Thursday, 2019-06-13

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michaelbarkdollHi, I'm curious when the next neutron tarball will be release (e.g., neutron-14.0.2.tar.gz)?  Reason, I ask is I'd like to use a patch that was released 14 days ago ( with a kolla deployment.  They appear to go off point releases instead of
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efried#startmeeting nova14:00
openstackMeeting started Thu Jun 13 14:00:07 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is efried. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.14:00
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova)"14:00
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'nova'14:00
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efried#link agenda (updated seconds ago):
efried#topic Last meeting14:03
efried#link Minutes (such as they are) from last meeting:
*** openstack changes topic to "Last meeting (Meeting topic: nova)"14:03
efriedwe skipped last meeting due to low attendance and interest14:03
efried#topic Release News14:04
efried#link nova 19.0.1 (stein) released
efried#link m1 release for os-vif (merged)
*** openstack changes topic to "Release News (Meeting topic: nova)"14:04
efried#topic Bugs (stuck/critical)14:04
efriedNo Critical bugs14:04
efried#link 89 new untriaged bugs (up 7! since the last meeting (2w ago)):
efried#link 12 untagged untriaged bugs (up 2 since the last meeting (2w ago)):*&field.status%3Alist=NEW14:04
*** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (stuck/critical) (Meeting topic: nova)"14:04
efriedstop me any time if you have something under one of these topics14:04
mriedemlots of bugs going up14:05
mriedemfew people doing triage14:05
mriedemwe use to average in the low 70s for open bugs14:05
efried#link bug triage how-to:
efried#help need help with bug triage14:05
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efriedshould we have a bug smash day?14:05
mriedemthis isn't even reviewing patches, it's triaging reported stuff14:05
bauzasI can raise the point internally FWIW14:06
efriedyeah, so like a "bug triage day"14:06
efriedthanks bauzas14:06
bauzasefried: send an email and I'll forward14:06
mriedemidk, if we just had more cores triaging 1-2 bugs per day / week we'd keep it under control14:06
bauzastell me that14:07
efried#action efried to (delegate? or) send email complaining about climbing bug numbers14:07
mriedememphasize fixing the shit we've already broken before putting in new broken shit14:07
artommriedem, is there like a checklist or something for triaging bugs?14:07
* gibi feels the pressure 14:07
efried#link bug triage how-to:
mriedemclearly this is all gibi's fault :P14:08
artomAs in, what status to set when, affected releases, etc14:08
artomThanks efried14:08
efriedtia for helping, artom :)14:08
efriedand if you see holes in ^, please let us know, or edit14:08
artomefried, I'll try, but no promises :( I'll be blunt, unless we internally prioritize that stuff, it's not very exciting work14:08
efriedno question14:08
artomI've made half-hearted attempts at having "upstream" days in my week14:09
artomStarting those with a bug triaged or two might be a good beginning14:09
bauzasartom: that's my point, I'll try to make it a priority14:09
bauzasbut let's not discuss it here14:09
artomYeah, we all now it's a problem, and the obvious solution14:10
artomThanks for reminding us, mriedem14:10
efriedGate status14:10
efried#link check queue gate status
efriedhad a doozy a couple days ago when the gate nodes upgraded their py27 with a breaking backport in the tokenizer14:10
efriedstephenfin came to the rescue:
mriedemwe likely need to backport that skip patch to stein
mriedemor that14:11
efriedwe can backport the real fix ... yeah14:11
mriedemstein is using bionic nodes as well14:11
efriedI thought someone already proposed the backport of the skip patch14:11
mriedemlyarwood did
efriedbut yes, we should backport the fix.14:12
stephenfinI can do that now14:12
efriedgross, merge conflict. Thanks stephenfin14:13
efried3rd party CI14:13
efried#link 3rd party CI status
mriedemgotta cherry pick it on top of the skip change14:13
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efriedI've noticed a resurgence in activity in PowerVM (still pay a little bit of attention over there) - they're on the path to getting their CI green again.14:14
efriedThe new people are themselves very green, in a different way. But coming along.14:15
efried#topic Reminders14:15
*** openstack changes topic to "Reminders (Meeting topic: nova)"14:15
efried#topic Stable branch status14:15
efried#link Stein regressions:
efriedbug 1824435 still pending14:15
efried#link stable/stein:
efriedstein release 19.0.1 happened14:15
efried#link stable/rocky:
efried#link stable/queens:
*** openstack changes topic to "Stable branch status (Meeting topic: nova)"14:15
openstackbug 1824435 in OpenStack Compute (nova) stein "fill_virtual_interface_list migration fails on second attempt" [Medium,Triaged]
mriedemi'm working on flushing rocky so we can do a release14:16
efriedI heard rumblings that mriedem wants to get a rocky release going soon14:16
mriedemyou can probably remove that stein regressions line from the agenda now14:16
sean-k-mooneyjust read scrollback i was planning to do an os-vif release today/tomorow so its unforunet that a release was jsut done  with out the ovs-dpdk feature :( but anyway ill propose the new release when it does.14:17
mriedemthat doesn't apply to stable right?14:17
sean-k-mooneythe dpdk feature does not but there is a stable stine backport i want to land14:18
sean-k-mooneyto fix tox/the mock_open bug14:18
mriedema stable branch release for a unit test fix is likely not super important14:18
mriedemthe dpdk feature on master would get released at t-2 unless we do an early release for some reason (if something depends on it)14:19
sean-k-mooneyya we can decide after the backport14:19
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efriedmoving on?14:19
sean-k-mooneymriedem: we need the release to merge the nova use of it14:19
sean-k-mooneyefried: yes we can move on14:20
efried#topic Sub/related team Highlights14:20
efriedPlacement (cdent)14:20
efried#link latest pupdate
efried#link Spec for can_split is dead/deferred unless someone speaks up
efried#link Spec for the rest of nested magic is undergoing deep discussion on one last (?) edge case
efried#link spec for rg/rp mappings is merged
efried#link WIP for rg/rp mappings
*** openstack changes topic to "Sub/related team Highlights (Meeting topic: nova)"14:20
efriedWe might be getting close on the nested magic 1 discussion, see review14:20
efriedmelwitt expressed concern yesterday about how such discussions impact the timeline of the work, so this is worth mentioning to the nova team:14:21
efriedWe (placement team) are not strictly observing merge-spec-before-code rules.14:21
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efriedWe have already cut a new microversion with one of the features in the spec.14:21
efriedand can continue to do so with the components that are not contentious.14:21
efriedand the one that is contentious right now is pretty corner-y and not in the critical path for things like NUMA affinity14:22
efriedany questions etc about placement-as-relates-to-nova?14:22
sean-k-mooneythat being can_split14:22
efriedcan_split is dead14:23
sean-k-mooneyright i thought that was the contentious one14:23
artomFWIW, I tried to get our PMs to react - nothing came of it14:23
artomMaybe it's because they're both French14:23
efriedwe found a new one14:23
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artomAs in, holidays14:23
sean-k-mooneyah ok ill try to catch up outside the meeting14:23
efriedAh. I did some internal poking as well, and also asked the starlingx ML. Radio silence.14:23
efried(on can_split ^ )14:24
mriedemas far as i know nothing *active* on the nova side is being blocked by the placement nested magic stuff14:24
efriedyeah, sean-k-mooney lmk if you want me te tldr it for you.14:24
efried(after the meeting)14:24
sean-k-mooneymriedem: well that depend there a few numa feature like vgpu numa affintiy14:24
efriedmriedem: The one melwitt brought up yesterday was effectively: "Do we need the VGPU affinity spec at all"14:24
artomefried, sean-k-mooney, so can_split's death means nova will need to uncouple NUMA topologies from CPU pinning and stuff? Can discuss after the meeting14:25
efrieddammit, I'm just a half second late all day today14:25
mriedemsean-k-mooney: that spec isn't dependent on placement14:25
sean-k-mooneythat we are proposing workaroudn for to not need to depend on it14:25
efriedthis ^14:25
sean-k-mooneyit isnt but we went out of our way to make that be the case14:25
efriedmriedem: correct, the spec does not depend on placement, that's the point. It's a workaround assuming we don't have placement support. I would prefer to get rid of it and use the placement support.14:25
mriedemso let me ask,14:26
mriedemof the people that care about that nova spec (bauzas, sean-k-mooney, melwitt, et al) - how many are reviewing the placement nested magic spec?14:26
sean-k-mooneyefried: right but we dont want to block that feature or other again waiting for that supprot14:26
efriedmelwitt is14:26
sean-k-mooneyi am too14:26
sean-k-mooneyi think bauzas has skimmed it and is aware of it14:27
efriedmelwitt also asked who was on the impl and if we wanted help. There's code proposed for some of it, in various stages of WIP.14:28
efried#link rp/rg mappings microversion series (of 2 patches) starting at
efried^ has one +2 already14:28
sean-k-mooneyam i the only one gerrit is broken for currently by the way14:29
efried#link WIP resourceless request groups
efried#link also WIP resourceless request groups
efriedsean-k-mooney: working for me14:30
sean-k-mooney:( ok14:30
efriedMuch of the feature work isn't especially hard. It's the requirements/design that has been hard.14:30
efriedvolunteers would be welcomed.14:30
efriedbut probably not critical for closure.14:31
efriedmoving on?14:31
efriedAPI (gmann)14:31
efriedUpdates on ML- #link
efried^ from week before last, I don't see one this week.14:32
efriedgmann: anything to add?14:32
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efried#topic Stuck Reviews14:33
*** openstack changes topic to "Stuck Reviews (Meeting topic: nova)"14:33
efried#topic Review status page14:34
efried#help Pick a patch near the top, shepherd it to closure14:34
*** openstack changes topic to "Review status page (Meeting topic: nova)"14:34
mriedemthat reminds me,14:34
artomPresumably only cores can do this? For instance, has had to repsonse to -1 in 1.5 years, can be force-abandonned?14:34
mriedemwe can probably drop the remove-cells-v1 series from runways now can't we?14:34
artom*has had no14:34
mriedemartom: i've looked at that one,14:35
stephenfinmriedem: Is someone can hit this one patch then yes14:35
mriedemand rather than abandon i'd like someone to just take it over14:35
efriedbut yes artom, cores can force-abandon in general14:35
stephenfinactually, it's all cleanup. Yeah, remove it14:35
mriedemartom: most of the review comments in that change are nits from what i can tell14:35
mriedemstephenfin: will do14:36
artommriedem, I mean, since I brought it up I guess I have to now?14:36
mriedem(remove run runways)14:36
mriedemartom: no, you can just be a bad person14:36
mriedemit's fine14:36
mriedemit's the world we live in now :)14:36
artomThere's a place in hell with my name on it14:36
efriedwe've discussed doing a force-abandon-anything-older-than-X. So far we haven't done it. I guess I prefer mindful looks like we've been doing, despite that being much slower.14:37
mriedemsame - a lot of the time there are just nits or a missing test or something on an otherwise obvious/reasonable fix14:37
artomefried, in that case we might want to maintain a list "plz someone else own this" somewhere14:38
efriedAnyway, I think I'm going to start tracking this like our bug queue, listing the total (+/- from last time) and the highest score on the list. Not that I expect any action to come of it, but it'll be fun to see the numbers go down...14:38
efriedartom: That's a good idea. Someone should make an etherpad...14:38
artomOh god I signed for another thing didn't I?14:38
* stephenfin politely disagrees14:38
efried^ with what stephenfin?14:39
stephenfinThe "plz someone else own this" list14:39
sean-k-mooneyif we think its still relevent then i think it makes sense14:39
stephenfinWe all have enough work to do. If it's a significant issue, someone will stumble upon it again in the future14:39
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sean-k-mooneyif its just old stuff that no longer relevent we can abandon14:39
artomstephenfin, I don't see the harm in having a list - no one has to look at it14:39
johnthetubaguyI assumed the list was more for folks outside the usual folks who want to join in? maybe I am too optimistic?14:40
stephenfinFair. I just didn't want you wasting your time :)14:40
aspiersCounter-argument is that people (a.k.a. unicorns) with free time might be able to use the list to pick up stuff14:40
artomstephenfin, I can't really populate it - except that one patch I mentioned14:40
stephenfinIf others think it'll be useful, go for it. Just noting _I_ won't personally use it14:40
artomBut I can create it14:40
efriedyup. Add near "low-hanging fruit" link on our wiki page14:40
artomWhich is, like, 5 seconds14:40
artomWhat's the bot thing for action item?14:41
stephenfinartom:   #action14:41
stephenfinI think...14:41
efriedlike other things (e.g. themes, cf ptg discussion) it's useful for people who find it useful; others can ignore, no harm no foul14:41
artom#action artom to create etherpad for "plz someone else own this" and link to low-hanging fruit section of wiki14:41
sean-k-mooneyartom: i think efried has to do it14:41
efriedthanks artom14:42
mriedemmeeting chairs add actions14:42
efriedoh, the #action thing.14:42
sean-k-mooneyi didnt think the bot listened to everyone14:42
* artom storms off in a huff and pouts in a corner14:42
efried#action artom to create etherpad for "plz someone else own this" and link from near low-hanging fruit section of wiki14:42
efriedwe'll see if it shows up twice14:42
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efried#topic Open discussion14:42
stephenfindid we ever do anything with that review priorities in Gerrit thing14:42
mriedemstephenfin: ironically the patch used as an example here is for docs14:42
*** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: nova)"14:42
mriedemwhich you're a big fan of14:42
mriedemand pushed fora release theme14:42
stephenfinwell then artom should just ask me :)14:43
efriedstephenfin: no, nothing with review priorities in gerrit14:43
artomstephenfin, or. OR! you should just listen ;)14:43
efriedI think we concluded (at least for now) that it's too heavyweight and we don't have a crisp view of what it should look like anyway.14:43
efriedWe have three open discussion topics on the agenda14:43
sean-k-mooneyif we still want to do it its fairly simple to update the project-config repo to add teh lables14:43
efriedand ~15 minutes left14:43
stephenfinartom: Sorry, I just saw something fluffy and am going chasing it14:43
stephenfinwhere were we?14:43
efried(mriedem): Any interest in adding a rally job to the experimental queue?
mriedemi didn't add that to the agenda so i'm not speaking to it :)14:44
artomDidn't we talk last week about dwindling gate resources?14:44
mriedemexperimental queue is on-demand14:44
sean-k-mooneyexperimenal is manually triggered but it also has a lot of stuff in it14:44
* artom stands corrected14:44
efriedoh. Who added the agenda item then?14:44
efriedif nobody speaks up Ima skip it14:44
mriedemefried: i should say i don't remember adding it14:45
mriedemmaybe i did in a blackout, idk14:45
sean-k-mooney personlaly if we add it i would poroably make it a periodic job14:45
mriedemthe interesting part from that thread is neutron has a rally job with visualizations for the time spent in a given flow14:45
sean-k-mooneybut it sound like we dont really see the need14:45
sean-k-mooneyat least for now14:45
efriedOkay, let's move on. Someone re-add it next week if there's interest and further discussion needed.14:45
efried(shilpasd) Forbidden Aggregate Filters: automatic (un)traiting of host providers (
mriedemi for one assume we have lots of poorly performing code in nova but nobody profiles so nobody knows14:45
artommriedem, we run performance/scale tests internally14:46
artomSo there's that14:46
mriedemartom: like 12 months after we release upstream yeah?14:46
artommriedem, you're being optimistic14:46
sean-k-mooney:) yes and i dont know where teh data actully goes form those test either14:46
artomsean-k-mooney, I've seen a couple of reports on rhos-dev ML14:47
mriedemright - i don't hear about that scale testing resulting in fixes coming back upstream14:47
mriedemCERN is usually the one saying scaling sucks14:47
artommriedem, to be honest a lot of it is finding misconfigurations :/14:47
artomI think last time we discovered we were using the wrong hash algorithms in keystone tokens or something14:47
sean-k-mooneyso back to the forbidden aggrage filters topic14:47
efried(shilpasd) Forbidden Aggregate Filters: automatic (un)traiting of host providers (
efriedtldr the "strict isolation using forbidden aggregates" work in nova has a question on the ML, linked above, about automatic traiting (and especially UNtraiting) of providers to enable this feature.14:47
artomJust saying, it's *something* Not the best, but something14:48
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sean-k-mooneyefried: were we settling on just extending the osc-placement plugin to add a command to add/remove traits14:48
efriedWhat we *could* do is, when you add "required traits" metadata to an aggregate, or when you add a host to such an aggregate, we *could* automatically add those traits to the RPs. So it would be one step to set up your "strict isolation".14:48
mriedemsean-k-mooney: the osc plugin already does that14:48
sean-k-mooneyform the root RPs in the aggrate?14:49
mriedemoh traits per aggregate...14:49
mriedemi can't even remember now what that spec said14:49
efriedBut then what do you do when you remove a host from such an aggregate, or remove a trait from such an aggregate? Do you remove it from the hosts?14:49
efriedThe spec said automatically add traits. But it doesn't mention what happens on removal type ops.14:49
efriedwhich is where the thread comes in.14:49
efriedRemoving traits is really hairy14:50
efriedknowing how/when/which to remove14:50
efriedso IMO we shouldn't do it.14:50
mriedemthe host could be in multiple aggregates yes?14:50
efriedBut then there's asymmetry between the + and -14:50
sean-k-mooneymriedem: yes14:50
efriedyes, among other tygers14:50
mriedemas in pan tang tygers?14:50
efriedso what at least sean-k-mooney and I have agreed on in the thread is: don't muck with RP traits at all, on the + or - side. Make the admin do that part manually.14:50
sean-k-mooneyi discirbed how to do it in ~ nlongn time but i also liked efried suggestion of just doing it via the command line14:51
mriedemfwiw there is a reason that the sync_aggregates CLI we have doesn't deal with removals14:52
mriedemit *could* but requires a lot of thought14:52
sean-k-mooneyya its possible to do semi effiently in via the info in the nova database but its notrival to write correctly14:52
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efriedso can we agree with this path forward: aggregate ops won't muck with RP traits14:53
sean-k-mooneywhich is why i was lean toword dont do it automaticlaly14:53
mriedemaggregate ops as in when you add a host to an aggregate *in nova*?14:53
sean-k-mooneyefried: im +1 on that. if someone write the code later to do it automatically and proves it work right i would not be againt it either14:53
efriedmriedem: yes14:54
efriedor when you add a required trait to an aggregate14:54
mriedemcan aggregates have traits?14:54
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sean-k-mooneynova host aggages can14:54
efriedmriedem: as part of the "forbidden aggs isolation" spec, yes.14:54
sean-k-mooneyplacmente ones no14:54
mriedemoh i see, the orchestration funbag we have to sync that all up14:54
mriedemguess i should read that spec again14:55
efriedyes. The proposal is: syncing to host RPs should be done manually, not automatically via agg ops14:55
sean-k-mooneyactully i just thought of another way to do this but ill bring that up on #openstack-nova afterwards14:55
efriedOkay. Five minutes, let's hit the last topic please.14:55
efriedIronic "resize"
efriedmgoddard: thanks for being here14:55
mgoddardefried: np14:55
efriedThe proposal in the thread is basically: Implement a limited 'resize' for ironic. It's always "same host" (really same-node) and it's very limited to what you can change14:56
efriedbasically the "deploy template"14:56
efriedmgoddard: did I get that more or less right?14:57
mriedemwhy not pick up and polish off the old fujitsu spec for actually supporting resize for baremetal instances?14:57
efriedmriedem: link?14:57
mriedemwhich i think was pretty close last i reviewed14:57
mgoddardI think so. Resize is like rebuild but keeps changes to the server, correct?14:57
TheJuliamriedem: I think that was about redundancy, failing instances over to hardware with share storage.14:57
sean-k-mooneyresize changes the flavor rebuild changes the image14:58
sean-k-mooneyso resize keeps your data and may or may not schduled you to another host in the vm case14:58
sean-k-mooneyrebuild is always on the same host in the vm case14:58
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mgoddardI see14:59
sean-k-mooneyi guess rebuild would be the same for ironic14:59
sean-k-mooneye.g. same host just reporvios the root disk14:59
efriedso the overlap here is: we want to change flavors, keep "data", but stay same host14:59
efried(same node)14:59
mriedemironic driver in nova already supports rebuild, but we're diverging14:59
mriedemi'd say spec it up14:59
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sean-k-mooneyin principal for BFV ironic nodes there is no reason not to supprot resize in general15:00
mriedemwe can obviously restrict a resize to the same compute service host and node via request spec15:00
sean-k-mooneyposible to a different host15:00
mgoddardis this logic handled within the virt driver, or will we need logic elsewhere to handle an ironic resize?15:00
efriedOkay. We're close to spec-ish in the ML, but getting something formal in the specs repo...15:00
efriedwe're at time. Can we continue in -nova?15:00
efriedThanks all o/15:00
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openstackMeeting ended Thu Jun 13 15:00:45 2019 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at . (v 0.1.4)15:00
openstackMinutes (text):
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gagehugo#startmeeting security15:01
openstackMeeting started Thu Jun 13 15:01:06 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is gagehugo. Information about MeetBot at
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.15:01
*** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: security)"15:01
openstackThe meeting name has been set to 'security'15:01
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gagehugo#link agenda15:01
fungialoha security folks15:03
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gagehugo#topic openstack-security mailing list reassigning15:05
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gagehugofungi: we talked about this last week15:05
fungiyup, you should have received a notification of the password reset15:05
gagehugoyeah I did last week15:05
fungiif you log into the admin interface with that, you'll see the general page with most of the things we probably want to change15:06
fungichief amongst those is likely the description15:07
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fungiwe need some brief (sentence or so worth of) prose explaining that this list receives automated notifications about security-related bugs and code changes15:07
fungii just now updated the subscription rules so that only admins can see the list of subscribers15:09
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gagehugosure, I can update the description then today15:10
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fungii've also cleaned up the sender filters just now, as they were full of a bunch of stale whitelisted and blacklisted addresses surely no longer relevant15:13
fungii left the blanket rules in place for and addresses15:13
fungiso that gerrit and lp can continue to send info like they have been15:13
fungii've also set the moderation bit for all current subscribers and configured it to set the moderation bit for any new subscriber in the future15:15
fungithis way anyone sending to the list other than from those whitelisted sources will hit the moderation queue, even if they're subscribed15:15
fungii'll endeavor to keep an eye out for any new messages landing in moderation for the next while to make sure we haven't missed whitelisting anything important15:16
fungiand then we can switch the default action from moderate to reject15:16
fungiso we no longer have to keep an eye on that15:16
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fungithere were also a bunch of old messages stuck in moderation (probably a thousand or more). i wasn't going to review each and every one so i discarded them to get us a clean slate15:17
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gagehugosorry got pulled away for a minute15:24
gagehugo#action gagehugo and fungi to transition the mailing list15:24
gagehugoI will come up with a nice description today15:25
gagehugo#topic open discussion15:25
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gagehugofungi: did you have anything else?15:25
fungiat this point yeah it's mostly just lacking a corrected description and keeping an eye on the moderation queue until we're satisfied nothing important lands there15:25
fungithe security team autoassignment feature landed in storyboard over the weekend15:26
fungii haven't played around with getting that set up for the vmt yet15:26
fungier, auto acl addition15:26
fungii keep saying assignment, it's not assignment15:27
fungifeature so that projects can be marked to auto-add access for specific teams on private stories marked security15:27
fungithis also added separate classifications for private and security stories15:27
fungiif a new story is marked as security when it's being created, it will automatically start out private and has to be edited after creation to make it public15:28
gagehugoah ok15:28
fungiso that should help reduce the number of people accidentally filing security stories public due to not understanding the interface15:29
fungii don't think i had anything else to bring up this week15:33
gagehugook, thanks fungi!15:34
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fungithanks gagehugo!15:35
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