have any real resistance to an addition to the mapping API that says "just pass through the groups as is, don't require an explicit enumeration of them?"18:22
ayoung*allowing* explicit enumeration is a good thing, but requiring it leads to duplication of effort for places that don't want or need it.18:22
morganfainbergayoung, do we have the bug/bp to get testing of the examples handy?18:22
ayoungmorganfainberg, you mean PKI signed tokens?18:23
ayoungcompressed rather?18:23
bknudsonayoung: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/90472/ has a -2 on it but there's no suggestion what to do differently.18:23
morganfainbergayoung, was that one where we wanted to test the example scripts?18:23
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ayoungbknudson, if the "server" switches from PKI to uuid tokens, the existing tokens that were revoked are still in memcache18:24
morganfainbergayoung, i know we had ~2-3 reviews we wanted to test the example scripts.18:24
dolphmayoung: why is this only Partial-Bug: 1255321 rather than Closes-Bug?18:24
ayoungand they went from revoked to unrevoked18:24
ayoungyeah, I need to resplit the example scripts...on my list for this week18:25
morganfainbergayoung, ah just want to tag related reviews for tracking on that bug/bp if possible :) that way we can say "no no we're planning on implementing tests" and see what we need to incorporate. that way we don't miss something18:25
stevemarbut we still don't have anything that tests the example scripts?18:26
ayoungdolphm, hmm...good question18:26
bknudsonayoung: seems like auth_token always worked that way -- cached tokens aren't checked if they're revoked18:26
ayoungthat bug is a Server bug, and it needs this patch in order to issue signed tokens18:26
morganfainbergstevemar, the plan is to work on that specifically in Juno, tag it to J1 or such so we have a timeline but not require it before.18:26
morganfainbergstevemar, that way it's on the radar we have a timeline, but we don't block work18:26
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morganfainbergand yes, i'll commit to getting that work done if we get down to the wire on it18:27
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morganfainbergbut hopefully i can convince everyone to collaborate on it vs. just waiting till it gets done at the last minute18:27
ayoungdolphm, so the client patch is partial, and the Compressed PKI provider would be the other half.  I have not yet written it, as it won't pass check until the client is avaialb3e.  It is a simple one line difference from the current PKI provider18:28
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ayoungbknudson, you are correct, but we have a patch going through right now that is attempting to rectify that:  let me see if I can find the link18:28
gyeebknudson, ayoung, didn't we have the same discussion last week about the other patch which does the same thing?18:29
ayounggyee, heh, yeah18:29
ayoungfrom the other side18:29
bknudsongyee: right, that patch merged and now uuid-only setup fails... because there's no revocation list18:29
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bknudsonayoung: could you post the keystone server changes for compressed tokens so I can try it/18:30
gyeebknudson, I thought that patch is token format independent18:30
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ayoungbknudson, wilco18:30
bknudsongyee: I thought it was too18:30
stevemarayoung, i like the idea of supporting a bunch of group names in mapping, but probably needs to be thought out a bit more, perfect for a side session in the dev lounge18:30
ayoungstevemar, ++18:31
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bknudsongyee: but if you use uuid tokens you probably didn't pki_setup, so auth_token can't get the revocation list18:31
ayoungstevemar, I think we can do ity without an API change, actually, just a change on the enforcement of the rules processing18:31
gyeebknudson, ahhhh! I remember now18:31
bknudsongyee: and with the change we check UUID tokens against the revocation list18:31
gyeethere's also a bug about requiring PKI setup even though token format is set to UUID18:31
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stevemarayoung, agreed, it might just open a discussion about how to handle domains, and we should get others opinion on that too18:32
ayoungbknudson, I('m OK with that.  Lets make it as painful as possible for people to stay on UUID tokens!   But seriously...I wonder what the right logic is?  Maybe check_revocations needs to be configurable.18:32
bknudsongyee: so my proposed fix is to allow auth_token to fail to fetch the revocation list18:32
gyeestevemar, you mean hierarchical domains? :D18:32
dolphmayoung: it should be Closes-Bug in the client then, we'd track against keystone itself separately18:32
stevemargyee,  the old fashioned normal one18:33
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ayoungdolphm, that makes sense...I'll change18:33
stevemargyee, not those crazy new fangled hierarchical ones18:33
morganfainbergayoung, the bug should be filed against server and client if it needs to be tracked in both places.18:33
ayoungmorganfainberg, it is18:34
jamielennoxbknudson: i haven't been following - but that doesn't sound right - why would you need them to fail to fetch the list?18:34
ayoungjust listed as "affects"18:34
morganfainbergayoung, ah easy then18:34
morganfainbergayoung, yep see it18:34
jamielennoxbknudson: you can still revoke a UUID token18:34
gyeestevemar, I am hungry for a hierarchical in-and-out burger, maybe I'll get one after the meeting18:34
bknudsonjamielennox: fetching the revocation list fails because there's no PKI certs.18:34
jamielennoxbknudson: why? all it should need is the CA cert from the server18:35
bknudsonjamielennox: the server doesn't have a CA cert... if you're using UUID tokens why do you need CA cert?18:35
bknudsondeployments didn't need it before this change.18:35
jamielennoxdid we not allow UUID token revocations before this then? i was under the impression that we did18:36
gyeejamielennox, for UUID, validation is over the network18:36
bknudsonjamielennox: we did allow it. But we never checked the revocation list for UUID tokens.18:36
jamielennoxgyee: but we would always allow cachig18:36
gyeejamielennox, right, caching is a security tradeoff18:37
jamielennoxgyee: the revocation list was just a way to remove the UUID token from memcache before it expired18:37
gyeesecurity-performance tradeoff18:37
gyeejamielennox, if we really want to do it right, have a lightweight process to listening on the events and update the cache accordingly18:38
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dolphmgyee: i think caching should be a given, but how long you cache for is the trade off!18:38
jamielennoxgyee: yea, you mentioned that and i've no idea how you architect it18:38
jamielennoxgyee: really we should have all the auth_tokens listening for notifications from keystone18:38
gyeedolphm, absolutely! but that's a decision customer needs to make18:38
jamielennoxbut you can't really do something like that in middleware18:39
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dolphmjamielennox: why not?18:39
gyeejamielennox, what is caching for anyway, if what you wanted is real time validation18:39
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dstaneki'd be worried if we only listened for revocation events and didn't have a list or something to catchup the process (or validate that is has what it needs)18:40
jamielennoxdolphm: well it18:40
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dolphmdstanek: ++ the list is critical, which is why we started there18:40
jamielennoxdolphm: well it's python you can do almost anything - but would you need to spawn a subprocess or something? because you need a server that can respond to notifications and middleware can't do that18:41
jamielennoxgyee: i was just under the impression that we used to allow that - i guess we must never have18:41
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dolphmjamielennox: oh i didn't read "lightweight process" as "subprocess" - i just read that as message listener18:42
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gyeejamielennox, security and performance is one of those things that will need constant calibrations18:42
gyeeits not a one size fits all18:42
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gyeewhat we can offer is flexibility, really18:43
jamielennoxdolphm: right - but middleware is only triggered on an incoming request as a wrapper. if we wanted to actually have a listener then that would require a new thread of control that could sit and listen somehow18:43
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bknudsonit could gobble up all the messages when it woke up18:43
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gyeebknudson, there's no wake up18:43
bknudsonand if it got too far behind then it'd get the full list18:44
jamielennoxgyee: there is - per request18:44
gyeeits a separate process which always listening on the revocation events18:44
dolphmjamielennox: you should be able to create a listening on __init__, no?18:44
jamielennoxbknudson: do the queue implementations support that - what if it's getting a request/day18:44
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gyeeampq doesn't support pushing?18:45
dstanekif you register a callback from a notification won't that callback be executed as the notification arrives and not need a request?18:45
jamielennoxdolphm: sure - but it still needs to be a thread/subprocess18:45
gyeeor it is strictly a pull model18:45
jamielennoxdstanek: all this stuff is controlled by an event loop somewhere, we *could* try to get access to that from middleware but that's crossign boundaries18:46
bknudsonbtw -- the way nova works with the default setup is that there's a separate in-memory cache for each "thread"18:47
dolphmgyee: both/either18:47
bknudsonso one thread could have the token cached and it works and another doesn't have the token cached and it fails18:47
gyeedolphm, both/either sounds good :-)18:48
jamielennoxbknudson: is nova handling this differently?18:48
gyeebknudson, they have the *option* to use a distributed cache no?18:48
dolphmjamielennox: i think he's just referring to auth_token's default in-memory token cache18:48
dolphmthere's nothing specific about nova in the example18:48
bknudsongyee: I'm guessing if they use memcache they'd have consistent results.18:49
bknudsonmemcache for token caching seems like overkill18:49
morganfainbergbknudson, heh18:49
jamielennoxso, does anyone know how the other projects support integrating the HTTP listener event loop with the AMQP event loop?18:50
jamielennoxi haven't done that18:50
morganfainbergjamielennox, not sure.18:50
jamielennoxdoes it 'just work' because of socket.select()?18:50
morganfainbergjamielennox, it might "just work"18:50
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jamielennoxbecause in that case we might be able to spawn a listener in __init__18:51
bknudsonwhat project would be listening for amqp events?18:51
dolphmbknudson: auth_token18:51
jamielennoxalthough then we would have a listener per worker process which is not ideal18:52
jamielennoxbknudson: ceilometer is the main one i think18:52
gyeejamielennox, make it configurable, per process or shared18:52
morganfainbergjamielennox, the way the fan-out queues work that would be most correct if auth_token itself was meant to listen for that for a thread-local cache18:52
morganfainbergjamielennox, /for a/with a18:53
ayoungbknudson, make revocation checking a configurable option is, I think the only solution.18:53
ayoungAnd, no, we are not spawing a separate thread for it.18:53
jamielennoxmorganfainberg: yea because it will be a lot of extra work for a memcache setup to have every listener try to remove a token from the cache18:53
bknudsonayoung: ok, I'll take a look at that as a solution18:53
ayoungbknudson, the issue is that the server doesn't know if the token format is PKI or UUID, and it doesn't know if it should be looking for revocation events.  With PKI, revocation (events or list) is a must have,  with UUID, it is a nice-to-have....but with caching, it really should be required18:55
morganfainbergjamielennox, depending on the number of workers18:55
bknudsonayoung: I might have an option to check revocation list for UUID tokens?18:55
ayoungbknudson, there is no way to distinguish18:55
ayoungit might have been issued as PKI, but thne the MD5/SHA256 submitted as the token itself18:55
morganfainberg5 minutes18:55
ayoungit will be treated as a Keystone lookup....but by the time it gets put in memcahced, that detail is forgotten18:55
dolphmmorganfainberg: 2?18:56
bknudsonayoung: if auth_token gets a MD5 hash of PKI token it typically goes to the server18:56
morganfainbergdolphm, maybe the clock here is off then \18:56
dolphmbknudson: why do you need the revocation list for UUID tokens?18:56
morganfainbergdolphm, here = my computer18:56
dolphmbknudson: you need to validate them online to populate headers anyway18:56
morganfainbergdolphm, caching.18:56
morganfainbergdolphm, if auth)_token is caching, you don't ask keystone for token validity18:57
dolphmmorganfainberg: because you already have, and trust that cached data for some duration18:57
dolphmmorganfainberg: what does that have to do with the revocation list?18:57
morganfainbergdolphm, you could use the revocation list to know if you should trust that token (uuid or not)18:57
bknudsonthe revocation list is cached on a different schedule18:57
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"18:58
openstackMeeting ended Tue Apr 29 18:58:00 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)18:58
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-04-29-17.59.html18:58
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-04-29-17.59.txt18:58
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2014/keystone.2014-04-29-17.59.log.html18:58
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jeblairanyone around for the infra meeting?18:58
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jeblairit's the designated week off for the project so no worries if you're, you know, actually taking the week off.  :)18:58
jeblair#startmeeting infra18:59
openstackMeeting started Tue Apr 29 18:59:17 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is jeblair. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.18:59
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.18:59
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)"18:59
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'infra'18:59
jeblair#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting18:59
jeblairLast meeting:18:59
jeblair#link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-04-22-19.01.html18:59
jeblair#topic Gerrit upgrade18:59
*** openstack changes topic to "Gerrit upgrade (Meeting topic: infra)"18:59
lifelesso/ ping if you need me otherwise I'm in -> -alt18:59
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fungiwe're early?19:00
jeblairi think this is the only thing we really have on the agenda...19:00
jeblairfungi: are we?19:00
sdaguenot any more :)19:00
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jeblairso, we upgraded!19:01
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jeblairi have a few things on the punch list19:01
jeblair* something's weird with tag jobs19:01
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jeblair* turbo hipster's vote looks wrong on this patch: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86443/19:01
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jeblair* and of course we need to restart for the cosmetic changes19:02
jeblairthat's all i have right now; am i missing anything?19:02
SergeyLukjanovit was re restart ;)19:02
anteayasearching for strings doesn't seem to work19:02
anteayaregex's work19:02
dimsjeblair, and "recheck migrations" did not work on that same review19:02
fungii'm as of yet unconvinced turbo-hipster is operable. it ignored dims's recheck19:02
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jeblairyeah, i'm not really concerned about that.  turbo-hipster inc has their own crack team of ops to deal with that...19:03
sdaguejeblair: I noticed merge collision not -2ing a patch19:03
clarkbthey probably need a regex update19:03
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anteayaclarkb: hey19:03
anteayaclarkb: you are on holidays19:03
jeblairclarkb: heh, you're terrible at vacations19:03
jeblairsdague: link?19:03
sdaguelet me go dig it up19:04
jeblair(re turbo-hipster -- it's the fact that it was -1 then +1 but the approval summary still said -1 that's troubling)19:04
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jeblairoh good grief, what's the deal with the bird?19:04
clarkbnot really here >_>19:04
jeblairwe should get rid of that19:04
zaroanteaya: what do you mean about searching for strings?19:05
sdaguehah, I totally missed the bird when I looked at it this morning19:05
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sdagueI noticed that change because it was in my review list as 'submitted'19:05
jesusauruswell, turbo-hipster +1'd patch 21 after -1'ing patch 23, so the -1 is accurate19:05
anteayazaro: if you look at teh backscroll with tjones and myself today, she was looking for message:"spawn refactor - phase 1" to return results19:05
fungijesusaurus: good eye19:05
anteayait didn't19:05
sdague"Submitted, Merge Pending" that is19:06
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ianwre gerrit upgrage : is it a known issue that the regex matching for jenkins results isn't doing the formatting any more?19:06
jeblairsdague: oh, that's actually a missing dependency, not a conflict -- that's something we should fix in zuul19:06
anteayazaro: I got her going again with topic:^bp/vmware-spawn.* but taht doesn't solve the string search issue19:06
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jeblairsdague: but i think it's consistent with old behavior19:06
fungijeblair: i think jesusaurus's insight explains the turbo-hipster -1 rather well19:06
jeblairfungi, jesusaurus: thanks for catching that; i'm striking it from the punch list19:07
zaroanteaya: hmm, i remember that working for me.19:07
anteayaianw: what regex?19:07
sdagueok, then it can wait until later19:07
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jeblairalso, wow that change was started a long time ago.  :)19:07
fungiianw: the formatting is what we've got a pending fix merged for, awaiting the next reasonable timme to restart gerrit19:07
anteayafungi: would that explain my outcome with tjones?19:08
ianwfungi: ok, thanks19:08
fungianteaya: unrelated19:08
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sdaguejeblair: so question on dashboards, where do those go? (i.e. how do I submit them)19:09
fungianteaya: i think ianw was asking about the regular expressions used in commentlink configuration within gerrit, not having to do with search queries19:09
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jeblairsdague: i think mordred was looking into how to do that.  they are special branches in the repo -- my guess is we might want to have jeepyb do it, or we might want to set up those branches for review.19:10
ianwanteaya: yeah, the regex's in https://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/config/tree/modules/openstack_project/manifests/gerrit.pp19:10
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jeblairsdague: i think in the interim, we can manually push some in when you're ready19:10
zaroanteaya: i don't think the spaces work, you need to do "message:spawn message:refactor message:phase .."19:10
sdaguejeblair: ok. I can probably convert most of these custom queries to dashboards, but having a way to review / test them would be good19:10
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anteayazaro: yeah, which is not how I would expect to have to do a string search query19:11
sdaguejeblair: ok, I'll see about converting the basic no negative feedback one, that will be the most generic one people will want I think19:11
zaroanteaya: gerrit doc doesn't say it supports what you want :)19:11
anteayazaro: searching for one word at a time and chaining them with AND worked but was contrary to my expectations19:11
anteayazaro: you used to be able to search for strings like that19:12
jeblairsdague: yeah, we certainly want to review them; testing them might be hard without just pushing them in to see what happens.  though the query language being the same as searches helps.19:12
anteayaand I can't search for message:- or message:"-"19:12
anteayawhich was a character in the original string19:12
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zarointeresting, i guess i never tried to search like that before.19:13
sdaguejeblair: yeh19:13
jeblairany other new-gerrit issues?19:13
sdagueanteaya: my guess is secondary indexes are doing stop words, so that's dropped19:14
sdagueit's a lucene index on the secondary, right?19:14
jeblairsdague: yes19:14
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fungilinks including target="_blank" by default could be considered a new gerrit issue i suppose, though not sure whether it's one we care enough to solve/investigate19:14
sdagueyeh, so think less "grep" and more google19:14
jeblairfungi: i wonder if there's an option for that19:15
fungii don't see a personal preferences option anyway19:16
fungicould be a global setting somewhere, i suppose19:16
fungii'll dig in the config ref a little19:16
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jeblairwe _could_ write a commentlink parser that strips them out19:17
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jeblair(which, i believe technically we have inadvertently done for the zuul links -- it's just inconsistent now)19:18
jeblair(or will be after the restart)19:18
fungiapparently commentlinks are now configurable per-project as well19:19
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sdaguejeblair: I think this is a reasonable inbox zero kind of query -  status:open NOT label:Code-Review>=0,self label:Verified>=1,jenkins NOT label:Code-Review<=-1 NOT label:Workflow<=-119:20
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* sdague <3 queries that can mix label and id19:20
jeblairyeah that's nice19:21
jeblairsdague: what if you -2 a change?19:21
fungilabel:Code-Review<=-1 would include -219:21
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sdagueI think my only question is if NOT label:Code-Review>=0,self applies to all patches, or current patch only. If #1, then it probably has to change to >=119:23
anteayamy connection had dropped19:23
anteayawhat are stop words?19:23
sdagueif #2 then it's probably ok19:23
fungii believe labels only ever apply to the latest patchset19:24
jeblairsdague: i would guess #2 based on my usage...19:24
sdaguefungi: ok, cool19:24
sdagueyeh, I'm trying to find an instance where I have an old 0 comment19:24
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jeblair#topic Upcoming project renames19:26
*** openstack changes topic to "Upcoming project renames (Meeting topic: infra)"19:26
jeblairwe have some now19:26
jeblair#link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Upcoming_project_renames19:27
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jeblairi have some things to do friday and will be out next week19:27
fungiahh, i missed blazar was finally okayed. awesome19:28
jeblairso i may not be particularly useful in that department for a bit19:28
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jeblairwe could just do it on, say, thursday -- or we can see if the crew that's around next week is interested19:29
fungii could rename things this weekend, but with both you and clarkb travelling that seems unwise. thursday's fine with me though, or roping people into it next week19:29
fungii have no real preference and can do it whenever19:29
jeblairfungi: i lean toward deferring it right now, we have quite a bit on our plate while being short-staffed19:30
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jeblair(i think i'm not eager to make _more_ work for us right now)19:31
fungifair enough19:31
jeblairit being the first 2.8 rename, we could have... surprises.19:31
fungii'll bring it up next thursday and see how those who are around feel about viability19:31
fungier, next tuesday (in the meeting)19:31
anteayacan you create a test repo and rename it prior to next tuesday19:32
anteayawould that have any value?19:32
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anteayaguess not, since you can never delete anything in gerrit19:32
jeblairanteaya: on review-dev, sure, if we have time.19:32
anteayaoh okay, yeah there19:33
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jeblair#topic open discussion19:33
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)"19:33
jeblairanything else?19:33
ianwjust wanted to chase up on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/86842/19:34
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anteayazaro: you were going to change the db schema on review-dev to match the db schema on review, were you not?19:35
fungiianw: i'm cool with merging that later today, after i confirm i have no other gotchas in nodepool19:35
jeblairfungi, ianw: ++19:35
jeblairwell, thanks everyone, and enjoy the rest of the "off week"  :)19:37
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings"19:37
openstackMeeting ended Tue Apr 29 19:37:40 2014 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)19:37
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-04-29-18.59.html19:37
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-04-29-18.59.txt19:37
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2014/infra.2014-04-29-18.59.log.html19:37
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zehicle_at_dellttx, did I miss the TC meeting?20:06
dolphmzehicle_at_dell: nope, most of the big meetings are cancelled this week per the release schedule20:07
dolphmzehicle_at_dell: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Icehouse_Release_Schedule20:07
zehicle_at_dellwhew, ok20:07
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zehicle_at_delldolphm, I'm reading next week as the off week.20:08
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zehicle_at_delldolphm, nm.  I see it's thursday based20:09
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dolphmzehicle_at_dell: ++20:09
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rustlebeebreak week \o/20:19
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