Wednesday, 2015-04-29

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adahmsMorning, all00:59
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loquacitieshi everyone01:00
loquacitiesare we all here?01:00
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adahmsI believe so01:00
loquacities#startmeeting docteam01:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 01:00:31 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is loquacities. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.01:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:00
loquacitiesroll call?01:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'docteam'01:00
loquacitieshi slong! long time no chat :)01:00
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slonghey there:)01:00
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bmossg'day y'all01:01
dnavalehi there01:01
loquacitieshi adahms01:01
adahmsHey, Brian!01:01
loquacitieshi :)01:01
suyoghi all!01:01
loquacitiesok, let's kick off shall we?01:01
loquacities#topic Action items from the last meeting01:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Action items from the last meeting (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:01
loquacitiesasettle to investigate first week of june for another APAC openstack docs f2f01:01
loquacitiesasettle: you here?01:02
asettleloquacities, sorry, internet dropping out01:02
asettleI am!01:02
asettleI am investigating, thinking that time frame suits all :)01:02
loquacitieswe have an agenda item for that coming up, so let's circle back01:02
asettleI was going to suggest somewhere closer too the RH office01:02
asettleOkay, thanks :)01:02
loquacitiesLana to report back on i18n RST issues01:02
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loquacitiesi went to the meeting, and the main issue ended up being that translators weren't familiar with RST, so the conversion was tricky01:02
loquacitiesbut we're getting somewhere with that now01:03
loquacitiesin the meantime, feel free to hang out in #openstack-translation to help out01:03
loquacitiesalso, i learned a valuable lesson about including translators in plans like that01:03
loquacitiesLana to change meeting schedule to alternating weeks01:04
loquacitiesthis has now been done01:04
loquacitiesso thanks for the support there, everyone01:04
loquacitiesany questions on the action items?01:04
JRobinson__loquacities, sorry arrived late. Items seem in order01:04
loquacitieshi JRobinson__ :)01:05
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loquacitiesok, moving on01:05
loquacities#topic Kilo tasks01:05
*** openstack changes topic to "Kilo tasks (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:05
loquacities#info RST publishing is done01:05
loquacities#info The rest is underway, should be late this week/early next week01:05
loquacitieshas everyone had a chance to look at the new RST docs?01:05
loquacitiesthey're very shiny :)01:06
asettleWhat's the issue, exactly?01:06
asettleThe spaces?01:06
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asettleWhat's the next set of books set to be changed to RST?01:06
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loquacitiesasettle: still working on that01:07
loquacitieswe're just getting through kilo first01:07
loquacitieswe'll work out the next book to be converted as part of liberty planning01:07
asettleloquacities, okay thanks01:07
loquacities#topic Docs specs in review01:07
*** openstack changes topic to "Docs specs in review (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:07
loquacitiesthat's a link to the current list of specs01:08
loquacitiesthe main ones that need some attention are:01:08
loquacities#link (Work in progress user guides)01:08
loquacities#link (HA Guide)01:08
loquacities#link (API work)01:08
loquacitiesthere's also a bunch of training guide specs01:09
loquacitiesi'm in contact with sean on that01:09
loquacitiesany questions on specs?01:09
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slongWill Diane still be working at all on API stuff?01:09
slongJust curious.01:09
loquacitiesi believe she is01:09
loquacitiesanne is also continuing work on api docs01:10
loquacitiesso even though she's not PTL, she'll still be around and working on those things01:10
slongAnne put in that note about whether docs should continue to own API docs.01:10
slongWondered why.01:10
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loquacitiesit's a discussion anne and i have had a bit recently01:10
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loquacitiesi have no desire to look after API docs, and anne is happy to continue doing it, so it was a natural progression to ask if they should be run by the same person01:11
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loquacitiesi think it's worth asking the larger community how they feel01:11
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asettleConvenient, really01:11
slongk, understood, ta01:11
loquacitiesasettle: indeed :)01:11
loquacitiesok, moving on01:11
loquacities#topic Specialty teams01:12
*** openstack changes topic to "Specialty teams (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:12
loquacities#info HA Guide - Please look at the new spec01:12
loquacities#info Training Guides - Preparing to publish for Kilo01:12
loquacities#info Install Guides - CentOS/RHEL is on schedule, Ubuntu has rabbitmq issues that are being worked on, SUSE is underway and should be done by early next week01:12
loquacities#info User Guides - Please look at the new spec01:12
loquacities#info Security Guide (i don't have an updated status)01:12
loquacities#info API docs - Please look at the new spec01:12
loquacities#info Networking Guide - Test & review01:13
loquacitiesany questions or comments on speciality teams?01:13
loquacitiesoh, now is probably a good time to mention that the user guide team will need a new lead, as well01:13
JRobinson__Just a comment on the user guide team01:13
asettleWhich, we unanimously decided was darrenc :)01:13
loquacitiesasettle: i'm not sure darrenc agreed :P01:14
loquacitiesJRobinson__: go ahead?01:14
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JRobinson__I'm okay to start heading that up as we discussed,01:14
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JRobinson__I'll need a managment or OpenStack experienced person to assist if possible.01:15
darrencno I haven't agreed to that :)01:15
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loquacitiesJRobinson__: that's great news, thank you :)01:16
loquacitieswe can talk more about that on the meeting on friday, anyway01:16
JRobinson__okay, sounds good01:16
loquacities#topic Doc tools update01:16
*** openstack changes topic to "Doc tools update (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:16
loquacities#info use 2.1.4 clouddocs-maven-plugin for Kilo01:16
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loquacitiesthat's more an FYI than anything else01:16
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asettleThanks JRobinson__ :)01:18
loquacities#topic Vancouver01:18
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loquacities#info Design summit sessions should be up by the end of this week01:18
asettleSorry, bit late.01:18
loquacitiesany questions on the design summit?01:18
asettleAh, nothing. I'm hoping to be able to be a part of the discussion on Swift docs01:19
loquacities#topic APAC Meetups01:19
*** openstack changes topic to "APAC Meetups (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:19
loquacities#info Planning for an APAC OpenStack meet up in May01:19
loquacitiesasettle: ?01:19
asettleo/ yes, it is I01:19
asettleThinking something closer to the RH office01:20
asettleBut I can't think of much. At the moment, it is looking like 1st week of June01:20
asettlePlan is to discuss summit - what's happening, informing our community01:20
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loquacitiesso, next week?01:20
asettleMaybe we can even potentially think about doing a lunch and learn01:20
asettle... loquacities next week is the first week of May01:20
asettleit's April01:20
loquacitiesthat requires a venue01:20
loquacitiesoh yeah, sorry01:20
asettleI'm thinking after June01:20
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asettleafter summit*01:20
loquacitiesa month ahead of myself :P01:20
asettleNo typey01:21
asettleNo worries01:21
asettleYes, a venue. I was wondering if we could talk to adahms about that.01:21
asettleA potential for summit debrief01:21
loquacities(i might be starting to stress about summit a little, if no one had noticed)01:21
adahmsRoger that01:21
asettleadahms, thanks :) what do you think?01:21
loquacitieswould an evening work better for that, then?01:21
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asettleloquacities, evenings aren't always the best, simply because of children and lives etc01:21
loquacitiesyeah, tell me about it01:21
asettleBut, if you want to do an evening thing, maybe straight after work? Haha01:21
adahmsHmm, the schedule is going to be pretty busy during June / July, but we should be able to find a date in there somewhere01:22
asettleA 4pm till 5pm 'dinner and learn'01:22
loquacitieswe could order pizza01:22
asettleadahms, thinking the first week of June - if you can find something free in there, that would be great01:22
asettleloquacities, yes, that was ma plan :)01:22
adahmsI'll ask around :)01:22
loquacitiesok, i might add an action for adahms then01:22
asettleAnd those that went to summit can give us a bit of a talk about what happened, what the plans are, and where OS is going and what we can do to help01:22
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loquacities#action adahms to find a suitable date for a meetup in early june01:22
loquacitiesi'd be happy to do that01:23
loquacitiesi'll probably be up to my eyeballs in liberty planning by then :P01:23
asettleWonderful, anyone have any issues with the idea?01:23
loquacitiesok, next up:01:23
loquacities#info Planning for APAC Docs Swarm on 17-18 August01:23
asettleOh, me again!01:23
loquacitiessuyog: this is your baby now?01:23
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suyogYeah, i'll follow up with the people here.01:24
suyogThe venue is still booked.01:24
asettleGreat news :)01:24
bmossthe ghost of bmoss lives on in Zimbra...01:24
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asettleOfficially I also have most of the 'old team' onboard as SMEs01:24
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asettleSo we're nearly ready to go01:24
loquacitiessounds like that's all under control, then01:25
suyogbtw, i thought it was 13-14 Aug01:25
bmossyeah, what suyog said ^^01:25
loquacitieshrm, yeah, i think you're right01:25
loquacitiesmy agenda is wrong01:25
* loquacities fixes that01:25
suyogcool, np! :)01:25
loquacities#info Planning for APAC Docs Swarm on 13-14 August01:25
loquacitiesmoving on ...01:26
loquacities#topic Meeting time01:26
*** openstack changes topic to "Meeting time (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:26
loquacities#info Now on alternating weeks01:27
loquacities#info Does this time work for everyone?01:27
loquacities(i'm assuming so, since we only just changed the APAC docs meeting time anyway)01:27
adahmsAny chance we could move it an hour earlier?01:27
loquacitiesto 10?01:27
loquacitiesthat wouldn't bother me01:27
asettleAw guys01:27
asettleThat's early :p01:27
loquacitiesalthough it makes it 0000 UTC, which could be confusing01:28
loquacitieswhat if we split the difference, call it 0030?01:28
adahmsThat works01:28
loquacitiesok, i'm cool with that01:28
loquacitiesin other meeting-related news ...01:29
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loquacities#info Need someone to run US-timed meetings01:29
asettleUS people can't run the US meetings?01:29
loquacitiesi'm assuming that most people here now are not really up for that job, though01:29
loquacitieswell, this agenda gets reused through both meetings, so it applies to everyone ;)01:29
asettleOh goodie :)01:29
loquacitiesessentially, we should find a US-based person to run the US meetings, though, yes :P01:29
suyogAny night owls? Not me.01:30
loquacitiesbecause i certainly can't commit to doing a midnight or 1am meeting every fortnight01:30
loquacitiesand i think anne wants a breather01:30
asettleloquacities, what about Matt?01:30
loquacitiesasettle: definite possibility01:30
asettledarrenc, and I are on the same wave length01:30
loquacitiesanyway, that's it for today!01:30
asettleOh, there we go01:30
loquacities#topic Open discussion01:30
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: docteam)"01:31
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loquacitiesanything else?01:31
adahmsNothing from my side01:31
loquacitiescool, thanks adahms01:31
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loquacitiesthanks slong01:31
loquacitiesi think we'll call that a meeting01:31
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"01:31
openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 01:31:46 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)01:31
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openstackMinutes (text):
suyogthanks, all!01:31
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loquacitiesthanks everyone :)01:31
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asettleThanks loquacities :)01:32
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asalkeld#startmeeting heat12:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 12:00:02 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is asalkeld. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.12:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: heat)"12:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'heat'12:00
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asalkeld#topic rollcall12:00
*** openstack changes topic to "rollcall (Meeting topic: heat)"12:00
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asalkeldyea one person12:01
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asalkeld#topic Adding items to the agenda12:01
*** openstack changes topic to "Adding items to the agenda (Meeting topic: heat)"12:01
skraynevI am here ;)12:02
asalkeldwe could add the gate status to the agenda12:02
asalkeldanything else?12:02
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asalkeld#topic Any critical bugs to stop rc2 becoming the release?12:02
*** openstack changes topic to "Any critical bugs to stop rc2 becoming the release? (Meeting topic: heat)"12:02
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asalkeldany super important bugs (critical) that would prevent rc2 being the final release12:03
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asalkeld(other bugs can be backported later)12:03
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shardyasalkeld: not a release blocker, but just FYI the hooks interfaces we landed have ended up being not that useable12:04
asalkeldwell I'll watch the bug list12:04
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shardyI'm implementing client side workarounds as it's too late to fix the API, but we'll have to rework during L12:04
skraynevasalkeld: ^12:04
shardyasalkeld: yeah, the exposing of hitting hooks only via events turns out to be not-so-great12:05
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shardyas you have to poll and filter (client side) every single event from all the stacks in the tree12:05
skraynevI 'd like to see this one, because it fix bug with common case:)12:05
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asalkeldskraynev: that seems like a corner case or no?12:05
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asalkeldskraynev: if we want that in, we would have to move very quickly12:06
asalkeldand get it merged into master12:06
skraynevasalkeld: do you mean today?12:06
pas-haasalkeld, not really - we hit that quite often with say server with ports that is unable to boot due to "no valid host found"12:07
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asalkeldskraynev: it needs to get into master fast12:07
asalkeldthen we need to chat to ttx12:07
asalkeldhi zaneb12:07
skraynevI have reviewed it yesterday.12:07
pas-hazaneb, please take a look at
skraynevand wnated to get feedback from zaneb12:08
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* zaneb looks12:08
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asalkeldskraynev: zaneb can you figure out if that really needs to go into kilo-final12:08
asalkeldif yes please ping  ttx and say so quickly12:09
asalkeldit's after 10pm here12:09
zanebis this a new issue?12:09
asalkeld#action zaneb skraynev shardy follow up on
openstackLaunchpad bug 1446575 in heat "Invalid Templete Reference when delete failed stack" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Kairat Kushaev (kkushaev)12:09
asalkeldnot sure12:10
skraynevzaneb: same behavior for Juno12:10
skraynevzaneb: two wrong updates may leads to undeletable stack12:10
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zanebskraynev: then I don't see a reason to rush it tbh12:10
asalkeldwell if we can, and it's a common uses case - then why not12:11
zanebI'd be more comfortable getting it in 2015.1.112:11
asalkeldmaybe ask ttx how big the hassle is12:11
asalkeldzaneb: when is that?12:11
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zanebasalkeld: because this is an incredibly fragile piece of the code which has had next to no testing and we are about to release like today12:12
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skraynevzaneb: anyway I agree to backport it later, if it be more comfortable ;)12:12
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anantaI agree with zaneb12:12
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skraynevand safely12:12
asalkeldok, if we are ok with it coming later, then fine12:12
asalkeldok lets move on12:13
zanebasalkeld: it's not like it's a regression12:13
asalkeldzaneb: sure, but i believe reasonbly common uses case of murano12:13
skraynevzaneb: agree12:13
asalkeld#topic HOT & Fn::Split (shardy)12:13
*** openstack changes topic to "HOT & Fn::Split (shardy) (Meeting topic: heat)"12:13
asalkeldshardy: ...12:13
shardySo, I've run into a use-case where we want to split a neutron cidr12:14
shardyby the "/"12:14
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shardythat used to be possible via Fn::Split, but afaics we removed it after the first hot version12:15
noaKoffman Hi guys, can anyone please review the blueprint spec ? thanks12:15
shardyasalkeld: you don't know either half ahead of time to populate the replace12:15
shardyatm, we're kludging it by using get_attr to get each character of the subnet mask12:15
* shardy gets link12:15
zanebyeah, opposite problem12:15
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zanebthat said, the answer is to pass in the network and mask separately12:16
tspatziershardy: is the use case that you want to use one part for a property, or split a string into a list for filling a list type property?12:16
shardyzaneb: Yeah, I'm not sure the port resource provides those12:16
asalkeldshardy: we would need to make a new template version12:16
zanebshardy: that's fixable :)12:17
shardyasalkeld: sure, I guess my question is, am I missing a way to do it, and if not, what would a good interface look like (for L, obviously)12:17
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ryansbzaneb: sure it is, but a Fn::Split equivalent sure would be nice in any case12:17
asalkeldwhy not just add split12:17
asalkeldshardy: instead of coming up with yet another inconsistency12:18
shardytspatzier: the use-case is some attribute-mangling, but it's more general as I think the split feature is useful12:18
zanebasalkeld: because as you just said, we'd need a new template format12:18
tspatzier+1 I like split much more than e.g. digest which was added some time back ;-)12:18
shardyasalkeld: Yeah, I'm leaning towards just adding a native split12:18
* zaneb is happy if tspatzier is happy12:19
shardyzaneb: I think the workaround we have for TripleO is OK for now, but I'd like to define a cleaner way for L12:19
skraynev+1 for the split for hot ;)12:19
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shardyOk, I'll propose a spec for L and we can bikeshed on interfaces there ;)12:19
ryansbshardy: indeed, I'll bring my book of paint swatches.12:19
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asalkeld#topic open discussion12:20
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: heat)"12:20
shardythanks all12:20
asalkeld#topic open bikeshedding12:20
*** openstack changes topic to "open bikeshedding (Meeting topic: heat)"12:20
zanebshardy: you know that attaching a mask length to an actual IP address makes no sense, right?12:20
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* zaneb scratches head12:20
ryansbzaneb: uh, yes it does?12:20
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ryansbCIDR notation is pretty universal for network-y folks12:20
shardyzaneb: it does if you want to configure an interface12:20
ryansb^ also that12:21
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zanebryansb: right. a network address has a mask length. an ip address is just an ip address12:21
shardyzaneb: I'll follow up with dprince on why/where the subnet is used in this case12:22
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zanebmaybe it's just too early in the morning and I am losing it12:22
* asalkeld sleepy12:22
tspatzierhas anyone ever thought about combining MultiPartMime with SoftwareDeployment? Currently, it seems it can only take a simple config. Use case is that somebody would like to use CloudConfig with SoftwareDeployment which does not seem to work today.12:23
shardytspatzier: it does work, but you have to do the SoftwareDeployment after cloud-init runs12:23
inc0well, ip can be represented by /32 cidr12:23
tspatziershardy: do we have an example for this?12:24
shardytspatzier: also, we're doing the same in the TripleO heat templates12:24
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tspatziershardy: great, thanks! One of my colleagues was looking for something like this, so he'll be happy to see this :-)12:25
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shardythere, you can pass any cloud-config via multi-part-mime, and then we do a bunch of subsequent SoftwareDeployments12:25
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shardytspatzier: np :)12:25
zanebinc0: the given example is taking the masklen from the network address and mashing it on the end of the IP12:25
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dprincezaneb: with ipaddress/CIDR you can get everything you need12:26
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asalkeldzaneb: dose it matter, the mask - well masks the unused bits out?12:26
inc0all I'm saying - CIDR can represnt both network as single address12:26
dprincezaneb: some of our tooling makes use of this compressed format in TripleO already12:26
zanebyeah, it probably doesn't matter and is orthogonal to the actual problem here12:27
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asalkeldzaneb: missing working on mulitcast protocols12:27
ryansbtl;dr we need split12:27
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zanebasalkeld: not in the least :)12:28
asalkeldwe seem to be running out of topics12:28
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asalkeldend or some bright ideas?12:29
inc0do we accept all sessions from etherpad?12:29
inc0(I don't know if its free discussion yes?:)12:29
asalkeldinc0: it's purely a matter of space12:29
ryansbinc0: it is12:29
inc0yeah, I think we can't fit it all already?12:29
asalkeld(how many on the etherpad vs. slots)12:29
asalkeldo, i nearly forgot12:30
asalkeldrelease notes!12:30
asalkeldwe have an eathpad12:30
shardyasalkeld: one thought, to the extent that is possible, it'd be good to juggle sessions to avoid collisions with TripleO12:30
asalkeldand we need to get all official12:30
shardygiven that quite a few of us are now working on both12:31
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asalkeldshardy: maybe - chat to the baker12:31
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shardyoh yeah12:31
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asalkeldplease have a look (and edit)
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asalkeldi'll move that into the wiki12:33
pas-haasalkeld, no-op, etherpad is not working12:33
asalkeld#action asalkeld update the kilo release notes12:33
asalkeldpas-ha: works for me12:34
skraynevasalkeld: pas-ha: for me too12:34
asalkeldit says 4 people are on there12:34
skraynevI mean wfm ;)12:34
asalkeldok that's all from me12:35
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asalkeldlast chance or i end the meeting12:36
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"12:36
openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 12:36:14 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)12:36
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-openstackstatus- NOTICE: gerrit has been restarted to clear a stuck events queue. any change events between 13:29-14:05 utc should be rechecked or have their approval votes reapplied to trigger jobs14:05
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BobBalljohnthetubaguy: Ping15:00
BobBall#startmeeting XenAPI15:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 15:00:16 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is BobBall. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: XenAPI)"15:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'xenapi'15:00
BobBallGood morning!15:00
BobBallOr afternoon15:00
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BobBallHi johnthetubaguy15:00
BobBallHow are things?15:00
BobBallBusier now I imagine!15:00
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BobBall#topic CI15:01
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johnthetubaguyyeah, busy busy15:01
BobBallSo the main issue with the CI this week ishas been that the gerrit stream keeps getting reset15:01
BobBallit seems that zuul has also been suffering from it (periods of up to 10 minutes where we can't contact
johnthetubaguyoh yeah, I heard about some of that in -infra15:02
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BobBallbut the OSCI didn't restart as nicely as Zuul15:02
johnthetubaguyah, doh15:02
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BobBallI've now added a cronjob to ensure it's running every 30 minutes15:02
BobBallsimplest fix15:02
BobBallMedium term I still plan to move to the zuul+jenkins way of doing things15:02
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BobBallso didn't want to invest in a more complicated solution15:03
johnthetubaguyyeah, that sounds like a good plan15:03
BobBallApart from that pass rates look good when we're running15:03
BobBallso I'm going to re-enable voting15:03
BobBallbut restrict tests to just Nova15:03
BobBallsince I haven't asked for voting permissions to be added to the other repos (devstack/tempest)15:03
BobBallI think that covers that really15:04
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BobBallthe libvirt+xen CI is an interesting one too15:04
johnthetubaguyoh, one sec15:04
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johnthetubaguyI think turbo hipster folks are running zuul, not sure what they can share15:04
johnthetubaguybut its worth exploring that15:04
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BobBallWell I'm running zuul for libvirt+xen CI15:05
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BobBallI do want to investigate a combined zuul for several 3rd party CIs where we can15:05
johnthetubaguyah, cool, so step one already done15:05
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BobBallso my plan is to move the XenServer CI to share the jenkins+zuul with libvirt+xen15:05
BobBalland from there it's a simple step to integrate with or integrate other peoples 3rd party CIs15:06
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BobBallthe only issue is access as several CIs are running within a firewall rather than in a public cloud like the XS and libvirt/xen CIs15:06
BobBall-only+main :)15:06
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BobBallAnyway; pass rate for libvirt+xen is looking good too.15:06
BobBallThe jobs you can see there have mostly suffered from common problems -infra have also been struggling with15:07
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BobBallfor example the period 24 hours agoish where the RAX mirror was broken15:07
johnthetubaguygood signs15:07
johnthetubaguyare there any major bloopers left?15:08
BobBallNext step is I'm planning to write a simple tool to analyse the results and compare to see which jobs we fail that jenkins passed15:08
BobBallNone of the tools I'm aware of currently do quite what we need15:08
BobBallbasically to investigate disagreements between the systems15:09
johnthetubaguyelastaicrecheck is good, but yeah, that could be not quite what you want15:09
BobBallWe don't have a logserver that can be used to run elasticrecheck15:09
johnthetubaguyactually it might be able to compare tempest failures, but it takes quite a bit of infrastructurure15:09
BobBallour logs are stored in swift for cost reasons15:09
BobBallThat to :)15:09
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BobBallAnyway - a simple script that pulls results from gerrit + a jenkins server should be straight forward to write15:10
BobBallso I'll have a bash at that soon15:10
BobBallso I can convince myself mostly that the results we're seeing are god.15:10
BobBallA quick check of the results doesn't show any tempest jobs that fail more often than others, so if we do have an issue it's a generic libvirt+xen one15:10
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BobBallI think that's it for CI15:11
BobBallunless you have any more johnthetubaguy ?15:11
johnthetubaguynothing from me, thats sounds good15:11
BobBallOh - one more - we're likely to have a meeting next week or the week after to explain how the CI is set up15:11
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BobBallbasically just following asselin's puppet scripts with some tweaks and hacks that I'm going to upstream at some point :)15:12
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BobBallThink that's it.15:13
BobBall#topic XenServer Dundee15:13
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johnthetubaguynext version?15:13
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BobBallJust to let you know that an alpha for "Dundee" has been released.15:13
BobBallThis is an Open Source XenServer release15:13
BobBallbased on the latest trunk code15:13
johnthetubaguyah, centos715:14
BobBalland, for legal reasons, may not have any correspondance with the next Citrix XenServer release15:14
johnthetubaguypython2.7 ?15:14
BobBalle.g. features in this alpha may not be present in the next XenServer release ;)15:14
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johnthetubaguyah, yeah, that old cookie, well thats probably accurate too, in general15:15
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BobBallAnyway, the C7 work is definitely the biggest item in there15:15
BobBallbut I think it's also upgraded Xen15:15
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BobBallbut still using the 3.10 64-bit kernel from 6.515:16
johnthetubaguyah, cool15:16
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johnthetubaguythat makes sense15:16
BobBallAnyway, that's all for that from me.15:16
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BobBall#topic Recruiting15:16
*** openstack changes topic to "Recruiting (Meeting topic: XenAPI)"15:16
BobBallGoing well - but again, if you know anyone in Nanjing who wants to work on OpenStack let me know.15:17
BobBallThat's all.15:17
BobBall#topic AOB15:17
*** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: XenAPI)"15:17
BobBallAnything from you johnthetubaguy ?15:17
BobBallOr anyone who has been lurking?15:17
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johnthetubaguynothing really, liberty is open, I guess thats the big thing15:17
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johnthetubaguydid you get the help from our side on the CI yet?15:18
BobBallI disabled the test15:18
BobBallYes, I probably should have talked more on that.15:18
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BobBalljg0 was ready to help15:18
BobBallbut I couldn't build a dev CI environment15:18
BobBallas the -infra modules (specifically project-config) have evolved and our scripts aren't compatible now15:18
BobBallI need to do a rebasing round to be able to deploy a dev CI for jg0 to investigat.e15:19
BobBallBut with summit prep that rebasing has taken a back seat :)15:19
johnthetubaguyoh, we have mostly chosen the summit sessions now15:19
johnthetubaguydid you need anything in the Nova design summit track?15:19
johnthetubaguyI was guessing no?15:20
BobBallI'd say not this time, no.15:20
BobBallWe'll have a lot to ask / talk about next summit I'm sure.15:20
johnthetubaguyoh, xenapi pool support15:20
johnthetubaguyare we ready to kill that, seems to pop up now and again15:21
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BobBallI'm happy for it to be removed yees15:21
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johnthetubaguyOK, maybe its a good on boarding task for new devs15:21
BobBallquite possibly :)15:21
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johnthetubaguycools, nothing more comes to mind right now15:22
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BobBallOK great15:22
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BobBallNext meeting is week before summit and one then week after summit15:22
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BobBall#topic Next Meeting15:22
*** openstack changes topic to "Next Meeting (Meeting topic: XenAPI)"15:22
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BobBallI'm assuming we won't need both as we'll be talking lots at the summit15:22
BobBallpreference for one or the other?15:22
johnthetubaguyoh, good question15:23
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johnthetubaguyI should be alive for both of those, in theory15:23
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johnthetubaguypossibly post summit would be better?15:23
BobBallOK - let's aim for post summit15:23
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johnthetubaguycool, thanks BobBall15:24
BobBallOh drat15:24
BobBallNo, I can't15:24
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BobBallI'll be in Nanjing week after summit.15:24
johnthetubaguyhehe, the one before then, thats fine15:24
BobBallLet's shoot for pre-summit :)15:24
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BobBallNext meeting 13th May then!15:24
BobBallThanks johnthetubaguy15:24
johnthetubaguycatch you later!15:24
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"15:25
openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 15:25:16 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:25
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thingee#startmeeting Cinder16:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 16:00:01 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is thingee. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.16:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:00
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'cinder'16:00
thingeehi everyone!16:00
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jungleboyjHump Daaay!16:00
thingeeliberty midcycle meetup date choices are here
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dustins_err.. o/16:01
thingeeaug 3-5 or aug 10-1216:01
thingeealso an idea, extending the meet up for actual hack time16:01
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thingeeor perhaps using the last day for hack time16:01
thingeewhile everyone is in the same room16:01
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thingeewould like feedback from people16:02
cebrunsHack time would be awesome!16:02
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jungleboyjNot a bad idea.16:02
DuncanTI think hack time is definitely worth trying16:03
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thingeeso please provide feedback, and people that are welling to host us, please indicate which date(s) work. if no one can work with these dates, we'll revisit16:03
thingeejust throwing something out there though to start16:03
kmartin_hack time +116:03
winston-djoin late, hack time when?16:03
adurbin_+1 on fort collins16:03
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e0ne+1 for hack time16:03
winston-dmid cycle meetup?16:03
thingeewinston-d: at the midcycle meetup16:04
thingeeAlso reminder spec reviews are happening,n,z16:04
thingeewould appreciate people helping me with reviews as some of you have been doing already16:04
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thingeeFor blueprints that don't require spec, I was wondering, can someone tell me if you're able to mark a blueprint as pending approval?16:05
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thingeewas thinking of announcing to people that they should flag a blueprint as so to get my attention, so I have a queue to look through16:06
thingeeinstead of individual pings16:06
tbarronthingee: you mean marking our own, right?16:06
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thingeetbarron: yes16:06
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tbarronwhere a bp within our own driver doesn't need a coresponding spec16:06
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thingeetbarron: yes16:06
vilobhmm1hello everyone gm16:06
tbarronthingee: I will try it and let you know later today,16:06
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patrickeasti just changed one to pending approval, looks like it worked
thingeepatrickeast: thanks16:06
thingeeok, so does that sound ok to everyone? Just mark things as pending approval and I'll watch those?16:07
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thingeeand if I'm being slow, of course let me know16:07
patrickeastsounds good16:07
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thingeeI'll send an email to let folks know on the list16:07
xyang2thingee: do we have to change the approver to your name too?16:07
thingeelets get started!16:07
thingeexyang2: nah I can do all that16:07
xyang2thingee: ok, thanks16:08
thingeeagenda for today
thingeeexpect a lot of time to be taken on the summit review stuff16:08
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thingee#topic Cinder Quota delete API behavior16:08
*** openstack changes topic to "Cinder Quota delete API behavior (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:08
thingeegeguileo: hi16:08
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geguileoOk, so currently quota delete API deletes limits16:09
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geguileoBut also deletes usage and reservations16:09
geguileoAcording to API doc it shouldn't:
geguileoIt reads: Deletes quotas for a tenant so the quotas revert to default values.16:10
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geguileoAccording API guidelines this API endpoint can be changed without needing a new endpoint16:10
geguileoBut people don't feel confortable with that16:11
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geguileoI don't mind either way, but there must be a way for operators to only delete limits (which is usually their intention)16:11
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DuncanTDeleting usages and reservations looks like a straight bug to me? That can never be the right thing to do, right?16:12
geguileoDuncanT: That's what I think16:12
thingeeDuncanT: Someone who wrote the docs was also confused about this too16:12
winston-dIn what cases, people want to delete quota for a tenant?16:12
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geguileowinston-d: You delete the quota limits for a tenant and set it back to the defaults16:12
winston-dgeguileo: so what's the asnwer to "This is a matter of how the "Quota delete" is understood, as "Delete quotas and leave no quota limits, not even defaults" or just "Delete additional quota limits that override defaults".16:13
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geguileowinston-d: The answer is that you delete the limits and revert to default as the documentation says16:14
geguileowinston-d: It's not about setting it to no restrictions16:14
winston-dgeguileo: so it's reset-quota-to-default16:14
geguileowinston-d: That's what the API docs says16:14
geguileowinston-d: "Deletes quotas for a tenant so the quotas revert to default values."16:14
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winston-dOK. thx16:15
winston-dI agree usage and reservations shouldn't be affected by doing that.16:15
thingeeanyone opposed?16:15
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thingeegeguileo: sounds like no one disagrees16:16
DuncanTJust make sure it is clearly release noted, I guess16:16
vilobhmm1i agree with DucanT, winston-d16:16
thingeeDuncanT: +1 upgradeimpact please so we remember to add this16:16
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jungleboyjdulek: +116:16
jungleboyjDuncanT: +116:16
thingee#agreed usage and reservations should not be affected16:16
thingeegeguileo: thanks16:17
geguileoOk, I will modify the commit message of current patch:
jungleboyjSorry dulek ... unpredictable tab completion.16:17
geguileoThanks guys16:17
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thingee#topic Liberty Summit Sessions16:17
dulekjungleboyj: I was surprised. ;)16:17
*** openstack changes topic to "Liberty Summit Sessions (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:17
thingeealright here we go16:17
thingeelets start with working sessions16:18
thingeebecause I have a feeling we'll be moving some out to fish bowl maybe16:18
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thingeeVery small discussion if we think these topics will be worth technical discussion16:19
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thingeeremember working sessions is a smaller room16:19
thingeenot meant for user interaction16:19
thingeethese are things we already agree have a clear use case.16:19
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thingeeif we're unsure of use case, might be best to propose to fish bowl to get feedback16:19
thingeeok first up, Task resumptions16:19
thingeedulek: hi16:19
dulekHi guys!16:20
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thingee#topic Task Resumptions16:20
*** openstack changes topic to "Task Resumptions (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:20
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dulekI've updated the spec with what I think would work.16:20
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thingeeso at this point, this is something I think we all want in Cinder. the question is how the approach will be16:21
dulekSo basically I want to discuss if this is sane at gather feedback16:21
dulekMaybe redesign some things.16:21
thingeedoes this currently have a tie with decisions in another topic dulek ?16:21
thingeelike taskflow?16:21
thingeewould like to make sure I schedule things in the right order16:21
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e0newe could start with PoC based on taskflow before summit16:21
dulekYeah, I'm assuming TaskFlow would stay.16:21
thingeeok where's the discussion on taskflow?16:22
thingeecan someone move that to the topic of working sessions16:22
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thingeedulek: can you make yours as dependent on that discussion? just so I schedule things in the right order16:22
e0nethingee: do you want a separate session?16:23
dulekthingee: Okay, I'll do that.16:23
vilobhmm1thingee : i have one
thingeee0ne: I thought there was going to be one16:23
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thingeeAny others that are dependent on taskflow should state so...just so I schedule things in the right order16:23
vilobhmm1myself and duncanT will be covering it under "Active / Active cinder-volume: Towards better resiliency, the way forward "16:23
e0nethingee: agree, that's why i didn't add topic about TF16:23
vilobhmm1thingee : have updated the liberty session link with it already16:24
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tbarronI think it's a mistake to just move ahead working on designs that assume taskflow w/o having the meta conversation first.16:24
DuncanTtbarron: ++16:24
thingeeDuncanT, vilobhmm1 I think there is some work anthony lee is doing towards this effort16:24
thingeeof removing locks16:25
thingeecan we make sure his work is part of this?16:25
vilobhmm1thingee : but first we need to clearly outline all the problem16:25
hemnathose locks16:25
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DuncanTthingee: There are several people working on it. Part of the problem is that there are several related problems16:25
vilobhmm1sure i am ok with tha16:25
thingee#topic active/active cinder-volume16:25
*** openstack changes topic to "active/active cinder-volume (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:25
hemnaremoving those locks, requires fixes in Nova, and nova tempest tests and gate tests.16:25
winston-dtbarron: +116:25
DuncanTThere are two sets of locks, the ones in the manager and the ones in individual drivers... both doing different jobs16:26
vilobhmm1yes..fixing locking issues in manager, drivers etc…also16:26
winston-dhemna: why a cinder internal implementation has external dependency on Nova?16:26
hemnathat's the spec16:27
hemnawinston-d, because the changes in Cinder causes different API behavior16:27
dulekwinston-d: Because Nova is checking the state and assumes that it won't change before making an action.16:27
dulekwinston-d: That's wrong.16:27
hemnathat Nova doesn't account for.  Nova is currently not catching any possible exceptions that might come back from calling Cinder.16:27
hemnanova blows up.16:27
hemnabad mmmmkay16:27
vilobhmm1dulek : i guess we have covered most of the things here
thingeeok seems fine to keep IMO16:28
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thingeekeep in mind we have eight slots here. ... 17 are on this list if I counted right16:28
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thingeeso lets be picky and merge things when necessary :)16:29
dulekthingee: Shall we move some to be discussed at friday in smaller subteams?16:29
thingeedulek: yeah, but I think this is fine16:29
thingee#topic API and contracts between nova and cinder16:29
*** openstack changes topic to "API and contracts between nova and cinder (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:29
thingeeDuncanT scottda hemna hi16:30
DuncanTWe discussed this earlies16:30
thingeeso no details on this yet, but I agree we have a falling out a bit16:30
hemnaSo we started taking a look at the contract between Nova and Cinder interactions.16:30
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DuncanTThere are two strands: simple fixes to what is there16:30
hemnaand DuncanT and I are going to try and throw together a WIP spec to look at this16:30
DuncanTAnd a re-do to do it properly16:30
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hemnaas a parallel effort to what exists today.16:31
DuncanTThere should be a spec before the summit16:31
scottdaAnd we are told that Nova is very interested in this as well.16:31
scottdai.e. supportive16:31
winston-dbig +116:31
thingeeso I would say move this to sprints. If you are actually going to get nova folks to show up, might be worth while.16:31
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winston-dvol attach/detach failure has been our no.1 issues of Cinder, which unfortunately all happened in Nova16:32
scottdawinston-d +116:32
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e0newinston-d: +116:32
hemnathere are a lot of 'bad' things that nova is doing with cinder currently, and will try and encapsulate those fixes along with attach/detach APIs in the spec.16:33
tbarronwinston-d: +116:33
hemnalive migration being another PITA16:33
ameadehemna: +116:33
tbarronameade: you have the right to say that :-)16:33
thingeeDuncanT, scottda, hemna can we do some communication to let nova folks know about this session?16:33
e0nehemna: we've got one more session proposal  with live migration16:33
xyang2hemna: we have a related patch in nova and would like your feedback.  I'll send you a link of it.16:33
jungleboyjwinston-d: +116:34
thingeeare there going to be conflicts to have interested parties attending?16:34
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hemnaxyang2, ok thanks16:34
hemnathingee, my thoughts were, lets figure out what our API should be, and then pull in the Nova folks16:34
hemnaso we don't get bogged down in theoreticals16:34
hemnabut also just touch base with them and let them know this is an issue we see value in addressing.16:34
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thingeeseems like we can keep this in the sprints then if we're just talking amongst ourselves then?16:35
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jungleboyjthingee: +116:35
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thingeesomeone mind moving that to sprints?16:35
scottdawill do16:35
thingee#topic cinder agent /ironic integration16:35
*** openstack changes topic to "cinder agent /ironic integration (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:36
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thingeeso we don't have a cinder agent yet. not sure it's worth having at the working sessions yet.16:36
thingeebut the ironic interaction16:36
e0neironic team is interesting in it too16:36
hemnasorrison, e0ne and I were looking at this one16:36
hemnait's basically a REST API in front of os-brick16:37
hemnaand made into a standalone service.16:37
e0nei hope, we could get some working agent poc before summit16:37
hemnato manage fetching the initiator information, as well as volume discovery and detachment.16:38
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hemnae0ne, if we ignore the authentication stuff for now, we could get a POC REST api working pretty quickly in front of os-brick16:38
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e0nehemna: i want to finish auth staff this weekend:)16:39
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hemnabasically 3 APIs, get_connector, discover_volume, detach_volume16:39
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hemnae0ne, we should talk about that offline.16:39
e0nehemna: agree16:39
thingeehemna: what do we plan to be discussed if this was a working session?16:39
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hemnathe auth piece is a bit of a mystery to me and has security related issues16:40
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e0nethingee: we need to notify ironic team when we'll get it16:40
hemnathingee, we can chat offline if you like.16:40
thingeeok, just trying to decide if this is beneficial at this point to have ironic folks attend or if this something we can do in the sprints.16:40
winston-dhemna: make sure new REST API service get the active-active HA piece right. ;)16:40
hemnawinston-d, :P16:41
thingeeright now it seems like it would be great to hack on this in the sprints? instead of rushing for POC at the summit?16:41
e0newinston-d: ok:)16:41
hemnathingee, it might be worth pulling in the ironic folks16:41
thingeethey might also be at the sprints.16:41
hemnathingee, in the past, I know that deva was against having agents running on the BM16:41
hemnanot sure if that's changed though.16:41
thingeedevananda: you plan to be part of this if no conflicts?16:41
hemnabut the only way to do volume attaches/detaches is with an agent.16:42
thingeeif it's a working sessions at the summit?16:42
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thingeeok running out of time on this one, so maybe...16:42
thingee#topic online backup using snapshot16:42
*** openstack changes topic to "online backup using snapshot (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:42
thingeeDuncanT, xyang2 hi16:42
xyang2hi, so we discussed about this at the meetup16:42
xyang2I just want to have more detailed discussion on the API design16:43
xyang2and nail it down16:43
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thingeexyang2: +1 for sprints shouldn't be too controversial?16:43
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xyang2that is fine.  I just want to discuss about it16:44
xyang2and make sure we are in sync16:44
DuncanTNeeds input from vendor experts, ideally, though we can do a safe fallback and just create a hidden volume from snap if necessary16:44
xyang2by the way, what are doing at sprint that is not in a working session?16:44
thingeeI think for sprints we'll have discussions at the first half, and the second half of the day will be actually working.16:44
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xyang2DuncanT: I thought we want to avoid creating a volume?  Seems slower16:45
thingeexyang2: working sessions is technical discussion on implementation details, but involves other parties16:45
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thingeenot sure just us talking to each other16:45
thingeeso vendors will still be encouraged to show up16:46
DuncanTxyang2: Where it is possible to do data transfer from the snap, we optimise, but that is a new requirement16:46
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thingee#agreed move to sprints16:46
DuncanTxyang2: We need a fallback path16:46
xyang2DuncanT: ok16:46
thingee#topic automatically sync up service catalog16:46
*** openstack changes topic to "automatically sync up service catalog (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:46
thingeexyang2: hi16:46
xyang2DuncanT: yes, driver needs to implement attach snapshot16:46
xyang2thingee: this is somewhat related to your topic on capabilities.16:47
DuncanTI have no idea what this is referring to16:47
dulekDuncanT: +116:47
xyang2thingee: so we are doing a POC trying to automatically read data from array and build service catalog16:47
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thingeeservice catalog to me is keystone16:48
thingeeam I right what you're talking about here?16:48
xyang2service catalog here refers to volume types and extra specs16:48
e0nexyang2: do you have a spec for it?16:48
hemnaxyang2, what do you mean by service catalog ?16:48
xyang2not yet16:48
hemnathat's completely unclear to me.16:48
xyang2I can definitely add more info to it.16:48
thingeexyang2: need more information.16:48
DuncanTCan we rename it, right now, please? Reusing the name 'service catalogue' is just inviting confusion16:48
hemnaok coolio16:48
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xyang2service catalog means volume types and extra specs.  Sure I can rename16:48
hemnaI was thinking cinder-manage service list16:48
thingeexyang2: but if we can merge it into the capabilities stuff, I'm fine with that...just have no idea what this is16:48
tbarronxyang2: I think we call that service catalog too :-)16:49
xyang2tbarron: that is what I think:)16:49
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thingeeno service catalog please :(16:49
tbarronall the more reason to rename16:49
hemnathingee, +116:49
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xyang2thingee: ok, I can rename it.16:49
thingee#agreed may merge into capabilities fish bowl talk16:49
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thingee#topic abc meta driver16:49
*** openstack changes topic to "abc meta driver (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:49
xyang2thingee: let me create an etherpad for it16:49
thingeemkoderer: hi16:49
thingeeI think this will be fine for sprints16:49
thingeesprints should have active maintainers16:50
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xyang2tbarron: I think I saw "service catalog" on netapp patches.  so thought this is commonly accepted terms:)16:50
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winston-dthingee: +1 for sprint16:50
thingee#agreed ABC meta driver to be in sprints16:50
tbarronxyang2: :)16:50
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thingee#topic the state of live instance migration with attached volumes16:51
*** openstack changes topic to "the state of live instance migration with attached volumes (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:51
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thingeeso I thought this would be great for fishbowl. I understand we'll be technical, but I think there is a bit of misconception on this to users?16:51
thingeepeople say it works, doesn't work, use this patch16:51
ameadeyeah exactly16:51
hemnayah it's a mess16:51
thingeeshould be a full room16:51
tbarronameade: +116:51
thingeeameade: I would also like jgriffith to help with this...16:52
hemnaand there are some really bad assumptions that the nova code is making wrt connector information coming back from cinder drivers.16:52
kmartin_thingee, +116:52
dulekthingee: +116:52
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thingee#agreed move to fishbowl16:52
ameadesounds good16:52
xyang2hemna: do you have a bug number for the problem you see?  we tested a few days ago and it worked16:52
* thingee hopes people are updating the etherpad as he quickly makes decisions16:52
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hemnaxyang2, yah I have a few16:52
thingee#topic shadow tables implementation16:52
*** openstack changes topic to "shadow tables implementation (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:52
dulekthingee: We're trying to catch up. ;)16:52
thingeee0ne: hi16:52
e0newe can move it to Friday:)16:52
thingeeinitially going to say sprints for this16:52
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thingee#agreed move to sprints16:53
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thingee#topic REST API: volume detailed view16:53
*** openstack changes topic to "REST API: volume detailed view (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:53
e0nemay be. need to discuss how can/should we change our REST API16:53
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winston-de0ne: i thought we don't change API, just the implementation of it, no?16:54
DuncanTWe're putting a lot of things in sprints now... that is going to cause some reduction in focus... how many sprint sessions do we think we have?16:54
e0newinston-d: i mean extend api to return more fields16:54
ameadecouldnt the client just make multiple requests?16:55
thingeeDuncanT: it'll be fine. there should be initial discussion, but people are going to break up into their stuff in the second half of the day16:55
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DuncanTReturning more fields we can just do....16:55
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dulekDuncanT: +116:55
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e0neDuncanT: not everybody agrees with it:(16:55
DuncanTthingee: Some of these are not going to be all that quick to discuss, I think16:55
thingeee0ne: I agree with it. Is that good enough? :)16:55
winston-dDuncanT: +116:56
DuncanTe0ne: We've done it before, it's documented API policy that we do it16:56
e0nethingee: ok. i'll wait +2 on spec;)16:56
thingeewe've always been fine with adding more fields16:56
DuncanTe0ne: Where is the spec?16:56
thingeejust changing/removing fields is a no no16:56
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thingeee0ne: like I said sprint should be fine, but sounds like we can resolve this in the spec.16:56
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thingee#action thingee to decide after reviewing spec16:56
ameadeyeah i may have some concerns, i need to readup some16:56
e0nethingee: fair enough. thanks!16:57
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DuncanTe0ne: Ah, you are proposing removing stuff from the default... that is harder16:57
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thingee#topic nested quota driver16:57
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*** openstack changes topic to "nested quota driver (Meeting topic: Cinder)"16:57
thingeevilobhmm1: hi16:57
vilobhmm1hi thingee16:57
DuncanTthingee: that REST API stuff does need discussion IMO16:57
vilobhmm1have uploaded blueprint , spec16:57
e0neDuncanT: maybe my fault. i mean _extend_ current defults16:58
thingeeis there a cross project initiative on this? could it be discussed there?16:58
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vilobhmm1it has detailed use cases mentioned16:58
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DuncanTe0ne: Shall we talk after the meeting?16:58
e0neDuncanT: sure16:58
thingee2 min warning16:58
vilobhmm1no cross project initiative that i know of…keystone has done work on heirarchical stuff and that was accepted in kilo16:58
vilobhmm1nova started work on same16:59
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vilobhmm1i think we also need to gear up in same direction16:59
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vilobhmm1as the community is moving for that support16:59
thingeewhat do we need to discuss exactly?16:59
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vilobhmm1the implementation16:59
vilobhmm1the effects that it will have, the use-cases16:59
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thingeefish bowl maybe?16:59
thingeeout of time17:00
thingeecontinue on #openstack-cinder17:00
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*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:00
openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 17:00:17 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:00
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openstackMinutes (text):
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tjones2#startmeeting vmwareapi17:05
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 17:05:22 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is tjones2. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.17:05
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: vmwareapi)"17:05
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'vmwareapi'17:05
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tjones2hi - anyone around?  sorry i am late17:05
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tjones2guess not - ok canceling17:09
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings ||"17:09
openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 17:09:15 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)17:09
openstackMinutes (text):
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devanandathingee: if no conflicts, yes. there are others who could attend/represent ironic even if I can't17:29
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thingeehemna: e0ne mind figuring out who from ironic can attend once we have a schedule? ^17:29
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devanandathingee: hemna: as far as agents go, I'm still very stronly of the opinion that we can't require an in-guest agent to attach volumes, though I there seem to be cloud providers who are willing to make that compromise....17:30
e0nedevananda: agree17:30
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devanandathingee: hemna: my main requirement will be that what ever API we come up with, across both cinder and ironic, it works for both in-band attach (whether agent or not) and out of band attach (eg, FCOE or firmware-based iscsi attach)17:30
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devanandae0ne: let's continue in #openstack-ironic17:31
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notmynameswift team meeting time18:59
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notmyname#startmeeting swift19:00
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 19:00:02 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is notmyname. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.19:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: swift)"19:00
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'swift'19:00
notmynamehello, everyone19:00
notmynamewho's here for the swift meeting?19:00
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notmynametoday's agenda has one item: summit session prep19:01
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notmynameso before we get into the sessions, general info and helpful links19:02
notmynameroom layout for the technical sessions:19:02
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notmynamethe overall schedule:19:02
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notmynameyou should have your passport by now. and probably flights and hotels19:03
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notmynameif you have a account, you can select the thigns you want to go to and download a calendar for you r phone19:03
notmynamemakes it easier to know where to be when19:03
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notmynamelooks like it will be a busy week, but I think this will be one of the more productive summits for us19:04
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notmynameI'm especially looking forward to the new technical track layout19:04
notmynamethere are 3 kinds of sessions19:04
notmyname1) fishbowl: large rooms, similar to previous summits. facilitated discussions with a large audience. we have 6 of these19:05
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notmyname2) working sessions: small rooms, similar to the hackathons, focused discussions on specific things, write/review code. we have 10 of these19:05
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notmyname3) "meetup": we have a room all day friday for an open space meetup with no specific schedule in it. similar to friday in paris last november19:06
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notmynameif you have specific conflicts (eg I think I might be giving a talk during one of the swift sessions), please let me know asap19:07
notmynameand we'll see if something can be worked out19:07
notmynameso...where are we right now?19:07
mattoliverauat home :P19:07
notmynamewe've got the RC2 tagged. that will be released tomorrow at around 1400UTC as swift 2.3.0 in openstack kilo19:08
notmynamethank you, again, for all your work on it19:08
peluseway cool19:08
notmynamewhich brings us to "what's next", which is a perfect segue to the summit sessions (where we talk abotu what's going on and what's next)19:09
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notmyname#topic summit sessions19:09
*** openstack changes topic to "summit sessions (Meeting topic: swift)"19:09
notmynamesince last week, I've reorganized that etherpad19:09
notmynameat the top are the fishbowl sessions19:10
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notmynamenext are the working sessions19:10
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notmynameand at the bottom are the "overflow" sessions19:10
notmynameI've got 6 fishbowls listed and IIRC 7 working sessions19:10
notmynameso 2 things:19:10
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notmynamefirst, if your name is on one of the sessions, this week (today even!) make a etherpad with a high-level description or outline of the session and add it to this document19:11
pelusehmmm, all I see are blank sections for fish/working at the top and then a lundry list of ideas19:11
notmynamepeluse: have you tried turning it off and back on?19:11
jrichlilol - love that show19:12
peluseoh, never mind :)19:12
notmynamethe linked etherpads can either be a scratch pad for ideas and we'll work through them as a group in the room. or they can be more of a place to collect thoughts for what needs to be discussed19:12
pelusestuff at the top are definitions and then I see 'type' with each idea19:12
notmynameremember that while there is a small about of "presentation", especially for fishbowls, these sessions are more of a conversation or discussion, not a lecture with a huge slide deck19:13
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notmynameI will be very happy to help anyone with prep for a particular session19:13
dmoritanotmyname: ok, i will prepare it19:14
notmynameok, the second thing is that I'd like to go over the sessions in the bottom overflow sessions to fill out the working rooms and prioritize19:14
notmynamedmorita: thanks!19:14
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notmynameok, first one to look at is python-swiftclient status and next steps19:15
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notmynameI think this is important, but there isn't yet actually any specific thing around it other than "we should do something"19:15
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notmynamewhat do you think? should we make sure this gets specific time, or leave it to more informal conversations?19:15
notmyname...not everyone at once...19:16
peluseno input from clayg on this one?19:16
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notmynameclayg doesn't seem to be here :-(19:17
torgomaticit's a long way between "ugh" and "here's how to fix it"19:17
peluseseems like there's always plenty to talk about wrt client - at least last time anyways19:17
mattoliverauhmm, I'm on the fence.. it is important, but do we have 40 minutes of conversation about it.. but it does need time i guess19:17
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pelusemaybe call it "a bitch session" :)19:17
notmynameok, in my arbitrary scale, let's put it at a 719:17
notmynameok, fast-post spec19:18
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notmynameacoles isn't here (he had a work dinner)19:18
notmynamedo we need a full working session on this, or do we really just need to get the spec landed and work through it?19:18
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notmyname(same question for all of the spec ones, actually)19:18
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peluseI've talked with him about a few of the tiems there, think its al stuff we will do19:18
peluseso probably land it and do it19:18
torgomaticprobably the latter for this one; seems like we know *what* we want, it's just a matter of *how*19:19
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notmynameok. priority 419:19
torgomaticdiscussion is more valuable when there are differing opinions on what to do IMO19:19
notmynameglobal cluster improvements19:19
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notmynameI think this one is low priority (I added it)19:20
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notmynamethis should be more a response to what we're all seeing in prod, not ideas we come up with19:20
notmynamehowever, if there are some specific things to bring up, that's good19:20
notmynameanyone feel strongly about including this one in a working session?19:20
mattoliverausounds like a beer session ;P19:21
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notmynameI can't see your face, so typing "no" helps ;-)19:21
torgomaticwhen the only tool you have is getting hammered, everything looks like a beer session ;)19:21
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gvernikmattoliverau,: it's 6 am for you...and you already speak about beer? :)19:22
* torgomatic doesn't care about this one19:22
notmynamegvernik: he's australian. it's different there19:22
mattoliveraugvernik: lol, 5:22 actaully :P19:22
notmynamepriority 119:22
pelusenot different than AZ!19:22
* cschwede just arrived - hello!19:22
notmynamesymlink spec19:22
notmynametorgomatic: do you want a working session on symlinks?19:22
notmynamecschwede: welcome19:22
torgomaticnotmyname: if we don't get the spec more hashed out by then, yes19:23
peluseI think we have 3 somewhat related sessions, that one, the policy changing and the netapp tier'ing19:23
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torgomaticI could see that one going with policy-change, but not the tiering thing19:23
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pelusedo we hold all 3 and then spend some time Fri to sort out overlap (or not)?19:23
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pelusewell, tiering could be the decision engine that then uses policy change...19:24
notmynameI'll mark them as potential candidates to combine19:24
mattoliveraunot a bad idea19:24
peluseyeah, just so everyone knows there's some potential relation there19:24
torgomaticwell, the difference is that I like symlinks, could tolerate policy changing, and dislike auto-tiering :)19:24
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notmynameobject undelete spec19:25
notmynamecschwede: does this need a formal working session?19:25
cschwedenotmyname: no, not a formal one. discussion on friday is enough i think19:26
notmynamesame question for container alias spec19:26
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cschwedesame answer :)19:26
notmynameupdateable object sysmeta19:27
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notmynameisn't this related to fast post?19:27
torgomaticthey're certainly playing in the same sandbox19:27
mattoliveraui think it is19:28
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notmynameok, I'll propose combining them and bring it up with acoles19:28
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notmynamemetadata search / notifications19:28
notmynamethis is interesting, since it makes me think of zaqar  and their recent call for adoption19:29
notmynamecschwede: is there a spec yet?19:29
cschwedeno, no spec yet19:29
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notmynamewould anyone rank it as more important than a swiftclient session? how about more important than the fastpost/sysmeta one?19:30
torgomaticI wonder if the zaqar folks would be open to a cross-project working session here19:30
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notmynameif we schedule it, I'll tag it as part of their track too19:31
notmynamelike I'll tag the ops session for ops19:31
torgomaticas it stands now, I believe that you have to get all kinds of keystoney to talk to a zaqar instance; there's no signature-based auth or something that'd be nice for use from within Swift19:31
notmynameso it shows up in multiple tracks19:31
notmynameok, but where does this one rank? do we choose it over sysmeta/fastpost?19:32
torgomaticif zaqar folks are going to show up, yes. otherwise, no. IMO19:32
notmynamethat makes sense. the summit is a perfect place for cross-project discussions19:32
vkmchey hey o/19:33
vkmcI, in behalf of Zaqar team, I can say yes :)19:33
notmynameof next up is kota_'s updates to container listings19:33
notmynamevkmc: :-)19:33
notmynamevkmc: should I ping you when it comes to scheduling to check for any potential conflicts?19:34
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vkmcplease, feel free to ping me or flaper87 after the meeting or when you schedule the sessions19:34
notmynameI will later this week when I start to schedule them19:34
notmynameok, back to container listing updates19:35
notmynamekota_: you proposed this one and said a friday discussion might be sufficient19:35
kota_ya, we don't need 40 minutes for this one, I think.19:35
notmynamewhat do we all think? keep it on friday or have a working session?19:36
notmynameanyone want to argue for a working session?19:36
torgomaticnot I19:36
notmynameok. let's bring it up on friday19:37
notmynameweekly meeting time is already a friday discussion and we havent' seen any hummingbird code so there's nothing to talk about there yet19:37
notmynamethat's the end of the overflow list. thanks19:37
hosorry. I would like to put on a friday discussion.19:38
notmynameho: ok. add it to the etherpad and mention it for a friday session there19:38
notmynameof the ones I had higher in the working sessions19:38
notmynamelarge contaienrs19:38
honotmyname: thanks!19:38
notmynameec follow-on work19:38
notmynamechange policies19:39
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notmynameincrease part_power19:39
notmynameare there any there that should be dropped in favor of another?19:39
mattoliverauSo as it stands we have 7 working (what your going through now), plus swiftclient, symlink and messaging making 10.19:39
dmoritamattoliverau: sounds good19:40
kota_sounds good19:40
notmynamemattoliverau: yeah. i want to make sure the 7 I had aren't taking the place of one that we should have19:40
notmynamespecifically, the one I'm thinking of is the tiering one19:40
mattoliveraui agree its good to go through and make sure :)19:40
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mattoliverautiering could be replaced with fast post19:41
peluseyeah but fast post isn't very controversial19:42
notmynameon the other hand, tiering is one of those things that I hear a lot from customers19:42
notmynameyeah. fast post is like "yes, ok just do it"19:42
mattoliverauhowever 40 minutes of torgomatic rage would be awesome :P19:42
mattoliveraulets leave it then19:42
* peluse thinks he'll just say 'this is stupid' and leave after 5 minutes :)19:42
notmynamejust withhold coffee that mornign for extra torgomatic smash!19:42
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mattoliveraulol, awesome t-shrit idea19:43
mattoliverautorgomatic SMASH!19:43
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torgomaticswift is many things, but it is not many more19:44
notmynameok, unless I hear differently soon (ping me in IRC) I'll keep it pretty much the way it is and how mattoliverau said it above19:44
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notmynameand I'll start scheduling those later this week19:44
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notmynamethanks for helping me go through them. I'm looking forward to it19:44
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notmyname#topic open discussion19:44
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notmynameanything else to bring up in the meeting this week?19:45
dmoritaone question about summit.19:45
torgomaticI want to drop py2.6 support in Swift after the Kilo release19:45
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notmynamedmorita: you first19:45
dmoritageneral quesion. do you know what equipments are prepared in the room of design summit?19:45
notmynamedmorita: generally we'll have a projector and a table and microphones (if the fishbowls are like the previous ones)19:46
notmynamebut that's a good question19:46
dmoritaok. no change from previous summits. thanks.19:46
notmynameI'll check with ttx to see if there is anything changed19:46
notmynametorgomatic: your turn19:46
torgomaticbasically, any objections to dropping 2.6 support after Kilo?19:47
torgomatic2.6 is dead, dead, dead19:47
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torgomaticpython core team won't touch it19:47
notmynamelucid expires tomorrow IIRC. it had py2619:47
notmynamewhat about centos/RH?19:47
torgomaticI'm not sure19:47
notmynamewhere's the red hat people?19:47
torgomaticI think the latest one (6?) has 2.7 available, though it's not the default19:47
notmynamedoes anyone here run on py26?19:48
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notmynameI think it's perfectly reasonable to drop py26 at this point. all of the major distros have py27 or don't even ship py26 anymore19:48
notmynameI think we can assume that all new deployers will have py2719:49
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notmynamethis is something that definitely needs to be asked of the operators19:49
torgomaticplus, writing code for 2.7 + 3.4 is annoying but reasonable19:49
notmynametorgomatic: rather than waiting for the summit, can you send an email to the operators mailing list about this?19:49
torgomatic(or 3.X)19:49
mattoliveraushall we bring it up at the ops session?19:49
cschwederhel6 uses py2.6 by default19:49
notmynamecschwede: ah thanks19:49
torgomatic2.6, 2.7, and 3.X together is awful19:50
notmynamecschwede: and I'm guessing it has support until about 2056?19:50
cschwedenotmyname: close19:50
torgomaticand now that eventlet supports py3, it's probably getting towards time to get Swift working over there at some point19:50
cschwedei’ll check that, get back to you later19:50
notmynameok, thanks19:50
notmynametorgomatic: can you send that email?19:50
torgomaticnotmyname: I'm not on the -operators list19:51
* torgomatic already gets too much email19:51
notmynamethat's not hard to change ;-)19:51
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notmynameok ok. I'll do it19:51
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mattoliverauthat's called deligating up :P19:51
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notmynameok, anything else to bring up this week?19:52
* torgomatic has nothing19:52
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notmynamethank you for coming today, and thanks for working on swift!19:53
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openstackMeeting ended Wed Apr 29 19:53:05 2015 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)19:53
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barrettHi, who's here for the product work group meeting?23:01
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rolandchanI am23:01
barrettHi Roland23:02
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barrettlet's get going, I think others will join in a short bit23:03
barrett#startmeeting product work group23:03
openstackMeeting started Wed Apr 29 23:03:34 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is barrett. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.23:03
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openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'product_work_group'23:03
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barrett#topic A Glimpse at the Roadmap session content23:04
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* geoffarnold mostly read-only mode23:04
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barrettHere's a link to the slides:
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barrettare there any comments or discussions on the content?23:05
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rolandchanNot from me23:06
barrettWhen I read the mission on slide 3, and on the wiki page, the thing that seems missing to me is the mission to create a roadmap that aligns our community23:07
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sgordonsorry, was running late23:07
barrettNP, just getting started23:07
barretthave you had a chance to look at the slides for the 1st vancouver session?23:08
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sgordonso slide 1423:09
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barrettThe nova content needs to be integrated in. The summary is in the socialization etherpad23:09
sgordoni feel like in some ways that was the most honest answer given23:09
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sgordonin that michael didn't attempt to gaze into the crystal ball for liberty/m23:10
sgordonwondering if we want to call that tension out23:10
sgordon(the one he cites)23:10
sgordoni guess we kind of do on 1823:10
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sgordonwill depend on speaker emphasis23:10
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barrettMichael did provide some views when he talked to MikeC.23:12
barrettYou can find the info here:
barrettstarts at line 63323:12
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sgordonyeah i know23:12
barretthigh level and directional23:12
sgordonthat is what i am referring to23:12
barrettIs the tension you're referring to the challenge in projecting beyond the current release? Or the tension between new features vs bug fix?23:13
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sgordonthe former23:13
sgordonthough the latter is fun too23:13
ShamailHi all.23:13
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barrettI think the tension is really the problem statement that this group is trying to address.23:14
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barrettShamail - Any comments on the slides for the Monday session?23:14
ShamailIs anyone else on who can give an update on this session or should I?23:14
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ShamailMscohen is driving it but I can provide an update since he can't make t.23:15
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barrettgo ahead Shamail23:15
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ShamailThe team made great progress last week, I volunteered to do cosmetic enhancements once we nail down the content.  We will be meeting again next week to lock down the draft.23:15
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barrettThanks - how do you want people to give comments?23:16
ShamailOur thought right now is to spend time on the group charter, what we've accomplished so far, and how the initiative will work with the community23:16
barrettComments on slides or notes or email or ?23:16
ShamailWe are not planning to spend too much time on the actual feedback from the PTLs since the content is self-explanatory and will be published.23:17
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ShamailThe best way is to review the slide deck and make comments through the comment function or in slide notes.  Please identify yourself so that we know who to contact for more details.23:17
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ShamailThe content is hosted on Google.  I will be glad to resend a link later tonight.23:17
barrettI posted in earlier in this session23:18
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ShamailAll in all, most slides are complete from a content perspective so a review by the team will be greatly appreciated before our next meeting.23:18
ShamailThanks barrett23:19
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barrettAnything else on this?23:19
ShamailLast I checked, the session had 100+ people registered.23:19
ShamailThat's it.23:19
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barrettLet's move to the next topic23:20
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ShamailHi Rockyg23:21
Rockygo/ sorry I'm late.  mail -in tax audit prep  grrr!23:21
barrett#topic 2nd Session at the Summit23:21
*** openstack changes topic to "2nd Session at the Summit (Meeting topic: product work group)"23:21
barrettHi Rocky23:21
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barrettShamail - do you want to give an update on the Tuesday session at the Summit?23:22
ShamailI want to apologize for the late notice on the second session.  I had forgotten about it until earlier this week.23:22
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ShamailSure. The current presenters are Sean R., Allison R., Stefano M., and Rob H.23:22
ShamailWe had originally proposed to sessions to divide education about the group and to share our findings this far23:23
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ShamailState of Product Management23:23
barrettI'm not sure those folks have the best info23:23
ShamailThe first session actually touches on both of these topics so I wanted to discuss if we could re-purpose the second session and validate presenters.23:23
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sarob_Hello my friends23:24
ShamailI hope everyone had a chance to review the email.  I would like to discuss the options, identify presenters, and start working on this asap.23:24
ShamailHi sarob_ , perfect timing23:24
barrettHi sarob23:24
ShamailWe are just starting the discussion on the second session23:24
barrettThe more I've thought about it, the more I like option 323:25
sarob_Barrett by23:25
ShamailFrom the ML, it seems like option #3 is preferred.23:25
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sarob_We have the Monday sessions23:25
ShamailI stated my opinion as well.  I like both option 2 & 3 but our selection will achieve different objectives.23:25
sarob_I'm hoping that we learn more about23:26
sarob_What the rest of the community wants Monday23:26
Rockyghi, sarob ;-)23:26
sarob_Apply that to the second meet23:26
sarob_Rockyg hi23:26
ShamailThat would mean an intense planning session on Monday evening. :)23:26
Shamailbut I like that.23:27
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sarob_That how I roll23:27
ShamailI would also like us to touch base with cross project rather soon.23:27
sarob_How about next week23:27
ShamailIf we work with them on the session then that could account for 50-80% of the content23:27
ShamailAnd we amend it with community feedback23:27
sarob_With some email prep with them this week23:27
ShamailAnyone else have preference on the options or alternate suggestions?23:28
sarob_Any amendments to the workflow as in the gdoc?23:28
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ShamailNot yet but I think we should share that with the xproj team.23:28
ShamailThey might have ideas too23:29
sarob_I'm pretty sure xproject is going want nuts23:29
sarob_And bolts23:29
barrettI made edits to the work flow23:29
sarob_Who what where when23:29
ShamailAh, so should we schedule a meeting later this week to review the flow?23:29
barrettIs this the Doc you were referring to sarob?
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barrettI think it would be good to have a call to walk through it - might be other ways we can simplify it.23:30
ShamailI agree sarob, we should have more details.23:30
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sarob_The bit that we should23:30
sarob_Figure out23:30
ShamailI'll schedule something.  Any preferences or should I use doodle?23:31
sarob_Laurensell wants to publish23:31
sarob_The next release23:31
sarob_With the multi release23:31
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ShamailDefinitely want a review before publish.23:31
ShamailAnd buy-in23:31
sarob_So we should have either a way to integrate23:31
barrettIs there something ready for publication?23:32
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sarob_Or the multi relase23:32
RockygDefinitely want a summit session with input from the xprojects before publish23:32
sarob_Needs to be ready mostly before23:32
sarob_The summit23:32
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ShamailCan someone put an action for me to schedule review call?23:32
ShamailBad memory :(23:32
barrettAt the last board meeting I thought there was agreement on Tokyo being the target for publishing a multi release roadmap23:32
barrett#action Shamail to schedule call to review work flow23:33
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sarob_Barrett yup23:33
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ShamailIs Lauren going to join our summit meet up?23:33
sarob_Starting with m summit let23:33
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barrettsarob: What would Lauren want to publish at Vancouver?23:33
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sarob_Multi release and m release get together23:34
sarob_Barrett. I meant about workflow timing23:34
sarob_Not this summit23:34
sarob_Sorry that23:34
sarob_Wasn't clear23:34
ShamailAh; that clarifies it.23:34
barrettThat seems doable23:35
sarob_Xproject is going to very23:35
sarob_Focused on23:35
sarob_How we23:35
sarob_Make things23:35
ShamailI agree that we should have that pretty much close to nailed before the summit.23:35
sarob_Not worse like in summit lead up23:35
ShamailHow we make things easier + help execute.23:36
sarob_Shamail cool23:36
barrettI think we have a good story to tell, but it will only work if we can collaborate with the PTLs23:36
sarob_Barrett right23:36
ShamailAgreed barrett23:36
sarob_Some will be our devs23:36
sarob_And others will be collaborators23:37
sarob_So balance will be important too23:37
ShamailHas anyone run this process by their internal teams yet?23:37
barrettCan we use the call Shamail is setting up to walk through the flow and prep for cross-project meeting?23:37
ShamailI'd be curious to hear feedback (organizational perspective)23:37
sarob_I started to with EMC folks23:37
ShamailI remember :)23:37
sarob_I'm going to adopt it for Akanda23:38
ShamailBut I'd like to run it by our actual contributors too not mgmt.23:38
sarob_Both will be important23:38
sarob_Ptl and devs23:38
ShamailI'm going to continue the work you had started at EMC23:38
Shamailbarrett: +123:38
sarob_Carry my torch23:39
Rockygouch! ouch! ouch!  Dang thing gets hot!23:39
barrettI'm meeting with Intel PTLs and devs this week23:39
ShamailI'm meeting with my team a week before the summit.23:39
sarob_I think if the devs23:39
sarob_Dig it23:39
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RockygHuawei devs and core don't talk to me.23:39
sarob_Then the product and Dev mgmt will follow23:40
ShamailRockyg: 😕23:40
Shamailsarob_: +123:40
sarob_Rockyg I'll talk to you ;)23:40
RockygYeah.  I had to get the report on the China bugfest from Intel.23:40
ShamailI'll try to find one hour. That should be enough to get a good start right?23:40
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Rockygsarob:  thanks you!  I promise not to be too needy23:40
RockygHous is a good start23:41
sarob_Rockyg keep plugging23:41
ShamailShall we move on?23:41
sarob_I'm good23:41
ShamailLock in option #3 for second session?23:41
RockygOh, I am.  With contributors ;-)23:41
barrett#agreed Option #3 from ML thread, for Session #2 at Summit23:42
RockygSo, we should have at least one PTL as presenter23:42
ShamailI'd like to have people from both Product and Xproj on stage.23:42
sarob_I like23:42
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* sarob_ like too23:42
ShamailLet's start an outline and refine workflow.  We can identify presenters after discussion with xproj.23:43
ShamailThat work?23:43
sarob_Good plan23:43
barrettReady for next topic?23:44
barrett#topic Product WG F2F Plans at Vancouver23:45
*** openstack changes topic to "Product WG F2F Plans at Vancouver (Meeting topic: product work group)"23:45
barrettWe're set for 2 sessions, both on Monday23:46
ShamailI think sarob_ and you are leading this topic.23:46
barrettThe 1st is for a team work session from 2:00 - 3:3023:46
ShamailDo you have the necessary info to send out the email?23:46
barrettShamail - Yes, I do23:46
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barrettWill send it out tomorrow23:46
ShamailAwesome.  Sorry for the interruption.23:47
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barrettWe could use some of that session to work through what we heard in the 11:15 session....?23:47
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Rockygsounds good.23:48
Shamailbarrett: +1 and also coordinate next steps between Vancouver and Tokyo.23:48
barrettWe could probably take on 1 other topic...thoughts?23:49
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Rockygcircle back on all the PM type efforts -- WTE, Log, Telco23:50
ShamailPossibly use case generation from PTL feedback?23:50
ShamailActually I like Rockyg's idea. We can work on the use-cases outside of the summit.23:50
barrettRockyG: There's a session after this one that will include the other groups23:50
sarob_Use case23:50
barrettIt goes from 3:40 - 4:4023:51
Shamail😟 I'm going to miss that one due to a breakout session.23:51
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barrettShamail: bummer23:51
RockygMaybe working through stuck places.  How to fill the gaps23:51
RockygI'm boging to be toast Monday night23:52
ShamailWill we be at a point where we could try to mock flow something through the process as a team?23:52
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barrettWhy don't we include Use Cases and Issues in the planning for tokyo topic23:52
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Rockygbarrett: ++23:52
Shamailbarrett: +123:53
* sarob_ like23:53
barrettThen for the xproject session - do we want to talk through the flow and how they can feed use cases and get involved in the group?23:54
barrettWould be interesting if each group came with their top 3-5 use cases and we could look at how much or little synergy there is...23:55
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ShamailI think that will work.  That's the best way to show the process and what we are trying to achieve.23:55
sarob_We should have them submit through gerrit23:55
ShamailIt will also let everyone come up with the best way to interface23:55
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barrettShamail +123:56
sarob_Be loose on formating23:56
sarob_That way everyone can see them23:56
barrettsarob: I'd actually propose that we give a template. The PTLs have said that consistent format would be helpful23:56
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sarob_Maybe even post comments23:56
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sarob_But not be too picky23:57
sarob_First go around23:57
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ShamailGerrit is the right way and being loose on the format is okay.23:57
sarob_Get ideas out there23:57
barrettUse the one the Telco work group is using? The WTE folks have started using this too23:57
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ShamailWe do want to at least identify the type of information that should be included23:57
sarob_Where is it?23:57
ShamailCan't make things happen with incomplete data23:57
sarob_Just not tox test on it yet23:58
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ShamailYou're no fun!  JK23:58
barrettWhat repo should we ask people to post to?23:58
ShamailI would ideally like to leverage cross project but will they be able to give some of us core?23:59
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sarob_Up to them23:59
sarob_not required23:59
ShamailMakes sense.23:59

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